Why do so many anons hate the idea of doing art as a career these days? Didn't this board start out as primarily for aspiring concept artists?I have never seen good work come for a "hobbyists" they almost never commit to it.
Working as an artist in the industry isn’t very realistic right now. The few jobs that are left probably won’t go to someone who needs a steady income. Creating your own content and connecting directly with fans through crowdfunding and donations is your only option. Nobody is hiring artists.Open a Patreon and draw dickgirls.
>>7922302Good enough for me, desu
I'm not good enough to get a job or chase patreonbux but when I see all those dudes making several thousand a month drawing one thing a week it definitely seems a lot more chill than what an industry artist would need to do for the same pay.
I think you're delusional, catfag.I see tons of "hobbyists" with incredible work on social media, but only a small percentage are making it a career, and an even smaller percentage of that are managing to balance professional life with having a soul. The fact of the matter is, being pro seems to have little to do with the quality of one's art, and can even hinder creativity and enthusiasm.If anything I would advise learning artists to worry more about making a single piece of art worth a damn before worrying about making money off it. We could use a little less trash-slop in these times we find ourselves in.
>>7922294How many good artists are out there? Tens of thousands, at least. How many of them are making liveable amounts of money from their art? Very few. Even if your art is good, that's no guarantee you'll get hired, and if you don't you'll have to rely on commissions and donations, which requires a reputation, which without marketing is borderline impossible to build except by luck. If a few of your posts get popular you can easily snowball from there, but that requires a few of your posts to get popular in the first place, and no amount of quality can manipulate the algorithm.
>>7922294art was never good as career
>>7922294>Why do so many anons hate the idea of doing art as a career these daysYou're trying to understand how losers think.Zoomers are a failed generation and have complete loser mentalities, don't look deeper because because there isn't anything deep, they're losers through and through.
>>7922334>I see tons of "hobbyists" with incredible workpost 10
>>7922358Random guy with 4.8k followers who showed up my feed the other day, who describes himself as "practicing drawing for the first time." And this isn't even the tippy-top or anything, this is like "very good for social media," not a generational talent or someone pushing boundaries or anything - which you can also find.I could go on and find 9 more but there is no point. You have to be a real chucklehead to think this is rare.
>>7922294Because you can't really sell the rockstar artist image anymore. Your idols get paid about as much as an Arby's shift manager and everyone you're going to be working with sucks. The citadel is high and there are no keys. CConsider 5his more ominous possibility, chances are anything you like is a gay nigger reboot. Chances are you'll be fired for following the wrong people on twitter. AAA is not worth the squeeze anymore, and I would rather my own IP or merely be a hobbyist.
>>7922397lol retardlurk before posting
>>7922405seethe, beggie
>>7922397>trace photo >Clip Studio anime face .jpg>tehee I'm 12 years old btw xDPixiv is full of these people.
>>7922324I make money on patreon (not a lot, but more than I thought I would, I basically cover rent and that's it) and I feel like I have to draw every day or else people will leave. I'm still jealous of those artists that barely draw the same thing once a week while I'm trying to constantly be original and outdo myself.
>>7922397>practicing drawing for the first timeThat's some chinkspeak MTL, retard, it doesn't mean he's a hobbyist, he was already drawing like this in 2023 and probably just nuked some other account since he's a chink drawing degenerate zoophilia and hunted by the CCPhttps://www.pixiv.net/en/artworks/105703336
>>7922416yet another 4chan unc mind broken by young talent on the interwebs
>>7922419Where do you see this guy earning money? If you don't see him doing pro work, then shut up. It is not unusual to find skilled artists who are not doing art as a career.
>>7922427>after deleting many online platforms...Confirmed for an account nuking chink lmao.>n-noooooo he's not doing work on accounts without illegal porn nooooooook retard
>>7922431So you got nothing. Got it.
>>7922397>describes himself as "practicing drawing for the first time."If you paste that into google translate, it says>A beginner drawing student! EN/JP/CN no AI/Commercial/Unauthorized reproductionSince he already had a competent original illustration on pixiv 15 months before creating that account, we know he's bullshitting for engagement. 0/10 so far
>>7922465The point is that he is not a professional, dumbass. Holy shit.
>>7922465Chinese LLM says it's written in a scholarly old-fashioned style to indicate irony or humility/self-deprecation.
>>7922466>h-he's a hobbyist!According to your asshole. Prove it, otherwise you're 0/10, copecuck
hobbyist
>incredible work>coomslop on white background AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHHHAHAHA
>>7922494hobbyist
>>7922497takes "commissions" apparently but let's be real, hobbyist
>>7922494embarrassing
>>7922498>I know tons of hobbyist >runs out of them by post 3oof
>>7922498Going through my likes"aspiring animator""low activity"Honestly if I posted all the dudes making less than 30 bucks a month on it, you'd really get your filthy asshole blown the fuck out but I think I've made my point. Now shut the hell up and go draw.
>>7922502>aspiring animatorso...not a hobbyist
>>7922503Do you know what "aspiring" means, Jimenez? I'm an "aspiring" astronaut. Check my wikipedia page.
>>7922504very informative, thank you, pingpong
>>7922504You're conflating "hobbyist" with "amateur", ESL-kun. Someone aspiring to be an animator is an amateur, not a hobbyist. Being an aspiring astronaut would mean you are pursuing it as a career. OP literally says it>Why do so many anons hate the idea of doing art as a career these days? Didn't this board start out as primarily for aspiring concept artists?and then contrasts it to hobbyists>I have never seen good work come for a "hobbyists" they almost never commit to it.Learn English.
>>7922498Only thing you've posted that's actually good and it's someone earning money lol
>>7922347it was great in the 40s to the 70s
>>7922514Look, nigger. Here is the uncomfortable reality you don't want to accept: the vast majority of artists living, the vast majority of artists who have ever lived - didn't make a penny on their art. Okay, maybe they made less than 100-1000 USD in their lifetime. I'm talking about skilled artists, too.You can twist the facts as much as you want, but there ARE provable, demonstrable skilled hobbyists (and amateurs, whatever you want to call it) who are not earning money from their art regularly enough to call it a career, and may even be content with that.I can "wanna be" anything, it means jackshit until I have been hired and paid to do a job, and have made a living at it for some time.Now eat shit.
>>7922517You know what's funny? You're a permabeg.
>>7922519>that postI can smell the SEAnigger on you.
>>7922502I fully agree with you. Idk why OP is samefagging. There are thousands, tens of thousands, a hundred thousand artists who would be potential prospects in a good economy or during art industry's heyday.Not even pro artists with 10+ years of experience can find work right now. Entertainment industry is doing mass layoffs all the time.
>>7922519That's still not what hobbyist means, ESL-kun.
>>7922519what the fuck are you talking about lmaoart as a hobby wasn't even a thing until like 200 years ago, fucking vermeer bankrupted himself buying pigment
>>7922527People have been drawing and making art since the fucking Ice Age. A lot of it hasn't come down to us necessarily, most art is not archival and most people were not famous. God you're stupid.
>>7922528>my girlfriend goes another schoolmay we see the hobbyist art?
>>7922519>donde es la biblioteca, fellow anglos
If anyone's interested read this book it's about why most creative children rarely grow up to be creative professionals, it requires discipline and grit and grinding your weak points, nothing else.https://ia801606.us.archive.org/1/items/FRENCHPDF.COMTalentIsOverrated/FRENCHPDF.COM%20Talent%20is%20Overrated.pdf
>>7922538Yeah sure, Tiger Woods isn't talented lol
>>7922538>heh, I know how to become one of the best in anything, buy my book to find out!What skill has he mastered with this amazing knowledge?
>>7922538>At age three, he shot a 48 over nine holes at the Navy course. >A 48 for 9 holes corresponds roughly to a 24–28 handicap. Approximately 40–50% of golfers who maintain a registered handicap are at or below this levelsure sounds like an average person grinding his weak points
>>7922538youre an idiot if you try to be 'world class' at your job that just means you get overworked. People tend to excel at their hobbies because they like them.
>>7922559Right, that's why the best people in their fields are hobbyists oh wait no, that's retarded
>>7922562The difference is time moron, and the statement was relative.
>>7922563>Look mom, I'm excelling because I enjoy drawing! >I-I mean relative to not actually drawing because I have to work!
>>7922564dont enjoy drawing see how far that gets you.
>>7922568>I enjoy drawing so much I'm gonna do it less so I can excel relative to being a shitteryeah, ok
>>7922570youre literally so mad that you are just arguing with yourself. Go draw, im going to sleep.
>>7922571yeah, i wouldn't expect you to go draw lol
>>7922339I still don't understand why all of this has to be online. Why can't you just go to galleries and do exhibitions like a normal person?
>>7922347Retard, it was the only thing that you could get some money to survive purely based on merit, before AI.
>>7922294>Why do so many anons hate the idea of doing art as a career these days?This goes for every single job. You like it until it becomes a souless job (in the case of art, maybe you are forced to use AI, which to me would be like a Circle of Hell).They would like to freelance, but this is not always possible as you are going to be poor and miss a lot of work benefits...Unless you are in a third world. In that case, you are going to shit on the people in middle class, and have a rich life.>Didn't this board start out as primarily for aspiring concept artists?There are a lot of people with different goals, and every year there are new people.
>>7922576There are a limited number of galleries and they won't accept everyone.
>>7922294It seems like a lot of butt hurt crabs. They became hobbyists because they became demotivated from recent happenings, and now they expect everyone else to give up on their dream too.It also seems like a lot of anons on this site simply don't have a clue how to go about pursuing art as a career on this site, outside of drawing porn and opening a patreon... and sure that's one way to go about it, but it's a niche way that's not for everyone. Types of work that require even a little interpersonal communication skills seems completely ignored (or more like avoided).I'm just surprised that even suggesting treating this as a hobby until you make it seems frowned upon now... well, less competition for us, I guess.
>>7922551I seem to recall he was heavily pushed by his family and father, no? So he's talented sure, but also was putting in the effort that is suggested in the book, yeah?
>>7922690that's not even what the book says, even the page in the screenshot tells you being a conscientious, diligent worker for 40 years "clearly isn't enough to make you a great performer"
>>7922697Ah, I should have said page rather than book, since I'm not brothering to read more than that; but to me the pictured page seems to be suggesting that they're not giving a FULL effort, because their normal lives and jobs are getting in the way, whilst Woods was trained constantly and lived & breathed golf for much of his life, even from a young age.Do correct me if the book is suggesting something completely different though.
>>7922704the book is the deliberate practice meme originator afaik, basically what the post said, targeting your weak points with intense practice that is unsustainable (per the book) for more than a few hours a daya hard sell for a toddler
>>7922397isn't this takako
>>7922302you sound like a diaper whitegirl. I myself, and many other artists have been steadily employed for years.>Working as an artist in the industry isn’t very realistic right now. It's all about location, you probably live in some shithole like Kentucky >>7922339Location is a factor.Also this board is a joke, majority of the people here are those who aren't good enough to post on real forums like polycount.
>>7922294>get a job as an artist>have to draw whatever ugly boring shit your soulless faggot bosses ask you to draw, get your life drained out of you>do art as a hobby>can draw and paint literally anything you want.Seems simple to me.
>>7922783>get a job as an artist>have to draw whatever ugly boring shit your soulless faggot bosses ask you to draw, get your life drained out of you, can draw and paint literally anything you want>do art as a hobby>have to do whatever ugly boring shit your soulless faggot bosses ask you to do, get your life drained out of you, can draw and paint literally anything you want.
>>7922783>>7922785>get a job as an artist>you're at art>do art as a hobby>you're bad at artSeems simple to me.
>>7922787unironically, ontologically, metaphysically N.G.M.I.
>>7922765>polycount just checked that forum and it seems even more dead than here, no one offers critique, am i missing something?
>>7922788pyw
>>7922792It, was lively seven-ten years ago; actual networking and people actually got full-time jobs from networking there. They even had in person meetups at GDC in San Francisco. Once pandemic kicked off, the site seemed to have died off, everyone is using discord these days.
>only animetards postingof course.
>doing art as a careerWhat does that even look like in 2026? Everyone says they want to make it big but no one really knows what that means.
>>7922576Making a living from galleries is waaaaay harder than making a living from patreonbux or other forms of "commercial art". You also basically have to be a woman and/or brown, if you are a white man you will be laughed out of the room at any "fine arts" institution
>>7923237selling at galleries doesn't mean "fine arts institutions", you terminally online niggermuttthere are galleries selling paintings to the average joe all over any european city, and I'd bet any non-hicksville us city
>>7922294>Why do so many anons hate the idea of doing art as a career these days?It's not the 90's anymore. Working "in the industry" has gone from a difficult, but achievable dream, to an outright impossibility unless you're lucky AND well-connected. And why would you even want to work in the industry these days, anyways? Big companies have absolutely zero respect for artistic integrity and will work your ass to the bone on an assembly line job. And you're a bit wrong when you say "hate doing art as a career." I would say the general mood here is anti-industry, but that in no way equates to being "anti-career." A 'career in art' is still possible, with the caveat that you have to be your own boss, and that means also doing your own marketing, web design, social media management, expense management, community management, etc.
>>7922294>Didn't this board start out as primarily for aspiring concept artists?Isn't it the art branch that got butchered the most by AI?
>>7930989It's arguably the only fully replaceable role
>>7922522what the fuck did I do? ;d
>>7922294I don't even know how to get followers. I get maybe like 5 likes on a drawing, that's it. Plus I simply don't have the discipline to draw 10 hours everyday. That sounds like hell to me. Shit only some chinese Zen mon could do.
>>7922538>>7922541>>7922548>>7922551>>7922559Not that it doesn't take a lot of hours but when you're already pretty good at something, it's significantly easier (and requires significantly less discipline) to spend hours and hours doing something you're already pretty good at.This is why anyone except David Goggins can't impress me.They didn't achieve their success through intense suffering, blood, and agonizing psychological torture.They just did what they felt like doing most of the time.How is that impressive?I do what I feel like doing all the time, I just wasn't fortunate enough for that to have been an impressive skill.Another anon even mentioned "enjoying drawing."Really?You have to enjoy drawing to stick with it?That's unfortunate but it also shows that I'm right.Instead of treating drawing like a 9-5 job, these people genuinely love to draw. They want to draw all the time.So all this bullshit about them having discipline is moot. They had no discipline, they just did what they wanted to do, what they felt like doing. I do that all the time and there's nothing impressive about that.
>>7922294If I make it in art, I want to be self-employed or at least have a workable eniugh schedule to invest in my own business. Due to the time-consuming nature of most art jobs, I would be getting paid to make somebody else's vision with little to no time to work on my own. I chose my current career specifically so I could have a workable schedule while making ends meet.
>>7922294Until around a decade ago you could grind the fundamentals for a few years and land a job as a concept artist or illustrator. That’s as good as ancient history now.
>>7931089No one cares about your "discipline" except your boss. Yes, it has always been overrated. The GOAT artists are usually disciplined, but that's in addition to having a knack for it, or enjoyment of it. Nobody was merely disciplined ever got great at anything.
>>7931089>hurr durr something can't be trying and fun>hurr durr sir thing can't be difficult and enjoyable>you enjoyed turning the marathon? heh, guess you didn't REALLY endure itstupid nigger
>>7931200Glad you mentioned running because I run.Getting up to run does require SOME discipline.I'd rather beat off or do something else, but when I'm running I get into a flow state or "the zone" or whatever, and everything else just fades into the background. I'm not forcing myself to move one foot in front of the other, after a while, I get a sort-of high and WANT to keep going. Why would I want to stop?This is my point, though I'm doubtful your IQ is high enough to understand that nuance.My point still stands. The amount of discipline required to draw continuously is insignificant to the amount of discipline required to JUST get your ass in that chair and start a draw. They're completely different things.If I ran and hated every second of it, I'm sure I'd stop early. This doesn't mean it requires NO discipline, it just means the discipline required is so small it's almost insignificant.Feel free to refute any of my points (you can't).
>>7931208post your marathon finisher medals with timestamp, nigger
>>7931225what they're saying is backed by actual science thoughhttps://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12465751/https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/10413200.2016.1272650https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/ejn.15014Here are a few studies that cover this phenomenon in endurance activities (sorry if theyre ass i just looked them up real quick), but flow state applies to almost any high exertion activity, physical, mental or emotional. Flow state and fun are like very close cousins. It isn't some bullshit that guy is feeding you. I haven't run a marathon but I've ran 6 miles straight while super depressed or have had some days where I turn on a song and just lock into painting something for like 12 hours straight without thinking about anything except about the thing in front of me. Your perceived effort when you enter into flow state drops to almost nothing because your sense of self or "the observer" stops existing and you enter a state of complete absorption.
>>7931236so you have finished a marathon?
>>7931236it is bullshit, retard"muh flow state", "muh runner's high" has nothing nothing to do with the fact that finishing a fucking marathon is a matter of discipline because again, something being enjoyable or fun doesn't preclude it from being a grueling endeavor, which is the entire fucking topic of discussion, you illiterate fucking monkeypeople drop out of marathons minutes before the finishing line because IT'S FUCKING HARD and TAKES DISCIPLINE no matter how much you like running6 miles is what kids run during PE, you dumb nigger, it's like comparing doodling in art class to academic training
the absolute fucking state of excusecucks
>>7931250Black and white thinking is nigger behavior. You are aware you can have both things be true at the same time?
>>7931286>You are aware you can have both things be true at the same time?ahh, the favorite phrase used by hypocrites
>>7931250You can try as much as you'd like but you'll never convince me that artists are on the level of David Goggins when it comes to discipline with how many pussy artists there are out there. That's why there is such a thing as loser artists who are under/overweight, no GF, and all they do is draw. If they had "muh discipline" they'd be waking up at 4AM everyday, hitting the gym, getting laid, and then drawing without ever touching a video game or movie.Instead what you get is artists that have a mental breakdown because they have to wash dishes and need to take a "mental health day" off from work because Stacey at the office just slightly raised their voice at them. They go home and draw because it's the only thing they're good at and the only thing that gives them any sort of relief.This is different from people treating drawing like a job who don't get dopamine from making marks on the page. One requires discipline, the other does what they feel like doing.Prove me wrong.Oh, wait. You can't. That's why you resort to ad hominems. I accept your concession though (ad hominems are immediate forfeiture of your position as being the correct one, btw)
>>7931295Whenever I meet people like you, I always think about how you're so binary in your logic. Like an outdated OS from the 60s. The absolute cream of the crop are a mix of conscientiousness, talent and the ability to live within the flow state. I don't know what it was you were arguing about with the other anon but you're both arguing about two facets of the same thing.
>>7931302flow state might even just be under the umbrella of talent since it's such a nebulous term. It describes an affinity for a skill, but that affinity can manifest in many ways.
>>7931286>white thinking>nigger behavior
>>7922969this board is full of zoomers who don't know their heads from their assholes.>>7927645zoom, zoom, network dumbass.Also be multifaceted.
>>7922538Let me guess - ADHD?ADHD can cause racing thoughts that connect multiple things together, enhancing creativity.That is cause by low levels of dopamine, which also causes executive dysfunction. They have fun coming up with new things, but God help them when it actually comes to working and boring grinding.
>>7927645>Working "in the industry" has gone from a difficult, but achievable dream, to an outright impossibility unless you're lucky AND well-connectedHoly fuckin cope and skill issue niggaI know like 10 different people that work in anything from vidya to tabletop/card games to animation to regular illustration freelance so no it's not impossible, you just have to treat it like any other trade, simplify your workflow, develop some consistent style
>>7922294>Why do so many anons hate the idea of doing art as a career these days?AI, obviously. Also, art for commercial settings is some of the most soulless and uninspired crap imaginable so it's another reason why>these daysPart of growing up is the whole starving artist meme is real, in a society as hypercapitalistic as ours its value isn't perceived culturally, and therefore there's no one to foster that talent unless it's to use their artistic skills for propaganda purposes.There's a silver lining here, and that is that true artists armed with only passion for the craft will shine through, weeding out all the pretenders and frauds who are in it only for the money
>>7922302And why that's a good thing
Look, just do what you love, dude. We're all going to die, and it's better to do it doing whatever we damn well please, especially in this already twisted world that's going to shit anyway.
>>7922294>Why do so many anons hate the idea of doing art as a career these days?They don't. They just hate having to try for it. Anons think being an artist means a cushy job where you sit around and stare pensively out a window and maybe once in awhile draw something and get cash thrown at you for your utmost contributions to the medium of Hentai. And not a job, where you get a wage for doing grueling work for 40 hours a week. Self-employment included.That goes for attitudes toward both employment and training.
I've been following this guy for years and admire his business model. Write your own story, have a legion of fans eager to dissect every nuance of your last comic strip, and peddle merchandise to them.
>>7934662>Business modelCare to elaborate?
>>7922294From my experience you can still make an alright living from graphic design/illustration/concept art w/e but making it into a career where you can make REALLY good money is becoming less possible every year, the recent Marvel lay offs being another example of thatObviously the best route you can take is just be really good like Craig Mullins and just freelance but that's too difficult for most people
>>7922294It takes time to get good and you pretty much have to be really good to make some money, the competitive market mediocre and beginner artists had to compete for has been swallowed by AI.It's just over, so we work at boring jobs to pay the bills and draw for fun.
>>7922765>for many years>right nowI want you to read these two lines and write a 1500 word essay on why you think they're the same.
>>7937293>From my experience you can still make an alright living from graphic design/illustration/concept art w/eHow? I just need to pay rent and eat. Please explain how.
>>7922294for me i hate it because i'm not good enough to compete. but even if i were god tier, the simple fact is that there are millions of god tier artists out there and not enough art jobs. there aren't enough jobs period (i am very blessed to have my boring, low legacy tech job, i hate every minute of it but it pays me decently for my area) but art feels especially dire to me because a.) visual art doesn't really matter in the west b.) what makes livable money are dc/marvel comic books, visdev for games and film, and abstract art, and c.) all of that is really reliant on connections and again, intense skill if i were east asian or something where art mattered then yeah, hell yeah, i'd definitely happily go full retard and spec into art. i sort of envy mangaka biographies where they write about drawing for 10 hours straight. that does sound like a dream to mebut i'm an americuck, i don't know shit and i don't know nobody, and i live in nowhere town, so. we deal with the cards we were dealt
>>7934858Write a story, gain a following, peddle merchandise to them. Be entirely self sufficient, keep control over the IP and hold every dime of profit.
>>7922294It's resentment. People who have those aspirations tend to work alone; but the bare-minimum for success is being comparable to the professionals who have vastly more time and resources than them. Being short of exceptional is just getting you cucked as every other artist/pro/scammer will be using your art to get ahead.
>>7937323Well all im gonna say is beggining was the definitely the toughest I tried keep a survival /gd/ job at an ad firm and doing my art in the free time, I was definitely improving but it was sluggish and I was 100% coping, the moment I started neeting for savings and asking me dad for money things started accelerating, I know, not really fair but I'm just being honestObviously you need to get your fundies down first, perspective, anatomy, gesture, composition, if you can't draw a simple 1 pooint perspective background scene then don't even bother with the restStart small and take any commisions you can, personally I used and a friend used upwork, go to conventions to show your portfolios to industry guys there, apply for competitions, obviously all of this requires luck and your work actually meeting some sort quality standardHow to reach that standard? Find one guy who's making a living right now for me it was Jakub Rebelka, break down what you find appealing about his work, for me it was the way he handled saturated colors, his level of detail, frazetta-esque compositions and how he rendered mechanical elements in an organic fashion, ask yourself why are people willing to give him money?If you really apply yourself and get your work to that certain level of polish you should start seeing some real outreachOh and obviously throughout all of that try to keep your social media somewhat alive, atleast 1 post a week for me, but don't focus on it, treat it as a jumping off point, unless you want to be a fandom ape or coom artists going all in on social media isnt really a good jumpstart option imo
