No one on /tv/ has seen or wants to discuss Naked Lunch (1991), so I figured I’d come here to talk about the unfathomably based heroin-using homosexual wife-killer William S Burroughs. Junky was such a good read and all of his spoken word tracks especially the ones set to music are fantastic. I particularly love Dub Spencer and Trance Hill’s ‘In Dub’ ive also started listening to Allen Ginsberg and Jack Kerouac, who are also fantastic.
>>24810570Why isnt the drug he used to kick his heroin addiction more commonplace? He talks about it a lot in the appendix of naked lunch. It's called apomorphine
Please be trolling.
>>24810589Why
>>24810570Burroughs was based beyond belief. I've been reading through his letters recently and in a couple of them he's complaining about liberals and how Ginsberg needs to stop being a commie. I doubt you'll get a lot of discussion about Burroughs on /lit/ as he tends to make a lot of anons seethe. Personally, I have huge respect for Burroughs as an artist. Naked Lunch is a huge redpill. It's meant to be read as a manual on deprogramming oneself from external control. A pamphlet of psychic gurrellia warfare than a standard novel.
>>24810588It's more profitable to throw addicts into prison.
>>24810600Yeah it fucking ruled. I laughed my ass off when the Lesbian Witch Coven Leader turned out to also be the leader of the Gay Alien Syndicate and aso Dr Benway, basically creating the scenario where your doctor and dealer is just MK Ultra-ing everybody so he can farm your work and essential fluids for whatever sick purpose as he takes over parts of the world with his schizo queer army
>>24810592The beatnik and punk movement were most definitely psyops with no intellectual or artistic value.If these homos were alive today they would be endorsing XYZ candidate and vaccine just to keep their spot in the public view, they would sacrifice any ounce of authenticity in a heartbeat.That being said, junkie did have some good insights and the naked lunch movie is decent, somehow better than the book.
>>24810613>tell me you know nothing about Burroughs or early punk without telling me you know nothing about Burroughs or early punk
>>24810631>tell me X without telling me XGo back.
>>24810613So you’re clueless and don’t know what Burroughs was up to as he approached his death in 1997>>24810660You are literally a frogposter
>>24810570watched the movie and read the book. They're trippy. People on this board want 'philosophic' value. Whatever the fuck that means.& most people don't want to give the guy any sort of credit because he was "gay". I don't particularly care how he depicted his sexuality (even if he had to obviously hide it in plain sight). He does give a lense, a glimpse into that time period. & it's nice to know not everything was seen through hyper pastel, rainbow colored goggles back then. You're going to come into contact with a lot of intellectual dishonesty and different flavors of ignorance trying to discuss Burroughs.It's the type of gritty perspective that some aristocratic baby's desperately need, in order to not be seen as total spoiled freaks. Thread reminds me, I need to get through Opium-Eater.
>>24810660Sorry, didn't know I had to spell it out for you: Burroughs was a hardcord libertarian and racist. Just because he was gay doesn't mean he was a leftist. He opposed all the things liberals hold dear. Early punk i.e. punk before it got on MTV, was full of literal nazis. The reason the left has revised the history of punk so badly is because of cope. Things like muh punk is trans muh blacks invented punk are provably false. Just look at the Oi! movement, right-wing, angry working class men. This predates all the slopbands you think are representive of the genre. KYS.
>>24810729Not to mention how ridiculous and cultureless getting mad by guessing a man born in 1914 would be a liberal in 2025 is.
>>24810729And we’re talking about a guy who serial kills lesbians anyways. He can barely even mention a woman without calling her a lesbian and saying he wants to beat the shit out of them
>>24810740Liberals existed in the 20th century, anon....
>>24810752Anon was talking about the 2019 covid vaccine, not realizing he was talking about a person who wrote Dr Benway as a supervillain doctor who drugs the public under false pretenses into becoming his slaves, not to mention his discussion of Virus B-23, the President hoarding fountain of youth drugs in his bunker as the world destroys itself in medically-induced civil war, as well as the nuclear bomb as an american-made soul-killer that mutated the public
In fact I would firmly say that the idea of governments and officials who poison, mutate, brainwash, and kill the public by developing drugs and weapons with sinister and mass murderous ulterior motives, is one of William S Burroughs most main and prevalent themes. I'm pretty sure 100% of his government and medical characters meet this description to a T. The only doctors he vaguely treats as 'good people' are the ones who won't give him heroin, while also saying he hates them for that and wants to crack their skulls in occasionally. To suggest he would be pro-vaxx is insane, the man would be writing about how the government used a virus bomb to enclose the world in miniature coffin-bunkers with their brains hooked up to diodes or some shit
>>24810570Go read Cities of the Red Night and explain how Burroughs' revolutionary strategy best matches the problems of the post modern. DO NOT REFER TO AUSTIN TEXAS.
>>24810808Oh god I can't wait, I've got it right here, maybe I'll start. https://youtu.be/glGKaNxPSc4?si=3FhI81MI5OzITqp8This song and album have been my obsession lately
>>24810729>Early punk i.e. punk before it got on MTV, was full of literal nazis.No it wasn't, the swastikas were used only for shock value.
>>24810613>no intellectual or artistic value.Ridiculous. I don't think I've ever laughed at writing harder than Kerouac's description of becoming a Mexican cotton-picker.
Have we considered how much of Burrough's life quite literally predates Nazism? How about you look at the actual man and his work, even, instead of things he has not said or done, but that you associate with people and highly disconnected liquid movements that followed him?
>>24810832Oh man if you knew how good these Bacon and Eggs were you wouldn't be sitting there writing a post, oh man these Bacon and Eggs
>>24810837Those movements being liberal movements, he was never a beat(nik), he was beat, and it was something he and his friends made up.
>>24810772Unironically, I was obsessed with Naked Lunch just before Covid and I think it gave me the mental capacities to see through the medical tyranny that ensued.
>>24810600>he's complaining about liberals and how Ginsberg needs to stop being a commie.didn't know he was such a chuddie...he went to that Democrat manifestation along with Ginsberg and Genet though
>>24810613Wow so edgy. Counterculture is le psyop, we should be counter-counterculture ie normalfags but cynical, because that is for sure not a psyop.>Captcha: DAYUM lol
>>24810877Im pretty sure Burroughs writes about that exact phenomenon, no? I mean Naked Lunch is all about his infinitely culture-rejecting character being absorbed into a drug-induced military conspiracy, right?
>>24810888>I mean Naked Lunch is all about his infinitely culture-rejecting character being absorbed into a drug-induced military conspiracy, right?That's more about WWII.
His words and manner of writing increase my literacy
>>24810908I took it as more of a Cold War story based on his own post-War experiences, but even so he applies the theme of subversive indoctrination of counter-counter regardless of what war or era he's talking about. He was just writing it from a first person perspective as one of the very first modern 'punks' to live this phenomenon
>>24810872Probably to fanboy over Genet.
>>24810914Double subversion is a common theme arising from Queer, it seems to represent interior being as in conflict. CotRN indicates that the interior space is politicised for Burroughs: the nazi feminist scientists are inside him already.
>>24810570I kind of like Burroughs, but it's worth keeping in mind that he, like many of the type, came from a richfag background and that it was the main reason why he landed on his feet even while being quite the fuck-up.
>>24810943>nazi feminist scientistsGod damn I love how accurately phrases like 'Gay Alien Heroin Syndicate' and shit apply to Burrough's works. There's gotta be a word for it, somewhere between satire and accurate truth. I don't want to say it's just a political parody or that it's the truth itself, there's gotta be a word for thisMaybe its just Beat literature lol
>>24810985Yeah man that $150/mo ($3,471/mo per 2025!!!) American Arithmometer Company Trust from his grandpa Billy Burroughs sounds fucking insane. I do take his word for it though when he said his heroin expenses forced him into the workplace and into the world. He was pretty forthcoming about that in Junky
I don't think he killed his wife and abandoned his children in pursuit of being a dedicated writer, like the movie suggests, nor was Joan Vollmer sitting there lazily 'playing William Tell'. He probably was on heroin and had a lot of mexican gay sex and chose to knowingly do something evil because he was on heroin and in a gay sex craze.Actually, I haven't read all his works yet, but I bet Burroughs very much enjoyed the pun 'William Tell' as a homophone for 'William S Burroughs confessing to the murder of his wife'. Shit, maybe that's what he meant.
>>24811030I keep trying to get people to call me Johnny Rotten, but people keep calling me Freddy Fresh
>>24811039>t. Cunty Carl
>>24810570haven't seen the movie but i enjoyed the book a lot. i don't like him because of the faggotry; i like his writing. i like his anti-everything sthick. i like the drug stuff. i like the sociopolitical control stuff others anon have mentioned.>>24810806you get it, anon. any junkie, active or not, hates every doctor's guts and is filled with vitirolic monkey rage towards them.>>24810600based
>>24810827That's just bourgeois whitewashing, propagated by music journalists and other media faggots. They all jumped on the punk bandwagon because they wanted to be cool. They never remotely understood it.In the 1970s my home town was full of literal neo-Nazi skinheads, and they all listened to punk.
>>24811106other anons*killing myself btw
>literal male prostitute despite coming from money>shot and killed his wife at a party and got away with it>a great mind and talent wasted slurping up semen and ordure at every opportunity>oh but he rite good!all of his admirers should kill themselves.
>>24811125Well you just can't get that perspective from anyone else, really. I essentially believe he's evil, and I'm a big fan of his evil artifacts
>>24811130okay, let's shift that around a little.>oh jeffrey dahmer? yeah he was something special>you just can't get that perspective from anyone else, a head in the fridge? lynchian!it would be better that the evil simply didn't exist. evil needs fewer spokesmen, not more.
>>24811132Yeah I would read Jeffrey Dahmer's book if he had this incredible literary skill like Burroughs has, but I'm morbid like that. 'If William S Burroughs didn't exist' question is a good one though, though I like the literature we not only have to consider the direct murders this most likely serial killer has committed, but even according to his own cosmology it seems he has in fact created and spread a volatile enemy mind virus perhaps far worse than any of the subjects which he accuses have. Of all things I feel most personally bad for his son, drunken to death at 33 on so many factors related to being his father's son
>>24811145waste like you should be consigned to the midden with the rest of the refuse.
>>24811155Actually it might please you to know I do live in the American Midwest and I do in fact stack boxes for a living at a warehouse. Pretty dung-like. So there it is
>>24811174that you think hard work is the sort of debasement you deserve shows how far from the light you've strayed. what you furnish your mind with (the dreck of maniacs and killers) becomes you, dolt.
He was obviously a degenerate faggot but I love this reading, everything is perfect including the hollers of the braindead sycophants in the background. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njD-3OgB-vQ
>>24811180Alright I hear you
>>24811204>He was obviously a degenerate faggotthat's exactly what makes him so great
>>24811220That guy is totally psy opped with dumb performative 4chan rhetoric. I'm on your side with this. Burroughs fascinated me but I was too immature for naked lunch and got lost and it went over my head
>>24811271He became that because like the silly american in the story he invoked ancient spirits he couldn't control to "employ them". Unlocking vaults sealed by Constantine, releasing creatures that have been locked up for 1500 years to parade them around as novelties for the consumer masses.Why did Constantine lock them up in the first place?
>>24810600He's the one real Celine inheritor out of the Beats, stylistically and otherwise.>>24810605lmao, you got to see picrel
>>24811180Just put the fries in the bag.
>>24811371kill yourself, faggot.
>>24810613the beat movement was supposed to be nothing more than Kerouac's inner circle of literary friends and hustlers that he met in all his exploits across America only to evolve into a political movement prefiguring the hippies. The Beatniks were never intended to have a political message let alone an enforced ideology and it was for that reason Kerouac later disowned the movement.
>>24811030>sluuuurpkeep eating it up pal
Is this the homo that fulfilled the boomer fantasy of killing his bitch wife?
>>24810570the spoken word pieces set to music are garbage. I'm usually "Stop saying 'yo', nigger, I'm trying to hear him speak." the rappers were trying to pick up on his fame.
>>24811550What rappers?
>>24810570>all of his spoken word tracks especially the ones set to music are fantastic.So is there an album? Where can I hear it?
>>24811928There's tons, In Dub, Spare Ass Annie and Other Tales, and way more I'm always finding, all the way back from when he was alive even.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChKoQX5Aogw&list=PLyibAt8clDqhZClIqd6XToqDDuPOKUz1Chttps://youtu.be/BbbgizIdbCE?si=EGGE0W8I4V-zrEQchttps://youtu.be/z4BDbOE2RDQ?si=e7FzWN_fyi_3BphBAnd Sopranos fans already knowhttps://youtu.be/SQc3T45pRWY?si=yJEJ7W_amwrtJXtm
>>24811952Keep in mind by the way those first two links are playlists for entire albums, I can't recommend both of them enough
>>24811952>>24811964Wow, thanks. I'll listen to it asap
>>24811976I guess the Spare Ass Annie link didn't work the way I wanted, you can just youtube search 'Spare Ass Annie Burroughs' and you'll find the playlist. It's also all on Spotify
>>24811125if rimbaud is good enough then why isn't this guy? Is he not twink enough for you?
>>24811018It was the Ugly Spirit. He started writing in an attempt to purge it from himself. He was a writer of Freedom, foremost. Absolutely American in all it's hypocrisy and ugliness. He predicted the surveillence police state and wrote about power and control in a simple illustrative way, in contrast to the European pomos with their textual mumbo jumbo and stuffy academics.
>>24810631I like Burroughs but the anon is right using this "tell me you" meme is incredibly gay and I've only ever seen irritating women on Instagram using this.
>>24810570Hey, that's DEATH from the hit tv show SUPERNATURAL.
>>24812798But the post youre quoting was using it well and as part of a good argument
>>24810729Woah why are you so mad buddy I didn't read your faggot post but I saw you said kys at the end and you said "literal Nazis" first off Hitler was righteous in all his actions and the holocaust never happened so what the fuck is wrong with being a Nazi? You don't know shit dude stop seething cause you're probably Norwood reaper'd
I affirm Gay Nazism
>>24813136If you read his post, he never said anything negative about Nazis and actually blamed liberalism for a disinformation campaign against Nazi Punks
Of course there were/are Nazi punks, the song is called ‘Nazi Punks Fuck Off’ after all
>>24811132>>you just can't get that perspective from anyone else, a head in the fridge? lynchian!Quite
>>24813589watch the charlie rose interview of DFW.
>>24810995It's more than that, in the words of Jarvis "If you called your dad he could stop it all, yeah"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6kHN92Yv48A Junky's Christmas, claymation directed by Francis Ford Coppola
>>24813623That's true lol
>muh monotone junky faggotdoes /lit/ really?
>>24810570At least three bands were named after Burroughs:>Soft Machine>Steely Dan>Thin White RopeNot to mention all the other ones he influenced either musically or lyrically.
>>24810570How does anyone even take William seriously? He was more of a mystic than an author, and he'd regularly make sentences out of gibberish articles he'd arbitrarily cutout and paste together.Actual joke
>>24810729Punk was invented by arty farty New York hipsters, anyone who says otherwise is lying out of their fucking ass. And no, insert-earlier-hard-rock-band-here is not an example of punk.
>>24810570Truly the greatest science fiction writer of all time in how he predicted the modern porno sewer world. The prehensile anus is the ultimate symbol of modernity
>>24815061he didn't predict shit
>>24814500https://genius.com/William-s-burroughs-dr-benway-operates-annotated
>>24814865>Punk was invented by arty farty New York hipstersFunny you say that seeing as punk originated in Britain.
Thinking of giving Junky a go soon. It's a nice, tight lil volume. Just my kind of book.
>>24815348It goes down so smooth, while also being jarring hilarious and disgusting. His concise writing is incredible
That's a cool ass fucking suit. I hate how thin they are nowadays.
>>24815348Junky is by far his best work, a shame he wasted his talent making abstract book art cut up method shit that was jibberish for freshman lava lamp enthusiasts.
>>24815570And yet his spoken word music in The Sopranos is KINO
I remember I tried to read this book years ago, but I found it a bit boring and a faggot who were phony with me liked Burroughs, so I had two reasons to be a hater. I didn't remember there was a movie by Cronenberg as well, so I got interested again. Should I give it a second chance?
>>24815573kekhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIfdKH4Tq-g&list=RDtIfdKH4Tq-g&start_radio=1
>>24811018I've read both biographies about Burroughs, and the incident seems to be an alcoholic fuck up. Both biographies imply that the Mexican stay was fueled by too much alcohol consumption by both parties due to attempts at drug abstinence. Joan ditched amphetamines; Burroughs, unsuccessfully, heroin. Periods of sobriety actually featured fall into alcoholism by both parties. All sources agree that it was a drunk prank gone out of hand, and that maybe Joan goaded Burroughs and Burroughs accepted because he was a good shooter and he was proud of being a good shooter ("Let's show our William Tell trick", which implied it wasn't a one off exceptional act). Simple alcohol intoxication explains everything. Here, in Estonia, it isn't considered newsworthy if an alcoholic shots or kills his wife while drunk. Business as usual.
>>24815687>if an alcoholic shots or kills his wife while drunkThese were almost the only murders in Iceland until very recently. They happened around once every 2 years. Now there are multiple stabbings a year, mostly immigrants.
>>24815343Girls inventend punk rock not England
>>24815570lol filtered
>>24815588>'top soul and first to leave at the moment of death is Ren, the secret name - this corresponds to my director, he directs the film of your life from conception to death. When you die, that's when Ren came in'>Tony dies and the first name that comes in is his Director - David Chase
Who else besides Allen Jack and Bill should i look into? Hunter S Thompson reading Kentucky Derby was kino
>>24816826Corso, Ferlinghetti, Snyder, Lamantia
>>24815570I read Cities of the Red Night first, after reading Lou Stathis' review in Heavy Metal magazine. it's kind of a full on intro to his style and interests.
>>24818038Did you like it?
>>24818844it took a while, but I appreciate what he was trying to do.
>>24815711mostly?
>>24810613100%. Beats were CIA and punk was manufactured like the Beats.
>>24819218He makes a loooooot of references to being offered jobs at the CIA and being in the CIA. He frames it as 'he went rogue and wised up the marks', in The Soft Machine, he characterizes himself as Uranian WIlly, a shapeshifting time-traveling CIA agent
>>24819211The locals get dragged into it. Even small girls start stabbing.
Anyone read The Soft Machine? I hear its main story is about a shapeshifting CIA agent who time travels back to the Mayan Empire and manipulates the Mayan Priests’ calendar-based mind control over the slaves to destroy the empire
>>24819317He was allowed to disclose some stuff
>>24810570This guy glows, and so do you OP. Fuck boomers, and fuck the beats.
>>24813146Jewish tranny psy-op.
>>24811271Stick your head in a fucking sewer hole if you want "greatness"
>>24810570Lemuria's strongest soldier
If Burroughs was CIA, what was the plan? Doesn't the Cold War CIA want American loyalty and service to the state against socialism?Or are they fomenting rebellion to justify greater control?
>>24822665He wasn't, it's all dumb accusations from commie retards upset that people are more interested in the Beats than in their failed ideological "art" and revolution
>>24822694I figured 'smash the control machine' would be good enough for most anti-authoritarians
>>24810613Kerouac become a religious reactionary and Burroughs was vocally critical of the cult of science, that is actually his major theme—one might even argue that heroin in his writing functions as a symbol of the total subordination of man to science instead of science to man
>>24822694Not a single person gives a shit about the beats anymore, cope.
>>24822665>If Burroughs was CIA, what was the plan?>how does promoting nihilistic hedonism through social engineering aid the CIA's goalstis a mystery
>>24810588Methadone already existed and was being used to treat addicts in the 60's
>>24810600>Naked LunchI can think of two things wrong with that title.
>>24810570if you watch tv for 10 minutes and flip channels you get a naked lunch esque pastiche/collage, no need to read any of the books when you can get the jist of it and be way less of an insufferable "look how cool I am" tryhard. a lot of you wanna be counter-culture so bad it's so pathetic
>>24823638t. a pseud who got filtered by Burrough’s genius
>>24815711>These were almost the only murders in Iceland until very recentlyDoesn't even know the history of Iceland and their tradition of murdering great poets like Snorri Sturluson. Snorri must have had his own ideas about the king's position and the validity of his orders, but at any rate he chose to disobey them; his words according to the Sturlunga saga, út vil ek (literally 'out want I', but idiomatically 'I will go home'), have become proverbial in Icelandic.[13][14] He returned to Iceland in 1239.[12] The king was distracted by the necessity to confront Skúli, who declared himself king in 1239. Skúli was defeated militarily and killed in 1240. Meanwhile, Snorri resumed his chieftainship and made a bid to crush Gissur by prosecuting him in court for the deaths of his brother Sighvatr and nephew Sturla. After the jarl's defeat, Haakon sent two agents to Gissur bearing a secret letter with orders to kill or capture Snorri. Gissur was being invited now to join the unionist movement. A meeting at the Althing was arranged for the summer of 1241 but Gissur and Kolbein arrived with several hundred men. Snorri and 120 men formed around a church. Gissur chose to pay fines rather than to attack.Hallveig died of natural causes. When the family bickered over the inheritance, Hallveig's sons, Klaeing and Orm, asked assistance from their uncle Gissur. Holding a meeting with them and Kolbein the Younger, Gissur brought out the letter. Orm refused. Shortly after, Snorri received a letter in cipher runes warning him of the plot, but he could not understand them.[15]Afterwards Gissur led seventy men on a daring raid to his house, achieving complete surprise. Snorri Sturluson was assassinated in his house at Reykholt in autumn of 1241. It is not clear that he was given the option of surrender. He fled to the cellar. There, Símon knútur asked Árni the Bitter to strike him. Then Snorri said: Eigi skal hǫggva! – "Do not strike!" Símon answered: Hǫgg þú! — "You strike now!" Snorri replied: Eigi skal hǫggva! – "Do not strike!" and these were his last words.[16][17]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snorri_Sturluson#The_end_of_Snorri_and_the_Commonwealth
>>24822715This guy gets it but replace 'science' with consumerism. Junk being the product the person is sold to rather than the object sold to them. The subject is degraded to a point in which he has no choice but to consume the product. You don't manafacture a robost expensive everlasting gadget. You stupidify the person and seduce him and he doesn't know any better. It's his 'choice' but not. Cheaper, apparently. >But who am I to be critical?
>>24810570Burroughs and Ginsberg article about exorcisms:https://www.sensitiveskinmagazine.com/william-s-burroughs-interview/>You would never see it. In exorcism, a verbal argument can never do anything. You can’t ever beat the entity in a verbal argument because that’s what he wants. It’s only through a confront, a non-verbal confront, that anything happens. It has to be non-verbal. Otherwise, they’d argue and argue going around and around and around for a hundred thousand years. But the arguing has nothing whatever to do with what they’re really doing.
>>24823710>heh, you don't even know that a murder happened there a thousand fucking years agoWhy would you assume I don't, retard? Snorri was killed in the biggest civil war in Icelandic history where he was one of the largest players, consolidating power, originally in the name of the king of Norway but when he refused his orders he became a threat as a possible king of Iceland.Snorri and king Hákon had access to esoteric ancient Greek books and knowledge associated with orders of knights like the Templars. Snorri consolidated power using armoured "eastern knights" instead of locals. The order was destroyed for being too powerful 70 years later.
>>24822715Kerouac was always fairly conservative if you read the whole Duluoz cycle. He found the 50's stifling and chased after the remnants of old America as they were being snuffed out. He was, after all, a working class kid from a mill town
>nobody posted ithttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eTSL2kopP4
>>24810570>>24810570The stuff about him making contact with entities from other dimensions is really weird desu
>>24810613Trvke
The Soft Machine is kino
>>24810570>I particularly love Dub Spencer and Trance Hill’s ‘In Dub’ ivHell yeah, that’s a great album.
>>24825971The cut-up parts ruin it, same with Nova Express. Good thing WSB got tired of that pseud shit in the 70s.
he is a satantic idiot in hellall writings of this type should be commited to flames
>>24810570burroughs' best writing is always between the lineshttps://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MPHyR92MQic
>>24826738shut the fuck up you christranny retard
>>24826583My brother
>>24826594>Good thing WSB got tired of that pseud shit in the 70s.I'm glad as well. Been reading Cities of the Red Night and really enjoying it. The only worthwhile cut-up novel is Naked Lunch and even then I'm dubious to the claims over how much of it was actually cut-up.
>>24810570junky is just poverty porn for boring squares who never led an underground lifestyle before. it's nothing special. the rest is schizo garbage. overrated af
