Tell me /k/, is .380 really a bad self defense cartridge? Or are the Fudds/Armchair Operators just coping?
No but in a direct blowback it is
who the fuck says .380 is a bad self defense cartridge
>>65122409If you aren’t carrying a .45 and 4 spare magazines you will be dead in the streets
>>65122409Modern chemistry has generated.380 ammunition that is inside the lower bounds of acceptability for self defense. Don't expect it to work vs landwhales in heavy coats tho.
>>65122415Me*smacks dick onto the table*and what do you have to say about it?
The PPK is the only 380 I have and I can say for sure its an awful defensive gun. Looks nice though
>>65122409No.The vast majority of pistol cartridges are all about shot placement. The power of the cartridge itself is not really relevant, because none of them have the actual power in them to cause significant damage to a human through something else than shot placement.So unless you're carrying a .357 magnum revolver or something, what matters is where you place the shot, not the cartridge itself.
>>65122445I keep one in my jacket pocket when I'm out looking for french fries or whatever. How do you argue it's an awful defense gun? It puts holes in things and i can shoot it well one handed.
>>65122445You bought the wrong chambering, and arguably the wrong model too. The only PP that makes sense is the full size PP in the original chambering of 32. In this case it is an excellent gun, very accurate and easy to shoot and low noise/concussion.
>>65122409It does everything bigger rounds like .40 S&W and 9mm do, but with less recoil.It’s great.
.380 is bad because 95% of the guns made for it are pot metal garbage.
>>65122472No
>>65122435I say nice cock anon, but .380 is still good
>>65122435
>>65122481So size matters and shot placement isn’t the most important thing? Just trying to follow your argument.
>>65122527If you think 380 penetrates and expands like 9 or 40 you are profoundly retarded
>>65122598…penetrates, Yes. Expansion is tougher at such low velocities. A flat nose will tumble, causing more damage or you can step it up with Underwood or Buffalo Bore.
>>65122598>If you think 380 penetrates and expands like 9 or 40The penetration and expansion for all these rounds is inconsequential unless you're firing through a barrier.Hitting flesh directly, none of these rounds are capable of anything beyond icepicking where you place your shot.
>>65122669>all of the self defense shots I ever take will be at targets presenting themselves to me perfectly out in the open at close range.Okie dokie
>>65122679As opposed to?What kind of schizophrenic gunfight are you imagining where you're actually taking part in proper firefight?
>>65122686Lol, lmao
>>65122463Straight blowback .380 is as snappy as 9mm
.380 is a perfectly adequate self defense round.The most important thing is penetration. If you do not have sufficient penetration, your shot placement doesn't matter..380 has more than enough penetration to get the job done.Place your shot where it needs to be and .380 will get the job done.Don't believe me?Watch Paul.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nX3gpJ-GAy0Also look up his numerous videos going over .380 ammunition choices and effects.Is it nice to have more bang in your bullet?Sure.However, in most handgun rounds (.380, .40, 9mm. .45acp) that more bang AT BEST translates into marginal terminal performance on the average human being. When it comes to self defense, do you want every reasonable edge you can have? Sure.Does that mean .380 is bad for the job? No.Could another cartridge do a better job? Maybe, if the person can handle it. I'll take 5 rounds I can get on target over 10 rounds I _might_ get on target every day of the week. And for a lot of folks, .380 is either all they can handle, all they have, or all they can get away with carrying at the time.
>>65122424/thread
>>65122729If you can't handle full on 9mm then take you're 380 and kill yourself with it
>>65122749I'm glad you have such a high opinion of folks of smaller stature, or who might have weaker hands for all kinds of reasons.I'm glad you've said smaller women, old folks, and anyone with a disability that might affect their hands just don't deserve to able to handle a gun with confidence; or to carry one for self defense. I'm glad you said out loud that you think they're all worthless and deserve to die.Do everyone a favor and wear a trip so you can be filtered. Or, better yet, KYS.
>>65122779damn you've got a leaky clitty
>>65122480The Beretta 80x cheetah is nice.It's the only .380 that I've fired that is genuinely great. I dumped my Sig 229 for the 80x as my go-to carry gun.
>>65122808A rarity amongst 380s which are usually tiny and light cheaply made back up guns
>>65122409having a gun regardless of caliber is more important than said caliber. having a gun is the Aceshot placement is Kingcaliber is Queeneverything else is for Jackassesi'd suggest something smaller though if youre going 380, i really like the khar cw380
>>65122808I want this in .32.
>>65122839You sound like a faggot
>>65122860Good news
>>65122839shot placement at work
>>65122860I thought everyone already built up immunity to .32 ACP
>>65122785>underage shartybabble
>>65122480Sig P365Springfield HellcatS&W Bodyguard 2.0Glock 42, 28, & 25Ruger LCP, LCP Max…where’s the pot metal?
>>65122808Cheetahs are awesome, I just got mineprefer the older models though
>>65123218NtaDo you have any examples that aren't gay strikers covered in polymer? I've shot half of those guns and they are pretty shit compared to the Beretta that other anon mentioned.
>>65122483Y-you too
>>65122413this, OP picrel pistols are based on early 20th century designGet a Bodyguard 2.0, smaller contemporary design that's a mini-Shield>>65122808I have a Browning BDA. It's nice but has a snappy direct blowback recoil (easily managed, but still mildly annoying). Excellent smaller size pistols though
>>65122749>>65122785You act like a spastic little nigger that gets avoided by everyone that has to interact with him, because your company doesn't improve on loneliness and your voice doesn't improve on silence. Which would be forgivable if you owned a gun, but since you don't know that shooting .380 out a little carry pistol sucks... For the impressionable reading this, >>65122729 is correct. Even from pocket guns, .380 has adequate penetration, and with Fiocchi Extrema you can get reliable HP expansion from them too. More importantly, .380 is basically the biggest bullet you're going to have when you need your gun to be actually concealable in a vest or pair of pants. Any environment where tucked shirts are the norm and you may not get away with constantly wearing a jacket makes concealment a pocket-only affair. >But my 30oz .327 Fed Mag fits in my pocketAnd it looks lumpy as fuck, and drags your pants down on one hip. A loaded LCP weighs 11 ounces and looks like a phone in your pocket in its holster. The only thing smaller I would bet my life on is P32 (9.5 oz loaded), but now we're in 32 acp land.
>>65122669>The penetration and expansion for all these rounds is inconsequentialNTA, but a denim jacket, leather jacket, or thick coat will prevent a .380 from penetrating 12" of 10% ballistic gel (if it can't consistently penetrate 12" of gel, then it can't consistently penetrate 4" in the human body); you wouldn't have that problem with a heavier 9mm or .40.>>65122686>What kind of schizophrenic gunfight are you imaginingHe's probably preparing for a gunfight where his opponent is wearing clothes. LOL
>>65122409Thays a great gun for cc. My grandma uses one
>>65123599>he fell for the jhp meme
>>65123599Penetration is THE most important factor in handgun lethality.Expansion can have some positive effects, since the bullet increasing in diameter gives it a slightly higher chance to hit vital structures inside the target.For rounds with questionable velocity or energy, sacrificing vital penetration power to gain a slightly larger wound channel is a terrible idea.Boomers are unironically right when they say that ball ammo or hardcast lead is the way to go for low-power pistol rounds.
>>65122409I carry either a RM380, Ruger LCP, or whatever the Taurus 380 is called. I also occasionally carry a Keltec P32. These are guns I can pocket carry anywhere, occasionally even in the courthouse or police station. All the people Ive met or seen that "carry" a full sized pistol only wear it in specific circumstances as their clothing or location allows or they "EDC" their gun in their vehicle(lol). Nobody can convince me that fullsizelets arent either larping, over compensating, or expect every self defense situation o occur while they're in the drive through ordering a double McLard
>>65122409It is fine just having "a gun that you can shoot" will be sufficient 98% of the time.
>>65123670>"For rounds with questionable velocity or energy..."This statement contradicts the earlier... >"It does everything bigger rounds like .40 S&W and 9mm do..."...and...>"The penetration and expansion for all these rounds is inconsequential."The previously stated "just as good" fallacy your side peddled earlier in the discussion has now fallen apart. Carry what you want; I'd much rather you carry a .32 ACP and/or a .380 ACP over being unarmed, but stop pretending like your compromise is equal to a more powerful cartridge.
>>65122808>>65123241The older ones with the curved backstrap are much nicer in my opinion, kudos.If they made a new cheetah without the fucking straight 2x4 grip I'd be all about it. >>65122839>khar cw380I actually have one of these, I love it as a deep carry gun because it's unbelievably thin and light, but I wholeheartedly admit that it kind of sucks to shoot.It being locked breech does help a bunch with recoil comfort, but it's still a crazy, crazy tiny thing to grip and fire.
>>65122409Carry the largest caliber that you can shoot accurately and rapidly that you're willing to carry every day. If that's a .380, then go with that.
>>65122463this. i can consistently hit with my 380 and being able to do that is more important than whatever ballistic terminal effect some idealized round/gun would do. that's the job i need it to do, hit the target, and it does it. that it scoops out a large chunk of their torso when i do is less important than simply hitting the target.i have a 357 mag. it can do hole punching like nobody's business or a bit less with 38 spl. but i can't hit as consistently with it. so 380 it is for me.>>65122724i have not found that to be the case. also newton's second law of motion doesn't agree with that assessment either.
>>65123809>Trying to compare straight blowback recoil impulse to delayed action recoil impulse and misrepresenting one of the laws of physics in the processYou're a fuckin' winner Harry
>>65122724I wouldn't say it's that bad, at least in guns of similar size and weight.But it's definitely noticeable vs .380 short recoil guns.And in a market that's been flooded with .380 short recoil guns for a while now it's increasingly hard to justify. Feels satisfying to shoot in all steel euro police pistol sized guns like an Astra constable or a beretta 84 though
>>65122729>>65123795Are you expecting this place to have actual nuance and not devolve into shit flinging?
>>65123769It seems you're confusing me with someone else who posted earlier in the thread and unintentionally putting words in my mouth that I didn't say.All I said was that for rounds with questionable energy, or velocity (I'm including non+P .45apc and various old non-magnum revolver cartridges here), expanding projectiles are counter-productive and perform worse than plain ball and cast projectiles. These rounds need all the penetration they can get, so hollow-points aren't beneficial in these applications, they're actively detrimental because they reduce penetration significantly in exchange for a tiny increase in wound channel size
>>65123795good overall advice
I ‘luv me Bersa, simple as. Fits the hands good and I shoot it well
>>65124086>Are you expecting this place to have actual nuance and not devolve into shit flinging?I am >>65122729And no, I don't expect this place not to devolve into shit flinging. But there are a few people left here who have intellect that is above "two brain cells fighting for third place" and they're the ones I'm talking to.
>>65122808>>65123241Here's my 85f. I like the single stack a lot better than the double stacks. Ive been wondering if the new 80x model slimmed them down at all and was thinkin of getting one for a suppressed gun.
>>65124399oops forgot pic
>>65122413Limp wrist detected
>>65122409Get off /k/ grace, you're supposed to be taking care of emily.
>>65124300Based twink. I like my Bersa.
>>65122480Bro is posting from the mid to late 20th century.
>>65124401Clean your gun, you greasy faggot.
>>65124438Thank you. I like your holster and sunnies :D
>>65124300KISS twink tmuuy
>>65124182>>All I said was that for rounds with questionable energy, or velocity (I'm including non+P .45apc and various old non-magnum revolver cartridges here), expanding projectiles are counter-productive and perform worse than plain ball and cast projectiles.Great, no one was saying otherwise. Continue your monologue elsewhere, I guess. I was responding directly to...>65122472>65122669>65122686
>>65123218>he names 5 pistolsKeep going, retard
>>65124575I like my guns greasy. I also rub the entire frames with oil when I clean them.
>>65125229>I also rub the entire frames with oil when I clean them.LEWD
>>65122409The caliber is fine, but the big brain move is to get a micro 380 with a locked breech which will have way less recoil and generally be much smaller/lighter. I can IWB carry a PPK, but why would I do that if I can IWB a 15 shot 9mm that feels nicer to shoot or pocket carry a Ruger LCP/S&W Bodyguard with the same capacity.I've owned PPKs and they are cool, you CAN carry one but it doesn't make sense to do so given the better options that are available nowadays.
