A loving God wouldn't make me suffer to the point where I simply can't believe anymore even if I want to, would He? Why? And by believing in Him it's not about doubting His existence but that He's good.
>>18131117Why do you think God has to be purely beneficent? Because a book written by humans told you that God is?
>>18131117It's shrimple: John 6:44. You don't believe because God doesn't want you to believe.>"B-BUT HIS ANTECEDENT WIL-"Stupid and worthless distinction to force a harmonization and cushion the obvious contradiction of the primacy of divine grace in salvation and Paul's statement in 1 Timothy 2:4
>>18131117Let's see.Here's the problem with your problem.It seems you've chosen a retarded religion among 5000+ to just disbelieve it, there,fixed
>>18131117Why does this man love God even after all that he has suffered?https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Sxh4j27qOUkWhat makes your pain more significant than his?
>>18131117maybe God is something deeper and more mystic than you assumenot another but a brotherunseen but felt like windmeasured in the hearts of menperhaps God wants you to spread your wings and let you carry himi am musing, i do not know, but it could be so
>>18131117Just overcome the world bro
>>18131117>Another bait thread out of 10 or so currently present at /his/Anyone has an alternative to /his/ where we can talk about history and not some /pol/lution tier useless post.
>>18131117>Why does God don'tSaaar
>>18131117>A loving God wouldn't make me suffer to the point where I simply can't believe anymore even if I want to, would He?Yes.>Why? Because you've repeatedly decided to hate him and reject the sacrifice of his son.
>>18131159>purelySo you admit that you can't read? We are talking about extremes and you say purely as if it's just something minimal. Yep, totally not a dishonest person.>>18131236But why?>>18131243Well, the point is that in this one God is supposed to be all loving.>>18131530Because he's delusional and or were made to still believe in Him. Why can't I believe, like I said it's not my choice but more like an allergic reaction. >>18131550That makes no sense but it sounded funny.>>18132102Right.>>18132115>baitThis is a very philosophical question which is part of the humanities. And a very difficult one at that.>>18132299Do not redeem!>>18132303But I didn't and you seem like an uppity person that has no idea what he's talking about.
>>18132455>uppityI’m white.
>>18132466Doesn't mean that you can't act like the opposite of it.
>>18132455Im the shrimple guy.It's because the diversity of the divine attributes made known exemplifies the beautific vision (heaven) where we "see God for who He is" (1 John 3:2). For eternal life consists in this knowledge (John 17:3).Knowing God = better.Knowing God implies knowing his attributes more fully; hence the fall. The fall is often called a "truly necessary sin" because "it merited so great, so glorious a redeemer". A world where men fell and were brought back to salvation via sacrificial love makes known God's love and mercy (Rom 5:8) in a magnified way, while also showcasing his justice in punishing the wicked; hence, the Augustinian polemic against the Epicurean paradox: >"Since God is the highest good, He would not allow any evil to exist in His works, unless His omnipotence and goodness were such as to bring good even out of evil.Therefore, anon, you do not possess the virtue of faith because God has not given you it, and therefore it is within the realm of possibilities that he wants you to burn for his glory (Rom 9:22-23).That's the contradiction in the Christian religion. The assimilation of Hellenic philosophy into the Hebrew legend spun a conception of God that is incompatible with a hopeful chungus loving God and one who is truly omnipotent>erm calvinism muchNo, it's called not being a Pelagian or open theist. Adhering to predestination does not necessarily constitute a system which is formally calvinism, that's just superstitious evanjelly retardation.Again, anon, remember, in response to Nicodemeus's inquiry into how one enters the kingdom of heaven, Jesus responds:>Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God..The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit.”
>>18132455Look anon, many religious books proclaim to have loving gods, or compassionate buddhas. Your problem is optics, you think this religion may be true. It isn't. And you think there could be no other religion being true, there is. >How do you know? I am a demon, a non abrahamic one. Yes, you're talking to a demon. >Can you prove it? I can sprout nonsense inside your mind, like a demon, I guess, but that's besides the point. >WutWhy in Hell you want religion in the first place? The need arises from the sense of doing what is spiritually sound, right? Well, little problem with this line of thought: are you trying to fit in Christian Religion a soul blacker than a pit? There, I have said it, Accept Darkness, become a demonic being today, you just might be. Have you studied your persona? Are you the hero that saves the day or the guy that looks at the hero's wife with a hardon? Perspective: you may not be a hero, so look also into "villain" religions. Lets see if those seem more reasonable.
>>18132861I have understood that to an extent personally, obviously not in such an elaborate manner but that still doesn't explain what my purpose is.>>18132907I just want peace...
Bump!
>>18132907>accept darkness, become a demonhooooly fucking reddit
>>18132861>Adhering to predestination does not necessarily constitute a system which is formally calvinismWhat's the difference.
>>18135216Calvinism refers to a system of theological doctrines (soteriology, ecclesiology, sacramentology, christology, etc.) that adheres to the Reformed Tradition of mainline Protestantism. Predestination refers to a doctrine. If you think that believing in predestination makes you a calvinist, then you are confusing the part with the whole. It's the same line of reasoning as to how a Lutheran can hold to baptismal regeneration without being a Catholic.
I demand an answer!
>>18132861>>18135489I wonder, is this inevitably what happens when you try to fit a good God into a universe where the concept of suffering exists, or could things have gone differently?
>>18136490Bump
Correct, therefor god isnt loving. Next question?
>>18136490With a classical theist conception of God, I would argue yes.With a Bronze Age Canaanite conception of god, no.There would be no contradiction between the CHARACTER of God/Jesus and suffering if he were limited in the Hebrew bible.Sure, there are verses you can point to that seem to espouse a classical conception of God's attributes such as eternality, immutability, omnipotence, omnipresence, omniscience, etc. but I'd argue those passages are the result of pompous, exaggerated praise which was reinterpreted to mean things which result from a conception of an actus purus. To the Hittite, "all powerful" could just mean "he can make a volcano go boom and destroy your crops" rather than "he can actualize any logically possible potency". It seems frankly ridiculous that if Jesus were the omnipotent God incarnate, that he would seem so passionate and caring about humanity that he was willing to die on a cross for the propitiation of their sins, only to have hundreds of millions of natives on the other side of the planet, totally disconnected from the gospel, to be living and dying through brutal sacrifices and disease, and practically guaranteed to go to hell (if we are consistent about original sin) for thousands of years with no hope of salvation until Europeans arrived 1500 years after his death.
>>18136490continued from above replyOn top of this, like I mentioned earlier, the damnation of souls serves a purpose insofar as it makes known God's attributes of justice and mercy upon His creatures, diversifying God's goodness. Yet as we know from certain passages such as >“Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many."paired with the historic teaching of mass damnata, that is, even among the members of the Church i.e. outwardly professing christians, that the majority of them will be damned (forget about unbelievers), most people in church, according to the position of scripture and tradition, will be damned. God will give them an impassable body where they will feel the pains of torment forever (we are desensitized to this concept but I want you to really think long and hard about what it means to be tormented forever). Now, most people in heaven, statistically, will be aborted fetus's or babies that died from diseases during the past thousands of years. That means, in Gods master plan, he created us, allowed suffering, so that 90%+ of those who had conscious experience will be burned alive forever while a handful of some and (arguably) ~70 billion infants can enjoy paradise forever. It just doesn't make sense, considering the whole point of heaven being "the greatest good from all other possible worlds" is premised upon the saints having gone through suffering their whole lives. Yet, if we presuppose a secular approach, that Christianity is (to put it bluntly) "made up" then this does make sense. I would like to make a note here. None of what I said so far leads to atheism. I myself am a theist, I'm just arguing there is a contradiction between being a theist AND saying that that God is the Jesus Christ from the Bible and that this God must adhere to the revelation therein.
>>18133958why are 4chomgers so mad at reddit
>>18137367>will be aborted fetus's or babies that died from diseasesHistorically most Christians have affirmed infant damnation, Calvinists (mostly) still do. To make it worse, even those who deny it cannot in good faith claim it to be evil for God to do so, since scripture is silent on the issue.
>>18131117What is keeping you from believing in God is not God, it is pride. Be had kble and don't take suffering personal. Don't be offended by the fact that you suffer.
>>18137711>Don't be offendedThat's not how it works.
>>18132941>I just want peace...Peace is just a state of mind, yogic experiences as described on religious and spiritual books can come from either Darkness or Light allegedly.It's up to you what to believe, but if you think that a religion based off scaring peasants for money has any peace to give you're a retard.Tell you what, give it a shot, try living like a saint, then I'll post here a sigil of a demon, you're not gonna invoke the demon or do some insanity like that which a novice has no business doing, instead you're gonna get a feel for the energy inside you, and see how it makes you think and feel.I'm not sure you're well versed in these things, but if you're serious about spiritual achievement, Darkness is a valid path. And it could be more normal a path for just you.Case in point, can you sell all your belongings and give the money to charity? Can you then visit the ill and confort them, the prisoners? Etc? All your life constantly? Well, I doubt it.Pictured is a sigil of Astaroth, I've chosen Astaroth because of familiarity with your culture, abrahamic in most religious dens.In a followup post I will post an image with a different source of Darkness, for you to absorb and compare. I will not post light, as I am disgusted by it.>>18133958>Not believing the first lunacy a retard believed is redditYepWhat is a demon, anon? Not a fallen angel, as I wasn't an angel to become one and then fall.So what am I talking about, then?You're a retard.
>>18139992Here it is, Sadako Yamamura, I hope you're at least familiar with the idea of Ringu's Sadako, because you should for this to work in your mind, and with neoplatonic and gnostic ideas.There's a perfect world of Ideas, so Ideas are realer than reality!So here's Sadako, now here are the instructions to try either Sadako's picture or Astaroths Sigil:Look at the picture, believe it iss your consciousness while knowing who the sigil belongs to or who Sadako is, listen to it mentally, you will receive Darkness.In my case, Sadako's is stronger, fuller. However I'm neither abrahamic, nor in friendly terms with Abrahamic religions, I'm a gnostic (has to do with demonic stuff).No, I'm not sharing my spiritual path, it's important to explore yourself and see who you are and if you're Darkness or Light.
bible time!
