How was a predominantly foot-mobile Chinese army able to outmaneuver and catch off-guard a highly mechanized superpower force equipped with tanks, heavy artillery, and total air superiority? Also was this the reason why the US didn't dare to invade North Vietnam during the Vietnam War?
>>18259345Golden Age PLA small unit tactics were decades ahead of their time. The army was also used to taking heavy losses against superior opponents to gain victory.The US Army in Korea was legendarily overconfident and undertrained. Enough time passed since WW2 that you lost that old core of vets. Put together and the PLA was very effective if commonly taking massive losses. This turned around in the latter half of the war, when the US was able to adapt and the PLA's logistics system started to break down.
There was no time to entrench and fortify the captured territory. US forces were stretched all over the north in an all-out push to drive the enemy out of the peninsula. Basically, MacArthur was gambling on the Chinese not making a move. His plans specifically counted on that fact, because the disposition of his forces left them vulnerable to a massed counterattack. The North Koreans on their own could not have mounted such a counterattack, since the American offensive had them will in hand. It all hinged on China sitting out on the sidelines. So when the Chinese crossed the border, everything fell apart for the American offensive. This is what comes from hinging your entire plan on "this definitely won't happen, it'll be fine".What's impressive, though, is that even though the Americans were caught flat footed and punished for over-extending, they regrouped and retreated in good order, and made the Chinese pay a very bloody price for the land they took. China was the last major power to enter the war, yet they suffered more casualties than any other party, more than both Koreas put together in fact, which is actually incredible to think about. China's losses in the Korean war were so terrible it effectively left their army a gutted ruin. Mao's son was among the war-dead, and they'd lost virtually every veteran unit that had fought against the Japanese a decade earlier. The core of their army had been ripped out and they basically couldn't recover from this. It sparked a serious retrospective by the CCP to figure out what they could've done differently to avoid such losses. Probably not marching whole battalions into American artillery fire.
>>18259350>PLA was very effective if commonly taking massive losses.Such tactics cost you in the long run. Pyrrhic victories lead to strategic defeats and costs of opportunity. The PLA could have won the war without throwing away half a million men. They could have really used those men later, could've been in a much stronger position to pivot toward Taiwan, could've kept an entire generation of soldiers alive to train men for future conflicts.
>>18259414Literally retook the entirety of North Korea in the process
>>18259419And what did that get them? North Korea was devastated from war. Once it held valuable industry, but all the PLA got was a ruined husk of a country. South Korea would go on to become a major economic power while North Korea for decades languished as a poverty-stricken buffer state. And the aftermath of the war left China without a veteran army. Yes, they took North Korea, but what did they do with North Korea that was worth losing their veteran army?
>>18259407>>18259414>We were fought to a stalemate but the subhuman bugmen despite our Overwhelming advantage in technology, firepower, and experience but it was cuz them Chinks were willing to sacrifice 6 gorillian lives>dont forget how many gooks we killedThe hubris and delusion of the Americanid
>>18259345>How was a predominantly foot-mobile Chinese army able to outmaneuver and catch off-guard a highly mechanized superpower force equipped with tanks, heavy artillery, and total air superiority?China had been thru a civil war, WWII and another civil war, nobody expected them to be in any kinda condition to launch an invasion and as nobody had any diplomatic contact with the Chinese government, nobody knew what was going on in China.Meanwhile, the success of driving back the North Koreans turned into a plan to liberate the entire Korean peninsula, with US/UN forces speed running after them as fast as possible with the result that Western forces were strung out and sitting in the middle of nowhere when the Chinese hordes poured over the border.With superior numbers and surprise, the Chinese pushed the Western forces back but it came at the price of horrendous casualties from zerg rushing straight into the teeth of American firepower and by late spring 1951, the Chinese were spent and broken.At this point Stalin stepped and offered a cease fire but the plan was never to sign a peace treaty, just to gain breathing room for the Chinese and Norks and reinforce and resupply the remaining troops.Despite the US at that point being poised to carry out another and far stronger counter-invasion, Truman took Stalin's bait and the Korean War from then on turned into a pointless brutal WWI style trench war that eventually petered out.>Also was this the reason why the US didn't dare to invade North Vietnam during the Vietnam War?After suffering massive losses, it was the Communists who changed their tactics, avoiding a stand-up fight with the US who could blast them to pieces and instead, used unconventional guerrilla warfare after the Korean War.
>>18259428>they shouldn't have fought as hard because they should have known it wasn't going to be worth it in 30 years time or somethingTerrible argument
>>18259428>all the PLA got was a ruined husk of a country. South Korea would go on to become a major economic powerYou can't use the "hindsight" argument when:1. Both countries were destroyed by two armies fighting up and down the peninsula2. Neither the UN nor China were in charge of the Koreas after the war ended. And they weren't in charge of the politicians and the steps they took that resulted in where they are now. 3. China wanted to keep their buffer state Communist country, the extended goal was to put everything under their buffer. In that case they won the war by accomplishing their primary goal. And to this day, they still have that strategic buffer.
>>18259428Norks were actually the wealthier of the two until the 1970s.
>>18259605>And to this day, they still have that strategic buffer.is today 1965? North Korea is only useful today to supply rare earth minerals to China.
The PLA never actually recovered from the Korean War incidentally, their good soldiers and officers were all shot up and that experience lost forever.
>>18259622They seem to have recovered just fine
>>18259640>literally no combat experience in modern history>last war was 46 years ago and it resulted in the loss of 20k dudes in Vietnam in 3 weeks
>>18259605>2. Neither the UN nor China were in charge of the Koreas after the war ended. And they weren't in charge of the politicians and the steps they took that resulted in where they are now.Nonsense, North Korea was utterly dependent on both Chinese and Soviet aid just to keep the lights on, (most of the time) while South Korea was literally transformed into a Western nation with the US insuring it would be loyal to us.>3. China wanted to keep their buffer state Communist country, the extended goal was to put everything under their buffer. In that case they won the war by accomplishing their primary goal. And to this day, they still have that strategic buffer.North Korea has become an albatross hanging around the Chinese neck, it's of little value yet requires Chinese economic aid and constant political placation, as the crazy Norks have nukes.
>>18259930>loyal to usAmerica is dying
>>18259414Not really.I don't think that you are aware of how dire the PLA equipment situation could be.Having a rifle with more than a handful of cartridges was high level. Having a squad with only two types of rifle ammo was better than average.The PLA needed to rush in close and often literally fist fight America for ever inch of land taken, and did not have the option of choosing ideal battles or waiting for more resources.
>>18259930as he said the main purpose of North Korea at this point is just to provide China with rare earth minerals and Chinese companies own most of their mines
>>18260306It was pretty terrible all the way to the 80s, only since China's industrial boom in the 90s could the military be equipped adequately and not be chronically short on clothing, shoes, and equipment.
>>18259646the PLA was pretty non-serious until Xi Jinping reformed them into a proper modern military but they still totally lack any modern combat experience
>>18260306ha ha my grandfather was an officer in the CPVA and a lifelong true believer in communism. he said the only time he momentarily had doubts was when they found how the American soldiers all had luxuries like candy bars that the average private got as part of his rations while in the Chinese army they were extremely scarce and only occasionally available to upper echelon officers.
>>18259930The Norks have always had an independence streak and rarely follow the Chinese model or interests.
>>18260306>>18259414I doubt the "training" these men could offer would be of much value, beyond advice about how to survive as a Chinese disposable soldier.
