Sounds you're gay/bi.
Explore it safely. I know you think you"shouldn't" be like this. But it's most likely genetic and you've always been like this. Not your fault, no reason to hate yourself

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>>41899961
If you're enjoying it why let it bother you? I swear you /pol/ types are so ridiculous, get fucked up the ass its pretty great and it sounds like you're interested. You don't have to have a fucking crisis about it

larp but mef rly fried these incel niggas' brains

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>>41899961
it doesn’t have to mean you aren’t straight if you don’t want it to. there are a number of cases where people fall in love, genuine love, with someone they didn’t think and generally aren’t attracted to. especially in a case where you haven’t had many close relationships it’s possible him caring for you in that way just triggered something in your touch starved brain. i would encourage you to think about it, even if it’s a woke mind virus, if you think you’d be happier living a different way then it’s at least worth a shot right? it’s also possible you were pressured by society into thinking you were 100% straight and you never felt like examining that claim until you were forced to. we can’t know what’s going on in your head unfortunately, so do think about it, or don’t, it’s your life you’d be ruining

>gets princess carried once
>troons out
chuds really are the funniest people

this story makes me want to princess carry a manlet chud
why do i have to be a tranny

>>41899961
Hey
This is your chance to be happy and self-actualize
Let's take it, yeah?

>>41900152
>Hey
>This is your chance to be happy and self-actualize
>Let's take it, yeah?
I get what you are saying about this being a chance to actually figure myself out, but I honestly do not know what direction that even means for me. Half the time I feel like I am trying to force myself into being the “straight guy” I thought I was supposed to be, and the other half of the time my brain is throwing out ridiculous ideas like maybe I should just troon out or transmax or fag out because nothing about the old version of me was working anyway.

I am not saying any of those are real answers. I am just saying I feel completely lost and my mind keeps offering up random paths I never would have considered before.

And then there is the other thought that guys are never going to respect me and girls are never going to respect me as a man. So honestly shouldn't I at least just let guys degrad me even if I am just some becky that they fuck and forget it's still better than being a KHHV.

I do not know if this is me finally questioning things properly or if I am just spiralling because everything I based my identity on fell apart at once. I guess I am trying to figure out whether this “chance to be happy” is actually real for someone like me or just another cope my brain is throwing out.

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>>41899961
yoonbum ass post
i love it

>>41900196
This is fair, I'm fucking old and forget what it was like to not have all of that introspection done, especially with the extra years of life experience (and at 18 you are basically just starting)
Do you actually wanna be the endgame version of the straight guy you were forcing yourself to be? Does the idea of being a fully actualized chad version of yourself feel good, or is it spiritually incongruous with your sense of self?
And the whole gay/bi/trans thing is pretty fluid anyway, you can always just be a cute twink or a bi nerd or nonbinary or whatever dude
Don't feel obligated to make a decision, but I guess what I was getting at with my first post is that you should explore all of this even if it feels reflexively wrong
Kinda all over the place post sorry, but gl. Very personal journey but you'll figure it out

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>>41900196
>and the other half of the time my brain is throwing out ridiculous ideas like maybe I should just troon out or transmax or fag out because nothing about the old version of me was working anyway.
maybe this half has something to say worth hearing, anon. you just got drunk with a bunch of burly men, played into their pity, and got princess carried upstairs. that is hilariously not straight boy behaviour and i dont even blame the guy for treating you like a girl after that.

>>41900063
if hes really into men hes probably internalised this AAP fantasy of wanting to be a chad to get by. its kinda how a lot of gay boys survive in environments when they become unconsciously aware that the world is hostile to their existence, they essentially attempt to internalise a conception of manhood one could only have if they were never really a masc straight guy to begin with.

>>41899961
>£200 a week for a shoebox
same price as the first year accom at my uni..

>>41900235
This is good advice OP you should take it. Explore yourself. You're still so young, figure out what you like and don't like. Maybe try hooking up with a dude? Or maybe just going on a date, hooking up might be a big step. Or if that sort of thing doesn't interest you try going to some sort of LGBT club on campus and see how that feels. You could also test the waters to see how more trans type stuff feels. Would growing your hair out feel nice? What about dressing more femininely? Hormones? I don't think you need to rush into anything, but I encourage you to keep an open mind and to not shame yourself for what you do or don't end up liking. It'll probably be a whole process and you're only at the beginning of it, but even if you do end up realizing you're just a straight man keeping an open mind and accepting whatever you might find out about yourself will only help you in the long run. Wishing you the best anon

>>41900196
>So honestly shouldn't I at least just let guys degrad me even if I am just some becky that they fuck and forget it's still better than being a KHHV.
They won't forget you, you live in the same accom as them. They'll take good care of you :)

>>41899961
My advice: Dress up like a girl "as a joke" and drink with them

>>41899961
Hey anon, this originally happened to me when I was in middle school. Then I started estrogen at 16, prepare your self. Yes men like this really can change your brain

>>41900323
Hey wait a minute. I feel called out.

>>41902318
giwtwm

Instead I only grew up with the asshole flavor of guys who just beat the fuck out of me instead of treating me nicely

>>41902343
not that anon but same. theres no escaping them completely, only giving yourself the best tools you can possibly have to passify and manipulate them.

>>41902371
Yeah...

But the main thing is trooning out a decade earlier. I was a faggot growing up but it was violently beaten out of me and only was able to resurface in the past few years.

>>41902385
same. thought about it at 19, thought i was too fucked from what i went through and should just stay gay. transitioned at 29 after realising its my only viable option. thankfully my body was never particularly good at masculinising outside of bodyfat, and even then i still somehow got a WHR of .8 and a face that looks vaguely butchish lesbian at a low body weight.

>>41902403
God, similar to mine. Considered it at 17, thought I was ngmi, trooned out at 25. I did have questions about it between those two times as well as just frankly weird gender shit growing up.

I unfortunately have a 19" bideltoid and 17" biacromial but I have good hips.

>>41902416
one of those where you sorta walk up to it, look at it with a mix of longing and worry, then walk away because its not viable/not for you/whatever keeps you from swallowing that and risking being completely helpless against what the world wants to do to you? i was distinctly gay in behaviour pre-adolesence. female friend groups, very much in with the bookish girls. boys did not view me as one of them at all. i think i actually wound up playing on a girls hockey team at one point lmao. then secondary school happened and i discovered i was now a target for physical violence, and my time having female friends was very much over.

my proportions for an AMAB are weird, ive actually never fit mens clothing. didnt know til i tried getting into menswear to look more twinkish but apparently a 38 chest with a 15" biacromial is not normal proportions for a male at all and sourcing jackets that i could wear proved impossible. /fa/ once accused me of being a pooner. post hrt my trochanters are actually wider than my shoulders at the bone even though i transitioned so late, and if i check at the delt with a plumb the fat distribtion has actually made my hips wider than my shoulders, which is wild to think about given i never looked like this pre-e.

>>41899961
yu shud learn how to suck dick better then any bitch @ uni and win him over, that's the strat

>>41900196
>Half the time I feel like I am trying to force myself into being the “straight guy” I thought I was supposed to be, and the other half of the time my brain is throwing out ridiculous ideas like maybe I should just troon out or transmax or fag out because nothing about the old version of me was working anyway.
This is a clear sign that youre not straight. Straight men don't ever have the thought of"what if I'm gay". They just aren't gay and don't think about it

>>41900071
False..op is gay

>>41902216
>My advice: Dress up like a girl "as a joke" and drink with them
Do you think they'll end up fucking him?
You made me hard..

>>41899961
from your posts sounds like you're UK based, and honestly half of the uni rugby boys are a little bicurious nowadays, especially if they're CS student adjacent. just act more feminine and comfortable in what feels right to yourself and who knows, you could get some good dick to go along with it.

>>41902529
I was very faggoty pre puberty but it was in a way that a lot of my female peers and authority figures absolutely loathed. Like, my most important memory from elementary school was of being scolded and called insane by a teacher because I kept trying to socialize mostly with girls. It was a religious school too.

I had a femme phase in middle school but was scolded out of that, too, and had a lot of difficulty with shame and feeling like I didn't belong with the girls during that time, too. I did notice I had some oddly feminine fat distribution (large thighs) back then as well, and a lot of my physical habits (ex: posture) were more feminine too.

Come puberty and I masculinized a lot, but not before I tried killing myself out of self loathing from simultaneously being too much of a fag and too masc. Didn't even realize HRT was a thing until I was 17.

My hips are still nice and wide but my shoulders and upper ribs are big. My ribs are really weird. They're feminine in shape (no rib flare, have an hourglass shape) but like, 20% larger than what they should otherwise be.

>>41899961
This never happened, but it's fun to imagine it did

>>41902589
This screams trans
Your body has always known you're a woman.
Basically your brain didn't masculinize in the womb and stayed in female configuration. And has been telling your xy body that you're really a female.
The moment you start living as a woman, your body will feminize more on its own, no hrt

>>41902709
I mean, I'm not OP. I've been on HRT for 1.5 years and have feminized really well, but I don't have an internal identity of a woman in a consistent fashion.

I wish I was a woman, though, but I feel like testosterone kinda poisoned my brain and body and has left some patterns that I really wish would just fade away. Even more stereotypically feminine activities I used to engage with "as a guy" can bring back memories of that and make me feel shitty.

>>41902732
I see.
Nothing has been your fault so why give it attention ? It's something you can't change. Everyone has their flavor of trans.

>>41902747
It isn't but it's really frustrating. I struggle to cook anymore because I built an identity of "a good big brother" on helping teach my younger brother how to cook.

That and the dysphoria I feel regarding like, the physical sensation of my ribs/shoulders is awful. I don't even know if I would have transitioned if I was smaller.

fuck my ogrechud retard life

>>41902589
i mean, my female friend circle was always small. the bulk of girls saw boy and wanted nothing to do with me, but there was consistently between 2 and 4 girls in every class that would befriend me and exactly 0 boys. unfortunately that lead to me being in some uncomfortable situations growing up, because i was apparently still boy enough in their eyes to approach with things id rather they never have even thought about with me.

>religious school
oh fuck, im really sorry, anon. i think i once called a female teacher a "schizophrenic split ass" which i somehow overheard my dad say once and thought it was the ideal thing to say to an adult woman in a position of power over me, but beyond that i actually did pretty well with teachers at that age even if they did lowkey drop hints that i was a closeted gay boy at times.

when i was in secondary school i had kinda similar experiences to what you described. i had to clock little things i was doing that made me stick out as a target for abuse, starting with speech patterns. i think i was genuinely used to talking with girls as girls talk at that point and i remember once talking with someone in a new school for the first time and literally every kid in the class turned to stare at me. then there was voice, courtesy of my mothers comments on it, internalising some foux bravado, etc. urgh. i dont think i ever really got posture and mannerisms 100% down. i still dont know if its normal to shake your hair into position like im on some kind of shampoo commercial as a guy because i was forced to get short haircuts as a teen under threat of homelessness.

i had similar experiences w body stuff, but my way of dealing with it was just to retreat from all self consciousness and essentially depression eat. at least that kept me from unwanted sexualisation. i still wonder if that stunted my growth. a girl on the bus once asked me to hold my hand up to hers and pointed out to me that my hand was significantly smaller.

>>41902789
Big brother who cares for the small ones and cooks? That's another indication you're a beautiful woman

>>41902878
I literally trained my faggy voice out of me because of abuse from peers and bullying from my own family. It was bad and I am still struggling with accepting my naturally faggy voice.

Also I do have tiny hands but they are awkwardly masculine in proportion.

>>41902898
It would be but it brings back memories of being a guy and I feel really shitty. It was my *thing*, I guess. It's what made me feel okay as a guy. I was a good big brother and a good son and now I'm a useless tranny.

>>41902976
>I literally trained my faggy voice out of me because of abuse from peers and bullying from my own family. It was bad and I am still struggling with accepting my naturally faggy voice.
yeah exactly fucking that desu. its so fucking bizarre remembering that i literally voice trained to sound more masculine because my mother wouldnt shut up making weird comments about it and my body, and i still really only drop to my natural, relaxed voice when im actually completely comfortable and dont feel the slightest pressure or anxiety.

>Also I do have tiny hands but they are awkwardly masculine in proportion.
are you actually certain of that? because i have a 1:1 2D:4D

>>41902976
>>41903005
oh and, if it helps, i had a "i need to cook nice things for people" and "i need to be a responsible older sibling" phase too, both at the same time. at one point i put my little brother up in the living room and we ate exclusively home baked bread for like 4 months.

>>41903005
Left hand my ring finger is slightly longer, right hand it's about 1:1. However, I remember it being a little different before puberty (TF2 pyro video) and noting "huh I have a gay male finger ratio but I'm not gay."

I have tiny wrists (6" circumference) and my hands are the size of my mother's. However she's probably a femrepper lmao.

>>41903019
I cooked both as a way of like, courtship and to be a good child/brother. I feel really shitty that I can't/don't do that anymore.

I don't want to be a male but it just makes me feel that way and it sucks.

>>41903038
>I have tiny wrists (6" circumference) and my hands are the size of my mother's. However she's probably a femrepper lmao.
my mother used to get drunk/high and brag about getting into fights and hanging around with boys as a kid. in particular she was quite fond of one story where she beat a boy up, he went home and told his mother, his mother came to my grans asking after the boy that beat up her son, and when my gran shouted down for my mother the poor kids mother got livid that her son lost a fight to a girl and beat the poor kid a second time.

>>41903048
yeah, i was in my first year of living together with a guy and i wanted to make him feel like he lived in a proper home with someone. i got really into cooking when my guy had a bad work site injury a couple years ago making pan sauces and rouxs and such and i burned myself out with it. havent felt like cooking the same way since.

>>41903058
Jesus Christ that's not okay.

I mean I think my mom is a femrepper because she took my sister's (gender neutral) deadname and started butchcoping.

I made a post about it a week or so ago but my family is insane.

>>41903068
I got really into cooking for my college roommate (and later my dad) and it was really nice. I just wish those memories weren't of me as irredeemably male.

>>41903038
6" wrists are not tiny

>>41903094
At my height they are.

>>41903072
>Jesus Christ that's not okay.
north of england. the people here are not exactly people like you and i are.

>I mean I think my mom is a femrepper because she took my sister's (gender neutral) deadname and started butchcoping.
that is mad, but possibly maybe at least better than violence coping. one time my mother charged a man who threatened her with a knife, took it off him, and proceeded to beat the everloving fuck out of him. she was a fucking terrifying beast of a woman. sometimes i think that if she wasnt a disgusitng homophobic creep she would genuinely have made a great dad.

>>41903080
maybe you need to sympathise more with your male selfs heart. you werent where you wanted to be, but your heart was very much in the right place.

>>41903094
they kinda are for males desu. im 6.5 and im tiny compared to most men. i am fat rn tho so they could be smaller at a lower weight.

>>41903115
My male self was a good guy. He was. It's just not who I want to be. Call it Autoandrophobia if you'd like. Just, I don't want to be that even if it was easier in many ways. I think he was a better person than I am now.

Also yeah I checked the ANSUR data set. For both male and female data sets, my predicted wrist circumference based on height is 0.3" larger for females and 0.8" larger for males.

>>41902216
>My advice: Dress up like a girl "as a joke" and drink with them
How would I even bring that up to them though? Do I just say it straight or pretend it's a joke first?

Honestly I’ve been thinking about it more and I feel like I might just fag out at this point. And if I end up liking it maybe I’ll troon out before the Norwood reaper turns me into a 40 year old cope machine.

And who knows, maybe I’d even have a shot with the rugby guy. I’ve heard their initiation stuff is insanely homoerotic anyway, so maybe he wouldn’t even blink.

>>41903153
i get that. i was trying back then, but i wasnt exactly making it. "struggling" might be an apt description for twink me but keeping that kindness towards him and affection for what he experienced is a key part of maintaining my current commitments. if i dont care for who he was at least on the inside and respect his determination, i cant love the people he loved as he loved them, and that would break my heart.

looked at the ansur data for my wrists and theyre right at the bottom end of male wrist sizes and the top end of female wrist sizes for my height. biacromial is respectably narrow though, lot of cis women with wider shoulders than me it seems.

>>41903346
I wasn't ever really a twink as a guy, either. I was just weird and very overweight. Wide hips and narrow hands, but big legs and shoulders and ribs. Some very odd positive androgyny. 19" bideltoid and 17" biacromial, putting my bideltoid in average male for my height but my biacromial significantly above average male. I assume there was a measuring error so I'd need help measuring it again.

>>41903381
were you low or high muscle mass?

>>41903392
Idk desu. I grew up overweight. Gained a lot starting with puberty and especially after my suicide attempt. Like I'm my middle school weight rn (160lbs).

>>41902976
>now I'm a useless tranny.
You're not
You're a loving and caring person. You're beautiful

>>41903515
No like I have weird health issues now that make normal living really hard. Anxiety has gotten worse too. Physical touch is painful.

Doctors are useless too unfortunately.

>>41903019
That's our female instinct.
I'm like that too.
Always cooking and taking care of the small ones.
>>41903048
You behaved like a woman, not a "big brother".

>>41903535
Iunno, I really framed it like being a good big brother. I tried to frame it as being a mom like figure later but as things got worse cooking got harder.

I honestly just want to completely run from my family. They're insane.

>>41899961
congrats on your gay awakening brother

>>41903229
You need a real girl to dress you up just tell her about how you felt when you were princess carried and i bet lots are willing to help

>>41903229
>How would I even bring that up to them though? Do I just say it straight or pretend it's a joke first?
You can just go drinking and say "you carried me like a GIRL lol"
Then joke about it and let it pass. Then here and then sparkle "we girls do this", "I'll become your girl cheerleader", "you will have to Carry me more hehe"

>>41903525
Are you in therapy?

>>41903548
>I honestly just want to completely run from my family. They're insane.
I'm sad...
I hope you can find someone who loves you deeply

>>41903612
Yes. Have been since before I started HRT.

>>41903623
It's not like they don't care for me, it's that they're insane.

>>41903606
U have a crazy degree of autism

>>41903633
:(
I feel you.
My family is also mentally unhealthy

>>41903785
Why?
Won't it work?