Has a nation/civilization ever thrived or done well with a declining population or stagnant one?Im looking to history to help me prove that >muh declining birth rates are a problem!Is nothing more than astroturfed nonsense from people who want to make a buck off more soldiers, more tenants, more workers, more debtors, more consumers...anything to make the arrow margin higher than the last year.
>>18446886No. But then, there's never before been a time when there were robots and AI. For all of history until the last few years, population and economic output have been the same thing. Now that's no longer the case, so looking to history to predict what happens next is useless.
>>18446886>muh declining birth rates are a problem!But they are. Every nation uses a system of taxation which presupposes there are more young people than old people. That is the fundamental assumption for retirement and welfare programs to exist. There must be more people contributing to the pool of money than drawing on it. I think people like you, who dismiss population decline as a non-issue, simply don't understand it. You imagine that population decline is something like a random reduction in the number of people, evenly spread across society. But that isn't how it works. Population decline is the final stage of a demographic inversion. A healthy, normal demographic pyramid has many young people and fewer old people. What happens when people have fewer children, and life expectancy increases, is this pyramid narrows into a column, and then if it worsens, the column becomes an inverted pyramid, with more old people than young.This means in practice that there will not be enough taxpayers in the next generation to support the elderly in their retirement. The retirement age will be pushed up, and eventually abolished, because the state will require the income taxes of those old people to prevent massive budgetary shortfalls. But then the old people start dying, and there are not enough young people to replace them. So government is forced to shrink, everything is forced to shrink. For abstract entities like governments and corporations, this is fine, but we don't live in an abstraction. We live in a real world, with real infrastructure that will become effectively abandoned. We will not have enough people to maintain everything.This is where things start to fall apart. Because society will have to choose which critical positions must be filled, and which go unfilled. Certain specialized knowledge and skills will be lost. Probably first in medicine and high tech, then in more basic industries and fields.Then the systems collapse begins.
Ever heard of the Renaissance?Happened after Black Death.
>>18446886Sorry anon, your animes are going to be voiced by Viets in 20 years. It's ogre.
Everybody move to Vietnam NOW
>>18446900Can population decline be fixed by flooding nations with worthless subhumans?
>>18446952that's what Canada is doing, they increased the population by 10% in 2 years by bringing in vast numbers of Indians. 10% more people working means line goes up.
>>18446942smaller generation just means less talented seiyuu, it's not like there are no Japanese kids anymorethey'll outsource to Vietnam but they're already doing that>>18446952there's no such thing as worthless subhumans
>>18446993err, outsource some of the animation to Vietnam, I can't proofread
tibet had a declining population during medieval times due to the dominance of buddhism. nothing bad really happened from it internally but eventually the chinese made them increase their birth rates
>>18447004Didn't they have tantric practices where you achieved enlightenment through sex or am I thinking of some Indian shit?
>>18447013They didIndia probably also had those, Buddhism (even the weird shit most popular in Tibet) crossed international borders, but Tibet absolutely did
>>18447013they did but you were not supposed to ejaculate or it would be considered a failure. the taoists also had such practices while also still practicing semen retention. also i think sexual tantra is supposed to be a relatively advances technique that not everyone practiced
>>18446952Define what you mean by "fixed". If you mean "Can we restock the supply of wagecattle golems" then the answer is yes. If you're asking whether this will restore the civilization, then the answer is a resounding no.>>18446993>there's no such thing as worthless subhumansWorthless subhuman detected.
>>18446955Line went down per capita. Maybe jews really are just niggers
>>18446900Maybe boomers should have saved money
>>18446942Vietnam is already below replacement rate.
>>18447034>they did but you were not supposed to ejaculate or it would be considered a failureSo it was spiritual edging?
>>18447127Yes
>>18447112Flips then, or Indonesians. There's always more third world brown hordes.
>>18447519Thankfully indians too are now below replacement level.
>>18446955The line is going down and Canada is a shithole kek
>>18447717Bullshit. Maybe in their best cities, but rural Indians are still popping out 7+ kids.
>>18446886>Has a nation/civilization ever thrived or done well with a declining population or stagnant one?In the mid to long term no.
>>18447730>>18447109>The line is going downNo not really. Unless you think global shocks like covid and the oil fiasco rigjt now is somehow exclusive to Canada.>Canada is a shithole keyYou spend too much time on Twitter and YouTube lmao.
>>18446952>Asks loaded and dishonest question. >gets mad when people don't mindlessly agree.Why?
>>18448915>BullshitYou didn't provide any counter evidence. The fertility rate in India has proven to have dropped in the past decades and there's countless stats to prove it.
>>18448954Burden of proof is on the person making the claim, not the person refuting it.You can't just say Indians, who are known to breed like rats, have a South Korea tier birthrate now.
>>18448959it's from official government statistics, there were news articles a couple years ago when they dipped below replacement TFR
>>18446900>Certain specialized knowledge and skills will be lost.That will never happen because we have all the knowledge stored.
>>18448959You can say that because there are multple stats to show the fertility drop
>>18448994Not even remotely close. Only those with no real idea or actual stake in the problem say this.
>>18449000Give an example.
>>18446886to my knowledge there is no historical state or people that had a similar situation. Depopulation events happened all the time of course, but the demographics were never a reverse pyramid with more old than young people. At the same time, industrial and technological advances are huge and should suffice to keep things going. But The Economy™ will of course suffer and that cannot be so mass import of cheap labor from foreign countries it is
>>18449024Trade secrets, job experiance and mentorships, historied institutions.
>>18446900>Every nation uses a system of taxation which presupposes there are more young people than old people.Then the problem is the taxation system.Of course population decline is a problem, don't get me wrong, I agree that it is a big problem, but what do you want, constantly doubling in population every few years? People were also worried about that when that was the case.
>>18446900>Every nation uses a system of taxation which presupposes there are more young people than old peoplesounds like the government is being run by hacks. pure skill issue
>>18449419>People were also worried about that when that was the caseIt was mostly Yellow Peril retards hypocritocally screaming about Asians for decades.
>>18446886For most of my life, I had been hearing that population growth was out of control, and the apocalypse would soon occur. Now I'm hearing that population shrinkage is out of control, and the apocalypse will soon occur. It's hard to know what to believe.
>>18446886the declining birthrates are only a problem for the western capitalists when deciding investment and shit like that. Asian countries hasn't trusted the western banks since the asian financial crisis.Lots of Japanese ppl I know are having kids. It's hard to have kids if you live in Tokyo, but westerners seem to not know that there's a Japan outside of Tokyo
>>18446886Well, no, but in the past people tended to have as many babies as they were able, hence if the population was shrinking it meant a lot of people were dying and things were clearly not alright. Couples just not having kids is a new phenomenon.
>>18449106that's just a stopgap, it can't continue infinitely when global population is also declining (plus public opinion turns against it as the numbers increase)
>>18449511Fertility rates in developed countries are too low, fertility rates in third world countries are too high.>>18449578Japanese fertility rates are atrocious and have been for a long time, declining fertility rates are a problem for all countries that run their economies and pension systems on the assumption of increased economic growth, usually through population growth since that's one of the easiest ways to grow your economy.
>>18446886>Is nothing more than astroturfed nonsense from people who want to make a buck off more soldiers, more tenants, more workers, more debtors, more consumers...anything to make the arrow margin higher than the last year.I just want to make a qt3.14 pregnant is that too much to ask. She'd be a hot mom then.
