This is not supposed to be some sort of gotcha, I am really intrigued to know where the line is. I was read the "Simile of the Saw" passage, and I'm unsure if Buddhism really is advocating for injustice to prevail.>"Even if low-down bandits were to sever you limb from limb, anyone who had a malevolent thought on that account would not be following my instructions. If that happens, you should train like this: âOur minds will remain unaffected. We will blurt out no bad words. We will remain full of compassion, with a heart of love and no secret hate. We will meditate spreading a heart of love to that person. And with them as a basis, we will meditate spreading a heart full of love to everyone in the worldâabundant, expansive, limitless, free of enmity and ill will.â Thatâs how you should train."
>injusticeThey donât believe in concepts like justice or love or even civilization.
>>24762308The really funny part is if our experience is actually one and done and these retards are full of compassion and love as they're getting ripped apart in their one and only conscious experience. lol, lmao.
>>24762308Injustice? All I see is a member of an oppressed class rightfully struggling to survive and glean pleasure from his worldly existence.
>>24762397Not exactly a gotcha since their torture would have happened whether or not they were trying to be loving and compassionate.
>>24762318>They donât believe in concepts like justiceSo why bother acting "good"?
>>24762497Yeah, but now they won't look like cucks to the 3rd party observer. Win bigly by screeching hatred at the entitles chopping you up into cubes. One final gottem.
>>24762540Wanting to act is suffering, you must become like water
In Buddhism, if you are enlightened then someone cutting your body up is about as serious to you as an ant masturbating. Buddhism is about just not caring and treating and believing itâs all a dream
>>24762570If you're so goddamn enlightened then just treat the material plane in a respectful manner too and move your fleshbody in such a way that it avoids robbers and maybe even does something productive
>>24764052There is no such thing as being productive in Buddhism. Being enlightened means transcending good versus bad and every other duality. You can move your body, sure, or not. But being enlightened means it ultimately makes no difference which you do.
>>24762308This passage is about intention. Buddhists believe that your intention is as or more important than your action. This is because of the dhammapada's statement that mind is everything and if you change your mind you'll stop suffering. The intention is what matters in an action. You can protect yourself from getting beat up, but if you do so with any negative intention, that intention (hatred, rage, or the intention to harm) will be bad karma and cause more suffering down the road.
>>24762308Doormats are the great illusion. You are clearly not enlightened
>>24765011Well even with positive intention youâll generate good karma, which ultimately leads to rebirth too. The point is to detach your mind and identity from all things, including your actions. Attachment is like a cobweb
>>24762308This passage is like a painting which depicts the behaviour of a Saint in a given situation. It's used as an example to illustrate what being enlightened/awakened is.
>>24762540You don't. It's all a facade according to buddhists.
>>24762308Early Buddhism was exclusively a religion for medicant monastics that hung out in graveyards in the jungle. It didn't concern itself with socio-political concepts like "allowing injustice to prevail". If you kill someone (even in self-defense) it incurs bad karma -> you go to hell for a bazillion years before you get another go at being human so don't do it under any circumstances. If you're a Buddhist monk that has fully bought into the idea of rebirth that line of reasoning is perfectly sensible.
>>24765050mendicant*
>>24765022No, all buddhists sects say to cultivate good intentions and good karma. The Buddha himself is simply an infinite storehouse of good karmic deeds.
>>24765063No they donât.
>>24765068can you cite any buddhist texts that says good karma is actually bad?
>>24762308You need to grasp how brutal and selfish society was before Buddhism emerged. Youâre looking at these texts through the lens of a modern world that has the privilege of thousands of years of accumulated wisdom... philosophers, spiritual teachers, moral frameworks, and a general awareness of human rights. Back then, none of that existed.People werenât worrying about âhow do I avoid being a doormat.â Their mindset was raw and impulsive: âIf someone steals from me, beat them within an inch of their life. If it turns out I misplaced the item... too bad.â Cruelty was normal. A single mistake was often met with tenfold retaliation. Assumptions and rage routinely led to unnecessary suffering and violence.Thatâs the context Buddhism was speaking into. It wasnât a cushy set of rules for a comfortable, modern society, it was radical medicine for a world poisoned by pride, vengeance, and ignorance. When you read these teachings today, donât interpret them as if they were written for your current social environment. Interpret them with the awareness that they were crafted in a time where humility, compassion, and forgiveness were almost entirely absent, and desperately needed.
>>24762308If all of your enemies were well, happy, and peaceful, they would not be your enemies. If they were free from problems, pain, suffering, affliction, neurosis, psychosis, paranoia, fear, tension, anxiety, etc., they would not be your enemies, and there would be less suffering in the world.The practical approach toward your enemies is to help them overcome their problems, so you can live in peace and happiness. You should fill the minds of all your enemies with loving friendliness and make all of them realize the true meaning of peace, so you can live in peace and happiness. When you hate somebody, you think, âLet him be ugly. Let him lie in pain. Let him have no prosperity. Let him not be rich. Let him not be famous. Let him have no friends. Let him, after death, reappear in an unhappy state of deprivation in a bad destination for eternity.â However, what actually happens is that your own body generates such harmful chemistry that you experience pain, increased heart rate, tension, change of facial expression, loss of appetite, deprivation of sleep, and you appear very unpleasant to others. You go through the same things you wish on your enemy. Also you cannot see the truth as it is. Your mind is like boiling water. Or you are like a patient suffering from jaundice to whom any delicious food tastes bland. Similarly, you cannot appreciate somebodyâs appearance, achievement, success, etc. And as long as this condition exists, you will not be at peace.Your thoughts are transformed into speech and action.Thought translated into action is capable of producing a tangible result. You should always speak and do things with mindfulness of loving friendliness. As mindfulness of loving friendliness develops, your thoughts, words, and deeds should be gentle, pleasant, meaningful, truthful, and beneficial to you as well as to others.
>>24762558Do 3rd party observers really exist?
>>24762308Right contemplation is learning how to think without greed, hatred and delusion underlying your thoughts.Try and contemplate the phenomenon of anger.>âWhat is common to all of those experiences of anger or irritation? What is their nature?âOne of the most obvious things is that>ANGER is UNPLEASANT.Every single time you experience it, itâs unpleasant. >âCan I be angry without that little sting of displeasure in it? Is there any anger that is truly enjoyable and pleasant?â>Itâs always unpleasant,thereâs not a single exception. It always burns.Somebody does something that upsets you, that irritates you. Youâre irritated, you got angry because youâre upset for whatever reason. Then, say, on some other occasion, youâre in a good mood and somebody does the same thing to you but now you really did not experience that sting of discomfort and youâre not angry. You might even laugh it off. You realize then that>ANGER is not directly determined by what has been done to you>itâs determined by whether youâre EXPERIENCING DISCOMFORT on account of it or not.>Itâs determined by your STATE OF MIND>Every time you were angry, irritated, annoyed, means to some degree you were upset.It doesnât matter how subtle that upset was, itâs still the upset which means>there was a degree of discomfort, displeasure, unpleasant feelingâevery single time.And every single time that you get upset in the future, that will be the same basis. Then you realize that what you get angry with in the present, what youâve been getting angry with in the past, or what you will be getting angry with in the future, has to do with your unwillingness to FEEL and ACCEPT DISCOMFORT on the emotional level.>resisting unpleasant feelings is what makes you angry.Not other people or objects.
>>24762397https://www.dhammatalks.org/books/TruthOfRebirth/Section0003.html>skillful actions always lead in the direction of happiness and well-being; unskillful actions always lead in the direction of suffering and harm.>itâs a safer wager to assume that actions bear results that can affect not only this lifetime but also lifetimes after this than it is to assume the opposite.>it is a safer, more reasonable, and more honorable policy to assume the truth of these teachings than it would be to assume otherwise.>action is an investment that, like all investments, incurs risks.In MN 60, the Buddha pointed out that anyone who adheres to the annihilationist view would not be expected to avoid unskillful behavior,whereas those who hold to the oppositeâmundane right viewâwould be expected to avoid unskillful behavior.Then he said of the first (annihilationist) group:âWith regard to this, an observant person considers thus: âIf there is no next world, thenâwith the breakup of the body, after deathâthis venerable person has made himself safe. But if there is the next world, then this venerable personâwith the breakup of the body, after deathâwill reappear in a plane of deprivation, a bad destination, a lower realm, hell. Even if we didnât speak of the next world, and there werenât the true statement of those venerable contemplatives & brahmans [who assert the existence of the next world], this venerable person is still criticized in the here-&-now by the observant as a person of bad habits & wrong view: one who holds to a doctrine of non-existence.â If there really is a next world, then this venerable person has made a bad throw twice: in that he is criticized by the observant here-&-now, and in thatâwith the breakup of the body, after deathâhe will reappear in a plane of deprivation, a bad destination, a lower realm, hell. Thus this safe-bet teaching, when poorly grasped & poorly adopted by him, covers (only) one side, and leaves behind the possibility of the skillful.âAs for the second groupâthose who hold to mundane right view and act on itâhe said this:âWith regard to this, an observant person considers thus: âIf there is the next world, then this venerable personâwith the breakup of the body, after deathâwill reappear in a good destination, a heavenly world. Even if we didnât speak of the next world, and there werenât the true statement of those venerable contemplatives & brahmans, this venerable person is still praised in the here-&-now by the observant as a person of good habits & right view: one who holds to a doctrine of existence.â If there really is a next world, then this venerable person has made a good throw twice, in that he is praised by the observant here-&-now; and in thatâwith the breakup of the body, after deathâhe will reappear in a good destination, a heavenly world. Thus this safe-bet teaching, when well grasped & adopted by him, covers both sides, and leaves behind the possibility of the unskillful.â â MN 60
>>24762308>This is the noble truth of stress:Birth is stressful,aging is stressful,death is stressful;sorrow, lamentation, pain, distress, and despair are stressful;association with the unbeloved is stressful,separation from the loved is stressful,not getting what is wanted is stressful.>The five clinging aggregates are stressful.>This is the noble truth of the origination of stress:The craving that makes for further becomingâ accompanied by passion and delight,relishing now here and now there:>Sensuality-craving,>Becoming-craving,>Nonbecoming-craving.And where does this craving, when arising, arise?And where, when dwelling, does it dwell?Whatever is endearing and alluring in terms of the world;that is where this craving, when arising, arises.That is where, when dwelling, it dwells.>What is endearing and alluring in terms of the world?The eye...The earâŚThe noseâŚThe tongueâŚThe bodyâŚThe intellectâŚFormsâŚSoundsâŚAromasâŚTastesâŚTactile sensationsâŚIdeasâŚ.Eye-consciousnessâŚEar-consciousnessâŚNose-consciousnessâŚTongue-consciousnessâŚBody-consciousnessâŚIntellect-consciousnessâŚEye-contactâŚEar-contactâŚNose-contactâŚTongue-contactâŚBody-contactâŚIntellect-contactâŚFeeling born of eye-contactâŚFeeling born of ear-contactâŚFeeling born of nose-contactâŚFeeling born of tongue-contactâŚFeeling born of body contactâŚFeeling born of intellect-contactâŚPerception of formsâŚPerception of soundsâŚPerception of aromasâŚPerception of tastesâŚPerception of tactile sensationsâŚPerception of ideasâŚIntention for formsâŚIntention for soundsâŚIntention for aromasâŚIntention for tastesâŚIntention for tactile sensationsâŚIntention for ideasâŚCraving for formsâŚCraving for soundsâŚCraving for aromasâŚCraving for tastesâŚCraving for tactile sensationsâŚCraving for ideasâŚThought directed at formsâŚThought directed at soundsâŚThought directed at aromasâŚThought directed at tastesâŚThought directed at tactile sensationsâŚThought directed at ideasâŚEvaluation of formsâŚEvaluation of soundsâŚEvaluation of aromasâŚEvaluation of tastesâŚEvaluation of tactile sensationsâŚEvaluation of ideasâŚThat is what is endearing and alluring in terms of the world.That is where this craving, when arising, arises.That is where, when dwelling, it dwells.>This is the noble truth of the cessation of stress:the remainderless fading and cessation,renunciation, relinquishment, release, and>letting goof that very craving.
>>24762308Beings are the owners of their actions (karma), heir to their actions, born of their actions, related through their actions, and have their actions as their arbitrator. Action is what creates distinctions among beings in terms of coarseness & refinement.âŚâThere is the case where a woman or man is a killer of living beings, brutal, bloody-handed, given to killing & slaying, showing no mercy to living beings. Through having adopted & carried out such actions, on the break-up of the body, after death, he/she reappears in a plane of deprivation, a bad destination, a lower realm, hell. If, on the break-up of the body, after deathâinstead of reappearing in a plane of deprivation, a bad destination, a lower realm, hellâhe/she comes to the human state, then he/she is short-lived wherever reborn. This is the way leading to a short life: to be a killer of living beings, brutal, bloody-handed, given to killing & slaying, showing no mercy to living beings.âThere is the case where a woman or man is one who harms beings with his/her fists, with clods, with sticks, or with knives. Through having adopted & carried out such actions, on the break-up of the body, after death, he/she reappears in a plane of deprivation⌠If instead he/she comes to the human state, then he/she is sickly wherever reborn. This is the way leading to sickliness: to be one who harms beings with oneâs fists, with clods, with sticks, or with knives.
>>24762308An angry person is ugly & sleeps poorly.Gaining a profit, he turns it into a loss,having done damage with word & deed.A person overwhelmed with angerdestroys his wealth.Maddened with anger,he destroys his status.Relatives, friends, & colleagues avoid him.Anger brings loss.Anger inflames the mind.He doesnât realizethat his danger is born from within.An angry persondoesnât know his own benefit.An angry persondoesnât see the Dhamma.A man conquered by angeris in a mass of darkness.He takes pleasure in bad deedsas if they were good,but later, when his anger is gone,he suffers as if burned with fire.He is spoiled, blotted out,like fire enveloped in smoke.When anger spreads,when a man becomes angry,he has no shame, no compunction,is not respectful in speech.For a person overcome with anger,nothing gives light.
Whenever anger comes up, take out a mirror and look at yourself. When you are angry, you are not very beautiful, you are not presentable. Hundreds of muscles on your face become very tense. Your face looks like a bomb ready to explode. Look at someone who is angry. When you see the tension in him, you become frightened. The bomb inside may explode any minute. So it is very helpful to see yourself in moments when you are angry. It is a bell of mindfulness. When you see yourself like that, you are motivated to do something to change it. You know what to do to look more beautiful. You need only to breathe peacefully, calmly, and smile mindfully.If you can do that one or two times, you will look much better. Just look in the mirror, breathing in calmly, breathing out smiling, and you will feel relief.Anger is a mental, psychological phenomenon, yet it is closely linked to biological and biochemical elements. Anger makes you tense your muscles, but when you know how to smile, you begin to relax and your anger will decrease.Smiling allows the energy of mindfulness to be born in you, helping you to embrace your anger.In old times, servants of kings and queens always had to have a mirror, because whenever anyone was presented to the emperor, they had to be perfect in their appearance. So for the sake of formal etiquette, people would carry a pouch with a small mirror inside. Try it. Carry a mirror with you and look at it to see what state you are in. After you have breathed in and out a few times, smiling at yourself, the tension will be gone, and you will obtain some relief.
>>24765401This assumes that malice is the product of suffering only and never a rejection of submission to the good.
>>24765490I don't think so.
>>24765070Teachings of Bodhidharma says enlightenment is about having no karma, good or bad, but you phrase the question wrong. Good karma is âgoodâ, bad karma is âbadâ, but Buddhism is about transcending duality and wanting neither âgoodâ nor âbadâ attachments. If you achieve an abundance of good karma then you get reincarnated as a god in a blissful realm which in term puts to sleep and makes you neglect getting out of the cycle. Therefore actions are to be done without the idea of âthis is goodâ
>>24762308If you die while clinging to ill-will, it can lead to a lower birth.>28. What is the process by which rebirth happens?The Buddhaâs short explanation is that,>at the moment of death, an act of craving heads toward a new birth in a new world of experience. If you cling to that craving, youâre reborn.The analogy he gives is of a fire jumping from one house to another. Just as a fire depends on the wind to sustain and carry it from one house to the next,>when you cling to craving here and now, at the moment of death, it sustains and carries you to the next lifeIn a longer explanation, the Buddha lists four stages to the process:⢠First, based on ignorance, thereâs craving, which can be for any of three things:>sensual fantasies;>becomingâa particular identity in a particular world of experience; or>non-becoming, the desire to destroy a particular identity in a particular world of experience.One of the Buddhaâs discoveries is that this last craving(non-becoming), instead of putting an end to becoming, actually creates new becoming.This is why the path to the end of kamma and rebirth has to develop dispassion for all three forms of craving so as to put them aside.⢠Next, based on craving, thereâs clingingâyou feed mentally off the craving, in hopes that it will take you to even more food.⢠Then thereâs becoming, in which a potential world of experience, together with a potential identity within that world, appears to the mind.These worlds can exist on any of three levels:âthe sensory levelâranging from the pains of hell and the animal realm, through the mixed pleasures and pains of the human world, and on up to the pleasures of the sensual heavens;âthe realm of formâheavens in which the inhabitants enjoy the pleasures of pure form;âthe realm of formlessnessâheavens in which the inhabitants enjoy formless pleasures, such as the pleasure of infinite space or of infinite consciousness.The range of worlds and identities that will appear in this way at your death will come from your past actionsâin body, speech, and mind. Unskillful actions will produce painful becomings; skillful actions, pleasant ones. This is why itâs important to develop skillful actions throughout life. In this way, such practices as generosity, virtue, and meditation not only lead to happiness in this lifetime, but also provide the possibility of happy future lives.⢠Then thereâs birth, when you move into taking on a role in one of the potential worlds of experience.These four steps are the same process you experience when the mind goes for a distracting thought while you meditateâwhich is why learning how to keep the mind concentrated on a single object without getting waylaid by distracting thoughts is an excellent preparation in learning to die skillfully.
>>24762308Buddhism is just religion for boomers and lefties who are comfortable watching their society crumble around them due to their passivity. Complete meme of a religion.
the difference is strength training, you need to have a good chance of fighting off and escaping such situations, in order to actually believe such a thing seriously. otherwise you'll either self consciously or unconsciously have doubt. you wont be able to truly believe such a philosophy. you'd feel more comfortable with a slave religion. buddhism is a religion of princes sitting under trees. with armed guards patrolling the perimeter.
>>24765611Society crumbles from greed, hatred, and delusion.If everyone were a Buddhist, society would be peaceful.Phenomena arepreceded by the heart,ruled by the heart,made of the heart.If you speak or actwith a corrupted heart,then suffering follows you âas the wheel of the cart,the track of the oxthat pulls it.Phenomena arepreceded by the heart,ruled by the heart,made of the heart.If you speak or actwith a calm, bright heart,then happiness follows you,like a shadowthat never leaves.âHe insulted me,hit me,beat me,robbed meââfor those who brood on this,hostility isnât stilled.âHe insulted me,hit me,beat me,robbed meââfor those who donât brood on this,hostility is stilled.Hostilities arenât stilledthrough hostility,regardless.Hostilities are stilledthrough non-hostility:this, an unending truth.Unlike those who donât realizethat weâre here on the vergeof perishing,those who do:their quarrels are stilled.
When the Buddha talked about Samsara, he didn't mean a place. Samsara is a process. It's something people do. They go around creating worlds. When one world begins to wear out, you've gotta create another one. When that one wears out, you create another. You keep creating worlds and moving in and then having to move on from them, over and over.And you bump into other people who are creating their worlds as well. In fact, it turns out that your world has to feed off the worlds of other people. Their worlds have to feed off others' worlds.Worlds keep caving in on you and killing you. Then you have to go through the process of rebirth all over again by finding a world and giving rise to it through your actions.The Buddha said the tears you've shed through your many lifetimes are greater than the water in the ocean. The next time you go playing in the water, remind yourself that you're playing in your accumulated tears.There's the suffering we cause each other because our worlds feed on the worlds of others. There's a lot in this process of world creation that depends on feeding off the worlds of others. Think about your food, your clothing, your shelter, the medicine you need in order to keep yourself fed, clothed, sheltered, healthy. Even basic processes involve a lot of suffering. Our ongoing lives require the support of others. We depend on the suffering of others.The most responsible thing to do is to learn how to get over this addiction you have for creating worlds. This is why the process of learning how to get out of the cycle of rebirth and redeath is not a selfish one. It's more like overcoming a bad habit - an abusive habit. It's like overcoming an addiction. Once you've learned how to overcome it, you can teach others how you did it so they can do it themselves. When you get the point where you're not creating worlds anymore, then you're lightening their load.One less world to feed.
>>24765617âBefore, when I has a householder, maintaining the bliss of kingship, I had guards posted within and without the royal apartments, within and without the city, within and without the countryside. But even though I was thus guarded, thus protected, I dwelled in fearâagitated, distrustful, & afraid. But now, on going alone to the wilderness, to the root of a tree, or to an empty dwelling, I dwell without fear, unagitated, confident, & unafraidâunconcerned, unruffled, living on the gifts of others, with my mind like a wild deer. This is the compelling reason I have in mind thatâwhen going to the wilderness, to the root of a tree, or to an empty dwellingâI repeatedly exclaim, âWhat bliss! What bliss!ââ
>>24762308Why are you singleing out Buddhism? How is this any different from "turn the other cheek" in Christianity?
>>24765544Compelling argument. This is somehow worse than the typical libertarian nonsense of "if everyone did X, than obviously Y." Which aside from being naive is just kind of dumb. Why must Y, how do you ensure X? What makes this worse is it holds itself as some deep spiritual truth rather than confining itself to the realm of politics.
>>24766180https://www.dhammatalks.org/books/ShapeOfSuffering/Section0007.html
>>24765490>malice is the product of sufferingsuffering a product of clinging to malice
>>24766180https://www.dhammatalks.org/books/SublimeAttitudes/Section0003.html
>>24765884create a world that feeds on suffering and shits out freedom from suffering, peace, and wisdom thenwhen there is no suffering left, that world will suffer from hunger and eat itself
