So I finally got around to reading this book and I must say, it's a pretty good apolitical introduction to the history of migration. I came out believing the same thing I did coming in, that we humans are a nomadic species and migration is a fact of life. The right to roam shall not be infringed, chuds.
>>24850210I'd say countries should be allowed to close their borders to foreigners, but being allowed to leave any country should be treated as a fundamental right.
>>24850235Like he said, we are nomadic and "countries" are artificial abominations created to control a peasantry. But the current immigration crises in the West world is a plot to rile up rightwing fervor, to get us to have a "civil war" instead of a revolutionary war against them. In the aftermath the rightwing/control-wing will clamp down on all these rights of the former age. Those left alive will be too war weary and autistic to resist and the media will write the history and claim the nation simply wanted all this. CIA/mossad/FreeMasons plan.
>>24850210You're half right. Humans aren't a nomadic species in general, but becoming nomadic is our natural response to hard times. When the crops fail or an earthquake hits the obvious thing to do is to take the best and hardiest of your group and leave for pastures new. When life is easy, there's no reason to abandon your homes and your fields and any of your friends and family too weak to make the trek.
>>24850210>migration is a fact of lifeIt is, but it's also sometimes associated with civilizational collapse. In Why The West Rules For Now by Ian Morris, migration is one of the four horsemen of the apocalypse.
>>24850427and what do u suppose happened if u "immigrated" into the land of some other stateless group? do you suppose the remote south east asian communities scott writes about in that book would welcome random migrants showing up and just living among them? if there's no state there's no police or immigration courts to protect you. leftists forget that the police and "juridical systems" exist to stop people from enforcing their own community rules with as much violence or little due process as they see fit.
>>24850453In general, people are welcoming of immigrants when they come in small numbers. You can safely immigrate anywhere in SEA.A takeover is a completely different thing, though.
>>24850427The problem is that I don't see any way to escape from organization around monopolies on violence. So, in my opinion, states/countries are here to stay and so are borders.
>>24850547leftism is fucking dumb is what it is. "100,000 years ago people lived in stateless tribes therefore all of recorded history is actually the result of a conspiracy and can be reversed!" get fucking real how do academics get away with publishing utter trash.
>>24850210>is ought fallacy in the OPGives women the ick
>>24850453They did indeed. >ProtectJust don't be dicks, bro. The police exist to aid the powerful and keep you in your place. Not to protect you, but to protect their property claims. If you're from the US, the 2nd Amendment forbids their existence btw.>>24850547>I don't see how the 2nd Amendment could possibly protect us from thugs seizing a nationstateThe solution was found. You don't found a state, and you put down any thug who tries. It takes strength of character and vigilance.>>24850581"Rightism" is the ultimate dumb when they expect that cages are ideal ways to live. Fucking lazy asses.
>>24850637>You don't found a stateA bit too late for that.>and you put down any thug who triesWhat if I'm not able to do that by myself? Would you say that I should then try to organize with somebody else around fighting those thugs, even using violent means if necessary?
>>24850708They rely on us to support them. Since we clearly hate them, all it would take is to organize the alternative and take action. It isn't "late", it's just an act of bravery needed on a mass scale. Including convincing a lot of the military etc. to join>if I'm not able to do that by myself?This is the primary reason they have instilled extreme individualism in society. We need to find common cause in the collective. (Not to be confuse with conformist traits) >ViolenceOf course. If your words can't convince everyone towards a peaceful solution, they require violence. Sadly.
>>24850437>Humans aren't a nomadic species in generalConsidering humans evolved as nomads I'd say we are.
>>24850744You've missed what I was implying. Ii'm trying to say that resistance to the formation of any state would have to utilize organized violence. And at that point I'd say that you've already created a state yourself, even if its power is limited.Basically, you can't escape the state, only change its form to something more tolerable.
>>24850210we're territorial as well, torturing and killing trespassers is in our nature therefore good
>>24850892No. This has always been an insipid conclusion.
>>24850901Territorial is one thing, the rest isn't true
>>24850911it is, humans torture and kill each other all the time therefore good
>>24850926>Human do dis tingI know what humans do. I know why they do it, and I know why they wouldn't. The human mind is incredibly malleable and we can choose to live how we want. Have you ever heard of MKultra, anon? We're acting like this because we're being directed to.
>>24850906why?
>>24850892Stateless societies can exist and wield organized violence. It basically works like a scaled up version of organized crime, with a huge elaborate web of social networks calling the population to arms one friend and brother at a time as each person who is called on to go to war in turn calls upon the men around him to join him. Rich, important men will also have a lot of guys in debt to them and can force them to join him in war in lieu of other payment. The issue is that a system built on interpersonal relationships breaks down if it scales up beyond a certain point, or if a charismatic chieftain dies and leaves a gaping hole in the network. And even when it works it is better suited for sporadic raiding than for total war between massive armies. States inevitably triumph over these systems in the long run because states have much more staying power thanks to their permanent impersonal institutions. People eventually come to prefer states in peacetime as well because those same impersonal institutions are less arbitrary on average than the tribal elders and chieftains who end up interpreting and enforcing the laws in the absence of a state. See also "Rule of the Clan" by Mark Weiner.
>>24850427Go to Dearborn, Michigan faggot
Yeah, go roam into someone's house right now, chud.
>humans are a nomadic species and migration is a fact of lifeSo colonisation was okay, right?
>>24851074>Victim of capitalist planned collapse to break the mild unionismNot a good example. What where you trying to say here, fudge-packer? >>24851191That's migration of a state-capitalist entity looking to plunder. At some points the migrating workers did rebel, famously in the American revolution, but other such colonializations were just for plundering, the enrichment of the "mother country". The inclination of those who go out to these colonies are to GET AWAY form that "mother country".Like those folks that hid in the swamps of the deep south or the Appalachians, and later the westward push of the pioneers. They were trying to get away from the urban sprawl and govt taxations, the filth of the cities in some cases. Is it "Okay"? It is a natural thing. It is sad for the native Americans, but it's more human nature than this bullshit about us being default evil brutes who need cops and lawmakers and rulers of whatever kind.
