This is the proposed map of Finland drawn up at the outbreak of the Winter War in 1939. It was signed between the USSR and Otto Kuusinen, who was to be placed as Finland's new leader.Land the USSR wanted from Finland is in red, the land the USSR offered to give to Finland in return is in green.Seems more than fair to me. Were the Finns just stupid?
>>214440105You have to consider the usefulness of the land. Red has more people and resources.
>>214440105the green land was probably already inhabited by Russians at that time and it would be an insidious attempt to russify Finland
>>214440105Instead they chose to fight, killed tens of thousands of their own, and in the end they still lost all this. A full 12% of their land with not a single square centimetre gained. Talk about a fumble.And they still had to act as a Soviet lapdog for the next 40 years anyway. The Finnish Army still has T-72s and BMPs did you know?
>>214440150not by a much since it doesn't include viborg, which was finland's second city at the time>>214440188karelians were much more numerous in those days, now it's pretty much 100 % russified
>>214440105What makes you think the R*ssians would honor this agreement?
>>214440105>Seems more than fair to meyou forgot the part where finland becomes a soviet, communist satellite state in that scenario
>>214440105The area in red is the main finnish defensive line. Soviets would have invaded anyway, as they had agreed to in Molotov-Ribbentrop pact
>>214440105try harder
>let us have the maginot line, that's all we want>you can have Belgium or whatever in exchange
Its crazy that even all with all the historical realities of how Soviet union occupied poland, baltics and romania, there are still people who are out there pretending that you could have "deal" with soviet union which was somehow beneficial. Soviets litearlly first demanded bases from baltic states and then used those bases to occupy countries in timespan of couple months. That would have happened to Finland as well without armed resistance.
>>214440398\thread
>>214440105Fake news. The condition for ceding territories to Kuusinen was that the democratic government of Finland was defeated in the war and deposed, and the communist puppet government took over control of the entire country.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finnish_Democratic_RepublicWould you think it reasonable if Papua New Guinea and New Zealand were annexed by Australia on the condition that Japan invaded and occupied the country in the 40s, sent the entirety of the government to labor camps in Burma and installed Prince Higashikuni as the new Prime Minister?(You're probably the resident vatnik, but try asking any of the locals you interact with if they find this kind of land swap agreeable).
>>214440424
If a Russian speaks, it is only to lie.If a Russian thinks, it is it only to plot someone's demise.If a Russian walks, it is only to get somewhere to hurt someone.
>>214440105That was meant to be a trap. Soviets are without honor.
>>214440105>dude just give me your entire fortified frontline in exchange for dogshit land bro>i promise i wont invade you if you do that bro>if you dont then i will invade you and genocide your entire population btw
>>214442394Yeah
>>214442517kek
>>214440105I'll just post this.
>>214442565What's this supposed to prove that? Slavic subhumans have been occupying our land for a millenia?
>>214442645That larger part of the gained territory by the USSR was almost never yours.
>>214442689Yeah it was just populated and lived in by us.
>>214442776Most likely by Karelians and Russians, not by your people.
>>214442689it was inhabited by finns for the majority of history
>>214442517>Scam far away lands>Steal lands from your neighboursYeah damn.
>>214442808>Most likely by KareliansAll my grandparents are literally from karelia had to leave and abandon everything when the soviets invaded>RussiansNever more than an insignifcant minority and they never belonged there in the first place
>>214442831Only this tip. And it was "Karelian Finns" the rest of this eastern big chunk was populated by Karelians and Russians.
It's a slippery slope imo. Might be a green light for Russia to try to take the rest of the desirable coastline later.
>>214442901>Never more than an insignifcant minority and they never belonged there in the first placeMental gymnastics. I can say that Finns never belonged to the place they're living in because they came there from Asia. It can be said about any ethnicity.
Ussr had to invade finland, poland and baltic states to create buffer states against nazi germany. Not justifiable but understandable from the standpoint of self preservationThis was a direct consequence of making deals with the devil instead of agitating for world proletariat revolution & overthrow of hitlerism from the very start. Stalinist bureaucracy tarnished the reputation of socialism for its own interests.
>>214442955It literally invaded them and erased any buffer states between the two countriesThis is your fucking mind on communism
>>214442919Nope. My grandfather was from Loimola which is in the North of Laatokka and there are documents of his family living there at least since 1700's
>>214442919the karelians, which have been reduced to nothing thanks to the soviet union and russian state. undeveloped, neglected lands which have suffered since 1944. just look at google maps and compare the two sides of the border
I'll just post this.
>>214442942>mental gymnasticsThats what you're using to justify russian
>>214443007Soviet union and its invasion. Not Russian state. Despite Soviet Union bringing many ethnic things for them, back in the day. They were friends with Russian state and even sacked Sweden along with Novgorodians.Besides most of the Karelians and Ingrians left to Finland during winter war and then ww2 and got assimilated.
>>214443062>They were friends with Russian state and even sacked Sweden along with Novgorodians.Yeah before the novgorodians conquered them.
>>214442983>It literally invaded them and erased any buffer states between the two countriesThey were weak governments that would had been overrun by nazis , facilitating operation barbarossa as early as 1940 or even earlierUssr needed to sovietize them to serve as buffer, obviously stalinist clique thought a german offensive would take couple of years
>>214440105This is false. That area was offered for the Terijoki puppet government which basically meant that Finland would be annexed to SU.In my picture, the light red area is what they offered for the legitimate Rebublic of Finland. A small strip of useless forest for our main defensive line.
>>214442919>RussiansIt was not populated by russians whatsoever
>>214443158forgot the pic
>>214442955The USSR and Nazis were allies at this time
nooo saaaaa muh epic winter war we killed 6,000,000 russians finland strong saaaaaa
>>214440105Oh wow another episode of russhits being terrible neighbours! Who woulda known
>>214440424why are we acting as if you and the baltoids weren't rabid bolsheviks in 1917 and only didn't end up part of the ussr because of the germans?
>>214440105are there even cities in the green area?
>>214448411maybe, if it had been finnish. they would've taken care of and developed the land unilke HIVan
