contrarianism

yeah, anecdotally I have never met a theist who is smarter but I'm sure they exist
you need to use your head

>>18426164
what kinda boomer thinks it's edgy and rebel to be an atheist in the 2020s?

>>18426171
Unironically most of the theists I've met were way smarter than me

>talking snake

>>18426174
kids of religious parents, who are 30% of the population in america

if you can believe in god, you certainly have the imagination to believe in above average atheists

>>18426182
This can be real, also this is another trait I find often in atheists. They seem to be very spiteful of religion, sometimes they sound really butthurt

>>18426181
>>18426195
>proving the point

>>18426163
Atheist iqs actually cluster in the opposite pattern. There's the high iqs and then there's those who are straight up too retarded to even conceptualise theism.

I think atheists prolly just lack imagination and abstraction ability, hence they seem not to be able to conjecture anything that's not material or directly observable

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Religion IQ ranking (Lowest to Highest)
Muslim -> Christian -> Jews -> Atheists -> Deists

>>18426498
>You think X is bullshit? Heh, that means you literally can't conceptualise X!
Daily reminder that Christians cannot model other minds.

>>18426498
It's quite that unironically.

It's funny cause they're not even aware of how
empiricist they are

Religion actually isn't a good predictor of IQ
Higher-IQ Christians for example probably don't think that snakes could literally talk, they still believe in God but they probably don't treat the Bible as some literal documentarian piece, they're closer to Deist than they are Christian
Atheism also isn't a religion, so it's even harder to generalize, since it just describes a very broad range of beliefs in the same way that Theism itself isn't a religion and just describes a broad range of beliefs. I tend to think people who subscribe to Hard Atheist philosophies are probably pretty low-IQ compared to Soft Atheists who just don't see the pragmatic use in believing in a God unless we have enough evidence to know the nature of said God in the first place.
And for what it's worth, some of the highest IQ people in history like Albert Einstein seemed to lean closer to some vague form of Deism and insisted they weren't atheists.

>>18426516
>I tend to think people who subscribe to Hard Atheist philosophies are probably pretty low-IQ compared to Soft Atheists
That's ironically because you adopted the New Atheist motte and bailey epistemology. Most academic philosophers are atheist, and "atheism" is synonymous with "hard atheism" in philosophical discourse ("soft atheism" is called "agnosticism").

>>18426163
>but every single atheist I've encountered in my life was an absolute midwit
this but for devout christians

>>18426210
>They seem to be very spiteful of religion, sometimes they sound really butthurt
were you raised in a religious household where your boomer parents used religion as a behavioral cudgel if you got out of line which in turn made you spiteful against it? because i was, and that's what the baby boomers across the country did.

85 IQ boomer christians are the biggest reason for christianity's decline in the west, at least as far as america is concerned.

>>18426520
Isn't Agnosticism closer to Hard Atheism? Agnostics assert that it's impossible to know the nature of God or whether or not he exists, but Soft Atheists don't assert that it's necessarily impossible, just that we lack evidence and shouldn't jump to conclusions based on our limited knowledge.

>>18426520
There is no practical difference between atheism and agnosticism. The latter is a term people are more comfortable with because because most people, even people who are not religious themselves, think "atheist" is synonymous with "immoral". "Agnostic" is a purely self identification term for someone who behaves identically to any other non-believer.
Frankly many theists in secular societies are also functionally atheists, in that they do no go to religious services or pray with any regularity, and their notion of God is vague and non-committal, and they are really only "religious" because they were raised that way and religion doesn't play a large enough role in their lives for them to think too hard about it one way or the other.

>>18426526
That's not how the terms are used within academic philosophy. In that context, what you call soft atheism and agnosticism are just two agnostic positions, with the former making a more modest agnostic claim and the latter a more ambitious one.

>>18426539
I don't know what academic circles you participate in but for all intents and purposes, agnosticism is the more ambitious claim, it's not a lack of belief, it's the assertion that belief simply isn't possible. It's somewhere in-between soft and hard atheism

>>18426542
>agnosticism is the more ambitious claim
That's what I said.
>It's somewhere in-between soft and hard atheism
The fact that two claims are more ambitious than a third claim doesn't mean they're also more mutually similar. What you call "soft atheism" is more modest agnosticism while what you call "agnosticism" is more ambitious agnosticism. There is a difference in degree but both are closer to each other than to atheism.

>>18426524
>were you raised in a religious household where your boomer parents used religion as a behavioral cudgel if you got out of line which in turn made you spiteful against it? because i was, and that's what the baby boomers across the country did.

MUH PARENTS FORCED ME TO GO TO CHURCH AND NOW I BITCH ABOUT IT AROUND

>>18426552
Your parents want you to get drafter for a war with Iran so that Benjamin Netanyahu can build the third temple and usher in Moshiach, lil bro.

>>18426163
Why would you spend time espousing atheism if you didn't have an axe to grind?
Atheism doesn't have anything to discuss. God isn't real, not that or that, and not that one either. So what else is there to say? Any discussion of atheism almost invariably becomes just criticism of religion, and criticism of religion tends to draw a lot of angry people who have the aforementioned axe to grind.
Religions have had thousands of years to shape themselves, they aren't science, they may contain elements that are illogical or impossible but overall they generally can neither be proven nor disproven by simple human deduction. Any religion that could be objectively disproven by just having a think about it would have died out a long time ago. No one with a brain spends time butting their head against that wall. There are legitimate reasons to be concerned about the influence of religious thought were you think it doesn't belong, but that isn't what motivates the stereotypical fedoralord who seems to just want to feel intellectually superior by pointing out that a miracle would break the laws of physics. If Hume didn't destroy religion with that argument a reddit post won't, either.

>>18426555
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8qZ4qzDICg
?

>>18426554
Killing Shia fundamentalists is based

>>18426559
>dying for bibi netanyahu is based
wew lad

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>>18426163
How stupid do you have to be in order to believe that demons are real?

In the thousands of years that religion has existed, it has never given a single instance of proof that any of its dogma is actually true and to the contrary, you'll never find a bigger collection of child abusers and scammers than the inside of a temple.

>>18426552
>MUH PARENTS FORCED ME TO GO TO CHURCH
only until i was about 9. around that time was when all the child rape stuff started coming out and thankfully my parents stopped going because of that. so no, it was more that kinda stuff that disillusioned me from the church more than being forced to go.

>>18426562
This is word salad.

>>18426498
>hence they seem not to be able to conjecture anything that's not material or directly observable
The issue is the Abrahamic faiths make material and observable claims. The majority of the Christian Bible including the Old Testament is historical subjects. Adam and Eve, Noah's Ark, the Tower of Babel, the Exodus, the history of Israel to Christ's life and the Acts of the Apostles are all historical stories which can be investigated just like any other historical event. Maybe deism and Buddhism etc are immune to empirical criticism, but the Abrahamic faiths aren't

>>18426524
>this but for devout christians
devout christians aren't midwits but complete idiots

>>18426562
that depends on what you count as demons and how well they fit the description, plenty of beings here on earth can count as one

>>18426163
Justin Holmes the guy who runs DZ Debates channel on youtube is an atheist and smarter than every christard that calls him.

I mean... being an atheist is worse than being a literal bible retard because both are blind but at least the second one is trying to do "good" even if he doesnt understand hes a part of the problem

The first one is just a retarded midwit trying to feed his ego the success he will never get in real life (there are literally 0 people who make a living out of being atheists, people work jobs and claim to be atheist because they dont like/want their actions being subjected to morals)

>>18426711
>not believing in sky daddy means they have no morals
you christkikes really love your mythical headcanons

>>18426729
>something came from nothing
>thus good and bad exist
Try harder next time, bitch. Youre not even worth a reply.

>>18426163
Literally every study shows that more intelligent people are less religious and that top scientists are the least religious of all.

You are wrong, your thread is based on wrong assumption. No, 4channer larpers aren't smarter than reddit atheists.

>>18426163
The fact that you think "demons" are something reasonable to believe in tells me everything I need to know about you.

>>18426163
Polling shows that atheists are actually smarter.
You must be projecting your retardation.

>>18426516
>Albert Einstein seemed to lean closer to some vague form of Deism and insisted they weren't atheists.
lol
lmao even
>"The word God is for me nothing but the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of venerable but still rather primitive legends." (Letter to Eric Gutkind, Jan 3, 1954)
>"I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly." (Letter to Joseph Dispentiere, March 24, 1954)
>"My position concerning God is that of an agnostic." (Letter to M. Berkowitz, Oct 25, 1950)
>"I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings." (Response to Rabbi Herbert Goldstein)
You could stretch it, and call him a pantheist, at the most extreme. But he's just saying that he believes in the universe.

>>18426834
That's all compatible with a Deistic worldview

>>18426516
Einstein's IQ was never tested. You seem to be mistaking intelligence for IQ.

>>18426210
Yea people make the world a really bad place to exist because they believe in wrathful judgemental demons and don't think life starts until after you die and it is better the worse you make things for everyone else by doing things like biting off infant foreskins, why shouldn't that make people just trying to live life incredibly butthurt?

>>18426498
Except theists are the ones who have to anthropomorphize abstractions because they can't consider unbounded abstractions unless they are presented as magical old kings who live in the sky.

This tranny atheist thinks its not obvious he's samefagging LMAO

>>18426516
High IQ christians/jews/muslim/theists are just the cult leader sociopaths exploiting occult demonology that can be used to psychologically manipulate dumb fearful people, they don't actually believe what they say, what they say is just a means to an end which is just to have as much power over other people as possible.

>>18426797
>The fact that you think "demons" are something reasonable to believe in
There is literally nothing unreasonable about a belief in demons.

If you think high iq people are right then you have to deal with the fact that nearly all of them are libtards.

>>18426516
Deist is a made-up shit, nobody believes that. Most smartoids are monists.

>>18426861
>actually all the smart people don't believe in nothin'
nah libtard

>>18426700
>plenty of beings here on earth can count as one
No, not at all, demons aren't born and they don't have to mature, they are created whole from spiritual precursors like some king demon's desire (if its born its a half-demon at best), so that excludes every being on earth.

>>18426555
They can be disproven when its a materialist religion like Christianity which makes historical claims.

>>18426868
There are absolutely demonic, "born evil" people.

>>18426711
>there are literally 0 people who make a living out of being atheists
Anyone who makes a living that doesn't necessitate communing with a god and receiving its blessing is making a living out of atheism instead of theism.

>>18426752
So you don't even understand basic math or know that 0 is the value of nothing, + is positive (ie good), - is negative (ie bad) and 0 = +1 -1?

>>18426516sh complimentary quality was the high. All the germans spoke fluently English, and of course non of usage speak a second language by 14th grade.

>>18426838
Deistic worldview doesn't really make sense, if it lacks personhood and personal agency, it isn't a god, its just a categorical abstraction.

>>18426866
>Most smartoids are monists.
>monists existing when we can explicitly perceive falsity and illusion
kek

>>18426867
Good job proving theists like you can't even read since I very clearly said that smart people who put a theist mask on definitely believe in psychological manipulation and power accumulation.

>>18426871
Demons aren't born, so if something is born it isn't a demon, it is a half-demon at best, but since demons and half-demons are imaginary beings that have never been thoroughly documented outside of books of demons this is a pretty retarded conversation you are trying to steer the thread to.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1186/1936-6434-6-3

Eminent scientists reject the supernatural: a survey of the Fellows of the Royal Society
>Fellows of the Royal Society of London were invited to participate in a survey of attitudes toward religion. They were asked about their beliefs in a personal God, the existence of a supernatural entity, consciousness surviving death, and whether religion and science occupy non-overlapping magisteria (NOMA). Overwhelmingly the majority of Fellows affirmed strong opposition to the belief in a personal god, to the existence of a supernatural entity and to survival of death.

>Overall, the majority of Fellows indicated lack of belief in God (Table 1), with 78.0% strongly disagreeing (answer 1 or 2) and only 8.1% strongly agreeing (answer 6 or 7). Disbelief in a personal God was even stronger; 86.6% strongly disagreed (answer 1 or 2) and 5.3% strongly agreed (answer 6 or 7). Belief in consciousness surviving death was reported at a similar level; 85.0% strongly disagreed (answer 1 or 2) and 8.1% strongly agreed (answer 6 or 7).

>>18426883
yes, you did indeed claim smart people don't believe in nothin'

>>18426894
Yes, you did indeed prove you can't read and don't even understand basic grammar and punctuation.

>>18426895
so the only way to truly believe in something is to be an antitheist is what you're getting at.

>>18426884
You even sound demonically possessed.

>>18426898
No my illiterate demon worshiping friend, the only way to believe in something is to put it into practice and the only things the smart theists actually put into practice is to rise the ranks of their theist organization and accumulate as much power as possible through social manipulation since drinking the "blood" out of the "gold" chalice never actually gives them the magical powers they want to put into practice.

>>18426900
What exact octaves of noise do you hear when you read text that contradicts you and start feverishly hallucinating demon voices as a result?

Because 99% of *vocal* atheists have some ulterior motive besides an honest uncertainty about god as an abstract philosophical concept.

Imagine a reasonable intelligent Chad, a superior specimen of humanity who may have been taken to church as a child but gradually it waned until one day he decided "I don't really believe Jesus walked on water, I guess I'm an atheist now". Regardless he doesn't feel the need to rant about it all day because he sees the good Christians do with charity and building families and communities. He knows people have been ranting and debating it for centuries and he'd never get anywhere with it anyway. He focuses on his career in finance, social life and later in his life his wife and family, although he has no belief in God he still has faith in other things, that there is some good in this world worth fighting for.

He may well be a cynic and aware of how corrupt and fucked up society is, but these are material things, when it comes to the nature of the universe he's not going to go full Joe Rogan, schiz-out and say "dude the world is run by interdimensional demonic forces", he will join whatever group of likeminded people working against it. And he won't be posting on r*ddit about it, if he wanted answers he'd read a book, not Richard Dawkins, he'd read the classics, the reputable philosophers who shaped vvestern civilization, maybe renaissance and enlightenment philosophers too.

>>18426903
>more word salad

>>18426890
One more study
https://www.nature.com/articles/28478

Leading scientists still reject God
>The question of religious belief among US scientists has been debated since early in the century. Our latest survey finds that, among the top natural scientists, disbelief is greater than ever — almost total.

>>18426500
Most accurate post in this thread

>>18426905
I'm saying you sound jewish and act jewish.

>>18426163
>atheists as a group

>>18426907
4channers are mindbroken by reddit so much that they become retarded as a result of it. Your post exemplifies that.

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>>18426163
isn't this the history board?

>>18426925
History and HUMANITIES (includes philosophy)

>>18426916
>t. the one on the side who worships a jew and considers jewish lore to be divine canon

>>18426163
theres just no proof for God or Gods to exist. You can come to this very obvious conclusion regardless of your intelligence. You just need to grasp simple logic. No proof for someting = no reason to believe in it.

>>18426936
Yet you replied to your own post >>18426915
and declared Jews to be above Muslims and Christians.

>>18426947
No, you simply still can't read or draw logical conclusions which is why you believe retarded nonsense and worship jewish demons in the first place.

>>18426953
Keep deflecting.

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>>18426947
NTA, he is just right

>>18426925
The only history thats talked about are war generals and the only humanities that are talked about is religion. This is the war general/religion board with some off topic philosophies/history appearing from time to time

Atheism lowers fertility, so its dysgenic, as smarter people don't reproduce under it.

>>18426958
>t. the jew worshiper who originally invoke jews and keeps trying to assert their superiority to distract from your lack of argument

>>18426977
Yes, you're jewish we get it.

>>18426979
>For if you believed Moshe, you would believe me; for he wrote of me. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe my words?
- Yeshua Ben Yosef

>>18426979
>durr me worship uh jew, so dat meens dat you is da jew

>>18426982
>>18426995
It's alright, I won't tell :)

>>18427000
You can't tell anything from the next thing because you clearly can't read and process written information due to your retardation.

>>18427005
Got it, what else jew boy?

>>18426516
>Higher-IQ Christians for example probably don't think that snakes could literally talk
This is an empirical claim, you should investigate it

>>18427013
If you want a jew boy, ask the one you pray to whose demonic voice talks to you whenever you read something you don't like.

>>18426872
Lol???

You're still butthurt about the meaning of 0?. No wonder you're an atheist, you spend all day posting inane bullshit on an image board instead of actually doing something with your life, lmao

>>18427016
Ah, you're projecting your schizophrenia still, are we?

>>18427025
Sure sure, anything else, jew worshiping, jew boy?

>>18427020
No, the meaning of 0 mathematically definitely proves my point and disproves yours which is why you are clearly the one who is acting like a butthurt namecaller instead of furthering your own points with actual logic.

>>18427034
You donr even know the definition of 0, dumbass. Lol.

>>18427036
You are just projecting because you don't clearly understand that 0 is defined as the mathematical additive element and acts as the fulcrum that balances the positive and negative which is why it is exactly equal to +1-1.

>>18427040
>0 is defined as the mathematical additive element
Lol...

What happens when you divide by 0?, can you divide 0 by 0?

Your chatgpt definition is very lacking, it's really giving me second hans embarrassment to read your retarded pleas for attentiom

>>18427040
>muh negative numbers proves 0 exist, goyim!
niggerlicious bullshit

>>18427045
Thanks for admitting you are the one that doesn't understand what 0 or how to use it mathematically, but it doesn't make sense for you to say I am lacking when you are the one asking questions because you lack basic math knowledge.

>>18427054
No you illiterate retard, the fact that positive and negative cancel each other out completely proves that 0 necessarily exists.

>>18427062
So, you were unable to understand what chatgpt said so you just dont want rl say anything because you know youll be ridiculized

I accept your concession

>>18427063
You are chatgpt in this scenario and you don't think I understood you even though I directly addressed your question that rose from your lacking the necessary knowledge to answer it yourself?

>>18427071
Lol

>>18427080
Any other silly retard noises you want to make instead of ever once having a rational thought?

>>18427062
>No you illiterate retard, the fact that positive and negative cancel each other out completely proves that 0 necessarily exists.
>the nonexistence of something proves it exists
this is what negative number niggers actually believe

>>18426163
Look up Homo Academicus and their connections with the Professional Managerial Elite.

>>18426502
Literally who cares you oversocialized faggot

>>18427093
Additive element isn't nonexistent, though, it is the foundation of modern math.

>>18426176
You must be a thick cunt then

>>18426163
Most people everywhere are midwits

That's what the term means

>>18426163
Has it occurred to you that the atheists you've talked to are teenagers in their edgy, outspoken militant atheist phase and that there are plenty of intelligent atheists who don't care about religion in their daily life?

>>18426210
The vast majority of athiests haven't put much more thought into what they think/demand than "HAHAHA! FUCK YOU DAD! I AM SAYING I HATE GOD AND THERE'S NOTHING YOU CAN DO ABOUT IT!!!!!"

>>18426524 looks like a pretty typical example.

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>>18426163
this is what happens when atheists come on top

>>18426163
Atheism is a disease. You can think you're a brillian Atheist, but if you deny your own Creator, how can you be that brilliant?

>>18427533
Jews can't fly

>>18426498
One reason I had a years long atheist phase was because I thought religion is nonsense because it does not feel like anything. It honestly still does not feel like anything, but I am more convinced that something more than matter exists. I still don't really get anything out of religious rituals in all honesty .

>>18427533
>but if you deny your own Creator
I'm open to the idea that we have a creator but the notion that people speak mandarin and people speak french because a bunch of proto-jews built a tower in ancient Mesopotamia 5k years ago is fucking retarded, I can't help but not believe it

>>18426163
>>18426164
Abrahamism is a diary of what happens when you try to implement 130iq ideals into an 80iq population.
You end up with thinly veiled satanistic "atheists" oppressing the world because they're too butthurt about not understanding God.

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>>18426562
>demons are real
its not socially acceptable to call them that anymore, but theologically it is what they are

>>18426562
This is what the demons want. If you believe that then you will be in for a rude awakening

>>18426163
The only way you can endorse the bible **with a shred of intellect** is to say the vast majority of it is metaphor and never literally happened. Or that they've taken various historical tales and had a 4000 year old game of telephone where they got hugely embellished with time.

If you believe in Genesis, Exodus, or the Jesus's miracle's **literally**, you're a guaranteed dolt. To literally endorse these stories, you have to abandon history, science, and common sense. And be a completely malleable shitwit.

I have met intelligent Christians but they understand the majority of their Holy book are metaphors and not literal truths. And it should be noted that intelligent Christians are like .001% of them. The majority of them are swept up in bullshit that wouldn't fool an unindoctrinated toddler.

>>18429073
>You end up with thinly veiled satanistic "atheists" oppressing the world because they're too butthurt about not understanding God.

Do you realize how dumb this sounds to anyone who isn't swept up in bronze age myth? Christians give themselves way too much credit as intellectuals.

You believe shit that wouldn't fool an unindoctrinated toddler. A normal 2 year old would say what you just said is stupid and they'd say it to your face.

>>18429123
JEW DETECTED OP IS A JEW
JEW JEW JEW JEW JEW JEW JEW JEW

>>18429141
>You believe shit that wouldn't fool an unindoctrinated toddler.
interesting that you would assume that I am your idea of "christian", when christianity itself is an internal reaction to this abrahamic infighting and hatred of the world and themselves.
>>18429141
>A normal 2 year old would say what you just said is stupid and they'd say it to your face.
i guess the average non-abrahamic 2 year old does indeed have a better grasp on what I said than (You) do, because they're atleast capable of acting according to their upbringing and interpret any questioning of abrahamism as silly intra-cult gibberish, whereas (You) didn't even manage to recognize that my post talks about how people within this headcanon (seem from the outside) would react and develop a pessimistic worldview.

>>18426552
Yes, it is in fact a bad thing for your parents to force you to participate in stupid shit
>DADDY TOOK ME TO COMMUNIST STRUGGLE SESSIONS AND NOW IM A LITTLE PISS BABY CHUD

>>18426163
>holy shit the world is actually run by inter dimensional demonic forces
I like how the supposed intellectual of the right amounts to a boomer shitposting on Gab after watching an Anunnaki documentary.