Trying to get a radar lock on to a modern stealth fighter with a modern electronic warfare package is an endless technological game of cat and mouse.So why not instead sidestep this completely and distribute thousands of IR + cameras around your land area networked together to give you the exact location of all enemy fighters in the area without any chance for jamming? You can also create a similar camera array in the ocean with small boat drones.
Because the military is based around making counter-measures for things that are also financially 'good'. You could put up gorillions of radar stations and cameras and loads of shit. You COULD cover your cities in giant 10m thick gold-titanium alloy shields. But that costs.Think of it like the video game EUIV/V. Sure you could build a fort on every single province you own, but you'll run out of money doing so. But you make invading you incredibly difficult. So your idea is expensive and time consuming and making X doesn't mean X works all the time, you need somebody to maintain it and make sure it works.
It would cost an insane amount of shekels, coverage would mostly be limited to your own territory and on the front lines you'd probably end up with zero coverage as they get blown to bits.
>>65097442>$1000 per camera module>insane amounts of shekels
>>65097261Fuck off Elon.
>>65097442>small cameras that do not emit spread around everywhere>blown to bits
Wouldn’t it make more sense with a combination of acoustic listeners, IR cameras, radar and potentially satellite (maybe not possible yet?)As in, as far as I understand the main problem with the radar is that you need to beef up the power in a frequency band in a specific direction.So if you have 0 information you don’t know where to look. Same problem with IR cameras.If your acoustic devices pick up a sound signal that matches that of a jet engine, then IR cameras and radar can then have more success narrowing down to some area.
did you not like the answers last time you posted this
>>65097261>thousands of IR + cameras around your land area networked togethernetworked together by what?
A big issue is that optical sensors like IR are inherently limited to within-visual-range detection, which gives you much less time to respond when compared to radars that can see much further. You can place cameras further and further away from your position in a network to increase your detection range, but this gets complicated when you are moving, or don't have access to large amounts of friendly territory to set this up
>>65097473>>65097481yeah go and build it and see how that works out, fucking kek you cunts really think you can aliexpress your way out of anything
>>65097261cloudsresolutionlatency
>>65097523Modern IRST have retarded ranges (80 Km for the Eurofighter's PIRATE) tho they are constricted by clouds
>>65097630IRST is a million dollar sensor so that goalpost move was pretty expensive
>>65097642Chang sells thermal cameras with FLIR for 10k. Pair it with an AI that can recognize aircraft and you're golden.
>>65097659Except changs garage built thermal isn't IRST or even close. Also whose gonna produce the magic ai and all the hardware to integrate it for free? Obviously not you.
>>65097683It's already been done on a professional levelhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnbmIxe4TYs
>>65097707>Detecting a drone at 500ft is the same as tracking an aircraft at 30000ft going mach 1+!Changs garage sensor ain't gonna cut it bud
>>65097749You can use IRST. Ozelot comes to mind.
>>65097758So you can just use something that has been in use for decades? What's your point retard
>>65097261>distribute thousands of IR + cameras around your land area networked togetherBecause unless you are some tiny city state, you need millions upon millions of fucking cameras.And either billions of miles of wire to connect them, or a small army of dudes running around, replacing power packs or refueling generators.
>>65097261Man if only the laws of physics weren't a thing, you'd have it all figured out.
>>65097261Head on against an F-35, a thermal camera going to have a worse detection range than radar system.
>>65097999Head on against an F-35, a radar system will detect the presence of the aircraft by exploding.
>>65097972Ever heard of the electric grid or Solar panels?
>>65098194Okay that's great, but then to add to all those cameras, you also need millions of solar panels too.
>>65097261Cameras can't see through clouds. And current stealth CONOPS are to fly at very high altitude. You'd need insane zoom required to see even a going glint on a clear day and more zoom means less FOV which means more cameras. That and anti IR and optical dazzlers are a thing. But I don't think your idea is too retarded.
>>65097261Because if you're relying on visually acquiring enemy aircraft in this age you've already lost air superiority.
>>65097659>>65097707this shit is fucking comicalwhat if we just took the aliexpress and then used ai.exe using YOLO and then made 0 camera noise and also had an instant datalink and also made it never require maintenance and also always scan and also make a youtube video where i made military hardware for $3??? and also use meshtastic and also meshcore and also aes256 and also consumer hardware and also
>>65097261Costs rapidly expand because you need a specific density of them to be effective, plus you'll need redundancies, and you'll need the logistics to install all of them, all over thousands of square kilometers of territory. You also need the infrastructure and signals processing capacity to effectively use the system and generate useful information. You're going to be stuck with the limitations of the IR cameras and geography. Areas with low development density will more than likely require you build infrastructure specifically support this system. On top of this, they're going to be highly reliant on existing energy systems to remain operational and any building you put them on becomes a legitimate target because you've made them part of your IADS.
>>65097261>IR + camerasBeaten by a cloudy day lmao
attach balloons and a tether to children and float them in the airspace. affordable, they don't fucking know the value of money
>>65098194Ok, so are we only building cameras along transmission lines and in cities then retard kun?Or are we actually trying to cover the whole country, including famous places like bumfuck nowhere?>solar panelsCongratulations, you now need a few million solar panels and batteries and you still need a legion of maintenance workers.
Kinda hard to do when the lamentations of your women and children are echoing through the valley
>>65098262And? It costs like $5/camera
>>65099281A 5$ camera is going to be less than useless for what you want to accomplish
>>65098283>>65099214The infrastructure really isn't a problem.The camera modules can charge from a tiny solarpanel and transmit data over cellular networks.Just screw them on some tree trunks in the forest.
>>65099287The $5 is in reply to a post about solar panels reading comprehension-kun.
>>65099292>cellular network And when it gets jammed?
Do you not understand that the amount of visible airspace a single high end camera could cover is in the dozens of feetTo reliably spot aircraft at 10,000-30,000 feet visually to protect a city you would need so many cameras as to outnumber the amount of existing cameras in the USA by an extra zero. It’s just completely non economical and even if you did that it’s too much data to parse. And even if you could parse it then you still get cucked by a cloud bank.
>>65099292>throw shahed knockoffs at a few cell towers or the power substations keeping those cell towers operational>entire nation's air defense network goes downRelying on civilian assets to support military hardware means that those civilian assets are mission critical. Combining that with distributed military hardware and you suddenly need to put heavy air defense around the entire goddamn country because minor damage to civilian infrastructure cripples your sensor network.
>>65099304You'll never convince people who believe in this shit that it's a good idea. To them, you can just mix cameras and software and AI like they're magic spells, because to them, it might as well be.
>>65099297>>65099304Ok then a hub and spoke short wave radio system where numerous hubs are connected to the central system by a wired connection each wirelessly serving a few hundred camera modules spread out around a hundred km radius.Do you really think fucking communications is going to be the problem with this system in the 2020's?
>>65099292>The infrastructure really isn't a problem.Kek, that certainly is an assumption.>The camera modules can charge from a tiny solarpanelWe're talking about a camera that's supposed to spot a plane 30 miles out, that means cooling the sensor and all kinds of bullshit that reuqires power.The silver lining here is that clouds are not a concern, since your camera network can't see through them anyways, so you can just turn the cameras off and save some power.>Just screw them on some tree trunks in the forest.Oh god, it gets worse. Now you have to cut back foliage for every single fucking camera three to four times a year, so it can actually see the sky.Not to mention falling leaves gunking up your solar panels, have you ever been in a fucking forest?
>>65099304>the system is useless because it can be disabled by simply bombing tens of thousands of small distributed civilian communications infrastructure installationsIf you can do that then you've already won.
>>65099328>thousands of small distributed civilian communications infrastructure installationsOr one fucking substation.
>>65099367Not enough
>>65097511bluetooth or wifi or AI or something. he's probably retarded anon, be nice.
>>65099324THE problem? No. THE problem is scale.It is certainly A problem though.
>>65099312cargo cultism is a very serious mental illness. many such cases!
Why not just fill the entire sky with cheap fishing nets that will catch all enemy missiles, lmaoactually, a cope cage around an important building should work pretty well if it's spaced properly. it'd just look and feel horrible to live and work inside bars.
>>65099419Scale is not a problem.See smartphones.
>>65097479>only time an F-35 was hit in history was with an IR missile, no radar lockSo basically he's right?
>>65097273What about acoustic? Yeah the plane is faster than sound, but it's not faster than the network the sensors are connected to. That's how the ukes catch drones isn't it?
>>65099488Scale is a problem because an iPhone can’t even see a plane at 5000 feet let alone 30,000
>>65099552Modern phones have cameras that can see better than the human eye.A human eye can spot a jet in the sky just fine.
>>65099620Dentge.jpg
>>65097537>Doesn't know about EODAS
>>65099518He is completely right. Future missiles are going to be Autonomous AI-optical guided — traditional countermeasures such as chaff, flares, and stealth will become obsolete. Crewed aircraft will have to adopt new defensive measures entirely such as active defenses like those seen on modern AFVs. Combat roles in contested zones will see crewed aircraft disappear in favor of cheap masses of expendable, yet precise drone aircraft.
>>65099427a man walked into a bar
>>65100284Yes, and EODAS is a littlllleeeee bit more advanced (read as: expensive) than stringing together some chinesium IR sensors.
>>65099427Make the building cope cage out of glass for aesthetics
>>65097261Better yet just use sound. IR gets decent range but sound receivers launched deep in enemy territory are cheap in comparison to high tech IR and can be powered by double AA lithium battery with a transmitter and solar panelTriangulate 2-3 gg plane spotted
>>65097261Properly tuned synthetic aperture radar can find them fairly easily.
