You're not going to throw a 6-7 pound weapon in your backpack that requires it's own ammo supply, and you're not going to run around brandishing a non-concealable rifle in a SHTF scenario where there are confused cops, blue helmets, jumpy preppers, and bandits looking for loot drops all over the place. Your handgun is your only viable survival weapon. Let's consider a full size Glock or similar:- Concealable and lightweight- Can carry a spare- Uses compact and lightweight ammunition in the most common caliber in the world. - More than enough for self defense. - Same range and terminal performance as a bow and arrow which people have relied on for survival for thousands of years. - Can hit human target at 100 yards if necessary. You can't possibly argue for needing more performance than that when you're already carrying around 50 pounds of camping gear and food and water and medical supplies and tools. All of your rifles are going to be left in your house or your car, and you must have zero backpacking experience to actually delude yourself into thinking you can incorporate something like an AR into a survival system.
>>64950107AR
>>64950107Why is your retarded ass automatically assuming some sort of SHTF larp scenario? Most people buy survival rifles because they're fun lightweight plinkers, they aren't planning on using them for actual 'survival'. Other people have legitimate needs for a survival gun, and that usually involves a 12ga because that can shoot flares of meaningful size.
>>64950125Because if you're able to stay in your home or are able to access gasoline and operate a car on the road then by definition you are not in a survival situation. Foot egress and backpacking IS survival.
>>64950142>Foot egress and backpacking IS survival.So, it sounds like you meant to criticize improper use of survival rifles rather than the rifles themselves?>blame then gun for when people misuse themthis is gun-grabbier tier stupidity anon.
unstocked pistols are just incredibly awful for literally anything but conceal carrythe minimum you should have is like a vz61
>>64950107dont areplain survival guns tend to t be carbine type things?Guess it depends what you mean by survival, you seem to be talking some urban meltdown zombie apocolype post nuclear shinanigans. When I think survival, I think woods. And for hunting and animal self defense, you want something with a but stock for ranged stability and pretty reliable.Also, if you have access to multiple, regardless of the situation, why wouldnt you have two different guns? A primary carbine/rifle/shotgun/full length gun and a secondary pistol?
>>64950152Awful compared to what? If you were going to, say, hit a quartering deer through the lungs, for 99% of human history you would have been limited to about 25 yards for a shot like that with a bow. Millions of hunter gatherers made do with that kind of performance for thousands of years. With a Glock 17 I can make that shot at 40 yards, penetrate bone much more reliably, make follow up shots with a speed that ancient hunters couldn't have dreamed of, and move with much greater stealth due to the compact size and carrying characteristics of the weapon. And there are much more accurate handguns out there than that if desired, as well as more powerful cartridges like 10mm and 44 magnum. But even just a G17 is superior to what we used for 40,000+ years. Personally I am satisfied with that, from a survival perspective where weight and size are more important than performance.
>>64950183nta but you essentially only get pros for adding a stock. only downside is if you are trying to quickdraw cowboy style for some reason. two points of contact instead of one, its pure basic physics.
>>64950162There are no hard barriers between the woods and populated zones, and you cannot predict which ones you will find yourself in. By carrying a rifle you have added a dramatic increase to your equipment weight, equivalent to a gallon of water not even including ammunition, and you have permanently locked yourself into "brandishing" mode, with no option of discretion and blending in with groups other than to leave the rifle behind somewhere. All of this to achieve performance that didn't exist until a couple human lifetimes ago.
>>64950194A pistol stock of some kind is not unreasonable but personally I don't like them.
I think that the soviets were on something with this TP-82.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TP-82Designed after one cosmonaut landed in the middle of nowhere Siberia, and had only a backup makarov pistol. He thought "yeah, if a bear comes at me there is no way this is enough to deter that". So they started working on something more heftier and multipurpose. A double-barrel 12.5×70mm (40 gauge) shotty for slugs, buck- and birdshot with a third barrel for rifle-type 5.45×39mm (the same used in AK-74). The "stock" is actually a survival hatchet/machette type choppa.Not exactly sure why they chose 40 gauge? Maybe they already had flares of that size or something? But anyways, I think it's a pretty strong contestant for a survival gun, if the ammo is prevalent enough (which, turns out, it wasn't as it was discontinued later)Still, a cool idea.
>>64950107>you're not going to run around brandishing a non-concealable rifle in a SHTF scenario where there are confused cops, blue helmets, jumpy preppers, and bandits looking for loot drops all over the place.Agreed but that's one scenario out of many. A riot where you might get caught up in it and need an AR-15 to prevent your house from being burnt down is absolutely plausible and weve seen it save people's lives multiple times now.
>>64950440Neat concept, but a real shooter doesn't need large heavy cartridges like that to get the job done. Maybe stranded astronauts with limited marksmanship training would. I'm satisfied with 9mm personally, and 10mm is the only other cartridge I might consider.
>>64950183people historically didnt just hunt deer for survival anonyour likelihood of surviving by depending on being able to sneak up on some deer or wait for one to jump out while you sit in a tree and hoping to shoot it from less than 50 yards is lowdeer are also not the only animal you need to be hunting, you should be plinking at geese, ducks, rabbits, squirrels, pidgeons, everything, and those are small targets that you will have a hard time hittingand im sure you think your accuracy with a pistol is great but your accuracy is always going to be even better with a carbine
>>64950142> Because if you're able to stay in your home or are able to access gasoline and operate a car on the roadStaying in your home and having access to gas are mutually exclusive. Bugging out is retarded. Bugging in is the smart path. Everything could go to shit but I’m still staying in my house because I have food and shelter. And lots of guns. Why should I take only a pistol and fuck off to somewhere random?
>>64950152Based klobber
>>64950107I don't live in a city, so.... no.
>>64950107>Let's consider a full size Glock or similarNo need. The Colt Single Action Army revolver has it all covered.
>>64950554>2x the size and weight>Under half the capacity>World's longest reload award>Mogged by the Glock 20 no matter what caliber you chooseYour noguns is showing retard
>>64950596nta, but other than the long reload times, doesnt weight and barrel length work in its favor? things like that make recoil more manageable, or you get a beefier cartridgei can imagine something like a break action 22 revolver with speedloaders could be one of the most useful pistols in a real shtf scenario
>>64950440I emulated the TP82 a bit when doing my personal survival gun setup. Folding 410 sxs with 13" barrels. Weighs about 3.5lbs, has a non slip sling so it wont fall off a parka. Left barrel is full choke for bird, right barrel is cylinder for slugs. Has double triggers so i can instantly choose shot or slug on the fly. Ammo is a dozen rounds of #7 shot for small ground game, dozen rounds of #4 shot for flying bird, and ten handloaded slugs for deer and other large game. All the ammo fits neatly into a empty cardboard 9mm box. Gun folds into a small daypack, weighs so little you dont even realise you're carrying it.
I'd have rathered a 28 gauge, but it's so hard to find short hammer guns in that gauge.
>>64950525>The point of bugging out is that you bug out to a prepared location, not that you just fuck off into the woods.Your assumption that people only have one piece of property is incorrect.
>>64950665anon the vast majority of people that talk about bugging out do NOT have any setup like that and you know it
>>64950636See, this is the shit I kinda was expecting from "a survival gun".Birdshot, buckshot, slugs, and if possible flares too. With option for more rifle-like (maybe soviet 5.45 or 5.56mm generic purpose assault rifle round. It's a survival gun, so you are not expected to hold a full-on fire-fight with enemy combatants. All you have to be able to do is to quickly reload it between pot-shots against angry wild-life and maybe a lone bandit. Don't try to think some extremely improbable lone-gunman-against-a-band-of-brigands scenarioes. A survival gun is "Oh shit, there's a boar!" king of situation. And for that, a double-plus-one barrel shotty usually does the trick.
>>64950107Anyone with even a modicum of experience will tell you that a pistol is only a compromise while you reach for your rifle. all your fart sniffing about weight and concealability are immediately outdone by the simple concept of range. A good rifle can shoot out past one thousand yards and a good marksman can hit the target out there as well. Also, there's your idiocy of 9mm. >the most common round known to man. Yeah, I puked writing that. Here's an item for your clearly undeveloped brain to consider. When the police transitioned from the .45 (or even the .38) to the 9mm, they were taught the concept known as double tap. The double tap is not two rounds, it is three. That's two to the chest, stop, reevaluate the situation, then shoot them in the head. This is a clear statement that your 9mm is expected to NEED three rounds to take down a threat. That's definitely more than a standard AR-15 or even shotgun, and I shouldn't need to point out the absolute killing potential of a rifle in anything above thirty caliber.your 9mm peashooter needs three times as much ammo to present the same threat as one rifle in thirty caliber.also, a pistol? at one hundred yards? You're no bob Munden or Jerry Miculek. Take your pathetic ass out to a range that actually reaches to that distance and see what you can hit. Don't bother coming back to show us; we don't need to be looking at an un-shot target.
>Be hillbilly who lives out in boonies. >SHTF, WROL>Be chilling in house have neighbors you’ve known for years>Have massive ammo stockpile for all your guns>Dipshit shows up on property uninvited>Has backpack and no gun visible>Warning shot from 150 yards>Dipshit struggles to open coat, clearly going for gun>Shoot dipshit in face, pump a couple more into him to make sure the jobs done>Wait a bit, then pop him one more time just to be on the safe side>Dipshit was going for gun, got into a shootout with a pistol, rflmaoIn your SHTF scenario, you have failed to account for the fact that you either already have a SHTF location or you have to find one; you have to get to your SHTF location; you have to either work with or fight everyone else also trying to get to their SHTF location; you have to deal with the people who see this as an opportunity to settle old scores, seize power, seize your stuff for survival, or people just being anarchic for fun; and that the people on the way to your or the people at your SHTF location probably aren’t going to be happy to have you fucking around their properties. That and hunting with a pistol is pretty much a meme, a rifle with a scope will take significantly more and more varied game.
>>64950699>Promotes open carrying an AR in public like a mentally ill troon>No pics of xis epic larperator sheepdawg setupYou don't own any guns, do you?
>>64950107"LE SHTF BOOG PREP" is a glownigger honeypot and I'm tired of pretending it's not
>>64950731>>64950742KYS Grabber I should be able to shoot you fucking faggots anytime I fucking want, SHALL
>>64950697>It's a survival gun, so you are not expected to hold a full-on fire-fight with enemy combatants. All you have to be able to do is to quickly reload it between pot-shots against angry wild-life and maybe a lone bandit.for what its worth, for this reason a burp gun could be incredibly effectivethe goal in a firefight is to end things immediately, so a gun that can unload into an enemy in a short window of time would work really well
>>64950472>Maybe stranded astronauts with limited marksmanship training wouldarent most astronauts military? Also, I believe most actual experinced hunters and the like still prefer bigger calibers. Shotguns are nice because you can load them with various round types.
>>64950731Wasn't the whole point of this thread survival, not what you should bring to a nice sit down restaurant in the middle of town while you eat spaghetti?
>>64950107>he doesn't have a collapsible 22LRNGMI
>>64950142This nigger complains that scout rifles are useless.
>>64950107survival guns are based actuallywanna know how i know?they're fucking guns RETARDinherently basedeven a dildo that can shoot 9mm is based
>>64951075I'm guessing it was to min/max the most compact/lightest shotgun ammunition possible while still having enough payload for effectiveness against game (something 410 struggles with).It may also have simply been the Soviets reusing reject 12.7mm machine gun barrels for the TP-82 the same way they reused 23mm autocannon barrels for the KS-23.
>>64950107>Survival guns are retardedYou're retarded.
>>64950107You type like one of those retards on /out/.>no one has ever been in the woods but me and it sucks *bleh* I better make it my personality so people know I'm hardcore like my videogayme manModern backpacking setups base weight are ~20 lbs dry, without food or water.Water is obtained in the field via purification methods, at most people carry 2 quarts these days, ~2 lbs.Food weight is dependent on distance and method of cooking, a modern freeze dried meal weights ~4-6 oz, a non-stripped MRE would be ~16 oz.A configured AR-15 weights between 7-9 lbs, a magazine full loaded weights 1 lb.How many magazines do you need? How much food do you need? How long are you going to be gone? This weight is below 50 lbs.And the current USAF issued "survival gun" is an AR-15....
>>64951668you posted the inferior version
>>64950596>getting this upset over a SAA postYour newfag is showing
>>64950107>"Survival" guns are retarded>Your handgun is your only viable survival weapon.NGL, you in particular are most likely going to get merked by a group of 2-4 poachers who all have 12-gauge pump shotguns or their grandpappy's bolt gun.>Uses compact and lightweight ammunition in the most common caliber in the world.>the most common caliber in the world.Your CCW is a .22 LR? Honestly, I kind of dig it if true.>>64950596Newfag detected.
>>64950665> Your assumption that people only have one piece of property is incorrect.That’s an assumption that is incredibly accurate to apply to a population. >yeah bro I totally have a second piece of land in a secure, secluded area>and I only own a Glock 19>rifles and shotguns are for dipshitsThere are precisely zero people who own land to bug out onto AND don’t bring a rifle with them. More importantly, why are you waiting until after it’s all collapsed to get there?
>>64950440>12.5×70mm (40 gauge)That's roughly 12 gauge (12x70 for a 2 3/4 chamber) not whatever 40 gauge is.It just a proprietary Russian 12 gauge.>the article Wiki sites from is retardedIt was supposed to be used in the tundra, to take out bears. Because a cosmonaut crashed out there and only had a Makarov before it was implemented.
>>64952573>That's roughly 12 gauge (12x70 for a 2 3/4 chamber) It's not. It's 12.5mm bore. Just a bit bigger than .410.
>>64950107I think you people are out of touch with all forms of reality
>>64950107I'd argue that a light machine gun is best for SHTF. You'd have overwhelming firepower and win every engagement.
>>64950107>survival gun for situations where you need to shoot small game to survive>"this gun is bad for duties requiring a general rifle in intermediate cartridges and higher."No fucking shit retard
The 16 inch AR-15 varmint rifle in 556 perfectly commits itself to the landscapes of the United States semi rural semi-urban topographical challenge. A 20 inch rifle would be top end in any medium reasonable use engagement.
>>64950596>2x the size and weightnot a problem for men who live up to the legend>Under half the capacitysix bullets, more than enough to kill anything that moves>World's longest reload awardI love to reload during a battle>Mogged by the Glock 20 no matter what caliber you chooseThe Colt SAA is the greatest handgun ever made
I thought the point was that a survival rifle is the minimum possible gun used to hunt small game, in case of some kind of emergency like a plane crash. it's not about killing people, and it being so basic makes it non useful for criminals
>>64950525The implication is that you have no home anymore whether due to CBRN or civil unrest. That's the logic behind the INCH bag
>>64950596>le glonk 20 meme10mm loaded to .357 specs will blow that thing and take your hand with it. And Ruger-spec .45LC is practically .454 Casull
>>64953021>LE VIDYAnoguns
>>64950107Glock 19 (or similar sized 9mm) is the answer to all questions in life, don't get caught up in meme caliber autism>>64950596Hipster award
>>64953035yea, 7.62 is the best caliber for small game hunting thoughbeit
>>64950107Well yrah really unless you're a pilot. The nicest 22 I've ever seen was this, takedown semi auto and bizzarely enough french, the one I saw had a 25 curved mag on it a silencer and a scope but can't find a pic of one like that, they all have threaded barrels it seems, there is a swich that sets it to single shot mode and it's the quietest gun I've ever heard silenced.
>>64950964>be in situation where ammo and weight are precious commodities >plan to mag dump copious amounts of ammo with low accuracy Yeah good luck with that. I honestly don’t disagree with the option, large volume of fire in a short period of time wins ambushes. However I think that’s a plus in the AR column. Have a super safety and push it to FA if you need it, keep it in semi for everything else.
>>64951684>integrated loudenerBros when did the chair force go from being this based to gay?
>>64950107I think you have completely failed to grasp the concept of a "survival gun". They aren't intended for SHTF zombiemaxxed fantasy scenarios. The purpose of a survival gun is for subsistence hunting and predator deterrence when your vehicle fails in the middle of nowhere, so you can survive long enough to pack out/be recovered and return to civilization. OP is gay and retarded.
>>64950742>oh teh noez the le FEDS have muh ip addressTed K did nothing wrong and I hate the antichrist.
>>64953686More people have gotten into guns and shooting thanks to gaming than anything else in the past 20 years you retarded boomer. If you want to see progun voters push to overturn the NFA and repeal Hughes then gamers are your best shot.
>>64953567Ok. That doesn’t change my point. Either things are still functioning well enough it’s “localized” issues and you just drive away. Or shit is completely fucked and you’ll want a rifle, not a pistol.
>>64950596>Mogged by the Glock 20 no matter what caliber you choose>laughs in Ruger only .45 ColtPost reloading bench you pleb
>>64953686>post doesn’t even mention video gamesAre you a bot or just retarded? Post guns. Here’s an ebin glonk 20
>>64951057A normal 22 is way better than a combo gun
>>64950107>this nigga thinks he's hunting squirrels and keeping bandits armed with ARs off his back with a GlockI like pistols too but your LARP is retarded.
>>64953686grow some taste
>>64950107"survival" guns are like AR-7 takedown .22s and shit.Fuckin dope. Your shit's all fucked and it sounds real retarded.
>>64950152I want a pirate brace of skorpions, hung across me chest.
>>64950195When the fuck do you "find yourself" in places. Are you on meds or something?
>>64956931>Are you on meds or something?Worse, he's off them.>it'll definitely be dangerous enough to where you can NEVER EVER go back home>but if you even think about picking up a rifle to defend yourself you will be seen!>by people even!>they might even say something about you!>or... ye gods... they might even say something TO you!If he acknowledged that his prep scenario was a narrow one-off I could understand. But he acts like rifles are off the tabel because they're big, end of, no upsides whatsoever. Fucking moron, him.
>>64957023>tabel*table. Kill me.
>>6495261312.7mm is .50, .45 is 11.43mm
>>64955105>HEY WE SHOULD ALL BREAK THE LAW AND BOAST ABOUT IT ONLINE BRO THAT WOULD BE SO FUNNY LE KEKERINOS!!!SHALL
>>64957023FROG SPOTTED(I kid)I mean are we talking about survival rifles or rifles for SHTF?Between AR-7 and 10/22, what can't you get? Calibers? Then you need a sporting takedown civilian two-caliber or drilling rifle, or if like there is a takedown Rossi .410 I guess?If it's a "collapse" of some kind then you'll torture yourself min-maxxing for an environment you can't anticipate. Just own reasonably useful shit and learn how to bake basic bread.
>>64950107Survival guns aren't actually meant to go in a backpack, they go in an airplane's Survival kit.Most people don't have airplanes.
>>64958577Weirdly enough a squaw back in like the 1920’s killed a grizzly with a 22. It’s not the world’s greatest idea, but it is possible.
>>64955989Pretty much the standard for wildlife defense now.
>>64957023You could not even describe for me a theoretical survival situation in which a rifle would solve more problems than it causes other than living off the land long-term on purpose.
>>64958705Neat. You still didnt post guns.
>>64950107Something like thiscarry around your shoulder or velcro to your backpack. Ammo is light and easy to get Magazines are light and plentiful150-300 yards, no problem20 inch barrel.
>>64956923I...can't say this idea isn't immediately appealing to me. I just want an 8" barrel for one so I can make a "jungle carbine" vz61.I'd even accept a 16", I'd just have it cut down somewhere. I wish someone made such a thing.
>>64958912Defending your community from a mob of fucking niggers
>>64950107This is the most highschool sophomore instagram brained just went backpacking for the first time in my life op ever. He even included a screen shot from an ipad kid remake game to cap it off. Even included the zoomercore "loot drop" adjective despite never even experiencing a natural disaster. I see why AI is taking your generations future
>>64950107I never got this line of logic, if people are going to auto engage you like the zombie npcs in the video games you base your life around why aren't they doing it if they just see you at all? Like I know you are a vidya brained child who went hiking a total of twice in your life but if rifle=being shot as soon as spotted they are going to shoot at you anyway even if you look unarmed.
>>64950107I like my glock 26
>>64950107Senpai, tell more about how you keep killing people 100 yards away with a glock. Your eyesight and hand steadiness must be remarkable.
>>64950107.38 snub (Colt or Smith, pick your poison) for innacity.30-30 lever for innawoods.12ga sawed off pump/shockwave for innahousethese guns are all effective, easy to reload for and source ammo for in my area, and most importantly don't scare the hoes. Being a tactical-timmy in SHTF is a horrible idea.
>>64963091people who dont shoot have no idea how dogshit pistols are
>>64950107>Your handgun is your only viable survival weaponDroppedTake down rifles and shotguns are the only viable opinion and you're too retarded to live
>>64951684The looter fears the dooter
I'd want some sort of plastic fantastic 22 with a bulk brick of ammo for a true wilderness survival situation. I've hiked with rifles and it sucked, pistols are mostly ok but the ammo gets heavy fast, with a 22 pistol in a nice holster, that's easy to carry. 500 rounds of 22 is probably the weight of what 100 9mm?
>>64966801What kind of money can you spend?
>>64950742You are gay, larping about the end of rule of law is the white man's pass time
>>64966808Ohh, I got a ton of 22s. I was just saying in a wilderness survival situation, I'd want a 22 and a block of ammo. Jn survival, and I'm assuming any force I'd encounter wouldn't he friendly. Even if I had 308 and tons of mags I wouldn't want to engage a squad on my own. Plus 22 can take deer and *most* hogs. That covers me for food.
>>64966821I can see carrying 22wmr for that not sure I would feel good with just 22lr. This conversation make me want to get a PMR30
>>64966854Funny you say, I have a PMR30 and love it. Still would take the 22lr, esp if I have a can on it. I don't know if any auto 22mag that will cycle subs
>>64966821I don’t live in hog country, so how and where do you shoot to take a hog with an 22? Deer make sense, wouldn’t have trouble taking down one with some 22 rounds. There was a poacher a long time ago in a neighboring county who was killing moose by mag dumping 50 rounds mags into them. He killed a couple before they caught him.
>>64966892headshot
>>64966892I've one shot dropped white tail with my 22 1911, it's not as hard as you think it is. As far as hog goes, plenty of videos on GoyTube with people dropping some big pork with 22. Outside of hogzilla that's what I'd want. Id also want to run mostly subs since in a survival situation I wanna keep the noise down.
>>64950107>blue helmetsWhat is this american paranoia with UN Soldiers?
