Post gear, discuss gear.Camo chic: Operator modeOld: >>64611658
/gq/ Infographic Emporium:https://imgur.com/a/gq-infographic-emporium-1-00-1lZ5xw6Legacy Infographic Reserve: https://imgur.com/a/k-infographic-reserve-AIKzwWF>Quick and dirty "what plates should I buy on a budget?"SRT (M855A1): Hesco T212.Level III + M855: Expired Hesco 3611.Level III + M855A1: Hesco 3411 or LTC 19513. 3411 is preferable. Wildcard Protech 2120-5.Level IV: Hesco 4403. If broke Gilliam 1023.Level IV + M993 / Swiss P AP: Gilliam 8002.Level IV + M2AP going really fast: Protech 2230Last time on /gq/, we talked breaching tools - including a 50lb rip and ram from the 1990s. Trex sans Lucas is now shilling breaching charges that can't break a basic residential door. Anon was saved from buying crappy .04 LTC plates. Two anons argued about Verco boron carbide flexible rifle plates. A man learned the meaning of true 1x, and Militech is back on the menu boys - they reduced their tariff fee.
RE: What is your opinion on buying temu and aliexpress clones of g3 pants.I recently bought 40 dollar clone of g2 and they seem pretty good although i haven't been /out/ yet. I normally wear Helikon-tex bdu mk2 pants in the field
>>64628339As long as you bought from a source that is reputable for decent clones then fine.
>>64628326If you're talking plates, let's not forget that "Mjolner" is running a scam where they shill imaginary or American Blast-tier cheat-ringed plates for unknown reasons. Probably fleecing dumb investors.
>>64628292This ai slop is bad no sovlstop it
>>64628355How can I check the reputation. The reviews are probably from larpers and airsofters anyways.
>>64628365Only troon "creatives" whine about AI. You lost.
>>64628370AI=always indians
>>64628370Nigga this is objectively ass and is antithetical to the creations /gq/ used to have for op images. A shitty mspaint drawing and copy paste images ontop has more relevance than this le heccin operator ai gen.
>>64628384trvthnvke
>>64628365Stop complaining and offer better.T. You won't, it's easier to just whine.
>>64628053In addition to interacting with the broader suite of eagle gas mask pouches and drop leg holsters, one of the reasons Tac vests had those belt loops was to allow the vest to replace the harness of an alice belt. Presumably it sucked dick, as I've never once seen it done in practice; but its something to consider.
>>64628365ai slop IS junk, but for /gq/ in 2025 where half the posters are buying shit off temu, its entirely appropriate.
>>64628369>How can I check the reputationVisit various forums and certain gay websites to hopefully see lots of people saying that they're good to go. I can't remember the name of the chinese clones I was looking at but they were recommended by anons here and I recall seeing other websites mentioning that clone being fine. Sorry wish I could tell you what they are.
>>64628432temu? Dude we're on Aliexpress get it together.>>64628364I don't see what their game is. Talk about AI sloppa. At least Rook had an actual product and some bullshit white papers about titanium carbide.
>>64628437Thanks! I didn't know people were cataloguing these things.
>>64628437Emersongear?
>>64628465>At least Rook had an actual product and some bullshit white papers about titanium carbide.Also AI sloppa. It's one thing for a whimsical /gq/ thread. It's another thing for these fake-ass companies to feed us AI-generated bullshit products.I'd bet that "Mjolner" is just putting together cheat-ringed plates, testing them, and using the fraudulent results to raise money. Then they'll either disappear, or release an ABS-tier plate, or release a 6.5-pound Level 4, while still advertising 4-pound alumina Level 4 plates on their site. Those are for le hecking operators only, no civilian sales!
>>64628415kys nigger
>>64628499Yup, that was one of them. I recall another one, really basic website that has basic pictures of the gear on a black background as well. However, emersongear should be among the better chinese clones according to everything I've been reading.
>>64628505True, BUT Rook has actual test reports and you can, in theory, buy a BASS REEVES or MAKO or EXECUTIVE or MEGALODON plate if you're rich and retarded enough to do so.Their .50 BMG plate, the Megalodon, stops M33 with like 90mm BFD. Just one, don't ask about edge protection that's uh not included possibly maybe actually.
>>64628480We catalog everything it's kind of absurd actually
>>64628570lolI genuinely doubt that those plates exist and that they've ever sold any. If you're rich and RETARDED enough to buy one, here's what I think happens:> You place order > "H-holy shit, somebody placed an order?!? WTF?!"> Depending on what you ordered, Rook hastily buys Z210, 4800lv, or Colossus> Tears the covers off> Puts Rook cover on> "Sizes and weights and weight discrepancies are uh nominal."
>>64628623Nah I bet they just rebrand Aholetech. Why waste money on the grift?
Look at this Aholetech. It's 4.73lb, boron carbide and PE. Level IV. RMA can't even fathom this technology anymore.https://www.aholdtech.com/peb4c-hard-armor-bulletproof-plate-iv-atbp-4bl-sta-product/
I read a few days ago the the entire Westpoint Class of 2029 is going to have The Clean Swwep" laser sugical hair removal procedure done to support the special forces already doing it. Quote from a female officer candidate:>We all support our specfor and have all commited to better hygiene in the field. As a medical expense for work, it is tax deductable now and we are working to get it fully reimbursed. My fiancée is fully supportive and says, "There should be tile in the kitchen, not carpet anyway." She's so funny! I'm going all in from my naval to my tramp stamp and getting everything "slicked"The Clean Sweep appears to be trending. I'll check /out/ and see what the ultralight backpackers are doing.
Just got my LBE all set up. I've got my water, water purification, medical, entrenching tool, woobie and heavy poncho, compass and maps of my local area. I also have 6 mags, and 2 more pouches for 6 more, but I don't have enough mags for it right now. For context, this is going to be going in a metal lockbox in my vehicle as a "get home kit" type of deal. I have a rifle and survival food and some boots already in there. Anything else I should be packing?
>>64628693>>64628635Yeah you're probably right. Isn't that literally what the ShotStop guy did, though? BTW he got five years:> https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndoh/pr/body-armor-company-owner-sentenced-five-years-prison
>>64628710He did two things.1. Sell Chinese plates with fake NIJ labels.2. Modify Tencate's plates without authorization by removing the drop foam and other components to save weight. This invalidates the NIJ cert.>five yearsShould have been ten. Fucker.
>>64628292>ai slopwhat a perfect encapsulation of /arg/
>>64628693ahole is fine
>>64628700Flashlight, batteries, toilet paper.
>>64628761On what source do you base ahole is good? I prefer dikkbutt
>>64628783He's talking about laser hair removal.
I think Ahole OEMs for Jinwudun.https://www.aholdtech.com/news/new-type-nij-iii-low-profile-ballistic-applique/They've got a very similar Level III helmet applique and a similar Level III helmet.
>>64628826I can't believe they're literally called Aholetech. You're probably right, though.
>>64628825Laser hair removal is how we can use aholetech ballistic underwear to protect future generations to cum.>>64628837The virgin militech vs the chad aholetech
Anyone want ballistic ahole shields?https://jinwudun.com/collections/bulletproof-shield
>>64628857yeah I'd like to shield against aholes
>>64628914They even fold into suitcases so you can be discrete
Speaking of chinese shit, Armor Empire's website is locked. Damn, I had an armored belt of theirs on my list.https://armorempire.com/password
I'm not clicking that
>>64629016It's a generic wix website or sum shit brudda
Change my mind. A lot of the tiny ass aholetech importers are like mitsubishi dealers and are aktshually fronts for something else.
>>64628339you can buy the emerson knockoffs they're probably made in china so you should be able to find direct copies
I'm more of a DMgear and Genuine Bulletproof Equipment Store man myself
>>64628326>Anon was saved from buying crappy .04 LTC platesBased armor knowledge chad
>>64629584Rule of thumb. If a Level IV or B-32 API (IV-) plate is under 0.75" then it likely does NOT have drop protection.0101.04 plates categorically are not drop tested.
Anyone know what kinds of glue might be good for adhesive fabric wraps? I hate the idea of wearing cordura next to skin, but a cotton blend twill fabric wrap on an IWB holster might not suck.
Meanwhile in St. Petersburg...Capytech came out with new Gen. 3.5 CAPs. Major change is slanted edges to reduce clothing snag and a slightly harder underlay.Evolution of gear continues apace.
>>64630864Is it any good?
>>64630864Damn that's nice! Do you have any BFD numbers?>>64630874NTA. It's a "CAP" - climatic amortization panel. It's basically a super heavy duty trauma pad that attaches to the rear of your plate bag and also provides ventilation. People in the west sleep on these but they're basic kit in Russia because they have a much tighter (<17mm) backface deformation standard. You can buy the inflatable AA shield ones on eBay for about $50 a pair, they reduce BFD by about 50-60%. These Capytech CAPs are state of the art.
>>64630874On-paper feature set is stellar: non-hygroscopic, fully breathable and washable, very thin but energy-absorbent due to gyroid internal structure. End-user reviews are sparse but positive. One point that comes up is stable on-body position due to uniform surface and traction (as opposed to traditional "bars" CAPs).I haven't seen it in person, but from what I know, I'm excited to try. It's only marginally thicker than Ars Arma HEXS pads, but otherwise better in every way. Also, it's innovative, someone's using all the buzzwords in a real way: generative design, additive manufacture, new materials, etc.>>64630918>Do you have any BFD numbers?No. I've just randomly clicked on their VK page right now and they had a poast up about new half-gen improvement from couple days ago. I don't think there are any BFD numbers for those anywhere yet. You'd have to waste at least a pair of plates to get some concrete numbers anyway.
>>64630960Just double checking, are these legit Ars Arma CAPs? They have Evike listed as a dealer.https://www.evike.com/products/126478/
>>64628292So what's the final verdict on civilians buying gear and getting training? Is it pointless larping or is it a good idea? Do we need permission from some veteran to do it?My initial thoughts are that it really is a good idea for as many civilians as possible to get training and acquire gear, and I don't like the idea of needing to ask for permission/approval from veterans.
>>64631054Better to have and not need than need and not have. I think vets gatekeeping gear died out in the mid-00s. Anyone that gatekeeps gear at this point is just someone that's envisioning the "boog" and doesn't want well-equipped and trained competition.
>>64630998Could be. All the images are Ars Arma official press kit, and AA started off making Crye knockoffs for airsofters before getting SF contracts and branching out into their own designs sometime around 2017. It's easily possible Evike has some (leftover?) HEXS in stock. Most of their other AA inventory is predictably out of stock, although this pre-order page for an already deprecated PC model is concerning. They may be actually waiting on a batch of A-17 Granits that AA makes specially for them and somehow ships to CONUS for purposes of RUSFOR LARP at MSW or something. Or they may be lining up to ship knockoff AA gear due to lack of real deal.>>64631054lol, lmao.A lot of LARPers and airshitters that vets sneered at back in the peaceful days of late '10s are now themselves veterans, and they had far better survival rate than average mobiks or even some "prestigious" pro units. Only constant training keeps a peacetime army from turning into a defeated army as soon as war hits, and if you believe you're heading for some serious shit, getting ready for it is just prudence. You're free to disregard anyone who would stop you from that.
>>64631154People CONUS genuinely never use CAPs or legitimate trauma pads (the 0.25" AR500, Spartan, and RMA pads are barely better than placebo) so I could see them being dead stock. Can't rule out fakes though. The price is excellent.
Armor deal FYI. Pair of LTC 28780s for $1,150. These are 4.35lb / 0.7" thick, rated for 7.62x39mm BZ API and 7.62x51mm M80. GEN-4 TSA/LTO that came before the 28791. Basically like a Hesco U210 but also good for .308.https://www.ebay.com/itm/157484112055?
>>64628326Hey for the plates, I want a set for my exercise plate carrier and dont want to move my real plates, but also I don't want to wear something that won't stop bullets because I feel like wearing plates in my neighborhood increases the chance someone will shoot at me. Weight isn't a problem because I want the exercise resistance.So steel plates?
>>64631246How much weight (excuse the pun) are you putting on them needing to stop bullets? Steel plates have fragmentation issues and generally (with exceptions) lose to M193 at 3,250ft/s.If they need to be primarily exercise, buy some Highcum AR500 (it's NIJ certified) on sale for super cheap. I'd point you to the Adept Mantis - which is a titanium strike face PE-backed plate, but the BFD numbers on that are ass (40mm vs M855) and it costs too much. AMI TAC3S is still the dominant steel plate if you actually need a reliable ballistic performer, but it's costly and now difficult to get.
>>64628292ai images now? really?
>>64631292Not OP, but it seems to draw people in. Last thread was fast as hell.
Gents, I need a 100-liter duffel bag for reasons. Gimme recs on something sturdy.
>>64631609no
>>64631655help a brother out so i dont get condor
>>64631609Surplus sea bags.
>>64631818tits, thx m8
I just shit myself AGAIN
>>64632092You have A PROBLEM
>>64632123I can't HELP IT. I bought GEAR and it tickled my pooper all zesty like and it forced the chocolate sundae onto my tenant brown carpet and the fuxming smik alarm is going crazy this shit smells burnt i think my ass just did double cheeked up arsonn
>>64632092Me? Not yet.
Dude is literally shitting himself with the smoke alarm going off and his first thought is to tell the gear queers.Are we the baddies?
This thread needs a theme song. Here it is.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2It6MlC9vyYOther theme song:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p95C0z515CY
Well that never happened.
>>64627618I meant to reply but got distracted by something else. Is aluminum powder regulated now? That'd make for some fun stuff to play with at the range. Honestly if an anon can manage to make paper mache he can make these "breaching charges" with little issue. They're as safe as fireworks are, I mean, they practically *are* fireworks if you really want to get in the weeds of it. I'm sure if some anons are mindful enough to read surplus TMs, they can pick up any old fireworks zine or book or an issue of PGI and have at it with little risk. I'd hope so at least. Surely they know not to hold an M80 for too long or they can figure out electric match is extremely safe
>>64632719Surely it'd do better than this. Imagine paying nearly two hundred buckaroos to dent a residential door. Could get better results with a used 12lb sledgehammer from goodwill.
>>64632917they didn't place it well but I'm dubious on the damage that would do to a proper oak front doorneed the tactical propane mortar like was discussed last thread
>>64632388Enjoy working out your traps and neck in the gym just to wear this heavy ahh helmet
>>64633075it's only about as heavy as this thing
>>64628292those two foto models look like they are listening to the photographers intructions but have no clue.gay and fake.no chance against bubba on his swampy lands. moving targets. and once theyre in captivity its time for the more weird stuff. butt stuff.
>>64632917>Surely it'd do better than this1000%. Seriously, a properly done M-80 or salute would send the door flying open if not turn it into chips. Maybe it'd do that crater if it were a nice, high quality steel door>Could get better results with a used 12lb sledgehammer from goodwill.Yeah this is the biggest thing. A good sledge, ram, or halligan would make quick work of a door provided the person behind it has the strength and know-how
>>64633092Sort of doubt it. Unless material science has sped up considerably in the past 3 years. Then again if a "lightweight" rifle rated helmet was possible to made it would already be on the heads of CIA SAD units
>>64632388lol, I think that company is a Longfri outlet.Yeah, that was never gonna happen.
Are there multi curve hybrid composition plates yet that defeat M80A1, M855A1, HOT M193 etc, while being LESS than 4.6lbs per 10x12", and that cost less than $400 per plate, and are no more than 1" thick?
What type of stuff can I fit inside the velocity system buttpack
>>64632092Laser hair removal from your anus would make for MUCH easier cleanup. Just try this experiment next time you wipe:>be you>shitting>wiping>wipe poo on your arm>now wipe it off with the papper>sniff testYou will fail the sniff test because the paper doesn't clean. Add in poo clinging to your ass bush and you really do have a problem.>>64632123He does.
>>64632926They placed the charge in the center to ostensibly not damage the door frame. I think that was a red herring to avoid the charge looking even more pathetic if properly placed.>>64633075Lighter than Jinwudun's Level III PE helmet, and predictably a no-show.>>64633188Basically every helmet higher than M855 / M80 protection has been a no-show aside from extremely expensive and heavy Ceradyne or Tencate applique sets.>>64633601I agree.>>64634131The LTC 28570 (4.58lb 9.5x12.5), VelSys TSA (4.6lb 9.5x12.5), and Tyr XHA4/S6/T (4.5lb) meet your weight, thickness, and protection requirements but that price is impossible unless you get second hand from a crackhead that needs them gone immediately for a fix.
>>64634131Also, as a side note, the 10x12 swimmer versions of the 28570, VelSys TSA, and Tyr XHA6WTFBBQ are about 0.2lb lighter than SAPI M. They don't sell in 10x12 shooters since they're SOCOM-oriented plates. The Tyr plate is really badass since it'll make Level IV if backed by IIIA and, by default, meets the 6x 7.62x51mm M80 Level III req on top of 2x BZ API or 1x B-32, but it's impossible to get without credentials. LTC 28570 and the VelSys show up second hand for 2.5-3.5k a set. The Tyr plate's OEM is either Tencate or NP Aerospace.
You have lived to see digital NV surpass analog in price. Bear witness to the NVG-90... Pro. GNG has it probably overpriced to shit. This is a 60/120hz upgrade to the NVG-90 with a wide 50-degree lens. Can take either a 16340 / CR123A or 18650. Battery life 18 hours on a good day. I'd rather buy white phosphor GEN2 from Lindu for $1.4k.
>>64634759Based chinese pushing people towards the superior analog tubes.
>>64634880Here's some cheapo Lindu for $1.1k a pop, unshipped. https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/subject_1600063140650.html?
>>64634417> Tyr XHA4/S6/T I'm not 100% sold on this and I don't think that it should be mentioned alongside the LTC and VelSys plates. A few reasons:> We have no idea who makes it but it's definitely not Tyr Tactical. (Also NP Aerospace's hard armor apparently sucks dick. Check out picrel. They have "Level IV+" plates that don't even stop .30-06 APM2, lmao.)> We have no official/unofficial/Youtube/whatever test results. > Tyr's soft armor is C-tier at best. > The XHA4/7-S/T "Level IV ICW" is so much worse, on paper, that it's legitimately weird.I wouldn't be surprised if the XHA4/S6/T is the cheat-ring little bro of the XHA4/7-S/T. Or if there's something else that's wrong with it. I don't know if anybody has ever seen one of these plates irl, so all of this is probably nbd.
>>64631322>>64631292Weird as it seems, the AI OP images seem to make for crazy fast threads. They get a lot of clicks, I guess? This one is on track to break the speed record.
>>64634988why is that important? This is not gaytube where clicks and replies = dosh.
>>64634979I'd be willing to forgive the chart for being a typographical error. After all, Hesco's chart says only the 4800 is rated for 7.62x51mm M80A1 and apparently the 4403 / 4601 can't handle it. We know that's not the case.>NP AerospaceI'm more personally thinking Tencate because of the relatively high multi-hit versus the 28570 / VS-TSA. Some people on plebbit are saying NP Aerospace, but they're usually dead wrong about armor so unless NP has secret plates (notice how their 7.62 WC is empty but they still list the threat?) it's more likely Tencate just like the VS-TSA. It's rather thin at 0.75", so I'd be inclined to think it's a relative of the CXP-800 SA with the drop foam removed. This isn't unheard of even for SOF use. Like twenty years ago SOCOM had a Ceradyne-Paraclete plate called the SOF ESAPI MK. II that was sub-5lb multi-hit M2AP ICW IIIA. Predictably, no foam.>The XHA4/7-S/T "Level IV ICW" is so much worse, on paper, that it's legitimately weird.Lower-end model, probably. The LE price on the XHA4 is allegedly $3,000 a set, so it's a very high end model. Realistically it'd be $3,450 if sold to civs.
>64635025Quick self-correct, the Hesco chart DOES say the 4601 is good for M80A1, but not the 4403MC / 4403SC.>>64634988>>64635009Discussion has been pretty good, so I'll take it.
Also, just as an additional data point, those old Ceradyne Defender 275s are 0.625" thick and 4.4lb Swimmer M (so realistically 4.6lb SAPI M) and lack the XHA4's six hit M80 requirement, but also stop 1x B-32 API or 2x BZ API.These are no-foam plates that were made for a go-fast DEA contract like fourteen years ago. I'm inclined to think the XHA also lacks foam, but has a somewhat beefed up backer or crack arresting solution (or it's a tile array) for additional multi-hit. Weight savings can be had from the fact modern PE is MUCH better than what was available in 2011-2013.
>>64633075That's one part that could benefit from an exoskeleton whatever those things are called. Something that rests on your shoulders and holds the helmet up, could have better nods/thermals too.
>>6463424920 lbs of pussy and ass. Rain jacket, socks and boxers in a dry bag, mres, cool rocks you found along the way.
>>64635154A fine idea. Tencate had Level IV helmets (helmet + heavy appliques) available in the early 00s (bottom of pic rel) but the weight was north of 9lb. That demands something to take the weight off.
>>64635177>dry bagThat reminds me, I need to get a couple dry bags. Thinking sea to summit.
>>64635177Also reminds me to bring this up. USGI butt bags are cheap as hell nowadays.https://www.ebay.com/itm/127464909524https://www.ebay.com/itm/405700476734
>>64635182I can't find mine anymore so I need new ones. I had some cheap ones from midway to round up for free shipping. A zip lock bag is better than nothing. >>64635202It would take up a lot of space on your belt but if you have the room then go for it.
>>64635178A propeller on the top of the helmet.
>>64635242I propose gym membership.
Thoughts on the citadel defense split rig for 5.56? Kinda like the simplicity of 2 big, simple pouches on each side. But I'm worried it lacks adjustability in the fit and expandability bc it's presewn. Also not sure how well the swiftclip interface matches up. Coming from a Mayflower UW gen4...
>>64635248What issues do you have with the Mayflower?>pic unrelated, king of shitplates AR500's old 9x9" Freeman carrier idea because their steel was too heavy.
>>64635299Capacity. 4 mags is my base. Can carry 2 more if I leave water. Can carry another 2 if I leave my radio. Would rather not lose those things to achieve 6 mags (ideally more). Split rig should be able to do 6 comfortably, plus radio, water, nods, admin, maybe even sidearm in the right slip pocket...
>>64635299lmao, it's like a bullseye
>>64635330Are you running just the split rig or can you move some of this to a belt by following the 3-line system?
>>64635025> I'd be willing to forgive the chart for being a typographical errorNah I think it's serious. The specific plate's datasheet says the same thing.
>>64635334Sad part is that they'll still weigh more than III+ 10x12 or SAPI M ceramics that can easily stop M193 / M855A1 with no spall risk.They were trying to appeal to broke fudds who wanted to cargo cult a now-dead 2019-2020 trend of running 8x10 plates even though you're sized for a 10x12 to try and economize weight.>pic unrelated, "Armored Boss" on ebay IIIA+ mystery meat covert plates.
>>64635337I'd love to keep sidearm, ifak, and rifle mag pouch on the belt. Not sure if split rigs generally ride too low to allow that though. Regardless of whether I run an IFAK on the belt at 6 o'clock, I'll need one on the chest rig anyways.
>>64635345Then it would appear their marketing guy is riding the struggle bus to work and there's something hinky. It looks like it's an 0101.06 plate but is only rated against 7.62x54 B-32 API under 0101.04. B-32 is not an NIJ threat, so the only distinction is whether there's conditioning.I think what's going on is that their IV+ plate cannot withstand B-32 API or M2AP dropped but can handle lower threats in accordance with the 0101.06 conditioning protocol fine. Ergo, it's a "IV+" if we dialed the clock back to 2007. Since their lineup is rather ass I'm inclined to think reddit hivemind is wrong, again, and the Tyr is really a Tencate.It also doesn't follow that the XHA4 would be a clearly SOCOM-oriented plate but the manufacturer would be in the UK. SOCOM's plates all have to be made in the US.
>>64635372Are you totally opposed to running a platecarrier? I agree anyways with running two IFAKs. The rule is one for yourself, one for somebody you're helping.If the rig is adjustable you'll be able to fit sidearm, IFAK, rifle mag pouch on belt. That's basic first line gear.
>>64635395>totally opposed to running a platecarrierIf anything I'm hoping it's swiftclips match up with the carrier so I can keep running plates easily
>>64635248I have their spectre rig and I really like it. I've thought about getting the whittemore for the split front feature, but I never got around to it.
On another note, shady armor outfit Armor Forge replaced their old Mk-VI plate with an attempt at a PBZSA killer. They're a no-address registered in Delaware graphenebro outfit. I suspect, based on timing, they ran this against the LTC 28791 replacement but lost to LTC for the 2023 SOCOM contracts (GEN-6 less than overt), so this is indicative of the GEN-6 LTC plate's performance and then some. The Casper 4lb SAPI medium, 0.6" thick, multi hit M80 / M855A1 / BZ API with single hit 7.62x54R LPS protection. Swimmer medium would be 3.8lb. $2,500 a set. Notably, this is the first plate that actually beats the PBZSA objectively on (paper) specs in half a decade. Since this plate evidentially lost (or didn't perform) LTC's plate is likely superior in every way.https://usarmorforge.com/products/mk-v-rf1-ultra-light-level-3-body-armor-pair-copyI don't get what the hold up is with the GEN-6 plates not falling off trucks like the 28595s, 28791s, 287808s, and 28570s do. Tighter security, perhaps? Did the trucks get better guardrails? <4lb BZ API / A1 / M80 protection yes please.https://usarmorforge.com/products/mk-v-rf1-ultra-light-level-3-body-armor-pair-copy
>>64635428Is the whittemore supposed to sit lower than the spectre, and how does the spectre do with belt line items? What ride height is your holster? Both are designed really well, but I've been looking for a split rig and saw a deal on this one which got me curious
>>64635422So you're running a chest rig, carrier, and belt? I'd maybe try switching to something like the Tasmanian Tiger chest rig with the back panel extension so you've got a chest rig that fits plates by itself.
>>64635451It's a slick carrier with swiftclips, pretty low profile and very comfortable with heavier loads bc of shoulder pads
>>64635463If it works, it works. Do the dimensions on the clips line up in documentation or is it guesswork?
>>64635442>Is the whittemore supposed to sit lower than the spectrenot sure, but I don't think so.>and how does the spectre do with belt line items? What ride height is your holster?I don't really use a belt that much, but when I tested it the mags would hit the gp pouch if they were to far forward. as for the swift clips, I can personally vouch for the spectre, it fits my carrier perfectly.
Hypothetically, an EOTECH EXPS3 on top of an LPVOToo tall/retarded?
>>64635246There's a hard limit to both weight and threat rating of a helmet: vertebrae durability. Human neck CAN'T be trained to withstand compressive load, we just don't have any muscles that would work like that, so helmets over certain weight are invariably traumatic for your neck and have to be worn for very limited time (hours at most) to avoid permanent damage. This is fine for heavy assault missions, but not any other roles\scenarios. That's why mass-issued helmets chase weight targets at expense of protection. Compare TIG\Altyn\Rys\Maska face-shielded buckets on FSB\MVD heavies that clock in at up to 4 kg, and 6b47 that's 1 kg flat, but rated to 24hr continuous use. The other problem is energy transfer from impacts. Assuming infantry combat, these are lateral loads on the neck, and so can be trained for to an extent. However, these loads are applied at ballistic velocities, faster than one can react, and the practical limit again becomes a question of vertebrae resilience vs. projectile energy. Helmet mass mitigates it with inertia, but here we run back into the first problem.Now, if we were to hang the helmet off of the shoulders with something like the motorsport HANS device, the load can be transfered to parts of anatomy better suited to compressive loads, relaxing the limits on helmet mass. But tradeoff is mobility, size and complexity. So far, the mobility penalty of proposed solutions has been unacceptable. But then again, a decade ago exoskeletons were DARPA vaporware, StKSS was a Crye® Innovation and drones were either "childrens' toys" or actual toys for the man- and womanchildren of Chair Force. War is the mother of innovation.Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
>>64635519Full retard.
>>64635248>Also not sure how well the swiftclip interface matches upAre you supposed to? It doesn't look like the type of rig you would put on a plate carrier.
>>64635527A lot of it is also that you need set thicknesses of PE and ceramics to handle select threats. There are advances being made in ballistic trauma padding (Ivoryguard) that can offset this, but at the end of the day the best applique you can possibly get is going to be boron carbide, it's going to weigh X, only work with helmet Y, and stop Z.We need better materials for helmets to really open up protection-wise.Unrelated, you can now buy Zylon on Alibaba. Tiancheng New Material co is the mfg. Allegedly they can deal in Zylon-F, which is a UV-stabilized variant. You legally cannot sell Zylon body armor in the states but I would not be surprised if it reappears in some fly by night plates or, rather, helmets.
>>64634759What the fuck is the appeal of these digital night vision shits? They'll never be on the level of analog. I can only begin to understand if the customer is in eurostan where nightvision just isn't prolific
>>64635621DNV's original appeal was to provide something below the price floor of good analog. You can buy a GNG2K right now that competes with Gen1 NV well for about $350 - recently however DNV mfg's are getting really fucking cocky and coming up with units that are more expensive than good GEN2 and don't perform as well.One advantage of DNV is that they can see into shortwave infrared better than a lot of analog can. This only matters if SWIR equipment (lasers, COSIs) are in play, so you're going to be really fucked up regardless if an NVG-90 is the best kit you've got.The NVG-90 Pro and the ADNVs are, at best, comparable to mid Gen2 but the refresh rate is still an issue, along with minimum lighting (lux) reqs.
>>64635621> They'll never be on the level of analog.There's no physical reason this is the case. They've been getting better and better all the time. Good digital NV would be insanely useful, much better than analog, as there's more that a digital system can do.
>>64635647>They've been getting better and better all the timeAnon even the "best" digital analog is BTFO by any contemporary gen 3 device>Good digital NV would be insanely usefulIn what way?>much better than analogHow?>as there's more that a digital system can do.And what can it do that analog already can't?
>>64635647>They've been getting better and better all the timeYes, but it's incremental to the point where if you keep upgrading (ex NVG-10 to NVG-30 to Nvg3rd to GNG2K) you'll have fallen into a "death loop" and spent analog money on a shitload of digital that doesn't hold value. That's how they play a lot of people.They come out with a new model just about every year. Unless you're willing to pay analog money, you'll either play the digital death loop or someone will wait a little longer than you and get a slightly better device for the same price.If they replace the GNG2K with a unit that has a 384 thermal sensor built in for under $600 (192 is more likely but unacceptable), it's a done deal however and digital will be able to compete properly with basic analog.>other downsidesAnother, final, issue is that digital NV has terrible, thermal-like battery life. At best you're getting 18 hours with that new NVG-90 Pro. A PVS-14 gets 72 hours off a single CR123. Analog is logistically easier to keep active in the field.>another downside!Most digital units, especially the cheap Binocks, also include stupid features like wifi / bluetooth streaming so you can basically do ghetto land warrior type stuff. Downside is that you know damn well this has a backdoor, meaning it can be remoted into and you can get basically stream-sniped.
How do you guys pack your IFAKs?Any item you put in there thats normal?How much Quikclot gauze should I have?
>>64628364Don't forget they're also hucking digital night vision.
>>64635678Run more than one TQ. Pack more gauze then you think you'll need. Example IFAKs on the right side of this infographic.
>>64635299LMAO, the depths of commercial bullshit the "based" brownoids sink to never cease to amaze.>>64635382>abbreviated and modified NIJ standardThe actual fuck? Once again I'm glad for the totalitarian dictatorship of Bad Vlad that actually enforces standards. Rzhevka labcoats come and take your plates, and they either pass the entire gachi dungeon of GOST 34286-2017 and emerge battered but unpenetrated, or they don't and you fuck off back to the drawing board.This looks like they tried to emulate testing to Br5 standard with B-32, but strike face shattered after the first hit so they stopped there and made up a special threat rating. Pussies.>>64635437https://usarmorforge.com/products/armor-forge-trauma-comfort-pads-sold-in-setsOh, look, a US-made CAP, probably made out of D3O non-Newtonian polymer and sweaty as fuck.
>>64635692>LMAO, the depths of commercial bullshit the "based" brownoids sink to never cease to amaze.AR500 is probably the worst armor manufacturer in the industry for us Americanskis. I'd rather run RMA honestly. Their dirty laundry list is a mile long and goes back over a decade. It would take two hours to explain their transgressions.>abbreviated and modified NIJ standardThis is normal. Because your average joe doesn't know how to read a test report, manufacturers and dealers will ask labs to test to an abbreviated or modified version of the standard all the time. Look at pic related LTC 19513. NIJ required shot spacing is minimum 51mm. Do you see anything funky?>This looks like they tried to emulate testing to Br5 standard with B-32I think they tried to, going off the weight and overall specs, come up with a competitor to the Protech 9812-R1 - which has been the best no-foam Level IV plate in the US for nearly twenty years.>Oh, look, a US-made CAP, probably made out of D3O non-Newtonian polymer and sweaty as fuck.I like how they're on a nearly 50% sale and only reduce BFD by 40% - you can get over 50% with those inflatable AA Shields - although I still don't think those are drop safe.
>>64635686Just going to copy paste the notes Ive been taking so far and see what everyone thinks:>Package 1x>Penlight 1x>Trauma shears 1x>Tourniquet 4x>Quikclot hemostatic gauze x?>Untreated gauze x? (Quikclot will suffice as packing material)>Chest seals 2x>NPA (28 French; different sizes needed for different people) 1x>Nitril gloves 1x>Mylar blanket 1x (Heat helps clot, trauma, etc; they sell nicer ones than Walmart elsewhere apparently)Instructions for untrained people>Casualty card - Whats wrong with this person, when, when treated, etc;>SharpieGoal of the kit is to be quick and immediate access, I assume stuff like eye cups can be in a separate compartment in my bag/trunk/house. This is for life-threatening emergency TCCC stuff.
>>64635714More than one pair of gloves.
>>64635718I keep seeing this, is there a reason for that?
>>64635719There's a saying that two is one and one is none. You want a backup set in case a glove rips.
>>64635382> Oh, look, a US-made CAP, probably made out of D3O non-Newtonian polymer and sweaty as fuck.Nigga stfu. It's HALO Jumpable! That means that it's easily worth $100. It's not a CAP, it's a HALO Jumpable sweaty plastic pad. 50% off right now.
>>64635722How do you store the gloves in the kit? Usually I just take 2 from a box and wrap them in a rubber band
>>64635731>pic rel is worth at least $50This is like the FXR-Bravo positively buoyant plates (aka Hesco SC3812B?) that cost $4,200 a set, weigh 3.95lb, are an inch thick, and can't stop BZ API but that's okay because they float! https://www.tac11.com/shop/fxr-bravo-nij-level-rf2-e-1634
Also speaking of Armor Farce, their MK-VII Level 4 is $2,700/set and 4.8lb SAPI M (it'd be 4.6lb Swimmer M, so very comparable to the LTC 28595 - a B-32 API plate). It's also 0.61" thick, which is a very clear indicator the plate isn't drop safe for shit.That's kinda neat if you have a tight weight requirement and need a less-than-overt solution, but as seen with the 4SAS4, non-drop-safe plates can be killed by the mailman if they are improperly packed. Plates you can't drop aren't suitable for most purposes, IMHO.
>>64635748It's expensive because Hesco are gay af and only sell through dealers who hike the price by double.
ANONS help I need a flashlight. I had a Fenix that just randomly quit working. Disappointing because the Fenix I had prior to this one worked every day for 12 years. What's a good handheld for every day use (I frequently need to be able to see into tight dark spaces and compartments) that is rechargeable so I'm not burning through CR123s? Clippable to a hat and pocket would be ideal.
>>64635621>They'll never be on the level of analog.They will, and then you'll have all the advantages of a digital image sensor and processing on top of actual low-light performance.They're not there yet, and won't be for some years, so if you just need NV for normal NV things, get analog.>>64635678I don't have any of my field gear with me, but my "urban" IFAK that rides in my backpack is:- 2* CAT TQ- 1* 4" israeli bandage- 1* 12' z-fold gauze- 1* mylar blanket - 2* pair of nitrile gloves- assorted band-aids- iodine markerI'm thinking of adding a burn dressing and a pair of chest seals to match my field IFAK, and of course I need to beef up the gauze, but it's already quite a package. It's all in a pull-out subload in a lightweight pouch on an internal PALS grid in my backpack. The concept is I need to stabilize myself or one other person if I randomly end up in some MASCAL event like a drone strike or churka chimpout.>>64635708>Do you see anything funky?Let me guess: monolithic strike face with sub-par crack arresting layer, so they place 3 shots as far away from each other as possible?
>>64635678thats *not normalsorry
>>64635789>It's expensive because Hesco are gay afThey aren't super great when it comes to civilian sales and would probably do better if they did a Highcum and started a direct sales program.Their dealers are basically Sierra - which is basically one dude, Midwest - which can't ship for shit, Spiritus, Trex - which is probably going to go bust with Lucas gone, PRIME Armor - which is shady, and HCC. They have an annoying habit of not acknowledging special models as theirs, so they have a lot of weird shit like the Hesco 3812P, 3811 / 3811LV, 3801LV, SC3812, SC3812B, 3814, 4600LVC, 4403SC, and the infamous albeit older 1520, 3590, and 4520 - along with the long-rumored 4650 / 3885 - resulting in a confusing overall lineup.The dealers are mostly good about prices. Sierra for example has the 4601 for sale at $900/set, which is about where it should be, IMO.>>64635746That way is more than sufficient. People often just roll or stuff them in.>>64635790I have a Nicron N72-UV I really like.
I know Im the one asking the questions but I just wanted to say that I think a small makeup mirror should come in every IFAK or first aid kit. Its the only way you can realistically assess damage on your own head.
>>64635852Funny pic. Also 1.6kg is like 3.55 pounds, so which is it?
>>64635856Mirror is pretty fragile. You can add it to your own kit though from any store. Can come in useful.
>>64635814>They're not there yet, and won't be for some yearsIf I had a dime for every time someone said digital is going to catch up soon.>Let me guess: monolithic strike face with sub-par crack arresting layer, so they place 3 shots as far away from each other as possible?On the money. Companies will often fuck with shot spacing and location to try and maximize how it'll look on a report. Plus, it also reveals the LTC 19513 is sorta-kinda-not-really edge-to-edge if you look at the BFD numbers. Shot #1 is closest to the edge and looks to be outside the 6x8" fair hit zone, and it's pulling nearly double the BFD, which suggests the ceramic is thinned. LTC is a very reputable armor company, but they don't try very hard with the civilian-oriented plates. Many of them are 0101.04 holdouts. The .06 26605 has been suspended (and reinstated) by the NIJ twice and pic related in >>64635708 is basically the sole proof several vendors are relying on to say the .06 19513 stops M855A1. It was never originally designed to do so - same with the Protech 2120-5. That could have been a really good 19513. Do we know if it was dropped? We don't. Do we know if this sample size one is applicable to every 19513 ever made, including those on a Monday? We don't. The 19513 isn't even certified as a III.It's why I think the Hesco 3411, even though it's heavier, is a better plate. NIJ cert as a III, stops M855A1 and BZ API with 51mm min. spacing going off Hesco's documentation. Like it or not, Hesco controls the III+ (M855 + M193 or M855A1) market unless you're either broke (at which point Gilliam or Militech controls) or you have PBZSA / CR6450SA money. The 3811 is the lightest white-side M855 stopper, plus is NIJ-certified to stop 6x M80 even dropped.
>>64635877Actual number as of today is 3.4lb or 1.76kg, which is about 3.87lb. Verrett's, which has an exclusive on the 3811, says 3.6lb / 1.6kg, but they also say the 3811LV is standalone when it's not (all Hesco LV plates are ICW IIIA as a rule).I think Hesco is just very american and cannot use kilograms. I'd hold them to the 3.4lb number and raise hell if it goes over that by any non-nominal amount.
>>64635856Mirrors are underrated kit. Tardigrade Industries, the makers of the 5lb steel face shield, makes a picatinny mirror you can either use to look behind you or help with handling corners. Could run it unattached for IFAK purposes.>>64635878I remember seeing a pic here a while ago of a SWAT officer with a bus mirror rigged to his shotgun for CQB purposes.
>>64635929> Tardigrade Industries, the makers of the 5lb steel face shieldlol, I had forgotten about that abomination. IIIA+!
>>64635940Listen pal it's rated for .223 of some kind at some velocity - only face shield in the world rated for that!You want it? It's yours my friend, only if you have $699.00 - on sale from $995.00!https://armoredoptics.com/products/maxilla-maxillofacial-protection
>>64635929>unattached for IFAK purposesThere are probably better multi-use options for that which you may already have in your kit depending on your role. Like a signal mirror or a camo compact.
>>64635950True, but can they do this?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rz1Z9eFkc8A
The tardigrade operator must also be pretty poor from buying that face mask, he's got a $20 amazon special red dot on his AR. Dude's holding himself back with gear like that clearing a warehouse from NFS Most Wanted.
>>64635988The other day, I saw a watergun for sale with that exact red dot sight. This is not a joke.
>>64636041This one is red.
>>64635929A 4$ mirror from the dollar tree will more than sufficeImagine buying a tactical mirror
>>64636144Yeah but it didn't contribute to raiding a mid-2000s piss filter shinedown music video
Aliexpress is running a sale on knockoff LAP panels. The big one fits either soft armor panels or a very rare Ceradyne plate (which is so rare it's basically like saying go get a pair of Ceradyne 96034s if you need lightweight IV+ swimmers), small one fits a 6x6. Both are under $25 a pop. Hoplite has offered to have LTC make new plates for them in the past, but it'll be a custom job and probably $$.If you want larger rifle protection for the family jewels, Sabado makes an 8x10" (allegedly some Ukrainians wear 8x10 Hesco plates using this) and DMGEAR's XL accepts 10x12s. Obviously the Sabado and DMGEAR will accept soft armor in those cuts if running plates is a non-starter due to weight.UARM sells Level IV deltoids now, among other options. They're a touch shady as a company. https://uarmprotection.com/product/level-iv-shoulder-silicon-carbide-2We live in the silver age of extremity armor, enjoy it.
>>64634278>the paper doesn't clean.this is why I have a bidet, if you get shit on your hands you wash them, you dont just wipe them on a piece of tissue and call it good
>>64636214dude I got the single ply from costco and it gave me certified shitfinger. Now my mechanix gloves look like I gave a tactical prostate exam.
Never thought to ask this question.What gear can you skimp on, and what gear should you spend on?
>>64636221bidet also reduces how much tp you go throughwith the savings you can spring for that second ply
>>64636258skimp on pouchesspend on armor, carrier and ifak
>>64636269also you can skimp on commshoward lieght+ baofeng + trucker mic
>>64636258The anon who wrote >>64636269 is bang-on. You can skimp on pouches unless they need to be NIR-compliant (so they don't glow like a lighthouse under IR) or they need to be exceptionally load-bearing and hold up to strenuous use. 1. A cheap carrier versus a good carrier is a good QoL difference.2. Armor is 100% the biggest "do not fuck yourself" area. The armor industry operates on an almost uniquely high level of shady.3. Fake TQs will bite you in the ass when you need them most. The Chinese are improving, allegedly, and they've got a new ratchet-wheel TQ (pic rel), but the jury is majorly out on that one.4. You can skimp on a radio unless you need it to have certain functions or meet certain requirements. Plenty of people skate by on UV-5Rs. If you need actually private comms with digital modes, P-25 I and II, and AES-256 then you need to spring.>TL;DRThink about how much you'll depend on X to save your ass if you get into a bind. If you're totally reliant on it, do NOT skimp (obv armor and what carries it). If it'll never logically be a point of concern, you can skimp.
Best place to skimp on pouches?Top tier airsoft suppliers?How the fuck do I tell if X is IR compliant or not?
>>64636310>Best place to skimp on pouches?Aliexpress my man.>Top tier airsoft suppliers?Idogear, DMGear, Shekkin, Excellent Elite Spanker, and Emerson.>How the fuck do I tell if X is IR compliant or not?If they don't say you'll need to see if someone has already bought one and looked at it under IR illum. For example, I have a "50L" chinese pack that glows like a motherfucker. Also, by the way, the Chinese are often dishonest about bag capacity - they aren't the only ones who play games about that either.
>>64636310I enjoy aliexpress clones of spiritus pouches
>>64636322I have two Chinese mutants that are rock solid. Also, if you need to skimp you can turn to used policesurp off of ebay. Sometimes prices are really good and the armor, even when expired, is often more reputable than some Chinese outfits. Pouches, especially milsurp, are super cheap.Obviously you have to use your head with armor. Soft armor before 0101.06 (2008) needs to be checked for Zylon. Anything UHMWPE is going to be hinky if it was potentially stored in a car trunk in Texas for too long. Plates you have to watch for recalled and defective models. I saw a pair of Ceradyne 92547s not too long ago. They were excellent performers new but suffered from a delamination issue making them useless. Helmets are a solid deal more often than not. Also, Ebay has a rule where you can't sell anything Level IV or above, so you have to get creative with search terms.Moreover, if you get fucked Aliexpress usually hangs you out to dry. Ebay is EXTREMELY biased towards buyers if you play your cards correctly. If anything is materially different from how the seller described it, you can get a free return and your money back as long as the issue is substantial. INAD returns.
>>64636310>Best place to skimp on pouches?surplus
>>64631187Armor deal #2. Dude on tacswap is selling a pair of LTC 28550s for $1,400. These are 5.3lb 10x12 swimmers rated for 2x 7.62x39 BZ API or 1x 7.62x54R B-32 API. The 28595's granddad, basically. Rating is similar to the RMA XRT but the LTC is going to overall be a better performer. IMO, $1,400 is high given the age and obsolescence of the plates. The guy probably knows that and might be willing to go down. $1,000 would be fair.https://www.tacswap.com/post/691c16aaf761780ed3944e5f
>>64635678I put a MARCH resupply in mine desu
Armor deal #3 (this one is sorta-kinda a deal since the plates normally go for $2k). Dude on ebay is selling a pair of VelSys PBZSAs made in the PULV covert cut. $1,800. He sold at least one pair prior to this so I'm not going to ask where he got multiple sets of this from.https://www.ebay.com/itm/297826166822
>>64636430Excuse me for asking, but what do you mean by that?
>>64636447Sorry. MARCH resupplies are the issued "resupply" kit for your standard issued IFAK. A friend of mine tactically acquired one for me and I stuffed it into my AWS IFAK using a surplus IFAK insert
>>64636447NTA, but probably something like this:https://rescue-essentials.com/march-tccc-ifak-refill-module/
Also this guy is selling a pair of ESBI side plates out the side of his car for just over $200 shipped.>>64636361Based.
>>64636264This man understands the meaning of advanced warfare.
>>64636469He needs drug money or something? >>64636435What are these?
Anyone carrying medical with their EDC, how are you going about it? Belt clip mini IFAK, cankle medkit, fanny pack, prison wallet?
>>64628339I like emerson G3, their G3s are pretty nice for the price. They have some that use US materials that are NIR compliant
>>64636533>He needs drug money or something?Well it's a fresh ebay account and he's got more than two so I'll let you be the judge. The price is super low and the presentation is quarter-assed so he clearly needs these to move and fast.>What are these?The Velocity Systems PBZSA, which is a 0.52" thick, 4.15lb SAPI M plate rated to defeat M855A1, 7.62x51mm M80, or 7.62x39mm BZ API. It's been the dominant "M855A1 + M80" plate on the market for a few years if you have $2k. It's like a slightly upgraded Tencate CR6450SA and competes favorably against the LTC 28791. The only plates that compete with it are the LSAPI (3.5lb, same rating but raised BFD limit to 62mm) and LTC's replacement for the 28791, which is projected to do the same thing but 4lb. Last competitor is the Hesco SC3812, which drops BZ API protection but weighs 3.8lb SAPI M and is much thicker. This guy is selling the PBZSAs in a cut like pic related VS-PXULV meant for a covert carrier. These are very likely SOCOM issue.The PXULV is a featherweight all-PE plate rated for just 7.62x39mm MSC. 1.5lb and under 0.4" thick.
>>64636545I have one in my car. I don't need to haul around an ifak. I don't live in a 3rd world country.
>>64636545If you have a daily backpack, that's a great place for a real kit. The tourniquet, if you're going to have on, belongs on you somewhere. I carry mine in the back pocket with the red tip exposed because it's not a gun, it's not weird, and there's a band saw right over there that any one of us might lose a finger on if we're too complacent.
Patiently waiting for 4600 anon to give us the results of his shoot test of the $180 4600s he got from Botach.
>>64628389I had pic rel queued up but op is a ninja.
