Did it ever occur to him that desire is the actual cause of suffering, anxiety, delusion, etc. instead of "civilization" and "repression" or was his life just too sheltered to come to that realization?
>>24786264Except Freud recognises that the human condition entails that many mo of our desires will be frustrated, which causes suffering. The conflict between the individual and civilisation is intractable.
>>24786281>Except Freud recognises that the human condition entails that many mo of our desires will be frustratedExactly, in that it is something else in the human condition that causes desires to be frustrated and therefore suffering, not desire itself and man's meaningless striving after pleasure and comfort because, let's be real, Freud was a hedonist trying to justify his cravings.
>>24786264You have to read beyond the pleasure principle to get it. It’s not all about sex and pleasure. In fact, often sex and pleasure are mediated forms of deeper psychological machinery underneath. The core point of Freud that you need to understand is that the ego and super ego are evolutionarily younger than the id and they all mutually resent having to share a brain with each other. We are still too early in the evolution of the brain to live in minds which are psychically complete. Basically we are prototypes and 99% of our issues come down to the fact there is some issue between the interfacing of the three.
>>24786335>it is something else in the human condition that causes desires to be frustrateIf by that you mean the simple fact we aren't all-powerful.
>>24786382>psychically completeThis means nothing. Also, beyond the pleasure principle is essentially just meaningless speculation on behalf of Freud trying to salvage his worthless theory.>>24786405>If by that you mean the simple fact we aren't all-powerful.That is what Freud means. The anon I was responding to thinks that this was somehow a counterpoint to my point on Freud but in reality it isn't. Freud just locates problems in something other than desire or how the desire is merely frustrated/not fulfilled, leaving room for hedonists to speculate as to how to change the world so as to better accomodate pleasure/freedom. In reality, it is just desire that causes all problems and dissatisfaction since people still remain dissatisfied even after attaining their attachment and are filled with anxiety at the thought of losing them. The anon above may be right in his assertion that humans are backwards animals, but psychoanalysis is certainly not helping with that.
>>24786264just like neetch this nigga went mad trying to reject schopenhauer
>>24786264>>24786382>>24786600Not too deep into freud, but had to get a little familiar with him for child psych, Isnt the pleasure principle only one part of the three part human dynamic of id, ego, and super ego? The Id part? There is also the personalized vision of the self in the ego, and the back of the mind metacognition of the superego.
>>24786264>Did it ever occur to him that desire is the actual cause of suffering, anxiety, delusion, etc.Did you ever read a single fucking thing that Freud wrote? Fucking retard. What the fuck do you think the "reality principle" is? Desire and frustrated desire is literally one of the most important threads of thought throughout Freud's entire corpus. It especially comes out in Civilization and its Discontents. Did you spent your whole life regurgitating memes? Did you ever crack open a single book and try to figure out what Freud actually said?
>>24787124See>>24786335
>>24787124>jak poster>putting in effort to understand something they don't expect to agree with
>>24787200Freud is not difficult to understand. His theory is not really a complex science or even worth the weight of his books. It is the product of a delusional mind adhered to by decadent westerners who in the final evaluation are worth less than cattle.
>>24787228How many 4chan posts and GPT summaries did it take to reach this conclusion?
>>24786264
>>24787246Like zero or something. Unless you count posts made by actual freudians.
>>24787228I think the id, ego, superego is a useful classification. ANd I think there is something to be said about different stages of life bringing with it sensorial fixations. Even if all of it isnt solid.
>>24787386Ok, why?
>>24787398Well, when I think of the mind, there are immediate impulses, longer term tendencies that make up me rather than another, and even longer term patterns of generalized conduct.And as people develop, you can see as they experience the world through ifferent primary senses at different times.Now, im not a complete primary psycho-sexualist, but I think it is a useful lense to see human development alongside other models like cognitive-behavioral or socio-cultural.
>>24787409>Well, when I think of the mind, there are immediate impulses, longer term tendencies that make up me rather than another, and even longer term patterns of generalized conduct.And you need the Id, ego and superego to tell you this as opposed to, like, ignorance and craving?>primary psycho-sexualistFreud kinda stopped being this when he pulled the death drive out of his ass.>but I think it is a useful lense to see human developmentIn what way?
>>24786264I mean Freud took from Schopenhauer who basically said the same thing.
>>24787461> as opposed to, like, ignorance and cravingto my understanding, the model is more like: impulse, awareness, and metacognition. what I immediately want, who I am, and the patterns I have noticed subtextually.>In what way?Ah anon I said in what way already>And as people develop, you can see as they experience the world through different primary senses at different times.
>>24787472>the model is more like: impulse, awareness, and metacognitionWhy choose that pseudoscientific model instead of some other? Also, it's moreso about repression, things you do not know you even want but your analyst does.>Ah anon I said in what way alreadyNo. You said that it was a useful lens to see human development, not why it is a useful lens to see human development and in what way. This:>And as people develop, you can see as they experience the world through different primary senses at different times.Is just meaningless. See what? That if a child doesn't learn to pee in a potty when he is young he will thereby develop bizarre fetishes?
>>24786264His problem was being Jewish. Otherwise all that cocaine would have helped him make a great pop album.
>>24786281Moderns focus on the conflict between the individual and the society. Ancients realized it was really all about the conflict between the higher and the lower.
>>24786264>desireYou Buddhist fags are so annoying
