I'm genuinely curious, this is the question that always lead to the downfall in the debate.The question is asked "What is a woman?" and most of the time the pro-trans debate falls apart.The trans community is large and has significant places like reddit to for their Echo-chamber. Why haven't they come together to create a strong answer to that question?Why haven't they made some sticky thread on the biggest sub-reddit so they can create an answer that they can all use when asked in a debate?
>>42195188The lgbtq as a whole is so divided in these times and should become more united as there is more oppression on the way but it probably won’t happen
>>42195188Because cissoids are idiots, trannies don't all believe the same thing, and people prefer simple, incomplete answers over long, thorough ones.
didn't readLMAO KIRK GOT FUCKING BLASTEDTHAT SHIT WAS AMAZING
>>42195188Because the "adult AFaB" definition excludes them despite its really long tenure as the functional definition (though without the implicit "assigned sex" context said out loud because we used to just chuck intersex specimens down a cliffside)
>>42195188a woman is the feminine social class
>>42195188never gotten a good definition of sex from a phobe, the moment you prod them on it they fold
>>42195188>The question is asked "What is a woman?" and most of the time the pro-trans debate falls apart.Why does the pro-kirk debate falls apart whenever him agreeing with keeping his 10 year old daughter pregnant in case of rape gets brought up?
>>42195188every definition you can give will either sound retarded, be exclusionary or will be too long-windedi personally say a woman is anyone who the majority of people can look at and agree that that's their gender, so this includes both biological women and passoids, but not hons it's a pointless debate to have beyond that, because if someone is convinced that chromosomes are the only thing that matters for example, they're never gonna change their mind even if ftms and intersex people exist because they're just transphobic
the only two possible answers are born with pussy or anyone who claims to be a woman and its easy to see how ridiculous the second one could wind up but that doesnt change the fact that a man in panties with smooth legs b cups long blonde hair smells like cherrys gets me fuckin bricked
>>42195188Adult human female is flawless. There is no good response>what about muh intersexThey're intersex regardless of what we look like or guess based on appearance
>>42195284I am Charlie Kirk and I BELIEVE in hot plapspoonersdaughtersfemale dogswhatever
>>42195310im with you but not with the "majority of people agree" stuff because thats not how stuff works in practice. i think theres a lot of transphobic people who would refuse to acknowledge passoids as women, but would obviously treat them exactly like women in a normal context.
>>42195188You can't really define "woman" without excluding people. I think "woman" is anyone who looks like one and occupies a female social role, but this definition would exclude low effort hons or early stage troons.
>>42195351I mean, I treat trannies like women as best I can even if I'm starting a dorky male with like, not exactly a convincing costumeGerman spies weren't Russians, lmao
>>42195188The only real answer is that there is no objectively correct answer since it's an entirely subjective philosophical/linguistic question.
>>42195333>the only two possible answers are born with pussy or anyone who claims to be a womanfalse dichotomy>doesnt change the fact that a man in panties with smooth legs b cups long blonde hair smells like cherrys gets me fuckin brickedchasers should hang themselves
>>42195413chasers should love themselves and reward their attraction to tranny bodies and tranny souls
>>42195413show hole?
>>42195351sorry, i didn't mean majority of people agree as in "if people were told someone was trans would they agree they were a woman even if they passed", i meant "if people saw this person in an everyday context and they were stealth, would they believe immediately and truly that the person was a biological woman" the answer is yes for stealth passoid, but no for hons, even if they get pity treated like a woman because they're out
>>42195188The answer is simple. A woman is someone who is born with female reproductive organs. That is all.
A woman is anyone perceived as an adult human female by others.Yes, this excludes non-passers, and that's fine. Insisting that a definition include either all trannies or exclude all trannies is a trap.
>>42195543>perceived byAnd then trannies try to force cis people into lying about what they perceive. You've twisted the real definition of a woman, to include perception which is incorrect. A woman is an adult female. Trannies are adult males. Therefore trannies are not women.
>>42195588I don't force anyone. I've been asked to do things nobody perceived as a male would be asked to do. Seethe.
>>42195218
>>42195604Such as?
>>42195588I have never once asked a stranger to gender me as female, and yet it happens. It's also very easy to tell pity passing vs real passing.
>>42195633Let's assume that everyone genders you female upon seeing you, you still aren't a woman.
>>42195605Yes, "gender critical" is a circlejerk
>>42195646Ok and?
>>42195652You can't give birth, which is all women are good for.
>>42195652The point is you don't want to be a woman. That's not your primary objective. What you want is to trick strangers into thinking you're a woman, when you're a gross gooner man with AGP.
>>42195679>no! you're not allowed to adopt feminine presentation! only ciswombyns may do that!
>>42195651Gender Critical is the majority of regular people
>>42195711No, GC is an exterminationist ideology at this point, because they radicalized themselves in their echo chambers.Regular people see what the UK and US are doing to trans people and think, "Hold on, that's a bit much."
>>42195726You're in you're own echo chamber if you think regular people think what's happening in the UK and US as bad.
>>42195736A terfhon telling me I'm in an echo chamber. Cute.
>>42195706You can be a crossdresser if that's what you want, but you can't be a woman.
>>42195792I wear men's clothing, but other people seem to think I'm a woman anyway.
>>42195188We've had this discussion countless times, you bad-faith cunts just don't like the counterarguments so you pretend they don't exist and say "why nobody answer???"fuck OFF my board
>>42195809No one on this board passes. Random people you meet aren't going to go out of their way to tell you they know you're a man. Most people are trying to avoid conflict in real life situations. You can't tell what they're thinking though, and more than likely they're thinking that you are trans.
>>42195711>t. a dude who's hasn't talked with a person face-to-face since he graduated
>>42195828What is a woman?>BAD FAITH CUNT ARREGGGH *MALE TESTOSTERONE RAGE INCREASE*lol
>>42195838>You can't tell what they're thinking>more than likely they're thinking thatlmao
>>42195333>t. Gay Man
>>42195660You been getting women pregnant lately anon?
>>42195868If you pass as a woman to cis people, then you must be much shorter than the average man. If you're towering over women and eye-to-eye level with most men, ppl are definitely going to question whether you are a woman or man in their mind.
>>42195543>trannies is a trapBased and Ackbarpilled
>>42195726>Regular people see what the UK and US are doing to trans people and think, "Hold on, that's a bit much."No we don't actually, I think "I wonder how we can break through the ideological capture of the institutions and make that happen here in the Netherlands".
>>42195899People see my height, but then they see my face and build, and visibly recalibrate.
>>42195861The reaction is kind of beautiful in a way. It has a weird elegance to it.
>>42195927You are not a regular person. You are an obsessed autist.
>>42195931>I can read people's minds Hey neat definitely not autism.
>>42195948Don't be so hard on yourself>>42195838It's always fun to be like, "why is that guy wearing a -- oh", or, "damn, look at the size of that bitc -- oh" when your brain sparks for a half second and then you realize the haywire is the fact you're assuredly witnessing a wild tranny
>>42195968do you have a hard time picking up social cues? and call others autistic?
>>42195968Do you not notice people's facial expressions and body language? Do you not understand them? Have you never watched somebody do a double take?
>>42195968>Reading people's facial expressions is mind reading
>>42195976>>42195979>>42195980Today is the day we learned that terfs are even more autistic than we could have ever imagined
>>42195976>>42195979>>42195980>I can tell i pass because I'm reading people's minds in public....yes they're all desiring me and think I'm booeyful wimmnins Lol you guys are fucking retards on this board man. I had no idea you all are like this
>>42195971>n-no youdefinitely not a response of an obsessed autist>>42195838>>42195868>>42195968>>42196016>you cannot read minds, but i can, because i just do, okay?
>>42196036Observing another person's body language and facial expression is not "reading minds.">that person is smiling but it is impossible to predict how they are feeling because you cannot read their mindActually that makes sense for terfs with how many of them seem to interpret a man smiling as him wanting to rape them
>>42196036So you think that women see you in public towering over them, massive shoulder span, with a man's height and man features and they think you're a woman?It seems like what you're saying is more far-fetched than what I'm saying.
>>42195736that's pretty funny
>>42196081>massive shoulder spanwrong>man featuresalso wrong lol
>>42196099Did you have lots of surgeries to look like wumans? Because without surgery none of you look female, and even with surgery most of you still look male.
>>42195188The anti-trans right also cannot give a precise answer to this question, they just rely on thought stopping cliches like "common sense"
I am a woman because I look like a woman and people treat me like a woman. Its literally that simple. People who ask this question disingenuously tell me this doesn't count as an answer but this is just the reality of it. A woman is someone that people look at and go 'that is a woman' subconsciously and if you have that experience enough you just are a woman lol
>>42196130No, I did not have lots of surgery. Didn't need it to look female.
>>42195188nobody smart is interested in trying to debate kirk, walsh, etc. because they know it's a waste of timethose guys aren't interested in grappling with the strongest version of their opponents' case, they want to clip farm random undergraduates and make youtube compilations out of themif they come off poorly in an encounter they just don't post itacademics have a good answer here ("woman" is like "tree" in that it denotes a member of a cluster which tends to possess some number of a bunch of traits, but no one of those traits is itself a necessary or sufficient condition to be a tree or a woman, the boundaries of this type of term are necessarily fuzzy)some people have argued against using this kind of term (see peter unger's "why there are no people") but walsh and kirk aren't interested in arguments of that type. they're perfectly happy to keep using the words "tree" and "person", they just want to employ tactical nihilism against trans people.
>>42195861There's no such thing as a woman. It's a mass hallucination.
>>42196326Woman = socialized to be useless except as a hole
>>42196342>I'm a misogynist who claims to be a woman or want to be a woman Trannies are autistic incels
>>42196363Women can be misogynists. Stop being sexist.
>>42195188I post the answer all the time and get zero replies because you're not actually interested in the historical origins of gender and how it's maintained and how it has evolved
>>42196430So post it
>>42195188"Anyone"
>>42196435https://www.taylorfrancis.com/books/oa-mono/10.4324/9781003053330/even-gender-briggs-georgehttps://www.repository.cam.ac.uk/items/be498b33-8213-42b8-ab92-8db9a2c2f0b0https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/european-journal-of-archaeology/article/to-gender-or-not-to-gender-exploring-gender-variations-through-time-and-space/233DF85AFEA29A765D05C8735E681CE8There was a time before gender, obviously, it has to have been constructed at some point, and archaeological evidence points to the social construction of gender happening in conjunction with other kinds of class systems emerging with the advent of private property and agriculture. That's a very simplified version of the truth, things happened differently in different places and at different time. The important thing here is that humans existed as humans without the current binary of gender we use now, we didn't have a group of women and a group of men, we could have divided people up all kinds of ways; children, people that can get pregnant, the people that went on the hunt, the old and the infirm. If you asked what is a woman then you wouldn't have an answer, we hadn't invented that idea yet, that social divide. At some point, to do with ownership, it became important to be able to inherit property, so you needed to guard your lineage, and that's probably where we get the idea of men and women, and with that comes gender roles, you can probably see how that happens, and how the end result of that is the nuclear family. The problem with this division of course is that people don't always want to fit into this binary or want to be part of this construction of gender, and so we've found all kinds of ways to police and punish people, and rebels have also found their own ways to resist the binary. The truth of gender is that it is not innate, and it can be constructed differently, and it has been constructed differently.
>>42196147I am a good person. I go into public and I am a good person because I attend events and donate money to my community, which I've worked in for years.And I um Frtizl'd my wife, my daughter, my daughter-wife, her kids, etc. in my basement.;)
>>42196784do you suppose people have some kind of good or bad essence? a righteous or evil soul?if you exist as a good person in public and a bad person in private that's all there is to it, there is no extra truth, when your private behaviour becomes public you become a bad person in public too.map that onto a trans person if you want, if a trans person turns into a different gender when they get home that would make them gender fluid or something, if that gets out and people then treat them as that gender they are in private then they'd become that gender in both private and public
>>42196241this is why we're laughed at bc our brightest minds have been brainwashed into jewish pilpul to think redefining the word woman is a philosophical front in the liberation of queer people. >what is a woman?an adult human female. >what is a trans woman?put another way,>what do ALL trans women have in common? they're males. you can NOT be a trans woman without first being male.
>>42196761gender was invented with sexual differentiation stop being a retard
>>42196898Trvke
Holes seething that trannies don't have to endure periods or pregnancy lmao
