There is light and darkness in everything. It seems like Fascism is just a dark form of socialism.
Saint-Simonian socialism.
There is no 'light' form of socialism, it is always evil.
>>18131958It was post-socialism. Revising the errors of socialism and reconciling the good parts with what was salvageable about tradition (the nation, family, morality, etc).
>>18131958fascism is what happens when you get kicked out of the cool kids club and start your own
>>18132057>>18132055these are good answers. I want to hear more takes so bump.Also, Mussolini was literally a socialist for 12 years and many of his policies or more far left than what would have happened if the ISP hot into power
>>18132328holy mobile typing lol. I'm not esl, I swear.
>>18131958This, but Fascism is the light form of socialism. Marxism is the dark form
>>18132328Il Popolo d'Italia called itself 'socialist daily' for a few years. Then Mussolini decided that his brand of socialism needed a rebranding to prevent confusion.
>>18132055So based.
>>18132328>these are good answers. I want to hear more takes so bump.The fascists understood their mission as salvaging the good parts of pre-industrial civilisation for a modern industrial context as opposed to the communist vision which was to tear it all down. The principle difference between the two was their relationship to history.Fascism = keep the torch of historical civilisation burning, but adapted to new circumstancesCommunism = total revolutionary change
>>18131958>There is light and darkness in everything. It seems like Fascism is just a dark form of socialism.I can only imagine how underage the poster must be making such statementsTo simplify it, fascism really is just nationalism + socialism, or integralism or organicism or corporatism or however you want to nuance the latter. It just works. The alternative is, what? Leftists, anarchists, and Utopian socialists that would sometimes ally themselves with capitalist technocracy or the genocidal Bolsheviks
>>18131958fascism is the way
>>18131958It was the bourgeois reaction to bolshevism. Essentially European Kerenskyite petty-bourgeois lite-socialists who thought the October Revolution was a step way too far. In response to this rising threat of the workers, the petty bourgeois unionized and militarized before entrenching themselves in the political apparatus, keeping their precious material comfort protected. It’s a mistake to believe this is merely just a “dictatorship of the petty bourgeois” however since capital is still at the top dictating orders, it’s just that the petty bourgeois was gained it’s own form of class consciousness.
>>18132057When was D'Annunzio kicked out of the cool kids club?
Fascism is overcoming ethnic, political, religious and class divides in society by overthrowing bourgeois democracy and establishing the corporatism state, where every part (arms, body, head, etc.) is part of the state and must a serve a purpose of the state, include the cancerous parts (Jews, criminals, etc.). The primary goal is unite the country, develop autarky, find allies and start the war. The war will be the war that will unite all under the banner of the revolution. Against the plutocratic and reactionary regimes of the western nations. War is truly the most revolutionary force in society and the only way true change can be achieved.
>>18132878Sounds based and significantly more logical than letting commies take charge
>>18131958Mussolini was a filthy communist rat and only shaved off the worst of it to gain support from the people and favor with Hitler. It was a power move.
>>18131958>There is light and darkness in everything. It seems like Fascism is just a dark form of socialism.That's fucking retarded but your somewhat correct. Fascism emerged from the Orthodox-Reformist split in Marxism, more specifically how that split affected the Italian "left" during the first world war. Both are preferable to the modern world
>>18132906>The war will be the war that will unite all under the banner of the revolution. Against the plutocratic and reactionary regimes of the western nations. War is truly the most revolutionary force in society and the only way true change can be achieved.That's pretty close to what the fascists would say they were doing yes.>>18133160>That's fucking retarded but your somewhat correct. Fascism emerged from the Orthodox-Reformist split in Marxism, more specifically how that split affected the Italian "left" during the first world war. Italian syndicalists yes. I'd say their Marxism was pretty heterodox though many called themselves Marxists. They had a more extreme, far-left position that favored violence and direct action compared to reformist socialists. But it's also interesting to read about the right-wing organizations they merged with to produce fascism like the Italian Nationalist Association of Enrico Corradini. Corradini had this theory of "proletarian nations," so Italy was a "proletarian nation" which actually sounds kind of Maoist third-worldist, while also taking money from arms manufacturers and advocating irredentism of Italian lands and colonial expansion.
fascism - race warcommunism - class warcapitalism - culture warsimple as
>>18131958Fascism actually works, unlike socialism
>>18132906>and start the war. The war will be the war that will unite all under the banner of the revolution. Against the plutocratic and reactionary regimes of the western nations. War is truly the most revolutionary force in society and the only way true change can be achieved.>...loses the the first and only war they ever fought.
>>18134074Any system where the government decides what you can and can't say doesn't "work", right from the start.
>>18131958He specifically called it "Fascism" because that was the most generic Italian term for literally any type of political action committee.
>>18133987Maybe 18th-20th century was their sleep arc but I wish Italy didn't job so hard.
Fascism specifically defined the doctrine of class collaboration as the exact opposite of class war and marxism.It had socialist lite elements sprinkled throughout though.
>>18133989>capitalism - culture warThe culture war is part of Marxist revisionist theory.
>>18134705Socialism is older than marxism and nothing about it implies class war.
>>18133989>fascism >racefinally found the brainlet who thinks fascism and Hitler's nazism is one in the same. There's always one
>>18134712You are correct, I assumed OP meant marxian socialism.
>>18134690Even their unification was a story of them jobbing and getting the peninsula as a participation trophy.
>>18131958Socialism is a clear and rigid ideology with laid out forms of governance.Fascism is just vague. If you go by what Musso's shit say, it doesn't go any deeper than 'Uhh, violence is pretty cool, I guess. I got a bunch of disgruntled vets and I'm taking over'As far as real, tangible implementations go, it's just corporatocracy.
>>18132595another
>>18134765>As far as real, tangible implementations go, it's just corporatocracy.Braindead. How? Nothing in common.
>>18134788Explain what fascism is if not the state and private enterprises working together without accountability
>>18134858What you've described isn't corporatocracy. Isn't fascism either, but that's beside the point.
>>18134870Explain them to me, then.
>>18134872Corporatocracy is something like Syndicate where private companies hire mercenaries and wage wars between themselves. The strawman of anarcho-capitalism.Fascism, by contrast, is an old socialist idea about reviving guilds to enable a hierarchical union of businesses and the state meddling in production. Mussolini once described it as New Deal type of thing.
>>18131958>>18132055>>18132906>>18132328Fascism isn't a structured ideology. It's just the state priorizing aesthetics in the family, tradition, military etc. It's quite literally revolting against "reason" to establish what seems good/cool. They fight capitalism because "muh people shouldn't be poor :(", they priorize war and physicality because "muh strong chiseled men :D", they larp as historial fanfics because "muh empire epic :DDD" etc.As >>18132878 pointed out, the only reason Fascism (alongside all sorts of far-right nationalists parties) won during the interwar period was literally because the petty bourgeoisie had become a new sizeable social class and didn't want to see their privileges go away (e.g. how the NSDAP drained the liberal parties of their voterbase).There's a reason why fascism and the far right emerged simultaneously. There's always a factor that makes people lose faith in reasoned ideological plans and turn to reaction. Post ww1 this was due to the economical crisis aswell as the general trauma of the war, now it's because people are tired of stagnant living conditions and seeing obese fags on tv.
>>18131958Socialism is the corrupted form of socialism. All soclialist countries are vacuum for totalitarian regime because socialism requires people's individual rights (life, liberty and pursuit of happiness) to be taken away by strongmen. Its antithesis to democracy/capitalism where individual liberties determine the outcome without any government strongarming.
>>18134765>Uhh, violence is pretty cool
>>18135005>muh strong chiseled men :D
>>18135005>muh empire epic :DDD
>>18134765I do think this is correct tho. Mussolini's politics is more so a "anti-politics". He was reactionary, not revolutionary, but he embraced being reactionary. because the root word of reaction is ACTION. Socialists are utterly USELESS. THEY DON'T DO SHIT and that was one of Mussolini's early critiques of socialism. Even despite having actual socialist politicians in the Italian government they accomplished nothing. Criticize "muh heckin strong men :D" if you want but they got shit done. They ARE the real socialists, even without the ideological structure, the scholarly work or mapped out plans. They are the real socialists because they got shit done and they got it done fast.
