>>41195061
It really doesn't, in my opinion. I don't believe it IS a choice, but I don't think that should be the primary reason to support gay rights or trans rights. Whether it's voluntary or not, to me it's mainly a personal freedom/"pursuit of happiness" thing.

Historically speaking, I think the "born this way" argument might've been valuable against people who are terminally unable to mind their own business, because if they considered sexual/gender orientation to be voluntary, then they felt they should be allowed to force us to choose the same lifestyle as them. I never really got that.

because if gay is a choice, you can choose to be straight, and they want you to choose to be straight, and it justifies them pressuring everyone to be straight this whole time, as well as conversion therapy for those who resist

being trans actually is a choice though

>>41195268
Exactly what I'm trying to convey
>>41195712
I get what you're saying but then that goes against the whole fight for freedom in the US/west. You can also choose your religion as well yet it is seen as discriminatory if you target people based on their religion

>>41195942
religion is a scam to justify bigotry against gays and always has been
the centerpoint of religion is marriage, i.e. forcing bisexuals and gays to partner with the opposite sex
straight people don't exist

>>41195061
It invalidates the reality of everyone who felt they were forced to suffer through a transphobic/homophobic society when they naturally had a temperament to try to please everyone else and keep their head down.

It also makes a good half of the support non-lgbt people have for lgbt people disappear overnight because it's the core reason most people who support tolerating lgbt people do so.

>>41195942
>You can also choose your religion as well yet it is seen as discriminatory if you target people based on their religion
lmao that's a whole can of worms itself

People who hold views like "gays should all be executed" excuse it because of their religion or ideology and act as if it's simply an immutable trait of their being.

>>41195712
Being trans is not a choice. Gender dysphoria is not a choice. Choosing to transition is a choice, in the exact same way that being gay is not a choice, but choosing to have gay relationships instead of being celibate is a choice.

>>41196027
gender dysphoria is a choice

>>41197258
No it is not