You can land your shots at 25 yards right anons? You aren't bad with handguns right?
>he paid to shoot his guns at paper targets in a dungeonThis isn't the flex you think it is
>>64338120I can land consistent alphas with a dot. But with irons my groups are all hits but massive. Never been able to shoot irons. Makes me sad.
>>64338120my flinch is real noticeable at 25 yards
>>64338131what's your fucking problem
>>64338143you made a gay-ass thread about how you can hit a target at 25y with a pistol. now the avatarfags from /hg/ are gonna show up and shill their right-wing insurgent proficiency test.
>>64338120Of course. The real question is, can you keep that accuracy when rapid firing or when shooting one handed? I shall freely admit I'm only able to achieve the latter with only 1 of my guns shooting wadcutters, my rapid groups are still hot ass
>>64338177how about you post a group instead of all them words, cupcake?
>>64338177>right wingFound the tranny, go back to >>>/lgbt/ cocksucker noguns.
i rest my case
>>64338139not quite as noticeable with a dot....
>>64338210I have a sig p365 with a red dot and honestly I'm having a bit of trouble keeping my groups tight, could be my grip?
>>64338216I was all over the place til I was taught to stop locking out my right(shooting) arm, and to create a seal between my hands on the back of the gun such that I can't see the grip. That let me hold it properly tight without squeezing it into a shake.
>>643382169/10 times your accuracy problems are grip related. one big silent killer is your trigger finger rubbing against your support-palm as you pull
>>64338120I did this last weekend, 5 rounds at 7 and then 5 rounds at 25 on the same target
>>64338177This one? Could you not pass it?
>>64338120I can land them all in the field behind the target
>>64338136How many irons have you tried? Some are just shitty to use.
>>64338259i didnt do it because it sounds really boring.
>>64338266It is boring since passing is easy but getting a 300/300 is extremely hard, which there is no physical or mechanical reason your gun and ammo can’t get a 300/300 unless you as the shooter are the weak link
>>64338232>>64338235Squeezing the grip like you're choking someone to death is bad right?
>>64338350you always want to grip as hard as you can but not to the point where your hands are shaking.
>>64338232Any recommendations on videos for this?
>>64338364sadly no. Best to try for a class/lesson at your LGS if you can swing it.
>>64338364Ben Stoeger grip videos Langdon Tactical grip videos Joel Park? Grip videos Grips will heavily depend on your body and hand strength. Some people say “don’t grip it hard at all” and then obviously grip it very solidly than other people since they have more total grip strength There is no cheat code perfect grip. Just hold the damn gun on target
>>64338261Cz75d.
>>64338421Thanks anon. Embarrassed to say there were a few grip videos that really clicked with me, excellent, but I fucking retardedly had them in a private window and my computer crashed and I can't fucking remember what they were. I've never been able to find them again. I'll try all of those. Cheers
>>64338120I'm not a very good shooter and I have poor eyesight, but I can at least manage that much. Thanks for the reminder to hit the range this weekend. >>64338177>Retarded leftoid doesn't train and has sour grapespottery
>>64338443Retarded leftoid doesn’t want you to train so they can kill you and your family you mean*If that’s the poster I’m thinking about >>64338440Paul Harrell’s 3 videos on pistol shoot also serve as a good primer. That list is what helped me. My grip has evolved close to what I think Kim is talking about here, I don’t mind guns with mild or no grip texture https://youtu.be/qYxjwAx2MD4?si=VuNMGov3aZHt25Mn
>>64338363Depends on what you want, Shooting to Live is an old book but their rationale of "a little shaking won't make you miss a human sized target at combat distances and it beats being dead" is hard to argue with For slow fire you want something else obviously
>>64338421>>Recommends ben stoger anythingFuck right off with that larping faggots bullshit. You would get better advice from a guy mixing asbestos brake pad material by hand in a third world country. Ben would tell you anything if someone paid him to.
>>64338624nice try, kike, but ben is the only non-shill on guntube
>>64338136Stop trying to see the target like you would with a dot. Constantly swapping focus between target/front/rear cause you are unsure it's lined up makes the gun shake a little. It's like a bike where you unconsciously move in the direction you are looking.
>>64338120I do well enough
>>64338628Hi Ben. How about you shut the fuck up already. Your trying to pass of sport shooting like it translates to military and self defense is disgusting. Add to that your shilling whoever sponsors you this week gave the gun community. Aids.>>fast draws and shots dont win sections , Ben Stoger
>>64338628Good ol Ben Stoger. Knows more about combat and civilian shootings and training that Combat veteran marines, Combat veteran Army, Lifetime Sheriffs and Police officers which multiple encounters each. Of course ben has ZERO actual fucking experience aside from sport, but he sure is the expert on the subject. Just ask him. Lol.
>>64338647>>64338668Stoeger trains Delta and Rangers and SEALs. Matt Pranka literally works for him. You're just a butthurt leftoid Biden-voting tranny kike that can't handle when dudes drop N bombs. You're almost certainly going to attempt suicide within the year, btw.
>>64338691Stoger has a sport following. Stoger is a joke, but he is pr for recruitment. The military uses ben, bench uses the military for credit.The people who have legitimate experience in combat and civilian shootings are not following the advice of ben. Hes a bit soft.
this stoeger guy sounds like a real faggot wow
>>64338691Following literally any of his advice is pretty fucking stupid unless of course you are a sport shooter. Then shit, its good. In a real shooting? You will be riding to the hospital one last time.
>>64338703You don't even know how to spell his name, you retarded nigger. Stop slandering your betters.
>>64338120Lmao no I fucking suck
>>64338719My betters take and athletes stance and dont stand in the least athletic position possible when shooting. What works in pretend sports doesn't work when bullets are coming back at you. Feel free to post Ben's actual experience with lead coming back. Or even simunition. Or paintball? Anything at all that would suggest ben has the slightest fucking clue. You cannot, because what he does doesn't work when bullets are coming back. Its like a guy who learns to punch the best way hitting a bag and then goes on to try and correct boxers on form and technique. It looks wrong, it sounds wrong. Not just because its new or different, but because its fucking stupid. The emperor has no clothes.
>>playing middle school field hockey is exactly like getting shot in the dick, thats why I wear this purple heart. Ben Stogie
>>64338773Here's Matt Pranka (CAG Operator, Navy SARC vet) calling you a faggot. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ApvVmYK__oMatt Pranka works for Ben Stoeger and teaches his material, btw. Sorry you're too afraid to actually measure your abilities, and so you instead you cope online about it. In sum, competitive shooters are better at shooting than brovets, whites are better than nons, and males are better than trannies and females like you. Enjoy, nigger!
>>64338773Who do you get paid to train?
>>64338139Maybe if you tried not laying on your side it would help.
>>64338177>right-wing insurgent proficiency testYou will never be a real woman
>>64338177>testing your abilities objectively and trying to improve is a "right-wing" thingyeah, we know
>>64338259I have the night shift so getting up early enough to go to my local range is legit not possible
>>64338833but i'm oh so sleepy ohhhh
>>64338773Training in a non athletic stance means you can shoot in either athletic or non athletic. Is all about separation of your upper body and lower body, so you can engage a target in any position and don’t need to set your feet in your “stance” before shooting. It also helps shooting on the move as well.
>>64338815A guy who was in the military shills on YouTube for another guy? You don't say.There are a hundred actual secret squirrels out there on YouTube all saying the opposite of what ben teaches. I'll leave you with this. Notice Paul Harrell. How he stands. How he shoots. Notice he was in many actual shootings. Notice he had more experience than pretty much anyone here. Compare what Paul DOES with a pistol to what ben DOES with a pistol. Notice it yet?Ben is a fraud when it comes to training for civilian defense and military training.
>>64338945Lol, no. Training in a non athletic stance does not translate. Training in a non athletic stance is training in the least balanced way possible. >>I train wrong so that im even better if I accidentally end up rightFucking lolololololo holy fucking shit you cant be serious right now.
>>64338934it's okay anon you can use my lap as a pillow
>>64338964>>64338956lol you’re trolling
>>64338964>>we train our boxers to stand feet side by side and fight side by side so that if they ever end up in an actual balanced stance they will be bad ass. Trolling would be crab running sideways upright between objectives with your body and hips squared to the target thinking you would last half a second in a gunfight.
I don't really want to speak ill of the dead, but Paul Harrell was a dental assistant who killed a drunk black guy with an AR-15, and never made a dime training people how to shoot pistols. Ben Stoeger literally travels to Fort Bragg twice a year to train Delta. Ben Stoeger won IPSC world championships. Paul Harrell won Oregon State National Guard championships. If you think they're remotely comparable, you're a retard. This is like the And 1 Basketball street ball guy versus Steph Curry.
>>64338987Anonymous doesn't realize paul killed many people and was both a marines and army marksmanship trainer. You know, while in the marines and army. But its nice that Ben traveled to a base once.
>>64338987>>I spent twenty years in the military. In my initial enlistment, I was in the active duty Marine Corp for 4 years. I had an infantry MOS I was an 0311, but I spent a couple of years as a combat marksmanship instructor in the Marine Corp Security Forces School. So as such, I had to have training and education beyond what normal Marines were getting at that time. So in addition to basic training, infantry school, and so on, I also went to a couple of citizen schools, such as the Ray Chapman Academy of Practical Shooting and a course at Gunsite. I also went to the Navy’s CRF school (that’s a S.W.A.T. school) and I got sent to a Marine Corp school called “the Formal Schools Instructor Course,” where you learn to create class outlines, and select tasks for training, and create a curriculum — and teach classes…Anyway, when I got out of the Marine Corp I went into the reserve component of the military, specifically the Oregon Army National Guard… PHThe boxes and boxes of marksmanship awards and metals, plus all the other shit he left out...
>>64338987On the other side of this argument but Paul attempted to run training classes that were more general outdoorsmen ship than firearms and from his videos it seems like he did classes training family and friends. He was a security forces instructor in the Marines and in a few videos marines he trained commented.Ben Stoeger trains Delta, 10th mountain posted some pictures of him training them too, Ben gets flown out internationally to train undisclosed people
>>64339032Paul never won any practical shooting championships or won World Champions in USPSA
>>64339032Wow, he took a course at Gunsite! Maybe he even got the coupon off the last page of Soldier of Fortune magazine! Surely this guy won State level champs in USPSA, right? Or maybe a local, even? Oh... he was a dental assistant who didn't even have a Practiscore page...
>>64338987Its actually like comparing a really good figure skater (ben) to a professional hockey player (Paul)Ben looks better skating but when the puck hits the ice he is fucking worthless.
>>64339041Paper doesn't shoot back. When did k go from skeptics to shills
>>64339047Except the actual hockey player (Matt Pranka) says you should listen to Stoeger. You left that part out.
>>64339045>>Uspca When was the last time a uspca winner was in a gunfight?
dental assistant lmao
>>64339058Matt also said dont listen to combat Marines, combat army, sheriff's and state and local police who have been in shootings either. Seems like Matt doesn't like competition in training. Or am I wrong? Did Ben and Matt not Bad mouth others with actual experience and schools because they were direct competition?
>>64339047Ben gets paid to train hockey players how to skate.
Like a hygienist? The girls who clean your mouth? Or was he the guy who schedules your next appointment in 12 months?
>>64339068Seems fair since if you’re the best you’d have opinions about people doing it the wrong way
>>64339069Training someone how to skate would be great. Unfortunately he is trying to train them stick work and position as well where he has no real experience.
>>64339071Anesthesia, he’ll give you a monologue about that time he… and you’re already asleep
>>64338599>Shooting to Live is an old booki dont fucking care what old people say about shooting. reading books to learn how to shoot is for-real dumb.
>>64339077That would hold water if he wasn’t specifically scouted and brought on to train hockey players by hockey players
>>64339084what about reading books on how to fuck? or did I waste all of that time...
>>64339074Is Matt the best? His attention to accuracy training over actual QCB training is what got him the boot right? Soldiers do not have to be Uber accurate. Especially in close combat. They need to be pie plate accurate with a plethora of shots while maintaining discipline in mission and movement. It doesn't sound like Matt's way was the best way.
>>64339102Post your CAG credentials.
>>64339141You first. No? Huh. I'll take that to mean you could not articulate a real response and immediately fell on logical fallacy thinking it would hold water. I'll help you out for the future. Wrong is wrong regardless of the experience of the person who points it out.
>>64339095this is the only place where you are going to be recommended books on how to shoot and its because all of you guys think you're too good for watching youtube.
>>64339176>all of you guys think you're too good for watching youtube.yes
How this thread went from OP to this shit, I just wanna fix my grip...
>>64339245hey man I posted groups more than once but these guys would rather yank eachothers dicks and call eachother gay
>>64338202This isn't the flex you think it is.
>>64339251Bucket of crabs syndrome. Sad.
>>64339176You'd put toobslop in your brain?
Gentelmen please, cease this flame war faggottry and stop ruining OPs thread. I suck ass at pistol too and really need to improve. My sighting is good, focus on front post, even gaps, top and sides, all that good stuff, but I can barely group at 25m and I dont know what im doing wrong. Is trigger pull really the most important part once the sights are on? Talking purely about accuracy here, not like rapid engagement stuff, cause honestly I need the foundation first.
>>64339274If the sights are on and the bullet doesn’t go there then you pulled the trigger wrong
>>64339274i flinch real hard still after thousands of rounds but what got me tighter on the handguns was a shit ton of dry fire while making a bit of a game of trying not to disturb the dot when i break the trigger. It's literally just a practice/skill issue. Could always see about taking a class from your local gunstore range.
>>64339284I try to make a good crisp pull bring it back to the wall before firing and all that. Is there more to it?>>64339289You find dry firing really helps? Ive not got the chance to go out and shoot at all but I have been doing a bit of that, just drawing and trying really hard not to move the sight when I pull. Any other drills?
>>64339274>Is trigger pull really the most important part once the sights are on?its not trigger pullits being able to make the gun bang with minimal movement,this is the goal that you should be focusing on.trigger pull is a factor but not the main point.if the gun is shaking thats bad.if the gun started pointing at the target but by the time the trigger breaks its pointing somewhere else thats bad.if your whole body was shaking thats bad.
>>64339308>Any other drills?none that I could recommend. the biggest help was been dry firing with a pistol that has a dot so I can has an unambiguous picture of how much I am moving the firearm when I break the trigger.
>>64339312oh my god what annoyingly useless advice. stop talking like a fucking life coach.
>>64339308If trigger pull good but bullet does not land on the X then sights bad If sights bad then good trigger pull doesn’t matter
>>64339340I'm just happy that he isn't talking about which gay youtuber has the deepest asshole or sucked the most cocks.
>>64339312It would probably explain why I group better when I fire rapidly. Still not good mind you, but better. Less fucking shaking and overthinking maybe>>64339321Dont got a dot but hearing soneone else say it help is enough for me to keep on going
>>64339353could always get a cheapass amazon laser if your pistol has a pic rail. it'll stay put since you aren't actually firing it and you'll get the same effect of immediate visual feedback.
I had to qualify with my BUG (Colt Pony) and it’s awful sights and 16 lb trigger at 25 yards.
>>64339340spoken like a guy who will blame a "bad" heavy trigger for his misses.if the gun is pointed at the target when it goes off its going to hit.if the gun moved now its not pointed at the target and its going to miss.if you clamp a gun in a vice you get good groups. it doesnt matter if you were yanking the trigger with a string or pulling the trigger with different amounts of pressure.you want to be a vice to the best of your ability.
>>64339364Yeah, may actually get one of thoseI seen this guy on youtube the other day, Jared or some shit. He was plinking plates from like 50m away with a 1911 or a revolver or something. Make me feel like I was over thinking the whole thing>>64339391I could never really grasp the whole 70/40 grip thing people go on about. Is it just basically a firm grip with both hands but not to the point of shaking or what?
>>64339413>I could never really grasp the whole 70/40 grip thing people go on about. Is it just basically a firm grip with both hands but not to the point of shaking or what?you experiment to figure out which method results in minimal movement.get a coin or spent shell stick it on top of the slide or frontsight and practice pulling the trigger. if it falls off you failed. dont worry about the sights.once you figured out a method that minimizes movement then you worry about sight alignment.change your hand placement or what part of your finger is touching the trigger just experiment to you find something that works for you since all hands and guns are different sizes.
>>64339084>>64339176You sound like you're legitimately a child. I'm not convinced you can even own a gun.
>>64339451Ok got ya, makes sense.Im gonna work on all this stuff from here. May report back when I actually get a chance to shoot again soon. Until then, dry drills like a motherfucker.
>>64338120>shoot with my MK23>all goes left>put on suppressor>now everything is centeri'm going to bang my head against a wall until i get brain damage, this shit piss me off so much and i know very well i'm the problem
>>64339517That's normal adding weight to a gun especially at the muzzle will shift poi
