>>24945026>Philosophy/Theology books that converted you to ChristianityThis is all I want but I can never reach it. I read and pray and go to church and try to have faith but I can simply never convince myself that I actually believe in Jesus Christ. I feel despair.
>>24945039The fact that you pray makes you a Christian by itself. Having imperfect faith doesn't mean you aren't a Christian
>>24945058objectively that what it means.if you dont take it all as historical fact, your are an atheist
>jordan peterson fans feel shame for being fedora redditors back in the day and now need to larp as pious online for social validation pointsanyway pic related
>>24945039>I feel despair.literally the most christian thing you can be
>>24945141a biography of tillich is what made you a christian? not a book by tillich himself?
T'was the GOAT himself who led me to the light. A great chain of light, from God to the Blessed Virgin, to Saint Lucy, to Beatrice, to Virgil, to Dante, to me.
>>24945039>I wish I could believe in something that I don't think is true
>>24945183Tillich considers the Bible to be metaphorical, even God he considers a metaphor for being
>>24945285bruh that wasn't what i was asking
>>24945026It wasn't really a book but a personal experience but picrel nudged me in that direction
>>24945026Personal experience along with reading about near death experiences.
>>24945026Modalities by Alvin Plantingaand Plato's Eutyphro with Stephen Darwall's discussion of it and of theological voluntarism. These made the start, after that much Aquinas and Aristotle.Obviously also the Word of God, especially the Gospels, Deeds and the Pauline LettersBut I didn't convert because of my own intellectual labour. Faith is a grace for which one can only prepare oneself, but one can never earn it or be its source oneself. >>24945141???
>>24945026>Books that caused neurodegenerationStrangest thread topic.
>>24945318what an odd thing to say. surely you don't have ulterior motives...do you?
>>24945026A few words is all it takes to make it ok to delude yourself? Lol, lmao even
>>24945381>generic newfag vaguepost
>>24945183Reading Tillich's own work made me understand the type of stuff Jung pretends to understand, but learning about his own life helped me understand actual Christian praxis and weltanschauung much better.
>>24945039the fact that you feel guilt over it at all is evidence of the spirit working within you. you get a new heart, not a new brain.
>>24945039read Blake
>>24945536blake wasn't a christian, he was a schizo syncretist
>>24945537that sounds remarkably similar to the sorts of criticisms the pharisees made against Christ
>>24945026The Bible converted me, but I guess that doesn't count. Then I read more history and realized the religion is a sham. Still love Jesus Christ, but organized religion is death.
>>24945537Yes
>>24945026>>24945039Why would you want to embrace an illusions? Do you not value the truth?
>>24945058Imagine denying the truth and sticking with a falsehood. Is there any lower depth a man can stoop?
>>24945026Start with the Greeks.
'The Grand Inquisitor' a poem-excerpt from The Brothers Karamazovhttps://www.gutenberg.org/files/8578/8578-h/8578-h.htmit explains how Jesus is a pick-me and how that's good actually
>>24945949If you are alluding to Dostoevsky’s worst novels, then, indeed, I dislike intensely The Brothers Karamazov and the ghastly Crime and Punishment rigamarole. No, I do not object to soul-searching and self-revelation, but in those books the soul, and the sins, and the sentimentality, and the journalese, hardly warrant the tedious and muddled search. Dostoyevsky’s lack of taste, his monotonous dealings with persons suffering with pre-Freudian complexes, the way he has of wallowing in the tragic misadventures of human dignity – all this is difficult to admire. I do not like this trick his characters have of ”sinning their way to Jesus” or, as a Russian author, Ivan Bunin, put it more bluntly, ”spilling Jesus all over the place." Crime and Punishment’s plot did not seem as incredibly banal in 1866 when the book was written as it does now when noble prostitutes are apt to be received a little cynically by experienced readers. Dostoyevsky never really got over the influence which the European mystery novel and the sentimental novel made upon him. The sentimental influence implied that kind of conflict he liked—placing virtuous people in pathetic situations and then extracting from these situations the last ounce of pathos. Non-Russian readers do not realize two things: that not all Russians love Dostoevsky as much as Americans do, and that most of those Russians who do, venerate him as a mystic and not as an artist. He was a prophet, a claptrap journalist and a slapdash comedian. I admit that some of his scenes, some of his tremendous farcical rows are extraordinarily amusing. But his sensitive murderers and soulful prostitutes are not to be endured for one moment—by this reader anyway. Dostoyevsky seems to have been chosen by the destiny of Russian letters to become Russia’s greatest playwright, but he took the wrong turning and wrote novels.
>>24945026Philosophy, theology and arguments do not convince people of religious claims. The arguments work on those who want them to work and don't on those who don't/are neutral. At the end of the day you either believe or don't and THEN you justify it all.For the vast majority of religious people it's not a matter of having read the right arguments, they just 'feel' it, they 'experience' something that convinces them.For the vast majority of people who aren't religious it's also not a matter of being convinced by the right arguments, it's just that... they don't believe it. Nothing has convinced them. God, religion, prayer, the supernatural etc. just isn't a part of their life - divine hiddenness.
>>24945381watchu mean by this
>>24945026Be nice i started out as an ortholarper for like a year. I hate this book now it has 0 understanding of what nihilism is and has a horrible attitude towards reality and philosophy, complete garbage. It is what got me started though so I will at least be appreciative to gay Eugene for that. (sorry I don't respect gay (he was a practicing homosexual) larping (was heavily into taoism/eastern religions long before becoming eastern orthodox) californians).
>>24945026I remain unconvinced, mostly because forgiveness and grace isn't real and shouldn't be.
>>24945277>DanteI too like fanfiction anon
>>24945887>>24945890samefag pseud>>24946402Demonic hands typed this post.
>>24946388Qrd on this guy's homosexuality? I keep hearing about it everywhere.
>>24946031I'd say its experience. Depends on how the brain is wired. I made an argument in my writings that atheists have different wired brains than theists. Not in terms of actual circuitry mind you but how their mind processes things.
>>24945026I thankfully took the Gnostic rout to atheism.But have recently rediscovered its worth and gone back to agnostic. No, this "Christianity" you follow is Paulist garbage. It's for "cucks" honestly.
>>24945318>look demon daddy, I put the Church's councils into a chart>>24945887Imagine thinking that Freud will save you from lies.>>24946726>atheists have different wired brains than theists. Not in terms of actual circuitry mind you but how their mind processes things.Atheists view the world through their god, which is masturbation. Masturbation was so unnatural that Freud endorsed a fellow medical "professional" to perform a nose surgery to get him to stop. It didn't work. Atheism is the theology of the gooner. It believes that something comes from nothing and that one can have sex with one's self. Atheism is the opiate of the low-tier sinner. It applies the revelation that Santa is fake, a ploy of the devil, to the pseudo-revelation that Jesus is Santa for adults. Atheism is devoid of rationality, cuts off all connection with the past, and is so contradictory as to be nothing short of laughable. Atheists think they despair because they can't find God because they think God is a thing. They are closed in on themselves. Why wouldn't they be? They, like me and most of you reading this, were raised in the death cult of our era, or said otherwise, hell. To be an atheist is merely to not have an adequate definition of God and how would they have one considering how they were raised? Between porn, careerism, birth control, abortion, violent sports, blasphemy, scientism, and a Church that has all but embraced syncretic relativism, what hope do they have? My great Master, Jesus, is always available to listen but with what social media offers up as "Christians" and are really heretics of the most despicable stripe, who would ever ask my good Master for help? Atheism is the fruit of the hell our culture and society put us in, it is as unsurprising as it is wrong.
>>24945318i wish this were true. it'd be so cool
Philosophy only distorts and waters down the Scriptures. You should rely on the authority, inerrancy and perspicuity of the Bible alone. Starting with philosophy subordinates God's revealed authority to the shifting, finite standard of human reason.>>24946774You think putting quotes around your meme buzzwords absolves you of using them?
>>24947036>Atheism is the theology of the goonerso true king
>>24945026Good choice, Sickness upon Death is an incredible bookWhile I did not become a Christian because of Kierkegaard, his Fear and Trembling did make me study philosophy
>>24946015of course the pedophile had a problem with Christian thought
>>24946641A pseud can be redeemed, a schizo is lost to his delusions for eternity
>>24947036Freud would have a field day with the complexes on this anon
>>24947236I read Fear and Trembling first and then moved onto the Sickness Unto Death. FaT was good but TSUD blew my mind open. I have a copy of either/or and want to read it one day but am intimidated by its size. Also i feel like i have the attention span of a goldfish and it takes me a while to finish a philosophy book
>>24947422Those four years of penal servitude Dostoyevsky spent in Siberia he spent in the company of murderers and thieves, no segregation having been yet introduced between ordinary and political criminals. He described them in his ''Memoirs from the House of Death'' (1862). They do not make a pleasant reading. All the humiliations and hardships he endured are described in detail, as also the criminals among whom he lived. Not to go completely mad in those surroundings, Dostoyevsky had to find some sort of escape. This he found in a neurotic Christianism which he developed during these years. His emotional life up to that time had been unhappy. In Siberia he had married, but this first marriage proved unsatisfactory. In 1862-63 he had an affair with a woman writer and in her company visited England, France and Germany. This woman, whom he later characterized as ''infernal,'' seems to have been an evil character. Later she married Rozanov, an extraordinary writer combining moments of exceptional genius with manifestations of astounding naivete. (I knew Rozanov, but he had married another woman by that time.) This woman seems to have had a rather unfortunate influence on Dostoyevsky, further upsetting his unstable spirit. It was during this first trip abroad to Germany that the first manifestation of his passion for gambling appeared which during the rest of his life was the plague of his family and an insurmountable obstacle to any kind of material ease or peace to himself. Just as I have no ear for music, I have to my regret no ear for Dostoyevsky the Prophet. The very best thing he ever wrote seems to me to be ''The Double.'' It is the story - told very elaborately, in great, almost Joycean detail (as the critic Mirsky notes), and in a style intensely saturated with phonetic and rhythmical expressiveness - of a government clerk who goes mad, obsessed by the idea that a fellow clerk has usurped his identity. It is a perfect work of art, that story, but it hardly exists for the followers of Dostoyevsky the Prophet, because it was written in the 1840's, long before his so-called great novels; and moreover its imitation of Gogol is so striking as to seem at times almost a parody. Dostoyevsky characterizes his people through situation, through ethical matters, their psychological reactions, their inside ripples. After describing the looks of a character, he uses the old-fashioned device of not referring to his specific physical appearance anymore in the scenes with him. This is not the way of an artist - say Tolstoy - who sees his character in his mind all the time and knows exactly the specific gesture he will employ at this or that moment.
>>24945039Dont beat yourself up. "Lord I believe; help my unbelief" (Mark 9:24)If you want a book that might help with these feelings, read St. Augustine's confessions, essentially his autobiography of faith. He went through the same thing you are feeling.
>>24947132Paulists "catholics" are cucks
>>24947435>look satan daddy, I said he had a psychobabbleGreat work! Google "DSM" for more insights!
>>24947132Oh wow an actual heretic. Let's do this once:>Where in the Bible is the list of books listed?>What about books mentioned in the Bible that no longer exist?>Who decides the contents of each book?>Where in the Bible is solo scriptura?>Is Martin Luther in the Bible?>Where is philosophy condemned in the Bible? You must be in the Bible then to be able to give such authoritative interpretations of it, right?Repent, heretic. Seek the succor of Holy Mother the Church.
>>24947628>solo scripturalol, I love you Catholics, even if you're retarded platonists
>>24947644>if you're [redacted] platonistsSt. Thomas Aquinas in all fields. Go cope in your book club for hymns and lies and causing embarrassment to Christianity everywhere. Or, do you think that Jesus lies when my Master commands commands me to eat Him? Do you really think that the dumb cannot deceive the intelligent? How would it be any easier than to tell people to "read the Bible themselves?" Why shouldn't they just "think for themselves?" Did Jesus's compassion lead Him to appoint pastors to guard our minds and souls from false preachers? Was my Master not able to account for sinfulness of people in founding His Holy Catholic Church? Repent.
>>24947651Settle down, Fuentes, you're not going to end Protestantism by calling names on 4chan. I still love you.
>>24945039Why are you trying to convince yourself to believe in something? If you seek truth your won't need to convince yourself of anything. Do you want the truth, or do you want fairy tales (beliefs)?
>>24947626Did you receive a ritual partial castration from your father as a child? Were you taught to love the father that you must also fear? Were you encouraged to partake in the benefit of a human sacrifice by eating his manifest flesh and drinking his blood in a cannibalistic cult which venerates death? You already betray your desired place as a slave to a "master", but will you dig deeper into the psychological reasons for your self degradation?The final irony is that you rail against those who claim the mantel of God in determining what is right and wrong, all the while you, yourself, pass judgement as you please, taking this part of the Bible of tradition and leaving that, venerating what feels right to you and scorning what feels wrong, all with the false consolation that you're the only one following God's will and everyone else claiming to are wrong. What a sad little anon you are, but you'll never see it and thus never get better. What a fate!
>>24947543In what way? Elaborate.
>>24947660No. Do you understand how easy it is to make you and your descendants you curse with these loathsome lies to apostatize? How many Protestants with their Magisterium-less and rudderless "traditions" do you think I tricked into losing their "Faith?" It's easy and repeatable. Without the indwelling of the Holy Spirit your "Faith" is a raft that, if you are spared this generation, then you'll witness your children and grandchildren drown for the sake of your pride. Do you realize the level of intellectual pride and delusion you need to seek to immitate one setting up their own church? Fuentes is a child and has no policies to support his opinions. His obsession with race is abyssmal albeit his rhetoric is skillful.
>>24947678>Did you receive a ritual partial castration from your father as a child?No.>Were you taught to love the father that you must also fear?No. Fearing God is a mistranslation--it means revere.>You already betray your desired place as a slave to a "master", but will you dig deeper into the psychological reasons for your self degradation?There is no more simpler trick of the devil's than to tell a smart man that he is his own master.
>>24947692>There is no more simpler trick of the devil's than to tell a smart man that he is his own master.In the Christian tradition, God seeks to keep Man ignorant, a mindless automaton, while it is the Serpent who encourages Man to take the knowledge of Good and Evil. Thus, God is a tyrannical despot who wants Man degraded and bereft of dignity, while the Serpent encourages the attainment of wisdom, of self actualization. What will you choose, to be treated as a beast in chains, or to take up the Truth, Beauty, and Goodness attendant on a Man of dignity?
>>24947678>The final irony is that you rail against those who claim the mantel of God in determining what is right and wrong, all the while you, yourself, pass judgement as you please, taking this part of the Bible of tradition and leaving that, venerating what feels right to you and scorning what feels wrong, all with the false consolation that you're the only one following God's will and everyone else claiming to are wrong. What a sad little anon you are, but you'll never see it and thus never get better. What a fate!Where did I claim my own perfect fidelity to the Church's teachings? I do not make the Church's teachings more nor less correct nor does my witness add an iota to their stature or binding power. Submit your mind to the Catholic Church or it will be a slave to unimpressive lies from the devil.>it won't, I'm so smartOh, look, the man who invented ideas.>be nicer and gentlerYou brood of vipers and hypocrites! You want gentleness to be the yoke of ambiguity by which the Church can hide Her own grandeur.
>>24947699>knowledge of ... Evil.What do you learn from kidnapping someone? What do you glean from getting addicted from heroin? Evil is anti-knowledge and also, in the final analysis, evil cannot explain itself.
>>24947703The Catholic Church tends to use its power to hide pedophiles. Some divine organization that is.>>24947705Evil must be known to be minimized. If one had the power to eliminate it entirely, that would be the obvious course of action, but when one's power is limited, one must learn and diagnose, then one can begin to make things better.
>>24947679The faith was hijacked by Paul and distorted. That church has always been odious and evil and not Christ-like at all. Here's a short lecture for more detailshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6XGAc_OqCbU
>>24945926I actually read Celsus and he was dogshitI felt like I was reading a /pol/ rantAnd the fact that anti Christians have to dig through Origen's refutation in order to piece together that rubbish, lmao>>24947759>The faith was hijacked by Paulwhy wouldn't the living witnesses of Christ called out his bullshit then? Paul died with Peter; I highly doubt one would be willing to die with a con artist
>>24945926>Work only exists as quotations from those who later blew him out
>>24947865Then why do you observe the sabbath on the first day of the week?
>>24947874Sunday is the Lord's day not the Sabbath day
>>24947881So you observe the sabbath on the day the lord created the universe. This a part of the new covenant or something? Never heard about this.
>>24945039Try Feser.
>>24947928a plodding legalistic tradfaggot is the last thing that guy needs. he already has the fucking letter. the letter is in major ways his problem. what he needs is the spirit and he's not going to get that from feser of all people.
