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I've got a topic if you guys are willing to indulge me. What's the worst shot type of each reoccuring protagonist (Reimu, Marisa, Sakuya, Youmu, Sanae, Cirno if you really want to compare her HSiFS shot to her Yousei Daisensou shot but I don't think you can really compare them fairly)
For me, at least off the top of my head, it'd be:
Reimu: This is hard because she doesn't really have any truly awful shots. I guess either SA Suika for being kind of weak and awkward to use. Solo IN Reimu is pretty bad but most of the solo shots in IN kind of suck outside of Marisa and Youmu.
Marisa: I'd give it to DDC Marisa A, the flamethrower is just such trash and it doesn't even reach full screen. Such a shame because it's a really cool concept but it's hard to compete when Marisa's other shot is arguably the second most broken in the series.
Sakuya: I just really don't like her UM shot, I don't know exactly why but it feels kind of weak and unwieldy. Her B shot in DDC is also kind of lame but it's very specifically a scoring shot so whatever. I guess there's solo Sakuya in IN too but that just feels like cheating.
Youmu: I really can't call any of her shots bad in good conscience (outside of Eagle Youmu but it feels kind of cheap to count a straight up bugged shot) but I guess I'd go with Team Ghost for being the least interesting.
Sanae: I love the story reasoning behind her shot in TD, it's a really cool way to follow up her character arc in Hisoutensoku, but god is it a mediocre shot on what is otherwise a character that has historically always had absurdly good shots. I'd love for ZUN to explore the concept again but I can't blame him for going back to good ol' reliable frog and snake for LoLK.

>>49979859
>reimu
Do FW shots count? I can't think of having much bad impressions of Reimu shots outside of FW's Y2. The options floating around uncontrollably frustrates me to no end.
>marisa
FW Y2 Marisa has the same issues as Reimu of the options being completely unwieldy. Otherwise, I guess UFO Marisa B. I recall that shot felt overall pretty weak in comparison to other shots.
>sakuya
DDC Sakuya B, no contest. The shot has almost no utility and the bombs sucks ass. I vaguely recall solo IN Sakuya at least had some spread so you could clear stage mobs alright-ish even if the concentrated boss damage was ass.
>sanae
Sanae in TD. The curving shots made it pretty awkward to use and even if you line it up perfectly the damage wasn't anything noteworthy.
>youmu
Most of her shots are charged so they all kind of blend together for me. I guess Eagle Youmu since you'd want to stay unfocused but you also need to focus to charge which makes the playstyle awkward.

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How to enjoy SA? I have over 40 hours on that fucking game, and I just can't do this shit anymore.
It's always either Satori or Orin who fuck up my runs, and no matter how much I practice their spellcards I just can't do some of them, and when I think I've learned them they just pull some random undodgeable bullshit.
I can barely get to Okuu.
I wouldn't mind all of that if I felt I was making some kind of progress, or I was having fun.

>>49981388
Which character and shot type?
SA is (still) the biggest filter for new players, so no biggie if you're having problems with it.

>>49981397
Reimu A
The funny thing is that I've finished 01-10 and 13,14 but I just can't do 11 and 12.

>>49981417
New player doing Normal 1ccs? SA Normal is notoriously overtuned.

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Man, that anon was right. Nina is easy.

>>49981440
>New player doing Normal 1ccs?
Pretty much, started playing about 2 years ago, and have been trying to catch up.

>>49981453
Depends on your load out but I'd say Nina isn't too bad (as long as your shot isn't terrible).
She's easier than Momoyo but harder than Saki or Okina2 (but then Saki and Okina2 are probably the easiest extra bosses).

>>49981474
Yeah, 11 and 12 are frustrating. I'd suggest just leaving them for last honestly. SA you'll probably grow to like at least once it clicks, UFO is... contentious.

>>49981388
I haven't 1cc'd SA on normal yet either, but I still find it really fun.
The only part I find annoying is that I still loose random lives in the first three stages and have to restart. The latter stages are hard, but I find them engaging, and I found on thprac that if I play the first half perfectly, I can finish the second half, sometimes with one life left.
Maybe it's because I play Marisa A.

>>49981417
I would do a detailed write-up but instead of wasting my time and yours, here are some general hints instead:
- Practice Stages 1 to 3 enough to the point you can clear them without dying so that you have a good pool of Lives going into Stage 4.
- Practice the stages so that you don't have to bomb, or at least bomb once or twice times at most, you should be saving your Power for the bosses.
- Stage 4's bullets are all mostly aimed, so you can stream across the map at a moderate pace.
- Stage 5's ghosts fire aimed suicide bullets, so if you want to cheese them you can simply hold your fire during the yin-yang phases.
- Stage 6's are also aimed. Before I learned how to misdirect a stream I simply teleported to the other side of the screen (my first 1cc was also Reimu A). There are two spirits at the end that would fire a "Border of Wave and Particle"-like pattern so enjoy that.
- Satori's nonspells are genuinely easy to capture on Normal, try not to die or waste on a bomb on them.
- Orin's nonspells in all her appearances are tricky because the waves of bullets she fires overlap each other, so while you're focused on dodging the last of the first wave, the second wave is fired and they can fill in the gaps of the first and catch you off-guard.

>no matter how much I practice their spellcards I just can't do some of them, and when I think I've learned them they just pull some random undodgeable bullshit.
List them down and we'll provide specific tips for them. Don't wanna write down tips for all of them, otherwise, give me a few hours and I'll type them all out later.

Orin's (Atonement "Needle Mountain of a Former Hell") is definitely one you will mention. The concept is that the pink bullets are just a maze for you to navigate through while the spinning ghosts are aimed to fuck you up. Practice it a few times to get a gist of their size, then misdirect them. How well you do depends on your navigation skill and speed. As Reimu A you will need to bomb it about twice to skip it (same with all other spellcards).
On a slightly related note, I looked at my replay and thought I cleared it with 0 lives remaining because I still remember how my heart was beating like a drum, but apparently I still had 6 lives to spare.

>>49981481
Saki was disappointedly too easy. I thought she would be harder since "The strong eat the weak" is the theme of that game.

>>49981490
After 40hours on SA and around 45 on UFO I still like UFO more, as when I die I clearly know what I did wrong, but in SA there is too much random bullshit and I die while doing something that worked the last time around.
The only bad thing about UFO is the unholy amount of lasers, other than that it's actually kinda fair.

>>49981516
The UFO gimmick sucks imo, it's a frustrating mini-game you have to indulge in the middle of everything else, pyramids at least proportionately reward your efforts and don't require chasing down obnoxious fragments (which by the way get fucked if you collect the wrong color by accident asshole).

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Still the most well balanced game in the series.
Every shot? All strong, all the best at something.
Every subshot? All viable and all powerful options on at least one shot.

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Reimu G1 stones made the extra so easy that it actually felt disgusting to play it. I decided to try some other shot to learn the extra properly and it took me like 4 days to clear with Y2 but it was a lot more rewarding. I think I'll try to avoid abusing the OP options for other clears unless the base stuff is really bad.

>>49981558
Reimu is mediocre at extra and I'm tired of pretending her bomb makes up for her mediocre shot.

>>49981558
>Y2
I meant Y1. Y2 was the first extra clear I did with G1 unfocus and focused stones.

>>49981511
>Orin's (Atonement "Needle Mountain of a Former Hell") is definitely one you will mention
Actually that one that I can do quite nicely.
I usually bomb/die at her non-spellcards
I know that you can cheese her first nonspell by moving above her, but I haven't been able to do it.
Also I usually get lost in her midboss second attack.
Bigger problem is probably satori as I either bomb or die at everything after(and including) double black death butterfly.
>Stage 4's bullets are all mostly aimed, so you can stream across the map at a moderate pace
The problem is when you end up on one side of the map and you have to go back, that's when I usually bomb.
I can go through stages 1-3 without bombing or dying, at stage 4 I bomb a couple of times(mostly freebomb though), and at stage 5 I just freebomb, stage 6 is simple just go from left to right and then use the ability. By the time I get to Okuu I'm glad to have 2 extra lives.

>>49981529
I haven't played FW yet, but you can use UFOs to essentially freebomb as killing UFO clears the screen, so it doesn't really matter which color it is. Especially in the later stages this is quite useful.

>>49981589
FW and WBaWC both take an element of the UFO system and, in my opinion, massively improve it.
WBaWC takes the shard hunting part of the gimmick but instead rewards you with a PCB style shield and resources for picking up specific resources pieces (so no color matching required). There is a color matching system but engaging with it rewards you with a hyper shot on top of the pcb style shield which makes the whole thing less stressful.
FW takes the UFO type spawns but ties them to a predictable mechanic where chaining enemy kills fills up your encounter gauge, making it easier to plan around and less of an obnoxious chore to set up. You just get resources for playing the game well, and the spawns giving you both bomb/life pieces and resources to go into your hyper makes them feel more consistently rewarding to shoot down.

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>>49981504
Hardcore Marisa loyalist speaking, I'd suggest grinding out Marisa C. Her shot feels weak but that bomb is just so nice for the mental aspect of reducing stress while you have it up.
Also this might sound counter intuitive but consider just taking an immediate hit at the very start of your run. SA is a weird game where going down a life just for an early game power boost is genuinely worth the trade off.
It's also the easiest Marisa shot for Extra.

>>49981388
I'm still just at the stage of practicing individual stages and I just cannot manage to make stage 5 or 6 (especially okuu) feel comfortable, no matter how often I play through them. With every other game/extra stage I've beaten so far, the sixth stage ends up being about as easy as the rest of the game after enough practice and I always manage to compensate for stupid deaths early into a run by capturing cards at the end, but I can't see myself doing this with SA. I feel like I'd need to be a Hard-level player just to have a chance at 1ccing the game on normal. I've seen people claim that Okuu's first spell card is the hardest and it only gets easier from then on, and while that's mostly true, her last card is like the worst thing ZUN could make me have to beat after the hell of the rest of the game. Regardless of how often I try it, I have such trouble not either falling into a cylce of constantly panic-bombing, losing too much power and then dying a bunch because of that or just outright dying several times when I try to avoid that in the first place. I basically need 3-4 lives at that point and that's unrealistic considering the difficulty of the rest of the game. The game's just too cruel and the fact that it's still one of my favorite ones despite that makes it only worse lol. If it was just like UFO I could just avoid playing the game entirely.

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>>49981589
Watched my replay again and it's not too different than how you're describing it. How many lives do you have as you enter Stage 4?

Stage 4:
- Orin non-spell #1:
Just dodge. She leaves automatically after 15 seconds, but the spirits persist and will keep firing.
- Orin non-spell #2 (midboss):
Try to kill as many spirits on her front and side as possible. This will reduce the amount of bullets they'll spit out after her red pattern ends. The second time they respawn just focus all your fire onto Orin alone. This whole fight has two waves only, and is 27 seconds long, and the timer starts ticking when 9 seconds remain, don't let it make you panic and try to rush.
>The problem is when you end up on one side of the map and you have to go back, that's when I usually bomb.
- Fairies
I forgot about the blue and red fairies that fire the big blue bullets at you. Yeah they can be annoying and if you have difficulty here then just bomb, though I would strongly recommend learning how to "stream then misdirect and weave", it's an important maneuver and this is one of the best phases I can think of to practice it.
- Last big fairy before Satori
The final one firing a green card pattern. She drops 1.00 power and a lifepiece, so you can bomb here no problem.

- Satori spellcard #1: Recollection "Terrible Souvenir"
(skipping her non-spells because they're braindead easy on Normal)
I assume you know this, but you stay slightly on the left of her as the lasers stick on your position, then you alternate to the right, positioning yourself so that the first of the yellow bullets don't hit you (see pic related, I positioned myself wrong). I'm very inconsistent with this even on Normal so apologies.
- Satori spellcard #2: Recollection "Double Black Death Butterfly"
Personally I bombed this one. If you have at least 3.00 power, bomb just around when she fires her 3rd wave, you should be able to take her down with 2.00 if you're lucky with RNG. Curiously this spellcard was easier in PCB than here.
- Satori spellcard #3: Recollection "Flying Insects' Nest"
Stay close to the bottom of the screen, it makes it easier to misdirect the butterflies that are aimed once they ricochet off the walls. Be very mindful of the lasers because their length and distance between each other is not uniform, and it is easy to move left or right after passing one because you misjudged its length thinking it is similar in length to another one nearby. The "stream then misdirect and weave" I mentioned earlier is very relevant here.
- Satori spellcard #4: Recollection "Boundary of Wave and Particle"
Just dodge.
If you ran out of power then you can't bomb and will have to brute-force it or die and bomb.
It's easy, but the hardest part is trying not to get mesmerized or having a bullet slip past your gaze.

Stage 5 to follow...

I wanted to suggest Marisa C too like >>49981898 said because the bomb is a good crutch, damage is decent, and Satori's cards are easier.

>>49981898
>>49982785
I have tried Marisa and I found all of her shot types to be shit, I usually deal way more damage with Reimu A than with any of Marisa's shot types and the bigger hitbox certainly doesn't help.
On my Marisa runs I struggle to get to the 5th stage, whereas with Reimu I can get to the 6th stage consistently, plus I have no clue how to do the 6th stage without the teleporting ability.

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>>49981589
>>49982785
Walkthrough of Stage 5:
- Spirits
As mentioned earlier, all spirits fire aimed shots when killed. You can cheese them by not firing at all, however you won't get a good score and lose out on power items.
Generally red spirits drop (P) while blue ones drop (点), green ones drop special point items (after Orin's midboss)
- Yin-yangs
There are three types here:
-- At the start they fire fixed big blue shots and red aimed bullets. Misdirect the red shots as you travel across the screen. Be mindful that you cannot gap through the bottom corners because the blue spread shots cover these areas.
-- After that you have a yin-yang in the center of the screen shooting a constant wall of big blue shots, while spirits flood in from the sides. The wall is of a fixed length so get comfortable with grazing its trajectory that's closest to you. You can stream within this wall and if you're ballsy you can cross over the walls through the gaps. This same enemy reappears after this next section...
-- Popcorn hell, especially if you cleared Orin's midboss quick: You have spirits firing random scatter shots and (again) aimed shots when killed. This isn't bad on Normal but worse on higher difficulties. After that ends you get the same spirits but less frequent and yin-yangs that descend and fire very fast aimed shots. You might need to bomb here and if you gap be sure that the other end is clear.

- Orin midboss non-spell #1:
The first lane can be dodged while focused, but after the bend you will have to unfocus. I used to do it this way but I strongly suggest against this because you might overshoot and smash into the wall of bullets.
The better way to do this is to be higher than hugging the bottom of the screen, and descend with the pattern as you go pass the bend. You don't really need to unfocus doing it this way.
- Orin midboss non-spell #2:
As mentioned earlier >>49981511
>the waves of bullets she fires overlap each other, so while you're focused on dodging the last of the first wave, the second wave is fired and they can fill in the gaps of the first and catch you off-guard.
Just be very mindful when the second wave merges with the first. Even with 1.00 power you can end this before the third wave starts.
- Orin midboss spellcard #1: Cat Sign "Cat's Walk"
This honestly depends on your ability to read and reflexive dodging. I bombed this and even now I'm inconsistent with this. FYI you do have to follow her if you want to end it faster.

Orin fight to follow... (I might've posted a walkthrough of it before but I can't find it)

>>49982908
Yeah I had the same block mentality back then that's why I didn't really want to suggest it, but Marisa C is her best shot and the bomb really helps you practice better.
>plus I have no clue how to do the 6th stage without the teleporting ability.
Are you me from a few years ago or something? lol
You will get better the more you play.

>>49982938
>You will get better the more you play.
I mean yeah, but honestly I just want to be done with both 11 and 12 so I can move onto playing other games, as I've been playing these for probably almost a year now.

Also I've just done a run, and I've managed to get to Okuu's last spell card and get her to quarter of her health, so I think I'll just stick with Reimu for the time being, as relearning the stages and bosses seems like a lot more effort and time than just practicing Reimu.

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I've been going through the games lately, most of them for the first time, and trying to normal 1cc them, I've been having a pretty different time difficulty wise compared to what I've seen others describe, maybe because I haven't tried harder difficulties?
HSiFS has been giving me a lot of issues so far, my best attempt ended with one continue (2 extra lives lost) but it felt like a huge fluke considering that all the others have been at least 3 continues if not more, half the game feels like a deathmaze that I can't figure out just yet but I'm sure there's a solution somewhere, definitely the second hardest game so far with UFO being the hardest, that one felt impossible up until the very last second, not sure if I could replicate the 1cc right now either.
SA and LOLK on the other hand I didn't find particularly difficult, granted for LOLK I imagine it's because I've cleared it with Pointdevice Mode rather than Legacy Mode but I've captured almost every single spell in that game aside from Okina's final and it definitely feels like I could do that too if I tried just a little bit more. A Reisen Legacy Mode run feels very much doable and I'd love to try when I'm done with all the games too.
SA at least has honestly felt like one of the easiest games so far, not exactly sure why but I think it just took a couple days to 1cc it.
Extra stage wise I think Ran was by far the hardest, much harder than Yukari too who I was dreading given how much difficulty I had with the supposedly easier version.
I first tried PoDD and MS once I played with the respective shot types too which was pretty surprising, especially since it took quite a bit to replicate that success a second time (I wanted to record a 1cc since there's no replay system on PC-98).
Overall I would say that the three hardest games so far for me were UFO, HSiFS and HRtP, the easiest LOLK (PD), SA and IN.
Looking forward to trying HSiFS more tomorrow, so far I've had the most success with Winter Marisa and Reimu but I've started practicing Reimu Summer too to learn to actually use releases instead of just defaulting to bombs, I didn't vibe much with Spring (Reimu) or Fall (Aya and Reimu both) though so not sure how much I'll be revisiting those for the time being.

>>49983025
>aside from Okina's final
Junko's final, sorry, got HSiFS on the mind.

>>49983025
HSiFS is a very gimmicky game not saying that to deride it, I really like the game, you have to treat it more like Yousei Daisensou where you're actively abusing the gimmick to farm resources to abuse the gimmick again. Get comfortable shotgunning those releases.
Ran being easy is a meme, she's very middle of the road so far as difficulty goes. HSiFS and WBaWC probably have the easiest extras, followed by MoF. LoLK extra is brutal but Sanae and Reisen are broken shots so it balances out somewhat.

>>49983025
>>49983044
Oh, and a big warning regarding releases: releasing overwrites your i-frames, so if you, for example, try to release on a boss by abusing i-frames from dying, you will just instantly die again.

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>>49981589
>>49982938
Walkthrough of Orin's fight (I can't find my earlier post):
Before I start I'll say it again:
>the waves of bullets she fires overlap each other, so while you're focused on dodging the last of the first wave, the second wave is fired and they can fill in the gaps of the first and catch you off-guard.

- Orin non-spell #1:
This can be a bit tricky, because although managing the blue and green waves are already tough, you now have blue poker chip bullets scattered to make things worse. Keep your "box of concentration" a bit closer to your character than higher up, because you can easily account for a bullet when it's above you then accidentally slam into it sidewards.
I don't know of your safespot so this is a generic tip.
- Orin spellcard #1: Cursed Sprite "Zombie Fairy"
Here's what I did to capture it: Keep firing at the start because you have a few seconds to damage Orin before the zombie fairies activate. You can keep firing even after they are up, but when they all get near you stop firing. Try to slip past the fairies on the left of the screen, then rally the fairies to follow you and go clockwise behind and around Orin. Once you passed Orin the fairies would be in the top-left or left of Orin. At this point return to the bottom of the screen below Orin and just keep firing at her and the mass of fairies until the card ends. I couldn't use this strategy on Hard, but it works on Normal.
- Orin non-spell #2:
Orin jumps between the right, middle, and left sides of the screen. On the sides she releases spirits that fire aimed shots when killed or suicide after a delay, while in the middle she fires a wave of blue bullets like her first non-spell. I suggest staying in the middle and misdirecting the aimed shots from the spirits, and jumping through the wave of blue bullets once they descend.
- Orin spellcard #2: Malicious Spirit "Spleen Eater"
This is a bit of a breather but it's easy to get too comfy with this and mess up. Basically go clockwise when exiting the trap and passing through the existing bullets. Be sure not to trap yourself between the new trap's walls and the old trap's. The spirits will close in on you so be careful not to smack into them. With 3.00 power you can end this after 4 attacks.
- Orin non-spell #3:
This is a bit hard to explain. Each attack has about 7 spirits that fire a fixed expanding cone pattern relative to their own position as they travel outwards. The sooner you get inside a spirit's cone pattern the safer you are. In pic related you can see the average "best" point of entry. Make sure not to get hit by criss-crossing bullets.
- Orin spellcard #3: Atonement "Former Hell's Needle Mountain"
Already discussed here >>49981511, and you said you're consistent with it then that's very good.
- Orin spellcard #4: "Rekindling of Dead Ashes"
I don't have a consistent strategy for this besides constantly rotating clockwise and dodging. I brute-force bombed this by bombing twice in front of Orin.

>>49982986
The 1cc is close within your reach anon!
I won't with a walkthrough for Stage 6 because it's honestly easier than Stage 4 and 5 (and I can't find my earlier post about it either).
As for UFO, here's a guide I made for Hard 1cc (>>49559804) but is still useful for Normal: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZHESHGilG5K5fHuHr0hbQNpJRl_On1HpZooKgaIWHzU

>>49983044
>>49983047
I'll keep that in mind, thank you

>>49983025
>>49983044
I remember Ran personally taking me 100 or so attempts to beat when I was trying to clear it years ago. She's relatively simple compared to other extras yes, but when you're a newcomer to the series who can barely squeeze out normal 1ccs (in my case PCB was my 2nd Touhou game and I had only normal clears in EoSD and PCB beforehand, Ran was my first extra), you're gonna have a hard time adjusting to the extra format and difficulty spike.

>>49983163
Ran is harder to clear than Flandre.

>>49982986
>for a year now
damn you suck

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>that one card you always capture in practice but still kills your actual runs
FUCK Artificial Disaster, second good run i lose because of a dumb fucking mistake
No Bomb/No Hyper Break/No Equip but still no perfect because of it
at least i finally feel close to the finish line

>>49983399
Okay, and?
I know that I suck, what's your point?

>>49981514
It kiiinda makes sense that the brute strength character is bad at danmaku going by spellcard rules.
But Momoyo also feels like she would fare similarly...

>>49983439
Flat Earther is probably the most butt-clencher card in the game for me so far. It's simple mechanical dodging but the walls of bullets are coming at you non-stop from all directions, bombs dodn't really ease off the pressure and you can only keep full concentration for so long until you slip up and misread an upcoming wall.

>>49984473
you have to be very aggressive against Flat Earther, ideally you want to prevent having to dodge 2 or more walls simultaneously so you have to actively move towards each of them

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This and Th08 solo Yukari are my only hard clears, not counting Phantasmagorias. I feel proud of myself.
>>49983439
New World Order always takes two of my lives without fail.

>>49986473
>Solo Yukari
That just sounds annoying for stages.

>>49986496
It probably was. This was something like 6, 7 years ago.

>>49981388
use thprac hit backspace and f1 to skip stage 4 & 5 and turn off invincibility on stage 6

>>49981440
>SA Normal is notoriously overtuned.
Is hard and lunatic from normal not as much of a difficulty spike compared to other games?

>>49987620
SA Lunatic's difficulty is a bit hard to judge, it's one of the harder ones at face value but bombs are really powerful when you get good at abusing them. That aside I'd say the gap between Normal and Lunatic is still smaller than other Touhou games, yeah.

>>49987707
I'll never understand why people think SA Lunatic isn't that hard. It absolutely is one of the harder games on Lunatic, especially when you compare it to its Power Bomb brethren, MoF. In MoF, all bombs deal the same amount of damage (or at least close to it) and the game is generous enough that 5.00 is the same as 4.00 DPS wise so as long as you're at 5.00 you technically have a free Bomb. SA doesn't have this and on top of that, the game doesn't give you life pieces if you Miss on a spell or non spell, resulting in a game that is very unforgiving to any mistakes, whereas MoF only really sometimes punishes the player for Bombing. Bombs in SA either deal weak damage orthey deal weak damage unless you're one pixel below the boss's hitbox. And then there's ReimuC which has a good bomb but an incredibly gimmicky shot type that makes aiming a pain in the ass. Unlike a lot of early Windows games, MoF's stage 4 boss doesn't change patterns depending on the shot type so that makes the gap between best and worst shot type even smaller in that game. SA just has tough patterns in general (Yamame's first spell has to be of the hardest patterns from a stage 1 boss) and Orin is still one of the hardest bosses in the series. SA's reputation as one of the hrdest games in the series is earned and it doesn't just apply to Normal mode

tl;dr: SA is hard because bombs are mostly weak unless you stay in a very specific postiton on the screen, it punishes you for dying more than other games, and the patterns are some of the hardest in the series
t. did MoF Lunatic with all shot types (and a few games at least once) and gave up SA Lunatic stage 5

SA is only difficult with the worse shottypes.

>>49988251
It's more that SA lunatic is less of a jump from normal from other games because normal is already pretty hard

>>49988251
SA Lunatic is easy because it's extremely reliable compared to most other games. You're in control of most of the game, and RNG is less of a factor in general.

>SA doesn't have this and on top of that, the game doesn't give you life pieces if you Miss on a spell or non spell, resulting in a game that is very unforgiving to any mistakes
I don't know why people always bitch about this. SA gives you 50 life pieces for free, with no planning or special effort required to get them. Even if you die 10 times to unique boss patterns, that's still 8 extends, on top of the 2 lives you start the game with, nearly infinite replenishing bombs, and being able to autocollect items from anywhere on the screen to replenish said bombs without taking the risk of going to the top of the screen.

>Orin is still one of the hardest bosses in the series.
The only threatening attack she has is cat walk, which you can just bomb skip or even entirely skip by timing out the nons. After becoming familiar with her as a boss, all of the nonspells are free, and the rest have reliable routing.

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AI improves the Touhou experience

Casually launched MoF and decided to try the extra stage for fun. Ended up clearing my second ever Extra Stage, what! Well, Suwako is on the easier side obviously, but still feels good. Suwako has fun spellcards though for the most part, hated her non-spells though and had to bomb almost all of them.

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GFW is kicking my ass even on Easy what the heck is going on
I'm not this bad in any of the other games I swear

>>49992468
>Suwako is on the easier side obviously
I think Suwako was pretty widely considered to be the easiest extra boss before HSiFS, but any extra clear is a good accomplishment. Good job anon.
>Suwako has fun spellcards though for the most part
They're gimmicky but fun, yeah. I still struggle with her second survival card, never bothered to really learn it.

>>49992507
GFW is like HSiFS where you need to approach it from a different angle than usual. It's not as much about dodging as it is about abusing the mechanic as much as is humanely possible. Always be freezing things, position yourself so you can get large freeze combos.

>>49992507
The weird control scheme prevents me from doing well. Holding C to shoot but everything else being normal is frustrating. I hope someone makes a patch that swaps it and Z.

>>49992468
To continue from this, I also casually tried WBaWC and ended up clearing it with Wolf Youmu. Two (easy) extras is one day, NEAT!

>>49992640
Thank you. Yes, Suwako's spellcards are definitely gimmicky, which makes them fun for me personally, since I'm not too good with spellcards that are just about dodging tons of bullets from all sides. Though I suppose not many extra bosses are like that.

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>>49992691
I could've sworm you were able to change the keys in the options but now that I went and tried I wasn't able to.

>>49993326
ZUN didn't start adding the ability to natively rebind keys until very recently, I want to say UM but I don't remember for sure.

>>49992468
Congrats, anon!
>>49993107
>Suwako's spellcards are definitely gimmicky, which makes them fun for me personally, since I'm not too good with spellcards that are just about dodging tons of bullets from all side
This is probably why I still haven't beaten her and found Flandre/Yukari almost "easier" in a way as I cannot stand things that are too reliant on me just figuring out a gimmick, learning a static pattern or going through a timeout spell. I'm not that good at dodging, but it's so much more engaging than just feeling like the only difficulty is reaching a pattern often enough to figure out the trick behind it and then never dying to it again. Which is why I loved Kanako's first non-spell, as well as her last spell so much despite strugling the first few times.

>>49981898
I tried it and she works pretty well. I think one problem I'm having is that I am very reluctant to bomb in general. I think I need to start planning the bombs and I'll be able to finish the game.

>>49994829
The beauty of Marisa C's bomb is that if it does nothing you get a refund for half of what you spent, and power is common enough in later stages that it's absolutely worth just putting up a barrier for any really iffy segments.

>>49995270
Oh, I hadn't noticed that. This does make things easier, but I still have to manage power to some degree. I did a few runs and stage 4 became the new big barrier, since it has both a lot of segments I needed to bomb, and I didn't have enough power from the stage to consistently do it.
Thank you anyway.

>>49981388
>I wouldn't mind all of that if I felt I was making some kind of progress, or I was having fun.
I would recommend taking a break and playing StB until you unlock the extra scenes. It's the perfect training ground for all kinds of skills, and SA will feel almost easy once you return to it.

In case you want some more inspiration for a run with ReimuA, I can post a yt a recording of the latest run I've done, going for a no-bomb just for the sake of it and almost getting it (lost midway through okuu's final).

>>49983173
Man, it really looks like difficulty is a subjective thing. Ran is the only extra clear I've got besides suwako, she took me like 40 tries to beat and after that I beat her with every other shot type in one or two tries each. And yet I still can't beat flandre.

Is there an updated 1cc chart with Th20 yet?

>>49995586
>I would recommend taking a break and playing StB
I actually do play StB as a warm up sometimes, but I can't really imagine doing full 30min runs of that game, it's just too gimmicky to be fun.
>I can post a yt a recording of the latest run I've done
Please do, I'm genuinely interested. Maybe I could learn a thing or two.

>>49996091
I just took the HSiFS section and renamed it a bit for my chart. The number of boxes is the same.

>>49996157
>I can't really imagine doing full 30min runs of that game
Just take it easy, focus on beating at least one scene per day, and if you get stuck on one and stop making any progress switch to another one and come back to it later on.

Here's the recording, I've made it while streaming so you might want to mute the video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PlnX7A69Cok&t=688
It starts with me dying immediately because I had got used to the speed from the short warmup I did on Lunatic, but it's mostly smooth sailing from there on (besides losing a fuckton of lives to Needle Mountain, probably because I hadn't played SA in like a year).

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Is there any way to do a borderless window like this but with black bars on both sides, like borderless fullscreen in other games

>>49996891
None that I know of, but there's a trick I use to increase immersion: Create a 1920x1080 pic (or whatever's the resolution of your monitor) in your favorite image editor and fill it with black. Then, open it with your internet browser and press F11 to go fullscreen, and finally open the game and keep the browser behind it.
Regardless, I would recommend against playing in anything besides real fullscreen (aka Exclusive Fullscreen), since the desktop window manager adds a very small but unwelcome bit of input lag.

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>>49996091
i came across a new template and tweaked it a bit to fix small issues, dunno if i'm missing anything else but here it is

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>>49996163
>>50000284
Thanks anons.

>>49983025
Managed to 1cc HSiFS eventually, yay. UM is kicking my butt hardcore now, I imagine that there's going to be some card combo that clicks at some point but I'm really surprised by how hard some of these boss fights are, the stage 4 one especially I've lost a fair bit of practice runs of it already.

>>50000429
I just grinded out Spell Practice for Misumaru's cards since IMO that's like the one boss that can't really be cheesed with ability cards because of those Ying Yang orbs.

>>50000401
I don't quite get the grouping in your chart compared to >>50000284. Also why is it called SHOSS instead of GI (Gouyoku Ibun) or SFW (Sunken Fossil World)?
I remember when there was pretty much a "standard" one a long time ago lol
>>50000000

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>>50000284
Thanks. My chart is mainly focused on encountering all of the dialogue and endings, so I've collapsed it a bit since only the extra stage has different dialogue for each subcolor.

>>50000547
Oh damn, some of the text got misaligned when I gave it some more margin on the left.

>>50000547
What's the small square for? Bad end?

>>50000566
Yep, it's for making sure I get to read those too. For example, the FDF games have it empty because I got 1ccs on the first attempt on both of them and haven't played them again yet.
(Although I should check whether they have a bad end at all.)

Now, that I'm actually trying to clear SA I'm astounded at how many people have cleared so many games (especially SA, UFO and LOLK).
I've been playing these games for a few years now and have managed to beat several extra stages, but I still can't see myself beating any of these on normal. How can there be people that have gone from being completely new to shmups to beating these games on lunatic in a 1-2 years?

>>50000624
As >>50000547, I can't speak regarding your question as I've been playing for 4 years already and I still play on Normal (although I've been taking it easy, I only play every sunday for 3-4 hours), but I can strongly recommend you to play the camera games. My most noticeable improvements in terms of skill all came after clearing each of them as part of my playthrough of the games in release order.

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>>50000624
>I'm astounded at how many people have cleared so many games (especially SA, UFO and LOLK)
It's kind of like a collection-type autism, for me at least. Once you get a hold a 1cc chart with lots of empty squares, you naturally want to start filling them up. It helps that the games are mostly good and the sense of progress and seeing yourself improve over time is very addicting.
>but I still can't see myself beating any of these on normal.
It's up to you, as this is a just a game in the end and you should engage with the series in the way you find most enjoyable. If you're comfortable at your current level and don't feel the urge to aim above that, then no need to lose sleep over it.
>How can there be people that have gone from being completely new to shmups to beating these games on lunatic in a 1-2 years?
Looking at my 1cc timeline, I got my first lunatic clear roughly 14 months after my first normal 1cc. I don't think it's that impressive, I remember some anon on /v/ who was a real tryhard and got a lunatic clear 6-ish months after picking up the series back around 2021-2022 when the threads were still tolerable and people played the games there. My general approach for each game (for the ones I enjoyed at least) was to 1cc it on normal first with different shots as a way to get familiar with the game and its mechanics, then get some extra clears if I could. If I like the game and want to push myself further, I'll try to clear on harder difficulties either then or in the future when I go back to the game.

>>50000502
I don't know why either, I think I just kept adding to it instead of using the standard. There's a few small things about it I didn't like at the time, I guess. I put SHoSS during a time before it was agreed on what we should call it.

>>50000642
Thanks for the tip. The camera games weren't on my radar as I've hardly played them after trying them out years ago. I will try giving them another shot.
>>50000752
I know the feeling of wanting to fill up an empty 1cc chart; getting a clear in most games just takes me longer than my desire to beat any particular game (with a few exceptions, most of which I've already beaten, and others that are just very difficult, like SA and LOLK). I guess my drive to beat them all took kind of a dip after beating Yukari and Flandre as those were a big motivator for me. I'm feeling like filling up my chart lately so I will probably get a few more clears before I take it easy again.

>>49999474
real fullscreen on 6 and 7 stretch the image though and on 6 at least it also adds in stuttering for some reason

>>50000864
If you're getting a stretched image, that means you should change either your monitor's settings or your gpu driver's settings to disable stretching. Even better if you can set integer scaling on your gpu, as that will result in a cleaner (less blurry) image, although slightly smaller.
I've never encountered stuttering on EoSD, I would be curious to see what it looks like.

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>>50000284
I haven't filled one of these out in years, so might as well.
Is it weird that I just completely fucking forgot that Sanae was in UM? I had a mild Sanae jumpscare when I was checking the character select for which ones I'd cleared, I always think of UM as a Reimu/Marisa/Sakuya game for some reason.
I'm also noticing that my only mainline blackout is in the most dogshit game in the series, fuck me. Granted, I just blasted through it on Lunatic, I consider any standard difficulty below a difficulty I completed as being "cleared" for the sake of these charts.
Still haven't played GI, the demo just really turned me off of it and while Flan coming back is really cool I mostly avoid dog shit thcrap patches so I can't understand the story and I don't give a shit about the gameplay.
I have no idea what 85 means in 100BM. All cards collected?

>>50000752
No CtC for fangames? Play it motherfucker.

>>50001027
>Is it weird that I just completely fucking forgot that Sanae was in UM?
Consider that Sanae's bomb is so absurdly broken to the point where you can cheese through the majority of Lunatic by grabbing Hijiri's scroll and buying lives for the entire run, yes it is weird.

>>50001063
Sanae always has a broken bomb. You might as well say "oh it's that game where Marisa has the laser".

How do I learn the notation for the new Touhou game?
I don't understand all this G2 or Y1 stuff at all. I don't see it the stones referred to as such in game.

>>50001987
They're referred to as such somewhere, score screen I think?
Anyway it's just color and order they appear in the list of stones (In order, R1 = EoSD, R2 = WBaWC, B1 = PCB, B2 = HSiFS, Y1 = SA, Y2 = IN, G1 = UDoALG, G2 = MoF)

>>50002000
Thanks, that makes clear sense.

>>50001030
I never did get around to trying that one. I've had a pretty miserable time running any of the danmakufu fangames ever since I switched to Windows 11 2 years ago. Granted it has gotten easier with recent Windows updates for some reason, at least the graphic issues I used to have got fixed to a playable extent, although some games still crash when you reach a more graphically-stressful and bullet dense section.

I tried out how CtC would work out of curiosity now and the main menu opens up but selecting any button crashes the game.

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does anyone have fan game suggestions? i remember seeing a photo fan game come out on steam recently, wondering if anyone played it
>>50000752
>some anon on /v/ who was a real tryhard and got a lunatic clear 6-ish months after picking up the series back around 2021-2022
hey thats me! im not tryhard! i was just jealous of all the other cool charts. i remember liking a chart with yuyuko on it, one with doom guy, and i think there was another with alice
looking at some dates, it took 120 days to get my first lunatic clear from no experience nor knowledge about touhou. started in march 2021 and tried to play at least 1 hour a day.
>when the threads were still tolerable and people played the games there
i still try to post gameplay, but threads die too fast and i dont feel like i've had anything notable. one day it'll be decent again
>>50000624
consistent practice for me. try to have fun, you'll never learn if you're bored or angry. so know when to quit too. its a bit different for everyone though
i jumped around games for the first month, never being able to get past stage 4, tried some STB, then got my first 1cc not too long after. i found IN difficulty progression to be pretty easy

>>50004972
I don't have any fangames in mind that you haven't played yet, so I'll just thank the doc.

>>50004972
That's still really impressive, especially with no prior experience.
>does anyone have fan game suggestions?
I played Abyss Soul Lotus a bit before FW released and had a really good time with it. It's the most radically different danmaku Touhou game I've played gameplay-wise, I'd recommend it if you like the more cheesy bullet-cancel focused gameplay like HSiFS instead of pure technical dodging. Stage 3 has one of the best gameplay-music syncs I've ever experienced between both official and fanmade games, but that's more on the aesthetic and music front. It got an unofficial english patch earlier this year too.

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It's been long enough that I feel comfortable saying my opinion on FW is mixed. I think on a macro scale everything is fine, the ideas and general game design are all good. It's just the small things, the way systems interact and the balance, are really sloppy. Something specifically that bothers me is that it's a game that features heavy customization where like 90% of your choices are shit and it's tedious actually unlocking your customization options in the first place. HSiFS succeeded with its customization because all your options were incredibly well balanced and viable, while UM had poor balance too it also gave you so many diverse options that you could make several completely divergent strategies work. With FW the customization doesn't offer enough diversity in playstyle to really feel like it's worth experimenting with, and most of your options are just overshadowed by the two really good stones and the two or three shots that are actually worth using per character. I'm sure none of that matters to some people, given that I've seen people genuinely try to push this idea that "game is hard and that's all that matters", but FW has just been weirdly frustrating in a way other difficult games weren't. Still more fun to grind than UFO though.

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Put aside some time to play SA in the hopes of beating it as my first Touhou game, I initially picked it up on a whim about 12 years ago because of an Okuu doujin. Didn't even realize that I picked what's considered one of the harder games in the series, I then got filtered hard by Stage 3 and dropped it (ofc). Been exposed to a decent amount of difficult games since then so I figured it's time for a rematch.
Took me about ~19 hours to reach Okuu's final spellcard, a lot of it was grinding continues on Stages 5 and 6. Got myself thprac after that and went through all the spellcards from Stage 3 to build up my confidence and dodging. I focused especially hard on Okuu's Nuclear Fusion to work on my pathfinding and fix bad habits I picked up early on (mainly my jittery movement and tendency to overshoot in a direction).
30+ hours later, I can reliably reach Stage 5 with 4-5 lives and reach Stage 6 with 2-3 lives in a run. Still need to work on my focus movement/micro dodging a lot more to up those numbers, I still flinch from hearing the death sound (lol) since I wasn't expecting to clip a bullet while navigating through patterns. Bright side is I can counter bomb somewhat reliably if I know a hit is coming.
Fuck Double Black Death Butterfly, fuck Border of Wave & Particle, fuck Mega Flare, and fuck Hell & Heaven Meltdown especially. I'll get back to it again after a week break.

>>50000429
There was indeed, 19 and 20 fell in pretty quick succession after it too.
I've now 1cced every mainline game. There's still plenty I would like to do but it feels nice being able to say that.

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This is the first spell where I am considering the need to adjust my keyboard sensitivity.
wtf man.

>>50010892
What do you mean? That's her easiest card lmao. Use G1, if you really want to make the card a joke, but it's pretty easy as long as you remain calm. Her second and fourth cards are the difficult ones.

>>50010905
I love how you can always rely on some retard chiming in with a bad take that they're holding exclusively to shit on another anon. Literally any time someone talks about having trouble with something.
It's always paired with this retarded non-advice too.

>>50010892
Start it right below the health ring.

>>50010924
You will unironically figure it out in a few tries, it's that simple. Start right below her, wait until the last moment to go to the side, wait as long as you can and then just quickly go back to the middle while it's still off to the side and repeat with the other side. Don't move when the card starts or you can very easily have them spawn on you and be careful as you sometimes have to do diagonal movements. You also need to keep in mind that those bullets that follow you around become faster the further you are into the card so you will have to become more proactive with your movement. Also keep in mind how exploding bullet and the surrounding stones interact and force you not to remain on the same row. The card is really just best learnt by trying it until you get it. Using G1, if you position your shot right under her, the card ends so quickly you hardly even have to give a fuck and can remain on the same row.

>>50010973
By right below I obviously mean still far enough down to have enough time to move to the side and get a few seconds of directly shooting at her in.

>>50010905
I practiced it. It seems like I can just stand still and it won't spawn the matrix over me for an instakill anyways.
There were a few times where I could cap with no vertical movement needed, so yeah I guess it is easy.

>>50010973
>>50010988
Faggot.

>>50010927
This is good advice though.

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ZUN bump

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>>49981388
Patience, don't use Marisa A/C, every run after stage 2 should be no reset, patience, and have fun
Also don't die during boss fights

>>50000752
>Once you get a hold a 1cc chart with lots of empty squares, you naturally want to start filling them up
And it is very fun and 1 reason these charts are a good thing! It can be unhealthy tho. You gotta knot when to stop. I feel bad sometimes when i come across my chart and notice I never beat UFO in lunatic, and it makes everything look bad but at the same time, I know why I chose not to do it, thats important. Don't let the completionist in you push you into doing things you don't enjoy

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>>50004972
Thanks doc.
I recommend Touhou Kikamu ~ Elegant Impermanence of Sakura, it has one of the best fangame OST, fun gameplay and you can play with Yuyuko in it too! she is also a boss
The same devs also released Blue Devil in the Belvedere. It isn't as good but its still great. No Yuyuko tho.
There is also Shinning Shooting Star, which I consider to be the best th fangame ever. Worth a try
Now, could you explain what the hell is going on with that very large chart there?

Oh, FW is actually good. Even a 1CC doesn’t feel tedious in fact, it feels more fun than NB because in this game, the mechanics actually useful for survival, but they’re not super overpowered
Also, ZUN should just let players choose the stone from the start instead of limiting customization, especially since you can unlock them by just select the stone and alt+f4 anyway just like in the demo

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Is this the intended way to dodge this or is there a less ass-clenching way

>>50019375
>don't die during boss fights
I've been trying to (^^;
>and have fun
I struggle with this so much. I just don't know how to have a good mentality while playing these games.
When I actually try, and die(especially on the attacks that I know and usually don't die on) I get frustrated, which in turn means I make mistakes.
On the other hand if I try to do a chill run I just die because I'm not paying enough attention, because I don't care.
In either of those cases I'm not really having fun, and in general it's been a while since I've had fun playing Touhou. Which is why I want to finish these games(11,12, maybe 15 though I'll probably leave that one) and be done with it.

As of late I've been playing some other shmups, namely seihou shuusou gyoku, samidare, and refRain, and I've been having so much fun with those compared to the Touhou games I've been playing, and the newer ones.

>>50019730
>Don't let the completionist in you push you into doing things you don't enjoy
I agree wholeheartedly. I sometimes feel bad for never clearing HRtP since that's the only missing piece of the "1cc all mainline games" milestone for me, but I attempted it twice in the past and just couldn't stick with the game for too long. I don't think I made it past stage 15 or so on 1cc pace. Trying to force it when I wasn't enjoying the game that much felt pointless and it'd only result in me hating the game.

>>50020039
...sit under her and go through the gaps?
I swear you homing players pick up the weirdest fucking habits and then pretend as if you're playing optimally.

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>>50019753
>Now, could you explain what the hell is going on with that very large chart there?
Not that anon, but that's the Len'en BPoHC chart. Not sure how familiar you're with the game, but if you're not, think of it as this weird danmaku + CYOA game chimera with cell-based progression where each stage consists of multiple cells. Each cell is a separate RNG enemy wave and your movement on the screen determines whether you progress to the left, middle or right cell ahead. Your overall position on the cell grid of the stage determines whether you go the left, middle, or right next stage. What enemies you face along with the RNG events happening ocassionally can make or break your run, so it's very different from the usual Touhou style experience, but there's still fun to be had in it.

It's very wacky and intentionally unbalanced because there's an upgrade system with different perks and stat boosts for each playable character. The more upgrades you have set, the higher your "level". That's what part of the color of the chart is based on. The game has a barrier system, which can let you soak up hits before losing a life and makes the game much easier. If you choose the Instadeath option from the settings, the game will complete ignore that barrier system and cost you a life on each miss, that's the other color factor. The different horizontal sections of the chart are based on which boss you fight at the end. The top 3 are the possible bosses of the extra stage, and the ones below are all the different possible final bosses of the main game. I've rearranged part of my chart to be easier on the eyes and grayed out the squares which are not possible, because you can't fight a specific boss if you're playing as them.

I don't think the chart was made with the serious intention of someone ever filling it up. It's probably intentionally overwhelming, but it's funny to look at.

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>>50022214
>I don't think the chart was made with the serious intention of someone ever filling it up
Yeah, same as this one.

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>>49996891
>>50000864
Not borderless window, but you can do it with fullscreen. I just set these settings in my AMD Adrenaline software and it started centering the image with black borders instead of stretching.

>>50022214
Huh thats a lot to take in, is the game any good? Compared to say, mainline th games and th fangames.
>>50022251
OK I get the spell practice squares but what about the rest? I played a lot of IN but I don't understand. I probably have filled a good chunk of that

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Really only played 6,7, and 8, though I plan on starting MoF soon after finishing IN's extra stage with all the teams. I find both the stage and the Mokou fight to be easier than the phantasm stage and Yukari, but beast Keine is a shit shoot since she can mix the patterns of her spell cards. Still nowhere near as difficult as Flandre and EoSD's extra stage.

>>50022809
>is the game any good?
Like I mentioned, it's a very different and more experimental take on the danmaku game format. I wouldn't call it as good as mainline 2hu games or the higher tier of 2hu fangames, but I enjoyed my time with it overall despite the many frustrations involved. One way to think of it is if 2hu games are like roguelikes where each run is completely isolated and restarting brings you back to zero, BPoHC fits more as a roguelite where the game will initially feel hard and unfair because of all the RNG bullshit and characters being weak, but with each run you gain currency to spend on upgrades to make characters stronger and the game easier. Of course, you can completely ignore upgrades, turn on instadeath and rawdog the game, but you won't have the most pleasant time if the game decides to do something like throw a nasty enemy wave on you combined with a bad RNG event that gives enemies immortality or flips your control inputs. It's more in the realm of a self-imposed challenge rather than JynX's intended player experience.

>>50022876
IN is probably the easiest extra of the classic Windows games (unless you count PoFV), MoF will be even easier though.

>>50022876
>beast Keine is a shit shoot since she can mix the patterns of her spell cards
You can stream the first spellcard from the edge of the screen to the center while focused, then stream from the center to the edge in the last spellcard.
It's easier to do as Border Team because their focused speed is just perfect. This is harder to do as the other teams because they're much faster, while Magic Team's narrow shot means you'll have to use a different strategy.

Despite how much people like to hype up MAlice Cannon I genuinely think Solo Marisa is just a better shot all around than Team Magic. Alice laser and Alice bomb is just so miserable that I'd gladly kneecap myself and lock myself out of youkai mode rather than deal with that.

>>50022887
To add on that, it's a game very tailored towards replayability, between all the different routes you can go in the main game, all the customization via upgrades, and there being 13 total playable characters with very customizable shot options. The scope of the game is pretty huge. Upgrades also make the game as a whole more casual player oriented, something you rarely see in danmaku stuff. It's certainly a flawed game, but I would say it's one of the more interesting ones and I appreciate the ideas it attempted to pull off. I would recommend trying it at least, for the novelty if nothing else.

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>len'en

>>50022967
I don't get the appeal either. Tried the first two, found them painfully mediocre and very "fangamey" in their balance.
That's without even getting into how unappealing the character designs are.

>>50022876
I'd recommend not skipping PoFV, it's an extremely entertaining game if you enjoy raw reflex-based dodging.

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>>50022928
I know having Alice as a playable in a mainline again is a pipe dream, but I hope her shot type is like her card in UM: An option that approaches the nearest enemy, sticks in front of them and shoots. Hisami in UDoALG is a similar concept but with a wide firing angle.

>>50022876
>>50023000
It's also a fun multiplayer game, though it can be rough finding people to play.
For extra fun try playing 19 immediately after for a juxtaposition between great vs shmup design and terrible vs shmup design.
Even if you just care about story PoFV has some great dialogue. Final boss has some great convos with the cast that really help flesh out the world and the endings are all fantastic (Cirno's PoFV ending is an easy top 3 in the series for me, and most endings aren't far behind it).

>>50023018
Honestly SA already kind of redeemed the Alice shot and I'd be fine with zun reusing it.

>>50022809
>but what about the rest?
The first row is just the usual series of 1cc, like you get on the 1cc chart, although including Easy Modo.
Then there's spell practice, one square for capturing each (on all of the difficulties, according to the guy who made it), and main story, with one square for capturing each while playing the game normally (all diffs).

>>50022974
The third game is better in terms of gameplay, the stages on the first two feel like boring and empty filler and only the boss battles (and the music, which ranges from pretty good to really good) make up for it. The extra stage is quite good on all three.

>>50022492
This works really well, thanks!

>>50022949
alright, I'll see if I try it some time. I have yet to even play th20 tho
>>50023050
>with one square for capturing each while playing the game normally (all diffs).
this seems redundant

>>50023213
It's a meme chart after all, anyone wanting to use it can customize it as they prefer.

>>50023000
>it's an extremely entertaining game if you enjoy raw reflex-based dodging
NTA, but I've only tried it twice and hated it both times. Every stage before the final one the boss ended up dying without me having to try at all and the final boss refused to die regardless of how long I hung on; it was like playing against a computer that was able to do an infinite amount of god-level dodges. I don't get what other anons see in it and I love nothing more than the random dodging aspect of Touhou games.
>>50022974
I've only tried and beaten the first game, but from what I recall the stages were a joke and hardly required any skill, but I liked some of the bosses in the game (a couple of spell cards of the fifth and sixth stage bosses in particular). The music was pretty mediocre, but I still occasionally have an earworm from the fifth stage theme as that one was very good.

>>50023468
>it was like playing against a computer that was able to do an infinite amount of god-level dodges.
Because that's exactly how it is. There's an internal timer for each stage, and once the time is reached, the CPU will be reckless and straight-up not move away from a bullet's path, or actively crash into one to end the game.
>I don't get what other anons see in it
>I love nothing more than the random dodging aspect of Touhou games.
Because PoDD and PoFV are peak random dodging in the entire franchise. Of course, all games are more-or-less aimed or fixed, but for these two games there's noticeable RNG factor in play, that the player is forced to rely on reflexes instead of routing.
>Light blue bullets are vaguely aimed at you (i.e. you cannot stream them as they're aimed in your general direction only) and light red bullets ignore your position.
From https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Phantasmagoria_of_Flower_View/Gameplay#Obstacles
Anons here usually suggest StB or DS for practice, but in my case, clearing all characters in PoDD, PoFV, and UDoALG (after despising the thought for a long time) is what boosted my skill and gave me the confidence to do all the Extras.

>>50023000
Dodging in that game feels like a sign you're doing something wrong

>>50023590
I noticed that something like that was the case, but that just did not happen with the final boss. If anything, it was the opposite. She somehow lost a ton of lives in the beginning and then only got better with time. If the bosses were a bit more difficult early on and the final boss wasn't that broken it'd have been great as I liked the dodging part quite a bit.
>Anons here usually suggest StB or DS for practice, but in my case, clearing all characters in PoDD, PoFV, and UDoALG (after despising the thought for a long time) is what boosted my skill and gave me the confidence to do all the Extras.
I was already thinking of giving that game another chance, despite the bad experience in the past.

>>50022928
Magic team for in IN is actively infuriating to play. You'd think that Alice would be doing lots of damage since you have to be right underneath your enemies to actually hit them, but she gets outclassed by both Youmu and Remilia, who're much more flexible with stages thanks to their familiars. Beast Keine's first spell card requires four cycles of streaming to get through with magic team while everyone else requires max of three. MAlice cannon also shreds the shit out of your shift key and requires standing still, which isn't exactly a thing that's too common in these games. Too much risk, not enough reward to justify playing them.

>>50023018
I unfortunately have all the reflexes of a geriatric sloth, so PoFV's story mode is the literal bane of my existence. Matches essentially turn into endurance rounds with how the AI is programmed, and certain offensive patterns (Aya's homing meteors, Medicine's poison smog, etc.) feel like they were genuinely designed to piss you off more than anything else. I imagine the game is a blast with friends, but it's just not my cup of tea to play solo.

>>50024423
>but she gets outclassed by both Youmu and Remilia
I'm pretty sure she gets outclassed by fucking Marisa, and even if she doesn't it certainly feels like it.
>Aya's homing meteors
Stream in a u to avoid ricochet, once you get it down she's pretty free.
Once you realize literally everything Aya can throw at you is solved by streaming, it starts to become abundantly clear why she's a popular pick for worst character in the game (against human players anyway. Medicine and her absolutely shred the AI, albeit for different reasons. AI in PoFV is really bad at handling fast aimed dense bullet patterns, which is literally all Aya does, and they rely heavily on movement speed to micro adjust around bullets which means Medicine clouds just completely break their ability to dodge things).

>>50024423
>requires standing still, which isn't exactly a thing that's too common in these games
people gloating over malice cannon seem to ignore this for some reason. moving while spamming shift really fucks with speed.

>>50023468
>Every stage before the final one the boss ended up dying without me having to try at all
Unfortunately, every stage before stage 6 is indeed uber-easy modo and the opponents die on their own. From stage 6 to 8 they start to survive for long enough to become a threat.
The final boss fight is particular in that the hidden timer which states you long you need to survive before the enemy starts to allow itself to lose the last health point is set to about 5 or 6 minutes, which makes it almost impossible.
This only counts for the first fight though, the timer of every boss decreases after you lose one life against them, and eiki's goes down to about 3 minutes, which is still hard but doable.
The game is all about surviving as long as possible. Charge level 3 attacks are useless, and level 4 attacks (boss) are risky. You need to preserve your gauge and spam charge level 2 attacks every time you're in danger, not in order to trouble the opponent, but to clear some bullets around you.

I've finally killed Nue

>>50028042
That's fucked up Yorimasa.

Finally managed to beat Ran. All things considered, a little practice and bomb management with SakuyaA and it's pretty stress-free. But damn I made so many dumb mistakes either way. The survival spellcard is a no-go for me, have to bomb most of that shit.

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What if ZUN made a horizontal Touhou

Any way I can map triggers in Touhou without Joy2Key? Like is there an ini file I can edit and manually put in the button numbers for the triggers

>>50029568
Id have a hard time clearing normal mode again

>>50029617
Nah, ZUN didn't think that far ahead.
I recommend looking into AntiMicroX, it might help.

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>>50024248
>She somehow lost a ton of lives in the beginning and then only got better with time.
>>50024423
>Matches essentially turn into endurance rounds with how the AI is programmed
Yeah that's what anon mentioned in this useful post >>50026867.
Moreover, in Extra mode they actually show the timer itself under your character so you know when the CPU will take the hit.
I made a small table of my 1cc Normal clears for reference, in case it may come in handy. If you can get at least 2 lives in stock before the final boss, then should be able to get the 1cc.
Read through the gameplay page because there are some good stuff to know, like reaching 1,000,000 score by combo automatically fires a charge lvl 4 attack, bombing before picking up a G...etc.
https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Phantasmagoria_of_Flower_View/Gameplay

Also sorry the bit between parentheses was referring to Phantasmagoria games as a whole, not only UDoALG. It's still a flawed game, but after clearing it with all characters on Hard recently I think people were too harsh on it. It's also has a decent kind of grinding practice: Versus mode, Hard difficulty, disable the hit shield and leave HP at 1. Then again, the game is too unbalanced so some matchups are not conducive to practicing as the usual games (StB...etc.).

Any recommendations for keybinding for the fighting games?
I've been thinking of trying the fighting games, but the default controls feel kinda awkward.
Also is there anyway to resize the window? I don't wanna play them in full screen, but the minimized window is too tiny.

>>50037535
I remember changing between things like QWERT+space with one hand and arrows or WASD + space and UIOPN to have all buttons under a finger at the same time but I haven't played them in a long while nor did ever gid gud at them. Pressing with the thumb is sometimes a bit awkward.