why aren't you working on a visual novel? think about it. comics and novels are as oversaturated as it gets. but despite the low barrier of entry, there aren't really THAT many visual novels out there. thats an even narrower pool if we think about your native language only.face it, this is the one medium that hasnt yet yielded to peak saturation. this is just the beginning for visual novels
>>7941100Hyper niche genre that doesn’t really lend itself to streaming or short-form video (people do make shorts out of manga pages) which severely limits its market cap and potential exposure. It’ll probably stay niche forever. Too much reading for people who don’t like books, too weird and anime for people who do like books.I personally love VNs but there’s no reason to make one yourself unless you just really fucking love VNs.
>>7941100They don't really have that low a barrier to entry, because they require a diverse set of skills compared to comicsThat said they're probably one of the best way to be profitable as an independent artist making his own work
If you're not japanese, make a point'n'click adventure instead. Basically same thing but has a non-weeb fanbase (trying to appeal to weebs is always risky, as they may reject your work simply on the basis it's not japanese for REAL)
Because I want to create work that I myself would enjoy, and I don't enjoy visual novels.If I want to play something, I'll play a game; if I want to read something, I'll read a comic or novel.To me, visual novels are like a mix of the two mediums, but with the removal of what I consider to be the best parts of them. They lack the gameplay of actual games, lack the large amount of art that comics have, and lack the pure focus of a book.The only VN I've enjoyed is Pheonix Wright, and that's probably because it's moreso a point & click game, and is a lot more animated with a dialogue system that's more involved with the gameplay systems than what I see from visual novels.Not that I'm saying VNs are shit, I'm just saying they're not to my taste, and therefore are not something I'd even consider making.>>7941114Eh, there are game engines that essentially do everything for you, so the barrier of entry really is quite low if you're making something simple.I think the most well known one is called Renpy. Hell, I'm sure there's ways to make VNs in slideshow programs.>>7941119>If you're not japanese, make a point'n'click adventure instead.I agree with you, but there's more work involved in western point & click games than what's in a VN, in terms of art, animation, game design, and probably programming for a bog standard experience - even though there's a game engine made specifically for it (Adventure Game Studio), just like with VNs.So a much higher barrier of entry than VNs have - except in writing.
Success in VNs is pretty hard actually. People want (1) a bombshell, exciting new artstyle, and (2) an iconic/fun cast of characters. Stuff like Type Moon, Key, Danganronpa, Ace Attorney, WTC, SubaHibi, etc. all fall into that bucket. I have some concepts but they'd need a good year to flesh out. My current best idea would take months of improvement at photobashing so I could do BGs
stop talking about it and just do itno one fucking cares if you have NOTHING to show
>>7941195Anon is unable to conceive that people can be too busy with one project to work on another.
>>7941197pyw
>>7941204
>>7941100You know what's SUPER unsaturated? Glorified VNs that have "some" gameplay like walking on a linear narrative path.Should be easy for you guys to make a 2d anime or other digitally illustrated art style game with a focus on narrative. Just make it a walking sim, you don't even need to worry much about programming because all the main engines have templates for character controllers. I would play any game that someone from here made, I mean it.
>>7941100>niche format>mostly known for porn>low userbase, esp. for non-h>not well suited to genres that don't involve romance or fucking>requires at least decent writing skills due to text densityAlso>there aren't really THAT many visual novels out there.lol, lmao even
>>7941119you dont have to appeal to weebs, but it helps
>>7941677>there aren't really THAT many visual novels out there.there genuinely arent lol. just look at how many games are on steam and then what percent of them are visual novels
>>7941677set language to eng. 62738 becomes 23145. factor in a great portion of these are itch.io demos and it is as i say, it's a far from peak saturated art form
If a talentless, uncreative artist (you) makes a viaual novel the result will be a shitty visual novel, if they make a graphic novel it will be a shitty graphic novel, manga, illustration, whateverPorn and oc/adoptables/twitter bs is not like genres and mediums, they allow shitty artists to make money because it's not valued for artistic quality or creativity but labour and/or sexual/autistic fan gratificationMost artists don't have a vision, good art usually requires a visionAnd in visual storytelling art style is especially important because the style should work dynamically with the story, genre and themesThis retarded mindset happens when a person first learns how to draw and only after tries to figure out why, the ability to produce images is in itself worthless so obviously being passionate about the ability alone is like a filmmaker being autistic about camera lenses and hardware and trying to come up with a way to monetize on their interest that in itself has nothing to do with artistic expressionBut hey, a filmmaker like that could always shoot porn videos and moviesNow imagine a person like that thinking they're an artist
The government doesn't want you to know this but best thing about making a game with your art is that you can literally FORCE the audience to look at your pictures for as long as you want.Instead of them scrolling past in 2.3 seconds after you've spend 10 hours drawing it they have to SIT there and LOOK.
>>7941761>blah blah blah you will not succeed blah blah blahWhoah, look out! It's an edgy contrarian, here to show us how he's so different from us hive minded sheep!!I bet you watched so much Daria growing up.Also, were you that desperate for attention that you had to make your post into a thread? It wasn't interesting the first time. Fucking lame, my guy.
>>7941762NOT SO FAST FAGGOT>ALT-F4
>>7941765Truth hurts
>>7941765Bot post
>>7941767For you.>>7941771Possibly, but how could such a radical free thinker be a bot?
>>7941775Your art is just figures/oc doing a pose with a simple or no background repeated over and over, isn't it? Or maybe some ps5 looking space ship art station concept slopThere's absolutely no reason to get upset over what I said if it doesn't accurately describe you
>>7941766But then you'll never get the free dopameme that comes with getting a game achievement pop up..
>>7941766>Game is opened>Changes your desktop wallpaper into my art>Changes your desktop icons into my art>Changes your screensaver into a slideshow of my artGo ahead, alt-f4.
>>7941778>Your art is just figures/oc doing a pose with a simple or no background repeated over and over, isn't it?>Or maybe some ps5 looking space ship art station concept slop>There's absolutely no reason to get upset over what I said if it doesn't accurately describe youOh, so if we make a visual novel, videogame, comic, animation, proper illustrations, etc, we're in the clear? Those obviously do not fit in the categories you just mentioned, and require a good deal more work...>If a talentless, uncreative artist (you) makes a viaual novel the result will be a shitty visual novel, if they make a graphic novel it will be a shitty graphic novel, manga, illustration, whateverOf course not. Just say you hate artists and be done with it.Stop trying to intellectualise your baseless caveman like hate.
>>7941100I made one with stolen assets, and did show it at a con, 1 person really liked it
>>7941100I would because I want to make a story focused game but I want more gameplay. I'm now trying to make a platformer with 2d cutscenes for the story.
>>7941100Easy to make and easier to ignore
Yeah honestly was thinking awhile about doing one, just for fetish purposes, I never nsfw, so doing that for once could be fun.
VNs don't have gameplay for a reason. They are not games. You need a Skip button for everything. The moment that pressing the button does not advance or skip whatever is happening, will make 95% of your readers quit.People who have never read a VN always have the idea of adding gameplay elements.
>>7942092Hundred Line is basically a mashup of a VN and an SRPG-lite battle system and it works really well. You’re just making a regular video game at that point though, with all the design work and coding that goes into that.
It's a big project.I took 3 VN I liked, played them to completion, then scrapped all the art and made a comparison.I split character drawings into "Base pic", "Big alt (change of clothes)" and "Small alt (change of expression, minor pose)"The average game has about 5 bases, 10 big alts and 15 small alts per character.Then there's CG, big center pieces (that in hentai VN would be the "sex pic" but also could be a cool angle with several characters around a murder victim or whatever "scene") average of 6, with 0-2 Small alts each oneThen there's backgrounds, and holy shit the average was like 14Honestly, was considering making a VN but the backgrounds really put me off fuck backgrounds
>>7941100I'm a bit of a pessimist when it comes to the topics of VNs. I've seen too many "let's make a VN!" ideas fail horribly and for some god forsaken reason it's almost always the most drama ridden medium when it comes to amateurs or non asians tackling the projects. Especially once the project goes over more than 1 person working on it. It's a cursed medium for non nips. Even full blown groups like the guys who made Valhalla aren't free from eventually hitting the "creative differences" breaking point, which has always just been code for shit flinging in the background. Proper prose and world building is also arguable a much more significant factor than art, and crafting something compelling and engaging with words is a very difficult thing to do. Just look back to the mid 2000s when all the popular VNs were catching their stride and they are the most QUALITY ridden pieces of media to exist.
>>7942300Now count how many individual drawings in an average comic.
>>7942304As a comic maker would say a lot more. The VN HAS to be on color.Workwise, consider each background as a full "page". Each CG center piece as a "double page"And a combo of Base pic/1 Big alt/1 Small alt as a page as well, but this is just one character, I'll say you'll need at least about 3 characters to make something decentWe can bundle 3 Big alts and 6 small alts into "pages" as wellFor the average VN I described, it's the same work as doing14 pages (bg), 12 pages (cg), 18 pages (3 characters)Making all the art for (my) average VN in color, would be the same workload as making 44 pages of a black and white manga/comic
>>7942309It's really just about where you place the bar in terms of quality.You seem to be assuming a really high bar for the VN but a relatively low bar for the comic.And this is why counting individual pictures is pointless.
>>7942312The only bar I set is my own and the only measure of work I use is my ownI'm talking about what it would take for ME on MY artstyle to complete the project, having made both comics and colored commissions.I know how much time a b&w comic page takes me, and I've done pinup commission work so I know how much time a colored Base pic+Alts for a VN would take me, it's the same time. For me
>>7942313Sure but there's the missing variable of "using the art style I chose for this" that's always a decision you make.I know a comic page can take anything from 5 minutes to two weeks for me just based on how fancy I want it to be.
>>7942316Why would you pair the VN art that you would supposedly do at a high effort, commercial level... to your shitty low effort comic page timeframeYou want your VN will look shitty low effort?Is your argument "I would make a VN with shitty art, and that will take me less work than my high effort comic page"?I'm comparing high effort to high effort here, I don't understand your argument, or you may be too stupid to understand mineMaking a high effort VN art in color, would take me the same time as making 44 pages if high effort comic pages
>>7942320You were comparing high effort VN art to low effort comic art which makes no sense.If your VN "must" be in color, why would color be optional in the comic? Why would you just half ass 44 pages of comic then spend months polishing some background in a VN no one pays attention to?Anyway, the point remains, the final and absolute truth, that counting individual assets is pointless since it all depends on how many hours you dedicate to each.
>>7942338>You were comparing high effort VN art to low effort comic artIn no way shape or form did I classify my comic work as low effortIn no way shape or form did I show you my comic work for YOU to classify it as low effortIn no way shape or form did I imply that my comic work, by being in black and white, is more low effort than if I made it in colorI just stated that that the VN work would equate to X amount of pages of my own I do not know how you come to the conclusion that my work in comics is low effort to state such a thing
>>7941766>game uninstalls keyboard driversheh
>>7942309my VN is in black and white.
>>7941100visual novels are fucking gay. Hope this clears things up
