What was the absolute, most miserable environment to fight in during WW2?
Burma, and it's not even close.
>>64908360agreed. no one got malaria fighting through Europe
>>64908358New Guinea if you were Japanese. On a sub if you were German. In the 8th Air Force if you were American. Burma if you were British. Everywhere if you were Soviet. In the Soviet Union for the rest of the European Axis.
>>64908360Miserable? There's no time for misery, old top. Chin up and pop the kettle on, there's a good lad.
>>64908413Tea, sir? In this weather? Can't we ring up the Yanks and see if they have some ice cream to spare?
>>64908360FPBPKokoda Track might've been as bad at points, but it didn't last long in comparison.
>>64908360>>64908413Britfags begging for their participation trophy
From everything I’ve read, the Arctic conveys were absolutely fucking awful. Probably top three along with being on a German sub and fighting against the Japanese on the ground in general.
>>64908459Nah, just calling it how it is. The Pacific campaign had better logistics and support, so more ways to offset the misery. For the Russian winter of '40-'41 you could at least start a fire; it's a lot harder to turn the temperature and humidity down. Burma was all the shitty parts of Vietnam, but with worse support and equipment, and more mountains.
>>64908358France. >liberate Paris>have to hang back and pretend like France did anything all>muh resistance>pretend like half the nation weren't actively supporting the axis>de Gaulle never shutting the fuck up>not allowed to shoot every frog and raze Paris
>>64908459Kek. What a miserable life you must lead.
>>64908469>>64908486Fighting alongside smelly Indians doesn't make Burma the most horrific theater in WW2, I'm sorry to tell you.
Depends on what your metrics are. Pure human savagery, Pacific campaign no doubt. I think the experiences Eugene Sledge describes in combat on Pelilu or Okinawa in The Old Breed are probably as visceral as the common man will be able to understand. >"The fierce struggle for survival in the abyss of Peleliu had eroded the veneer of civilization and made savages of us all." >"Time had no meaning, life had no meaning. The war was a netherworld of horror from which escape seemed less and less likely as casualties mounted and the fighting dragged on and on."
>>64908459The KMT did most of the fighting in Burma
>>64908491>>64908461>>64908469The Japanese themselves said Burma was like hell and New Guinea was even worse.Japanese post war movies like Fires on the Plain show Japanese soldiers suffering subhuman conditions and even killing and eating other Japanese to survive.Japanese soldiers killed and ate each other in Papua according to Taiwan Aboriginal soldiers sent there.A Taiwan Aboriginal named Buyan Nawi saw Japanese kill each other and eat each other's flesh.
>>64909177
>>64908358>>64908404>>64908461>>64908508>>64909177Moro Muslims used bladed weapons (keris, bolo) to slaughter Japanese and hack them to death.https://www.positivelyfilipino.com/magazine/the-battle-of-tamparan-and-the-forgotten-moro-heroes-of-world-war-ii>The Battle Of Tamparan>In September 1942, the Maranaos dealt the Japanese a stunning loss when, in a spontaneous attack, a collection of villagers armed primarily with blades nearly annihilated an entire company of Japanese infantry. The Battle of Tamparan was the gravest defeat inflicted on the Imperial Japanese Army by irregular forces in the Philippines and quite likely their greatest loss at the hands of civilians in the entire course of the Pacific War. For the Japanese infantry, it was a defeat as improbable, shameful, and symbolically charged as that suffered by the U.S. cavalry at the Battle of the Little Bighorn but, unlike that iconic defeat, it has been mostly lost from history.>Some soldiers attempted unsuccessfully to surrender. One of the company’s officers, First Lt. Atsuo Takeuchi, made it back to the pier with a few of his men, but the boat crews, who were forced laborers, had dived overboard when they saw how the battle was going. With no way to escape, he dropped his sword and raised his hands in submission. Takeuchi had been very active in propaganda efforts among the Maranaos and had often bragged that the Japanese, unlike the Americans and Filipinos, never surrendered. According to Edward Kuder, an American colonial official hiding with the Maranaos, and the only contemporary chronicler of the battle, one young Maranao remembered those boasts and yelled, “No surrender, Takeuchi!,” before cutting him down with his sword.>Of the 90 Japanese infantrymen who marched down the Tamparan pier that morning, 85 now lay dead on the muddy lakeshore; their lacerated bodies, sprawled individually or tangled together in clumps of blood-soaked khaki, dotted the trampled grey marshland.
>>64909300>>64909303pp. 66-68.藤岡, 明義『敗残の記』中公文庫、1991年。 NCID BN07275250。That's Japanese text from the diary of Japanese soldier Fujioka Akiyoshi who admits Moros slaughtered the Japanese on Jolo.He said Japanese morale totally broke down, Japanese soldiers fought each other for supplies and he and other soldiers desperately tried to find the Americans to surrender as Moros massacred them.Totally different from weeb and nip incel fantasy of Japanese warriors fighting to the end.Fujioka says he and the other Japanese survivors desperately tried to surrender to the Americans since the Moro Tausug were slaughtering them.97-99% of the 6,000 Japanese soldiers died in Jolo.Moro Muslim fighters with keris (daggers) and bolo (machetes) annihilated the Japanese army at the battles of Tamparan in 1942 and Jolo in 1944-1945.Japanese soldiers like Fujioka Akiyoshi admitted to being slaughtered like animals by the Moros and their morale completely broke down and Japanese soldiers fought each other.Taiwan Aboriginal soldier Buyan Nawi said he saw Japanese Yamato soldiers kill each other and eat each other.Not eating dead corpses, but killing fellow Japanese for food.The Yamato Japanese starved to death and dehydrated and begged the Taiwan Aboriginals to use their skills to find food and water for them.
>>64909300>>64909303>>64909305The chain mail and segmented plate armour Stannis Baratheon wore in Game of Thrones is from Moro Muslim armor in Sulu archipelago and Mindanao. The Bangsamoro Tausug-Suluk, Maranao, Maguindanaon, Bajau-Sama Muslims.Moros used carabao horn for the plates.
>>64909177>>64909300>>64909303>>64909305Yes,yes. Very nice. HOWEVER,it cold.
>>64909330So is the eastern front
Russia.
Prolly ukraineT.it was miserable in 2022
>>64909177>>64909300>>64909305Japs are drama queens
probably being a plant manager in chicago. imagine being stuck in a floor full of muscular women who built millions of engines. air must be a psychotic drug that makes your dick pre cum just by the proximity.
>>64908358
>>64910247Imagine the smell.
>>64908358Winter War had over -40 C temperatures it was probably the most hellish condition you can imagine.
>>64908459>t. Joe Stillwell
>>64909300>Moro Muslims used bladed weapons (keris, bolo) to slaughter JapaneseAFAIK the typical and preferred weapon of the Moros was kris and barong, not the bolo
>>64908360This. Chindits were madmen.
>>64909177>>64909180https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fires_on_the_Plain_(1959_film)>He comes across Nagamatsu and Yasuda again. They claim to have survived on monkey meat and are living in the forest. Later, Nagamatsu goes out saying he will hunt more monkeys. When Tamura mentions he has a grenade, Yasuda steals it. Tamura leaves to find Nagamatsu and witnesses him attempting to shoot another man, realizing with a shock what the "monkey meat" really is. Nagamatsu turns the gun toward Tamura, who saves himself by pretending he still has the grenade. Nagamatsu tells Tamura they would be dead if they did not resort to cannibalism.>They head back to camp, but when Tamura mentions that Yasuda has his grenade, Nagamatsu says they will have to kill him or be killed. After tricking Yasuda into spending the grenade, Nagamatsu runs off and stakes out the only source of water in the area. After several days, Yasuda tries to bargain for water, to no avail. When he makes his way to the water anyway, Nagamatsu shoots him and begins butchering his body for meat. Tamura becomes disgusted and shoots Nagamatsu.
>>64909300>>64909303>>64909305
Manipur, Burma.Spent a lot of time there in the jungle, it's impenetrable even in comparison to other jungles. Amazon impenetrable.The war was characterised by infantry with no ass and no air spending months trying to hackers through what was left of the 1500s Burma road, nobody getting anywhere, everyone getting may malaria. I ran the golden triangle three times, thought that was bad. East Burma is seriously fucked up but not even that prepared me for himalchal Burma. There are very few people alive who can say they ran the golden triangle, Burmese jungle and Tibet, and we're all on a first name basis. Captain KMT, the triad, Chinese foreign intelligence (field), the tamadaw, shan warlords, none of us are necessarily enemies, just errand boys running in opposite directions. The manipur campaign, or the Burma campaign from the Japanese point of view, the longest theatre of ww2, Bar none. Years of godless jungle warfare. And then after Japan surrendered, their Burmese forces basically went rogue, and the whole region devolved into perpetual civil war which lasts until this day. Didn't check who holds the five hill river fort this week. Mandalay bridge probably still impassable for armour.
>>64910420>do anything other than sit next to a fire>freeze
>>64908360Agreed.The Pacific Islands were shit but each campaign was short with months of reset between each one.Burma was a continuous slog.PNG was long but once they closed the track the esst was slow mopping up.
>>64910420I've heard that extremely low temperatures don't feel like cold instead they feel like physical pain. Someone described it as having burning shards of glass sewn under your skin.
>>64908358ehhhhhhhh probably SE Asia
>>64912222More like extremely bad pins and needlesBut if you're already that exposed you will quickly develop frostbite and lose feeling anyways.
>>64908360I am very much inclined to agree, but I also think back to the anecdotes from the siege of Leningrad and would like your thoughts on what tips Burma over the scale when comparing the two?
>>64908358In terms of pure environment is definitely Burma or maybe Okinawa during the rainy season. But if you include the actual conditions of combat, its Russia.
Imagine going to war lmao couldn't be me
>>64909300>The Japanese responded to the battle by bombarding Maranao villages including Tamparan from air and artillery for 25 days, massacring civilian children and women Maranaos. 80 Maranao civilian children, women and men were killed in a mosque by a Japanese bomb.How did America react yo Little BigHorn
>none of these niggas even mention the arctic campaignsYeah, fighting on volcanic islands sucks.Yeah, fighting in tropical jungles sucks.Just surviving in barren desert with temperatures regularly dropping to around -50, so cold that gasoline freezes solid.A giant ice field suffering constant hurricane force winds during the coldest years of the 20th century, where you can't take a shit without literally freezing your nuts off, or getting eaten by a half-ton polar bear, sucks far worse.
>>64912531Please cool it with the antisemitism.
>>64909305Oh, someone summoned Spammy again.
>>64912222>>64912349It doesn't really feel like either, kinda hard to describe Just this dull ache and then your extremities go numb
>>64908413I mean, better a bong commander than motherfucking Stilwell.>By the time the town of Myitkyina was taken, only about 200 surviving members of the original Marauders were present. A week after Myitkyina fell, on 10 August 1944, the 5307th was disbanded with a final total of 130 combat-effective officers and men (out of the original 2,997). Of the 2,750 to enter Burma, only two were left alive who had never been hospitalized with wounds or major illness.
>>64908360100% this. and still would be today.
>>64912923In one book I read about Burma there was a story where and American, I think a Marauder, tried to shoot Stillwell lol
>>64908404>New Guinea if you were Japanesethe Japanese invasion of New Guinea is criminally slept on as the most disastrous strategic operation of WWII>don't undertake any recon or intelligence prep, base your invasion plan on a travel novel that claimed the kokoda track was an open valley cutting north-south>it actually crosses jungle, swamp, snowcapped mountains, and highlands>invade with a larger force than the combined Allied invasion of Sicily>get held off by a handful of Aussies and their conscripted cannibal headhunters>invasion force is immediately cut off from resupply>everyone is dropping dead from malaria, starvation or dysentery and resort to cannibalism just to not starve to death>you're either freezing to death fighting over some mountain pass above cloud level or sweating your balls off in a fetid swamp filled with crocodiles with no inbetween>end up losing your entire invasion force, with like 90% of the casualties due to starvation or preventable disease
>>64909300it's very funny how to nation of 'very honorabu 100000x folded nippon steel samurai ancestors' have some of the most genuinely embarrassing losses when it comes to bladed melee combat when they actually come up against anyone that isn't Japanese lol
>>64908360Yes. If even half the story of Ramree Island is true, that place and others like it were like a science fiction hellscape actively trying to kill everyone who went in there.
>>64908358pearl harbor. my great grandfather served there the entire war, and had a real had time keeping it up for all the wives left at home. a true american hero
>>64911296Yeah maybe if you're retarded (communist)If you are in a covered snow cave (literally just a slit trench in the snow, some boughs dragged over it, and some more snow piled on top) the temperature stays just under 0° C regardless of how cold it is on the outside. One of the reasons the soviets had such high casualties is because they were too stupid and ignorant to do this. Finns, meanwhile, kept their soldiers in these incredibly simple and easy to camouflage observation posts and didn't have any problems with the cold.Is this an oversimplification? Yes. But not by much.
>>64912923Shut the fuck up you absolute buffoon. You have no idea what the fuck you are talking about. Stilwell was only unpopular because he actually gave Chiang shit for wasting the precious supplies that the Brits and Americans sacrificed so much for to give to him, just for him to waste it in piecemeal attacks.Slim and stilwell saved the Burma campaign from retard faggot mountabatten and orde winggate a literal narcissistic faggot jew ass licker who was probably assassinated by his own men for his literal mal treatment of his own men, going out of the way to not rest them, not feed them and make them walk around naked for his own inspections.I hate fucking pop historian faggots like you who watched one youtube video probably titled something like "the forgotten campaign of ww2" and now you think you're expert.
>>64908358Pretty much everywhere the US was in the pacific. Imagine carrying all that gear in tropical conditions. In Europe? Everything east of Prague. Just vast forests and swamps. Finland was probably a nightmare for the Soviets. Good thing they invaded during winter, because most of that damn country is lakes and dense forests
>>64916462Dunno about "probably assassinated by his own men" but he was a dick,. His crazy ideas, when taken and handled/executed by more sensible and talented men (like Calvert), did produce spectacular results; though it is debatable how much they contributed. Stillwell was harsh but competent and hard enough to do a difficult job without shying away. Slim seemed like a good counterpart to him because he was militarily competent, enough to earn even some respect from Stillwell, but was far and away better equipped with the kinds of management and social skills to tard-wrangle and do the things Stillwell couldn't do well.
>>64916462>unironically defending StilwellLMAO.>Stilwell was only unpopular because he actually gave Chiang shit Stilwell was DESPISED by literally everybody he ever worked with, wether as an equal or as a superior. Chiang just happened to be the one who could push back harder than anybody else, and had more reason to do so especially after Stilwell literally tried to outright coup control of the NRA from him. And even then Chiang was if at all exceedingly retrained and merciful with the tard. Remind me, what's the punishment for mutiny against a superior officer under the UCMJ? Because Stilwell effectively tried to do exactly that while seconded to the NRA as a liaison.And if we're talking about wasting resources? You mean like Stilwell did with every fucking unit he was given direct command of, be it chinese, british or american? Slim saved the Burma campaign no thanks to Stilwell's incompetence and insistence on getting the men udner hsi direct command mangled over and over.>mal treatment of his own men, going out of the way to not rest them, not feed them and make them walk around naked for his own inspectionsReal fucking funny take from someone trying to crawl up the ass of Joseph motherfuckign Stilwell, a commander who decided to flatly ignore severe malaria and typhus epidemics among the troops under his command, because he decided they were just simulating because they were lazy.
>>64916462>>64916596>>64916693>Of the Chindit casualties, 90% were incurred in the last phase of the campaign from 17 May, while they were under Stilwell's direct command.>Stilwell's diary supported Chennault's claim, as Stilwell wrote that if a crisis emerged that was "just sufficient to get rid of the Peanut without entirely wrecking the ship, it would be worth it." Stilwell went on to write that the entire Nationalist system had to be "torn to bits" and that Chiang would have to go.>I have waited long for vengeance,>At last I've had my chance.>I've looked the Peanut in the eye>And kicked him in the pants.>The old harpoon was ready>With aim and timing true,>I sank it to the handle,>And stung him through and through.>The little bastard shivered,>And lost the power of speech.>His face turned green and quivered>As he struggled not to screech.>For all my weary battles,>For all my hours of woe,>At last I've had my innings>And laid the Peanut low.>I know I've still to suffer,>And run a weary race,>But oh! the blessed pleasure!>I've wrecked the Peanut's face.— Poem written by Joseph Stilwell in 1944Poor bongs wasted by this schoolboy-ass clown Stilwell.
>>64917459also>Disregards the notion his troops might actually have malaria.>Stilwellwho writes this shit
The Pacific front was hell on earth, for Americans as well but especially for the Japs. About 60% of Jap military fatalities in ww2, 1-1.4 million people, were from starvation, which was of course accompanied by brutal cannibalism. Though I will say the Japs were able to just surrender and get good treatment when that wasn't an option on the Eastern front, they just didn't know because they were fed lies about American treatment of POWs.People just don't know this because the Japs aren't pussies who whine about it every 5 seconds like the Russians do, and the American film industry didn't memorialize the Pacific as much as Western Europe because the (((producers))) and (((directors))) only gave a shit about Nazis. You'll notice there's fuckall films about Italy or North Africa as well.
>>64917536>there's fuckall films about Italy or North Africa as wellThere are, but a lot of them are British. The Americans had some fairly serious embarrassments in the Mediterranean. Fuck Mark Clark. On the other hand, the Pacific was very ugly and "ungentlemanly" compared to France in 1944. Not all Americans want to think about GIs prying out gold fillings from Japanese wounded and taking body parts as trophies like a fucking Comanche or captured Americans being used as bayonet practice or even having their livers eaten.
>>64916693>>64917459Common wealth niggers to the rescue. Crying about poor little Chiang getting disrespected because he did fuck all with tons and tons of equipment that he did nothing with because he was paranoid about using it against the japs knowing the communists were around the corner.Stillwell was loved by his men. One of the few generals to actually march out jn a retreat with his army then take a plane or submarine. Same common wealth bong groids have absolutely nothing to say about Mountbattens horrendous treatment of Canadians and Orde being a literal Israel first ass licker to the nothing degree. At least you guys had Slim, perhaps the best British leader of the war. Tragic, tragic.For anyone reading this with brain activity and interest in the campaign read The Burma Campaign. The Oxford educated bong lays it all out.
>>64917727>Crying about poor little Chiang getting disrespected Pretty rich coming from the guy who's crying about poor little Stilwell getting disrespected.>because he did fuck allRetard take. Even more retarded in light of Stilwell getting command of some of the best units of the NRA, only to immediately run them into the fucking ground. Simple fact is that Stilwell had no fucking clue how NRA troops worked, what their capabilities and limiktations were or how to use them in general, and this failure was key part all of his further analysis and decisions being equally retarded.Mind you, he equally failed to grasp the limitations of the Chindits, and the limitations of Merrill's Marauders, and hence likewise ran them to destruction.>Stillwell was loved by his men.Riiiiiiiiight. He was so loved by his men, most of them wanted to frag his ass by the end of the war. Well, the small minority that didn't end up dead or wounded after coming under his direct command, anyway. The man lost his troops at rates most SOVIET generals would've found concerning if it was them. Which of course wasn't a problem with Washington as long as he did it to the Chinese or the Chindits. Pretty telling that he was never given direct command again after he also did it to Merrill's Marauders.>One of the few generals to actually march out jn a retreat with his armyAnon. A general going out to the frontline during a retreat to play company commander for the media instead of actually doing his job of coordinating the larger picture is not something to be lauded, nor something the troops in question will be thankful for when they'll have to compensate for that failure of command and pay for it in extra casualties.
>>64917727>For anyone reading this with brain activity and interest in the campaign read The Burma Campaign. I did. It's nice bedtime reading. Shame about it repeatedly bending historical fact into a pretzel to create a more exciting story, and "only" highlighting Stilwell being an anglophobic ass instead of portraying all his other failures. Perfect for the pop-history brainlet who wants his prejudices confirmed, though.
>>64917727Pretty sure this is a butthurt chink.
eastern front. no contest. both sides. losing side? japan against the soviets prob. doesn't really matter you ended up in a work camp left to die after anyways.
Burma. Most of the Chindits who survived had their health ruined for life from disease. The Japs who attacked in Operations Ha-Go and U-Go mostly died of disease and hunger. Some resorted to cannibalism.
>>64908508Based Sledge reader Peleliu was exactly what I was going to say. Fighting an extermination campaign with little to no modern overwatch on a coral atoll. You get dust, heat and absolute animal savagery. They had to clear cave by cave and the taking of prisoners was unheard of, which basically means every corner is a last stand against someone willing to made charge you. Then you're stuck in the ass end of the Pacific on hard and brittle dust. Makes a man wanna scream
>>64918305>soviet level casualtiesReally anon from combat or malaria because they were in a jungle?>A general going out to the frontline during a retreatI can tell you've never spent a night outside in your entire life. Marching 150 miles in the fucking jungle with hostile nearby is not a media event. You literally just die if something goes wrong.>>64918328Again, youre mad that he shit on retard bong generals mountbatten and orde because they had no fucking idea what they were doing while their equipment in the theater was being completely bankrolled and moved by the US. Wasting time, troops and equipment etc.Same exact thing with the Chinese. Made hardly any progress building a supply road for years. Wasted equipment on piecemeal attacks, Stilwell had every right to kick them in the ass to do something to affect change in the theater.
>>64908360Yeah, it was either going to be Burma or Stalingrad, and it probably wasn't going to be Stalingrad.
Lol moros and marranos, the Spanish didn't innovate any new names when they got to the Phillipines, just reused some old ones they had for north africans
>>64921500>>64917727Chiang ≠ ChineseChiang Kai-shek was hoarding equipment because he was forcing warlord armies to do most of the fighting against Japan.The Sichuan warlords contributed the most soldiers against Japan, they sent 2 million troops.They only had straw hats and straw sandals, rifles, swords and hand made grenades.The Yunnan warlord army, Guizhou warlord army, Qinghai warlord army and Gansu warlord army all fought against Japan as well.None of these warlord armies had their own air force, tankettes, armoured cars or modern heavy artillery.Chiang hoarded weapons, ammunition, fighter planes and aviation fuel for his own central government NRA soldiers.Chiang then ordered warlords to fight against communists and then against Japan, so he could take over their provinces later.He hoped warlord armies would suffer most casualties in the war.Chiang even moved over 120,000 soldiers to Xinjiang in 1942 to fight the Soviet backed Ili rebellion from 1944-1946.Chiang sent fighter planes and aviation fuel to Xinjiang and refused to use them to help the underequipped warlord armies fighting Japan.Chiang's people at ammunition warehouses would refuse to distribute ammo to warlord armies right on the front lines.Some warlord soldiers had smoothbore muzzle loading muskets, smooth bore muzzle loading cannons, swords and spears. They had no gas masks Chiang hoarded gas masks, machine guns, aviation fuel and told warlord troops to fight to the death against Japan.These warlord troops fought hard and defeated Japanese at battles like Wuyuan despite Chiang cutting off supplies and withholding his own troops from action.
>>64921860Sichuan warlord soldiers at Hankou in Wuhan interviewed by Freda Utley even said they knew what Chiang was doing and withholding his own armies, but they were going to fight and stop Japan from reaching Sichuan.The Qinghai and Sichuan warlords issued orders for no retreat, they would fight to the death even though Chiang was holding his own armies back.Sichuan warlords troops in straw sandals, rifles and swords plunged into Japanese positions in Yichang and massacred them before Japan started bombarding the entire city with mustard gas.Japan never managed to occupy a single inch of Sichuan, Qinghai, Shaanxi, Gansu, Ningxia provinces.
>>64909300The Moro are fucking insane. Them getting drugged up right before fighting Americans was a direct cause of the army adopting .45 ACP (and thus, the 1911), because .38 LC wasn't dropping them reliably enough.
>>64921500>Really anon from combat or malaria because they were in a jungle?Yes. From combat under anb iuncompetnet leader (aka Stilwell) and from being in a malaria- and typhus-infested jungle while being commanded by an incompetent retard (aka Stilwell) who unironically stated that soldiers couldn't ever come down with malaria or typhus and must just be whining and simulating when they report such things, and who hence spent most of the campaign outright refusing to do things such as trying to provide adequate medical supplies or allowing units full of disease cases to actually pause combat operations to recover from such.Again: ~97% casualty rate for Merrill's Marauders. That wans't becuase they got fucked up in single unlucky engagement. That was because Stilwell consistently ran the fucking unit into the ground and refused to allow it off the frontlines until next to nothing was left of it. When a fucking regimental-size unit is reduced to a short company of combat-effectives, you better have a damn good explanation for what happened. Stilwell didn't.>I can tell you've never spent a night outside in your entire life.That's nice. I can tell you understand literally less than nothing about warfare, or effective leadership. Stilweel didn't walk 150 miles, retard. He and his posse got to ride in a jeep column while his troops got to walk. You're literally unironically regurgitating the propaganda narrative the man tried to make up now.>You literally just die if something goes wrong.Correct. And a lot of Sitlwells soldiers did, in fact, die. And what went wrong and got them, killed was him being in command and spending his time posing for the cameras instead of doing his damn job. And then of course blaming everybody else for it, as he always did.
>>64921500>Again, youre mad Project less blatantly.>because they had no fucking ideaFunny, givne Stilwell had NEGATIVE idea of what he was doing, hence why every time he got to directly command troops he consistently got them massacred.>while their equipment in the theater was being completely bankrolled and moved by the USDelusional.>Wasting time, troops and equipment etc.Yet again you seem to be describing Stilwell perfectly. Is projection literally the only thing you are capable of?>Same exact thing with the Chinese. ANd yet mroe projection.>Stilwell had every rightStill had LESS THAN ZERO right or authority to do jack fucking shit. Learn what a liaison is, retard. Fucking Stilwell is literally the one and only reason anyone can respect Chiang: The man proved to have the patience of a fucking saint when he did not have Stilwell lined up against a wall and shot, something he would in fact have had every right and authority to do.>to do something to affect change in the theaterThat "something" being to be sent to their deaths en masse to zero effect under the utterly incompetent commanbd of Stilwell, you conveniently orgot to mention.
>>64921383Marines had a cakewalk compared to the USN. Literally never fought a divisional level battle without 5:1 numerical superiority and total armor artillery superiority. Complete candyasses. Compare the Solomons to the 12 year olds birthday party of Guadalcanal
Is malaria even that bad? In the eastern front you had an apocalyptic clash of military complexes which had the most advanced methods of killing each other up to date, with wanton brutality against civilians and urban ravaging.Chemical and trench warfare, human barrages, psychological tactics through guns like the katyusha or the stukas going down, the treatment of POWs and minorities and whatever else, everything that made WW1 so fucking horryfing came back and got amplified x10. It was probably the closest humanity has ever been to experiencing actual hell
>>64923251>is malaria even that badBro do you want to find out for yourself?
>>64910269It would probably be this. I'm pretty sure they still have it, but the Museum of Science and Industry in Chicago had a U-boat that you could walk onto. It would have been horrible to be stationed on one of those things. And to think, Hitler and company crossed the entire Atlantic from top to bottom in a U-boat.
>>64909305>keris (daggers)Nah, you're thinking of Indonesian kris. Moro kalis are basically swords.
>>64913218Why on earth would anyone arm those primitives with modern firearms? What the fuck was wrong with them? They should have equipped those negroes with chemical or biological weapons while they were at it. It's just retarded.
>>64908404>some how survive on the eastern front as a rooski, you finally get to go home>oh shit, everyone is fucking starving and everything is fucked>oh also now were going to ramp up that famine, need another 20 million dead
Denmark
>>64908619I don't think you know where Burma is.
>>64909310It's called a brigandine
>>64923695That Anon isn't wrong though.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burma_campaignI would choose the Pacific. Civilization is an ocean away, it's jungle and volcanic rocks everywhere, and the enemy is entrenched and desperate.
>>64908358The British home front, hands down. Boys on Normandy had it easy, and don't even get me started about those wimps in the Pacific.
>>64923514>Why on earth would anyone arm those primitives with modern firearms?Because they are cute little fuzzy wuzzy angels <3
>>64923514Those are commonwealth citizens motherfucker!That and they hated the japs and had pretty much no convincing required to go out there into what was essentially their own backyard and kill as many as they wanted, no bag limits, don't have to take them prisoner and its simple as.
>>64923698That's nothing like brigandine, retard.
>>64922826>USN>hardHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>64923251>is malaria that badYes.
>>64923514>Why on earth would anyone arm those primitives with modern firearms?You don't find idea of arming cannibals with machine guns to fight the yellow peril fun?
>>64923695>being this confidently retarded
>>64910420-40c and -40(A) is the same temperature
>>64908360Chosin Reservoir deserves a mention.And being Airborne at the Bulge.
>>64908358For the Germans, Stalingrad was probably the worst, imagine being surrounded by an enemy who has functional supply lines, hot food, and the ability to sleep somewhere without expiring from the cold
>>64908470r*ddit
>>64923732This>tea rations cut down to only four cups a day
>>64912361NTA but Leningrad wasnt so bad if you could stomach a bit of Russian Longpig- at which point the only thing you're fighting is boredom
>>64923724your own source lists KMT as a minority force.>>64925587I accept your concession.
>>64912361Leningrad sounds downright comfy.
>>64924162>USMC Literally your entire hymn is shit sailors did. You guys were great at dying pathetically at capultepec though that was hilarious.
>>64916462>Actually defending Stilwell, King Retard of the Chinese theater of operations.lol, you're hilarious. Now tell me how Gen. Fredendall was a misunderstood mastermind
>>64926560ah yes the WW2 battles at Chosin Reservoir
>>64917579
>>64928223
>>64917579After people learned about what was happening to POW's in Japanese captivity around 1942-43 it was pretty much open season on the Yellow PerilNot a lot got taken captive at least I remember from what my grandfathers told me somewhat 'embarrassed' about it 50-odd years later, it was essentially the overall feeling for a lot of Commonwealth forces that they would both avoid trying to be captured at all costs and enough sentiment to just kill them all. That said, there was plenty of Japanese that were willing to fight like absolute mad bastards until the very end, particularly the Imperial Japanese Marine forces were very hard men. But there was also a lot like many in the Japanese regular infantry which were not so keen on dying for the emperor and probably didn't get much chance of surrender either.Once the yanks found out how bad it was, it didn't take a lot of time to pick up the same kinds of habits either
>>64923509no difference. keris is simply the general Malay Archipelago name for their wavy swords, some long, some short>>64921500>Marching 150 miles in the fucking jungle with hostile nearby is not a media event. You literally just die if something goes wrong.therefore Stilwell was a retard for attempting itas was Wingate>>64917536there is generally very little WW2 entertainment media that doesn't involve American successes, for obvious reasons>>64912574this>>64908358Eastern Front, because the Russians are dirty bastards in all senses of the wordthe Germans were shocked by the verminous filth and squalor which was the condition of the average USSR peasant hovel>bbbbut the junglein the jungle, you can drink from any flowing river, and there's loads of rivers in the jungle>bbbbbut waterborne parasitesirrelevant for combat purposes; they fuck you up years later, not immediately, and you can be dewormed. furthermore, if you boil water for a minute at 100 C / 212 F, you kill virtually all of them. and fuel is all around you. dysentery is a problem only if you were retarded enough not to have proper latrines.on the Ukrainian plains however, water is lots more scarce. in winter everything is frozen, and there is not enough fuel to warm yourself let alone boil water to drink. when it warms up everything turns to mud and it's full of vermin, microbes, and shit. there are fewer rivers than in the jungle.>bbbbbut insects and pestssure, that's not a problem in winter, but in all other seasons, midges and flies and mosquitoes swarm across those Ukrainian fields.winter itself is a whole nother problem too: the very air and temperature is trying to kill you. yeah the jungle is hot, but it'll never go up to such levels that even if you're caught without adequate gear, you can't lie down and sleep it off. the tempo of life and war just slows down.in the winter, you lie down and sleep, you never wake up.
>>64928311Japanese regular infantry were conscripts and many were desperate to surrender but their commanding officers would kill them if they did.Also many Japanese officers did fake surrenders and sudden attacks after pretending, to ensure no other Japanese soldiers surrender would be accepted, and force their troops to fight to the end.>>64909300 >>64909303 >>64909305 Fujioka Akiyoshi said he wanted to surrender but officers threatened the troops.
>>64913291That's only for the upper echelons of their society anyway. You're talking about maybe 1% of them, if even that. The vast majority of japs during the 1940s were bucktoothed goblin-bodied farmers that would make even the most corn fed good ole boy balk at how inbred they seemed by comparison.
>>64927872Korea was DLC for WW2
>>64928671
>>64927872>Implying I give a fuck about OP
>>64931458
>>64908470>>not allowed to shoot every frog and raze ParisReminds me of reading Jünger's WW2 Paris diaries and getting to the part where he meets Louis-Ferdinand Celine, a French author, and Celine castigates him because the Germans didn't simply kill every one and burn everything. Jünger is of course horrified.
>>64935014
>>64927094Post baguette, smelly fag
>>64910420Pretty muchI remember reading that even modern sec ops that train with the finns often run into the issue of frostbite and losing feelingNot changing out of sweaty uniforms is also deadly (already at -20c), touch your magazine without gloves longer than a few seconds? Frostbite unless you warm your hand at a fire.Poor as fuck visibility after 13:00, or even all day depending on where you are in the countryLogistics constrained to undeveloped roads surrounded by a hundred miles of forest that will definitely not house an ambushSnipers have pretty much free reign to do anything as long as they know the tricks to hide (albeit thermals would change this but the insane level of forest cover shouldnt be underestimated)Wanna warm up? Well the fire you make will be enemy target #1Winter War Finland is definitely the most hellish fighting condition, especially since it was one of the coldest winters on record.
>>64908358>>64913417>"Trifling"Nipfags continually btfo by true empires
>>64908358The UK.
>>64908382Audi Murphy did
>>64912222it stings but that's an exaggeration
>>64912222felt like muscle ache to me
>>64908358italy. truly dreadful food. many fatalities from greased noodles.
>>64909300>>64910573The Japanese Katana FEARS the Moro Keris....
>>64908358Stalingrad. You get to freeze to death, starve to death or die from brutal house to house combat usually melee with anything handy.
>>64908358I'd put in a point for the North Sea.Only tolerable when inside on top a big metal box, and so miserable on immersion that you die in minutes.
Depends who you asked. Guys in Africa said Africa. Guys in Burma/India said South Asia. Guys in Pacific said Pacific. It also depended on your ethnicity. South Asians fighting for Bongs were more used to the heat of Africa and jungles of Burma/India. French North Africans obviously fared better in North Africa.
>>64908413"Stay calm and affix bayonets" only goes so far brudda
>>64912574I didn't even know there was a Greenland campaign in ww2.
>>64908413One of the founding pillars of the IDF
>>64922029tbf .38 Long Colt was weak as fuck and it was a difficult gun to shoot due to its heavy as fuck trigger.
>>64908470Be russian>Liberate berlin after years of grinding down the Wehrmacht by literally drowning them in your own blood>Listen to pretentious burgers claiming to have done anything but join the war late and fight german scraps under the cover of complete air supremacy
>>64951505Russia could not have done that without American backing.
>>64923558Kek at filename
>>64938139>>64938139One thing most people miss completely when talking about arctic warfare: heatstroke. It sounds ridiculous, but it's a real issue. When fighting the cold you layer up, but layer up too much and combine it with combat operations, not just fighting, but digging trenches etc. and you have a recipe for disaster. You have to know when to remove clothes not just how to pile on as much as possible.
>>64951522land lease was nice to have but nah, pretty sure after the Wehrmacht failed to archieve their objectives before the onset of winter, they were done for. Once the relocated russian industry kicked off again and zhukov was in overall command t'was but a matter of time before they'd grind the wehrmacht down.Strategic bombing of german industry and opening a second front surely shortened the war but the german army was already on the defense in russia at that point.
>>64951947>land lease was nice to have but nahYou would have had a pyrrhic victory at best, considering the cataclysmic demographic damage you DID incur even with heavy American backing.
>>64952187I mean the initial wehrmacht victories and massive territorial gains had stalin sweating for sure. But the reason for most of these early successes was the complete incompetence of the red army commanders since stalin purged most of the officers a view years before and replaced them with party loyalists who had zero experience. Couple that with the fact that the bulk of russian industry had to relocate behind the urals lest it be overrun. But when the wehrmacht was stopped just short of moscow and had to retreat to avoid total desaster, at that point i think the tides had already turned. By then the russians had only received their first view shipments from the allies. Russia hardly lacked any recources and already had superior tank designs to what the allies supplied. It really was just about breaching that time gap until their own production was running again. Also after zhukov proved himself at moscow they had finally found a capable commander who was given overall command right away.
>>64912574me and my aryan bros visit thule and ascend to the astral plane
>>64916693Yeah his diery is pretty damning
>>64908360I was gonna say Burma and then list 112 reasons. Before the quonsets people were just wet all the time dying from every disease imaginable.
>>64908358It was 120f day 1 of peleliu, day 2-3 there was no water.
>>64908358I don't care about Burma. Eastern Front was the worst, bar none.>CHOOSE ONE:>SUMMER>swamps full of mosquitos and leeches>diseases spreading from the critters in/around the water>rats in the food stores>mud in your gun>mud in your boots>mud everywhere>you know what FUCK you your tanks are now part of the mud>roads impassable because M U D>WINTER>cut off from everyone who isn't also stuck on the front>gun's frozen>gunner's frozen>hard tack's frozen>truck fuel's frozen>radio for asking for less-frozen stuff's frozen>some dudes just popsicle up on watch or in their bunk>everything is dead or hibernating so there's not even anything to forage when rations run out>your options are to starve and hope reinforcements get here in time, boil shoe leather, or eat your recent dead>everyone's got frostbite>roads impassable because S N O WDid you choose? Good- now you get to conduct some hellish mixture of trench warfare in the plains and urban warfare around arty'd moonscapes (used to be a town of 600). You might get a bolt-action rifle. Might. Have fun! No snacks allowed.
>>64951505>Join the war lateAmericans joined the war 6 months after the soviets did
>>64952373NTA. All of that is also very true, but you have no idea just how up Shit Creek the Ruskies were. There were rolling typhus and cholera waves that killed millions a full 20 years before the Germans revved a single Panzer over the border. The famines that these outbreaks were part of were so bad that people were being stolen in the night to be chopped into goulash on the regular. The faltering of the Empire, ensuing Civil War, and subsequent Revolution with its purges and repressions, had also left many factories emptied out, stopped from the lack of electricity and fuel, parceled away elsewhere piecemeal due to parts shortages, mismanaged to practical standstill from the political upheaval, etc. Many basic goods, even something as simple to manufacture as winter clothing, were either in severely short supply or inflated beyond accessibility for the average working family. This was happening on-again-off-again for two whole decades. So yeah, Lend-Lease saved their asses, even when they could fight.
>>64940230
>>64951947>Strategic bombing of german industry and opening a second front surely shortened the warMore than just that. Not having to man the Atlantic wall, fight in the Desert or Italy would free up thousand of pieces of armor and artillery not to mention god knows how many men. Not needing to build literally a thousand submarines and being able to put those resources East. Not needing to build tens of thousands of large AAA guns to shoot down bombers. Not having your air force whittled down by Western fighter aircraft so it can clear the skies of the Reds. All the production gained from not having your cities flattened around the clock. Combine all that with losing lend lease. I don't think the Soviets would have the upper hand for long in that scenario.
>>64951947>Strategic bombing of german industry and opening a second front surely shortened the war>>64960488> Not needing to build literally a thousand submarines and being able to put those resources East. Not needing to build tens of thousands of large AAA guns to shoot down bombers. Not having your air force whittled down by Western fighter aircraft so it can clear the skies of the Reds. All the production gained from not having your cities flattened around the clockabsolutely thisper their own records, the Germans basically lost nearly all fighter production expansion in 1942 from bombingtank production also was probably deeply affected, but we don't have the records (yet) to calculate thatnor can we ever calculate how much production of small arms, light artillery, light vehicles, engineering gear, etc was lostor the efficiency impact of having to disperse production in small factories around Germany, as opposed to the massive plants in Detroit, Nizhny Tagil, etc.>thousand of pieces of armor and artillery not to mention god knows how many menjust to defend the skies of occupied Western Europe from Bomber Command ate up 1 million men, 10-20,000 heavy-class AA guns (Flak 88), thousands more 20-40mm type light batteries (very effective against low-flying raiders), and up to a third of the Luftwaffe's fighters (including nearly all its night-fighters).if they had been sent to the Ostfront instead, the Soviets would have to contend with a 25% larger invasion force and at least 1 more anti-tank gun for every platoon of T-34s built until 1945.
>>64957622nah it's still burma
>>64908358The concentration camps because you had to be around jews.
>>64931506Damage control after not fucking reading the thread you entered lmao
