Recommended reading charts. (Look here before asking for vague recs)https://mega.nz/folder/kj5hWI6J#0cyw0-ZdvZKOJW3fPI6RfQ/folder/4rAmSZxb>Archive:https://warosu.org/lit/?task=search2&search_subject=sffg>Goodreads:https://www.goodreads.com/group/show/1029811-sffg>Previous:>>24668507>Thread Question:Are there any worthwhile novel novel to comic adaptations or vice versa?
>>24681926>Are there any worthwhile novel novel to comic adaptations or vice versa?Robert E. Howard Conan's original stories. (Assuming 'novel novel' was a typo)
>>24681926elric. hell there's multiple comic adaptations of the stories.
>>24681926the Fafard and Gray Mouser comic from Mignola was pretty good
>>24681968A novel can be novel. but yeah Conan's great. I grew up reading the old marvel Barbarian and Savage sword books. Got into the Dark Horse run too late but it's great and the current Titan run is solid.
Didn't happen. Not possible. Doesn't make sense. End of story.
Reddit Rising trannies get the ROPE.
Red Rising is kinda mid but everything after is pure kino and if you disagree you're a CHUD
>>24679640The Silver John stories by Manly Wade Wellman are so good. Check those out.
What's the edgiest stuff?
>>24681061Lysander in Lightbringer is the closest to hate enjoying a character in a book since Joffrey in GOT
I got a large cardboard box with free books. Has anyone read anything by these authors that they would recommend I start with?
>>24682178>>24682182bros living in the upside down world
>>24682184I literally flipped them to be the right way up before posting.
Any harem fantasy recommendations with a mage MC?
>>24682196>>24682192>>24682188>>24682186>>24682182>>24682178never heard of them but the covert art is comfy
I blame Moot for the flipped images.
>>24682198Old fantasy covers are top comfy, the modern stuff is all soulless slop.
most sci fi has things like spacecraft, robots, lasers ect. This suggests a mastery of energy, computation and mechanical engineering. But a lot of these stories still have baseline humans in them. So are there any stories that showcase a mastery of biology?
>>24682209children of time, it has biological tech that is done in a unique and interesting way
>>24682186You're not fooling anyone, Aussie.
>>24681926The original Savage Sword of Conan was pretty good.
>>24682209Schismatrix.It has robotic humans and genetically altered humans fighting against eachother.
Red rising bros, what does it mean?
i'm back seethe about the name of the wind>back of the book says this dude did a lot of cool things>first 10% of the book is just about the dude and his family>middle 80% is him attending uni and chasing girlsnow i'm about to read the last 10% of the book and none of things from the back of the book has happened yet
>>24682237I think people were calling a prequel about lorn when he started this game thing but is it an actual book or a graphic novel or what?
Are there any good books with the aesthetics of the "Alien/Blade Runner" universe (except source materials)? Low-tech, corporation wars, industrial atmosphere, NO space religions/tech singularity/semi-magical technologies/iPhone aesthetics/other modern-space-opera shit. Maybe something from the 80s-90s?
>>24682271No idea. From memory, Brown said it was something he had never done before so maybe it's neither of those. Hopefully we'll get more info soon along with a Red God update.
>>24682273the alien franchise has tons of slop novels
post hacks
>>24682324I'm thinking audio drama
>>24682209I am writing a lil scene for a Biopunk setting. Cloning, genetic altering, biological augments and Biosuits made of flesh and machinery.
>>24682209>So are there any stories that showcase a mastery of biology?Ribofunk. It's a collection of stories taking place in the same setting. Opening story is kinda difficult to go through because it throws so much lingo and futurisms at you, but it gets better.
>>24681968>>24682026None of the conan comics are goodThey fail to depict the Hyborian age accurately
awful stuff, thats what i get for looking at books suggested by petrik leo
>it's another count fenring chapter
Nisses's Du Svardenvyrd is based.
>>24682441Maybe not in looks (no adaptation does, arguably) but they do nail the *feeling* of the Hyborian age. Same with the movie, which is otherwise an inaccurate adaptation, but it absolutely nails the verve and brooding of Howard's tales.
Bros. I am thinking about starting Red Country which is the last book before the Age of Madness trilogy (yes, I am skipping Sharps Ends). Is it true that Abercrombie goes full pozzed in this one tho? if it's true, I might not even bother with Red Country. I don't have too much tolerance for le stronk and cunning female PoV that is way smarter than those stupid pathetic men. Plus I heard this one is full of promiscuity which I also hate
>>24682551I disagree
>>24682186>>24682192>>24682199>David Eddings>David Gemmell>Tad WilliamsWould recommend all three of these guys, although I haven't read War of the Flowers so I don't know how good it is.
>>24682178>>24682178There was this one anon that kept mentioning these books a while ago right after the author died in 2022, he said they were solid and comfy. I remember him saying that the author was working on a book years later right before his death from a fall. It wasnt released and im not sure if there are any plans to release it.
>>24682681how does David Eddings compare with Tad Williams and Gemmell? Ive heard his books are generic fantasy.
>>24682753Yeah the Belgariad is fairly bog standard farm boy is the chosen hero who has to beat the dark lord plot but they're pretty comfy
>>24682454Try looking at smaller booktubers that have closer taste to yours rather than the largest male sff booktubers.Apply your own judgment rather than going in blind Accept there will be misses and cut your losses early
>>24682760Basically. Belgariad simply had more characterization at the time compared to other fantasy series.
What does /sffg/ think of Rivers of London series?
Anon you really should read the Belgariad, if only for Polgara and Silk.
>>246827704 stars: 2 3 stars: 52 stars: 11 stars: 1 No reviewshttps://www.goodreads.com/group/show_book/1029811-sffg?book_id=9317452Previous posts https://warosu.org/lit/?task=search&ghost=false&search_text=%22rivers+of+London%22
Picked this up despite having never read any DnD books. Only because I really like any fantasy that takes place in deserts.What am I in for
Hello lads. I have recently started reading and am looking for a new series. No female main characters. So far the only things I have read are Dungeoneer Carl and Cradle 1-12. Apart from the aforementioned requisite: I prefer the series to be finished or long if unfinished, and no female, gay, Jewish or South Asian writers. What are some must read series for someone new to the genre? Many thanks in advanced.
>>24682800Me again. After some thought I just wanted to clarify I am not hard set on the no gay writers requirement.
>>24682800>>24682804
>>24682804Sorry I meant I’m hard on the gay writers requirement. Very hard.
>>24682794If you know about Dark Sun those novels are absolute destruction of the setting by taking out key aspects of it. If you don't, you'll probably enjoy them.
>>24682820Me again. Sorry I meant im hard for gay writers.
>>24682820I assume you guys are smart enough to tell but this is not me.
>>24682830This is actually me.
>>24682832No this isn’t me.
Wow, 60 comments in and this bread has gone to shit.
>>24682839No fun allowed
Across all media, people are staying with what they know rather than moving on to new experiences. There's so much of everything now and the ratio of good to bad ever worsens. The far easier and more convenient decisions it o stay with what you know you'll enjoy and not have to go through so much of unknown quality when attempting to find something good. Even if it's not as good as it was, at least you know it's a sure thing. There's no reason to try to find something else until you've gotten out every last bit of enjoyment. You may even be able to come back and enjoy it again.What is the cause for this? I believe there are two main drivers of this behavior. As stated, there's so much more of everything. There's more music made available every day than there was in an entire year decades ago. There are more books published in a day than can be read in a lifetime. There are more games to play than ever could be. There's than could ever be watched uploaded every second on Youtube. Every microsecond there's more than enough new entertainment for a thousand lives.The problem with that is that Sturgeon's Law has intensified. No longer is 90% of everything crap, it's now no less than 99.9%. At most 1 of 1000 of all that exists is worthwhile and it decreases all the time. Most of it is stuff that no one will ever see, so it's arguable that it doesn't matter, but without curation it's a nightmarish morass of no quality and AI generated content.The more that there is, the less that will be chosen. The paradox of choice, choice paralysis, overpowers all eventually. The person who goes through a lot is to be considered irrational and wasting their time. The most common choice is to only go with the massively popular, because at least there's a chance it may be decent. Even if it isn't, at least you're included with everyone else and won't feel as left out.The other driver is the death of the reviewer, the critic, the tastemaker, the curator, and anyone else who has attempted to help others find what they'd enjoy. What we have now are influencers whose only interest is their own profit from you buying in to whatever they're promoting. Almost everyone else is telling you how great the thing you and them both like are and how wonderful performing fandom is. Fandom has become professionalized and an identity that is desperate for new followers.Even those who influence aren't organically chosen. Often a single easily manipulated and highly marketed metric, such as viewer or follower count is the sole criterion for where to direct our attention. That person may not be relevant at all to your taste, but they were easy and convenient to find, and everyone else is with them, so it's a socially acceptable choice. Does anything else really matter? Perhaps you can adapt your taste to theirs, or their sponsors.There are also those who try to make their way alone, completely self-sufficient, uncaring of anyone. That's their and our loss.
Not reading the AI post
>>24682770>jewish author>black mci assume /sffg/ loves it
>>24682541>Hmmmmm ummmm ahhh ahhh ahhh he who controls the cum flowing from my wife’s pussy controls the genetic destiny of humanity
>>24682178this looks great. I'll check this out for sure.
>>24682800Wheel of Time.
>>24682853A readymade excuse to not read anything of length.
>>24682881How bad are the last three books? After a cursory Google search it looks like some guy finished writing the series after the author died. Will this affect my enjoyment?
>>24682893man shut the fuck up stop wanting your hand held the entire way
>>24682918It's a valid question. The series is 14 books long. I don't want to invest time into it if the last three books don't do the first 11 justice.There is no reason for your hauty attitude and foul language. Good manners cost nothing.
>>24682893The whole series is slop. If you're fine with overwrought prose and generic fantasy, they're fine. If you've read more than a dozen generic fantasy books before, they won't offer anything new or interesting.
>>24682893Basically book 7-12 have a bunch of filler. Jordan wrote the vast majority of Memory of Light, the final book, before he died, and Sanderson was brought in to bridge to that last book from where Jordan skipped ahead when he realized he wouldn't get it all done.So, while there's a bunch of stuff that drags in the middle and a couple of Sanderson's OC's are grating, the series has a properly satisfying ending.I consider WoT and Cradle to be in a similar ballpark when it comes to pure Fun Factor. They're very different, WoT is far, far longer and much slower paced, but it's got enormous highs.
>>24682948it has some female main characters so i guess thats out the window for you NEXT
>>24682849Let's turn to the specific problems debilitating /sffg/.The structural difficulties are anonymity, impermanence, and conversational flow. Anonymity negates reputational costs, allows for impersonation, and limits the development of relationships. Impermanence incentives a culture of low effort, minimal engagement, and a preference for the trivial over the meaningful. A common complaint outside of imageboards is that it's far too difficult to tell who is replying to who and to have structured conversations.The greatest cultural difficulties are /sffg/'s reputation, the posting habits of its regulars, and post expectations.Over the course of 10+ years, /sffg/ has developed a reputation for repetitive posts, prolific spam, and low effort in general. The probable source for all of this is a minority of regulars.It is likely that almost all the worst posters are those who post on a daily basis. The overwhelming majority of posters likely only do on a weekly, if not monthly basis, due to the lack of reception and response. Few want to dwell in a sewer. Those who do are often hostile, cynical, and destructive. No fun or enjoyment can be allowed. Anyone who attempts to do something more than the minimum must be attacked and discredited. Discussion of books or series that last more than a couple posts are anathema. They expect the worst of others and so do the worst onto others.For almost everyone, the expectations for posts is very low. The preference is for short posts that incur minimal costs because then at least they maintain an acceptable ratio of quality to time spent. Anything of length likely has a far worse ratio, because there couldn't be anything of value here because no one can put forth effort, and even those who do, don't produce anything of quality. It's best to hope for the rare post that's of minimal length and high quality. This is the bigotry of low expectations, in which the anon has contempt and/or disgust for what they both consider their self to be part of, but also outside of.None of is this likely to change due to inertia and believing it isn't worth the effort to improve. Entropy brings a community to its lowest state and if there isn't counteracting order, then it will never improve. The prevailing opinion is to visit, refuse to engage, take as much as you can as quickly as you can, then leave. This results in a lot of hit-and-run posts and posts that don't get any response if they're replied to. The most common version of this is the anon who asks about a series and wants assurance and handholding that it's worth their time. This wouldn't be as much of a problem if it weren't for that it's almost always one of the most popular series and answers of all sorts have all been repeated ad nauseam. Because their investment in the thread is shallow and superficial, they refuse to find existing answers and feel entitled to good service, prompt responses, and courteous manners, which is absurd to say the least.
>>24682963>>24682954Alright thank you for the insight. I'll check it out.>>24682966As long as its not THE main character I'm fine with some female characters.
>more AI slop posts and indecisive needy anons who need people to recommend safe space books for thempathetic general /sffg/ has fallen
Any recommended books exactly like Undying Mercenaries?
>>24683004He cried out, not in lamentation, but to rejoice.
>>24683004they're not even real people. just engagement bots. we truly cyberpunk now
>>24683026I'm really.
>>24682972All three of those "difficulties of /sffg/" amount to the same thing: posting culture of the thread.Anyways, read picrel recently when it grabbed my attention from the cover and description, which I seriously doubt any of you have read or even heard of. For a debut self-published novel, it was pretty good - well edited, standard prose, good job of keeping character voices consistent. Not terribly funny but for a weird world it maintains lightness and humor throughout. The core conceit is that it's a fantasy world where women are inherently more physically strong - but less clever - than men. The impact of this is somewhat muted, but it's used enough to make the whole thing feel slightly satirical. Also magpies are fully sentient, "separate-but-equal" beings who live parallel to humans. It doesn't come up much but it's part of the world. The plot follows a professional jester who was kicked out of court, and ends up falling into companionship with a washed up heroine/queen with a Don Quixote bent, who takes herself on a poorly planned quest to save her slice of the kingdom from being reabsorbed by the crown. It invokes as many tropes as it subverts, but gives me the impression of intentionally doing so with a self-aware, "making fun of itself" vibe. Overall, 3/5. It's a light read and has some genuinely funny parts. The key characters were fun enough to keep me engaged. Worth a few dollars if you're looking for something light and decidedly different than the common dark, low fantasy. The cover is very good, too.
>>24683037Thank you for your contribution. I implore you to also put your thoughts elsewhere. The funny thing is how relevant that is to much of the posting here. Doubtlessly much of it would be repellent to the usual sorts who complain about such. Apparently it's the first book in the series. Do you have any intention of reading further? Personally, it doesn't seem all that interesting to me. I would prefer a strongly emphasis on the satire if it's going that way. It all seems very lukewarm, but as you said, it's something light, which usually precludes anything of strong emphasis. Yes, it is posting culture of the thread, which doesn't say much in of itself. Why is it? Should it be? And if not, can anything be done about it? This leads me to assume that believe that's simply how it is, and there's nothing more to say about that. Either make peace with it, leave, or suffer. That's a reasonable way to endure the status quo, whatever it may be, as long as you have can stay apart or have the resources to make it more bearable.
I miss the red rising fags
>>24683089The reactionary bemoans, "It was better before, no matter how or what it was! We are in perpetual decline!"
Heh I love you guys.Anyone read Kaiju Battlefield Surgeon?
>>24683096>Fantasy meets horror in this gore-soaked, standalone LitRPG adventure! certainly not me
>>24683103Maybe a couple, but since there aren't many posts, several could be you. It could even be you replying to me. I haven't, and although I like DCC, I don't think I would like this. There seems to be too much emphasis on the trauma, suffering, misery, body horror, and similar. As in, it's more horror than anything else and I don't generally read stuff where it could classified overall as horror. https://warosu.org/lit/?task=search2&&search_text=%22Kaiju+Battlefield%22You could try asking in the webnovel general, /wng/. >>24683111You missed.
>>24682568It's been a while since I've read Red Country, so the memories have faded. I can't give you specifics. But I remember it being my favorite Abercrombie book at the time.Yes, Age of Madness has a strong woman PoV who revels in being superior than others. And yes, there's promiscuity.Honestly, if you're looking for your little gay-ass white knight paladin fantasy story, you're not going to find it with Abercrombie. I don't get you uptight sorts. Looking toward fantasy to fulfill some kind of weirdo conservative christian crusade. It's hella cringe, bro. But it sounds like Abercrombie isn't the author for you. Just stop now, because all of his books have strong female PoVs and wanton fucking.
>>24683089We're still here, waiting for PB to FINALLY give us a release date for Red God.Victra best girl. What say you, Goodman Horsefag?
>>24681926Fug, those post-LOTR appendices are so depressing. It's like watching an "every character grows old and dies" montage.
What happened to the horror general?
>>24683201Arwen's part was the worst, it made me feel miserable.
Oh, neat.>>24683149
>>24683201>>24683206I just finished rewatching the extended LotR trilogy and couldn't stop thinking about those passages. How did JRRT manage to make a happy ending so tragic?
>>24683204The usual. No one to regularly create the threads or post in them.https://warosu.org/lit/?task=search2&search_subject=Horror+generalThere are a lot more results if "general" is omitted.
>>24683206Same.>"Estel, Estel!’’ she cried, and with that even as he took her hand and kissed it, he fell into sleep.>But Arwen went forth from the House, and the light of her eyes was quenched, and it seemed to her people that she had become cold and grey as nightfall in winter that comes without a star. Then she said farewell to Eldarion, and to her daughters, and to all whom she had loved; and she went out from the city of Minas Tirith and passed away to the land of Lo´rien, and dwelt there alone under the fading trees until winter came. Galadriel had passed away and Celeborn also was gone, and the land was silent.>she laid herself to rest upon Cerin Amroth; and there is her green grave, until the world is changed, and all the days of her life are utterly forgotten by men that come after, and elanor and niphredil bloom no more east of the Sea.
>>24683239>>24683201It's the underlying melancholy within LOTR. Frodo and the rest of the Fellowship leaving is probably a metaphor for Tolkien after the war. The world is saved, the enemy has been defeated, the Shire is undamaged but still the mental scars and damage are there. The world-view of the character is forever damaged. LOTR is also about the inevitability of death. The Elves both avoid it and crave it as the mystery of it is denied to them, the magic of Middle-Earth is dying but the world still goes on without us.It's a 'happy' ending where good wins but the heroes are forever damaged.
>>24683076I've posted a review of it on goodreads, probably should on Amazon as well - I like to support non-trad published authors that aren't churning out garbage. I reluctantly put the next in the series on my want to read list, but not sure when I'll get back to it. More likely I'll find a newer one of the authors books in a different series. I almost didn't finish this one at about 25% through, but then it picked up and finally "got good", or good enough anyways. I read it coming off a prose translation of Divine Comedy (I know, I know), so really wanted a light pallet cleanser. I lean more scifi than fantasy these days, and mostly look for things that aren't standard storylines; I've read enough unlikely heroes defeating the evil empire and humanity first contact gone wrong for a lifetime, I guess. I've shilled it before, but Cleave the Sparrow is probably the best book published this year, I'll post a longer review of that one at some point to push it again, it's a fantastic, unique book, Vonnegut writes Briefer History of Time while on Ketamine.
Just finished dark age, Lysander MUST die. Smarmy cunt.
>>24683256This is plenty depressing on its own, but then you compare it to the tale of Beren and Luthien and... man. Then you (me) give it a bit more thought and you get this>But the story has gone crooked, & I am left, and I cannot plead before the inexorable Mandos.
>>24683286I do hope you're onto lightbringer next
>>24683196Why not both my goodman?
>>24683291I'm starting it tonight.
>>24683305Based. Enjoy and remember, Lysander MUST die.
>>24683284Oh, I see it now. I hadn't checked. Cleave The Sparrow has a single review, 5 stars, in /sffg/ and your 5 star rating. Seems like too much absurdism and surrealism along with horror for me. I could be wrong though.
>>24683310There's no horror. The surrealism isn't overdone, it's more of a weird trip than something completely opaque. Think a quirky time travel scifi story turned to the nth degree, that's actively mocking philosophical, "deep thoughts" scifi stories. Chris Buckley takes on Phillip Dick's more conceptual short stories. Not for everyone I suppose, but I found it hilarious, engaging with a tight plot, and clever with its satire.
is it worth reading?
>>24683426Vampires are inherently uninteresting. So no.
>>24683428Cringe opinion. Vampires are the best out of the fantasy horror monsters like werewolves or zombies.
>>24683445Werewolves and zombies are uninteresting as well. Most of the popular horror creatures aren't worth reading about. It's ok if a fantasy has its own thing going for it, and just happens to features those creatures. But when those creatures are the main focus of a story, then it's almost always schlocky and bad.
>>24683454This man speaks truth.One of the best parts of picrel was the horror "spirit of the forest" thing. But stock monsters are shit.
>>24683466Th spirit in the forest stuff was like an oasis in a desert.
>>24682568>I am thinking about starting Red Country which is the last book before the Age of Madness trilogy (yes, I am skipping Sharps Ends). Is it true that Abercrombie goes full pozzed in this one tho?No, Red Country isn't particularly pozzed. As far as I remember, the protagonist is less stronk than Monza in Best Served Cold. Joe only goes full woketard in the Age of Madness (or maybe in Sharp Ends, I haven't read it).
>>24682209GRRM wrote some stories in a universe where humans used bio engineers to create weapons to fight their wars. in "tuf voyaging" a fat nerd gets hold of an old warship of those bio engineers. in "in the house of the worm" we see how people live underground on a dying world having to deal with the aftermath of the bio engineering. there are huge worms that eat humans. there are creatures evolved from man to be adapted to the live underground. there is lost old tech. and psychopathic hybrid creatures. i like the story.
>>24683426There's a hugely upboated review on goodreads by a foid talking about how misogynistic it is so yes
>>24683426>>24683579Dont listen to this guy, it has a lot of pozzed and LGBT content.
Do you lads read any smut? Curious if you need to prove age to read smut in the UK.
>>24682849Well said
>>24683794Thanks, I appreciate it. I considered typing much more, but decided to keep it within the limits of a single post.
>>24683155>But it sounds like Abercrombie isn't the author for youI mean, I enjoyed every single First Law related book of his so far. But people say he goes 180º from his original work in AoM. It's not my fault if an Autor I enjoy decides to completely change his style in order to appeal to his Reddit crowd. That's why am asking. Because most people say AoM feels very different from First Law and the standalones.If the females PoV are like Monza I am good because I really like her. I just don't want the females to be obnoxious sluts in a story that clearly nerfs men IQ just to make females look better
i refuse to imagine tuon as anything darker than this. no idc what the original covers look like.
>>24683813Abercrombie writes competent men and incompetent men. He writes competent women and incompetent women. In the age of Madness, there is a very competent woman with PoV chapters. When she encounters incompetent men, she makes them look bad. When she encounters competent men, it's a battle for power, and sometimes she wins, sometimes she loses.I don't know how else to explain it. Yes, there will be times when a competent woman makes men look retarded. But it's just because that's how the story goes. It really depends on the reader's sensibilities. Some readers don't have a tolerance for women winning over men at all. So they decide that Abercrombie did a turn. People like myself have a high tolerances for women winning over men. So I don't think anything of it.Since you say you liked Monza, then you will probably like Age of Madness as well.
>>24683815Tuon is CANONICALLY vantablack and that's a GOOD thing.
>>24683454I'd rather a fantasy world focus on vampires and werewolves than elves and dwarves. Give me horror-inspired fantasy any day.
>>24683851I also find the standard fantasy races boring for the same reasons.
>>24683037Always on the lookout for another jester book. Surprisingly there is not a lot. One day that will be different thanks to me. Any others I am missing please recommend thank you. I'm aware of Robin Hobbs books, I will get to those one day.
>>24683716I don't go out of my way to read it, but I've read stories that feature it. No age check needed.
>>24683850if this was true jordan would have said she was black as the night or some shit. so, i'm imagining her as zoe kravitz in mad max fury road
>>24682849The biggest reason is because everyone with a pulse got a college degree from the 90s onward, so you had a tidal wave of talentless degree holders flooding into glamorous professions like writing, academia, journalism, and media of all kinds and setting up elaborate gatekeeping systems to protect their newly colonized turf. Talented young people take one look at the closed-off fortresses that these professions have become and rationally decide to go to law school or medical school instead. And that's not even touching on more recent developments like new forms of online media stealing away most of the audience, which just intensifies these trends.
>>24683861Standard fantasy anything is boring after you've read enough of it. Doesn't matter what composes those "enough" either, eventually you just burn out. I did, anyways.Orconomics and Grunts! are two very different ways to subvert that boredom, both good (Grunts! is better), but even that can only go so far.I'm becoming convinced literary fiction is what the well read end up reading only because a standard setting of reality is more palatable than the alternative "standard settings". And literary fiction tends to lean less on the setting and have greater standard deviation to the mean in their plotting.Women are dogshit at this, btw, which is why most shit written by them is "recently popular thing with one twist".
I just saw a really liked comment on tik tok from a woman who said she refuses to read third person books.
>>24683922I was originally considering post this somewhere offsite, then thought maybe make a thread on /lit/ for it, and then just posted it here.>The biggest reason is because everyone with a pulse got a college degree from the 90s onwardThis is very much an exaggeration, unless you're defining "everyone with a pulse" in a way other than "everyone alive". It's true that a majority of Americans have attended college, and there are similar numbers for other developed countries, but getting a degree is a different situation. That's more like 35% for a Bachelor's degree and 1% for a Ph.D. How much does a Bachelor's even matter now though? Of course there numbers vary greatly depending on which subgroup of people you're looking at.>so you had a tidal wave of talentless degree holders flooding into glamorous professions like writing, academia, journalism, and media of all kinds and setting up elaborate gatekeeping systems to protect their newly colonized turf.No, the masses aren't getting into these professions for the most part. That primarily remains the domain of the elite, not in a meritocratic sense, as it never was. Yes, there are gatekeeping systems, and there always have been. It isn't newly colonized. What changed was how much it's fallen into decline relative how it used to be, in terms of prestige, influence, and compensation. That's a separate matter though. A related matter to this is elite overproduction, which is the cause for most of what you describe. This can be seen in ancient China, such as during time of Confucius. Much certainly would've been different if he had just passed the exams to be part of the government. There's a good bit of that happening in current day China as well though. Ken Liu's The Dandelion Dynasty has some interesting scenes what elite overproduction results in one of the books.>Talented young people take one look at the closed-off fortresses that these professions have become and rationally decide to go to law school or medical school instead.Not really. That they're in such decline is the main reason. They aren't going to law school or medical school either as a majority. The biggest trend is for the talented to go into finance, because that's where the most money can be made by far. Tech is also an option. Law and Medicine have some of the highest suicide rates of any occupation. That's not very appealing to many.You response has made me want to read more nonfiction, though it's almost surely just a transient feeling.Here's three related nonfiction books that I've read and can recommend. I had reviews for them, but I deleted all my nonfiction reviews due to being dissatisfied with what I'd written.The Cult of Smart: How Our Broken Education System Perpetuates Social Injustice - Fredrik deBoerEnd Times: Elites, Counter-Elites, and the Path of Political Disintegration - Peter TurchinWe Have Never Been Woke: The Cultural Contradictions of a New Elite - Musa al-Gharbia
>>24683969low iq people/women can not engage with something if they can't self insert and or have to keep track of many characters.
>>24683997ntaThird person dominates on web novel sites and in light novels, which I believe you'd agree doesn't have the highest level of sophistication of writing or readers.
>>24684004I'd bet web novel/litrpg progression bullshit has its largest demographic being low iq non white third world beta males.
>>24684013Believing that undermines your argument, which is a good way to be.
>>24684004Third person dominates all English literature. Your argument is essentially "Nazis drank water".
>>24684044I don't see how that's related.The argument was women/low IQ need first person and refuse third person.I replied with an example of low IQ people preferring third person.Most romantasy is probably third person.Thus, where is the evidence for the first person argument other than feelings and a single comment?
>>24684056Nta but most every romantasy I ever saw at my old job, former libraryfag here and especially the popular series like ACoTaR and Fourth Wing, were in first person. Idk if the apparent prevalence of first person is a social/cognitive thing or just a trend though. I generally prefer third person myself, because I like to see the main character acting rather than listen to him talking about what he did.
>>24684086I'm unwilling to personally verify this, so I'll believe you. I asked ChatGPT and it said the most popular was singular first person and multipov first person. The reason given was because it maximizes emotional connection, which sounds true enough.
>>24684124>I'm unwilling to personally verify thisThank goodness, I was worried you were en route to my residence>Maximize emotional connectionFor female-oriented genres (FOGs), first person is great because it forces a higher baseline of reader investment. Of course, a seriously gifted author can make either optimally effective.
>>24682192First few books of David Eddings Belgariad are great. Last couple are boring as fuck.
>>24682209Chasm City
why is it pronounced tar valon and not tar valawn. valon like talon just sounds lamer
Are there any fantasy books other than The Hobbit where the hero can turn invisible? You'd think with how influential Tolkien is there would be more examples.
>>24682770Started pretty ok but the last 3/4 were rather uninteresting.
>>24684235Harry Potter
Does anyone have an archive for the March 2003 issue of Locus Magazine?
>>24684230 Because its written by an american mutt.
>>24682046Can I skip the first book then? What I've read so far is pretty bad
>>24684376How deep are you in it?
>>24682273Have you read og cyberpunk like Neuromancer or Snowcrash?
Finished this five minutes ago, kinda weak desu. Do I wanna keep going to Silver Spike and the southern books?
>>24682972Welcome to 4chan. Enjoy your stay
>>24683037Fools and corvids are my jam. I'll take a look
Well, in my pursuit of >>24684312I will share some interesting links about a brief online drama regarding Wolfe's stint at the Odyssey Writer's Workshop. I will contribute something unlike the rest of you.What you have here in order is Gene Wolfe stating he left teaching the writer's workshop in order to avoid harming it due to one student misrepresenting a situation to him, Ellison raising hell at the disrespect the students showed (and getting other people to submit their displeasure), and then Ellison (once he found out) and the head workshop lady revealing what truly happened. The students apologized to Wolfe, and there were no real villains. I am really abbreviating it, but read through if you want to learn more.https://www.locusmag.com/2003/Features/Letters07.htmlhttps://www.locusmag.com/2003/Features/Letters07a.htmlhttps://www.locusmag.com/2003/Features/Letters07b.htmlhttps://www.locusmag.com/2003/Features/Letters07c.html
>>24684376The main antagonist of the first trilogy and beyond is introduced and characterized heavily in the first book. Plenty of other side characters who will be a part of future books are also fleshed out. I do not recommend skipping it.
>>24684509 Is it pozzed?
>>24684376yeah what >>24684509 said. skipping the first really would dampen your enjoyment of the series as a whole because of the characters introduced in it and the relationships they have with each other. So much is not going to make sense if you just start with golden son, even if it is when brown stopped fucking around.
>>24684521it is as non-pozzed as you can get in the modern climate, which is to say that none of the staple characters are gay.
Red Rising is basically Hunger Games for boys, except somehow worse.
>>24684532Only the first book
>>24684529There's a gay pov in the sequel trilogy but that has essentially no actual effect on his persona other than signaling that he won't fuck any of the women he works with.
>>24684564He doesn't fuck any men either, just to get that out of the way
>>24684564and more importantly, he’s based>>24684376No. It’s a short book and sets up lots of the character conflicts and relationships for the series.
>>24684564yeah i don't really count ephraim as a staple. and besides, he's gay, but he's not a faggot.
>>24684529> which is to say that none of the staple characters are gay.In other words its pozzed. There is no reason to include any gay characters in any book. Plenty of modern fantasy writers dont do that, e.g. James Islington and John Gwynne. Not saying modern fantasy is good (it isnt), but there are still writers that avoid the pozzed shit.
>>24684608write your own book then safe space faggot
>>24684406At least read Silver Spike. It's pretty interesting.
>>24684574> he's gay, but he's not a faggot.Same thing.
>>24682046Read first chapter of the first book holy shit the cringe
>>24684406>Do I wanna keep going to Silver Spike and the southern books?Absolutely. It's closure for the Northern books. Also, you finally get to see just how hard it is to kill the Taken when they actually set their mind to it.
>>24682822>If you know about Dark Sun those novels are absolute destruction of the setting by taking out key aspects of it.holy shit, that bad?
>>24683466Anyone get the feeling GGK is overlooked these days? Is it just because historical fiction isn't as popular?
>>24683969>spends enough time on tiktok to see that a particular woman was popular for whatever preferences she had, then comes to gossip about it on 4chanYou all right, grandma? Grandpa? Kids these days, huh.
>>24682046>mid>kinolearn to use proper adjectives
>>24682568>Is it true that Abercrombie goes full pozzed in this one tho?it's so much fucking worse. the first law books managed to give every pov character a discernible arc of their flaws being introduced, them being given a way to save themselves from what's coming (which not one takes, because to avoid what's coming they'd have to abandon what defines them), and then a final just desserts that is often good and bad; monkey paw style.honestly i really can't understand how an author who wrote the first law could turn around and write the madness books. not only are the madness pov characters inconsistent and aimless, the supporting cast who return from the first law are nothing like the characters they were before.>>24683155>It's hella cringe, bro.gaslighting piece of shit; the author who wrote murcatto, ferro and ardee was not the same author who wrote rikke and savineand it's not like he saved a huge dump just for his female charactersorso, who is a gay-ass white knight paladin, might be the most ill conceived and poorly executed of his new characters, and that's really saying something because there isn't a single new character worth pissing on to put out a fire. >>24683813he does go 180; and i dont know about reddit style, i dont follow that shit; but his books have been getting slowly worse imo (until this, where they got catastrophically worse). i thought red country was bad for a number of reasons, but especially for lamb. that story was over at the end of the first law books>Monzajust re-read best served cold and save yourself some suffering. my two cents: best served cold was the pinnacle of his writing, but i'll share a contrast with you to settle up with hella-cringe-bro's non-arguments:in the age of madness we're not tricked into liking brutal killers, allowed to enjoy the ineptitude of self-aggrandizing masterminds, appreciate wry salarymen who work for incompetent leadership or get to witness the absurd mayhem of the past conflicting with the future -- which is pathetic because the age of madness really, really wants to rehash all these same ideas. you have another killer, so obviously 9fingers in a new skin, but so hilariously unable to measure up. you have another mastermind, a returning character no less, who not only are you not made aware of until the last pages of the final book, but who succeeds so spectacularly it's comedic. you don't get wry, twisted humor from anyone, because they're all some form of self-obsessed nepo-baby jezals, except unlike jezal they're all actually meta-nepo babies, children of characters from the first law, nepo-babies who have about as much impact and stoke as much interest as jaden smith. and of course, despite being set in a french-revolution-esque setting; where he tries to unambiguously force the historical premise and conflict, abercrombie somehow did a better job of discussing democracy, tyranny and the power of the status quo in the books that aren't blatant about it.
>>24684235The Crimson Shadow. Dude becomes a thief and finds a magic cloak that turns him invisible but whenever he uses it it leaves a big read mark wherever he was earning him the titular appellation
>>24684737Honestly, he has always been overlooked after Tigana.
>>24683037your """reviews""" are SHITFUCK OFF
>>24683037>evayeah...not reading that shit
>>24683007
>>24684733Dark Sun is a craptastic dark world. That's the whole point. Every time someone approaches it, they do so from the standpoint of trying to "fix" it.
Is it just me or is Dark Sun actually a xianxia setting? The rulers of the city states are immortality-seeking demonic cultivators.
>>24684778If you think the characters in Age of madness don't have character arcs, then you only expose yourself for not having read beyond the first book.Orso is the antithesis to a gay-ass white knight paladin. How you could claim he is one, is actually baffling. Saying as much, just goes to show that you don't understand the character in the first place. Which is probably why your dumbass thought you were "tricked" into liking him.I really want to know what "tricks" you think Abercrombie is pulling to make the characters seem likeable. You yourself point out all of their flaws(self-obsessed neop-babies), yet you make it seem as though Abercrombie is ignorant to their flaws, rather than deliberately writing them as flawed characters.You also neglect to mentions how the two female characters are very similar to their fathers. It's highlighted quite a lot that they're following in their father's footsteps whether they realize it or not. And their fathers are still such legendary figures, that it's pretty much impossible to fill their shoes. Yet, they come close.God, why is it that the only people who want to discuss anything in these god foresaken threads, are the bitch-boy conservatards, crying about strong women?
>>24684983>reddit spacing>gay whiny tone
>>24684987>Tone policing like a woman.
I don't find Gibson's writing appealing at all. his hacking feels more like the power of friendship trope.
>>24684941Women shouldn't be allowed to learn to read
If I disliked Wizard Knight due to the writing style(I fell asleep due to slow pace of climbing stairs) will I hate Litany of the long sun?
>>24685049It could go either way. Id say give it a try, also, if you dont like a book by page 70 dont continue.
>>24684432Different boards and generals have different problems. Some have far more than others and there are even those that have far less. The problems have changed over the years as well.
>>24685017 Islam is right about women.
>>24683201>It's like watching an "every character grows old and dies" montage.Yeah, that was some Six Feet Under shit.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qD6Y7d4hIW4
>>24684632>>24684730Okay, cheers.
what do you think?
>>24682186Gemmell is great comfy fun l've read most of his books
>>24685137That read was like a roller coaster, boring, then super interesting, then boring again.
>>24684608there is a gay character in will of the many
Why do people hate steampunk?
>>24685488idk i just dont like it
>>24685488It's peak fedora
The mega charts are fucking trash if you're looking for cyberpunk.Anything similar to snow crash or net diving in GITS/johnny mnemonic? An avatar going through a constructed virtual world.
>>24685577The review character limit wasn't nearly enough. Several comments have to be used as well.https://www.goodreads.com/review/show/5836094653
>>24685577Some anon posted a list of his favorite cyberpunks awhile ago, you can find It in the archives:>Bruce Sterling:The Artificial KidSchismatrixIslands in the NetHeavy WeatherHoly FireDistractionZeitgeistThe Zenith AngleThe CaryatidsCrystal Express (Short Stories)Globalhead (Short Stories)A Good Old Fashioned Future (Short Stories)Visionary in Residence (Short Stories)Gothic High Tech (Short Stories)Transreal Cyberpunk (Short Stories, written with Rudy Rucker)>Rudy Rucker:SoftwareWetwareFreewareRealwareThe Hacker and the AntsComplete Short StoriesTransreal Cyberpunk (Short Stories, written with Bruce Sterling)>John Shirley:City Come A' Walkin' (Kino)Black GlassEclipse (kino)Eclipse Penumbra (kino)Eclipse Corona (kino)Heatseeker (short stories)Lewis ShinerFronteraDeserted Cities of the HeartSlam>Walter Jon Williams:Hardwired (kino)Solip:SystemThe Voice of the WhirlwindAngel StationMetropolitanCity on FireThis is Not a GameDeep State>George Alec Effinger:When Gravity Fails (pajeet kino)A Fire in the SunThe Exile KissBudayeen Nights (Short stories)>Richard Kadrey:MetrophageKamikaze L'AmourAngel Scene>Pat Cadigan:Dervish is DigitalFoolsMindplayers (kino)Synners (kino)Tea from an Empty Cup (kino)Patterns (short stories)>Jack Womack:Ambient (kino)Elvissey (kino satire)Going, Going, GoneHeathernLet's Put the Future Behind UsRandom Acts of Senseless Violence (kino)Terraplane>Steven Barnes:Street Lethal (blaxploitation kino)Gorgon ChildFiredance>Richard Paul Russo:Destroying AngelCarlucci's EdgeCarlucci's HeartSubterranean Gallery>Melissa Scott:Trouble & Her FriendsNight Sky MineDreaming MetalThe Jazz>Wilhelmina Baird:Crash CourseClip JointPsykosis>Shariann Lewitt:Memento MoriInterface Mask
>>24685692>>24685643Thanks and 'night
>>24685298I know what a train is and what it's like and I do not give a fuck what colour the chairs are - get to the point
>>24685298It is okay
>>24685577>The mega charts are fucking trashCould've just left it at that. They're of no real use.
>>24683815That's not cute enough to be Tuon. She has a heart shaped childlike face. She is Mat's brown loli wife.
>>24684983I've been around for a while and 4ch just isn't a place for quality discussion at least in the boards/threads I lurk. It happens rarely and that's great when it does but I have zero expectations for it. Critical thinking at a societal level is down and 4ch still remains a containment site that highly attracts the lowest common denominators
>>24685475Damn, his first trilogy didnt have any. Guess all we have is chad John Gwynne.
>>24685475Mmmmm, are you sure?
>>24685920yes it's indol
>>246859084chan used to have text boards where there was good discussion... I miss them.
>>24685692>When Gravity Falls (pajeet kino)IIRC its in the middle east not in India right?Picrel is pajeet kino
>>24683989not him, but the masses, as in the people of the worldly, are without a doubt getting into these professions. “I've been a part of the game industry for 30 years, but I feel there's less 'weird people' now. I don't know if this is something simply happening in my field of view, if the game industry ended up like this, or if the whole world is like this now.”In these times it makes logical sense to stay with what you know if you've found the honesty and quality your soul seeks. Contradictory to what you say I think the minority do that actually, most people aren't staying with what they know but what they are influenced to consume.
>>24684737Just finished Tigana. It really isn't historical fiction it's more like "setting inspired by historical setting". James Clavell is historical fiction; it's fiction literally set in Japan/Hong Kong/Asia or whatever.
>>24686335>literally set in japan>but all the people have been replaced by weird mirror universe versions who are completely different
>>24686270Are we talking about the same professions? Because videogame development wasn't included in what was meant. I don't disagree with quote from Yoko Taro, because it's definitely true. Without going into detail, here are some reasons why it's true. Videogames are a relatively new medium and only became mainstream recently. For anything that's marginal and on the fringes, it will attract the same sort of people. The weird, the outcasts, the misfits and so on. As something becomes more mainstream, the relative percent of such people will decrease if only because the majority of people aren't weird. The same thing has happened with 4chan since its beginning. Very few weird developers remain employed by major companies because their ideals, let alone interests, no longer align. The focus now is on safety and doing the same thing over and over again. Weirdness is the domain of the indie developer, such as Keita Takahashi, and his newly released game "To A T". There's also Yoko Taro's age to consider, he's 55, which probably means he's not much involved with the weird indie games that people in their early 20s are so on are making. That being said, I don't know how you're relating weirdness to this. >logical sense to stay with what you know if you've found the honesty and quality your soul seeksI didn't say anything about honesty or "what your soul seeks". That's far more idealized and romanticized than anything I wrote. >aren't staying with what they know but what they are influenced to consumeWhat they know is what's popular and often what's popular is what's been influenced. The popularity in itself is passively influential. I completely agree with you that there are those who have found some niche or obscure something that they want to stick with, and that's a minority. I didn't say otherwise. So, I don't know if you've misunderstood me or if it's something else.
>start Lord of Chaos>it's an Elayne/Nynaeve chapter>they don't stop
>>24686361That's what Japan usually does with their own history in their media. The US is far more concerned with accurate depictions of their own history.
>>24686369What an odd reply.In the original post the following is said "Across all media". To be weird is to not be of the masses. That is why I found the quote related. Did you not follow the chain of replies?
>>24686476Yes, but that's not what was replied to. You replied about professions. The quote is not related to the professions. It's only related to the game development industry in this context. Other newly emerging professions can also be included, but they are outside of this context.
I wish I could induce paranoid schizophrenia like Tim Powers.
>>24686486Because the game industry involves many glamorous professions. Writing being one which the other poster specifically mentioned.
>>24686463Perrin chapters are infinitely worse than elayne and nynaeve chapters. i legitimately want to combust when i have to suffer through faile and perrin chapters
>>24686499Relatively few games have dedicated writers, and it's definitely not a glamorous position. There are many articles and interviews about how disrespected and how much they're held in contempt. Game development isn't a glamorous profession and doesn't go along with what else was mentioned. How much is there about them being fire en masse and treated as all being disposable? Their passion being exploited to work long hours for low pay. You're being disingenuous.
>>24684737This guy wrote Lions of Al-Rassan, right?His depiction of the not-andalusians suffers from naive orientalism, the benevolent subtype anglos are very fond of, that makes it funny to read when you actually know a lil bit about the time period and the cultures referenced.Yet the weirdest part about that novel is that it's, fundamentally, a romantasy chick novel: The main character, the jewess, has virtually no influence on the story nor a moment of triumph besides being this object of desire for every strong man near her, and inexplicably so. I can't think of a single moment where she actually did anything that advanced the plot, not even with her supposedly great medical skills, while in her many POVs we are assailed constantly by her suitors. If you told me a woman wrote this it would be very easy for me to believe.Yet GGK is a grown ass man. Why he wrote such a useless heroine and made her the main POV in a political drama with far more interesting characters is beyond me.
>>24686509I'm being disingenuous? I've been ignoring your egotistic and immature attitude but this conversation is over. To be clear I'm not, this is what you were replying to "glamorous professions like writing, academia, journalism, and media of all kinds".
>>24686528 Game development by and large has nothing to do with any of those.
>>24683863Well, only take that rec' if you can read french, picked that up a few month ago. Basic pitch is that a young and shy monk (of a religion built around sadness/tears) is forced to become a jester. He ends up having to juggle between spying, uncovering conspiracies against the king and being funny. Some nice witty dialogs and jokes, endearing characters. It is a fantasy setting, not much magic, besides a flying castle, and a lot of arts (painting, poetry...) are forbidden. Second volume is planned but no date for it.Main character is a bit of a doormat but grows up little by little, quite a few awkward and cringe (but well written) moments that still makes him very endearing
Graphic Audio version of part 1 of Dark Age came out a few days ago and I'm trying to listen to it and it's a struggle. It's just not the same without TGR narrating. The guy IS Darrow. He's the GOAT.
>>24686581fuck, any possible translation in the future? I guess I need to learn french. Thanks anon.
>>24685488>period piece without doing any of the homework
>>24686519>>24684737I've read a few of his, and am quickly realizing he writes the same one female character each time. Usually not!Jewish hyper competent girl boss who is in a socially unacceptable role that she's won respect in due to being hyper competent. He also uses the same "underestimated, smart badass" character in a lot of places. His prose is top notch, and the books are page turners. His first book you read will likely feel like one of the best speculative fiction books you've read. The problem is, each other book feels too much the same, and as another anon noted his world is a softer, more progressive, and less complex version of real history.I've enjoyed the books of his I've read, but don't need to read any more.
>>24684778is the blade itself mentionned because its an introductionary book so its dull? Im at the second book and its alright. Glokta is cool, ninefingers starting to grow on me
>>24682209Blood Music by Bear showcases an attempt at trying to master biology
>>24686954Maybe I should bring back the meme folder and call it DO NOT TAKE THESE CHARTS SERIOUSLY.
>>24682199A Brother's Price is kinda nice, it's literally just a bodice ripper with the genders flipped, but it's nice and other than the Flipped Twilight I can't find other stuff with the same deal >>24682192Pretty good books, you can see them coming a mile off but the journey to get there is fun, I wouldn't call it "Whimsical" but it's generally within the same ballpark>>24682178Those are on my "To Read" list, they look neat
help a newfag out. where do you guys get your audiobooks from. just checked pirate bay and no one seeded the book im looking for
>>24687332https://fmhy.net/reading#audiobooks
>audio"book"
>>24687332check /t/
>>24687332audiobookbayThat's really what it's called. Google it. It has nearly everything. You need to make an account to download the torrents. Making an account is free. You might struggle to find seeds there too, if the book is old or niche enough. However, the seeding there is pretty good in general.
>>24687236it was actually ironiy all along? LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL!
As a prolific sci-fi reader I've tried getting into fantasy for a year now and every time I open a fantasy book I end up getting bored and dropping it and reading some sci-fi novel instead.Is fantasy just not for me or is there some procedure I'm forgetting?
>>24687779what are you reading? Fantasy is an incredibly broad genre
sci-fi isn't even real
>>24687807> fictionyou don't say
>>24687351oral storytelling predates writing and is the original way of having stories told
>>24687783I tried lord of the rings, wheel of time, game of thrones and discworld.Also Harry Potter when I was young, but didn't like it even then.
>>24687907How about pseudo-fantasy science fiction?
>>24687907Try something smaller as those are big series. What sort of things/themes do you like or maybe what sci-fi do you like so anons can see if there is a fantasy equivalent.
>>24687909I like exploration of weird novel ideas or profound realization about something or thought experiments.I don't care about power fantasies or characters too much.
>>24687779>>24687915same
>>24687915Check out The Just City. Blend of fantasy and sci-fi as it's about Greek Gods but has time travel stuff in it too.
