Romania seem to have bought their way into the NGSW program and might be the 2nd country to adopt the 6.8mm calibre.Is this a good deal for either party?
>>65128928Looks like SIG just did the usual.
I'm livid sig got away with this retarded design that didn't fulfill the requirements of the program in either spirit or practice.
>Not getting in on the Beretta NARP with the UK & Italy >Stuck with SIG for the next 15 years & 1 billion USD in the sink grim
>>65128928No, to the point that I'd suspect there's something shady going onBut then I don't have any insight into Romanian politics or military and I've heard they cleaned up a lot of the corruption in recent-ish years so idk
What 60 years of being stuck with AKMs does to a country. If they crank out 6.8 it might be inteteresting.
6.8x51mm is a terrible, terrible round. It sucks in rifles. It heats up LMGs faster than normal. It's not accurate enough for DMRs. It's just shit.
>>65130944>sucks in rifles It’s because it’s a Sig.>heats up LMG’s fasterIt’s because it’s a Sig.>not accurate enough for DMR’sIt’s because it’s military ball.>just shit90% of the issue is because the Sig Spear is such a shitty gun. 10% because the retarded boomers only made two types of ammunition iirc: Normal down-loaded all-copper ball for military range use (same retarded reason why the .30-06 wasn’t stronger than its design allowed because it would overshoot military ranges, and the expensive making a new military range was out of the budget) and standard military armor-piercing, full-powered ball ammunition, which was made without accuracy in mind
>>65130953if SIG is so bad how come they won the NGSW rifle program?
>>65128928>tfw we could have the WASR for the Modern Manwat a time 2 b alive
>>65131040Because the only gun they competed against was an overcomplicated piece of shit that had been abandoned by its designers.
>>65131042More like Euros may get Sig Spears for less than 5000 dollars.
>>65128928>It's spreadingthat thing needs to get shut down before it's too late.
>>65131205Romanians slack worse than Spaniards. They also bought/adopted the ARX design from Beretta and proceeded to do fuck all with it.6.8 is definitely spreading though. Steyr confirmed their dmr will be in the caliber.
>>65128928The new XM8 looks significantly better than the M7. Lighter, more compact, and maneuverable. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh1CES0q1MQ
>>65131195>overcomplicated>piece of shit>abandoned by it's designersWrong on all three accounts
>>65131040They were all that remained after textron couldn't secure the rights to some of the technologies they used
>>65130953>>heats up LMG’s faster>It’s because it’s a Sig.No, this one's actually because of the full retard chamber pressures.>>not accurate enough for DMR’s>It’s because it’s military ball.This however is partially owed to Sig, their manufacturing is shoddy and canted barrels is one of the many problems that keep coming up.Another part of it is that a 6.8x51mm rifle cartridge is gonna burn barrels very quickly for infantry rifles and machineguns, and especially fast once you look at the full retard pressure ammo. You really are looking at a lifespan of 2000rds in ideal circumstances for weapons in this role stuck with a cartridge of this kind, and that's just for the normal pressure training ammo.>>65131040Ron Cohen is a shady convict, is why.
>>65131662The cartridge is a fundamentally retarded concept, though. Re-adopting an armor piercing 308 round would’ve netted the same results while also not burning barrels.
>>65132343If we mass produce GNB200 steel its actually a good gun evolution. We get better than 308 performance out of a carbine barrel. Not to mention its also lighter than 308. We will use less steel overall where we needed 20" barrels before but now 11" per gun. 33% lighter per bullet than 308. The only real nitpick is should we replace a small 5.56 "small rifle" sized ammunition with full power. That's a tactics and strategic calculus that will matter theater to theatre. Id also like to see a M4a2 program with similar high pressure ammo.
>>65128928It's honestly comical at this point that SIGs perception is at an all time low yet still lands big deals with governments lmao
>>65131040We can speculate if a bullpup was ever legitimately on the table for the US, but TrueVelocity also fucked their bid by half-assing the machine gun portion of it. They literally did not submit one and just slapped on a longer, heavier barrel on the rifle and said "here's your machine gun", so sig kind of won by default (and maybe, probably bribery)
>>65129260The UK isn't with the NARP
>>65130944would you feel better if the word Creedmore was in there? You'd buy the fuck out of it wouldn't you.
>>65132645What do you have against creedmore
>>65131199More like the PSL in 6.8x51
>>65133132Muh DIK
Never ever have I heard one single first-hand experience with this gun in these threads. Not once has someone been like "yeah I tried shooting one, didn't like it for X reason"I think that's awesome that everyone with negative things to say is going off of like 2-3 doomposting ragebait articles riding off the coattails of the P320 shit to get clicks on soldier systems or whatever the fuck you absolute freaks spend your time reading, or rather, listening to fat people badly reread to you in long form video format because you are too retarded.
>>65133156
>>65132506>shorten barrels to have SMG size and weight gun with a rifle caliber>short barrel sucks, too much concussion, shit ballistics, add suppressor out of necessity>suppressor brings length and weight back up>develop round that needs less barrel to have good terminal performance so you can always have short barrels>its hot as fuck, NEEDS suppressor to be shootable at all, making it longer anyway>its bigger so you have to have a heavier stronger gun and carry less ammo>your terminal ballistics are still questionable
being blindly anti-sig is the most pseud shit
>>65133651You might not be anti-SIG but they are certainly anti-you.
>>65133649Textron did it right but they were being bitches with patents and service
>>65132343Isnt that not okay because youd need a 20" barrel and the Army wants suppressors?
>>65132343>.308More like .30 TC or a new bespoke cartridge along those lines. Which is essentially what we got anyway, just in the most jewish ham fisted way possible
>>65133156It's stupid but you have people believing we'll be keeping 7.62 NATO in service because it's a bigger number.We've seen in Ukraine magazine capacity is still king. They're carrying 14 mags a piece. M7 simply isn't a good infantry weapon.
>>651339707.62 isnt going anywhere unless militaries mass adopt vehicle mounted 6.8s.
>>65133970>We've seen in a protracted insurgency between 2nd world militaries using Skoda Octavias for logistics and MEDEVAC that magazine capacity is still king.The only lessons from Ukraine that apply to first world militaries are what everybody has learned about drones.
>>65133983>30-06 isn't going anywhere until the military mass adopts vehicle mounted 7.62 NATOYeah we know. It's still in its infancy but if you're buying TODAY 7.62 is obsolescent.>>65134008Drones are rewriting warfare. It's stupid to ignore the lessons of ukraine especially when we're seeing the world's most powerful navy be ineffective against a third rate nation rn.
