In a recent spoiler post on twitter, Kevin Brittingham of Q, LLC teased the first look at the new 12mm Blackout™ cartridge. Using the standard dimensions of the .458 SOCOM round but with a 10% increase in maximum pressure, .030" longer freebore and a 1:6 twist (compared the 1:14 of the parent .458 SOCOM), the round was designed for extreme performance with heavy subsonic bullets while still operating in the standard AR-15 receiver, which was the previous main criticism of the 8.6 Blackout.Standard loadings will be a massive 800gr bullet traveling at approximately 850fps (imagine shooting three and a half .45 ACP rounds at once!) with supersonic loadings of 400gr operating at approximately 1800fps.The cartridge will initially be offered in the Hog Hammer™ SBR bolt-action rifle (MSRP of $3000 not including tax stamp), alongside a currently TBA fully welded titanium 458 suppressor.Any anons excited? I just ordered a new lower, this would be hella cool with a gas block that you can shut off and make ultra quiet.
Another orphaned meme cartrdige that will be forgotten in 3 years.
>>64324575Is it backwards compatible with 458 SOCOM or another case of an existing cartridge being reinvented just as a blades-n-razors way of making people pay .50 BMG prices?
>>64324598No, it's not, at least with subsonic rounds the ogive will be different and they will be too long for the 458 Socom's less forgiving freebore. Same for magazines.That being said, it does share the same bolt face.
Why does this merit a new name instead of just calling it .458 SOCOM +P?
>>64324618Because it's not simply an increase in pressure?
Oh boy another useless meme round from the cringiest "how do you do, fellow kids" boomer faggot on earth.
>>64324575I don't want more rifle rounds, I want a handgun and handgun cartridge optimized for putting a 300+ gr slug at 950 FPS
At this point Kevin is just coming up with products to justify his never ending big game hunts in Africa. It’s a self licking ice cream cone for him. New caliber, new rifle, new cans; assuming this all even comes to market it’s all but guaranteed he’s gonna go and use them all on promo hunts like he’s been doing with 8.6.
>>64324646>300+ gr slug at 950 FPSThe desert eagle is the smallest you're going to get
>>64324656Desert Eagle with an adjustable gas block so you can close the port so the chamber remains locked for no chamber pop.
I'm astonished at the fact that Q apparently moves enough product to sustain these ventures.
>>64324575>10% increase in maximum>1:6 twist Significant . . . or just take existing rounds that can tolerate the high twist rate and call it a day.>while still operating in the standard AR-15 receiver, which was the previous main criticism of the 8.6 Blackout.338 Spectre only needed the 1:3, if you didn't care about super performance beyond the 300 Blackout use case distances. And reloading isn't fucky 6.5 mememore brass.
>>64324575redditor gunsmith desperately clinging to 300 buckout success which is only popular because its a drop in replacement for 5.56 guns
>>64324735I like it because it uses a common diameter bullet and is better suppressed but yeah you're right
>>64324575This is retarded and useless
>>64324765whatever dude im not saying its bad but those large bore subsonic cartidges are so niche and this narcissistic moron is making a 3rd one already all while hornday is pushing their 338 arcwhat i mean is that 300 blackout succes is largly due to it being so compatible with 5.56 ar15 specs, literalt just the barrel is diffrent but all the other ones are pretty much proprietary spec.as for 45 cal i kinda wonder why no delayed blowback 460 rowland, it essentaiyl super plus p 45 auto, rowland can fire 45 acp as well as 45 super so you could have a small frame pcc in a power 45 cartiridge
>>64324651I watched one of those hunting videos and it was one of the most embarrassing displays I've ever seen. That retarded faggot magdumped one of his 8.6 shitrods into a Cape buffalo, hitting it all over the place, then the camera cuts to him standing with it acting like some big bad hunter when it's patently obvious the PH had to finish it off with a real gun off camera. Utterly cringeworthy and frankly disgusting.
>>64324581This is the future, unc.
>>64324575>heavy subsonic bullets while still operating in the standard AR-15 receiverTHAT'S WHAT 338 ARC IS FOR!!!!!!
>>64324575okay if we want to go super large bore why not 50 cal? 50 Beowulf or 510 whisper based cartridgethe way i see it you could go with the largest legal bore of 50 caliber, maybe even .51 to get even more mass as is the case with 500 limnebaugh and then design the case so it fits in ar15 magwell
>>64324836mfw i have to have a subscription service for barrel and mags every other year because new bs cartidge comes outim looking at you 30 super carry and 224 valkyrie
>>64324824Apparently there was some behind the scenes drama between the Q fag and Hornady and .338 ARC is meant as a big, direct fuck you from them. No clue how true any of that is, just rumors and hearsay.
>>64324575Why just not design 12mm from the start?Why do first pussy weak rounds that replacement with 12mm?
>>64324836Yeah, the futurue. Where 9mm, 5.56, and .308, and 12 gauge still make up 90% of the ammo market. This is a niche round for consoomers and wierdos. Just like every other "game changing" caliber invented in the past 20 yeaea.
>>64324847>subscription service for barrel and mags every other yearCooked bro fr fr fr.Zoomers are pathetic lmao.
>>64324575>Any anons excited?No, because the premise is retarded. The .458 is already too big for the AR-15 platform. Specifically the problem lies in the diameter of the rim. Quite a lot of material needs to be cut out of the bolt head to fit the .458 round, and this weakens it. AR-15 .45 SOCOMs are already infamous for breaking bolt heads. Adding 10% more pressure is only going to make the problem worse.That said, I hope it forces more R&D for stronger actions. CMMG has a version of their "Mutant" that shoots .458 using an AR-10 size bolt head. That can handle 50k psi rounds. Hopefully other makers will offer some competition.CMMG AR-10 sized .458 bolt on the left, normal AR-15 size .458 bolt on the right. Notice how thin the rim around the bolt face is on the AR-15 bolt. That shit needs to be fixed, especially if 10% pressure is involved.
>>64324625It is, along with some changes to the barrel specs that aren't part of the cartridge. It's not like they renamed .223 when they went from 1:12 to 1:7.7 or whatever it is people use now.
>>64324927>last 20 yearsmore like 120 years. As long as cartridges have been a thing companies have been trying to invent the latest and greatest new shit to take over the market.
>>64324840There's really no way to get .50 spitzer bullets into an AR>>64324838300gr .338 bullets really have no comparison to 800gr .458 bullets though.
>>64324840There's .500 Auto Max. I don't know how it handles the biggest bullets.
>>64324901yeah im sure there was it directly competes with 300 and 8.6 prettty much a hybrid of both, hornady is known for being scummy they had some lawsuits with buffalo bore too>>64324945>There's really no way to get .50 spitzer bullets into an ARtheres always a way like making a really short case with fast burning powder
i got an ideaif we are chasing super heavy subsonic bullets now why not make a new slug for 12 gauge optimized for being used with a suppresor and rifled barrels, thats a 72 cal rifle which would not have problems with atf because rifled barrels for shotguns are common use but getting a new cartidge over .50 could be a problem with destructive device bullshit etc.
>>64324997A .75 cal high-BC bullet would probably weigh enough that it would have absurd recoil even if it were limited to being subsonic.
>>64325035dont be a pussy
>>64325035I just checked on a recoil calculator program, I used the weight of a 20mm shell (120 grams) as a rough estimate. Assuming a gun weight of 10 lb and a velocity of 1000 ft/s the recoil came out to 130 ft-lb. For context that's double the recoil of a .600 Nitro Express elephant gun. No fucking way.If that bullet weighs 750 grains instead, like a .50 BMG projectile, the recoil is 31 ft-lb, a little higher than the average 12ga shell. .510 Whisper makes sense, much bigger is just monster recoil.
>>64324997the 12 gauge wtf is a thing. Pushing rifle pressures to make a sort of redneck elephant gun. They get a pass from the atf since they can still shoot a normal shell they're legally still considered a regular shotgun
>new expensive Gucci meme bullet>from Qlol. lmao, even.
>>64324997>>64325035>>64325057>>64325178anons something like this already existsits called Seismic 2.5 oz slug it is subsonic not a full bore tho it has a sabot
>>64324575>take existing chambering>give the chamber an extra thirty thous of freebore and slap on a retardedly fast barrel>IT'S A NEW CALIBERNot very innovative, although it'll probably perform a bit better than what came before it, unlike that 8.6 meme bullshit that gets dunked on cartridges from 60 years ago.
>>64324575>Kevin Brittingham of Q
>>64324581Still neat.
>>64324666Hell yeah, Satan
>>64324575What a fucking kike, too bad nobody will buy this shit like with 8.6 and all of his other meme rounds(except 300 that's ok I guess)
>>64324575>le hawg gun>he doesn't know you can use any gun you want to kill a hog
>>64325057ARfags and shotgun rednecks will do ANYTHING but buy a nitro rifle kek
>>64324575At this point just buy a .45-70 with a threaded barrel and load up some of these fat fucks to subsonic levels. https://www.mattsbullets.com/500-Grain-Round-Flat-Gas-Check-458_p_128.html It would be cheaper, easier, and more reliable.
>>64325556>but dood muh tactics muh AR bro!
>>64324575Muh Hawg Gun is the second most retarded gunsoomer grift right behind muh Bear Gun.
>>64325556You've missed the point of 458, anon. It works in an AR. If you want subsonic 45-70 performance (or moderate super performance) in an AR, this is how you do it.>cheaperI'm pretty sure that you can get a new upper for less than a decent lever gun.>easierEasier than swapping an upper?>more reliableSet the gas system up properly and they're about equal, assuming that we're not including vintage Marlins in the comparison.
>>64324575> 10% increase in maximum pressure, .030" longer freebore and a 1:6 twist (compared the 1:14 of the parent .458 SOCOM), the round was designed for extreme performanceWhat qualitative advantages does this mean it has over .458 socom, or is it just another monthly memeware cartridge like .30 SC?
>>64325613The faster twist gives it more rotational velocidensity.
But everyone just settled on 300 blk.At the gun store today all if the employees were saying they just picked up 300 blk ARs this year too.Was gonna peice together an 8.6 bolt action at some point too.Now I'm concerned this dude is going to strangle his own cartridges in the cradle...
>copy 300 whisper, pass it off as your own innovation>copy 338 whisper, pass it off as your own innovation>now copying 458 whisper and passing it off as his own innovationDoes Kevin have something personal against JD Jones?Anyway, 8.6 blackout is the only one of those cartridge worth a fuck because they accidentally designed into it the proper overbore ratio and ogive length for something like a new CETME cartridge. Someone needs to make ultralight VLDs for it and a 1 in ~5 twist barrel.Pic sorta real. 510 whisper. That’s probably next on Kevin’s roadmap.
>>64325659wtf is up with that microscopic shoulder? Why not just leave it as a straight wall cartridge?
>>64325687It’s already 510 in caliber. They can’t increase bore size any more. And I’m betting the reason for the slightly oversized case (338 lapua) is that it was the smallest available parent case that could fit a .510 bullet.
>>64325659There's nothing special about JDJ's stuff either though, and the whole issue is that he decided to keep it proprietary. His call of course, but "make open version of some proprietary thing" is a long and cherished tradition. 300bo now being super cheap off the shelf with tons of support is a good thing.>>64325642300bo isn't going anywhere. There's nothing wrong with someone wanting to go more niche, though I personally think trying to cram everything into AR15 gets retarded at enough size. But I don't see any of them having the mass appeal 300bo got. Most people just don't want some way heavier and more expensive.
>>64325694It's not necked down. It's got a sliver of material turned off the neck to make that tiny shoulder. Does nothing to the bore size.
>>64324575People who bought a Dead Air Primal or equivalent "do it all" .458 can as their first suppressor are probably creaming their jeans over this.
>>64325757It does look that way. Why turn it down though? Why not use the normal (albeit 1mm thick) wall for the neck?
>>64325687Headspacing a rimless rifle cartridge off the case mouth is technically possible and has been done before, but there are some potential headaches involved. Probably best not to bother with it. Also, you'd be surprised just how small of a shoulder (or a rim, for semi-rimmed cartridges) you need to headspace effectively.>see 510 whisper as an example for just how little shoulder is needed
>>64325694>They can’t increase bore size any more.Just get a sporting purpose exemption, bro; 24mm Blackout when?
Why am I cursed to be a part of a species that is utterly fucking retarded.
>>64324575y not use a big shotgun slug with a big can
>>64325907Because rimmed cartridges suck monkey nuts in self-loading actions and only persist through market inertia.If rimless 12ga had ever caught on, there'd be no market for dummy thicc subs bigger than 300 BLK.
>>64325903your mom and dad
>>643256428.6 and 12 BO aren't competing with each other since they're made for different action lengths, and 300 BLK is an AAC thing, not a Q thing
>>64325973Kevin worked at AAC when they standardized 300 Blackout from 300 Whisper and claims he was partially responsible for its creation
You want bigger, wider, slower, you want something with a PUNCH?I just invented 6-Caliber Knockout.Eat my ass Kevin.
>>64325973Kevin founded AAC in 1994, they kicked him out as president of the company in 2011 after he sold the company to Freedom Group/Cerberus (the same group that ruined Remington and Marlin).
>>64324943speaking of future dead cartridges...PS: This shit literally only has Winchester manufactured ammo available last I checked on Ammoseek. Its main selling point is that it's 22LR...but the bullet is slightly slimmer and it isn't heeled and it can be jacketed or copper solid and sheeeeit and you can convert your guns ez (if anyone is ever retarded enough to make barrels for your gun). Like the 22 WMR doesn't exist, a MUCH better Winchester rimfire cartridge that does the same thing with better ammo and power selection for the same price or less per round.
>>64324575Possible dumb question. How does this compare to .50 Beowulf?
> In a recent spoiler post on twitterCurious where you saw this. Post a link. I went to both Kevin’s Twitter and Q’s Twitter and found no posts having to do with 12mm blackout.
>>64326145Best use of the rifles is rechambering to .22LR so you get the benefits of a squeeze bore.
>>64324575Fuck me I can't tell if you're joking
>>64325907Shotgun slugs have miserable ballistic coefficients and therefore very short range.
>>64326157>Post a link>a wh9le thread about an unsubstantiated claimWaste mybtime.
>>64325553>nitro riflesounds weak and smol
>12mm>quiet
>>64324575Q is the biggest faggot in the entire industry and fuck anyone who supports him and his overpriced dog shit guns.
>>64325884It would be way easier to headspace off the case mouth vs a shoulder of roughly half the thickness. You also save yourself the trouble of turning down the “neck” to a smaller diameter.
>>64325035True. The recoil of a 510 whisper is already extremely high. It’s a ~2000ft*lb cartridge with way more momentum than typical 2000ft*lb cartridges. Subsonics need to be kept low energy or else the recoil becomes unmanageable real quick.
>>64324575Why would I get this over a 9/45 PCC or a 300 blackout
>>64326930it's bigger than all of those so it must be better. plus all the cool kids are talking about it on social media
>>64326934>all the cool kids are talking about it on social mediabut they aren't doe
>>6432615650 Beowulf is a proprietary brand/name, and it's not really suitable for subsonic use
>>64325600>cheap>reliable>big bore AR upperPick two.>just fuck around with tuning the gas system and getting the buffer just right to run subsonic (and only subsonic) ammo correctly with a canJust get something off the shelf that works with whatever you throw at it.>but muh AR platformIf you're throwing around >1oz bullets you shouldn't be using an AR-15 to do it. Especially because some retarded chucklefuck is going to try and do it out of a 10" barrel and then whine about how the ballistics suck. Just buy a guide gun with a top rail and a threaded barrel for 1400 bucks, slap a can on it, and enjoy shooting big thumpy boys. It's a range toy, might as well make it a cool one.
>>64326973>t.dead in the streets because his fuddslop broke
>>64326973>>just fuck around with tuning the gas systemThat's the fun part.
>>64327082You and I have a different definition of fun then.
>>64324675Maybe they're government funded? It would be awesome to find out these weapons are already being used by jsoc/CIA to do black folder, spook shit with
>>64326899Have you tried it, or are you theorycrafting? Remember, we're not talking about a pistol round here. There's a reason (several actually) those most people aren't interested in this.>>64326973>try and do it out of a 10" barrelThat's probably a bit short, but it works fine at 12".>buy a guide gun with a top rail and a threaded barrel for 1400 bucksGoddamn, that gets you a decent upper and a complete lower. My math was based on already having a lower.>enjoy shooting big thumpy boysWhy not both? Admittedly I find a 458 SBR more fun, but there's nothing wrong with a suppressed guide gun. That's actually what first got me interested in this whole niche.
>>64327184Theorycrafting, but what exactly could go wrong with headspacing a half inch forward, off the case mouth, with about twice the contact area? I’m asking genuinely.
>>64324575Sheeeiiitt Nigga, don't need dis twellllvve sheet...I gots a Fiftty Wolf.https://www.youtube.com/shorts/4scOMByBFz0
>>64327103CIA uses guns from war zones. They would never use a Made in the USA™ gun to knock off some world leader. They are going to use guns that fell off the truck in Ukraine.
So maybe I'm too Fudd here but what's the use case for this?
>>64327103>Maybe they're government funded?lmao no.
>>64328487It's probably the ideal for shooting deer, elk, hogs in a forested terrain with your suppressed subsonic short barrel rifle
>>64324935agreeing with this anon. using the AR-15 as a base sounds incredibly retarded compared to the AR-10
>>64327187Making the case mouth twice as thick keeps it from obturating properly.
>>64328487hunting big game without making your dogs deaf
>>64328680But why an AR platform there are so many other choices for hunting
>>64328689because the AR is the most standard, assuming you live somewhere in NATO-land
>>64328689>t.dead in the streets because he used a fucking bolt action LMAO
>>64328709I know its standard...I guess I'm doing my hunting in more open areas, so 308-30-06 and 338 have been what I've been shooting. Bolt is fine for hunting game.
>>64328718I'm including the AR-10 in this discussion if it wasn't clear. I have a Savage MSR 10 for hunting moose
>>64328727I have an ar10 and a ar15 too, I just don't hunt anything other than varmints with them.
>>64328760those have to be pretty big varmints to call for an AR-10
>>64328781'yotes, but ya the ar10 was just for funzies.
>>64328783oh yeah that'll do itanyway .308 with a soft tip is more than enough to take down møøse. it'd actually be really interesting to have something based on the AR-10 that can be subsonic and still count as class 1 (big game) here in Sweden
>>64324575Now we are talking memeout on suicide watch
>>64324575I like all these new carbine rounds coming out, they're cool. However isn't this just exactly the same as .50 Beowulf but with subsonic offerings? Exact same speeds and bullet weight
>>64324575>useless expensive horseshit>from useless expensive horseshit companyI can't wait for the completely unethical promotional video where they shoot animals with bullet flight times of 2+ seconds and pretend as if they didn't edit out a bunch of wounded/lost game.The fix sucks dicks by the way. Sucks fucking dick and feeds like a $350 rifle.
>>64329000TrvthNvke
>>64329000Found the brokie bitch fudd, day of the pillow soon
>>64329000Digits of truth
>>64329375Hes right I handled one in a gunstore a couple days ago.Feels kinda cheap and loose for what it is priced at.Looks cool though
>>64329634So it was like OP's mom
>>64329634Sounds like you're malding because you're too poor to buy one desu
>>64328487The Whisper family of cartridges and the Blackout family of cartridges that keeps copying Whisper are obsessed with making subsonic ammo that's effective.
>>64328487>subs out of shorter lighter rifles in rough country with gains in terminal ballistics>wilder terminal ballistics gains in supers>vehicle disabling in not-AR 10/magnums and catastrophic terminal ballistic gains in fracturing rounds for personal defense purposesSoft shooting big bore with lots of ass that you could sportingly shoot large game with in something cheaper and more convenient. Pensioner boomer big game hunting mostly.
>>64324575>It happened AGAINRetard consoomers never learn, do they?
>>64329885>>64329903So it's a shitty version of 9mm and 308 that costs 10x more and performs worse? Wow that sounds fucking gay
>>64329909HERRO ... YOU FORGOT 45 KIRRS YOUR SOUR !!! :raughing:-Chang, 65
>>64329000What feeding problems have you had with yours?
>>64330244I'm telling you it feels loose and cheap for $2.5kLike budget AR looseIt weighs nothing though and Q makes attractive rifles.
>>64327292Great, now I'm jealous that they get to have an indoor range like that and I can't. Also Jesus Christ that's wild.
>>64326145Bought a box when I saw it locally if only to sit on my shelf
>>64330313I found a single intact round of it at the range a couple weeks back and nearly shit a brick when I saw it. Then my next thought was "did someone even realize this was a different caliber or do they not even have a .21 rifle and just shot it out of a normal 22LR rifle not knowing what it was?" because you can do just that with godawful accuracy. That's my only .21 I have and it's...somewhere around here.
>>64324575what is it with these fucking faggots and released a new hype cartrdige that is literally a clone of something that already exists its like the lazy game devs who keep dropping "remastered" versions of the same game made 10 years ago and the only change they made is scaling the resolution up to look slightly better on modern monitors
>>64330486But .50 Beowulf only has supers and it isn't pointy :(
>>64324598>existing cartridge being reinvented just as a blades-n-razors way of making people pay .50 BMG prices?Anon when has anything Q done that wasn’t a giant money grab over negligible at best performance increases
>>64324826Link? I’d like to see that.
>>64324840Because then in 2-3 years they can’t come out with 12.7 blackout and charge another 3 grand for a meme round no one will use
>>64330545https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYX-JkDIArg
After thinking about it all day I unironically like large bore ARs and I hope its successful.Its quite shocking none of the large bore wonder rounds for the AR-15 from 15-20 years ago really blew up for consumers.
>>64325600And you’ve missed the point of subsonics you nigger. If you’re using subsonics for any application it’s because you value low noise over performance. A manual action like on a lever gun will always be quieter than a semi auto. There’s no fucking situation you have where you need the increase in rate of fire from a semi auto AND need the noise reduction of subsonics.
>>64325915>Because rimmed cartridges suck monkey nuts in self-loading actionsThat’s completely horseshit. There are hundreds of thousands of semi auto shotguns with thousands and thousands of rounds through them without issue. >t actually bird huntsYou’d be shocked how much ammo waterfowl guys can go through in a year. I am not one of them but know them.
>>64326145I completely forgot about this retarded round until now
>>64328487Taking money from gunsooomers. There’s no reason to buy this.
>>64324575After doing an upper swap to an 8.5in 300bo, I'm excited for another easy plug and play option. What do you think the use case would be for this other than having a big fuck off bullet to plug into Cletus or Jamal?
>>64328709A bolt action is still more standard. Also taking say a .308 with a can and buying or loading your own subsonics works just as well as a .300 blackout for far cheaper, and is quieter. That said I have a AR in .300 blk because it’s cool and supers have their place. But for hunting it’s not the best choice.
>>64329000Checked. Trips of truth
>>64329375>>64329861Post yours richfag. Bet you won’t.
>>64324826It’s a little ridiculous trying to take Cape buffalo with an ~800ft*lb bullet, right? I get that it expands pretty wide like it’s a broadhead, but does this make that big a difference inside a Cape buffalo?
>>64330602Thanks anon. That was pathetic. Also what retard edited that video? It’s barely over a minute and there’s 10 seconds of man ass and feet for no reason at all.
>>64330655Yeah I thought .375 H&H was the minimum for dangerous game by law in those safari countries. But I could be wrong.
>>64330624I just love how pointless it is when fucking 22 WMR exists. I swear I had a screencap from a while ago but I just can't find it. It was more like 25cpr. 13cpr for 21 Sharp is still cheaper than 22WMR (ATM it's 19.3cpr)...but 22WMR will definitely be around in 5, 10, 15, 20 years and has options other than Winchester for ammo. That last one is worth the extra 4cpr alone; Winchester 22LR fucking SUCKS. Not to mention 22 WMR can be loaded to 22LR levels or even way above 22LR levels. Oddly 21 Sharp seems to be at an all-time low right now and 22WMR is about 2cpr higher than I remember it being at least. I think I could get CCI for about 18.5-19CPR not too long ago; must be small game/furbearer driving the prices a bit.
>>64330615Go out and shoot some suppressed subs you nocanz faggot. Ejection port pop doesn't exist downrange, and barely exists uprange unless you're using a shit can.
>>64330644yeah but a subsonic .308 won't take down big game reliably. probably fine for roe deer though. there's a guy on youtube who's doing subsonic loads for 9,3x57 specifically to take down roe deer. super quiet with a can. but it won't reach the 2 kJ legally required for moose
>>64324575Why not go all the way up to 12.7mm? A lot of laws hate anything larger than .50cal, so I understand why you wouldn't go larger.I dunno man. I don't understand anything anymore.
What's the point of an 800gr (51grams) subsonic boolit?
>>64331398>octave:1> E=0.5*51e-3*330^2>E = 2776.9
>>64330667> there’s 10 seconds of man ass and feet for no reason at all.The reason is Q being Q. They’re 12 year old edgelords. Their 5.56 barrel is not 9.7” because that’s not edgy enough, so they made it 9.69”, because “69” is funny. Cause sex, get it? They’re a bunch of weirdos but not the true eccentric genius or rebellious type. It appears labored, like they’re going out of their way to be a bit off the wall to differentiate themselves from others. It is pathetic for grown men to behave like this.
>>64324575Why would I ever use this over a 308 bolt action>inb4 muh heckin pupperinos hearingerinodogs are for bird hunting, you wouldn't be using a rifle
>>64330772Am I wrong? Is a lever action not quieter? Please tell me you’re saying it isn’t. You sound really upset, Q shill. Post your $4000 setup that isn’t actually good.
>>64331622broke bitch award
>>64331359Depends what you’re hunting and the bullet you use. My point was subs are a choice to give up power and lethality over noise, so why do you pick the noisier option.If an expanding ~200gr .308 bullet isn’t enough then you can do the same with a .338 win mag or whatever. My point is all the Q stuff is overpriced and no better than existing options.
>>64331433>Their 5.56 barrel is not 9.7” because that’s not edgy enough, so they made it 9.69”God they’re even cringier than I knew. Sex joke aside, make it 10.3” or 10.5” like everyone else.
>>64331638>My point is all the Q stuff is overpriced and no better than existing optionstotally agree based on what I've read so far
>>64331631>t nocansStill waiting for yours big guy.And for you to say a manual action is LOUDER like you implied.
>>64330615>If you’re using subsonics for any application it’s because you value low noise over performance.Correct.>A manual action like on a lever gun will always be quieter Sure. But the semi might very well be quiet enough. Don't fall into the min-max trap. There's no gold medal for having the gun as quiet as physically possible. You don't necessarily have to get the gun as quiet as possible, you have to get it quiet enough.>increase in rate of fire from a semi auto AND need the noise reduction of subsonics.It's extremely useful for culling hogs. I would assume it's also useful for combat, but as I haven't experienced that I'm not going to talk out my ass. But you bet that's going to appeal to the tacticool larpers.>stop defending QI'm not, this cartridge is retarded, and Q the company sucks. I'm just questioning your min-max approach to this.
>>64331645>why won’t Q do things like everyone else?They’re physically incapable of that because then they won’t stand out.
>>64331622>Is a lever action not quieter?Anon, I can't belive this actually needs to be explained to you, but you sound autistic so here goes:Yes, everbody knows that a manual action is quieter than a semi. The thing is that we don't care. We're not in a contest to make the gun as quiet as it possibly can be. It doesn't matter that a bolt or lever is quieter--we quite simply don't care. We either want a cool semiauto for larping purposes (see picrel if you don't understand), or we want to take the edge off the noise a little so we're less rude to our neighbors and game is less likely to spook. The fact that the gun could be slightly quieter if it were in a totally different configuration that we don't want doesn't matter.
>>64331671forgot pic
>>64331660>Sure. But the semi might very well be quiet enough. Don't fall into the min-max trap. There's no gold medal for having the gun as quiet as physically possible. Agreed. I did cross into the min-max bullshit because I wanted to call the Q shill a retarded faggot. Subs in my .300 blackout are still very quiet and quiet enough for me, but subs in a bolt action .308 are even quieter. >It's extremely useful for culling hogs.Fair but then noise isn’t as much of a concern. >I would assume it's also useful for combat, Agreed and I left combat out since it’s a different topic entirely. I don’t have a problem suppressing ARs or other semi autos. I do and it’s nice. You aren’t the retard I have been arguing with, and I agree with you. I admit I exaggerated to argue with him.
>>64330772Still waiting on you to post your fancy top of the line Q suppressor you faggot
>>64331651I don't listen to poorfags, kys subhuman
>>64331702>t nocans noguns Q shillAbout what I expect from you “people”
>>64324575>its another meme round that's worse than 3030it's been 120 fucking years will somebody PLEASE make something that's actually different for once
>>64331787>implying you have the right to even speak around metotal. poorfag. death. you won't post cans because you don't even own anything, you probably live in a hole in the mud kek
>>64331833>he says in response to a gun with a suppressor posted this morningProjection, the post. Also the only “poor” thing on that gun is the red dot. If you think $300 between a holosun and an Aimpoint makes you rich, then holy shit, you are struggling financially.
>>64331689You'll have to keep waiting. I like good cans. Q cans are shit for the size and weight, and that B&T notwithstanding, I don't own shit cans.Now, do you want to explain to me how ejection port pop is audible downrange of the muzzle?
>>64330693>>64331433I like how they were literally standing in the open after that opening crawling shot, with the Buffalo right there, one of them even fucking looking at them.Makes me think this was private land. All the dead branches around also fit that; trim an orchard or trees and you can get rid of the branches by giving them to the bovine to eat over time.A round so quiet and powerful the animals immediately run when you fire, and 3 rounds at practically point blank range can't put them down (although admittedly that could be the retard shooting the gun's fault). Epic.
>>64331919What cans are good cans, Canon? t. Canlet
>>64330602lol>shoot at buffalo 3 times>it runs about 50 feet away and calmly returns to munching grass and looking at the camera>smash cut to standing over dead buffalolmao
>>64332887I can't be sure but all the shots sounded like supers. Which makes this even more of a joke.
>>64324575The subsonic rifle round meme needs to die because 9mm and 45ACP do the same thing but for half the price
>>64332705>A round so quiet and powerful the animals immediately run when you fire, and 3 rounds at practically point blank range can't put them down (although admittedly that could be the retard shooting the gun's fault). Epic.FWIW at that range? It was absolute the retard's fault. People who actually knew what they were doing have killed grizzly bears with 22lr at close ranges. But you can't just fucking randomly spam shots at it holy shit.I don't think the round is any good EITHER sure, but stuff with far less kinetic energy and diameter will do the job if you actually fucking take 5 minutes to study the vitals of the animal you're hunting because you have some sense of ethics and basic civilization. Which these fags clearly do not.>>64333322>9mm and 45acp do 500 ftlbs subsonic or 1350 ftlbs superdumb frogposter. There's nothing wrong with 300bo, it's a decent enough cartridge as an alternative to 5.56, particularly if suppressed. And while 48cpr is more than 33cpr, it's not some radical difference either.It's between that and 510w where things get all weird.
>>64333555>22 is le meta for le bearsOpinion ignored
>>64333609>I make random strawmen up to attack because actually responding to what people say terrifies meyeah
>>64333555Do you understand how cape buffalo hunting works retard? Multiple shots is SOP. They will fucking KILL YOU.
>>64334129>cape buffalo hunting>they will kill youThis wasn't hunting and these weren't wild animals. It was a managed game reserve. The buffalo there had had plenty of exposure to humans.
>>64333555>FWIW at that range? It was absolute the retard's fault. Definitely. Even offhand at that distance it’s a fucking layup shot. You can easily get a single good killshot if you are moderately competent. I’ll excuse a second shot because it’s good practice for dangerous game but the third (that I think he missed) is just embarrassing.
>>64334226>I’ll excuse a second shot because it’s good practice for dangerous gameYeah that's fair. Even in game reserve setting with acclimated animals a confirmation shot isn't a bad habit when dealing with legitimately dangerous game, though it's no excuse to flub the first (which by definition is the easiest, when the animal isn't spooked/in pain). But that whole sequence stank of "dudes in love with themselves, their fancy tech and numbers who neglect the basics".
>>64324575looks shiny and fat
>>64331919>shills for Q bullshit>doesn’t own itNot surprising, but glad you’re not completely retarded.
>>64330615>>64331660>>64331681In theory I can sorta see how there'd be room for a not-entirely-niche subsonic round above 300bo. 300bo subs are good out to around 100yd, which honestly is mostly fine and obviously you can pop over to supers if more is needed. But while like, 80% or something in that ballpark of hunting around here is <100yd 200-250yd is like, 99%. Something that was a bit more without going all the way up to the expense of 510 mitebcool. I think 375raptor was the most promising candidate and didn't have the dumb meme twist but something else could be fine. But Q lost the plot.And even as I write this out, eh, maybe it is just too niche end of the day. 300bo benefits from basically being a drop-in replacement for 5.56. It has far better burn in a short barrel meaning that it suppresses far better even for supersonic, where it'll give you more energy but without the recoil or cost of going all the way to 308. But you still get to use the stupendous ginormous market of 30cal bullets (if you reload) and accessories. It's a pretty sweet spot for a round in the present market and the price trend has frankly been stunning. Like holy fucking shit it's dropped another 20cpr just this year, I just looked, I thought 64cpr was a good deal this spring and now ammoseek lists 37-42cpr! Wild. Hard to see getting that kind of mass market for anything else in the space.
>>64332759I'm very, very impressed with Cat's cans, and very unimpressed by their marketing. I can go into details about why I think so highly of them if you'd like, but basically they do the flow through thing better than most flow throughs do, and they do the quiet thing better than most of the high backpressure cans do. Logic tells me that this should be impossible, but here we are.For something a bit less boutique and a lot cheaper, Silencerco gets shit on a lot but they've been doing this for a while, their customer service is outstanding, and they've been relatively drama free throughout their existence. Two of those cans in that photo are Silencerco (three technically if you count the SWR Spectre, which dates me a bit as to when I got into all of this) and I've been happy with all of them. That Osprey was pretty much the best thing available for a .45 back in 2011 and it's still viable today, and the only bad thing I've ever heard about a Hybrid is that they're big and heavy, but that's kind of necessary for a big bore rifle can.>>64334625You may be confusing me with another anon. I've never shilled for Q. If you're talking about my enthusiasm for 458, that's shilling for Teppo Jutsu if anything, not Q. I actually made fun of Q earlier in the thread. >>64325475 I'm still curious about your thoughts regarding how far downrange ejection port pop can be heard. You know what it sounds like at the shooter's ear (that's easy) but you don't seem to know what it sounds like to the target. That part may matter, depending on what you're doing.
>>64332705NTA but IIRC Kevin mentioned on some podcast I was watching (he was a guest) that he has a place in SA on a buddy's property that's a couple thousand acres. Like, fucking massive. He has some Q guns and silencers he permanently exported to SA and owns/stores/etc them legally within SA laws. I wouldn't be surprised if that's recorded on that land as he mentioned that's where he "tests a lot of their guns for real world performance" or some shit like that. He must have a hell of a life, can't imagine what it must be like.
>>64335773>You may be confusing me with another anonAppears that I am. My bad. You can form multiple sentences into coherent thoughts so it can’t be the first guy I was talking to.
>>64324575Wow it's 4570 but for gayr15 larpers, who gives a shit?
