Virgilian editon>τὸ πρότερον νῆμα·>>24837194>Μέγα τὸ Ἑλληνιστί/Ῥωμαϊστί·https://mega dot nz/folder/FHdXFZ4A#mWgaKv4SeG-2Rx7iMZ6EKw>Mέγα τὸ ANE·https://mega dot nz/folder/YfsmFRxA#pz58Q6aTDkwn9Ot6G68NRg>Work in progress FAQhttps://rentry dot co/n8nrkoAll Classical languages are welcome.
Question for this thread: What are the most interesting texts written by women in the language you're studying?
>>24877875I just know few lines of Sappho by heart.That's all folks.
>>24877875divination records of Fu Hao 妇好 from the Shang dynastyAll writing of Wu Zetian 武则天 the only female empress of China from the Tang dynastyThe poetry and literary criticism of Li Qingzhao 李清照 from the Song dynasty
>>24877675This is very true. They have their own trade-offs. For my part I kind of just did what I was told and worked through my first two textbooks (wheelock and FR) but now I basically have alternate bursts of either grammar study or at-level reading.The debate is less what to learn, and more in what order and proportion to do it.
German is more precise than Latin in this particular case, and apparently Bulgarian is even more precise because it has three forms where German has two.
>>24877858Here is a short documentary film on Hippocrates and Greek medicine I thought some of you might enjoy. GER Lloyd from this video is the translator of Greek for Hippocrates in the Penguin classics edition https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=u1RHCarlm5c&pp=ygUuSGVhbHRoIGFuZCBIZWFsaW5nIGluIEFuY2llbnQgR3JlZWNlIGFuZCBDaGluYQ%3D%3D
>>24877858At about 51 seconds in to this video can any Anons make out the names of the titles of the Classical Chinese medical texts on the bookshelf?https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=u1RHCarlm5c&pp=ygUuSGVhbHRoIGFuZCBIZWFsaW5nIGluIEFuY2llbnQgR3JlZWNlIGFuZCBDaGluYQ%3D%3D
>>24878229The guy you see in the first few seconds, I saw his face somewhere earlier today, felt like a déjà vu seeing it now.>GER LloydHuh? Garloid? I don't know what you're talking about but apparently you shouldn't feed it tapwater.
>>24878156Would’ve been nice if the Germans chose low German for the national form of the language because then I could read it. Extra forms doesn’t necessarily result in more precision though, since it all depends on how it fits within a sentence. But I don’t really doubt your claim.And yes, reading especially the gospels and genesis/exodus is the earliest and easiest Latin you can really get into. That poster seems unaware (because he’s attacking a strawman) that Latin by the Natural Method recommends that students begin reading it as early as the 11th week of study.
>>24878354>Extra forms doesn’t necessarily result in more precision though, since it all depends on how it fits within a sentence.What? I posted English next to it to show that in English it's ambiguous and in German it's not, because of its vs seiner/ihrer.
>>24878251He wrote some of the translations in this volume (pic related). In particular he translated “The Canon of Medicine.” It contains some minor errors relying too much on literalism in some areas. A scathing insult/ quip against Socrates (“dubious things above and below the earth”) is rendered as actual references to geometry and astronomy- fields which aren’t at all dubious in any way, rendering the critique of other fields of science incomplete.
>>24878389>German is more precise than Latin in this particular caseCan you see how posting this with an image of English and German text is confusing?
>>24878519The German equivalent of "its" is picrel. Possessive adjectives in 3rd person singular. The stem inflects for gender of the possessor noun (antecedent), "sein-" for masculine and neuter, "ihr-" for feminine, that's the red square at the top. (it also inflects for number, but we're excluding plural here) Then the suffix inflects for number, gender and case of the possessed noun (head noun), that's the bottom red square. That's 12 different words for "its" in German:seinseineseinenseinemseinerseinesihrihreihrenihremihrerihresIn my example >>24878156 it's the two stems that are relevant though:sein-ihr-The 6 different forms of these agree with the possessed noun (head noun)/show which word is the possessed noun (head noun), in this case "Einfachkeit", but since the possessed noun (head noun) comes right after a possessive adjective it's rather redundant. The inflection of the stem however is more valuable, because it disambiguates whether the possessor noun (antecedent) is masculine/neuter or feminine. In the English text it's ambiguous if the possessor noun (antecedent) of "its" is "the grammar textbook pill" or "the NT". But in German it's unambiguous because "die Grammatikpille" is feminine and "des Neuen Testaments" is neuter (nominative: das Neue Testement, genitive: des Neuen Testaments) so you write "ihrer" if you mean to refer to "die Grammatikpille" and "seiner" if you mean to refer to "des Neuen Testaments". Latin, like English, has only one word for this, "eius". Latin generally has richer and more precise grammar than German, but this is an exception.
>>24878747That's fucking retarded
>>24878762what's retarded?
>>24878764Because it is an absurd level of complexity for little to no payoff in grammar. Good writing will not leave the meaning off two words ambiguous. My point was that there is more to precision than just having extra word forms, such as word orders.What you're actually saying is that German can be precise in certain word orders that would be imprecise in English, but that English writers ought to avoid because in our language it would be imprecise. Otherwise the difference in precision is marginal. What, you can tell what gender a word is? Big whoop. At least in Latin, where word order is highly flexible, such things are valuable. Japanese is often remarkably imprecise, but there are certain word orders that would be unintelligible in English/German that are usable for precise statements in Japanese. My point is that it's a ridiculous metric that equates the convoluted with the useful.People mess up proper syntax all the time in casual environments like 4chan, and I am sure they do the same with convoluted gender rules.Too much complexity harms utility. Since Hochdeutsch was chosen mere centuries ago, and since the Prussians had the opportunity to choose far more analytic and less inflected dialects, its status as "German" offends me.
>>24878783Very weak arguments.The only way English can disambiguate in a text like my example is by restating the antecedent, and the whole purpose of pronouns and possessive adjectives is to not have to restate the antecedent, which can be very long sometimes. English frequently works around this by using acronyms. So in my example the poster would have to replace "its simplicity" with "the simplicity of the grammar textbook method"/"the simplicity of the NT", or write "Take the grammar textbook pill (TGTP)" and then instead of "its simplicity" write "TGTP's simplicity" if that was the antecedent. People who write in English very often don't think the extra step and try to imagine how a text reads to the reader, they as writer know what is put into "its" and "it", but the reader doesn't, this is a cognitive bias known as the curse of knowledge, German has a built-in protection against it.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curse_of_knowledgeThere's a place for simple languages, and there's a place for complex languages. That's why pidgins were created for example. You are free to use simple languages.https://youtu.be/zRlnVhdw7y4https://youtu.be/qqJI7SdS9Gg
>>24878843>the whole purpose of pronouns and possessive adjectives The arrogance of Germans and wehraboos. Did you knock down Babel and create separate languages? Am I speaking with God?It insists on itself. Same with the attitude of the French and Italians to a lesser degree, but Germans are easily the most arrogant about their super special complex grammar.Every German-English translation I’ve read does shit like >“Taunhaus” (this word can’t be translated but it means something like house in a town)Instead of just putting “townhouse” like Germans invented the idea of compound words.And every non-German who says “the original German just can’t be translated because it’s too precise” that I have met IRL is a wannabe reactionary LARPer who isn’t actually involved in politics or institution-building who thinks that they’re the only nigger on Earth to understand Hegel because they can sorta-read German.
>>24878843>There's a place for simple languages, and there's a place for complex languages. That's why pidgins were created for example. You are free to use simple languages.This section is especially ironic since standardized german is an artificial literary middle ground of high german dialects. I speak the language of my forefathers as it evolved through common practice over the past millennium. You speak something that is a product of the unholy machinations of 19th century grammarians. Except you still had to learn the language of my forefathers, because my forefathers crushed Germany twice. Bit sad isn’t it?
Interesting Latin works for a beginner to read? I don't like poems and theology, and would prefer a collection of short stories.
>>24878927Familia Romana, and the other books in the series, most of which are in these two links:https://archive.org/details/lingualatinalatinbookshttps://archive.org/details/lingua-latina-per-se-illustrata_202506descriptions of the books are here:https://hackettpublishing.com/lingua-latina-per-se-illustrata-series
>>24878927If you've just started learning then Colloquia Personarum is probably the only one you'll be able to read of those, apart from Familia Romana. It's meant to be read alongside Familia Romana, I think the chapters correspond to the chapters in Familia Romana.https://archive.org/details/lingua-latina-per-se-illustrata_202506/Lingua%20Lat%C4%ABna%20per%20s%C4%93%20ill%C5%ABstr%C4%81ta/Pars%20I/Suppl%C4%93menta/%C3%98rberg%2C%20Colloquia%20pers%C5%8Dn%C4%81rum/page/n7/mode/2upOtherwise you have interlinears.https://archive.org/details/caesarscommentar07caes
>>24878927Well the gospels and genesis/exodus are just narratives. Unless that counts as “theology” for you because the religion they pertain to still exists. They’re the easiest latin texts to read and have a lot of translations for obvious reasons.
>>24878927Look up the r*ddit Latin reading list. Also Legentibus has a lot of beginner short stories for free.
whats the easiest ancient greek work to read after logos and athenaze if the anabasis filtered me?
>>24879457Have you tried an interlinear version of it?https://archive.org/details/anabasisofxenoph00xenoiala
>>24878893>>24878897That's a lot of adhominems. Study logic. As a matter of fact I'm just a beginner at German. Not that it matters one bit for the subject.
>>24878232The books are the 文渊阁四库全书, more commonly just known as the 四库全书It's a Qing dynasty encyclopedia/collection of books. In total over 10,000 books. The ones on screen are from the histories section (史部)for example I can see 405 which is the second part of the 尚史, a collection of biographies of ancient figures until the Qin dynasty.I expect the video makers just searched up "Chinese books stock footage" and used that lmao
>>24878927Isodorus, something for everyone in thereNepos
Doing a close reading of a section of poetry and then committing those lines to memory feels more effective and enjoyable for building vocabulary than drilling words through flashcards.
>>24878843...unless of course the two possible antecedents happen to be of the same gender.
>>24879104Aren't they in somewhat awkward Latin because they're fairly literally translated from Hebrew?
>>24879920kinda yes, Jerome sort of tries to stay in the middle, not stray too far from a literal interpretationthe gospels were in Koine Greek though so the Latin translation doesn't need to to do cartwheels for literalism
>>24879975Isn't Greek in literal Latin still liable to be vaguely awkward even if not outright bizarre?
>>24880038I mean sure, certain expressions might come off as a bit weird sounding by the classical ear, e.g from a quick look in Matthew>cum esset desponsata mater ejus Maria Joseph, antequam convenirent inventa est in utero habens de Spiritu Sancto.>in utero habens de Spiritu Sanctothis takes the Greek quite literally «ἐν γαστρὶ ἔχουσα ἐκ πνεύματος ἁγίου» while maybe in classical one would expect an expression like idk "gravida (ex) Spiritu Sancto", or, as in Sebastian Castellio's classical rendition of the bible, the whole expression is translated as "comperta est uterum ferre ex Spiritu Sancto"but still, for the most the Latin is beginner friendly without being "bad"
>>24879915Yes, but then at least you have the option to replace one of them with a synonym of another gender, an option you don't have in English and Latin. Bulgarian has three forms, not two. Having two forms is infinitely better than one.
>>24879623Oh, that is sad. I finished the Hippocratic corpus of Greece as well as Galen's Natural Faculties so I was wondering if there were Chinese medical texts from that era I could also read.
>>24879874Agreed. memorizing passages also helped me with reading in Latin word order and not translating in my head. Good practice all around
>>24880324Well said. I would go even further and say, given that two forms are better than one, three better than two, four better than three, and so on, that having a form corresponding to each individual word is better than having a form correspond to multiple words. In an ideally precise language, the pronoun and the antecedent would be one and the same.
>>24879578Pretentious Nigger.
>>24879920>>24880038By and large, no. It’s fine. You aren’t literate at all in Latin so the narrow expressions that are “weird” from Greek and Hebrew don’t really matter, and unless you want to really get into biblical exegesis it’s not ever going to be relevant for you. Terms like “awkward” are entirely subjective anyways and I have never seen it brought up seriously but more as a way to dismiss Late Latin in general out of hand.At the end of the day, it’s the easiest extensive authentic Latin for getting you reading.
>>24880077Yeah but that’s ultimately a matter of style and not of basic grammatical correctness, as is the case for basically all Bibles, and its influence on all following Latin can’t be understated.Many people might find more literal English bibles unusual in their wording but that doesn’t mean it’s “bad” English.At the end of the day, it uses the same most-common 2000 or so words that are absolutely necessary to read, and gives beginners lots of practice reading them. Sight reading the Bible will not harm your ability to read classical texts whatsoever, and it is the best way to read everything from the next 1000 years of written Latin (or even just native Late Latin which spans [roughly] 200-600.
>>24879578>I'm just a beginner at German.It is an ad hominem, but is it a bad argument if I guess correctly and it goes to my criticism of your faggy tone?
>>24878843>There's a place for simple languages [English], and there's a place for complex languages [German]. That's why pidgins were created for example [equivocating English to a pidgin]. You are free to use simple languages [English].And all from some wannabe chud who can’t even actually read German. You use a “simple language.” You cannot read your beloved “complex” language. You are bragging about the thing you study instead of actually studying it because it’s more about having an apparent intellectual stick to swing around than actual intellectualism.
>>24880601cottidie je mange les larmes de votre stupidité
>>24880663你这个天才,用谷歌翻译做的吗?
>>24880663J’ai aussi etudie le Francais a l’ecole, mais mon Francais est merde.Frankly, I dislike French for output because I find English to be substantially more precise. It definitely looks beautiful in writing/reading. Curious that you resorted to the next-most pretentious artificial tongue of continental faux-intellectualism.
Translation challenge:EasyLead him to me.The ship arrived safely.There are no pacts between lions and men.MediumEach of them was granted twice as many [acres equivalent of choice] of land than what was promised.By whispering through the leaves, [Pan equivalent of choice] let those who paid attention reach safety.If they hadn't attempted to secretly kill the senate, then maybe they would't have to be on the run.HardAfter the catastrophic storm which shattered the enemy's main port together with a large part of their navy, rumors have been circulating that the senate's most staunchly appeasive faction is reconsidering their cautious stance and may approve a preemptive naval assault while the main army deals with the land forces.
>>24880663Also, isn’t cottidie not even a French word. It’s “quotidien” right? I remember that much from my one year of French a decade ago.
>>24880706>>24880741Je m'en merde>>24880780;)
>>24880781j'ai gagne. Merci beaucoup mon ami.
>>24880781Switching into French without an elementary knowledge and assuming I wouldn’t know it was unbelievably ballsy desu. I respect that a lot just for the boldness of the maneuver. Icarus flew too close to the sun.
>>24880800and yet before the sun melted the wax upon his wings, he touched the clouds. CHKD
High average IQ in here
>>24880401There are lots of medical texts, I can find some if you're interested. But mostly they are diverse interpretations of regional customs rather than unified theories of medicine.
>>24878927Look at the readers on this page.https://www.fabulaefaciles.com/library/booksYou can get scans of the original books for most of these on Archive.org or Google Books. Depending on your level, I like Ritchie's "Fabulae Faciles." If that's too hard, I also liked "Julia," which contains stories from mythology/history. If I remember correctly, it avoids the subjunctive.I remember reading this collection of Latin fairy tales a long time ago. It's definitely easier than Fabulae Divales (by Avellanus) or Fabulae Gallicae (https://www.amazon.com/Fabulae-Gallicae-Peralto-Scriptae-Perraults/dp/9198509470).https://www.amazon.com/Fairy-Tales-Latin-Fabulae-Mirabiles/dp/0781813417
>>24879502thanks, extremely underrated postwhy are there more latinfags than greek patricians on /clg/?
>>24881792>a greek patrician>the anabasis filtered mekek
>>24881792>greek>patrician
>>24881859shut your filthy latin whore mouth, I’m greek respect your elders
I'm at chapter 10 of Athenaze and I'm feeling slightly overwhelmed now. Is it worth going to some other workbook like Logos to reacquaint myself with some of the grammar concepts and help with retaining vocab?
>>24882256yeah logos is more refreshing and even cooler id say, just keep chatgpt open for every sentence, grammar structure you don’t know.
>>24882271>just keep chatgpt open for every sentence, grammar structure you don’t know.zoom zoomwhatever you do, do NOT, under any circumstances, open a book
>>24882350it’s about time efficiency grandpa. No one is interested in looking the definition of a word on a book and taking 10 minutes, talk about losing interest and progress, students would soon look at it as a chore rather than as a passion. Even people back in the 19 century would gladly take the milisecond efficiency of an AI rather than indulging hours in books looking after a obscure grammar rule on optative aorist endings on page 1176.
>>24882356Then we agree. To paraphrase in your diction, do NOT look the definition on a book
>>24878156>mach es einfach hinter dichubi est baculum meum
>>24882256Just reread the previous chapters. If you have need additional supplements use Reading Greek instead of Logos.
>>24882584Oh, I guess I can do Reading Greek I have it downloaded too.What one should I start with? Is it Grammar and Exercises, Independent Study Guide or Text and Vocabulary?
>>24882256Did you do all the exercises?If they're not sufficient you might consider augmenting with Mastronarde.Logos won't do much for your comprehension at this stage that re-reading Athenaze won't, as the vocabulary is quite different.
>>24882601try to just read it and consult the vocabulary when you encounter an unknown word.
>>24882271>NOOOO IM STUCK PLEASE SAVE ME COMPUTERRetard zoomer your brain will be mush in a few years tops if it isn’t already. You will never learn greek
Proticus publica non operare videtur, nescio vero an cras revalescat (ignoscite verbi usum). Vereor quidem ne abfutura sit occasio ad verba commitendum ut cum collegis senecae epistulam haec hebdomadis tractemus solito more.
>>24883140* huius hebdomadae
>>24883140Laetemini, proticus iam rusrus operat.
>>24878389>I posted English next to it to show that in English it's ambiguousno, it isn't>You can start reading sections of the NT early due to its simplicitythe determiner has only one possible referent and cannot be misinterpreted
>>24882356>.No one is interested in looking the definition of a word on a book and taking 10 minutescur currunt athletae fessi, sed non in lecticis vehuntur?
>>24883090keksimus maximus
>>24882256https://libgen.li/edition.php?id=142693093https://www.open.edu/openlearn/mod/oucontent/view.php?id=113457
>>24883090imago infanda…
>>24882206>Greekoid claiming a Roman title
>>24883351No one actually understands English at all and it’s actually a lowly trade pidgin because this pleases my sensibilities as an >insert X ethnicity here with a non-global languageIt’s truly wonderful how our ancestors won so hard that Euros seethe so much, like residents of decrepit asiatic kingdoms reduced to servitude bragging about being more cultured than the Latins.
>>24883351in principle, you could say that the antecedent of its is llspi, but that would be absurd given the context. Clearly being able to read the NT after instruction from a beginner text implies that the NT is simple.
>>24883351>the determiner has only one possible referentWhich is what? Your quote contained "the NT" so I'm guessing you mean that. Nothing says the antecedent has to be in the same sentence. It seems natural that it would be "the NT", until you think about what he's saying. He's replying to this post:>Thanks but I just checked out Athenaze and it's not a natural method book, which is what I meant by "similar to LLPSI". Of course you need a little bit of information about the alphabet to get started with Greek but Athenaze from the looks of it goes way beyond that to where it's simply not a natural method book.The NT's simplicity is the same regardless of which method you use to learn Greek, and he's contrasting "the grammar textbook pill" vs LLPSI-type books/the natural method, and says that due to something's simplicity you can start reading sections of the NT early when using a grammar textbook instead of using LLPSI-type books/the natural method. So from that the stronger contender for antecedent of "its" is "the grammar textbook pill", but from being closer in the text "the NT" is the stronger contender, that's why it's unclear.
test.
>>24884608-icles
>>24884680what case is this
Is there something similar to Geoffrey Steadman's books for the rest of Plato's Republic?
>>24883305rursum abest! nuper conatus sum nuntium hodiernum immittere de Senecae nostri epistula vigesima quincta sed error nuntiatur
>>24885156Iam animadversi carus collega, Illud graviter fero, nescio quare non opus fungatur. Vero differendum esse puto nuntium ad hebdomadam proximam, usque rursum munus bene fungatur. Quid censetis ?
Does anyone know about ANY written down edition principles for Egyptian hieroglyphs? Things like direction of writing, glyph stacking, line breaks? It might be possible to derive the principles from a given edition, but there has to be something written down about it, no? Any major European language is fine by me.I've got to say, coming from Latin/Greek to Egyptian is quite a culture shock: scholars seem more concerned about translations, or, at best, transcriptions, rather than about editions of the actual hieroglyphic texts, and some of the "editions" seem to be simply drawings or photos of the monuments!(I'm asking because I want to create an Anki deck, but I want to practice reading the actual text, not repeatedly struggling to make out a grainy photo, so I'll have to typeset the hieroglyphs myself.)
>>24885169plerumque consentio, nisi fortasse cito redeat; huius hebdomadae epistula brevissimast igitur si hodie aut cras rediit possumus nuntium etiam brevissimum scribere, sin autem tardius ad proximam differendum
>>24880768κόμισόν μοι αὐτόνκατήχθη ἡ ναῦς βεβαίωςοὐκ ἔστι λέουσίν τ' ἀνθρώποις τ' ἀλλήλοις ξυνθήκηἀυτῶν ἕκαστος ἔλαχεν κλῆρον διπλάσιον τῶν ὑπεσχημένων κατὰ πλέθρονψιθυρίζων διὰ τῶν φυλλῶν ὁ Πᾶν τοῖς ὑπακοῦσιν ἔδωκεν τἀσφαλὲς ἱκέσθαιεἱ μὴ πεῖραν ἔλαβον τοῦ κρύφα τὴν γερουσίαν ἀποκτεννύναι, ἴσως οὐκ ἄν εἶεν φυγάδεςμετὰ τὸν πάγκακον χειμῶνα τὸν τἐπίνειον καὶ τῶν νεῶν τὸ πολὺ διέφθειρεν φήμη 'στὶ τοὺς τὰ μάλιστα εἰρηνικὰ φρονοῦντας τῆς γερουσίας μὴ ἔτι τῆς πρὶν ἔχειν εὐλαβοῦς γνώμης ἀλλὰ δοκεῖν ξυνψηφιεῖσθαι τοῖς ἄλλοις πρὶν ἀνορθωθῆναι τοὺς πολεμίους εἰσβάλλειν ταῖς ναυσὶ τῶν πεζῶν μαχησομένων κατὰ γῆν>mfw hard
I'm in my 3rd semester of studying Ancient Greek. I'm getting to the point where I'm hitting a wall. Where the information isn't being retained. Everyday we just look at massive chunks of texts and additionally do extra practice with optatives, subjunctives, every possible rendition of all of this, all coupled with constant vocabulary memorization + 3 other courses and their workload. I'm starting to collapse under the pressure and become extremely discouraged. I feel I'm not getting anywhere this way. I still look at a sentence and spend 5-10 minutes looking at dictionaries and indexes. Basic prepositions and particles I should know I keep forgetting as more information is slammed onto the curriculum with little time to digest it.I have been told that this grammar translation style teaching of Greek is criticized. I recently found the Ranieri-Dowling method. I don't have any time to do this now but over the Winter break I want to give this route a shot. I have the graduated readers though and all the paradigm spreadsheets.Did anybody else have the experience of the latter method opening far more doors? Or is this struggle essentially revealing that I'm retarded and in over my head? Any advice at all for someone on the verge of a total breakdown yet desperately wants to learn this language?
>>24885173this happens with cuneiform too. It's hard to find editions of the actual cuneiform text unless you can find photographs of the tablets. (Though there are plenty of books that have these, as well as handwritten transcriptions), but transliteration tends to be the norm. I imagine if the Chinese script had gone extinct, the same thing would be done. It takes a significant amount of work to read the actual glyphs, and so most people don't bother and go with the transliteration.
>>24885173There's also an important point that most of the texts we have only have one attestation (since they're monumental), and so textual criticism is impossible for a large portion of the corpus.
>>24885432>Everyday we just look at massive chunks of texts*Every day
>>24885432It's difficult to judge without knowing what are the texts you are given.In the first folder linked in the OP, go to "Reference and Textbooks" > "Greek". There you'll find the three part Reading Greek coursebooks. You can definitely learn Greek with those. The "Text and Vocabulary" copy in the mega is a bit crappy, so you might want to download a better one, but how difficult does some text from the first few chapters (pic. rel.) seem to you?
I'm elaborating on the second part of my inquiry, the culture shock, so if anyone knows anything about the first part, guidelines for editing Egyptian, please do post.>>24885445It's funny, these scripts (Egyptian, Akkadian, Sumerian, Chinese) are exactly the ones that have the feature of determinatives, so you do lose semantic information if you transcripe (unless there's special notation for them, like for Sumerian, I think). And with Egyptian, you're doubly fucked, because you also lose out on the vowels which might have disambiguated words.But I'll stop bitching now, it is what it is.
>>24885540Oh this is stuff I can easily translate through. There might be some minor vocab I need to refresh but I can pretty much parse through those with little to no references. What we are working on is The Symposium. It feels like a massive jump in complexity from Ancient Greek I and II that I took previously.
>>24885594>What we are working on is The Symposium.Plato is quite difficult. I'd suggest Xenophon, either Memorabilia or Anabasis depending on your interests. But if you are at the level where you can manage Plato, even with difficulty, you should be able to read almost anything. It doesn't really get much more difficult than that.So pick something you really like and go for it. Maybe pick a pdf from here that comes with a vocabulary and verb tenses:https://geoffreysteadman.com/At times it might feel that you are not making progress, but just by reading ancient Greek you are becoming better at it even if you don't immediately perceive it.
>>24885617NTA, but I heard almost the complete opposite: Plato being (depending on the exact dialog) one of the easiest Attic authors, after Xenophon and orators.Anyway, the advice to just read as much as he can, even if it's a good deal easier, is a good one.
>>24884684Nominative
>>24885594Does it feel like your biggest barrier is 1. Vocab 2. Reading fluency 3. Detailed parsing ability (explicit grammar)?Without knowing, it’s hard to give you advice. It sounds like you’ve done a lot of explicit grammar. Not to assume, but your reaction to a beginner reading text was “I can translate this” and not, “I can read this.”Dowling Method can work for very specifically supplementing your systematized knowledge of inflections, which can be hugely helpful. But you also might find texts generally less intimidating if you spent some time over winter break trying to actually read as much as possible, especially since you’re already getting a ton of explicit grammar practice through the curriculum by default (which of course you still need to keep up with, developing some basic reading ability can just make that a lot easier).Reading is the easiest way to acquire vocabulary, and the only way to develop fluency of reading comprehension, but anki can be incredibly helpful if used as a reviewing tool for words you have already read in context (ideally with the full clause or sentence put on the flashcard alongside the word itself).
>>24885432>I still look at a sentence and spend 5-10 minutes looking at dictionaries and indexes.Are you using a physical dictionary? Logeion might help a lot here. It’s a great website.Beyond that for Dowling, winter break might just not be enough time unless you really knuckle down. Even with Ranieri’s approach (audio and 100x per paradigm) the Greek setup is like 8 hours of audio. So probably it would be valuable to strategically prioritize the most important paradigms and to be rigorous about it. I found doing the same approach that I could clear a paradigm easily in a day if I wrote it down on a flashcard and did my 100x reps over the course of a long morning walk. Maybe do the article first.
>>24885624Plato's difficulty is kinda increased as soon as the content gets more technical so even if the prose is indeed fairly straight(and enjoyable) per se I could see the difficulty
Has anyone used Greek to GCSE? What did you think of it?
>>24887219Not yet, but it's one of the most legible of all the free downloads I've seen. Sadly copypaste isn't working though.https://libgen.li/edition.php?id=142693093
>>24887219It side-steps the issue of accents for the first few chapters by excluding them which may be helpful for an overwhelmed neophyte. The exercises are plentiful and not especially difficult so they reinforce the chapter material well. The readings are a little more challenging but have plenty of glosses and if you find them useful then there's a supplementary reader called "Greek Stories" by the same author. The textbook sequence introduces the aorist before the medio-passives which is worth noting if you're considering it as a supplement to Athenaze or Mastronarde. Participles are also dealt with early on. Overall it is quite effective although obviously limited in scope.
>>24878927If you're looking for easy mass reading material, this Latin teacher put together readings from Latin textbooks from history and mythology. Since they're from beginner textbooks, the grammar and vocabulary is limited.https://archive.org/search?query=creator%3A%22John+Piazza%22
>>24880768Adduc eum mihi.Navis feliciter appulit.Nullum inter leones hominesque pactum.Obtinuere singuli bis tanto iugera quam pacta fuere.Foliis susurrans Faunus aures praebentibus dedit in tutum se recipere.Si conatum non fecissent senatus occulte perimendi, fortasse non forent exsules.Post funestam procellam quae portum magnamque classis partem perdidit hostium fama est senatus factionem pacem maxime adhuc spondentem propriam retractasse sententiam pedibusque ituram in aliorum ut cum hostibus classe decernatur ante reparatas hostium res dum exercitus arma cum peditibus confert.
Why the FUCK does Augustus write like that? Genuinely want to cut my benis off when I read this shite.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmMauT_GejAMedus stultus, quia cum pecunia domini irati sui suae amicae anulum emit cuius pretium magnum.
>>24887764Yes he's a cuck and his girlfriend is a stupid but at least she's going to Heaven and everyone else is going to Hell.
Is there any value to doing North & Hillard before Bradley's Arnold if I am self-taught? I hear Bradley is a bit too hard for many.
>>24880768Clarifying question: Is "lion" here meant in the sense of one who is so far superior that they cannot be expected to negotiate as an equal, or one who can't be trusted to hold to a pact because they're seen as like a wild animal? I don't think the literal translation would work very well either way in Classical Chinese, and I'm trying to figure out how to Woolseyize it.
>>24885173How are you pronouncing it?
>>24888562it's a (paraphrased) quote from the Iliad, in the original it's more about the inability to ever come to terms due to fundamental differences(men and lions, in the next line wolves and lambs, but I thought translating literally if anything would be easier with the deeper sense being implied
>>24888562Just say lion chigga. It's an idiom. I don't translate 春种一粒粟,秋收万颗子。as "reap what you sow" I translate it literally. That's the fun of idioms. They're visual. When people translate them for meaning over literalness you lose how a particular culture words things.
>>24888617If I were translating from CC to English that would be one thing, but if I'm translating from English to CC I want to try to phrase it in a way that an ancient Chinese might conceivably have actually said.
>>24888621Well, no Englishman would ever organically say "plant one seed of millet in spring, harvest 10,000 in autumn" so I think this is just an example of Oriental conformity on your part.
>>24888652The relevant difference is more so one of translation from NL to TL or vice versa in general. I'd be more willing to render natural Latin as awkward English than natural English as awkward Latin for the same reason.
Oh great I stopped Latin for half a month and now I feel like a fucking RETARDED SUBHUMAN WORTHLESS PIECE OF SHIT NIGGER going back. Oh well I stopped for like a full year before and got back anyway.
