>>43105869
In my experience no

no. fem gay men are lesser equals to normal gay men which is still way more equal than cis women

>>43105874
what has your experience been with that?

>>43105869
Women see gay men as threats or someone to be jealous of

They get to have all the social perks of being on top of the social food chain (as a natal male) while also having the benefits of being feminine.

Feminine Amabs get to be feminine without it being a threat to their well-being.

>>43105978
Friend groups in high school and university

>>43106007
>fem gay men
>top of the social food chain
um wat

>>43106023
you aren't being specific at all
WHAT were your experiences

>>43106044
>fem gay men
>top of the social food chain
>Um wat
We're talking about the perspective of women. No amount of larping will make society see you as less than women

You are a male with the natural ability to produce testosterone and attack people, and you aren't limited by a biological event that disrupts your mentality on a monthly basis

>>43106115
I think women are fully aware that fem gay men are lower down on the social ladder than they are.

>>43106131
Literally no one sees it that way

FTMs literally fetishize being a gay male. Because they get to be the submissive role, while also having the respect of being a male. It makes the submission far more enjoyable, because it's not a
role forced by nature, it's forced by their partner.

Straight women just see gay men as men who have the advantage of being pretty without the downsides of being a cis female.

Even homophobic men see you as above women, that's why they're homophobic lol. Probably only gay men see flamboyant gays as less than women, and that's just because they're fetishizing it.

no they should transition

>>43106194
>nobody is aware that fem gay men are ostracized
you live on planet claire
>fem gay men are respected as males
hearty chortles

I'm not saying fem gay men aren't stronger or smarter than women are, but they certainly are not treated better or regarded more highly in the social pecking order and it's clear you have never ever lived a day as a flamer.

>>43105869
they do this thing where they pretend to on the surface while ultimately showing their disrespect in ways they can't be called out

>>43106207
>fem gay men are respected as males
There isn't entire legislature dedicated to controlling their fucking bodies you dipshit nigger

Maybe stop fucking poop out of peoples assholes and you won't get treated like the shit fucker that you are you fuck head

You can literally just stop being a gross faggot. Meanwhile women are literally seen, from birth, as a type of cattle that should be controlled and legislated against. How much of a subhuman faggot do you have to be. Kill yourself

>>43106277
because they can do it without legislation
gay men are enslaved by female mind control and social tactics
why admit they are doing it when they are getting away with it regardless?

>>43106253
this anon knows what's up
any stories?

>>43106277
insane and you don't belong itt. not sure why you think you belong itt if you think "You can literally just stop being a gross faggot." you revealed yourself to be a privileged cishet passing moid. GTFO.

>>43106308
>"You can literally just stop being a gross faggot."
Anon, literally just don't have sex if you think being gay is corrupting your social standing so bad. It's how society did it for thousand of fucking years before.

Literally every CEO in America right now is publicly homosexual. I don't know why you want to hold onto this delusion so fucking much.

Sorry boys didn't let you into their locker room because you look like you're going to eat their cock. Swallow your pride and fake a deep voice like we all do, and they'll start treating you like they do other men: by making fun of you and disparaging things about you that make you different from them.

You're just creating your own miserable destiny with this delusion you're holding on to

What about fem straight men

>>43106472
>Literally every CEO in America right now is publicly homosexual.
based

>>43106502
The most oppressed race

The entirety of homophobia and transphobia is because women hate men who can be as desirable and attractive as them

I lived through a lot of trauma because women decided I shouldn't be allowed to live because only real vagina women should be allowed to be pursued by men

Equals? No lol

An existential level threat to women's well being that has to be rounded up and exterminated? Yes

>>43106509
But zero fucks given amirite is more about naturally being beyond all dualities for us

>>43106502
repressing gays

>>43106530
you downed the whole bottle of blackpills

>>43106472
idk why you are being mean? you are proving me right by doing that. i can't even come to the gayest corner of the internet without being called delusional and talked down to by some cishet passing guy who thinks it's so easy to just repress and conform. you have no idea how hard it is for fem gnc guys. i tried harder than 99% of cishet men to man up

>>43106472
>Literally every CEO in America right now is publicly homosexual. I don't know why you want to hold onto this delusion so fucking much.
retarded
>Misinformation & Hyperbole
>The thread contains high levels of hyperbole, typical of 4chan's "blackpill" culture. One particularly egregious claim is that "Literally every CEO in America right now is publicly homosexual."
>Fact Check: This is factually incorrect. While LGBTQ+ representation in corporate leadership has grown, it remains a small minority. As of the most recent data heading into 2026, fewer than 1.5% of Fortune 500 CEOs are openly LGBTQ+. The vast majority of corporate power remains held by cisgender, heterosexual men.

>>43105869
no. were either everything they wished they could be or the shit on their shoe, depending on what fantasies about us they would like to entertain. personally id like to exist outside of womens fantasies.

>>43106007
>Feminine Amabs get to be feminine without it being a threat to their well-being.
aah yes, the great fujoshi delusion.

>>43106194
>Literally no one sees it that way
we know

>because it's not a
role forced by nature, it's forced by their partner.
they have 0 fucking clue lol. 0 clue what its like to try and exist like this, when the entire world thinks you either shouldnt exist or should exist somewhere less bothersome for them or should only exist in their fantasies.

rare is the woman whos introduced to the meaning of sex by the taste of their own blood.

>>43106502
simultaneously societies perpetual victim class and its most virulent abuser class

>>43106277
>racial slur
>homophobia
>ego so large it blinds them to any other point
former straight boy or failed FtM i wonder

they spit blood out from one mouth, i another. thats the difference between cis women and me. gender is the division of sex and violence, and those who wont be agents will be objects.

>>43106472
>Swallow your pride and fake a deep voice like we all do
you are a fucking moron. i did this. i did everything i could to pull this off. it didnt work. take your disgusting, soul devouring delusion and shove it up your ass. hopefully itll eat you alive.

>>43106530
dont forget, your body was meant for them. they shed years of their lives for you, held you for 9 months even, all so that you can go chasing cock from some man as a man? oh that wont do.

>>43106705
Because you're saying that your sexual orientation is more definite than someone's physical sex. That genuinely insane if you actually think that.

There is literally nothing a woman can do any different that's going to make the typical misogynist hate them any less. They can't have any less of a vagina or ovaries. They can't somehow be less of a woman in the ways that matter to a misogynist.

But your sexuality, or even your personality, isn't nearly as tangible as someone's birth sex. You don't have to act or sound in one strict, permanent way. You don't have even have to show the parts of yourself that matter to a homophobe.

It's like you're denying trying to play the cards you're dealt, and you just want them to work for you as they are. But NO ONE ELSE on the fucking planet gets to do that. We all have to figure out ways to be a kind of social chameleon and destigmatize people's perception of you. We all hide parts of ourselves that other male us unpalatable to other people.

So to say that somehow YOU have it worse than someone who LITERALLY CANNOT HIDE the aspects of them that some people hate, is batshit insane

>>43106735
It clearly resonated with people because we never have had so many extremely influencial public figures, CEOs and military contractors that are openly flamboyantly gay like we do now.

It shows that you can still hold influence as long as you make yourself, at the very least, useful to others

>>43106928
most of society believes in physical binary sex, but does not believe in fixed sexual orientations or anything other than universal heterosexuality

>>43106928
>There is literally nothing a woman can do any different that's going to make the typical misogynist hate them any less.
tren
if i can destroy myself and live a shadow of a life for the thinly veiled, barely abstracted pedophilic gratification of others, you can shed your fucking birth sex.

>>43106928
i never said any of that, idek what you are on about. you must be confusing me with some other anon

>>43106891
>rare is the woman whos introduced to the meaning of sex by the taste of their own blood.
>Autistic violent tranny moment.
I think you're insinuating that your experiences with sex/opening up about sex were met with violence.

If you think women don't experience that when expressing their sexuality you're retarded. Women will also get violence for NOT expressing their sexuality. They don't even have a default role they can occupy without experiencing violence for it. You can at least be not so sex obsessed that people know you're a faggot.

I am trans also but I think where we differ is that you people GENUINELY think you deserve sex or some sexual experience. You think every single human being deserves to have sex within their lifetime or else they didn't get a life. I don't know where the fuck you freaks can up with this idea, probably media, but it's turned you into disgusting rapehon freaks who think you HAVE to shove your sexuality in other people's faces because you think you sex is obligated to every human on the planet, it's not.

>>43106985
And yet FTMs still get stigmatized lmfao? I'm saying that even with T, those Afabs will be stigmatized against because they were literally born females.

You're trying to equate that to your desire for sex, or personality characteristics. That's insane.

>>43107112
>I am trans also but I think where we differ is that you people GENUINELY think you deserve sex or some sexual experience.
If there's two gay people willing to have sex with each other then they deserve to have sex with each other. It's not entitled at all

>>43107112
>If you think women don't experience that when expressing their sexuality you're retarded. Women will also get violence for NOT expressing their sexuality. They don't even have a default role they can occupy without experiencing violence for it.
the approximate corollary experience to mine is a lesbian being groped from ages 6+ and being raped at age 12. that is how this functions.

you are based on your understanding and experience almost certainly a straight boy on estrogen therapy. you have no concept of this, and were likely either an abuser or complicit in the abuse my kind and our cisf counterparts experience. not one of my kind is at all ignorant of the experience i am talking about or its meaning, even if they have other words and ways of thinking about it. only natal straight people have the gall to deny it exists altogether.

>And yet FTMs still get stigmatized lmfao
how are they going to tell? tren is the most virilising androgen there is short of straight up DHT. this is the equivalent of "just stay in the closet bro". im tired if hearing vague allusions to an obligation to emotional pederasty for the reason im getting fired, or having my shit examined far more closely than any of my colleagues, or other such fun stuff.

>>43107178
anon its not so much about entitlement to sex as it is the entitlement to exist. this clueless kid toucher wont admit that tho.

>>43107178
>>43107207
This conversation isn't about gay people's rights to exist, it's about who has higher or lower social standings in society.
You can manipulate your sexuality and personality into being seen as higher status. Women cannot manipulate their social standings nearly as easily.

>>43106985
i shot up steroids and went to the gym every day for 2 years trying to man up, completely immersed myself in cishet masc culture, tried suppressing all my gay behavior, forced myself to hook up with women, and everyone could still tell i was gay. these people who think you can just magically act straight are just showing their autistic lack of empathy and theory of mind

>>43107308
women don't want gay men to exist

>>43107308
>You can manipulate your sexuality and personality into being seen as higher status. Women cannot manipulate their social standings nearly as easily.
you are comically clueless. again, its a knowledge issue. you dont know what you dont know.

>>43107313
please dont do autists dirty like that, ive met no shortage of autists with a great capacity for empathy. this has a particular signature to it, look at the desire to beat down gay men, sexualize all women, and make everything about access to little kids. they cant help but make it visible, because its just what they are.

>>43107308
>You can manipulate your sexuality and personality into being seen as higher status
>>>/r9k/

>>43107351
you are right sorry

>>43107313
>>43107365
for what its worth i completely agree with you besides that bit. there is an unbridgable gap between me and them and we both know it.

>>43107313
>these people who think you can just magically act straight are just showing their autistic lack of empathy and theory of mind
Jesus fuck I've done it for years. I'm not even saying it's a better way to live, its not. But at least you have the option, women don't. Therefore I think women are going to be "lower" in society. That's my only point.

>>43107344
Please turn off your computer and go the fuck outside

>>43107351
>you are comically clueless. again, its a knowledge issue. you dont know what you dont know.
And you are hated for a valid reason

>>43107365
>You can manipulate your sexuality and personality into being seen as higher status
This is literally the opposite of what incels say, the hate it when I say it to them too. That's something you should think about

>>43107404
>And you are hated for a valid reason
yeah fuck off, straggot. i hope women keep denying you access to their bodies for the rest of time.

>um akshully girls love us fem gays bottoms
as long as you are good token queers who arent hotter than them and reassure them every moment that you are a subhuman and lesser than them for not having vaginas lmao

most of my childhood was spent in prison with women torturing me for fun because i was a gay boy and males exist only to die in wars, coal mines, or make money for women, and my existence is an atrocity to womankind

>>43107415
Don't project so much. Some of us actually had to learn how to mask our sexuality instead of trying to excuse it by hating on women

>>43107449
the second you threaten to be higher than a woman in the social hierarchy, she will turn on you, and use your being gay/fem against you

>>43107404
you're a loose cannon. im not part of the argument about totem poles. i see no use arguing about that. im simply against people coming to the gayest corner of the internet to tell fem gays to man up, thats predator behavior.
these are my posts in itt
>>43106253 >>43106308 >>43106705 >>43106735 >>43106990 >>43107313

>>43107463
i dont believe you. ive never met one of my kind who thinks like you do. not once. you are always, always one of them.

>>43107466
yes
its fucking pathetic

im a straight passing tranny now and its fucking disgusting how women pretend to be the biggest victims of gender roles in the world

the split second a guy likes me more than even the most wokest of women its suddenly YWNBAW and my vagina is real so you dont even deserve to live freak kys

>>43107514
passing is a myth
women like getting gay men to transition and then egging them on to think its working - its a public humiliation ritual to convince you putting on a dress has others fooled and you are autistic enough to buy into their lies

>>43107487
Nigger that's not even the point I'm making. This thread is about social hierarchies and my point is that gay men can CHANGE THOSE features more than women can change their features.

I don't think gay men should man up at all you stupid assumptive retard

>>43107532
guess i just hallucinated all those years of being forcibly outed and then instantly being hate crimed by women and then being homeless or unemployed

which is also what women have told me all my life, that i wasnt abused or hurt and actually just imagined it all because all women are sacred holy perfect angels incapable of hate or wrong

is that what you're going to tell me too?

>>43107557
>le motte and bailey

>>43107563
im not saying women aren't cunts, I'm saying you don't look like one of them now

>>43107566
Dude you came into a thread and decided to ignore the topic and assume that what I'm saying had any relevance to a new topic that you wanted to talk about. Not only that, you assumed an entirely separate point than anything I even suggested.

How fucking retarded/narcissistic/young are you?

>>43107591
none of that happened
you made it up to defend your attempt to distract from the actual point of the thread

>>43107607
Again, go outside

>>43107633
youre confusing who youre talking to now, and trying to do everything you can to distract from your very very flawed position. the bump to the thread is helpful tho.

>>43107557
>This thread is about social hierarchies
no? its:
>Do women truly see fem gay men as their equals?
if you arent a woman or a fem gay then you dont belong itt
>my point is that gay men can CHANGE THOSE features more than women can change their features.
no we cant. straight acting gay men can. fem gays are always clocked no matter how hard we try, even by normies.
also women can become mothers and then society respects them more. fem gays cant.
>I don't think gay men should man up at all you stupid assumptive retard
then how do we become respected?

>>43107532
there might be truth to this. far more women encouraged me to troon than men. but they would always just disappear. so i listened to men instead because they seemed to actually care about me more. and some women would say dont listen to those women they dont care about you. really confusing

>>43107682
>then how do we become respected?
mass foid extermination

I want to watch a movie where gays with guns just take out random foids for 2 hours

but suriously, you have to publicly stand up to foids and denounce them for being homophobic

>>43107757
You cannot win against women because they are the majority and will lie and manipulate men against you

Every single time I've tried to justify my existence or defend myself when a woman would hate crime me she immediately starts screaming for a man to help and he beats the shit out of me

Life will continue to suck for men and women will continue to moan they are the real victims

>>43107649
Are you new to 4chan? 18+ btw

>>43107682
>then how do we become respected?
PLEASE pay attention closely: You get respect as a gay man, by manning up. That is a THING THAT GAY MEN CAN DO to get more respect. It is a lot harder for a woman to change something and get respect for it.

No where in there do I apply a value in either direction. I have no intent to apply a value in either direction. I am literally just stating a fact that it is something that a gay man can do, and it is harder for a woman to do that same. I am not offering advice, or suggestions, or judging by saying that. I am literally just stating a thing that can happen.

Please reread that as many times as you need, and maybe re-enroll in elementary school. Or get some help with your autism.

>>43107780
you have to realize men are mostly bisexual and are just looking to see other examples of men standing up to women
we need solidarity, not the repressive anti-sexual attitudes of transgenderism
castration CERTAINLY won't make women respect us, its quietly acknowledging your own predatory nature needing to be curbed in a very extreme way

>just man up bro
>just man up bro its as simple as that its a choice just choose your biology its just like being gay is a choice or being italian
Fucking stupid retard animal tier iq

>>43107787
women get respect by having children. fem gay men cant man up. theres already like at least 3 or 4 of us who admitted to trying. pretty much every fem gay has a comphet phase wherre they try to man up before coming out.

>>43107813
>women get respect by having children
Holy fuck again: Read a book, go outside, meet people. Get off the internet and learn about the world.

>>43107813
bullshit, I never went to a phase where I thought I wanted to butch up

>>43107870
im not the one whos misogynistic, femphobic, homophobic, and peddling hateful rhetoric

>>43107929
noted

>>43107682
We become accepted I accepting ourselves, relating to our femininity, becoming aware that femininity is equal to masculinity and being feminine is just as good as being masculine by either sex and being ourselves not trying to copy masculine men

>>43107952
misogyny is a reaction to antisocial foid behavior

>>43107984
No it is not! It's not respecting women for who women are. Men tend to respect being tough more than being tender being harsh more than being kind. Being rough and rather than being gentle. Femininity is a virtue, not a liability.

>>43107952
>>43107984
I am literally the one making the radfem argument IN SUPPORT OF WOMEN you stupid fucking 15 year olds

I am only arguing with you because this entire conversation was prefaced on the idea that gay men somehow have it harder because they can't have butt sex, meanwhile women literally cannot be humans without attracting the hate of their adversaries.

You faggots are incels who transitioned out of your hate of women. You think you were "too feminine" for them and now you use your misogyny to excuse your hypersexuality. You disgusting, ignorant retards will live a miserable life.

>>43107813
anon
you broke the foid-simp-bot
>>43107870
he's just gonna repeat "go outside" and not engage because foid criticism overwhelms his brain

remember: these people are female supremacists who believe women are always victims and cannot oppress others

>>43108077
>remember: these people are female supremacists who believe women are always victims and cannot oppress others
Remember: I have my own criticisms of women that make them just as rapidly enraged as I've made you incels

People are more individual and complex than your Twitter echo chamber makes you think

>>43108077
Real female supremacist do not believe that they are ever victims because being victims means that there's somebody Superior to them victimizing them. The oppressor is always superior

>>43107978
i like this thank you

>>43108052
thats a a bad faith argument