If you were stuck on an elevator with a Pentagon official and could pitch a replacement to the m7, what would you say? I'd personally recommend a 22 arc with shell shock cases for lighter weight and when combined they should have ~20% more case capacity than a 5.56>Cheap optionKeep the current lower and upper, upgrade to a standard issue sopmod stock and mlok handguard, 16in medium barrel and bolt.>Total replacementAgain sopmod stock and mlok handguard, but with a fluted barrel, icar receiver, three position gas block, sand cut and upgraded bcg, incorporate some of the mk2 upper receiver changes, and a stubby suppressor
>>64321720M4. Rifle is fine.
>>64321720He'd just have security throw you out afterwards.
>>64321720LITERALLY just the fucking RM-227.
M4A1 SOPMOD block II for everyone. it's the best general purpose rifle the US ever had.
>>64321720I forgot to mentionStandard issue: ~77gr steel coreHome defense/police/urban counterterrorism loading: duplex rounds which are each 50gr
>>64321720they might as well go for Spear-LT
>>64321720Easy
>>64321790
>>64321732It's definitely better than a sig, but the round still seems like overkill for general issue
>>64321720I'd tell them to keep the M7 because I'm so fucking tired of these constant threads I swear to god.
>>64321790I wish there was more news on this, but I haven't heard any updates or new info on the round
>>64321720>.22 ARCIt's called .220 Russian, and if it was any good it would have caught on decades ago.>>64321732The RM277 was such an enormous pile of shit it actually managed to lose out to the Sig Spear in direct competition.>>64321736This, except URGI.
>>64321720>what would you sayalternatively a URGI with a quattro 15 lower in 22 ARC with polymer or shellshok cases
>>64321736SOPMOD Block 2? what fucking year is it? Give the infantry battalions URGIs
>>64321879Bolt face is too big for an URGI, has to be either .224 Valkyrie or some meme upper with an AR-10 bolt.
>>64321889bendy bill will not survive the infantry
>>64321720Regarding upgrading the M7 to be more like an M4, the phrase "throwing good money after bad" comes to mind. All the M4 "needs" to be good for another 50 years is a FF handguard, and even then, shit doesn't really matter. The M203 is still in use with multiple branches and is still floating around in some army units, so said handguard would necessarily need to be able to mount it, and DD rails are the only ones I'm aware of that have that capability. Though they should put it out to tender and have other manufacturers try their hand at it, since buying OTS often means you have to fit things to your purpose, which for something you're going to buy 2 million of shouldn't happen. I would just cut off FSPs at the armorer level for now, suppressors are having something of a renaissance right now so you don't want to buy early and get stuck with quickly outdated shit, so just wait until you're comfortable that flow through cans have hit another plateau and then you'd adopt a proven one alongside an adjustable gas block. You just don't want to rush this shit.
>>64321916The M320 will be old enough to drink soon.
>>64321902Do the URGI rails have flex issues?
This is going to be the same thread for the next few decades huh
>>64321926they are known for it yes. that and durability. honestly any similar rail suffers from the same issues.
>>64321931It's an important issue costing several billion dollars
>>64321720>cheap optionFN IWS in .264, converted LAMG or Evolys with a QCB>total replacementSmaller Textron NGSW in .264 LICC
>>64321923The M320 is just a standalone AG36, so its old enough to have 3 kids and a mortgage.
>>64321894ok so be it
>>64321939If you were to redesign the Textron NGSW for a conventional cartridge it would be a completely different gun.
>>64321931Yeah, probably. It doesn't seem like anybody who didn't receive direct kickbacks from Sig are happy with the way things turned out, so its fun to get granular about how things could have been better.
>>64321953you can fit the 264 bullet into the CT case
>>64321720Make the URGI standard for Army issue redesignated as M4A2, and adopt NAS3 77gr ammo. Also make a version stretched out to 20" with rifle gas and call it the M16A5, issued as needed for people who actually require that extra muzzle velocity and reach. Do the same for .308 caliber weapons, If they really do want the 6.8mm bullet, in that case they could just rebarrel all DMRs and M240s for the TV polymer case cartridge.
>>64321953Same loading, different case type.
>>64321720Bring back the LSAT. Chamber it for a 5-6mm bullet, ~40-60gr, whatever caliber and shape is optimal for ~400m range. Give the troops the lightweight rifle/carbine and ammo that they were promised, so that they can either carry less of a burden or so that they can carry lightweight guided weapons (mini-missiles, drones, whatever) for targets beyond 400m.Basically, if the target is farther than 400m, you should be engaging it with a sniper, a proper MG, or best of all, a guided munition. Stop trying to make every rifleman a marksman, because unassisted accuracy goes out the window when most people come under fire.
>>64321958Is that any different than the original 6.5 CT?
>>64322020Leaving distant targets to assets within the platoon other than the standard rifleman is such an obvious foundational principle, how did we ever stray so far from the light? Like the USMC have that every marine a rifleman meme, so nobody would be surprised if they tried this shit, but in a bizarre twist of fate they're the branch that kept shit normal.
>>64322039Traditionally the way you'd handle distant targets is to maneuver closer to them. You can't do that when you're lugging around 500 pounds of bullshit, so the solution is to add another 5 pounds of rifle so you can take potshots from 800 yards away with your 6 MOA battle rifle.
>>64321856>The RM277 was such an enormous pile of shit it actually managed to lose out to the Sig Spear in direct competition.This is what I keep laughing about. As bad as the Sig is, how much worse were the ones that lost out to it?
>>64321720Either of the other two finalists would be far, far better. I was fucking shocked that they chose the sig, it was clearly the worst option even in the testing phase.
>>64322081bull pups suck ass
>>64322066The only gun to lose in competition to the Spear was the RM277, Textron (and GD) dropped out before the competition actually began.
>>64322066>>64322081>>64322090The rm277 was solid and matched or outperformed the sig rifle on all metrics. To include soldier satisfaction ratings among units testing the candidates (so no, "muh bullpup" was not a reason). However it lost for two (official) reasons:>1. They did not provide a new machine gun option, which was at the time seen as more important than the new rifle itself. They said "you can just change out the barrel of an m240B, or just put a bipod on the rm277!" and this pissed the bigwigs off and was honestly simply a bad idea for several reasons.>2. The polymer casings would have required a complete overhaul of ammunition manufacturing lines and equipment. By contrast, sig's metal casings only required minor changes to existing ammo production facilities.Point 1 is valid and the main reason. You may notice that point 2 is completely fucking retarded, because it is fundamentally about cost: the savings of materials (no more brass) and transport costs (per round) from polymer rounds would have paid for the costs of retooling quite quickly, as in under 5 years. The citing of ammo factory retooling costs as a reason to choose the sigslop is what really convinced me this was a corruption case.
>>64322066the competition was so obviously (((rigged))) that it says nothing about the losers
>>64321720>I'd personally recommend a 22 arc with shell shock cases for lighter weight and when combined they should have ~20% more case capacity than a 5.565.56 super. Same case geometry as 5.56x45. but bullets 1/4" longer, pressure up to 80K. Shell shock case.Needs news recievers and magazines. New 5.56 super is reverse compitable with old 5.56x45, can use new ammo in old gun. With VLD bullets 5.56 has larger BC than 7.62x51 and easily outranges battle rifles. There is no need to leave computability with 5.56x45, whatever ballistic advantage you will get woul be miniscule, but ability to use old ammo us extremely nice.
>>64322235>can use new ammo in old gun.Can't use new ammo In old gun (doesn't fit into magazine so mostly safe from Kabooms).Can use old 5.57x45 ammo in a new 5.56 super gun
>>64321720keep the m7 for more specialized roles(dmrs iars and so forth)adopth the hk416a8 as m27a1 for general use and replace the p320 in the favor of glock 17
I'd tell them to pack away all this faggot shit and get the best AR-10 they can and make it 7mm-08
>>64322235>computabilitylol
>>64321832https://soldiersystems.net/2025/06/11/nsns-for-lightweight-intermediate-caliber-carbine/
>>64322022That was more like 6.5 Creedmoor, which was trendy at the time. It used the same size cases as 7.62 CT.
>>64322336Damn, I figure it had died on the vine. If its got NSNs, then they're at the very least giving it some serious consideration, if not already adopting it. Future looks bright.
>>64322081>>64322090imo a squad DMR seems like one of the rare use cases where a bullpup makes sense. you get a 20 inch barrel for your fuckhueg round, and it seems like it'd be easier to carry and aim because of the balance and length of a bullpup. but then again bullpups are still bullpupsthe idea of giving every rifleman a gun that shoots battle rifle ammo seems silly though. didn't the US already discover that battle rifles don't work because you can't accurately shoot at the enemy if you don't know where they are? wouldn't it make more sense to have like 70% of your squad firing 5.56mm at the general direction of the enemy while a couple of guys with overengineered space age laser rifles actually try to figure out where they are and shoot at them?
>>64321790Literally who
>>64322020this. nice and familiar, makes me feel good.
>>64322786>imo a squad DMR seems like one of the rare use cases where a bullpup makes sense.Completely the opposite.Given that it is a DMR the OAL isn't a big issue and having a more forward weight balance, especially with a long barrel, helps a ton with accuracy.
>>64322807>more forward weight balance, especially with a long barrel, helps a ton with accuracyeh i figured it'd be a better to start with a more balanced bullpup setup. i assume it's going to be somewhat front heavy anyway after you put in all the attachments and a heavy barrel. intuitively i think i would just prefer a bullpup if i had to spend a long time aiming at stuff with a heavy as fuck rifle. and i wouldn't feel totally fucked when forced to clear a room or something. but it's not like i would know anything about serving as a marine marksman
>>64322260everyone look! this anon is a zased minimalist! everyone stop and listen, they probably have incredible and nuanced opinions on iron sights!
Why not adopt the BAR again? No really, you have the 30-06 that can already melt through any armor like a hot knife through butter, and it can also be used as suppression for the machine gun part of the program. Instead of taking the M14 and making it an LMG you take the BAR and make it a true assault rifle. Throw away the mag and make it belt fed for a few of the guys and you are good to go. Seems like an easy solution right there :)>but it's still too heavyLift
>>64321931You can think of it as a form of repetitive stimming for turbo autists
>>64321720G11
>>64321931The truth must be told. Think of it as a replacement for the almost extinct .45 vs 9mm threads, only slightly more meaningful.
>>64322140>The rm277 was solid and matched or outperformed the sig rifle on all metrics.[Citation needed]>However it lost for two (official) reasonsHoly shit, you're actually retarded. If those reasons are actually official, them surely you can find a source for them. Except you can't, because they're both blatant bullshit. There was an RM277 AR variant as required by program, it was not belt fed because the program did not require a belt fed AR, and if the army changed their minds and felt certain that they needed it to be belt fed, there was ample time for them to tell GD and have them design one. The RM277 was heavily derived from the RM338, which was belt fed, so it wouldn't have been that difficult.Sig's hybrid case is completely different from traditional brass cases and doesn't have any more overlap with traditional case forming machinery than TV's.
>>6432172013.7" SR-16 plus Sig's 6.8 in M240s with the M250 replacing all SAWs.Adopt the NAS3 casing for M855A1. Make sure they ignore fucktards stuck in 2003 thinking 77gr smks are God's gift to mankind even though it wasn't even the projectile they wanted and had to default to it due to production requirements.Have someone who isn't dogshit or constrained by an unrealistic weight and length requirement to make a DMR.Force socom to abandon their 338nm mg program as well as their 6.5CM retardation. Consolidate to 338lm for sniper rifles even though it's hypothetically 5% worse than 338nm because everyone else uses it and we aren't going to snipe towelheads unaware of counter sniper procedure anymore.
>>64323005Quattro mag lower as well. Forgot that.Smart scope for sl and mg use.
>>64323005Admittedly, if the sig 6.8 is only being used in a machine gun or dmr capacity, you could reduce the pressure and switch to a different case construction as well
>>64323028That would be retarded since I want it to mog 6.5 cm ballistically. That's why it makes 300wm and 7.62 irrelevant.
>>64322991>so it wouldn't have been that difficult.It wasn't. RM834 pic rel.https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/true-velocitys-mult-caliber-belt-fed-machine-gun-the-rm834-44822677https://www.linkedin.com/posts/garrett-pellerzi_the-latest-game-changer-from-true-velocity-activity-7364424468124925952-wHNW/
>>64322791>>64322336
AR107.62x51DoneKeep the M4 for Urban and Jungle.
>>64323005>Force socom to abandon their 338nm mg program as well as their 6.5CM retardationAnd 6mm ARCAnd 264 LICC
>>64323059True they come up with retarded shit every year. It needs to stop.
>>64323036Yeah, there you go. There absolutely would have been a belt fed if the Army had at any point decided it was important.
>>64321720I agree with you almost completely, but for the expensive option, instead of standard .22 ARC a new cartridge with almost identical properties but slightly less propellant = .378 case head (for bolt strength like 6MAX), at 65,000 PSI like M855A1 or more, in an SST or polymer case, and with Quattro quad stack mags + lowers as standard. For the upper, what you said but also a custom BCG with a cam pin socket bolt and a straight gas tube. This should allow you to carry as much or more ammo than normal 77gr 5.56 and would be a great machine gun cartridge. It epitomizes the IAR concept for the Marines and would go great with the SCO too.
>>64321720Give everyone Mark 19s. Yes, everyone. The Infantryman, the Paper Pusher, even the HR roastie that prioritizes DEI hires. Give EVERYONE Mark 19s.
>>64323211chinese detected
>>64323047
>>64322223Yeah it was heavily rigged in favor of Textron/AAI, but they still managed to fuck it up.
Unironically the m249 is the most unreliable weapon in the squad or platoon. Replace it with a KAC LAMG variant. Replace the 240 with any modern MMG in 6.8 maybe even a m250 variant. if we have to switch calibers than something like 6mm MAX with shell shock technologies would give a decent bump in terminals without sacrificing capacity.
What's up with the SST shilling?
>>64323504>What's up with people talking about next gen cases in a discussion about future small armsGee idk. It works. Love mine I just wish Badlands would load more 62gr projectiles and step back from the 77gr meme.Honestly all the new cases show promise from TV to federals hybrid alloy case.
>>64323327They've tried the LAMG for decades now, it simply wasn't designed for that role. Stoner specifically built it for special forces to do lightning raids, shitting out tons of ammo then just exfill right away back to base, its not a "crawl in mud for three weeks and take sporadic shots" gun, it's not a "go through an entire factorys' output of ammo until the receiver warps" gun. Though one could arge, the SAW never could do those either, it is just a stupid role.
>>64321720I'd convince him to issue select fire M16A4s and KAC-made AR-10s with fixed front sight bases.
>>64323710Ranger Regiment as been using for like 5 years and seem to like it. I asked a former ranger about it and he said he loved it and that it was more reliable than the 249. Main down side is it cant be loaded with bolt forward I think. Your right about 249 also sucking in that role, honestly an IAR style weapon aint a bad idea at the squad level.
>>64322336>https://soldiersystems.net/2025/06/11/nsns-for-lightweight-intermediate-caliber-carbine/WE'RE SO BACK BROS
>Cheap optionUse those new 5.56 cases that one company was developing with thinner case walls so you can fit more propellant into them and get more velocity to make it more flat shooting and slightly increase range. Combine that with a new design of SLAP round with a better sabot so it doesnt go out the side of the barrel to get the armor piercing effect they wanted.>More expensive optionMake a telescoped polymer cartridge based off .350 legend with a longer case using a .223 projectile with a tungsten core in a sabot to get incredibly high velocity with armor piercing. Upper would need to be different but could be used with pre-existing M16 and M4 Carbine lowers. Standard rifle configuration would be a 20 inch barrel to take advantage of the increased amount of propellant with a 14 inch carbine barrel available.>Total replacementThe RM277 from GD. Seriously, the fact that this thing didn't win is proof enough we need to remove all the old retarded farts from being in charge of military procurement. Considering that the military is trying to get a bunch of kids born after 2005 to enlist its not insane to have a new change of doctrine with the adoption of a bullpup. Also, the fact that their submission for a GPMG was just a new barrel for the M240 that just drops in like normal and allows the use of the new cartridge was an even bigger selling point considering they wouldn't need to buy entirely new machine guns. God I fucking hate sig so much.
>>64323047He is so real for that
>>64325484>Also, the fact that their submission for a GPMG was just a new barrel for the M240There was no GPMG component to the NGSW program, no such submissions were made. GD submitted rifle and automatic rifle variants of the RM277, with the AR variant having a longer and heavier barrel profile, and a bipod. You can see them together here: >>64322081
I was looking at 11" AR uppers to put in a lower with a Law Tactical folder adapter for a backpack rifle and now I'm strongly considering just getting an 11.5 SIG MCX.
>>64325819>not an 11.5" PSAKill yourself
>>64326089I already have a 7.5" PSA 300 blk that I keep in my backpack lel.I want something that can reach out to 500 yards, but can fold.
>>64321720>>64323184These. With higher pressure you might not need a big case head like 6ARC's, whose parent case is 6.5 Grendel <- 7.62x39. >>64323036Why is there so little info about this? TV doesn't have to spend too much money to market it to civilians, but the webpage they set up for it literally breaks if you click on one of the drop-downs and has no high res images. They rely on their USMC connections too much.
>>64323184This is the correct answer. Simply duplicate 5.56 with modern cases and pressure and with better efficiency in internal and external ballistics. All of which serve to reduce the mass and volume of the cartridge. Picrel is something I mocked up. The Case is supposed to be that of a 30 carbine - 9mm in diameter vs 9.6mm.The powley computer predicts around 1250ft*lbs from a 16” barrel, and about 750ft*lbs at 300 yards, with a 59 grain bullet (5 calibers long, 8.2g/cc, assuming a solid steel bullet with a copper jacket around the bottom half)These ought to be fed from a 70-80 round desert-tech style quad stack mag, into a constant recoil action. It wouldn’t obsolete the LMG but it would make for a far more useful rifle, especially in full auto.
>>64321720The RM277 but in 6.5 sneedmoor. Just do the 6.5 Evolys for the squad automatic. No need for a rifle based mag fed machine gun.
>>64323184>the 6max shill doesn't understand the difference between EPVAT and piezo pressure testinglol, lmao even
>Some guy keeps shilling Shell Shock Technologies in this thread>Keeps acting like it's just as good as polycase ammo>Decide to look it up>It's just nickel cases>Heavier than polycase >Just as bad as brass casings when it comes to transferring heat to the chamber>It's a completely marginal upgrade to brassOooookay? I'm gonna stop taking you seriously now.
>>64323047Bring back the top charging handle with lock toggle lock for forward assist duty. Just give it some new recoil retarding stock and accessories. It was Cold War engineering perfection like the M60 and B52.
>>64327148polyMEME is dead, deal with it
>>64327148It’s 2/3rds the weight of an equivalent brass case and can withstand higher pressures. That in itself is a huge deal.
>>64327104It's amazing how many ways there are of saying that the ideal 5.56 replacement, and therefore the best general infantry cartridge, is just>external ballisticslong, relatively light sub-.260 bullet at 3200 fps>internal ballisticssmaller case volume, high pressureand make it lightweight.>>64327148It's a little weird that they're being mentioned so often in lieu of polycase recently but they're justasgood and better at some things. And more importantly SST is more widespread on the civilian market. TV doesn't seem to be interested in civvies.Both can handle pressures upward of 75kpsi (SST probably even more), but NAS3 cases have thinner walls, which increases internal volume and is why they're lighter than brass and about as light as polymer case ammo with its rather thick walls. They eject cool to the touch too, and they're more durable than either brass or polymer.On the other hand, polymer can be injection molded. 'Nuff said.
>>64321856the URGI rail is less durable than the RIS II and is barely any lighter weight. a URX 4 or MCMR would be better
>>64327267>They eject cool to the touch tooNo they don't. None of the 77gr or 75gr I've gotten from badlands do at least.They need to stop with the meme gr bullets and load some 62gr. Preferably m855a1.
>>64327276Huh, so it's just the pistol rounds then.Does anyone like Hornady or Sierra even make moderately long steel-core .224 projectiles? I don't imagine Badlands would be particularly keen on using the $1/ea. M855A1 bullets of dubious provenance floating around.
>the M16/M4 is just so good and has no flaws whatsoever that's why they've been trying over and over for nearly half a century to replace it>we should just go with SOPMOD block II or URGI because it's sooooo goodDoes it need to be replaced or not? Where has my 2+ billion or whatever it's been over the span of all these future weapons programs gone?I know what the right gun is but I'm not even telling you because you're all too dumb to get it.
>>64327374All those acronym salad modifications are just M4s/M16s. M4s and M16s are pretty good. As upsetting as it might be to /arg/ queers, Gucci part autism and clone contests are like debating which car trim has the best hood release lever location.
>>64327418>All those acronym salad modifications are just M4s/M16s
>>643271226MAX will forever be a rebated meme without higher pressures, I just like smaller rimless case heads. And yeah the M855A1's pressure is way lower than that, sorry
>>64326326>but can foldWhy though?
>>643217206.8 SPC but Ackley improved, so you can't accidentally chamber it into a normal 6.8 SPC. And use stainless steel casings like the 7mm Backcountry so that you can run 80,000psi pressures and get more performance out of a M-4 sized carbine instead of a heavy ass battle rifle.pic just because
>>64329366Slides right into my Jansport nigga
>>64321804To me the RM227's specific round isn't important but getting that polymer case adopted can lead to it getting applied to every other caliber. The case tech is just too good not to use
>>64322807I have never met someone that is happy about a front heavy rifle.
>>64323005SIG's cartridge is incompatible with existing small arms due to the pressures involved. However TV's ammo was with fairly easy barrel swaps or just manufacturing the cartridge with the new cases.
>>64325484The big thing for the 240 barrel swap was you could upgrade EVERY 240. Because the grunts aren't the only ones with with them, tanks, brads, helos, small boats all have 240s and a chunk of those have the optics to take advantage of the increased range or would benefit from the decreased weight of the ammo
>>64329720>SIG's cartridge is incompatible with existing small arms due to the pressures involvedNo it isn't. That's a bunch of bullshit sold by SIG marketers. Yes some guns can't handle it but you're an idiot if you don't think a titanium boxed receiver M240 with an action based around the BAR can't handle 6.8. They download it to 77k now due to accuracy problems anyway.
>>64329627>run 80,000psiretarded nigger shittotal bubba dead
>>64321720>Replace the Sig m7Define replace first, last I checked the M4/M16 is still in service because it JUST WORKS. If by replace you mean replace this garbage glorified battle rifle with an actually good battle rifle well we already have great and proven AR10's from Larue and LMT to fill those niche roles, plus H Scars are still kicking around too even if they're antiquated in some regards to newer designs and have a reputation for harmonics that kills cheap optics.Fuck it, let's just give everyone an Ohio Ordnance Works REAPR because it be funny.
>>64322090>bull pups suck assNormally I'd agree BUT battle rifles are already pretty heavy. Putting a good chunk of that weight in the rear has it's advantages.
>>64329805>Putting a good chunk of that weight in the rear has it's advantages.How about NOT adopting a battle rifle?
>>64321720>Badlands ammo>A universal NATO 308 AR to flush all redundant xyz-DMR/SCARs/M-14s out of the system (export incentives to sell surplus to US market)>A reliable and dirt cheap bullpup chassis for both for additional performance as required>Tariff incentives to favored Eurofags (Italy, Finns, Swedes, Greeks, Poles) to adopt, and longer range ones to coax others.
>>64321720Caliber change of existing platforms to a STANAG compatible 7mm round in a cartridge of the same dimensions of 5.56NATO. Then hold trials for a new platform to use that round with increased efficiency and polymer or hybrid polymer casing.
>>64329638Fair, but you'd have to own a SIG USA product.
>>643298717mm sucks because it has no ballistic co-efficiency. We're moving away from such rounds in favor of 6-7mm rounds. 6.5mm seems to be the ultimate caliber for a bullet.
>>64329871>7mm>same size as 5.56You mean 300 blackout? The bullet mass will be too high, velocity too low, sectional energy too low, cartridge mass too high, form factor too high, and recoil will be higher than 5.56.Think of caliber as a scaling factor, sort of, not an independent variable.
Literally any 5.56 gun that’s easy to carry and has decent magnification, the meta from this point forward is accurate suppressive fire sustained until you can maneuver a drone into the target.
>>64327275There is literally nothing wrong with the mk16 handguard. Keep coping, DD shills
>>64329714You think this thing isn't front heavy as fuck?
>>64329800> Fuck it, let's just give everyone an Ohio Ordnance Works REAPR because it be funny.When I become God Emperor of this great nation, I’m putting you in charge of arms procurement.
>>64321720>If you were stuck on an elevator with a Pentagon official and could pitch a replacement to the m7, what would you say?6mmMAX, NAS3 case.>I'd personally recommend a 22 arcMay as well recommend an AK because despite the lies people tell online, hogging out the AR bolt face does lead to sheared lugs, increasing the feed angle does lead to jams, and increasing the case wall beyond a certain point does lead to inefficient mag stacking.>>64321790>>64321802This is literally just 6.5 grendel with a NAS3 case. Inferior for the same reasons as 22/6ARC except it's worse.>>643298717mm sucks from a 5.56 case, and polymer ages. Nickel stainless is clearly where the industry is going. SST uses it, Sig uses it, Federal uses it, it's already in use with non-firearm industries in identical formulation; it's what's going to happen sooner or later.Also there's a laundry list of small optimizations (currently spread across 5+ companies) which need to be made to the AR bolt and carrier to justify the cost of replacing rifles.
>>64323234Does China let everyone have full-auto grenade launchers? No? Didn’t think so.
>>64331752Can you type a single sentence without shilling for a case that nobody uses or will ever use? 8% improvement over brass is nothing when polycase is 40% better and CT is 60% better.
>>64332109Nobody is using those meme polymer cases either and CT is 100% dead and buried.
Be US Military>adopt retarded gun>destroies all m4/m16>gets into a hot war>realize how retarded it is>Orders several million PSA budget AR-15s
>>64332109>8% improvement over brassAt identical pressures, SST have loaded their cases to 90kPSI. Obviously they're not releasing that load data but I don't think they'd be lying.>shilling for a case that nobody uses or will ever use7mmBC already uses the same steel, 6.8fury would have used for the body but for patent infringement problems. Nickel stainless IS the next-gen case technology, it won, get over it. People are already using it.
>>64331200Black ops 2 reference
>>64332109>nobody uses or will ever useI'm using it right now and so is SOCOM across multiple platforms and calibers. I was even willing to trade the ability to reload cases for the performance increase.
>>64332877>Obviously they're not releasing that load dataWhy not?
>>64332824The fact that you think the existing inventory of M4 would be destroyed says a lot.
>>64333155Because while a lawsuit about an exploding gun might be determined to be frivolous at some point, it's best not to give anyone anything to file with a court.The pool of people with the equipment capable of measuring peak chamber pressure is much smaller than the pool capable of reading a load recipe, or reading a chronograph working their way up to a number which SST published.
>>64332877SST's own website (that I checked out because of your profuse shilling) says they're 8% better than brass. That's not enough of a difference to make a difference, thus not worth any cost. Polycase rounds are available and actually already in use by the military for 50cal, since the weight savings are significant. Polycase is the real future
>>64334935>actually already in use by the military for 50calNitrocellulose, nigger, nitrocellulose. It's used in the 120 mm shells too, but do you understand why this is a bad idea for a rifle caliber?Polymeme is dead and forgotten, you stupid nigger, same with CT(only the frogs are still trying to shill it into existence)
>>64334935also, only the GAU-21 uses polymeme 50cal do you want me to tell you why?womp womp nigger
>>64332877>90kpsiAhhhhhh I’m gonna coom!! This is a game changer. Shell shock came out of nowhere just as nobody was expecting any change or improvement in ammunition technology and they ushered in what may amount to a paradigm shift.
>>64335527>the frogs are still trying to will it into existenceReally?
>>64335796It sure is a game changing paradigm shift, my marketing friend. >8%Lol who are you kidding? It's snake oil.
>>64335527>same with CTit's the future and it's undeniable. Or are we going to still fire brass cases in Mars?
>>64336226https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/40CT_cannon
>>64336228Are you pretending that you don’t see that I’m referring to 90kpsi chamber pressure?
>>64335527IIRC nitrocellulose was the first smokeless powder used in rifles. Wouldn't it be way too slow by modern standards?>>64334935>>64336228They say their cases have 8% more volume, not that they're 8% "better"
>>64336285>8% greater case capacity (NTA). So on top of using a less dense material, and using less of it with thinner walls, and being able to withstand higher pressures, the case capacity is also 8% higher? I take back what I said. This is not a probable paradigm shift, it is 100% a paradigm shift. I thought case capacities were about 0-5% higher, depending on the case. But 8% is a serious improvement.
>>64336376How much are you being paid to say this?
>>64336429You guys really think I’m a shill? No, I’m just genuinely excited about firearms and ammunition developement, because I actually like guns.
>>64321720I think everyone should switch to 16 inch ARs
>>64336692This is actually a pretty good idea, 16 for regular infantry and 10.5 and under for sped ops and vehicle niggas. Worked well for the ziggers back in the day
>>64321981I like the idea of an M4A2 and M16A5 in principle, but with heavier grain 5.56 I do question whether it is necessary to have both. The real irony would be that splitting the difference and standardizing on a one rifle set up, something between a 14.5" M4 and. 20" M16, like say a civilian length 16", could make a lot of sense ballistic wise. I'd personally rather they went with something closer to rifle length, like an 18", but the "muh CQB" crowd would never go for it.
>>64336769Sounds like you just want everyone to have the AUG. The 16 inch version is still more compact than a MK18.
>>64336662You mentioned the full name of the case and its company like 50 times independently, with copious marketing speak, even though nobody has heard of them before this thread existed. Yes, I think you're a shill. Quite obviously, in fact.Polycase is better. Notice how I can just say polycase without pointing out a specific manufacturer. There's more than one, you see. Bi-metal cases like what sig uses are a step back.
>>64340051I used their name ONCE, here: >>64336228You are confusing me for one or two other anons
