What written work of Christian apologetics can best convince atheists of the error of their ways?
>>24682807>Christian apologeticswhat's that? like theology?
>>24682807I hope this is bait
>>24682807the gospels
>>24682807This guy hasn't even read genesis. Don't fall for this grift
>>24682807Sam Hyde is still an atheist. His belief in God isn't done in faith it's a reactionary societal calculus
>>24683038Unironically worse than being an atheist since thinks he can be part of the Christian cause without being with Christ. Hilarious
>>24682807>best convince atheists of the error of their ways?the best approach for this problem is near-death experiences some obstinate atheists will need several of these tho'
A real Christian is not against the Jewish peopleSam is against the Jewish peopleTo be a real believer in Christ you cannot hate the Jewish people. Jesus Christ is the Messiah of the Jews. Christians are grafted into the promise that he gave to the Jews. Despite Jewish people (that are not Judeo-Christian) not accepting Christ, they are the 144,00 talked about in the book of Revelation who will accept Christ in the end. In Zachariah 13:8 it says that 1/3 of Israel will be redeemed. Anyways, bottom line is that Sam needs to repent of antisemitism. Despite many people having the spirit of the anti-Christ that does not mean the problem is the Jewish people. Jesus Christ was literally a Jew. God's chosen bloodline is the Jewish people (think Abraham--Isaac and Ishmael). Christians are grafted into the promise God has for the Jewish people (Romans 11)As a Christian, you can not be antisemitic. It says in the book of Genesis 12:3--"And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed."(this is God’s promise to Abraham — those who bless his descendants are blessed, those who curse them are cursed.)also Zechariah 2:8–9-- "For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye. For, behold, I will shake mine hand upon them, and they shall be a spoil to their servants: and ye shall know that the LORD of hosts hath sent me."Isaiah 60:12--"For the nation and kingdom that will not serve thee shall perish; yea, those nations shall be utterly wasted."Joel 3:2-- "I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and for my heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land."Romans 11:28–29--"As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance."
people aren't atheists because of reason they are atheists because they are bad people morally, i grew up secular w/ 0 exposure to religion.pic rel is actually a good brief overview of the general ideas and points to the philosophical errors (which I would say are moral).the issue is their self conception is basically the machine turning them into mechanical units to manipulate them and subjugate them and the mechanical philosophy isn't a serious world view it's more as I said a moral corrupt they've been trained into and actively will as a part of their self identity. Their existence and experience is filled with constant counter examples, encounters with children, other people, family, etc. If they can't be convinced by those things how could they be convinced by argument? You could give them something like Marcel's man against mass society but I don't think they'd even be able to process it. They are just fundamentally bad people who have rejected the goodness of reality.
>>24682807literally just read plato and aristotle and cut out the jewish middle men
>>24683038half of all public christians are like this, the finest and biggest example of this is peter thiel, who would have been burned at the stake a mere 300 years ago for being a ball huffing sodomite alone
>>24684063>people aren't atheists because of reason they are atheists because they are bad people morally
>>24684063>Their existence and experience is filled with constant counter examples, encounters with children, other people, family, etc.except the bible isnt about the happiness those things bring. instead its about this reality being increeeeedibly bad. i really wish people read the bible before reading feser, lewis, or aquinas
>>24682807sam hyde, for all his bluster, has the depth of a puddle of piss
Bump
>>24684405The bible assumes you aren't a technocratically brainwashed slaveI'd recommend people go to mass and read the gospels or try praying typically but like, this is a question about athiests, not agnostics. For agnostics I will actually focus on those things because the experiential side of religion is kind of essential in understanding it, though the intellectual side is understandable to you need the experiential side to even understand the question of what "does god exist" even mean.If someone is agnostic yes revelation is good there's a book i've been meaning to read on thathttps://www.amazon.com/Agnostic-Inquirer-Revelation-Philosophical-Standpoint/dp/0802803946This is making a philosophical case for why things like scripture/revelation should actually be like the primary approach for talking to these people. Personally im autistic and into philosophy so read my way into the church so if someone came at me with revelation I wouldn't really be able to take them seriously. But the experience with reality is about the "connection" with beings and how it points to people not just being material units, again this is about athiests who are all mechanistic materialists essentially. If you think children have any dignity, that love is anyhting more than a chemical reaction, all the really cringe reddit stuff then the athiesm doesn't really make sense. Serious athiest philosophers basically grant causality isn't real and consciousness is an illusion.There's a fundamental lack of gratitude that is required to be an athiest, again not an agnostic, to say as a matter of fact all humans are is matter, not that you aren't sure.Agnostic is a much less depraved position, but atheism is as I said just fundamentally a deep moral failure.
>>24684890>atheism is as I said just fundamentally a deep moral failure
>>24682807A book on how to build a gorilla nest out of twigs and branches.
>>24682807Oddly, Edith Stein's Finite and Infinite Being if you're very gifted philosophically will explain it. TL;DR, nothingness has an essence and essences have natures and the nature of essences and the essence of natures must come from somewhere, aka God. You could try to dent essences but denying is itself an essence whose meaning is denial. Meaning has an essence as well. These couple thoughts basically ensure God's real existence. Book of Job too.
>>24682807Personal experience
>>24684143>>24685020/pol/ bait
>>24685111Any philosophizing you can ever do to argue that being a theist is just being A DECENT FUCKING HUMAN BEING is immediately invalidated by the fact that most of the religious world is brown. Cope.
>>24684042>Jesus Christ is the Messiah of the Jews.jews literally hate jesus lolkike propaganda
>>24685364They hate dealing with christian proselytizing and antisemitism. They don't worship Jesus as God because that is idolatry according to the Bible. Otherwise, most jews don't have a problem with Jesus they just associate his followers with countless atrocities against the jewish people.
>>24685388>jesus is not the messiah of the jewsexactly what i saidanyway
>>24685397Not the messiah =/= hate
>>24685388>Otherwise, most jews don't have a problem with Jesuslmao read the talmud
>>24685402am i not allowed to hate?
>>24685364The contention between Christians and Jews is merely a schism over whether the Messiah was fulfilled or not. All of this is still based on Jewish mythology and Jesus was still a Jew, regardless of whether other Jews hate him or not. Quit being retarded.
>>24684143>>24685020Brown people also breathe so you should probably stop doing that.
>>24685518>to be religious is to be moral >the most immoral people are religious SAAR CHRIST IS REDEEM
>>24685430Jesus Christ isn't mentioned in the Talmud
>>24682807>written work of Christian apologeticsWhy is an almighty god so dependent on humans to demonstrate his existence, tho?
>>24685526>SAAAAAAAAR I PREEEEEEEYYYYY 2 JEWSUS CRUST!! SO EYE AM BETTER THAN UUUUU. TIME TO EAT MY OWN SHIT!!1
>>24685528ill post my excerpts from my hard drive later if i get the chance. He's reviled as a sorcerer and you are lying.
>>24682807DESU the vast majority of atheists are that way because of terrible dogmatic Christians or super-lax do whatever you want Christianity. Many "Satanists" are just edgy atheists attempting to catch these types of Christians into taking the rage-bait and attacking them for doing good things to showcase their hypocrisy. I think as Christians we shouldn't engage with these types of people but focus inward toward the Christians who make us look bad and poison our public image. Separating ourselves from those people and preventing their misuse of the Bible for their own gain and/or misinterpretations really needs to stop. It would at least win over many agnostics and young people.
>>246840632+2 = 4, therefore that book is false.
>>24682807
>>24685695There are several different Joshuas (common Hebrew name) mentioned in the Talmud in a negative light, all born in different times not corresponding to the birth of Jesus and with various facts contradicting each other and the Christ narrative.
>>24685770more educated jews than you have historically admitted that the infamous Yeshua is Christ.
>>24685795>the infamous Yeshua is Christ.Which one
>>24682807>>24683024>>24683038>>24684042>ITT RetardsSam Hyde is a Tim Rogers style troll wherein you can literally trust zero things he says or does publicly. He is always putting on some kind of character and always has contradictory beliefs and ideas. If you believe him, after decades of this, you're a retard.
>>24684042>real Christian is not against the Jewish peopleA real Christian Is completly against the jewish and a real jew Is against christianity, both are rival creed, if judaísm is true then Christ Is just a scammer and a charlatán and not the messhia, and if christianity Is true judaísm is no longer necessary since the pact of god with humanity has changed and jews are no lo ger the choosen people, both creeds can't coexist
>>24684415He was a flash in the pan 10-15 years ago. Basically just thriving on being edgy, bringing 4chan to the masses combined with a sort of evolution of vaporwave aestethics shifting from the 80s to a more 90s digital vibe and mixing it with shooter manifesto contents. The first season on World Peace was pretty interesting as far as bringing subversive counter culture tom a mainstream outlet. But they are just doing the same shit except that they've shifted from the edgy ironic right to conservative views. Sam doesn't seem to have any original thoughts, he's just a lost boy roleplaying a patriarch through quotes and stereotypical "masculine" posturing.Jordan Peterson and Sam occupy the same place in my brain as people taking advantage of weak boys. Sam gets the ones that never want to grow up and Jordan gets the one that want to. They are both just corrupting propagandists. At least Jordan stands for something, Sam just shifts to whatever benefits the situation he is in. Btw check out his temper tantrum on Harland Williams pod, the guy's truly a fag.
>>24682807I think thishttps://archive.org/details/logicorrightuseo00wattand thishttps://www.gutenberg.org/files/5827/5827-h/5827-h.htmWithout knowing what logic is, and that it's not something inherently anti-religion, and without knowing about philosophical idealism, and without knowing about rhetoric such as metaphor, the entire discussion of religion is utterly pointless, and most people on both sides are utterly lacking in these departments.
>>24686157>he's just a lost boy roleplaying a patriarchProbably the most apt description of Sam at this point. A mid-life crisis flickering before our eyes. He could have been like Adam Friedland if he had just kept his mouth shut a little longer. Probably could have squeezed in a few slurs like Shane Gillis but alas….its all over for him.
>>24684415I disagree. Several of his sketches were deep. For example the one about bullying, and the one about pua culture. There are also talk videos which were deep, such as this one:https://youtu.be/EBxMs8JiJ2Y
>>24686186You have to realize there's a difference between Sam Hyde the person and what he wants to say, and the end product which you see, it's not like he can say whatever he wants, he's just trying to play the cards he's dealt, play 4d chess, to the best of his abilities. He has a good heart, but his message is being corrupted, and the corrupted product is what you get. Being in person at his stand up is guaranteed to be a very different experience. He was blacklisted from all the venues as far as I know. He started again but like everything else he has learned to filter himself heavily, he has learned you can't be in showbiz without playing by the rules.
>>24686215>cards he was dealtHe was given pretty good cards to start out with: an adult swim show, loyal fans, friends with other comedians. If anything he’s just coping through the squandering most of those cards: even fishtank, the pet project, is just a shadow of the MDE energy. Friedland is hardly talented enough to justify his popularity, but he’s still grilling Zionist gov reps, even had Chris Coumo on his show. Sam could have easily taken Friedland’s place, if he had stopped chimping out and learned to keep that shit under the hood. Now it’s out, he’s a nazi, he’s inked out for good. Not even about “playing by the rules” so much as it’s “don’t be a fucking retard.” Marketability is one thing, but outright chimping out in public is entirely self-inflicted damage.
>>24686259I said he's doing as best he can retard, in dealing with trying to work in spite of filters put on him, by cards I meant the system.
>>24686269>Best he canAfter years of self sabotage, sure. You can only claim victim-hood so many times before it gets tiresome. He’s burned nearly all the goodwill he was given.
>>24686191Is it his depth though? Or has he just adapted someone else's deep thought? Jordan Peterson is the king of this. He just regurgitates Jung and gets credit for the another man's ideas.
>>24682807None.People can change their minds though. I was a hardcore fedora atheist during my teens and early 20s. I am now in my 30s, and after some years reading Lewis and Eliot, I truly feel I want to become a christian. Last week I attended mass for the first time, I thought it was beautiful.I still have my doubts, but I am certainly not happy with secularism. I think the lack of religion have made society, overall, far worse than it used to be.
>>24686291then go watch your corporate cocksuckers instead and stop moaning
>>24686373>regurgitates Jungdon't read books!don't get ideas from anything other than meditation!
>>24686132All that means is someone can't be jewish and christian simultaneously. Doesn't mean they can't coexist. Christianity being true necessitates judaism being true because it is a fulfillment of the old covenant.
>>24686215This is 4chan where every anon is so much smarter than everyone else. They approach any public figure from their infallible lens therefore no name is good enough
>>24686426do you really think sam is different from the others?
>>24686433I am not saying that you shouldn't learn from others. But they just make money off of people being to lazy to open a book themselves. Jordan gets labeled a genius not off of his own ideas but because he brought another mans ideas to the masses. If it was all alturisitc it'd be fine but it ain't
>>24686413>I still have my doubts, but I am certainly not happy with secularism. I think the lack of religion have made society, overall, far worse than it used to be.You betray your LARP.
>>24686479Well I agree that there is a problem which permeates every inch of our society which is intellectual corruption, but I don't think this is a novel idea. I can't trust anyone recommending a book for example and I'm disgusted by it. Everything is dirty. Someone says a book is good, you see it's a youtube short telling you there's a link, an affiliated amazon link, in the description, and the video has a million views, well no fucking shit it's the greatest fucking book ever written. This is what we're dealing with, welcome to Earth.
>>24685860Lmao
MDE is a teenage girl raping death cult and have been for a long time
>>24685430Not every David is a king.
>>24686413Putting down secularism is just masked hatred of freedom. Secularism should be rejoiced as a libreation of the collective conciousness. The west is at an inflexion point certainly but regressing back to the teet of religion is weak. Morals aren't exclusive to religion and finding meaning without it being prescribed is tough. I think this longing for religion might be more malicious though. With religion we only have to allot energy towards understanding a few ways of being, the rest get squashed. We want people to be controlled for our own convenience and to receive relief from existentialist thought. Be a man instead, embrace the absurdity and regain your dignity. It may not be the easiest route but the only way to remain in truth.
>>24686579This common sense is usually labeled as r*ddit here, either by pagan or christian larpers. And I say that as someone favourable to christianism, precisely because in Europe christianism was rationally developed as a precursor of secularism.
>>24686579Nah, nothing matters so I'd rather participate in collectivist delusion
>>24686579Based
>>24682807cringe
The Transcendental Argument for God is the most convincing as far as I'm concerned. >>24686191 Funnily enough, Jay Dyer writes for Sam Hyde.>>24685736How do you know that?
>>24684063>>24684890
>>24686579>Putting down secularism is just masked hatred of freedomI'll skip the rhethoric where I ask why ought I accept your presupposition that freedom is good and jump straight to the conclusion that, evidently, freedom in abundance has been detrimental to society, in the last 15 years and forever. Unless you want to claim that we're not free enough where we could destroy negative elements in society? They then wouldn't have freedom.>Morals aren't exclusive to religionThey are lest they're arbitrary
>>24683045It worked for the GOP for the last 60 years. The majority of Christians are cultural Christians.
>>24686579>Secularism should be rejoiced as a libreation of the collective conciousness.SSRIs, sterilization, and hedonism sure seem like liberation to me too after enough porn and lies. Where do I get those lies btw? Great drugs you got, mayne your cringelord boss Satan will give you a raise.>may the most precious Blood of Jesus Christ cover this thread and myself
>>24682807>Another Internet grifter turns to Christ™.People will look back at this like they do about atheists from 2009 and feel the same type of cringe.
>>24688144It really should already have happened. I feel like the tradcath meme had already become passe in 2017
>>24687860>They are lest they're arbitr-ACK!?
>God presents the truth to us in such a way that he requires us to examine everything before us, and to investigate whether or not it is true. Now, we can deduce from this that he asks nothing of us other than to examine and investigate what is before us and to do this with care, and that he will be satisfied so long as, once we’ve examined it to the best of our ability, we accept as true those objects which seem to be true, and so long as we love them as a gift from heaven. It is impossible for a sincere love of any object which, once we’ve examined it most carefully, we accept as a gift from God, and which we only love because of our conviction that it comes to us from God, to be a bad thing, even were that conviction to be mistaken.Pierre Bayle
I’m just at the point where I view all religious people as monkeys, just dumb and lower than me. I’ll still try to work with them if needed and be friendly but any matter of opinion or expertise and I already know to discount most everything they say. This thread proved it to me even more.
