Is there any wisdom in using hordes of disposable chaff infantry regiments to distract the enemy while a handful of actually decently special military units accomplish the objectives?
No.
>>64362637No, meat is expensive even in shitty nations.
>>64362637If you have the manpower but lack the time and/or equipment to get them to a high standard, yes there's a lot of merit in that approach.
>>64362637Cadians are disposable only by comparison to the rest of 40k universe, IRL they would crush any NATO regiment in a one to one.
>>64362881This
>>64362881>the good: fanatical morale & 200-shot lasgun magazines>the bad: Korean War level vehicles>the ugly: Korean War level artilleryAny modern army would squish them.
>>64362881The modern Russian military is only bad in comparison to the modern world, in medieval times they would crush any medieval army in a one-to-one.
>>64362981Are you sure about that
>>64362637Imperial Guard slander will not be tolerated
>>64362981The Mongolian Hordes practiced far more modern tactics and strategy than the Russian military ever did. Not even shitting, the Mongol invasions involved levels of maneuver warfare that really wasn't replicated till the 20th century.
Also, thanks for the great art OP, it's going into my 40k folder right now
>>64363049Yes. Actually the comparison is even worse for the Imperium because the medieval ages were only 1,000 years ago while the Imperium lives 40,000 years into the future. So saying the Imperium can match the modern military is essentially just saying that they're 40,000 years outdated.
>>64363049NTA but yes, if you look at tactics used in bronze/medieval it's pretty easy how they play out>everyone form line>now bring cavalry to the side to break formation>and then exploit weakness to circle the enemy away from their friendsall while taking massive amount of casualties, there's a reason why it took so long to defeat the mongols.now if you throw in a modern army with weapon against a medieval one, even if the later try to do guerilla tactics, they'll be just crushed
>>64362637>that picL O L What's the lifespan of a Cadia? Eh? Eh?13 BLACK CRUSADES!!! BWAHAHAHAHAHHAHAGet BLACKED, loyalist faggots!
>>64363058Humanity deserves better than the Imperium anyways.
>>64362637No. Just train and equip your troops to be actually useful.
>>64362881>when your entire attached artillery regiment is vaporized by JDAMs in two seconds>tanks are plinked one by one by an enemy armor you can't even see cause no optics lol>no real accurate weapons to respond with aside from insanely expensive and unreliable stuff like manticoreAs of 40m the average Guard regiment's Russian-tier but without the sodomy. Once the artillery crumbles, so do they. Creme de la creme is Elysians, Harakoni and the like, the lighter units that almost remember the light infantry tactics of their ancestors.
>>64363411Even if we go with the generous interpretation that their shitty tank designs are made up for by future materials, the Imperium is still so backwards that they literally consider BVR targeting systems to be some form of warp-sorcery they don't understand.
Fuck Cadia and fuck the Imperium of Man.>>64363353based
>>64362881IG would lose to WWII infantry 10:1 because WWII infantry had functioning small arms but lore accurate lasguns are literally incapable of harming a human in reasonable combat conditions because the entire setting is written by scientifically illiterate nogunz hacks.
>>64363454>but lore accurate lasguns are literally incapable of harming a human in reasonable combat conditionst. lorelet
>>64363454>but lore accurate lasguns are literally incapable of harming a human in reasonable combat conditionslasguns have been depicted as functionally identical to autoguns in the lore rather consistentlycaiphas cain has no issues using a laspistol of all things in his book series
>>64363454No reason to oversell it anon. By WWII standards the Guard's more than fine. It's just that once PGMs and other battlespace management stuff enters the equation they fall off extremely hard. For all the shit we give them, the Tau are probably the best example of that. On their own, the Guard -can- push the Tau back. But it'll come at the cost of regiment after regiment after regiment getting utterly gutted of all their shiny hard to replace equipment to take out a much smaller force.
>>64363522>make a universe that deliberately runs on visions of the past because there is no way to realistically predict the future 40 years into the future, much less 40 000>people get autistically upset that the future isnt realisticwhy are people like this?
>>64363522Yeah IIRC the Space Marines are the only Imperium force that the Tau really respect. Guardsmen amount to little more than disposable meatwaves that they can snipe and scoot before they ever have a chance to return fire, or they can just call in an air strike and watch them blow up from afar. Titan Legions are basically just railgun bait that can be taken care of by a Tigershark Squadron, a Hammerhead platoon, or a Stormsurge or two. But Space Marines have the mobility, firepower, and durability to somewhat respond to the Tau's fire-and-maneuver long-range doctrine, and IIRC they're part of the reason the Tau developed battlesuits as a counter to them. Granted there's only a million Space Marines in the entire Imperium and battlesuits are much easier to come by in comparison but still fighting Marines isn't easy like it tends to be with the other Imperium forces.
>>64363538because there is a shit ton of sci-fi that actually tries to understand science and make realistic predictionsmaking a sci-fi war game and not understanding war or science is pretty fucking stupid and leads to shit like pic relatednow 40k can be cool and has a good aesthetic but when brainlets start posting about how le epic stronk everything is when it's comically retarded and impracticable, you can't be surprised at pushback
>>64363563forgot pic because I'm also retarded
>>64363553>Titan Legions are basically just railgun bait that can be taken care of by a Tigershark Squadron, a Hammerhead platoon, or a Stormsurge or two.the imperium got over the shock of losing a titan and adapted new tactics to counter their titan destroyers, forcing the tau to develop their own titansthe KX139 supremacy armor is large enough to require 3 pilots and comes with 3 anti-titan pulse cannons that make it look like the SC2 thor
>>64363571The KX139 supremacy armor isn't meant for fighting Titans though. It's just a Scout-Titan sized artillery platform that the Tau use defensively, essentially walking it around to wherever they need extra artillery power to aid their troops. It's meant for killing blobs of regular soldiers rather than piercing ultra-heavy armor.The Stormsurge is what they use for anti-Knight and anti-Titan warfare, and it's 'merely' the size of a Knight.
>>64363538I just find things more interesting when some reasoning has to be applied to the way things are, desu. Human meatwaves aren't going to return to 1500s tier effectiveness all of a sudden, but they make sense insofar as human bodies being the main thing the Imperium can produce and expend at the rate they need it alongside tube artillery and shells. That comes with logical drawbacks that get punished ruthlessly by opposing forces that have the means to do so. Asymmetric strengths and weaknesses are fun to me.
>>64362937>>64362981>>64363069>>64363411>>64363425>>64363454>>64363522Anyone else find it odd that the second someone mentions NATO in a fictional military thread, there's suddenly a shitload of spam featuring outright disinformation?There's at least 7+ posts of unsubstantiated lies about a fucking game armed forces. >>64362637>Disposable chaffImperial Guard is drafted from planetary defense forces, not civie retards, and everyone is equipped with high tech weaponry, given superb training, commanded by officers raised to fight from birth, and employ maneuver warfare that may feature hundreds of thousands of troops in a battle.
>>64363567My niggy, America still uses black slaves to load our tanks' cannons.>>64363591Yeah, examining the permutations of asymmetry is half the fun of a weird scifi setting and it's spoiled when redditors try to sugarcoat or over-rationalize the problems. Give me lasguns making helicopters obsolete, pulsejet dogfighters brains exploding trying to understand BVR or smart missiles versus infinite human waves every time.
>>64363597>does anyone find it odd that people aren't wanking MY favorite faction???post cadia lol
>>64363617>WankingThe idea that a JDAM can do anything to a IG artillery is both inane in setting, and insane IRL as the bot obviously doesn't know what a JDAM is.
>>64363597IG is like Russia: sometimes you get reasonably competent VDV, sometimes you get malnourished 50yo mongoloids with a week of training. Everything in 40k is a bureaucratic game of telephone. Putin orders give me 400k of your finest men, the generals say we can do 300k with basic training, the provinces grudgingly offer 200k, and the recruiters drag 100k retards into the meat grinder. Everyone claps. Anyone who notices the discrepancy is a heretic subverting morale.
>>64363638Or sometimes you just need to shut the fuck up if you don't know anything about Imperial Guard.
>>64363636The basilisk is a fucking open-topped artillery platform. What about it means that it magically gets to survive getting directly hit 2,000 pounds of high explosive?
>>64363597>and everyone is equipped with high tech weaponryThey consider BVR targeting systems to be literal witchcraft.
>>64363655>-t. muscovite inhaling the munitorum propaganda like it's a commissar's cologne (he's about to earn his bonus pay)Grimmest darkest cruelest most incompetent regime, nigger. I get it: you're ignoring the title crawl. But at least read the lore.
>>64363658The part where JDAM is an addon for an air-delivered bomb, and you can't air-deliver anything against a space age military force prepared to fight off planetfalls.
>>64363685Orks air-deliver WW1 biplanes to your WW2 cannons my friend.
>>64363682You read the lore, dipshit.Imperial Guard are not conscripts, they're 1/10th of a given planet's or sector's PDF, with arms and armor. If planetary governor doesn't have elite troops in his PDF, he's ork meat twice over by the time he delivers the tithe to the Astra Militarum. Then, the people known for murdering insolent and traitorous, review the offered troops and equipment, and if found lacking, murder the insolent and traitorous governor. You dumb brainfucked war tourist.
>>64363685Sure you can, when most of their aircraft are doing old-school gunfighting (if the Imperial Navy even deigns to send any to help out the peons) and their primary SAM system is both rare, and is a dice roll as to whether the machine spirit decides if it's time to break physics to hit something on the other side of the planet or immolate its own operators.
>>64363674No they don't, retard. Electronics are purview of tech-priests, and nobody calls them witches. Guardsmen who use it don't understand how it's made, but they are trained to operate it.
>>64363703And how's that model working out for Putin right now? Is he getting the top 10%?30k fried your brain. The original lore is far more cynical and despite the over the top satire and setting nature, is relatively heavy on subtext compared to what you're used to. You're not supposed to take that line literally.
>>64363707The fucking space marines were getting blown up by BVR Tau weapons and they were so confused from this technology they had never seen before they concluded it must be warp sorcery. Something which is backed up by the fact that even the fucking Space Marines have to literally stuff a servitor inside of a missile to make it a guided missile.
>>64362637You literally just made a fancy and verbose description of a high-low unit mix, something virtually every military in human history has done to some degree.
>>64363713Russia is not Imperium of Man. Putin is not a Warhammer character. Imperial Guard are not Russian army.You are not a Warhammer fan. You're an idiot.
>>64363725>Imperial Guard are not Russian army.They’re pretty close down to both using penal legions.
>>64362937>the bad: Korean War level vehiclesThat take hits that would catastrophically overkill modern MBTs and keep going.>the ugly: Korean War level artilleryLMAO.>>64363597Nah. The Guard as a whole is wildly different and depending on place, time and strategic situation can go anywhere from mildly post-human hyper-elite operators to a bunch of cavemen that got herded into the troop transport, given a week of training, were handed a lasgun and then got pointed at the enemy and told to charge.>>64363674No.>>64363721So in other words, they speculated about enemy capabilities. In a universe in which witchcraft is absolutely a real thing. Retard.
>>64363721>BVRThe bots are so fucking retarded with their buzzwords.You do know that both Space Marines and Imperial Guard have literal space wizards that can see the future, not to mention their Navy is effectively a mobile field of guidance satellites that can respond to threats from up there, or deliver intel directly to ground units? If any conventional-tier force gets too uppity, they literally delete the planet.For a space age fighting force, the entire world is visual range.>>64363731>Out of billion of tidbits, they share one>They must be Russia! Russia Russia Russia!Hitler drank water, consider how that relates to you.
>>64363169>What's the lifespan of a Cadia? Unknown, given it is a people as much as a place. Ain't gonna get rid of 'em, armless boi.
>>64363751>Nah. The Guard as a whole is wildly different and depending on place, time and strategic situation can go anywhere from mildly post-human hyper-elite operators to a bunch of cavemen that got herded into the troop transport, given a week of training, were handed a lasgun and then got pointed at the enemy and told to charge.Nope, never. Astra Militarum does not have capacity or interest to conscript every single person on the planet or in a sector - that is the job of planetary or sector governor. He cannot just pick up random tards, as they will be tested when given as a tithe. At worst they can lack training with latest tech, but they will otherwise be healthy, mature and physically adept soldiers.The lack of training is rectified on long ass space voyages between planets that WH40K ships take.
>>64363751>So in other words, they speculated about enemy capabilities.Against a faction that doesn’t use psykers in combat, because they didn’t understand how BVR was possible, because none of the Imperium has BVR tracking except by literally stuffing a human into a missile. Hell, we’re talking about a faction whose navy reloads their guns via a rope system pulled by galley slaves.
>>64363725>-t. nomodelsHere's a classic example: Necromunda. The gangs have mass-produced plasma guns the military might never get issued. The nobles think the army is for morons. The real troops are the federal cops with carapace armor and hellguns. (It's no coincidence hellguns pen power armor better than bolters pen carapace: Space Marines are Space Chechens with toys, not real troops).The Guard are the disposable scum scraped up from prisons for library tickets and mass murder, given the bare minimum of kit to qualify as viable for Space Putin's (highly bribable) inspectors. They're penal troops thrown away as sacrifices to the Dark Eldar! It's a canonical win/win tactic the nobles use and the Guard themselves understand!
>>64363752>not to mention their Navy is effectively a mobile field of guidance satellitesGenerous to assume they have satellites when their navy literally has to pull up within visual range of the enemy to broadside them with cannons that don't have autoloaders because they lost that technology.
>>64363794>Here's a classic example: Necromunda.Ah yes, the classic example - a huge hive world of insane production capability, ran by nobles that use a secret ass artifact to be literal rivals to Adeptus Mechanicus, where nobles fight each other in exosuits for sport.>The Guard are the disposable scum scraped up from prisons for library tickets and mass murder, given the bare minimum of kit to qualify as viable for Space Putin's (highly bribable) inspectorsWhat's the point of making a bot call me nomodels if the bot is a lorelet? Bad show, need to fix asap.
>>64363817>a huge hive world of insane production capabilityThe hilarious thing is that hive worlds aren't actually that productive. You'd get like 50 times as much productivity by just re-routing the population into educated post-automation jobs like the Tau do.
>>64363752>they literally delete the planetRead the IA Taros campaign modules. It takes a platoon of space marines to infiltrate a orbital defense silo because the battle barge's super duper mega cannons can't take out an unshielded silo lid in the middle of the desert after dozens of shots. They nearly get massacred by reservists with a SPAAG.
>>64363826>Need to have a factory to staff a factoryNo wonder Tau are going extinct and keep trying diplomacy.
>>64363817>calling everyone who disagrees with you about plastic toys botsIs this the same retard calling everyone who posts Chinese tech a chinkshill and everyone who posts radios a larper?
>>64363836>he doesn't knowThe Tau have ecumenopolises with populations in the trilions just like the Imperium. They're just not smog-choked hive worlds. And, unlike the Imperium, whose citizens assemble their weapons by hand, every Tau workers is way more productive by virtue of controlling a factory's worth of drone-workers instead. Which is why the Mechanicus freaks out when they lose a Titan but the Tau can lose entire fleets and it's not a big deal to them.
>>64363833>IA Taros campaignAgain, what's the point of fucking lying about Wh40k?For all the nonsensical 'muh bvr' and 'muh unable to handle a planetfall' and 'jdam', you point out the importance of an orbital defense missile silo since it would threaten the invasion. But instead of admitting that the Marines deployed to destroy the silo because it was specifically protected against orbital bombardment, you instead pretend they merely missed it and shit.Just, why?
>>64363854>He doesn't knowYour favorite race of space commies occupies a minimal fraction of space compared to Imperium, and if they don't resort to hive cities, that means their population is even smaller due to low density.
>>64363774>Nope, never.Cool story, bro. Try reading some of the older codexes. Or just some novels. The Guard in fact will conscript whatever they can get when pressed Including the likes of feral world savages or pompous, comically inept parade units from local nobles in a system that hasn't seen a fight in a thousand years.FFS, the Savlar Chem Dogs exist. Literal fucking junkies hoovered up as cannonfodder, barely better than the full-on Penal Legions. Oh yeah, those latter ones? Also part of the Guard.>>64363783>Against a faction that doesn’t use psykers in combatYou mean the faction that is known for using carious client races in combat? Retard.>because they didn’t understand how BVR was possible,So how do imperial forces engage in BVR combat all the fucking time, again? Absolute retard.
>>64363866Ecumenopolis > Hive City. A hive city only covers a small amount of the planet and renders the land around it into uninhabitable wasteland because simple pollution filtration is a lost technology to the Imperium. A Tau ecumenopolis covers the entire planet in city while avoiding the pollution problem.
>>64363817Yes. Necromunda is the setting in-miniature from the earliest editions. It's 1980s British class-commentary. You self-insert into rooster slave soldiers drafted into meatgrinders to "battle the perfidious xenos" with rusty knives, while the nobles rest under fine void shields eating space caviar imported from the decadent west, er vile xenos through a dedicated xenos-friendly import/export spire.
>>64363774This is a canonical Guardsman. There's entire regiments like him.
>>64363617post pharos lol
>>64363877>So how do imperial forces engage in BVR combat all the fucking timeWithout tracking, that's how. In the Taros campaign the Imperium just...shot their artillery into the horizon, without knowing if the enemy was their, and hit nothing.
>>64363877>The Guard in fact will conscriptThe guard can't conscript anything, that's why there's the tithe system in place. They have no capacity to commit a force to grab random people off the street, especially>when pressedThat's why, they absorb PDFs and related paramilitaries, which exist and which are good enough because otherwise the governor would be killed by xenos and heretics before he had any tithe to offer, and then would be killed twice by those coming in to collect the tithe.
>>64363889>Armed with a space age portable laser weapon>Mature male of impressive physique>Has a skull of a deadly creature to signify kills to his name>Axe in the right hand, he knows things can get close and personalI fail to see the problem. Dare I ask, you need more?
>>64363169ngl, that has real "We only lost 1000 men taking this one village!" vibes.
>>64363703On paper... but you probably don't remember when 40k was cheap shitty starcraft shareware.
>>64363893>The guard can't conscript anythingIncorrect.>that's why there's the tithe system in placeCalling it a "living tithe" doesn't make the conscripts not conscripts.>they have no capacity to commit a force to grab random people off the streetTelling the planetary governor to do it for you also doesn't make it not conscription.>That's why, they absorb PDFs and related paramilitariesLike stone-age tribals. Which they don't even bother to give full lasguns.Also, good job ignoring that garbage regiments like the Savlari (and Penal Legions) exist, and they aren't just a pure emergency measure either.>>64363907If you want cannonfodder to drive at the enemy lines in an unorganised charge? Nope.
>>64363936>Like stone-age tribals. Which they don't even bother to give full lasguns.Stone age tribals are mostly left alone by the Imperium, and those that do get picked up like that are specifically trained and educated. They make good soldiers because they have good survival background. As for laspistols, it's because they fight better like that. They also give them flamers. And they have capacity for full IG rollout with no limits. Glad you missed the part where they teach them how to use lasweaponry still
>>64363890Listen here you little shit. Fuggit, since this is such a shitshow of a thread, r8 my homebrew army.>Cabal of the Sunken Harvest>Founded by crew of merchant craftworld that was transiting the Webway before ending up a shipwreck>Aesthetics based on WWII commerce raiding mixed with ghost ship legends, ships ever-so-slightly resemble Gatos or Type VIIs in hullform>Pocket dimension in Commorragh that's nothing but a seemingly-endless ocean (it loops back on itself if you go far enough)>Possibly responsible for Bermuda Triangle or Atlantis disappearances>Sea is full of leviathans and other extremely deadly predators sourced from around the galaxy>Willing to spend dangerous amounts of time outside of the Webway compared to 90% of cabals>Part of initiation for new shipmates is managing to find humor or eroticism in the Slaanesh-induced nightmares while deep under a terrestrial sea>Stole the Baltic Sea for fun and a refill>Will vanish entire cities and place them on artificial islands in their ocean, preying on them over a long period until they undergo societal collapse>Afterwards, they gently sink them to the bottom for use as fish/coral habitats and fun diving spots>There are thousands of settlements from across the galaxy like that, big and small>Captured sailors and marines treated shockingly well as a professional courtesy compared to anyone else>Admirals get to dine with the Archon, Captains get to dine with the lesser officers, even getting guided tours, sometimes>Fattening them up for the slaughter, naturally, though if suitably impressed by a captain, the cabal will let their crew go free>No such luck for the officer themself though, they will suffer exquisitely, only difference is the amount of reverence in the act>Archon possesses an absolutely massive boneyard of captured ships both sea and space-going, appreciator of fine naval architecture
>>64363960That just sounds like Russian foreigner conscription with extra steps.
>>64363892That's called rolling barrage... They did that on purpose, as much as the civilian writer for a game book could comprehend. Because they do have 'BVR' support from the Navy in the sky... Since the very same Navy located and scouted out the orbital missile silo without the silo firing at them...
>>64363971More like beaners in the USMC.
>>64363980>That's called rolling barrageRight, a WW1 era tactic. That sure bodes well against a modern force with BVR tracking.
>>64363989Is BVR your new stepdad or something that you can't shut up about it. I say again, the dumb book you keep reading proves they have BVR by virtue of the navy, they just have enough shells to flatten everything in their way.
>>64363994If the Navy had BVR they could've told the soldiers on the ground that there weren't enemies where they were shooting. They didn't because they literally couldn't see that far, at least not with any degree of zoom or resolution.
>>64363962Oh, also forgot, sometimes they'll drop a leviathan into some random planet's ocean, as a treat for the locals.
>>64364000>He doesn't expect heretical xenos and traitors to commit cowardice and conceal their positions with anti-surveillance systems.Never gonna make it.
>hey commander sir>i got a great idea>we could split up the tank regiment and artillery regiment and assign each of their companies to each infantry regiment permanently, so we can stop micromanaging our units>we could call these brigades and the whole unit could be deployed as-is to handle threats independently instead of uprooting 5 different regiments to do the job of one
>>64364012>Putting all of your eggs in one breadbasket for just the right occasion of a daemon to possess the commander and give it the full combined arms capacity.This is specifically why Astra Militarum and Navy are separate.
>>64364012The Imperium literally isn't designed to work. They have a Navy and Army rivalry that would make Imperial Japan tell them to calm down. The mechanicus, ecclesiarchy, inquisition, and space marines are all independent organizations that frequently tell the Imperium and each other to fuck off and sometimes go to war with each other. Their technology is so backwards they forgotten how to make autoloaders for their ships.
>>64363862Look at that. It's as if using lobotomized slaves, the Mk1 eyeball and unguided weapons isn't great at hitting stationary ground targets, even when it's a battlebarge of the emprah's finest in geostationary orbit over a tiny mining colony expending hundreds of shots.But at least they made some nice craters!The Imperium really is Russia.
>>64363960There are canonical guard regiments made up of stone age tribals.>and those that do get picked up like that are specifically trained and educatedThat is to say, they get like a week of trianign before being told to charge over that hill and kill whatever they meet on the other side.>And they have capacity for full IG rollout with no limits.Yet they curiously do not seem to actually do that like, ever. Instead they just take these feral worlders, give them under a week of training and then drive them towards the enemy in a disorganised mass charge. That is, LITERALLY, standard operating procedure for feral world regiments.Oh, and reminder that you're the one who is claiming that no such thing EVER happens in the Guard and that EVERY Guard regiment are nothing but highly-trained, well-equipped elite soldiers.>Glad you missed the part where they teach them how to use lasweaponry stillYes, because showing a guy how to hold a pistol and pull the trigger is such a vast amount of training, right? No way you could teach that to a caveman in like a week before shoving him out of the lander and towards the enemy. You absolute retard.PS: Glad you keep trying to ignore otehr examples like the Savlari or Penal Legions. Really shows that you're arguing in complete bad faith.>>64364028>They have a Navy and Army rivalry that would make Imperial Japan tell them to calm down.Um, no? The Guard and Navy generally stay in their lanes and emnity between both is normally a mild mutual disdain at worst?>Their technology is so backwards they forgotten how to make autoloaders for their ships.Also incorrect. And before you go posting pictures: Human loaders are A BACKUP.
>>64364040>Hitting a five kilometer zone around the targetJesus they really can't hit the broad side of a barn
>>64364046>Human loaders are A BACKUPSo they've just lost the capacity to produce spare parts. Plus who are you kidding, they literally put humans into missiles as guiding systems, why should we believe they can produce an autoloader?
>>64364046>That is to say, they get like a week of trianignThat is to say, you're an idiot, since space travel takes ages in WH40K, meaning you need to occupy these savages for months or years at a time. WITH SCHOOLING.Good grief you really just won't give up.
>>64364040Funniest part about this post is not that the navy missed from outside of Orbital Missile's range.It's that it describes gunners locking onto targets before planet's rotation brought them into LOS, finally confirming that Navy is capable of BVR tracking.
>>64364067Fair enough. The Imperium has BVR...it's just so bad it misses by several kilometers.
>>64362637
>>64363962You know what Anon? I like it. Literal pirate Dark Eldar, I dig it. Its well within their 'power level' so to speak but isn't overwhelming and absolutely plays to their strengths and what they like to do. Not that you'll have much of a chance to do it, but I'd also try and model them to be a little 'beefier' than standard almost emaciated Deldar, give them sleeveless shirts (body armor really) and that sort of thing to play down their normally over the top armor somewhat as though they spend a fair bit of time swimming. Y'know, like actual pirates. Otherwise, I dig it. 10/10.
>>64362881Pic related is literally beyond the capabilities of the entire Imperium to produce.
>>64364072Other, less biased versions>Firing outside of range of orbital defenses imposed limits on accuracy.>Countermeasures on site>Warp fuckery>Bad rolls
>>64364106Man, I wish I had that kind of modeling skill, those are some good ideas for setting them apart from the average fae hyper-rapist, but I still pussy out of painting what I've got. Still, thanks anon.
>>64364125>>Firing outside of range of orbital defenses imposed limits on accuracy.Why would it impose limits on accuracy, you SHOULD have a space age supercomputer that can accurately triangulate the exact coordinates that a round will take when you fire it. Surely you're not just eyeballing the rough area of the target right? RIGHT!?
>>64364124False. Blacksword, Helios Defense, Hellstrike, Hunter Killer and many other missiles outpace it.
>>64364144>Why would it impose limits on accuracyBecause cogitator can make any number of calculations, but the quirks of the weapon, such as state of repair, quality or cost of production, impose limitations to execution of calculations.You're on /k/, you should know about MOA. The further you are, the bigger the cone.Additionally, given the length of time required for a proper ritual to rouse the cogitator, simplier and faster equations or rituals are used, sacrificing a level of precision.
>>64364164>but the quirks of the weapon, such as state of repair, quality or cost of production, impose limitations to execution of calculations.So the Imperium's production quality is so utterly shit that they completely miss a stationary visible target by several kilometers after an extensive bombardment.
>>64364164>all this copeForget the power of science and technology redditor. We're manually loading space broadsides out here and basically, you're a heretek )))
>>64364180From thousands and thousands of miles away in space, at range where planet's orbital defenses are unable to target them, with possible presence of countermeasures, warp fuckery, void phenomena etc... Yes, the writer wrote them to have missed, so that Space Marines could save the day.
>>64364187Arch-Magos will not entertain your accusations, layperson.
>>64364188>with possible presence of countermeasures, warp fuckery, void phenomenaExcept we known that neither countermeasures, warp fuckery, or void phenemona was interfering. I'm sure the accuracy would've somehow been even WORSE if it was, but this was just a stationary target with no particular defenses noted.
>>64364188>he didn't read the loreAre you the anon who accused posters of lying until the quotes were screenshotted?
Reminder that this is how the Imperium monitors its public streets. These aren't even servitors, just anyone accused of a crime (and it can be something as small as insulting a nobleman).
Also Ultramar is considered an especially prosperous part of the Imperium and its average life expectancy BEFORE things went to shit was 35.
People are just discovering that warhammer is just several decades of different writers playing tug of war with the setting and there is no coherent canon for almost anything in it?Cause I'll tell you, you can find writing that contradicts literally anything else written. There is no real tone or rules or standards, it's just whoever was holding the reins that day scatter-shitting their writing out into the vague cloud that is warhammer.This is why any "power level debate" winds up with people discovering warhammer is both a super advanced, highly competent and sensible military setting and also complete 80's wackadoo noguns hair metal nonsense. They've hired both sorts of guys to write it and they never agreed which one was right.A lasgun is an ineffectual peashooter, literally just a laser ak-47, or a mega beam cannon that boils the blood of people it misses. These are all "canon" writing. Not much point in arguing about it.
>>64364499The best thing about power level debates is that I can personally beat every fictional character ever imagined at once. Goku, batman, the emperor, one punch man, darth vader - I'll win, because they won't show up to the ring.
>>64363482>>64363489>>64363522Oh no, I was't joking. When the IP had a little self respect, before it degenerated into and endless stream of fanwank for repressed homosexuals like (you), the quip that lasguns were little more than flashlights was borne from the fact that they literally were. In the grimdark future of 40k, an imperial guardsman's life was worth so little that the logistic efficiencies gained from issuing him a 0.5w/h per shot flashlight outweighed the risks to his life. All of the books that come later are in-universe propaganda and unreliable narration. The literal field manual for a guardsman tells you everything you need to know to determine that the real power output, behind all the propaganda etc, is pitiful.
I dont care. Its a fun setting. fuck you
>>6436306940k is weird because things were going fine until 30,000, but then some bad things happened and then the Imperium of man entered a period of technological stagnation and even regression. Originally, a Leman Russ was supposed to be about as capable as an M1 Abrams from the 80s/90s due to it's future material superiority, even though the actual design of the tank is on par with WW1 tactics.
>>64364770IIRC a Leman Russ was supposed to be the DAOT equivalent of like...a farm tractor. Which is why it's subpar and strangely designed for an actual tank but somehow still good enough to be considered a tank at all.
>>64363962>Sea is full of leviathans and other extremely deadly predators sourced from around the galaxyI like it, it sounds like the Damnation of Pythos
>>64364723You should be joking, it'd be less embarrassing.
>>64364804Wait a second, that's a Battletech image
>>6436487740k is slop written by british leftists
>>64364897Yep, Battletech Gothic. Regardless, the important thing is that the Imperium is literally the definition of a cargo cult. They inherited old technology but they don't understand how it works, they have little idea of how to maintain or repair it, and when they lose it or a part of it they often have no idea how to make more. Even what can be produced from their forge worlds largely depends on whatever those factories were pre-set to produce and they can't shift production around to meet new demand.While, yes, the Imperium often finds itself in awe of the technology of other factions such as the Necrons, one thing that's much more telling is how even the basic technology of a faction like the Tau often perplexes the Imperium. Whether it's being able to reliably and accurately hit targets from beyond visual range, or even something as simple as their refining process for promethium and the purity of the fuel it creates, and even the fucking holograms and how their holograms are high resolution and don't constantly flicker.The Imperium is fundamentally so incapable of fixing basic problems that they give entire planets to a couple of Guardsman just for finding an STC of a single knife design. A fucking knife. That's how reliant they are on their cargo cult bullshit.
>it's another 40soy thread in which no one realizes that GW retconned the lore at least three times overconsistency got thrown out of this trash franchise window years ago
>>64364919And you're being a little dweeb and fact-checking their obviously silly mathematics like you're gonna get a banana sticker for it.
>>64364770The Leman Russ wasn't a tank, it was an armed tractor for hostile worlds where farmers could be attacked by hostile fauna and aliens.The Land Raider was just a mining/agriyield tipper.
>>64362881>muh natoSo was it any surprise to anybody that the latest warhammer spam thread was another vatnik shitting and pissing itself
>>64363597It's easy to tease them, NATO is second to none in real life when it comes to conventional warfare, but the moment you say they can be beaten by a fictional army in a conventional war you automatically see how many people here are just retards "picking the winning side" and trying to justify their wank without really understanding what are the capabilities and limitations of NATO.
>>64367471Yeah but the conventional army in question is the fucking Imperial Guard, they’re not exactly the most elite of fictional armies.
>>64362637>Is there any wisdom in using hordes of disposable chaff infantry regiments to distract the enemy while a handful of actually decently special military units accomplish the objectives?If you live in the middle ages and intend to gain leverage over your allies and vassals by exhausting their manpower.Doesn't work too well if the men are yours.
>>64362937>200-shot lasgun magazinesThey're no longer laser guns. They retconned them into Star Wars pew-pews from Relic's lasers.
>>64363553Blue hooves with a reaction time measured in seconds typed this post
>>64369084You may notice that no modern military that can be taken seriously trains its soldiers to attempt to get into melee combat. They might get some training and exercise for melee but it's hardly what they orient their doctrine around.
>still don't like primaris>still think rowboat should've stayed in stasis jar>still think progressing the setting was stupid>still like kreigers>still think ADB is a faggot, but NLs are cool i guess
>>64364804>>64366467This was never really canon. There's a single line in rogue trader that says most combat vehicle STCs are based off moving vehicles and tractors. This is said right next to a line saying the imperium isn't capable of nuclear power or fission.
>>64363703The Imperial Guard are what are handed over according to a planet's assessed tithe. Whether they're the elite of the PDF or a pressganged crowd rounded up fresh from the streets of a hive is a matter of the particular fluff of the regiment. Hell, the planet might not even have a functional PDF depending on fluff.
>>64363866The Tau have always been a small but densely populated empire compared to the Imperium, which covers most of the galaxy but also highly porous and full of areas where Imperial activity and control is nominal at best. >>64363907>be Grug of Red Hand Tribe>Sky Chief's chariot descends demanding great warriors>interior of Sky Chief's chariot is smellier and more humid than assumed>Sky Chief's servants yell at warriors>Brok, son of Brok, yells back>Sky Chief's servants beat him to death in front of everyone>spend unknown number of moons in Sky Chief's chariot getting yelled at and hit to prove your toughness>one day man wearing large hat with Sky Chief's totem approaches>you know him to be mighty servant of Sky Chief since he kinda sorta speaks your tongue and wields sword whose blade is many tiny swords >you will prove yourself to Sky Chief killing something known as "Taw">get handed axe of shining metal and small thing is supposed to be like bow and arrow>you would kill for such an insult to your bravery to think you need bow and arrow like River Bend tribe but you remember Brok's eyes dangling from face as his chest was caved in>you charge from Sky Chief's chariot to massacre these Taw>you turn to Big Hat servant as you cannot see any Taw to fight>suddenly Big Hat servant head and chest explode into fine mist >you continue to charge as fellow warriors continue to explode into fine mist and tiny lightning that cooks flesh flies from treeline in distance>you call into hole full of corpses all wearing Sky Chief's totem>knowing that Sky Chief has abandoned you, you offer silent prayer to demon queen Wife-With-Penis-Like-Husband to save you
>>64364046The Mechanicus are just as feudal and compartmentalized as the Imperium, and exist as an independent parallel organization to the Imperium of Man as a whole. There very well could be a Forge World that spits out macrocannon autoloaders all day and 99% of the Imperial navy will never see on because it's designed specifically for a type of vessel only used in three sectors and the Forge World only obligated to supply two of them.
>>64369465>>still think rowboat should've stayed in stasis jar>>still think progressing the setting was stupidonly autist who think shit should never change think this, I'm glad booby g and the lion have returned, corax is next because his return won't matter
Pathetic whelps deserve to die for the gods, every last bit of drop is eternal sacrifice
>>64369918what kind of hack writer needs to use the "main setting" to write their shitty fiction when there's literal infinite space and ten thousand years to flesh out their own niche ala Sabbots World.
>>64364067It also states that the ship is in geostationary orbit, but that the planet rotates underneath it.Both of these cannot be true at the same time.
>>64362881I agree Canadians are more expendable even than Russians. Addition by subtraction really.
>>64363752>beyond-visual-range is a buzzword now
>>64369918Corax already returned.
>>64371215It is a buzzword when you're trying to one up a military force equipped with space-based sensors on interstellar ships because you failed to read a book about space knights once.
>>64371264>THE FIRST PERSON to see the flotilla break warp on the outskirts of Hydraphur was an opticon rating named Jarto, who saw the tiny, distant pinprick of light as the ships came spilling through the gap in reality, surfing their momentum and setting their prows toward Hydraphur’s bright sun.>Jarto dutifully slid the bronze measuring rods into place and charted the co-ordinates of the sighting, called them up the speaker-tube to the Opticon Intendant’s control cabin high above him, and punched them into a grey card that was sucked into the slotted mouth of a gargoyle on his viewing-deck’s central pillar and carried smoothly to the gate’s archive stacks. He never thought any more about itThose space based sensors are men peering through analog periscopes to see fusion torch drives and warp jumps in their line of sight. BVR is not a normal feature of space combat at any tech level.
>>64371315See what I mean about inability to read? That one tard was bemoaning that ground troops are not capable of BVR, and I had to very slowly explain to him that viewing battlefield from space grants these troops BVR.Now I am gonna have to very slowly explain to you that Imperial Navy targetting locked onto targets on the opposite side of the planet and then waited for it to rotate in position in this excerpt >>64364040Next, I hope, I won't have to explain to your stupid ass, that BVR for space combat may feature concepts like ships hiding behind moons, planets, asteroid fields, debris, and other space ships like, say, space hulks.
>>64371264>equipped with space-based sensorsWe have no proof that they actually have those though. The target they were 'locked onto' was a static facility that they knew the geographical location of beforehand. And they still managed to miss.
>>64371351>viewing battlefield from space grants these troops BVR.Go ahead and tell me what militaries patrols are currently taking place from this view. Oh, and you can't zoom in, because that technology is beyond you.
