Why did the UN let the Jews establish Israel?Didn’t they know it would cause more problems and tensions?
Because Jews own the UN
>>18472833Because the US and Soviet Union both wanted it in hopes of establishing influence in the new Jewish state. If both of the world superpowers want it, it's going to happen. Also, because the Jews had already established themselves fully in the land. The British tried to stop them prior but couldn't and gave up, passing the issue over to the UN to resolve. It was an inevitability that could only be resolved through war, which did occur after UN recognition with Israel emerging as the victor against the Arabs and solidifying themselves as a state.
>>18472833>Didn’t they know it would cause more problems and tensions?It was meant to prevent conflict, not create it.Haganah had already begun mobilizing for war in early November 1947. Irgun and Lehi were doing terrorist attacks in public places and arabs mobs were targeting jewish homes and workplaces. The British failed to establish any control or de escalate the situation.The UN was pressed to do something to stop what seemed to be an inevitable civil war. Their best solution was to create a seperate jewish and palestinian state since the two people could not coexist and neither refused to cease their attacks.People also forget that the UN plan was never implemented. The plan was only a recommendation, so all this talk about USSR and USA backing the plan is bullshit.Because the plan was never implemented, and civil war erupted, Israel declared independence, started to seize even more territory, arab states intervened and captured their own spoils of the region.Israel was mostly aided by France and Czechoslovakia. The overwhelming amount of weapons and materials used by the zionists were Czech.Britain was mostly siding with the Arabs. The jews used second-rate leftover weapons while the Arabs had modern Sherman tanks and Spitfire planes. Arab divisions were led by experienced British officers. RAF operated from Arab airfields and often had threatening skirmishes with the Israelis.USA was mostly passive during the entire conflict.
>>18472833Nobody "let" israel exist. They had a war of independence and won.
>>18472896>Because the plan was never implemented, and civil war erupted,Nice use of passive voice there. The jews accepted the UN plan, the arabs refused it and attacked thinking they could destroy them and steal back all the land they had sold to the jews (all jewish settlement prior to 1948 was on land legally purchased from arab landlords, often at exorbitant prices). Had they accepted it instead of chimping out the palestinians would be SO much better off today.
>>18472932>Nobody "let" israel existUnited Nations General Assembly Resolution 181 established the jew state in the middle east
>>18472941>Nice use of passive voice thereI was trying to be objective, unbiased. Not "passive".Very hard in these discussions but I tried.>all jewish settlement prior to 1948 was on land legally purchased from arab landlordsThis is true, but you're leaving out one critical detail.The jewish-owned land was only roughly 10% of the mandate, yet the UN partition plan was a complete 50/50 divide, and with that the jews were also given the the largest cities and the fertile lands and very important water sources. This is what caused the real resentment to the plan. Demographically the jews were roughly 30% of the mandate which also was percieved as unfair by the arabs to do a 50/50 split.>Had they accepted it instead of chimping out the palestinians would be SO much better off today.Civil war between Palestinians and the zionists had already largely begun before the partition plan, but yes you're right, had they accepted it then they would have had more land and just overall less suffering.For the Arabs it was a win-win to intervene since the arabs were mostly in it for themselves. This is the reason why they couldnt defeat Israel despite their overwhelming numbers and equiptment; they simply had individual agendas to capture territory for themselves rather than restorting an independent Palestine. Jordan annexed the West Bank and Egypt annexed Gaza. The Palestinian identity unironically died during this time and didnt re-emerge until after the 1967 war when Israel captured these areas.
>>18472951First of all the resolution was never implemented.Second of all the UN never lift a finger to help Israel actually establish itself in practice.In case you did not know, the Arabs and Palestinians rejected the plan and immediately attacked Israel. The UN stamp on the piece of paper meant nothing.Israels main aid came from Czechoslovakia, who sold them whatever was left from ww2.
>>18472999Britain gave jews a country and you faggots thanked them by trying to genocide all white people
>>18473004lol also Britain never lift a finger to enforce the Balfour promise. They had also promised the Levant to the Arabs for their uprising against the Ottomans.At the end of the conflict the British simply took the Levant for themselves and then tried to limit jewish immigration to the area because it caused civil unrest and thus made it difficult to control.I'd say the Haavara Agreement was more impactful since it was actually state-sponsored zionism. Thanks Hitler.
>>18472941>steal backYou can't steal something that was never the other person's.
>>18472833Basically, by the mid 1940s everyone on earth hated the British Empire and were trying to undermine their control of the Levant. The Germans and Italians were backing the Arabs against the British while the Soviets, French, and Americans were backing the Jews against the British. Since 3/4 of the major Allied powers supported the establishment of Israel, and the 'United Nations' was just the diplomatic vessel of the Allies, it was pretty much inevitable that Israel would be established after the war
>>18472833The Soviets and French created Israel as an anti-British moveAmerica came out in support since its also controlled by Jews
>>18473011Germany and Italy financed the Arabs. It was the Russians and French who financed the Jews. England tried to pit the Jews and Arabs against one another to maintain their own power but ultimately failed
>>18473053No the English very clearly supported the Arabs.Name me a single British officer that trained and led a jewish divison.Name me a single time Britain shipped modern weapons like Shermans and Spitefires to the jews.You cant. You're just making shit up and hope people believe you.Also anons who keep insisting that USA aided the zionists like >>18473049 and >>18473051 are basically a rubberstamp of not knowing any history and just come here with their /pol/ memes.USA barely lift a finger to aid the Israelis win that war. The main aid came from France and Czechoslovakia.
>>18473059I didn't claim England financed the Jews>The main aid came from France and Czechoslovakia.So you agree with me? That's what I said. The USSR and France. Or are you quibbling that there's a difference between Czechoslovakia and the USSR?
>>18473059America was the first nation to informally recognize Israel while the USSR was the first nation to formally recognize Israel.It was clearly a joint diplomatic project since both America and Russia wanted to see the demise of the British empire.But you're correct, in terms of material support it mostly came from Russia and France.
>>18473065No you said England tried to play a double game.They didnt.It's just some /pol/ bullshit that non-history morons keeps saying and then immediately rat out of the discussion when pressed on the question.It's literally impossible to discuss the history of Israel withour /pol/fags coming here to shit it up.Prove that England was playing a double game and supported both. The evidence is overwhelming that England supported the Arabs if they were to be supporting anyone.
>>18473067>But you're correct,So maybe you and every other /pol/fag should stfu and stay away from history?>America was the first nation to informally recognize Israel Ok so they sent their thoughts and prayers. That's very helpful. Very critical to the establishment of Israel against overwhelming enemies.
>>18473059>No the English very clearly supported the Arabs.Nope, the English were diplomatically neutral. This is reflected by them abstaining in the 1948 UN proposal. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Partition_Plan_for_Palestine#Abstentions_(10_countries)
>>18473071England had diplomatic relations with both Zionist and Arab factions and didn't openly support either. They wanted Palestine to remain British. I have no idea what you're sperging out about. I think you're confusing me for someone else in this thread.>>18473073Why are you so angry?
>>18473077>Why are you so angry?Because it happens every time"Kike USA and kike England established Israel""Ok explain""Well, something about diplomatic support and uhm... lol why you care so much?">>18473074>Nope, the English were diplomatically neutral. And who were the English selling weapons to? Arabs or Israelis?Who had British officers training and leading them? Arabs or Israelis?Who were RAF operating from? Arabs or Israelis? And who did Britain frequently threaten to attack and tried to limit the space of operations? Arabs or Israelis?Do you even know ANYTHING about the 1948 conflict? Or do you just have a bunch of opinions based on /pol/ memes?
>>18473059>No the English very clearly supported the Arabs.There may have been more British sympathy toward the Arabs but formally the British state attempted to play a neutral role. Which isn't that much of a surprise since either an Arab or Jewish victory would come at the cost of their influence in the region
>>18473082Except I literally didn't say that? I said America, France and Russia created Israel. Why are you sperging at me over what someone else said on a different board of 4chan?>America dindu nuffinDiplomatic stance matters when you're the most powerful nation in the world. If America had actually wanted to oppose Israel then they would have done so
>>18473082I'm aware there were weapon sales between the UK and Arabs. I still don't know what point you're making? We both agree that the British wanted Palestine to remain British and therefore didn't want either a Jewish or Arab victory. What point of that statement do you disagree with?
>>18473082>Conflating America and EnglandLmao. The US will always take Russia's side against England, just as it did ten years later in Egypt
>>18473073>That's very helpful. Very critical to the establishment of Israel against overwhelming enemies.Having the diplomatic support of America actually helps a lot retard. Which city do you think the UN is located in?
>>18473059>>18473082Why do Anglokeks so desperate defend their American masters? It's embarrassing. America backstabbed you in Palestine and then they backstabbed you again over the Suez. Get over it. The US will never treat England as an equal ally no matter how much you try to wish it into existence
>>18473071>>18473073>Muh /pol/>Muh /pol/>WaaaahHoly shit go outside retard. /Pol/ is retarded but they win if you let yourself get mindbroken by them
>>18473059>The main aid came from France and Czechoslovakia.Yeah. France and the USSR. "Czechoslovakia" was a Soviet client state they used to launder money through>>18473071>No you said England tried to play a double game.England did play a double game and you yourself acknowledged it earlier in the thread >>18473011They made promises to both the Jews and Arabs.I have no idea what you're sperging out about but it's embarrassing, stfu
>>18472984Realistically would the Arabs have accepted a 30/70 land split
>>18473059>>18473073>>18473082America obviously supported the creation of Israel lmao, what is this blatant attempt to retcon historyAlso no one said England supported Israel in 1948, that's just your own headcanon because you saw someone on /Pol/ claim that and you're coming here to sperg out about them
>>18473107Im Swedish.I just care about history.I know you dont tho. You literally have no idea about the 1948 war but you have a lot of opinions on it.>>18473117>England did play a double gameNot during the war you goalpostmoving retard.And if you keep saying they played a double game during the war then show me where and when otherwise stfu. They sold heavy equiptment to the arabs and trained/led arab divisons and operated from Arab bases. Doing absolutely nothing for Israel to fight the war isnt a "double game".>>18473103>Having the diplomatic support of America actually helps a lot retard.How many tanks, planes, ammunition, fuel, training, consulting, shared intel, diplomatic pressure on the arabs etc, did America provide during the 1948 war?>>18473095This thread is about the establishment of Israel, for which the US didnt really lift a finger to actually aid.>>18473089>I'm aware there were weapon sales between the UK and Arabs. I still don't know what point you're making? That Israel wasnt founded on British support like everyone claims yet retreat like rats when pressed on the issue.>Diplomatic stance matters when you're the most powerful nation in the worldHow many tanks, planes, ammunition, fuel, training, consulting, shared intel, diplomatic pressure on the arabs etc, did America provide during the 1948 war?In what other way does "diplomatic stance" matters? Can you provide something concrete? Something that actually happened instead of things you imagine and hope nobody checks?>>18473083>There may have been more British sympathy toward the Arabs Ah so there MAY have been more British support towards the ArabsI like how we're slowly moving towards the right direction in this debate because the memes can no longer be upheld.
>>18473141>Not during the war you goalpostmoving retard.That wasn't what was said, you're literally sperging out over something someone on /Pol/ said. Why don't you go to /pol/ to debate that person?
>>18473141>Ah so there MAY have been more British support towards the ArabsI never disagreed with you retard. You saw someone on /pol/ disagree with you and decided to lash out at me
>>18473147There are multiple people in this thread, and there will be multiple people next time a thread on the 1948 war is created, that will say that Israel was created because of USA and Britain.Did they approve the partition plan? YesWas the partition plan ever implemented? NoDid a war erupt instead over the creation of Israel? Yes Did Britain and USA in any way help solidify the creation of Israel to survive that war? NoAnd if yes, then how?
Lmao /pol/vermin are getting absolutely BUTCHERED in this thread
>>18473141Point to where I claim England financed Israel in 1948. You literally can't because you spent the entire 'debate' screaming at me over strawmans I don't believe in.I said England set the Arabs and Jews against one another which they objectively did, you acknowledged this yourself when you claimed the British gave promises to both parties>>18473151You keep conflating Britain with the US which is deliberately disingenuous. British foreign policy in the late 1940s was not the same as American foreign policy. This is reflected by Britain abstaining from the vote of the 1948 partition plan while America voted in approval
>>18473151>There are multiple people in this thread, and there will be multiple people next time a thread on the 1948 war is created, that will say that Israel was created because of USA and BritainYeah and those people are retards. My claim was Israel was created by America, France, and the USSR, largely in opposition to British interests
>>18473148> You saw someone on /pol/ disagree with you No I'm saying this board and this thread is obviously infested with /pol/fags with their memes about UK and USA being behind the creation of Israel, dog memes that they themselves 100% believe in to be true, but when pressed on the question they scatter like rats.
>>18473158Ok so debate those people? Why are you yelling at me about this?You think I'm hiding all my beliefs and I secretly think Britain created Israel, when everything I've said so far in this thread is the exact opposite?
>>18473157> My claim was Israel was created by America, Then explain how?Yeah they voted on the partition plan.Problem is that the partion plan was never implemented. Instead a war broke out and Israel declared independence on its own accord, and by that USA did next to nothing to aid them, so I'm very curious why you single out America as the top reason Israel was created instead of other candidates.
>>18472833Since when genocidal settler colonialists care for International treatiesZionists have been oppressing Palestinians since the late XIX century, I blame the Turks and the Arabs for the existance of the baby killing jewish regime
>>18473164>so I'm very curious why you single out America I literally didn't 'single out' America, I listed it as one of several nations that supported Israel, the other two being France and Russia.I don't think you know what 'single out' means. The only one 'singling out' America in this conversation is you because for whatever reason you're emotionally attached to denying them any responsibility.America is the world's most powerful diplomatic player. Their recognition of national sovereignty matters
>>18473153>Point to where I claim England financed Israel in 1948. What do you mean financed? When in 1948 did UK finance the Israelis?>You keep conflating Britain with the US which is deliberately disingenuous.I dont. I just put them both together because anons claim that it was America AND Britain who were the prime movers for the establishment of Israel, which means they must have aided Israel to win the 1948 war.
>>18473168>I just put them both together because anons claim that it was America AND Britain who were the prime movers for the establishment of IsraelOk, so scream at the morons who believe that. It's never been my claim. My very first post in this thread was claiming Israel was created against the will of the British
>>18473167YOU said that America helped creating Israel in that previous post.How did USA help CREATING Israel.And since you name USA by name, it means the US aid must have been as significant as the aid they recieved from Czechoslovakia and France.>Their recognition of national sovereignty mattersWhy? What did they do? What diplomatic pressure did they assert on the Arabs? What are you even insinuating. Why are you so fucking vague with your argument?Probably because you have no argumentYour argument is "eeehh USA is a main reason Israel was crated because .... they're a big country... next question please".Yeah, that's you. Gold star.
>>18473176>How did USA help CREATING Israel.Diplomatic recognition from the world's superpower, and (at the time) sole nuclear arsenal?>And since you name USA by name, it means the US aid must have been as significant as the aid they recieved from Czechoslovakia and France.Never said that. But keep lying and strawmanning so you can continue this conversation in circles for as long as possible.
>>18473180>Diplomatic recognitionHow is that helping them when they are invaded by 5 neigbouring armies?Why are you so vague?Why cant you elaborate with a concrete argument? Why do you have this gay "trust me bro" attitude towards everything you think you know? It's a fucking discussion not your TED talk. Tell me how this 'diplomatic recognition' became a critical factor for Israel to prevail in the 1948 war and not be completely terminated (which they nearly were until the Czech shipment arrived).>Never said that.No but you're insinuating it retard.And your entire argumentation method is to be vague and insinuate so that it becomes easier for you to later say "i never said that".Can you post something that can actually be analyzed? How was USA critical in creating Israel?
>>18473188Look, I'll make it easy for you since you keep sperging and going in circles.The only two claims I've made in this thread are that America, France, and Russia supported the establishment of Israel (diplomatically, and in the case of the latter two with military shipments) and that this support was done in opposition to the British Empire's control of the Levant.Do you disagree with either of these claims?If not, I have no interest in letting you sperg at me all day. Either get to the point or fuck off.
>>18473011No, the British managed it and managed it dutifully. They permitted the jews to circumvent every treaty with the Arabs and wouldn’t even give the Arabs an audience in London.Multiple British officers stationed there resigned because of the impartiality.What do the jews do to thank the British?Suicide bomb them, assassinate British officers, and attempt a genocide on Whites.You are subhumans.>we are le chosenNah. Jesus was the Messiah. He said you are the servants who were replaced.God said in Leviticus you were brought out of Egypt to serve him in Canaan, he said the land wasn’t yours, you were servants of Elton who owned the land. You don’t own the land according to your own founding myth. Elyon owns the land and demands your servitude to Him.Britain help you accomplish and now look what you’ve done. You betrayed the British. You abused your position as servants.You have completely abandoned your position as servants. You think you own the land of Elyon rather than being tenants.And you completely ignore the Messiah who said so himself that you were derelict in your service and thus Christians have replaced you as the servants of Elyon.Do jews even read the Bible?>da Bible? Christianity is all bunkYou might say this, and maybe it’s true, but strictly speaking, if we are using the Levantine “myth” to justify land claims.A jewish state should not exist.
>>18472833Jew was pretty much synonymous with communism in the 40s. Most people thought Israel was going to be a commie aligned state and that the Arabs would be west aligned. It is one of those things that modern commies, like they do with the Molotov Ribbentrop pact, pretend never happened.
It is amazing how much total fiction normies believe about the history of Israel. You can talk to one about it and get a completely bastardized version of the real history. Quite horrifying considering the strong opinions they have on the region.
>>18473271>>18473271>history of IsraelThere is no history, only a criminal record
>>18472848fpbp. use your brain OP
>>18473073>overwhelming enemiesYes I'm sure all the little Palestinian babies that got ethnically cleansed in the Nakba were itching to join up for the jihad against the yehudi infidels before they were even able to walk
>>184733991 Jewish life is worth 1000 of your kind. Get that through your thick skull, goy.
