It can be anything from canvas sizes, coloring, techniques, warmups, figure drawing, networking, philosophies and so onArtists need to help each other more now than ever before
learn to do one stroke well and rotate your paper/canvas/jaypeg to match the direction of that stroketry to network with non-artists, not other artistsyou need to take writing courses or just practice writing to be able to write that comic, not just draw well. webcomics especially live on their writing, not their art; nobody's gonna read a pretty comic for long if its writing sucksdon't hoard resourcesseriously just dontyou dont need those videocourses, just pick one and go with itstop
>>7925420fun > everything else
While knowing how to write is important for making comics you don't actually need to know how to finish a storyThis is one medium where forever stories that go nowhere are an accepted norm ;)
>>7925436webfics (worm, wandering inn, etc) are the ultimate example of this, but yes you don't really need to know where a comic is going, just as long as you can make the journey fun so that people stay on board
>>7925425>solo leveling
>>7925451i dont read narutos so i cant judge, but my comment was made in the context of an audience not inured to dog farts who seek out more dog farts. in any case, there will always be exceptions and no rule is absolute. take it as a tip not dogma
>>7925454....but some of the most successful stories of all time are considered slop by elitists so what exactly is your tip
>>7925464? i find it was a pretty simple one> you need to take writing courses or just practice writing to be able to write that comic, not just draw well. webcomics especially live on their writing, not their artthat if your writing sucks, the webcomic is likely to not go anywhere. if the target audience finds it slopshit, you're a goner. you write for an audience and i hope that audience isn't elitist critics
>>7925464>develop a good business? but people win the lottery with no work!what percentage of badly written slop is successful vs what percentage of well written works are not successful?
>>7925489I mean.......................................................... *gestures broadly to most shonen manga*
>>79254901. stop typing like a retarded redditnigger2. how much shounenslop is a flop vs successful?
>>7925490>t. never read jumpMore serializations are dropped than retained annually, and that's not counting the ones that don't even make it into jump.
>>7925490I can easily ask you the same question, how many 'well written' stories aren't successful? The point is if you're giving advice on how to be successful, there are many cases where that isn't the case. I'd even say the most important part of being successful is knowing your audience and how to cater to them. There's a reason Shonen is so popular, it's a cash cow because young adults that have some disposable income consume it. >inb4 but what is le troo successidk anon, you're the one trying to condense something as nebulous as success into one element.
fuck im retarded>>7925496>>7925492
>>7925496>I can easily ask you the same question, how many 'good' business aren't successful? The point is if you're giving advice on how to be successful, there are many cases where people win the lotteryretard>>7925497I accept your concession
>>7925496>I can easily ask you the same question, how many 'well written' stories aren't successful?I'd say there's a decent amount of lost and hidden gems, simply because the author couldn't get word out/network/advertise/pitch properly. being well-written is a great boon to your chances, but it's not sufficient on its ownon the other hand, very poorly written things can be pushed by a lot of money in front of a lot of eyeballs and still fail>I'd even say the most important part of being successful is knowing your audience and how to cater to themI agree yeah. there's no doubt the amazon tolkien show had a lot of money and effort put into it, it just didn't cater to any of its potential audiences enough (fantaslop watchers, hardcore tolkien fans, good tv enjoyers, whoever) and it turned out to be a billion dollar flop, i can't even remember its name and i'm a tolkienfagsimilarly, cameron's blue bitches movie made a loooot of dosh both by riding on his name recognition, and catering to an audience looking for a visual sensation. the writing was serviceable, the movie was fantastic, i don't remember anything about it other than that it was pretty. turned a pentillion in profit.webcomics audiences are there to read, not look at pretty pictures (except if they're an artist doing an archive binge, but that's not your target audience), so if you fail to write something worth reading youre going nowhere
>>7925490most *published* shounen is cancelled very early, you have survivorship bias
>>7925420expect to produce 10_000 shit drawings before you can actually draw appealing stufffailing is the name of the game, so don't burn yourself out trying to create a masterpiece or set so high expectations of yourself that you start dreading the process of drawing
>>7925464>As an aspiring chef, I hope to some day work in Mcdonalds. The numbers just don't lie.
>>7925501Goes for low hanging fruit doesn't address argument>>7925503Money made is the easiest metric to point to for success, the guy never defined what success means to them because once again, success is nebulous>>7925506we're talking about successful slop indeed, just as there are many "well written stories" that never become successful>>7925534strawman. Funnily enough, if you had two people, the one who is more specific with their goals will almost always be the more successful one.Ah come on guys, I'm not even against the guy saying that good writing is a key part of web comics, but come onnnn, that's clearly not the case, just look at one piece.
>>7925588>just as there are many "well written stories" that never become successfulname 10
>>7925591I wouldn't know they were never successful
lol
>>7925420If someone draws and doesn't know basic perspective yet, I urge them to learn as soon as possible. It's a relatively small amount of knowledge that you'll get a lot of mileage out of. Vanishing points, horizon line, 1 and 2 point perspectives. There's more to perspective than that of course, but even these basics will help a lot.I confess, I got pretty lazy with it and just skimmed the beginning of Perspective Made Easy, and even that helped me a lot.https://ia801206.us.archive.org/34/items/PerspectiveMadeEasy/Norling%20-%20Perspective%20Made%20Easy.pdfRelating to perspective, I too often see people draw mouths and teeth without any perspective. Even with a really cartoony style, it's good to keep in mind how the mouth wraps around the face and how the shape of the teeth looks in space.About anatomy - it took me a while to realise how small the ribcage really is. On the sides and especially around the shoulders, there's a lot of muscle covering it. It's silly, but before I realised this, it confused me how I should treat this area. Also, another thing is, that leg bones, especially the lower half, are pretty curved. I used to draw them too straight and it looked awful, until I figured out the issue. Also, you have to keep this curve in mind while bending the legs in perspective, too.And about color, I really do recommend readind some of John K.'s articles about his thoughts on color theory. It might not be helpful for everyone, but for me personally, it really made some things click. This blogposts specifically links a lot of them.https://johnkstuff.blogspot.com/2008/08/some-nice-paintings-of-woody.html
>>7925594so it's literally not even real in your mind
>>7925606Nope, it is. Same way there are starving children in the world but I'm not going to ask you to name them to prove they exist
>>7925607here, this is mohammad al-motawaq, your turn
>>7925618
>>7925626>The title character, Asterios Polyp, is a professor and architect of Greek and Italian descent who teaches at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York. After a lightning strike burns up his apartment, he leaves the city on a Greyhound bus and takes up employment as an auto mechanic in the town of Apogee (somewhere in America, likely Arizona), the furthest point his money will take him. The novel is interspersed with scenes from his past (ostensibly narrated by his stillborn twin brother, Ignazio), including his childhood and troubled marriage, as well as dreams and allegorical sequences. Finally, Asterios must not only confront his own flawed nature, but the implacable and amoral whims of the gods themselves.AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA lol okay
>>7925627Oh wow look at that, now we can finally move the discussion forward about how "good writing" is completely subjective based on your AUDIENCEEE wow, have you noticed how this entire time I've been saying "good writing" ?Here's another manga that's widely considered to be extremely well written that never had commercial success. Which brings us to my next point, success is NEBULOUSSS wowwWWWwwWWW
>>7925626are your real
>>7925630*you for real
>>7925633Yep, I am, because that retarded story is widely regarded in literary circles. The other manga I posted, is widely considered to be extremely well written. Are you noticing a pattern here? If you don't recognize the manga, guess what, that illustrates my point exactly. It's almost as if... it's almost as if
>>7925634...you're retarded and pretending this garbage is well written by appealing to fictional authority because you're too much of a nigger to learn to write?
>>7925636I like how you chose to insult me because you can't actually find an argument against my stance. That's very nigger of you. How ironic.
>>7925634May we see the literary circles?
>>7925637I don't need an argument against your stance, nigger, you are the one who failed to argue itwhat's well written about that slop?
>>7925639You can literally just search it up and find it's critically acclaimed. If you want to find the literary circles do that yourself. The manga is also a cult classic, I'm sure you'll find people raving about that as well.>>7925643Hey buddy, just so that we're on the same page here cause I know it's hard for you to keep up, my argument is the "good writing" is completely subjective to your audience and that "success" is a nebulous term. You good there? Need to insult me more? At least come up with something more interesting than "nigger" I thought you were suppose to be on the side of well written prose? Could it be you're a nigger?
>no argumentsad
>thread derails into shit flinging by two autistshave some respect and fuck off you cancerous niggers
>>7925588>Money made is the easiest metric to point to for success, the guy never defined what success means to them because once again, success is nebulousi'm not trying to narrowly define good or successful, it's just a vague rule of thumb. not everything has to be exact or watertight, the human experience is very fuzzy. it's just a tip to remember that webcomics need to have good writing too to make it> Ah come on guys, I'm not even against the guy saying that good writing is a key part of web comics, but come onnnn, that's clearly not the case, just look at one piece.like i said idk anything about narutos and shit, i've found my advice generally holds for western comics for small authors. who cares what exact breakfast the bruce willis of oriental comics is eating if you're just another bloke>>7925628you need to eat a tranq anon
>>7925626>>7925627>>7925630>>7925633This actually seems interesting, thatnks for the rec
>>7925628I actually highly recommend people read Spirit Circle. It's really well written but it never got the recognition it deserved
>>7925658Here's my golden nugget for you, stop wasting your time on /ic/ looking for some secret sauce you've been missing
>>7925658respect deez nuts
>>7925420I think that the most valuable thing I’ve learned as an artist is to simply do it every day. It’s cliche advice but it takes you far. Even if you draw a circle on a page, do SOMETHING art related daily and your improvement will be immense
>>7925706how are those boxes going?
>>7925420Heres the quickest way to draw more accurately and to start seeing things more clearly: MEASURE WITH STRAIGHT LINES. Hold up your pencil vertically or horizontally to your reference and look at which parts are in the line. With enough practice you dont need to hold up your pencil anymore and can just visualize. With this technique you can draw anything you see. Looking at things this way over a long period of time will massively improve your visual accuracy.
>>7925516needed this
>>7925761Well I’d say
>>7925425>>try to network with non-artists, not other artistscan you elaborate on this one? I understand that life experiences outside art can be valuable sources of inspiration, but why would non-artist networking help your career?
>>7925893not him but it's obvious you want to network with people who want your services, which is not other artists. you're never going to get hired by another artist, you will get hired by some project leader or creator who needs to recruit a good artist, or an HR. also some artists are very petty and jealous bitches, they see you as a threat.
>>7925420Here's a weird one that just dawned on me recently:There's 2 aspects to drawing: draftsmanship, and style. The former is the ability to draw things accurately (think anatomy or perspective for example), while style is about deforming that in an appealing way (ie. stylizing).It is important to separate the 2 when trying to learn, and I'll use my own example to explain: few years ago, when I started drawing, among many other books courses and shit, I got rizdraw's tutorial, because I thought him a good artist and thought I might learn something. Turns out the videos were mostly focused on his style of drawing (style), not really explaining anything about actual drawing skills (draftsmanship), now, years later, after properly learning to draw from more boring sources like loomis, I found this tutorial again while cleaning old folders, and figured I'd check to see if I could learn from it with my current skill level. And it made me realize the tutorial was completely worthless, not necessarily because it's a bad tutorial, but because by now I've improved enough that I can tell the reason I looked up to his art in the first place was because he's competent at drawing, not because I particularly liked his personal style.In summary, if you are a beginner, don't get too lured into specific artist's teachings, because all you can learn from them is likely their style. You need to learn the basics, so prioritize a learning resource that focuses on those. Better learn good shit from Loomis even if you hate his style, than chase some influencer with style and learn no/bad fundamentals. Your style can come later when you are more learned and develop your eyes and taste.
>>7925907You know what kind of artist I detest? The ones that are clearly talented but really want to stress that they've made all this progress without putting in much effort. I praise them because it's respectable but it's almost like that was not what they expected. Almost like they really just wanted to simultaneously stroke their ego and demoralize me because they know deep down inside they don't want to actually put in the effort lest they find out they aren't as talented as they think they are.It's such a subtle form of crabbing and those kinds of friendships always inevitably end up falling out if the person who is consistent remains consistent and the talented person that relies only on talent and the appearance of low effort gets demoralized that you are pulling ahead. They begin to make all kinds of excuses as to why they aren't getting better. Begin to throw shade at your work. Begin to talk about other artists that are better than you. It's like, oh I thought we were friends my guy, why are you trying to crab me like that when I've shown nothing but support for your talent this entire time?
>>7925600>>7925916>>7925927holy fuck nobody cares lmaooooo
>>7925943clearly you do
>>7925893having artist friends is good and they can help get your foot in the door or pass on jobs they don't want to you, but when they need something drawn or know somebody who needs something drawn, they'll just do it themselves. it's good to have peers, and network with other artists, but don't neglect networking with programmers, tabletop DMs, musicians etc because they'll also have work for you or will be more likely to recommend you for a job some friend of theirs might need done. i get a lot of my work from knowing tech-focused roleplaying types, writers, musicians who need a portrait, illustration, cover done or know someone who does
>>7925946>clearly you do
>>7925950Yeah a person who cares so little they have to reply to somebody about how they're actually seething. You care sooooo little I believe it
>>7925943absolute goycattle behaviour
>>7925958>behaviourlearn english thirdie
>>7925986That is correctly spelt, faggot
>>7925943>>7925950>>7925986imagine being such a low IQ SEAmonkey, that you see an advice thread and decide the best use of your time is shitting it up.
>>7925997spelt is some pig feed eaten by third worlders like you
>>7926031>>7926002>>7925958yes yes races battle of the bulls bringe cased etc etc can we get back on topic>>7925430i feel it's important to keep having fun, but you gotta draw even when it's not fun. sometimes it's just a job you do
>>7925420Do blind contours, gesture studies, the envelope method, break down refs into shapes and forms (this is what they mean by intentional tracing and using references), and the Cognitive Method in that order.Don't aimlessly draw boxes, draw boxes from life and find the boxes in body parts and such.Draw what makes you happy.Perspective comes naturally, what matters more is composition so study comic panels and movie shots.Continuous lines are superior to chickenscratch.Intentionally study one part of the body before connecting it to the next (hands for a week, arms for a week, torso and arms, etc), and so on.Grind lots of lines and shapes and forms during your first month of drawing.If you're drawing people, focus on drawing clothed bodies, clothes, the skeleton, and proportions instead of getting hung up on overly detailed anatomy.Read lots of books and listen to all sorts of music.Draw really big and draw really small when you're first starting out.Use the marker on the glass method from Drawing on the Right Side of the Brain if you struggle with form.Make sure you know how to draw with a pencil well before moving on to drawing with a pen. Similarly, get a firm grasp on values and shading before you start going at it with colors. Same thing goes with bones before moving on to muscles.If you can get live models, still life, and 3D references (toys, plastic models, etc), then go for it.Get as many plastic bones as you can get to study.Balance study and play. If you draw every other day, then play during those days not spent drawing. If you take more than a week off drawing, make the most of that time spent resting. Get into sculpting, photography, origami, puzzles, cycling, ball sports...Have a high-fat high-protein diet with plenty of greens.
You will all make more progress if you stopped wasting your time shitting the board up with your multi-post wall of text sub-50 IQ ESL diatribes on the current state of childrens picture books in america that NOBODY FUCKING CARES ABOUT and spent that time drawing instead.
>>7926150>Continuous lines are superior to chickenscratch.what if it's continuous but it doesn't do what I want exactly? ctrlz 5-10 times or break it into 2-3 shorter lines?>Grind lots of lines and shapes and forms during your first month of drawingwhat if it's not my "first month" but drawing a precise nonshaky line is still a kind of lottery to me?>Draw what makes you happy>Balance study and playHow can it make me happy if I'm dogshit at it (yet?) and all I can do currently is clench teeth and burn hours?>Have a high-fat high-protein diet with plenty of greenselaborate why
The best drawing of all is made of nothing but implied lines.
>>7926519It's fine if it's not exact. Either option is fine, the whole point is to do your best to be accurate rather than something 100% perfect.Drawing a precise line is something that will improve over time. Even if you still have shaky lines, what matters is accuracy. It doesn't matter if you draw a shaky circle, what matters is that it's clearly a circle and not some wonky mess.Charles Schulz had Parkinson's and he made his shaky lines work, after all. Peanuts is still nice to look at!Sucking at something is the first step to being sort of good at something. If you're not happy with where you currently are, cut yourself some slack. Draw something you think is cool or fanart of your favorite characters. Copy and trace, there's no harm. Drawing is about the process, it's a long-term thing. If you want motivation, compare your earlier drawings to your current ones.You need brain food for an activity that relies on using your brain. Your brain is a muscle, which means you need lots of fat, water, meat, and fuel for the muscle. Get plenty of carbs in there too.
>>7926764>Get plenty of carbs in there tooAren't carbs a no-no in "high-fat high-protein diet"? I have zero understanding of diet related things
>>7927037Neither do most of the "people" talking about diet on the interest. Want my advice? Stop being a conspiracytheorytard and just look at what doctors are recommending. (Only those outside of U.S., though, because that place has been hijacked by an actual conspiracy)
>>7927045>interest*internetthat wasn't even autocorrect lol though you might think it was
if you're doing digital, try to avoid using CTRL+Z / the undo button as much as possible early onbad habit, will cause you to chase ""perfection"" that you can't really achieve early on
>>7927110i believe that even if you want to learn and exclusively do digital, you should do a lot of work with pens, markers and coloured pencils. there's no erasing it, and there's no undo. even whiteout has its limits. build up the confidence and skills to make the correct stroke the first time, or to cope with whatever comes out if it's unplanned
>>7927110I hate u
