The Eleventh Circuit ruled today that "machineguns are not protected by the Second Amendment as weapons in common use for lawful purposes". You can read the opinion here:https://media.ca11.uscourts.gov/opinions/pub/files/202414058.pdf
>>65096719the common use is a slippery slope argument that is not mentioned in the 2nd amendment. They can and will continue to use this down the road to subvert the 2nd amendment.
If FRT become very widespread, maybe an argument can be bridged to the widespread/historical argument approach.
>>65096719not only did the people that wrote the second amendment know that fully automatic weapons existed. They were actively supporting their department.
>>65096719What do they even mean by "machine guns"? Is it like "assault rifles"? Does the second amendment say that the right to firearms is only for defensive purposes?
>>65096755with enough surveillance it's easyDo you own a phone?
>>65096851>leave phone at home>go for a night time walk with an unregistered firearm, during a winter storm, near a substation in Texas >repeat until complete social collapse.----------------------------------------------------------------------------AGENT NOTICE:AVOID POSTING UNPROMPTED. OVER ADVOCACY CAN BLOW COVER.NOT NOT POST WITHOUT VPN TO NOT IMPLICATE AGENCY SWITCHBOARD.DO NOT INCLUDE THESE MASSAGES.
>>65096844I think people stopped taking the whole 'machine gun' thing seriously after they declared a string or shoelace to be a machine gun.
>>65096719>Biden appointee says "erm ackshually"This is going to SCOTUS and the ATF is going to get BTFO. Not only is the ATF going to get BTFO, the Hughes ammendment is going to be overturned as unconstitutional, which means actual full autos are going to become widely available for less than 5 digit prices. This is exactly what the ATF and dems don't want, and is the entire reason for the Hughes ammendment in the first place.
>>65096922Shhhh! Never interrupt when the enemy is making a mistake.
>>65096922yeah im sure this one will be totally different from every other 2A case in the past 5-10 years, all of which they've declined to hear
>>65096719This case just reaffirms earlier precedence, you need a court (like the 5th) to deem it unconstitutional before the supreme Court would pick this case up.At the moment all the lower courts have generally agreed, machine guns meet the "dangerous and unusual" doctrine exception in the 2nd amendment that previous rulings used.The court has no reason to pick this case up at the moment, as there is no court split, all other federal courts have ruled the same way as of today.
>>65096934>Bruen>Cargill>Caetano>Vanderstok>Reheif>Nyrsp>RahimiYeah it turns out when the court isn't full of people that actively support gun control and are following an agenda cases start to be heard. Not all the cases were won by the plaintiff (Vanderstok and Rahimi) but cases are proceeding. In fact Caetano itself goes as far as to say that any bearable arm is protected under 2A.https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/577/411/
>>65096942There is no "dangerous and unusal doctrine" clause in the 2A. It's pretty unambiguous, and every attempt to argue otherwise is disingenuous.
>>65096954When are the AWBs in several states going to be overturned then?You’re lapping crumbs up off a shit-covered floor and thanking the people who sprinkled them there of all places.
>>65096999>progress isn't good because it's not fast enough Calm down, nigga
>throughout the opinion they argue that machineguns are "uncommon" and "not typically possessed by law abiding citizens">they even bring up how the Tommy gun was used by mobsters>guy submitting the appeal was convicted for possessing a part for the most common rifle in America
>>65097011We're losing ground. That's the reality. All the liberal states are going for AWBs and Maryland has an AWB that has been challenged in court and they already upheld it.
>>65097011Correct. The Supreme Court will not be as (ostensibly) conservative as it is now, potentially for generations. Failure to achieve anything significant in the near term is catastrophic.
>>65097019Demoralizing shill
>>65096844doesn't matter, all gun laws are unconstitutional
>>65097073Can you say he’s wrong, though? The SC has had plenty of opportunity to take up an awb case for the past 6 years, and they haven’t. Those robed rats are worse than useless. If and when the dems get back in power, they’ll stack the court to guarantee dem rule for eternity, and those worthless fucks who did nothing but sit idly by on their benches will have deserved it.
>>65097011Progress isn’t being made at all on a state level, you silly son of a bitch.
>>65096954If you go against the shills' demoralization attempts they will simply go to the mod discord and have the thread deleted. How dare you post the truth on 4chan.
>>65097140>if and when 2030 is going to cost them something like 40 seats due to the census changes and redistricting.
>>65097256Wasn’t that supposed to happen last census and it just… fucking didn’t? You’re on copium, buddy.
>>65097011>SCOTUS ignores AWBs and mag bans for 30 years>ur impatient Fuck off. SCOTUS won't do anything to jeopardize the machine gun ban. If you actually read any of those opinions from >>65096954 then you'd know this. They're not going to take a case that's some retard with dey glock switch. More states now have AWBs, existing ones are expanding it, and Rhode Island now has a bill to remove grandfathering like they did with mags. All they have to do is issue a per curiam like Caetano and say that AWB and mag bans violate the second amendment and must be repealed. That's it. That kills the modern gun control movement. Even fucking Kagan said AR's are the most popular rifle in America and are protected in the Mexico case.
>>65097328On some level people know the Supreme Court wants to protect one of the main things Republicans run on, but they don’t want to admit that it’s all about realpolitik.Completing an objective means it can’t be used as red meat.
>>65097333Adding to this: let’s be honest, we all know that no elites want us to be well armed, right?
>>65096999Uh oh, shill melty
>>65096745Yep.
>>65096922quick don't look up who signed the hughes amendment into law
>>65097403Congress isn’t even TRYING to pass a law that would protect the second amendment. So between an absent Congress and a useless Supreme Court, what wins concerning AWBs are you seeing at a state level that I’m not?
>>65097432>'wins'New York itself is still in litigation after Bruen 2022. That's not the point.U.S. Department of Justice civil rights division (Harmeet Dhillon) already enjoined the state of Virginia with lawsuits after governor Spanberger signed those completely unconstitutional flouting-U.S. Supreme Court sixteen bills last week.SCOTUS has been playing merry-go-round-docket on taking an AWB-magazine case: there are several prime candidates slated, but when they rule on that it's smackdown for these post-2022 ban states (that will constantly forever as long as the Sun exists continue to gungrab).
>>65097446So all that is to say that they “may” do something and definitely haven’t done anything yet?Come on.
>>65097344Oh absolutely, that's the last thing any of those fucks want.
Are people really in here crying about Mario not being edgy enough for them?
>>65096719The courts maintain, but the second amendment isn't a permission slip, it's a prohibition on the federal government to pass such laws in the first place. Challenge the laws themselves on the basis of the 2A, and argue that the government overstepped its constitutional authority and blatantly violated an amendment to pass a law.
>>65096965It was DC v Heller, the common use vs dangerous and unusual weapons. One would have to argue against a SCOTUS ruling and the SCOTUS tends to keep their rulings consistent.
>>65097446>Harmeet Dhillon) already enjoined the state of Virginia with lawsuits after governor Spanberger signed those completely unconstitutional flouting-U.S. Supreme Court sixteen bills last week.She's probably our best hope outside of SCOTUS, but all she did was send a letter saying DOJ might sue the state if CIAberger signed the AWB. The bill itself just got returned from the legislature denying the governor's requested changes that would have made it worse than it already is.
>ban something>sue to overturn ban>since it's banned, fails common use testmany such cases
>all this quibbling about weapon definitions and common useJust regulate ammunition, are they stupid?
>>65097966Arms includes ammo, tard.
>>65097944Interesting. I’m genuinely surprised they hit the brakes.
>>65097952More like>something is in common use>ban it>ignore supreme court jurisprudence >circuit courts do mental gymnastics to keep the ban in place>SCOTUS ignores it>>65098021They didn't hit the brakes. Spanberger's changes made things much more confusing and are coming out of left field. She amended the assault firearm definition to be any semi-auto with magazine greater than 15 rounds in addition to the features test. Does that mean only when a magazine is inserted? Does that mean if it accepts a mag that's larger? So every firearm with a detachable mag? Even a grandfathered mag? She also amended the section for banning carry at hospitals or in-patient mental health facilities to only allow for cops removing an exception for security guards.
>>65096755trannitor coded picrel
>>65097019>>65097061>>65097234>hurr durr I live in a cuckstate that votes democrat and now I have an AWBVote with your feet. I did. The more.people move to conservative states the more conservative they will get. Or maybe you care more about gay buttsex and money than your rights and freedoms..>>65097328>SCOTUS won't do anything to jeopardize the machine gun ban. They did when theh struck down the bumpstock ban. Expect this to go up on appeal in 5ish years. Kavanaugh forshadowed Bruen in an opinikn II like 3 years before it happened. You people have no idea how slow the courts are.
>>65098081California already put in a bunch of workarounds like the pop open receiver auto mag drop and the stripper clip internal magazine, the 30 round cap lower without a detachable magazine and an ejection port stripper feed system is something that has already been done.
>>65096865is that image AI? if not can you post the artist name?
>>65097966Commiefornia and Jew York do this already
>>65096719We don't need any more demand for ammo
>>65098167shouldn't have to give up my home and my family for retarded laws. And blue team is flooding the red states at a much higher rate. The bumpstock ban ruling was because of the very specific definition of a machine gun and how the executive branch wasn't allowed to say "close enough." There are statements in Heller and other decisions that specifically call out how "the M-16 and the like can be banned." They are not going to do anything that would overturn the machine gun laws from the NFA or the Hughes amendment. >>65098243and Assachussets.
>>65097073bro Virginia JUST banned most semi-autos and 15+ round magazines
>>65096865>unregistered firearm, during a winter storm, near a substation in TexasFirearm registration does not exist in Texas.
>>65098320>shouldn't have to give up my home and my family for retarded lawsThen seethe, retard. You either value your rights or you don't. You clearly don't.
>>65098232it's a slop. i found it on /g/
>>65098330Virginia also tried to rape representation wirh an emergency redistricting that got blocked by scotus, that state is a shitfest in general
>>65096719Nothing will happen>stfu doomerNothing will happen because the courts and legislatures that would be the ones to fix unconstitutional laws simply won't do it. Why should they? What sort of enforcement power does the SCOTUS have? It doesn't because it's not the branch of government that EXECUTES the law. You really think the Trump admin would go to bat for gun owners? Sure, it's a better chance than a Biden or God help us, a Harris administration would be. But not a mother fucking thing has come from the Trump administration for gun rights. It's all lip service to keep us voting for them. Just like how abortion is for Democrats. Exactly like abortion, the "huuuuuge issue" for Demosharts that's such a big deal that they do absolutely nothing to enshrine abortion access at the federal level. Keep voting Republican because they aren't rabidly anti-gun but don't rely on the courts.
>>65096922On this episode of lovely things that willNot happen
>>65097952There are a gorillion Glock switches out there so you can make that argument it’s already in common use. Regrettably they are all in common use by nigs so it’s anyone’s guess
>>65097086so strange to see a middle aged male who is the weight he's supposed to be.
>>65098855>nothing ever happensOh things are going to continue to happen. Individual U.S. state legislatures and governors, circuit courts are going to continue to push all this anti-Bruen, anti-SCOTUS and anti-Second Amendment legislation, litigation, Lawfare, and judicial musical chairs.Until the U.S. Supreme court makes a definitive case ruling on a magazine/AR-15 ban case, and probably further in the future a case that substantively challenges the NFA and parts of 1968 GCA on ownership of machineguns>not a mother fucking thingWrong. See --- >>65097446 >>65097457>“may”(You) talking about the U.S. Supreme Court? It's a question of their schedule docket, many dozens of Second Amendment cases come up for them each year. They are going to do it soon because at least a half dozen cases, some have been there as 'hot potato' for years, are possible candidates.Understanding the U.S. Supreme Court and how their cases (any topic) to be heard are selected is complex tea-leaf-reading process that only a handful of expert attorneys who follow SCOTUS closely are even able to forecast or explain. Not for amateurs (if you want heads up on SCOTUS/their machinations and have a desire to comprehend it, follow FourBoxesDiner or WashingtonGunLaw)>>65096844>What do they even meanATF, NFA and GCA have a specific (legal nomenclature) definition of machinegun>>65097944>just got returned from the legislatureKayfabe (on the part of Virginia)
>>65097921>One would have to argue against a SCOTUS rulingIs a weapon used by every modern military actually unusual? A gun is deliberately dangerous, but a gun needs to be dangerous AND unusual. Not dangerous and one of the most common weapons in recorded history. Common isn't the same thing as unusual.
>>65096719Idk what they mean by not in common use for lawful purposes. The US military has like millions of machine guns and they're all used lawfully.
>>65099884>the military uses it legallyRetard logic. Every nutjob with enough money would be buying tubes for their fucking prepper bunker perimeter by that stupid line of thinking.
>>65100041So what? "Shall not be infringed" is quite clear
>>65096719Just what we need. More future astronauts with switches and full giggle Dracos
>>65100622To kill each other faster? Yes
>>65100041Good?
>>65099362The states will still be fags and write legislation to make it illegal. Florida had no leg to stand on when they expanded the bump stock ban to include literally anything, after the ATF-FRT agreement happened. They saw that, freaked out, and changed the language to ensure that full auto would never get into the hands of the plebs. If the SCOTUS overturned the ban, you can bet they'd do it again and this time use the exact same language and stipulations as what's found in the NFA. Someone will challenge it, they will refuse to hear it, and so it goes.
>>65100730>so it goesThat's the Lawfare aspect (applies to far more than solely 2nd Amendment topics). What's required is a total SCOTUS smackdown ruling on magazine bans that will have the 'cleanup' slamdunk effect which goes even beyond what Bruen 2022 had. (Refer to below video)Acting Attorney General Todd Blanche clearly and explicitly says that the DoJ's strategy will be to act against states that are passing gun ban laws or anything restrictive to Americans' 2nd Amendment rights:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks0kPScwsqcMark gives a rundown on the just-concluded attorney's NRA convention, the deep state is actively undermining rn the Trump administration policy directives:incoming DoJ civil rights division head Dhillon had 70 percent of the employees resign when she came in. If that many resigned outright in just that one part of DoJ, imagine how many others are still burrowed in to the system trying to kneecap everything else they are doing at DoJ.Virginia's move+gunban bills this week / their CIA governor, are just another demonstration of the deep state *external to* fedgov trying to undermine these policies. They're working together (prev. Obama-Biden era employees still at ATF+DoJ, along with gungrabbing governors and state legislatures in NY, D.C., Virginia, California etc.)
>>65100730>>65101540**corrected** Video URL, watch it:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kS0kPScwsqc
>>65100730>>65101540What y'all are seeing is evidence that this an issue where the courts *cannot* help. If you want a historical example, consider desegregation. Brown v. Board of Education was pretty clear, "all possible speed" notwithstanding. But the segregationists committed to Massive Resistance, and it took the involvement of both Congress and the Executive to finally crush that. I'd argue the consequences of that were disastrous for the federal character of our nation, but that's beyond this discussion.What matters is that when the states want to defy the courts, it's piss-easy for them to do so. They can move faster, and courts are inherently limited in what they can handle by a whole host of statutory and doctrinal restrictions. Unless and until you can mobilize the entire federal government to ram the right answer down everyone else's throat, the feds aren't going to be much help. You're gonna have to keep fighting it out in local legislatures and governor's offices.As a final note, the segregationists didn't go down without a fight. As in, literal bloodshed. The total number killed over the course of the movement turned out to be pretty small, but if that's what it took to get states to abandon a policy they thought was essential to their culture and which so many now think was morally wrong and practically misguided, I don't think it's ridiculous to wonder if it's going to take a lot more for a similar change to happen with gun rights. Before you push, I'd make a sober assessment of whether you're willing to die for it. Because that may be what it takes.
>>65101576>defy the courtsThere is some of this (broader aspect). Real problem **WATCH THE VIDEO ABOVE (You)r POST** is that the deep state has fully infiltrated the federal court system itself (not just the unelected DoJ/rest of D.C. swamp agencies).Federal courts and their appointed judges, the Circuits are the real main problem here. That's why it takes so long to even get a decent magazine-ban case for the U.S. Supreme Court to rule on definitively. The revolving-circuit federal courts are the ones with total-retard and anti-Constitutional judges sitting for life on those benches, that keep on passing-the-ball or rejecting these cases that ought to be slamdunks to reach SCOTUS.Video discussing what DoJ is doing vs. the states, and getting a _good_ worthwhile case before SCOTUS for them to rule nationwide on:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kS0kPScwsqc
>>65101576>have to keep fighting it out in local legislaturesNo. Wrong.Here is what (You) and everyone who actually cares about not just 2A but their own country and community--BECOME the Legislature yourself. Run for office.Get into your own local city commission, run for sheriff in your own county. Get active, *become part of the government* itself at the local level in your community.I'm serious and not kidding. There's no way to just 'leave it up to _____ (the gov)', you absolutely have to Do It Yourself. Become a local/state government representative that actually gives a fuck about the Second Amendment.Are you an attorney? *Become a judge*, that will have the chance to be nominated for federal court.or, become a District Attorney (and then become a judge later).This is the only way to change things. The D.C. swamp, the bar association in your own state, they don't even care that the Second Amendment exists.Re-read all the lines above this one.
>**WATCH THE VIDEO ABOVE (You)r POST**>_good_>--BECOME>*Become a judge*Why do you type like a schizo?
>>65101607Why don't (You) Shut The Fuck Up?
Why do you type like a schizo tho?
>>65101607Video again:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kS0kPScwsqc
>>65101610why r u a zoomtard
>Only young people type normallyWhy do you type like a schizo?
>>65101625Why are (You) a schizo
>>65101602Funny you say that, because one of those is on my list. I dunno if I have the mettle for it, but wish me luck anyway.
>>65100730Dumb question maybe, why is the 9th amendment not used as a defense against all these dumb laws seeking to infringe on our rights? it literally says: >The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.Even if they want to jewishly argue that the text of the 2nd lets them pass their gun laws, shouldn't the 9th be another layer of protection?
>>651017959th is a dead letter. You could try and breathe some life into it, but good fucking luck. A couple of the justices in Griswold v. Connecticut, which more-or-less birthed our modern substantive due process doctrine, actually did rely on the 9th to justify the holding, but that wasn't the controlling opinion and it didn't carry the day in legal circles, so we're back to it essentially not existing.Part of the issue is, what exactly does it protect? Rights not enumerated, sure, but what are those, and who gets to say?
>>65098167>You people have no idea how slow the courts are.Meanwhile: >Citizens are upset that states are enacting flagrantly unconstitutional laws?>I sleep>Trump is doing a meanie weanie to heckin wholesome bipocs?>SHUT THAT SHIT DOWN RIGHT NOW THE GOYIM NEED TO REMEMBER THEIR PLACEThe courts only serve their ZOG masters. They've never held any accountability to the people. You don't get appointed to a judicial office by having a career of keeping the legislative and executive in check. The judicial branch only exists to justify blatant overreaches of the government in the faces of unhappy citizens. The tree of Liberty has been shriveled and desiccated for well over a century and deserves refreshing
>>65101905Trying too hard, officer.
>>65101739
>>65096922This scotus has been cucking out lately so I wouldn't be so confident
>>65102050>cucking outRead >>65101587 , watch the videoit's due to their docket schedule, they are going to get to it (Kavanaugh and Alito want to rule on a mag ban case)
>>65098167>vote with your feet>state imports thousands of shitskins to ensure your vote doesn't matter anyway
>>65098167>>65102107>immigrantsMark at FBD did a video the other day on this specifically with reference to the 2nd Amendment:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cboR9uxVFPIthe author of Virginia's gungrab AWB is an immigrant^
>>650983364473s still exist, where applicable.
>>65101795>>65101848To quote Nancy Pelosi, when asked what part of the Constitution allowed for a massive expansion of government power, "Are you serious? Are--are you serious?"
>>65096844>even mean by "machine guns"?Any firearm that contains mechanical parts.
Anyone know of a good organization to join thats a pro 2A? Is the NRA still a good option It would be great if it is Michigan based and focused too>pic not related
>>65102173Didn't know solid state guns were a thing, how time flies
>>65102425(not from Michigan but) Second Amendment Foundation, and Gun Owners of America are doing great work
>>65102425also National Association for Gun Rightsgunrights dot org
