>mogs your puny weak little capitalist bolt locking lugs
>>64685674China has never won a war vs anyone but itself.
>>64685674Yet it is still mogged in ergonomics by a rifle designed in the 60's
>>64685674>mogs your puny weak little capitalist bolt locking lugsless lugs less accuracy
>>64685674why is a rifle the newest propaganda item? rifles don't win wars, doctrine does. besides, cabbage made a great video about the 191 years before the PLA released their latest fluff piece.
>>64685714Why hasn't anyone made hundred lugs? Maybe thousand? Unlimited accuracy.
>>64685727Interrupted screw breeches have existed for a hundred years.
>>64685674it's garbage :it has to rotate more to unlockthe trunnion has to be larger in diameter to accommodate with fewer but bigger lugseffort on the base of the lug is greater because of lever effect
>>64685727interrupted thread artillery
>>64685718>why is a rifle the newest propaganda item?whats funny is that the 191 is like ten years old now.
>>64685718Chang is scraping the barrel because no one thinks random concepts and bodykits are implessive.
>>64685704>50s
>>64685683Tibet.
>>64685843>Tibet>anyone but itself
>>64685843China claims Tibet as an integral part of its own historical territory, so the claim stands.
>>64685714>>64685755>>64685763If more lugs provided more accuracy wouldn't you see that in benchrest rail gun shooting?
>>64685674>has to use 200% material thickness due to chinesium>still keyholes at 3 meterslollmao even
>>64685759All else being equal fewer lugs provide more locking surface area for a given trunnion size.This is because between the trunnion lugs and the locking lugs there has to exist a certain clearance for reliable function. Therefore the more lugs you have, the more this clearance will eat at your surface area.And when it comes to strength in general, a four lug design is obviously better than a seven lug design because the four lug design automatically has a space for the extractor while maintaining symmetricity which means a more equal loading of the lugs unlike with the 7 lug setup where the lugs next to the extractor are a weak point.
>>64685846>>64685847LMAO at you guys. Tibet was an independent nation before China conquered it.
>>64685727>WhyClassified.
>>64685683>China has never won a war vs anyone but itself.But, didn't they technically also lose 1/2 those? To put it another way, 1/2 the people lost half the time, which added together is a 100% loss.
>>64685847>claimsI have just claimed the 2 moons of Mars and btw will be changing thier names to Debbie and Dallas..
>>64685943>conqueredBig if true. For all the 'Free Tibet' stickers I see, doubt.
>>64685718I think it's meant to mock the spear>Our rifle...just works.
>>64685947It's a distinctly chinese phenomenon for a foreign power to somehow win your civil war
>>64685992Rodg.
>its over for america!!! chinese guns have... fewer locking lugs!!!!Maybe the resident wumaos got their pay cut and stopped putting any effort into their posts as a way of quiet quitting.
>>64686044The Chinese have a superior infantry rifle and all you can do is cope.
>>64685915If you don't think picrel are stress risers you are out of your mind. Also, "symmetry," not 'symmetricity'.
>>64686049zhuan from texas province here, this post has convinced me that china is not pathetic but actually very strong
>>64685674>>64686049So you are implying QBZ191 on Mars? Doubt.
If only I had a rifle with massive lug nuts.
>>64686049did you just admit to simping for foreign nationals? sad.
>>64685674it's 5.56 who cares
>>64685759>>64685915No-one mentioned steel case which is the elephant in the room. RHS is more force wide tolerances (wide is good). Steel case is unforgiving it needs that.
My supressed bargain bin .300 from PSA doesn't keyhole as badly as the PLA service rifle...
>>64685947
Is this the guy with the Japanese grandfather or is he still on vacation from his meltie?
>>64685759those are both good things
>>64685951Have you, your ancestors or political predecessors ever stepped foot there?
If you ever want to know how incompetent the Chinese military is just read up on the sino-vietnamese war. China will never be a real military threat to anyone except Tibet.
>>64686049I install home Air Conditioning for a living. You can guess which country I’m grateful to be living in.
>>64685674it takes approximately the same force to shear either one
>>64685674So, a bolt design that only uses a tiny fraction of it's potential extraction area is somehow superior?Get the fuck out of here you wumao fuck.
>>64685683youtu.be/26cly3TZltg?youtu.be/RlQVz1vRYts?youtu.be/KBHhsAnxubQ?youtu.be/Fr1zRFbFr8Y?youtu.be/JE5-c7y383s?
Why do we care when the right will never see any real combat?
>poor man shortcutIf 4 lugs were good than Mr Stoner would have designed with it.
>>64686788>outnumber the enemy 5/1>still take disproportionately enormous casualties>fail to achieve stated strategic goals>fail to achieve stated tactical goals>fail to achieve stated political goals>son and heir of the great dictator gets roasted alive by American napalm, ending the dynasty before it began>only continue to exist because the enemy shows restraint and doesn't deploy their unrivaled super-weapons because burning entire nations would be bad for their public image>forced to sign peace treaty that both sides find humiliating, effectively declaring the war a draw>seethe about it for decades>retroactively decide that "Nu-uh, we actually won that fight! No, I'm not going to elaborate on what was actually won, or how."How in the fuck does this count as "winning"?It's somehow even more pathetic than when the Soviets picked a fight with tiny little Finland, took enormous losses of men and equipment, failed to achieve any of their real goals, and only managed to secure a fraction of the territory they originally wanted.
>>64685683Well they did have a few wierd wars with India where first the Indians ran away, then the Chinese occupiers ran back to China. And there was that war with Vietnam nobody talks about, it's debatable who won, the Chinese won in military terms but somehow lost both tactically and strategically because again... they just retreated to China. Then there was the Tibetan uprising, which China crushed pretty conclusively, but it's debatable whether Tibetan rebels even constitute am army at any point or whether Tibet is even a country. Then there was that incident in Korea where the Russians, Chinese and Americans ended up attacking each other directly. But it was unclear if that was accidental, constituted friendly fire, who's territory it occurred on. Nobody seemed to have won out lost anything, and it doesn't seem like anyone even had orders to engage someone just lost their nerve. China arguably won the Gobi campaign because Russian invaders withdrew completely. But the Russians didn't really suffer any military losses, and seemed to withdraw on a diplomatic basis. Like they just sort of got lost on their way to Nepal and ended up in China by accident. It's hard to navigate in a desert.China invaded a part of myanmar. Nobody wants to talk about that, like it's some big secret. The satellite footage of the region is all blacked out and its hard to see why Google cares. But it seems someone had a war there, and as Chinese troops are there right now, it stands to reason that China won that war... whoever they were fighting. The wierd part is that the Burmese army denies having been there before, the Chinese army denies currently being there.I'm beginning to suspect China actually has two separate armies. The main one, which never wins and always loses, and some kind of second army, which everyone runs away from, but then runs away from nothing itself.
>>64686088Disregarding the truth in favor of blind jingoism does no good for your nation.
>>64686076Obviously not an equally significant stress riser.On the AR-15 not only are the lugs made weaker by the extractor cut, they also experience a higher load due to the missing lug. A double whammy.
Also the issue with having 4 lugs is that the bolt has further to rotate to get into battery. The upside is less machining, greater tollerence for fouling, greater % of engagement if it's not fully in battery. But you get thermal issues with larger metal parts expanding more, specifically a greater heat diferencial.So if the rifle is really cold on the outside, shrunken, and the bolt is really hot, expanded, there's an awkward number of rounds where the bolt lugs might jam, at least, until the other parts warm up or the bolt cools down. But this can lead to a third issue, where the rifle jams out of battery, then fires out of battery, which tends to destroy the mag and blow off the dust cover. It's an issue common to a number of rifles.
>>64686894>But you get thermal issues with larger metal parts expanding more, specifically a greater heat diferencial.>So if the rifle is really cold on the outside, shrunken, and the bolt is really hot, expanded, there's an awkward number of rounds where the bolt lugs might jam, at least, until the other parts warm up or the bolt cools down.Nonsense>But this can lead to a third issue, where the rifle jams out of battery, then fires out of battery, which tends to destroy the mag and blow off the dust cover. It's an issue common to a number of rifles.Nonsense. Rifles do not fire oit of battery. The firing pin cannot contact the primer unless the bolt is fully locked.
Aren't AR15 bolt lugs legitimately somewhat weak? Think I read that somewhere.
>>64686928Only really relevant if you try to fire the rifle with its barrel totally blocked. Typically a squib. Due to modern ammo quality both squibs and overpressure rounds are very rare in the first place. And in these cases, one rifle part or another must fail. Better it be the bolt lugs, which are in the housing, and because the bolt can be replaced. Better than say... getting parts of an AK gas system lodged in your face, or parts of the grip/barrel protruding through your hand, or the entire bolt flying backwards through your neck.
Imagine be so poor that you make a shitter bolt only to save a few minutes of machinig.
>>64686928Yeah AR15 bolt lugs are known to shear off after a certain round count. They're undersized and even the best steel you can use for them with a good heat treat eventually breaks.Rifle designs after the AR15 have beefed them up significantly.>>64686999>Only really relevant if you try to fire the rifle with its barrel totally blocked. Typically a squib. Due to modern ammo quality both squibs and overpressure rounds are very rare in the first place.>And in these cases, one rifle part or another must fail.Uh, no.Germany introduced into NATO a requirement for "Geschossvorlagenfähigkeit", the ability to drive out a squib stuck in the barrel with another round without a failure, since this will feasibly happen with automatic military rifles. The official document is not publicly available on the internet, but I have seen it cited in reputable books.All rifles made for the german army like the G3, G36, G95 have this ability.The M4/M16 do not.>Better it be the bolt lugsSuch a catastrophic failure is inherently dangerous to the user. The upper receiver will then fail, and shrapnel will fly into your face.
>>64686844Dubs that the Chinese are culturally terrified by, no Wumao may quote this post for he fears death.
>>64685911>>64686124Ah I see you too are a connoisseur of me ebin /r/NCD reddit maymays about me China. To coherently claim that the 191 keyholes because of some vague nonsense about "muh corruption" (how the fuck are you supposed to embezzle money by not properly rifling barrels?) Or "muh chineisum, quick question, where was the electornic device you're using made?) You have to hold the position that the Chinese were perfectly capable of rifling the barrels of All three Type 56's (SKS, AK, RPD), Type 81's, QBZ-95's and all th variants thereof, QZB-03's, all their machineguns and handguns but were suddenly magically unable to press the "rifle the barrel" button on the rifling machine since 2019 because the universe struck them all retarded. What's more likely 1. Rubber bullet training ammo used for CQB practice keyholes 2. The Chinese are not able to incorporate a firearms feature that has been practiced for centuries and were perfectly always to do before 2019 Even the most jingoistic retard has to admit they're being retarded about this.
>>64687042You've upset me with your semantic arguments and autistic knowledge. Because at sea level there's no difference between the bolt designs, the soviet ones are easier to manufacture and have a longer theoretical service life- but are more prone to critical failure. At sea level, it's a non issue. But in the Himalayas there are specific issues with temperature differential on the larger AK style lugs at the adjusted high altitude operating pressure. The AKs can be slammed into battery when they really shouldn't, and will suffer a non-trivial rate of failure.It's only a few thousands of an inch, but it's a consistent issue with the AK bolts. Tolerances are too loose, beefy steel parts shrink, you're working with adjusted gas pressures, operators smash them into battery when they're full of frozen sandgrit, you get a non trivial rate of OOB.So in the technical discussion about locking lugs, that's the only context i think it's relevant and that's my experience.
>>64686885Someone ran an LMT E-Bolt for 28k rounds and it hasn't sheared a lug yet
>>64687104It's a meme you dip.Not meant to be taken seriously.
>>64686928Yes. Which is why pretty much all military oriented AR-15/18 derived designs take some steps to make the bolt stronger.Stoner was a fucking hack.
>>64687124>lobster tailPretty clear where the Chinese drew inspiration from.
>>64687179>Stoner was a fucking hack.Wow how brave and stunning
>>64687194Bolt strength is the one thing pretty much all bolt action rifle designers got right.And then comes along this fucker with his newfangled autoloader who thinks he's above all that basic shit and designs a rifle with the weakest bolt known to man.
>>64686882>Disregarding the truth in favor of blind jingoism does no good for your nation.Debatable.
>>64686302Doesn't matter. If (they) can just make up claims, so can I. Also, you now owe me.taxes.
>>64686473Saudia Arabia?
>>64687036Ghis is what it comes down to. And coping it is superior to have more reciprocal mass because your designers are uninspired, communist monkeys.
>>64687179Bum companies enlarging the bolt face of a standard AR-15 bolt for accommodating a larger round will never not be funny.
>>64686049Man don't make me defend the fucking AR-15
>>64687187Another key point on the LMT bolt Lug number 4 is sheared down enough to the point where it's essentially a symmetrical 6 lug bolt larping as a 7 lug bolt. And it's made out of some proprietary supersteel that's massively overbuilt with relief cuts to boot. The Stoner action also relieves some stress on the bolt through his internal gas piston magic where the bolt is pressed forward towards the barrel extension when firing so IMO I don't immediately believe that 4 giant ass lugs are immediately better and stronger than 7 smaller lugs if you factor that in, especially not when using an improved bolt design like the LMT E-bolt. Stoner was REALLY good at optimizing shit and he totally got away with using smaller lugs, it does pretty damn well for running 58,000 PSI+ ammo.
>>64687115Ohh ching chong ping ling
calling it now, as soon as any kind of conflict over taiwan happens /k/ will be flooded with "oldfags" claiming to support china and that actually china is the good guy like what happened when russia invaded ukraine. then when they can't get a foothold they will move over to (lefty)/pol/ and congregate in their /chtg/ thread and circlejerk over their pedo commie memes while /thg/ will post endless videos of PLA soldiers getting droned.
Why worry? No chink rifle is going to shoot that much. Not in peace, not in war. Manage steel QC.
>>64686878>I'm beginning to suspect China actually has two separate armies. The main one, which never wins and always loses, and some kind of second army, which everyone runs away from, but then runs away from nothing itself.kek
