>Don't you worry, Mr. Gorbachev>NATO will never expand one inch beyond East Germany
>>18441377>As you know, I'm the eternal dictator of the west and get to make binding promises vocally, and not a temporarily elected official of a single state, who would have to ratify such a treaty with my parliament and those of all other nato states before making a valid promise
>>18441382This is what Gorbachev heard, unironically
>Don't you worry, Mr. Hussein>Mr. Baker has instructed me to tell you that the Iraq-Kuwait issue is not of interest to us
>>18441382Okay, but why complain when the other side adjusts their actions accordingly?
>>18441377Explain to me why Ukraine can't join NATO for the defense/ article 5 area of the organization but then agree not to host any bases or soldiers within its borders? If Ukraine and Russia don't agree to a deal like that then they are lost.
>>18441411Puccia wants keev.
>>18441411Because russia was never actually afraid of NATO bases or attacks or something. They hate NATO expansion because it stops their own expansion.
We are going through the Cuban missile crisis in reverse, Putin was right to crash out the US has no qualms with breaking the golden rule.
>>18441419If that were the case there proposals for ending the war would include Kiev region and not just Donbas plus Crimea. >>18441424It stops Russia from “expanding” into their own territory. Kiev hasn’t controlled Donbas since 2014.
>>18441464>If that were the caseIt is the case because they sent police units into Kyiv on week 1.>Kiev hasn’t controlled Donbas since 2014....because Russia invaded it in 2014. Land grabs aren't seen as legitimate and "it's been a while" isn't an argument.Also here's a direct quote from Putin:>I am absolutely convinced that Ukraine will not shy away from the processes of expanding interaction with NATO and the Western allies as a whole. Ukraine has its own relations with NATO; there is the Ukraine-NATO Council. At the end of the day the decision is to be taken by NATO and Ukraine. It is a matter for those two partners.https://web.archive.org/web/20220220154206/http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/transcripts/21598
>>18441471Donbas and Crimea are Russian territories that Ukraine invaded and has been occupying. Remember Yuri Meshkov? That was literally an invasion in 1995 that the international community sat and watched happen because they hate Russia.
>>18441464>If that were the case there proposals for ending the war would include Kiev region and not just Donbas plus Crimea.Puccia knows the proposals will never go through. It's a humiliation ritual.
>>18441464Russia doesn't seethe at ukraine joining nato (which it doesn't and wasn't ever allowed to) but at the rest of the warsaw pact (poland, baltics, romania etc.)
>>18441482Russians should be exterminated to the last Ivan.t. Warsaw pact country anon
>>18441377Wrong. The agreement was IN East Germany not past it. The US still held their end of the deal. There isn't a US base in East Germany
>>18441474>because they hate RussiaRussia shouldn't act like a bunch of niggers to the west then
>>18441497In 1995, Putin wasn’t even in power. Kiev ousted Meshkov just because he was too pro-Russia for them.
>>18441500Its crazy how all the countries that suffered under russian rule are anti-russian and take actions to not be controlled by them.
>>18441500Sounds like Keev knew what getting too cozy with R*ssia entails. But let's be real, all slavs had known that for a while. It's just russiaboo Westerners like you who still haven't got the memo.
>>18441377Yeltsin officially supported Poland joining NATO in 1995
>>18441505>> It's just russiaboo Westerners like you who still haven't got the memo.Your countries are ran by Azov-Neonazi gangs who want to use my country as an unending piggy bank you can just pilfer for money and weapons because people living in a sliver of land called Donetsk speak a different dialect than you and have a different religion.
>>18441406Russia invaded NATO?
>>18441401Hussein had ultimatum before Desert Storm. He could just you know retreat his army from the Kuwait. But of course he would look like beaten dig here also judging by his experience of Iran Iraq war there would be millions of American casualties, they obviously would just back down after couple weeks of fighting.
>>18441382This is how all third-worldists unironically think western governments work.
>>18441536So you really are a westerner who fell for pyccknn propaganda, gotcha. Btw I'm a latin slav, not a cyrillic slav.
>>18441424This delusion that America is untouchable and no country can expand will be its undoing. America is not the undisputed global hegemony any longer. Other great nations are rightfully owed their sphere of influence. Who are we to deny Ukraine, a fabricated state with less legitimacy than an independent Britanny or any Iberian separatist group (funny spain gets to wack all those away without criticism), from its rightful civilizational head. You think Russia or china care about the US meddling over all the Americas? No. Because they know our domain. The future super civilization states of Eurasia, East Asia, and America will dominate. Western europe is too faggy and parochial to be an independent pole. Some bantoid super state is more likely than a unified EU
>>18441382Using elections as an excuse to violate agreements when those elections are controlled by hereditary oligarchs is extremely perfidious.
>>18441377And why is expansion of NATO, a defensive alliance, bad?
>>18441474Meshkov never tried to secede from Ukraine, but he did try to coup the Crimean parliament and that's why the national guard was sent in to depose him. Russia sat by and watched it happen too btw as Yeltsin fully recognized the territorial integrity of Ukraine, as did Putin until 2014.Spain quashing the attempted Catalonian secession in 2017 was more of an invasion than this, and likewise the rest of the world ignored it, do you think the rest of the world hates Catalans?
>>18441569>agreements Lmao
>>18441562>Other great nations are rightfully owed their sphere of influence.HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHQHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>18441531Russia also tried to join NATO but they were denied, the US doesn't want peace they want Russia gone.
>>18441562Anon, "spheres of influence" cannot be split along neat geographic lines and never have been. The states that wants to be in your sphere, or are forced to, are in your sphere, wherever in the world they may be.In the Americas in particular Cuba, Venezuela and Nicaragua are firmly in the Sino-Russian sphere, always taking their side against the US and the West, while the rest mostly try to play off both sides. If the US was to invade a country in the Americas, the way Russia invaded Ukraine, Russia and China would certainly try to support the invaded country if they were able to, especially if that country was one of the three I mentioned.They do not give a shit that it is "your" domain as they want to grow their influence and power globally, and at your expense.
>>18441562>You think Russia or china care about the US meddling over all the Americas? No. Because they know our domainDo libtards actually believe this?
>>18441711That's a bit of a simplification. Those three make deals and have embassies w Russia and the DPRK for instance but others like Sheinbaum are defacto in the Russian camp and Milei in Argentina are in the US camp, they just don't put it outright that way on paper.
>>18441562>You think Russia or china care about the US meddling over all the Americas? No. Because they know our domain.Retard there's Russian military in Cuba, Nicaragua and Venezuela RIGHT NOW helping to foster socialist regimes that oppose the US.
>>18441377Why would any parts of the former UDSSR join a defensive alliance against their brother nations?Clearly, this is an Anglo-Saksii plot.
>>18441500Ukrainians just don't want to become another Belarus, and I don't blame them.
>>18441569>violate agreements A verbal promise is not a legally binding agreement. I know this is a foreign concept to you, as a third worlder, but in the first world if you want something to be held as legally binding you have to formalize it in a treaty, or law, which is backed by the mandate of the state. Our politicians are simply elected officials, their "promise" is not a legally binding promise on behalf of their country. It only applies to them, personally.
>>18441762Christ what an embarassing post. Russia is hardly even helping Iran and you think Nicaragua or China have any meaningful support from Russia.And Venezuela... Nigga rhe US litteraly captured Maduro and his successor licked up the cum left over.
>>18441562There have been communists from Russia and China active in the Americans for over 70 years, you fucking disingenuous piece of shit.
>>18441826Russia isn't helping Iran because it can't, really. It was, and still is, helping those countries in central and south America. It's help just isn't worth very much
>>18441649I thought coups were good. They installed Poroshenko in one.
>>18441745I was thinking of the geopolitical world order that we're used to, before 2025, because at present it's hard to know what to think as the US has alienated almost all of their traditional allies and cozied up to some of their traditional enemies.
>>18441848In the new world off the top of my head, Mexico and Panama are cozy to Russia and China yet oppose Trump on everything. El Salvador and Argentina are in Trump's field. Trump likes Argentina and Russia but not Mexico and wants Greenland.
>>18441562>Other great nations are rightfully owed their sphere of influenceNo nation is rightfully owed shit and Russia is incapable of decisively defeating Ukraine. Their neighbors in Europe all hate them and distrust them and they're squandering their ever-shrinking population on a grinding attritional war in Ukraine.
>>18441838Poroshenko won a free and fair election.
>>18441826>you think Nicaragua or China (sic) have any meaningful support from RussiaI don't "think" they do, it's a fact that there's Russian military personnel in there.>rhe (sic) US litteraly (sic) captured MaduroYes and it was swapping six of one for half a dozen. The entire regime is still there with a new bitch a the top. Huge fucking change lmao.
>>18441710>source: it came to me in a dream
>>18441817But Ukraine was promised to us 3000 years ago!
>>18442601The Soviet Union officially applied to join NATO on March 31, 1954
>>18441817They don't want to be a functioning state? Seems to me like they're doing a good job so far if that's the case.
>>18442759An agitator against the west
>>18441817Belarus has been in better shape than Ukraine for 35 years now.
>>18442759>>18443037lmao, I don't know what standards you have, but Belarus is an agrarian shithole with zero chances of becoming anything else.At least Ukraine was in its way of pulling a "Poland" until the war happened.
>>18442627If they made the reforms necessary they would have been let in
