We had a pretty good Drone thread last night that didn't immediately devolve into political shitflinging or goreposting. Let's see if we can do that again, because something is on my mind.I woke up thinking about some of the arguments people were making, and realized that almost everyone's idea of the drone's power is wrong. The description people seem to be making of drones is that it's a 'loitering munition'. Sure, I could see in some aspect that could be a description. That seems to undersell the danger of drone warfare. We have tons of loitering munitions and aircraft, but no visceral reaction to them up until now. Why? The answer is that drones offer the new concept of a slow, inevitable death to its targets which no other munition has before, and this is the part that militaries are untrained to tackle. Ordinary soldiers going about their day before being vaporized is nothing new, everyone has seen videos of that. The recent addition of videos of their prey screaming, shitting, running, or shooting themselves that can be spread to all of that soldier's friends and family is the actual strength of drone warfare. You cannot train a soldier, any soldier, to not panic with the knowledge that his death will occur in the next 5-10 minutes and he's simply waiting to die. Literally anyone would panic. I'm also not delusional enough to think that those videos of Russians screaming, crying, praying, running, shooting their friends, before shooting themselves, couldn't happen to our soldiers, too. We're seeing videos of this happening to Israeli soldiers, now. here is no surrendering to a drone, but there is no set time that drone has to kill someone, and the spectacle of a doomed human who has the knowledge that his death will be painful, and every person he has ever loved will get to see his insides splattered across the evening news is what drones are offering the battlefield. >Cont.
So the question came up, how do you counter that? What is the counter to drone warfare? The problem is twofold, A drone can hit literally any soft target. It's operator, upon seeing the existence of a hard target, will simply choose to seek out a soft target. That part is obvious. Literally any army has soft targets anywhere near the front lines, if it's not the soldiers who may have MRAPs, it's the people supplying the soldiers a few miles away from them. The other, more insidious problem, is that every single death is recorded, and the funniest ones are splattered across all social media. There is no stopping that, either. Even China, with it's great firewall, gets goreposting videos on its sites. It's assumed both sides will be trying to paint the other side as cowardly, unprepared, stupid, irrational, and suicidal. Which drone footage absolutely provides and there is no stopping that. The only way I can see to even begin to put a dent into this problem is to train 90% of all armed forces on drone warfare first. All armies with standing soldiers have to be made to be drone warfare armies. Which isn't going to happen for another 50 years, at the earliest, since this means scrapping 100% of infantry military doctrine. It effectively means infantry exist to be carted around in their little MRAP minivans before taking pictures outside of buildings and hiding. The other way, which nobody will want to address in my lifetime, is to give soldiers an effective, quick, and painless way to commit suicide once they realize they are outmatched. Then train them, the moment they enter bootcamp and maybe even in society in general, that using this option is not dishonorable since they're preventing the enemy from using their death as a propaganda tool. Effectively, to make drone warfare ineffective, you have to death soldiers to kill themselves extremely unceremoniously to rob the spectacle out of their deaths.Any other ideas?
The obvious answer, to me, which robs the entire point of free government in general, is to go full fascist the microsecond a war with a drone-armed army happens and begin executing anyone who shares drone warfare footage of your soldiers. It can not just stop at the battlefield. Any site that posts it, must be taken down. Any news agency which shares it, must have its journalists arrested. Effectively, you have to instill the idea that mocking the deaths of your soldiers will be met their deaths, and maybe the deaths of their loved ones, in return. Worse, this cannot just stop at the battlefield, it has to extend even into their own countries. Even if it costs a billion dollars, paying an assassin to knock off the social media personality posting "NAFO Pig cookout.webm" is worth every penny if it makes it clear that you can touch them, anywhere. And being some "I'm such an ironic faggot lol i love gore!!!" liveleak poster will not save them. This is what I suspect other countries with less scruples have considered or are considering. If you make it abundantly clear that you are not against terror tactics if it means their soldiers are less psyopped in return. Even this isn't enough.This also gets into the financial tactics of it. All of these platforms are ultimately beholden to money. This is what China has learned, prying open our social media. It basically means that every site which has drone footage posted must also have criminal charges posed against it, which are acted on seriously resulting in arrests of its senior members, with no exception.And yes, this means sites like 4chan will inevitably be taken down and there will be no more free internet. I also think this is why we're getting this push for ID verification on the internet. To harden your army against the psychological warfare of drones, you have to harden your society, and that means giving up every single thing you felt society was good for.
I think we'll just return to attached K-9 units. Nice FPV drone, asshole. Unfortunately, poochie can smell you from outside your little wire's range, and he's coming for you.
>>65157263>The description people seem to be making of drones is that it's a 'loitering munition'I prefer to think of them as tiny PGMs, all the advantages of sub meter CEP but so cheap you can use them on a single man.>>65157274>What is the counter to drone warfare?Hard kill systems intergrated at the platoon or section level, think the AT that was introduced to counter armour or the MANPADs introduced to counter aircraft.>Which drone footage absolutely provides and there is no stopping thatYou are a warfare autist like the rest of us and not the general public, the MSM and their new media pets on the same payrole still control the content 90% of the population see.>train 90% of all armed forces on drone warfare>this means scrapping 100% of infantry military doctrineWhy? It's just another specialty like AT or mortars and neither Ukraine or Russia is making their majority of their force drone pilots because one pilot can fly a lot of drones in a day.Think of it more like the no-mans-land of WW1 expanding from 1km to ~10km with the most common drones with greatly reduced strike capability out to ~50km.>preventing the enemy from using their death as a propaganda toolWho gives a shit? Dead soldiers have been used as propaganda as long as warfare has existed, it doesn't win wars.>>65157282>go full fascist the microsecond a war with a drone-armed army happensThis has been happening for decades with a slow drift towards authoritarianism, not due to war propaganda but because the general public can't afford a house & family making them angry with the capitalist class that extracts all the wealth from society.Every time people correctly identify the 1% as the cause of massive wealth disparity there are laws passed to discourage it.>Any site that posts it, must be taken down. Any news agency which shares it, must have its journalists arrested.This has nothing to do with drones and is just the way things are going to defend capital.1/2
>OP and his chatbot thread
>>65157282>>65157353>Even if it costs a billion dollars, paying an assassin to knock off the social media personality posting "NAFO Pig cookout.webm"Open a history book, these things are dealt with by assassins the secret police turn up, these days because Palantir flagged your posts.>This is what I suspect other countries with less scruples have considered or are considering.This is happening today, Defense for Children International reported on IDF raping Palastinian boys which resulted in them being arrested and declaired terrorists.You are correct to notice the stripping of freedoms, you are blaming the wrong thing.To quote Sam Altman "(economic) freedom and democracy are no longer compatible"
>>65157369To be fair, altman absolutely has a stake in saying that.
>>65157353>Hard kill systems intergrated at the platoon or section level, think the AT that was introduced to counter armour or the MANPADs introduced to counter aircraft.I would like to know your reasoning for that, because so far the only really effective hard kill systems for drones are other drones, there has been nothing else with an even remotely effective kill rate on them to deter their usage. So war just becomes drones fighting other drones while people sit it out, and whoever wins the drone war gets to massacre all of the people.
>AI jeetbot arguing with itself
>>65158218Is no one allowed to ask questions to have discussion on /k/ anymore? I wasn't aware this became another ragebait board like /v/.
>>65159217
>>65157263>drones offer the new concept of a slow, inevitable death to its targetsI disagree. Drones are a ubiquitous recon platform that are difficult to see or hear except at close range. In a noisy environment such as a vehicle you won't hear the buzz or whir.They're effective precision weapons which invalidates the traditional protection that a foxhole or other position would normally provide.I think the whole psychological analysis is bullshit, because it is a very real threat that is difficult to counter. We don't see anyone in today's conflicts not fighting because of drones. We see them continue to fight anyways and do their best to counter with cope cages, shotguns, jammers, counterdrones and smart optics.
>>65157263>slow, inevitable deathYeah. That is exactly what caused "shell shock" in WWI from artillery. And everything else since then that's lead to PTSD for survivors. There is nothing new in warfare, son. The only thing that changes is the furniture.
>>65157285You got something here, strap a cat or a dog to each soldier. Once you blow up fido you are automatically the bad guy, and can't use that video for propaganda purposes.
>>65157282>this problem I just made up has to be solved by totalitarian fascism
>>65159217Lmao
>>65157263Bombardment has the same effect; see WWI (shell shock), or WWII (in particular, the 30th Infantry Division, or anyone near a Stuka attack in the early part of the war or a V-1 attack near the end). The sound of the incoming, if the bombardment persisted long enough, could practically drive some people mad from the fear of not knowing if or when they were going to get hit. The sound of drone props does the same thing today; the only difference is the aiming/guidance. Once drones eventually get reliable autonomous capabilities and can be used simultaneously en masse, it'll get a lot worse.The solution is probably going to be photons, coherent IR or focused microwave.
Necessary conditions of victory in the psychological field in near peer conflict:>legal/technological apparatus to control and prevent proliferation of gore videos of friendly troops>physically disconnect from enemy information networks>censorship of non authorized information sources through requirements on fact checking and chain of knowledge rather than sedition act style censorship >deplatforming of misinformation without appeal>public/private partnership + value alignment with threat of trust-busting/natsec expropriation >mandate proportional air time of official information sources onto all media platforms>obligatory civilian mobilization into Civil Defense / FEMA CERT teams (with ideological training component)>CMP reintroduced into high school/college >militarization of DHS for domestic counter intelligence role>officially sanctioned video games representing all levels of warfare, including tactical, operational, strategic, logistic, and cybernetic
>>65157263Drknes only seem inevitable if you don’t know how they work > t. Have DJI goggles 3, a Radiomaster boxer and a eachine ev800d by my bedside right now
