I always thought the Portuguese empire, contrary to what they believe, was closer to that of the Anglos than the Spanish. After all, they were the biggest traders of African slavery, and there are fewer percentage of indigenous remaining in Brazil than even North America. Only Spain gets to boast their morality.
>>18231810Apentinian thread.
>>18231810>there are fewer percentage of indigenous remaining in BrazilThat's because Brazilians are gigamutts. There might be fewer pure natives, but Brazilians have much more native admixture, most of them are pardos, Portuguese + Native
Depends on time and place. Sometimes the intermingling with locals went pretty far even in Africa. In Portuguese wars with Kongo there were some Portuguese settlers and their mixed families fighting at the side of Kongo.
>>18232033how come imperialism by brown people is more humane compared to by white people?compare spain, portugal, italy, and turkish empires with how barbaric the brits, french, dutch, and germans could be
>>18231810>>18231837There were just less natives in Brazil than anywhere else in Latin America and the ones who were receptive to Portugal's influence were integrated and intermixed with the Portuguese. Up until the 1700s Brazil was very mixed with native toungues still being spoken alongside Portuguese, but as the colony developed and the gold rush started it's population started ballooning like no where else in the continent with the exception of the US, with people from across Europe moving in, and by the 1900s the exodus from Europe to Latin America further diluted the total native admixture.
>>18231810>Only Spain gets to boast their moralitydid you forget it was spain who destroyed the biggest native cultures in the continent and killed millions with their diseases? just compare the lands brits took from the natives vs what spain took.
>>18232075diseases were not intentionalonly the spaniards could end their conquests to debate whether they were moralit took the anglos until the 60s to consider racial equalityimperialism by brown people is far more beneficial than by white people
>>18231810The glorious Spanish colonisation resulted in countries people are trying to escape from.The barbaric British colonisation resulted in countries people are trying to get into. You browbois are doing what commies did during the cold war. Oh communism is so great that's why they need to build a wall to stop their people from escaping(lmao). The reality is that the natives were a degraded species of man(read de Maistre's "On Human Nature" he touches on how savagery is a state of utmost degradation) and by mixing with them you only took the degradation into your very bloodstreams. Mexican cartel execution are just an evolution of Aztec and other mesoamerican people's ritualistic murder, it's not even some pathology - that's the natural course of events you'd predict from such mixing.
>>18232135they are escaping the countries that the spaniards built and the anglos destroyed and corrupted
>>18232238cope
>>18232242you are the one copingthe spanish were the ones who ended the human sacrifices and cannibalism in the americas, and brought civilization to the tribesthey have every right to boast their history and legacyanglos don't have the right to do any of that
>>18232296spain reduced unique civilizations across the americas to mentally ill violent mutts with a permanent identity complex (see: hispanchistas like yourself)
>>18232238>>18232296>SEEEENIIIOOOOR EL EVIL ANGLO BE KEEPIN US DOWN LA LEYENDA NEGRA O ALGOOOOyou're a subhuman spic moor rapebaby negroid animal
When did people start pretending spansh colonialisation wasn't monstrous? Inb4 muh black legend even Spanish Priests protested over the slavery and murder
Portuguese colonialism gets a bad rep because the Portuguese don't have giganationalist pseudohistorians ready to try to disprove every single bullshit accusation thirdworldist pseudohistorians throw at them.95% of the supposedly brutality of the Portuguese in India and Africa is actual bullshit and their biggest crime really was the slave trade but only from a modern perspective, the biggest years of the slave trade were to happen after Brazil's independence
>>18231810All three were fucked up.
>>18232689>95% of the supposedly brutality of the Portuguese in India and Africa is actual bullshitNope. It's all extremely documented and well known.>their biggest crime really was the slave trade but only from a modern perspectiveAnd plantations destroying the environment, relgious persecution, forced labour and wage theft, cultural destruction, shitty economic policies, military and police crackdowns
>>18232135>The barbaric British colonisation resulted in countries people are trying to get into.Which ones?
>>18232689what was the portuguese equivalence of Valladolid Debate, Laws of Burgos, New Laws?did the portuguese build 25 universities like the spanish did?
>>18232765>extremely documented and well known easy to say when you only use sources completely hostile to the Portuguese. normal acts of war suddenly become genocide in the minds of third world scholars>>18232825native slavery was banned from the getgo but colonists invented workarounds>universitiesPortugal was a centralist country unlike Spain. Portuguese students from all over the Empire flocked to Coimbra.Besides, there were multiple higher level institutions that were universities in all but name, some of them later serving as the foundation for universities once the colonies went independent do notice as well that Portuguese imperialism really didn't go that much away from the coast. Except for the Brazilian gold rush, Portugal would only care about the interior of the colonies once the 19th century rolled up, so the population that lived under Portuguese suzerainity was smaller.
>>18232765Missed the second half of your post.>plantations destroying the environment ... when, exactly? The coastal areas of Brazil? They were already highly anthropogenic landscapes, as the Tupi tribes used a lot of slash and burnThe coffee plantations outside the Amazon started seriously only after Brazilian independence.>religious persecutionbanning hindu women from burning themselves, such horrible persecution>forced labour and wage theftAs I said, slavery was the worst crime of the Portuguese empire.>cultural destructionPlease state your case. I can't remember anything that might fit in here.>shitty economic policiesthat's not a crimeUnless you mean restrictive economic policies? Even then, I don't get exactly what you mean>military and police crackdownsI mean... you kind of need that to maintain order?
>>18232102The Spanish enslaved millions of Peruvians and Mexicans and worked them to death in silver mines, no wonder they all died of "disease".
>>18233226two words: goa inquisitioni’ve even seen some indians say that the portuguese make the brits look like saints, and that says a lot
>>18231810>British Colonialism was like an Iron Maiden album coverWow. Mucho ProfundoUna cerveza por favor
>>18232135The countries you mentioned saw their native population wiped out or reduced to insignificant numbers.
>>18231810Portuguese exterminated every native in Brazil they came across and the only ones alive in that country are those isolated tribes well within the Amazon.Portugal was far more cruel and barbaric than the Brits
>>18233296>goa inquisitionso third worlder revisonism, gotchaOne thing about modern Indian politics that you've got to understand is that the Hindutva party sees everything that's foreign to an idealised version of Hindu culture is a crime against India and should be fought against at any cost. Indians have crazy theories about all Christian and Muslim converts there having converted only due to money that's supposedly promised to them. Many Indians even support an anti-conversion law, which should tell you about the general attitude towards Christians for many Indians.Now, what happens when you have an empire that's actually trying to evangelise, like Portugal? Those of course become the demons to every Indian. Never matter the fact that Goa is one of India's best states, no, the demonic Portuguese raped and destroyed all good hindu temples.Any narrative on regards to Goa should be viewed as incredibly suspect. India conquered that region without clear consultation of the locals' wishes and has sought to import huge numbers of foreigners in order to change their demographics. Actually, I'm sounding a bit crazy here, so let me say that this could also easily be explained as simply Indians from poorer regions seeking to move towards a richer state, which really should tell you a lot about Goa.
>>18233469Reality: there are native communities that still live in the same place where they signed treaties with the Portuguese 500 years ago, like the Tupinambás of OlivençaUnlike other empires Portugal stopped counting you as native (= barbarian} as soon as you adopted Christianity and the daily use of the Portuguese language. And even then, the native settlements weren't completely separated from the Europeans settlements so natives on the coast mingled with Europeans from very early on. Natives also mingled with other native groups on mission settlements which means that their collective identity was diluted.
>>18233469Illiterate.>>18231810Portuguese adventurers in Brazil married locals and used their acquired familial networks to press more locals into service, in a system called cunhadismo. The very first bandeirantes, the jungle explorers and slave-catchers were mostly born from these unions. Early portuguese colonies in Brasil, nominally beholden to the Crown and the Church, were a racial and cultural mix of Portuguese and Tupí culture; the Tupí people were the locals living by the shore that the Portguese first met and are related to many Amazonian peoples, in the Tupí-Guaraní language family. The area was never as densely populated as those colonized by Spain, however, there being no great civilizations (concurrent with the colonizers - there are traces of lost cities in the jungle and much of the soil is anthropogenic).Later white and black (slave) newcomers dilluted this element in the population.Portugal had a consistent dearth of settlers, even though it tried to proccur white brides (Orfãs d'El-Rei) for it's men. Miscigenation and the import of slaves was how it coped with the population/manpower issue.
>>18233296Goan inquisition is purposefully overblown in India because it justifies their anti-colonialist beliefs. It's basically the portuguese equivalent of the "brits stole trillions from india and killed millions". In reality the Inquisition targeted people who performed rituals like sati, religious extremists, jews (of course) and policed converts. It was more of a political tool like it was in Portugal>>18233469>this totally happened, just trust me broThere is literally no records of large scale armed conquest in Brazil
>>18231810i wonder who is behind this whitewashing of spanish/portuguese colonialism
>>18231810>>18233626Dutch and Anglo whites raped Native women too.Most old stock white Anglo Americans are castizo or pardo by Latin American standards.Many Anglos have a portion of Native DNA.It's just that the Native population of US and Canada was less dense and many also died of disease, so the proportion of Native blood is less, like 5% per person instead of 50%British Anglos also fucked Indian women in India, creating Anglo Indians.In Indonesia, Dutch fucked so many Indonesian Muslim and Hindu women they created the Indo ethnicity.Geert Wilders is Indo and he has Indonesian facial features.Old stock white Americans and Canadians are all casinos.I don't know whose pushing the claim that British and Dutch didn't fuck Native women because they did.
>>18231810The Portuguese left East Timor alone.East Timor was only one third Catholic, and two thirds animist when it became independent from Portugal in 1975.Majority of East Timorese were pure natives and spoke their native languages.There was only a small mixed race mestiço elite in East Timor.Portugal like did nothing with East Timor for centurie when it was there.East Timor only became majority Catholic during Indonesian occupation.
>>18233585The revisionism needs to stop.
>>18233578Orfãs d'El-Rei in east Africa and Asia were given to native rulers who converted to Catholicism.Some Black African Muslim and Maldivian (South Asian pajeet) Muslim royals converted to Catholicism and were married to these Portuguese women.
>>18233576>Portugal stopped counting you as native (= barbarian} as soon as you adopted Christianity and the daily use of the Portuguese languageIn theory. In reality Mestiços In Africa dealt with BS from the metropole and colonial administration. "Assimilated Africans" was only in name because the eays to attain it were more obtuse and cost/time consuming than attending for a raid in Vanilla Wow. You could get your status flipped at anytime if the admin decides to and a ptoerstant missionary reaching you or your ancestor first meant you were fucked since you needed tk be Catholicm
>>18233648Basically this is saying a non-white royal is worth a Portuguese commoner woman instead of a princess or noble woman.
>>18233226>banning hindu women from burning themselves, such horrible persecutionKilling Hindus, killing Muslims, killing African and other nin Abraham's religions around the Indian Ocean. Detaining and basically enslaving subjects for practicing "witchcraft".>slavery was the worst crime of the Portuguese empire.And it still went on long after abolition. Ever colonial power world wide just swapped to forced labour and other measures to extract free/extremely discounted labour.
>>18232102>imperialism by brown peopletoo bad they're incapable of such
>>18233663Napoleon carried a non-white Moorish paternal haplogroup.
>>18233663During the rule of Almanzor's Amirí regime, the already-rich Al-Andalus slave market reached unprecedented proportions. For example, the Moorish chronicles mention that after destroying Barcelona in July 985, Almanzor brought seventy thousand chained Christians to the great market of Córdoba[317] and, after destroying Simancas in July 983, he captured seventeen thousand women[374] and imprisoned ten thousand nobles.[483] Obviously, these figures must be carefully evaluated, but likewise given the enormity this type of trade reached during his tenure, Almanzor is described as "the slave importer".[317] The commoners of Córdoba even asked his successor to stop the trade since, to get a good husband for their daughters they had to raise the dowries to exorbitant levels because the young Christian slaves were so numerous and cheap that many men preferred to buy them instead of marrying Muslims.[484]
>>18233675north africa and the levant region were both white until relatively modern times when they became majority brown due to race mixing between the indigenous white population and foreign dark raced slaves>>18233681not an empire
Why do latinx larp as iberians? You lost, your nations and culture are a failure, which is why you're here, on an American website, speaking English.
>>18233702>dark racedRetarded ESL Brazilian gives himself away again lol
>>18232135>The glorious Spanish colonisation resulted in countries people are trying to escape from.>The barbaric British colonisation resulted in countries people are trying to get into.no, till like xx centurybefore it was opposite, its fairly recent phenomena
>>18233631Pocahantas
>>18232771The US, Canada, Australia and New Zealand.>But india and Africa is a shitholeIs Mozambique better than South Africa? Is Goa the shining beacon if civilization in India? I'm afraid not.Brown boys are really delusional.
>>18233366And it clearly served them better than getting mixed with them.
>>18235205mozambique’s crime rate is considerably lower than south africagoa is the richest part of indiacope and seethe white anglo, brown iberians were better at civilization
>>18231810Brazil had a very low demographic density of Indians to begin with.>>18231837No, most brown Brazilians are mulattoes. Indigenous ancestry is present but generally a lot lower than in most Spanish-American countries. Someone with visibly Amerindian traits in São Paulo for exemple clearly stands out from the other brown people and usually has Bolivian, Paraguayan or Peruvian ancestry.
>>18232102why the fuck did we stop this? why the fuck did we let those niggers loose?why the fuck did we delude ourselves that niggers could be normal humans?
British colonialism wasn't even bad. Most of it happened when British people had already realised they had some kind of duty to the colonised people. They failed to build strong enough colonial states to really take care of local business, but they weren't tyrannical
All forms of European colonialism were positive and benevolent
>>18231810Spanish colonizers were as murderous as British colonizers, so I've heard
>>18231810need kuruminha
>>18236514Indian wages went down during the british empire
The civilizations the Spanish conquered in southern America had populations of tens of millions collectively and actual cities and societies so it's more prudent to compare them to, say, British India or British Sudan than anything. And in that comparison the Spanish very clearly come up short. 90%+ population reduction in their conquered territories and mass rape of the survivors. Native Americans basically don't exist as a coherent group in most of the former Spanish EmpireEven for settler colonies the Spanish were way worse. They were far more economically primitive and extractive which is a big reason of why, say, Canada is so much nicer today than Argentina. And their brutal repression in Cuba killed literally twenty times more people than British attempts to stop American independence. And that's JUST Cuba. Literally millions died in all the Latin American Wars of Independence together.The Spanish were uniquely shitty colonizers. I genuinely can't think of any worse than them beyond one-off meme attempts.
>>18235205>Is Goa the shining beacon if civilization in India?Yeah?
>>18239358You can also compare the Philippines to Malaysia (+Brunei, Singapore). Both thinly-populated ethnically fragmented southeast Asian polities conquered and thrown together under 1 label by a foreign colonizer for convenience. The former is so much nicer than the latter and the difference was even starker when they were both under their respective power's rule. There's a reason that there was a Philippine War of Independence against Spain that killed hundreds of thousands and no remotely comparable discontent and violence at any point in British rule in Southeast Asia.
>>18239363It's just a tourist area like bali, or miami. All the coastal areas are the best.
>>18231810>Only Spain gets to boast their morality.0/10
>>18239344They were more V shaped than anything, they also went down after independence for a period as well. In both cases it happened due to rapid population growth outpacing economic development as in they couldn't outrun malthus.
>>18239344The Indian population and economy grew under British rule. The amount of cultivated land grew. Port cities boomed. An entire class of native traders grew and spread around the world on British ships. British people were so willing to share and teach the Indians that they even founded the Congress party for them and taught them to rebel.
>>18239469Indian Hindus from cow belt states raped 9 year old Russian girls in Goa.Names of rapists were all Bihari or Uttar Pradesh Hindus, not one local Goan.
>>18239875>The Indian population and economy grew under British ruleThat's meaningless if wages don't grow in gold.>>18239848Wages have been dropping since fiat currency was adopted. It was easier to see the value of wages when they were in gold and silver.
>>18239369>>18239358>And their brutal repression in Cuba killed literally twenty times more people than British attempts to stop American independence. And that's JUST Cuba. Literally millions died in all the Latin American Wars of Independence together.>There's a reason that there was a Philippine War of Independence against Spain that killed hundreds of thousands and no remotely comparable discontent and violence at any point in British rule in Southeast Asia.All that violence was because of the Anglo-Jewish Masonic subversion THOUGH.
No matter who the source is, Dutch, British, French, or Spanish, the understanding of Portuguese Brazil is that the Portuguese were evil bugs.
>>18231810He is proud of being a mixed race bastardo lmao
>>18232075We literally had entire debates on how to treat the indigenous pop humanely and give them their God-given rights.The Church even promoted marrying to avoid children born out of wedlock, as the Spaniards and the indigenous chicks were going crazy for each other.
>>18232344not even thathttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_influence_of_Evangelicalism_in_Latin_Americathe US pushed the same ideology in Latin america and Europe (christian democracy)
