Christianity is a Judeo-Semitic religion that made its way throughout the entirety of Europe; it arguably was just as brown of a religion as Islam was upon its foundation. If Islam historically made its way through Europe with more Europeans practicing it, would it be more appreciated, or would they have been persecuted like Jews? Or is Paganism the only way to go?
>>18421299If Islam were practiced by Europeans, it wouldn't be the same Islam, it would be a far more moderate version of Islam with more Hellenistic influence
>>18421299No. The problem with Islam is the ideology itself
>>18421299Islam could only be taken upon by dysgenic populations (and clueless women), so no.
>>18421299Whites aren’t respected, they’re a race of goycattle cannon fodder
>>18421299You mean like Bosnians?
If Islam was around in Europe for longer, you probably wouldn't have white Muslims playing dress-up and cosplaying as Arabs I'm sure the Mosques would use local materials instead of looking fake as fuck, like a plastic copy of those in MedinaThat would go a looooong way
>>18421299>Would Islam be more respected if it were practiced by white Europeans?Yes. The problem is 100% racial when it comes to islam. Nobody wants to be around these brown subhumans.
>>18421299I fully expect in 1000 years for retards on 4000chan to be talking about how based and European Islam is and how Islam is actually an European relgion and calling Christians LARPers.
>>18421299It's called Bosnia
>>18421299Islam was respected, which is why films like Lawrence of Arabia were made,the concept of a genie made its way to Western pop culture, and Hitler said Islam was better than Christianity
>>18421299Christianity is a very European religion, with 1k-2k years' pedigree of cultural evolution, depending on region. Tied to the roman empire, the sacred language is latin, a European language. And to a leser extent, greek.Islam is not. Islam is a very non-European religion, with a small pedigree in southern Spain that was entirely stamped out. Islam is tied to being oppositional to the roman empire and western tradition, with arabic as its holy tongue. It developed non-European cultural traditions, like marrying your 7-year-old cousins and inbreeding until you're genetically retarded, and swirling around a cube with a stone in it. Islam is associated with being brown and stupid.So all in all, your question is stupid.
>>18421473>>18421693 Bosnians aren’t considered white by anyone.
Modern Islam isn't medieval Islam and has nothing really to do with it, it's just Marxist anti-colonialist ideologies in a religious wrapping.
At least on 4chan, YES. Mormons are far more batshit than Muslims, but since they are seen as mostly nice white people they get a pass. Muslims, seen as "filthy browns" get denigration.Personally, I'd rather live under a Muslim theocracy than a Mormon one... Both would have no alcohol. Under Islamic rule you get no pork but at least you get coffee and tea and nicotine (although there have been anti-smoking fatwas).
>>18421299>Would Islam be more respected if it were practiced by white Europeans?It would be more respected if it was consistent
it would be more respected if they listened to sufi mystics instead of whabbiist retards and assimilated into western culture while maintaining the religion, or if they valued being an intellectual again instead of blowing themselves up because they saw a womans ankle in the west oncei mean indians get shit on too, but its because they are indian, not hindu, hindus arent going around killing people in the name of ganesh or some shitanyways, islam in the west even pre 9/11 was always seen as a negorid brown turd person religion. White people who venture from chrisnitay usually go towards Buddhism, zen Buddhism in particular became very popular in the 50s-60s
i have respect for the turks for being the only muslims to secularize, all because attaturk beat it into them.in general young western people arent religious, but are familiar with christ and Christianity islam is seen as brown, founded by a pedo war lord, filled with terrorist who dress their women in garbage bags i mean even if you are an atheist you can commend jesus for his character, being the prince of peace
>>18421299Lol. If islam were practiced by white europeans, civilization itself would've ceased to exist. 1000 years ago.
>>18421299>Christianity is a Judeo-Semitic religion Then so is Islam by that logic.
>>18421321>clueless womenRedundant
>>18421299>>18421302>If Islam historically made its way through Europe with more Europeans practicing itSome evangelical denominations/sects are about as retarded at enforcing their ghoulish beliefs with the only difference that instead of "blow yourself up and you will have 40 virgins" there is "waste your life to make some degen richer on the offhand chance that you will go through pearly gates during Rapture".
>>18421868There's a theory that Islam is actually successful Marcionism. That refers to Marcion of Sinope who was a Christian heretic who showed up in Rome around 140 AD and argued the God of the Old Testament (the one who commanded the slaughter of peoples, drowned the world in wrath, etc.) couldn't be the same God as revealed to Jesus Christ in the New Testament. Then Marcion began editing his own canon that stripped out everything tying Jesus to the God of Israel. He got excommunicated for this but some of his followers lived on for a few hundred years.>Unlike the Bible, the Qur’an does not present itself as a continuous narrative in which meaning accumulates through temporal progression. Nor does it exhibit a clear overarching compositional logic in which individual units are ordered toward a discernible end. What we encounter instead is a compilation of proclamatory passages marked by a striking stylistic uniformity but little explicit narrative scaffolding. The text moves abruptly between genres and registers: brief Biblical allusions to well-known figures and episodes; eschatological warnings and visions; exhortatory sermons; legal or moral instructions; liturgical formulae and hymnic declarations. These materials coexist, overlap, and recur, often without transitions, chronological markers, or narrative closure.
>>18422664Except Islam teaches that Allah is the same as YHWH, just that the Quran is the final in a series of successive revelations that were corrupted, Jesus was a Muslim, etc.>>18422640Islam is a Western religion, it could be argued.https://youtu.be/cRpWnR0OLuQ
>tfw tempted by a beardless youth again
>>18421321>taken upon by dysgenic populations (and clueless women)Literally how Christianity began in Europe kek
>>18421302That's literally what happened during Islam's beginning so if you aren't referencing that you're a fucking retard. The retardation you're seeing now mostly stems from South Asian influence.
>Why is Islam so retarded?Because instead of worshiping the one true living God, the body of Christ, like they are supposed to, they instead worship a cube. Islam was created so that the dark hell-spawned demons could worship the light of God in Christ, one true living God instead of being destroyed.Sadly, they no longer recognize God, and have become rather retarded.
>>18423284Yeah man Christianity is really smart just look at Africa and South America. Also the fucking people at the oval office comparing a dementia ridden Trump to Jesus and speaking in tongues.I hate Abrahamism. Why is the whole world based around you people trying to bring the end of the world because you're think a dead man is going to save you from accountability or something?
>>18421849Not true, there were libs who called Clinton a racist for intervening to save white Bosniaks but not black Rwandans
>>18423284lol imagine thinking monotheists don't recognize "God" but people who worship a human man as god do.
>>18421299The main problem with Islam is Mohammed. How in the name of fuck could anyone think such a figure a holy man? The Koran itself is dumb as fuck too and not in away profound. Europeans are too intelligent for Islam. Christianity and pre Christian European paganism are far superior in every way to shitslam
>>18423404>a human man
>>18423446Yeah I've seen your schizo personal interpretation of Christianity posted before. What denomination agrees with you? Do you have a cult or is it just you?
>>18423471>your schizo personal interpretation
>>18423494Christ is considered fully man and fully God, you've just considered a major heresy you fucking imbecile.
>>18421299The Quran is quite coherent and could have some appeal in the West but none of the main branches of Islam actually follow it directly, they follow the Hadiths which are much more tenuous and require more cultural context to understand.Also, they insist the texts should be read in Arabic which is a non-starter for Europeans. At least Latin was closely related to their own languages. Nobody is going to learn a language to see if they might like a religion.
>>18422664This is the wrong read. Yes, it probably originated with heretical Christianity but it definitely wasn't Marcionism, which condemned the Old Testament God.
>>18423599The biggest shift in Islam was that it wasn't a textual based religion for a long time. Shia Islam had Imams and proto-Sunnis had their caliphs who were the ones who placed the rules on religion. The Sunni caliphs got decimated and the only prominent Shia sect has no Imam so the transition started there. You can still see the political implications in Dagestan and even Iran has tried to switch to a more Sufi model, much to the dismay of the clergy around them.
>>18423609Thanks for the extra details, you're clearly much better informed. I guess it's kind of like Judaism then, the Masoretes are a much later development, with it being many oral traditions prior. Sufism seems like it could actually work in the West. Immigration and its backlash have definitely complicated things.I remember growing up, that Arabia was just this cool other interesting place like China or India, with its own myths and mystique, flying carpets and genies and scimitars, etc. Then 9/11 happened and it's just been endless struggle and friction since then.
>>18423620In the West people mostly convert either to a liberalized Sufism or Salafism. The former is for people searching for spiritual meaning but not a fan of the strict rules associated with Islam. Salafism is because it is very easy at first glance and the Islamic view of God is infinitely more cohesive than the Christian view they grew up with. It's also extremely prominent and has funding from Saudi Arabia. The ideology is extremely anti-intellectual though which, while does have appeal to reactionaries upset with the liberal world order. It's attractive specifically to people who hate Western views wholesale.All this to say is that I agree with you.
>>18421299Let's flip it around. Do people respect Catholic or Orthodox Africans?
>>18422695>while still being profoundly unable to figure out how soap and water works
>>18423581You don't recognize Christ, and you hardly know who Jesus was, you're in no position to debate the finer points of theology with anyone, cube worshiper.
>>18423638I don't care about Jesus all I know is you 90 IQ retards are trying to commit a nuclear holocaust for your stupid messiah myths and you're all fucking retarded.
>>18423641What are you talking about nigga we just want the oil
>>18423641dispensationalism (what you're referencing) is a retarded heresy invented by jews in the 1830s.Again, you are a retarded cube worshiper who is as far from the promised reward as you could possibly get
>>18423643Venezuela was willing to give US oil and you guys had a great deal with Iran to get oil. It's not for oil it's because christcucks love to suck Netanyahu's cocks and apparently little boy cock too.>>18423644I don't give a fuck about your cope all you guys talk about is how Christians are the spiritual Jews. Catholics spend their days sucking off to Jews and the pope loves them too. I hope the Islamic world and the whole world secularizes but it won't because it's opposition are you fucking clowns who literally want to end the world.
>>18422555>even if you are an atheist you can commend jesus for his character, being the prince of peaceLmao>i have respect for the turks for being the only muslims to secularize, all because attaturk beat it into them.Secularization is a massive joke that no one in the western world actually adheres to lol.
>>18422546>assimilated into western cultureWhat the fuck does that even mean at this point? Plenty of assimilated groups world wide still get shat on for being different. How would this be any special?>if they valued being an intellectual againThere's a ton of MENA and Muslim people in many research discoveries though. Do you stop being Muslim the instant you get a Nobel Prize?
>>18423643>>18423652It was never about oil or religion. The US is the largest exporter of oil in the world. This might be a big surprise to some of you, but there is a lobby of Venezuelan and Iranian Americans in America who do in fact hate their respective homelands current regimes. Shocking I know
>>18423643Bullshit, it's not about oil. Just like Iraq wasn't about the oil. Sure, the oil is a nice bonus, if you end up getting it, but the PRIMARY objective is enriching military contractors and shareholders in the military-industrial complex that Eisenhower warned you about. That's why you don't have to win, just spend money that will end up in the pockets of your buddies.Though that other anon DOES have a point though, many evangelical neocons think this is a holy war that will make Jesus come back. To the point where they have the President threatening the end of Persian civilization and saying shit like "Praise be to Allah" on Easter. To them, WWIII is not something to be avoided but rather encouraged, they fully expect to be "raptured" before the nukes land.
>>18423630Yeah I definitely don't hate Western views overall but do have woke fatigue like everyone else. That doesn't mean we should abandon everything.I have to admit Islam feels vastly more coherent. The contradictions disappear. Pure monotheism. No trinity mental gymnastics. Paul invented the religion and the church (He literally did by his own admission in the epistles, and a bunch of them are even fraudulent...). Christianity is this weird fusion of ideas that don't quite work together and tradition has just made it seem like it does.It would be nice if we could just go back to things being cool and safe to explore like Buddhism or Taoism, without all this geopolitical and racial tension, which just adds a lot of baggage to actually exploring the ideas.
>>18421299Praying five times a day is already more effort than most Westerners are willing to put in. Combine that with the insistence on learning Arabic, the autistic obsession with hijab, and the retarded Hadiths, and you have a religion that is off-putting to anyone who isn't a brown turd worlder. The average Westerner has more exposure to Islam now than ever before and yet the only people converting to Islam are social rejects looking for a countercultural religion and way of thinking.
>>18423658>but there is a lobby of Venezuelan and Iranian Americans in America who do in fact hate their respective homelands current regimes.So? What about that means the US has to invade those countries? Can the US government not say no to a lobby?
>>18423682Money is money and most politicians are just glorified camgirls with better foreplay.
>>18423652>doubling down on insisting dispensationalism is real christianityonly in your dreams, jew
>>18423663It's (Sufic) Islam or Taoism for me. Buddhism suffers from being too monastic and distant from the world like Christianity, and even worse when it comes to being spiritually watered down than Islam in the West. It's basically impossible to join any religious group as a Taoist anywhere in the world as well which means removing ego and following someone enlightened is practically impossible.
>>18424022Nta but just figured I’d share some vids from some prominent Sufi leaning western Muslims Is orthodox islam possible without Sufism?https://youtu.be/uQWNeGyRu0k?si=vVGQq-teFjUJ1mCgRiding the tiger of modernityhttps://youtu.be/07Ien1qo_qI?si=KuV4LnMK0CUg5YGUTheology of the Muslims (playlist)https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbUiSjN6S8fNaqmiJuGkV6O-mzlBFr446&si=Gp7yC-JKGU_l2GhLI reverted about a year ago & while I agree that the Hadith tradition can seem tedious and unnecessary at times, I started to understand it when I started seeing stuff like so called sufis talking about how their DMT trips bought them closer to God & things of that sort. My personal rule of thumb is to try and not to learn too much from brown people as they’ll usually be too strict for my liking, but people who can speak fluent Arabic & English with no accent. Sounds dumb but it helps me sort things out a ton.
>>18421299It’s the fastest growing religion in the west, so we’ll probably know for sure in a hundred years or so inshallah
>>18425036the fastest growing "religion" in the west is atheism
>>18421299>The wonderful culture of the Moors in Spain, which was fundamentally nearer to us and appealed more to our senses and tastes than that of Rome and Greece, was trampled down (I do not say by what sort of feet) Why? Because it had to thank noble and manly instincts for its origin, because it said yes to life, even to the rare and refined luxuriousness of Moorish life. The crusaders later made war on something before which it would have been more fitting for them to have grovelled in the dust: a civilization beside which even that of our nineteenth century seems very poor and very senile.
>>18424305It'll be a while before I finish these videos but I am listening to the first one as I type this.>while I agree that the Hadith tradition can seem tedious and unnecessary at times, I started to understand it when I started seeing stuff like so called sufis talking about how their DMT trips bought them closer to God & things of that sort. I don't hate hadiths but just hate when they're taken literally, as strict rules to be applied today, or really anything that isn't tertiary. The Quran is way more historically proven to be accurate unlike the vast majority of hadiths, and both (as texts) are secondary to experience.
