What would Ukraine need exactly to achieve Air Dominance over it's own territory.I think there was once a discussion abut it here, I don't remember the details but it seemed like it was a complicated process, requiring a lot of specialized air frames with specialized equipment, used in a precise and well coordinated manner, something few playas can pull off.A few modern jets with some modern pods & rockets aren't enough, or so I remembered.
>>6488549340 F-16. Not 6. Not 12. 40 or 50 F-16. And dozen Typhoon.
MANPADS
>>64885503That's what I thought. Will the NATO AWACS that cruise near the Ukraine border be of any help in reclaiming the occupied, eastern part of Ukraine, or is it too far due to distance and/or earth curvature?
>>64885518Maybe you could google radar horizons....
>>64885493A miracle/thread
>>64885550Good Idea.
>>64885493politicially its impossible actually.
>>64885493A hell of a lot more planes.
>>64885645>>64885503There's surely more to that.
>>64885866>Their air defense network has been heavily attrited
>>64885866How well are them Mirages and Gripens integrated with western systems, can they be used along F16 in the battle for air superior-titty?
>>64885866ukraine's air defense network isn't attrited, more like it's saturated with the drone spam against civilian targetsrussians have little capability of waging an aerial campaign against anything other than civilian targetsstill, what little they have is enough to keep ukraine's air force at bay--until russia's air defenses are wiped out
>>64885866
>>64885885>until russia's air defenses are wiped outWill it ever happen?
>>64885896good progress is being made >>64885868
>>64885882The issue with those aircraft are 1) whose going to donate them and 2) training. The F-16 hasn’t made a real splash at all save for shooting down a few cruise missiles and drones in the eastern part of Ukraine
>>64885897Sadly scores like that are quite rare.
>>64885963Russian air defence is becoming quite rare
a miracle
>>64885963yeahbut that was the case when russia had western quality satellite communicationsmuch longer vulnerability windows now
>>64885963"Quite rare" nowadays because Tors have become an endangered species already, you forgot to mention.
>>64885493>defined by NATO and the United States Department of Defense as the "degree of air superiority wherein the opposing air force is incapable of effective interference".But the russians has been incapable of interference over Ukranian territory for years, almost since from the very beginning. Shooting a drone/missile through someones air space does not equal an control of air power.
>>64885493In no particular order >Trump and his 5th columnist collaborators are removed from office, and are replaced by someone who understands that TZD is the moderate position >NATO/free Europe finds their balls and sends in a few fighter squads, and peace keeping regiments with IRST radars and AWACs to do BVR shenanigans and enforce a No Fly Zone (which should have been done day fucking one)>MOAR AA systems with competent crews>MOAR MANPADS>MOAR crews and pilots for F-16s to SEAD and Wild Weasel, and F-15s for TOTAL MIGGER/KINZHAL DEATH >Priority targeting of Shasneed production sites>more glowie ops and pilot assassinations (it's a hell of a lot easier and cheaper than shooting them down)Anyone else, feel free to add on.
>>64885868>that heart reticleUkies have a fun sense of humor.
>>64885831Yes. All the personal, and technical equipment that would come with 40 birds
>>64885942nigga they already have an agreement with sweden and france to buy 100 gripens and 100 rafales. they also already trained pilots on those airframes in anticipation of the deal
>>64885493>Substantial awacs fleet>substantial A/D platforms with well trained and disciplined troops to operate them>Substantial fleet of attack helicopter fleets>Substantial fleet of drones to offset potential gaps in their air force>Double/triple digit fleets of modern F-16s, Gripens, etc. >Eyes on 5th gen platforms such as F-35 and KAAN>Work being done to start up 6th gen platforms>Wide variety of munitions that comes from multiple sources, not singular sourced bespoke munitions>Well trained and disciplined ground crews and pilots>Healthy and spread out aviation industry to maintain and supply all of the aboveYou'll need 10+ years to make this happen even in the most break neck speed sense of things, but it's doable if Ukraine plans out industrial investments and proper multinational deals that involve their airforce being involved in purchases of platforms and sending their guys to international military air exercises
>>64885503This + a heap of weapons to go with them, SEAD / DEAD munitions, A2A missiles, SDBs, JSOWs ect.
>>64885493Likely ~120+ multirole airframes, even more trained pilots, a huge pile of modern munitions of various types and bases that are out of range of russian strikes.At least half a dozen AEW platforms.An improved IADS.
It still fucking enrages me that we haven't just straight given Ukraine a few squadrons of F35s flown and maintained by Western "volunteers" like the Russians did in>Korea>Egypt>Vietnam>Literally every proxy conflict
>>64885585Nice image, for some reason I thought the range would be longer
>>64885503needs to be a system that can reliably down hundreds of cheap drones every night for months or years, this sounds too expensive to be a realistic strategy
>>64885493Are you talking about those long range suicide drones? Just build your own and bomb their factories. If you can't reach those then bomb the launch sites, train yards, bridges, anything that you can reach really. Or just build them bigger so you can reach.
I refuse to believe that heavy concrete and steel fortifications are completely obsolete especially in a setting like Ukraine, At what point are people going to realize that hinging survivability entirely on running away isn't always the best solution?IF it's possible to defend a ship or fleet then it's possible to build an effective heavy fortification because nearly every technology used to defend ships works even better in a static fortification where there are no weight or space constraints.
>>64888075Wrong thread? Retarded?Concrete and steel fortifications are playing a massive role in the Ukraine war.
>>64888080I haven't seen them employ anything more sophisticated than some really basic bitch precast concrete pillboxes. I don't even think they're placing that many of them when they might as well go full Albania mode.
>>64885891I think taking out the repetition makes it stronger.
