>short petite girl with skinny noodle arms
>big fuckhuge battleaxe or greatsword
A match made in heaven. Literally always perfect.

second for RI

/wng/ authors
Previous Update Dec 27th
Updated stats for the ongoing series

Added
Added all 12 of Dimestorepublishing's stories.
Added the rest of AusticMan's stories
A Return from the Sky (Highschool DxD/High School DxD Fanfiction)
The Ultimate Weapon at Royal Academy (901 followers, second most followers and growth speed of Ongoing. It's doing better than their first story.)

Status Changes
The Crow and The Rabbit has resumed
Hexenjaeger has been deleted
Fallborn deleted his remaining two ongoing series: FALL OR DIE and Chiari Cooks for Cthullus
K U W A B A R A unhid/undeleted their stories
A few ongoing are close to Hiatus and several Hiatus are close to Inactive.

Recap
Some anon wrote several reviews
Arguing about sex appeal of covers and the semantics of being a gooner
Dialogue argument
Arguing about what life was historically like and that fantasy should be similar to how life was
the usuals continue patting each other on the back
laying out a different tagging system
Kinoman uses laptop and PC as interchangeable terms.
underboob discussion

Stories Posted
>>24981971
>>24982123
>>24977595
>>24983528
>>24988144
>>24988508
>>24988817
>>24990138
>>24991674
>>24992363

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How do I write moralfag characters when I am simply too sigma for concepts like good and evil?

somewhat seriously thoughbeit
I have a much harder time making "morally good" characters interesting, probably because I don't think they're all that interesting myself.

>>24992506
There was a good video someone posted about this a few threads back but just because a character is morally good doesn't mean they don't have flaws or make the right choices in every situation, not every character that wants to do the right thing needs to be the boy scout infallible Superman/Captain America

>>24992506
Make them self righteous pricks with rigid beliefs. That's what a moralfag is, after all. Or you could make them actual good people with depth but that may take skill you don't have.

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What i read: A Doctor Without Borders

What I expected: a savvy adult doctor using his old world experience to get shit done

What i got: Autistic Medical textbook explanations almost but not quite drowned out by sociopolitical autism stuck in a never ending prisoner arc

>>24992501
>zine posting for thread news
cringe or based?

>>24992501
>underboob discussion
We need more of this and less of everything else

>>24992527
either way it's definitely schizo

>>24992512
I just mean to ask what people find interesting about characters that reaffirm commonly held moral standards.

To me, all the most interesting characters don't do that. Either they have no morals, or they have their own set of rules that run at least slightly counter to the society they live in. Like Batman refusing to kill, even though he knows that the villains he spares will kill more people down the road.

>>24992514
>actual good people
Examples being...?

>>24992506
>How do I write moralfag characters when I am simply too sigma for concepts like good and evil?
Noir, anon. Noir, noir, noir! Once more for the cheap seats? NOIR !
the noir MC/hero/anti-hero is what you're wanting. You;re describing an elephant, by saying you want...
a trunk
a tail
big ears
noir heroes are a different breed. its like a byronic character, but on steroids. They don't just pout and brood. They have that "sigma code", and yes I know what that means. you can put noir and noir characters into any other genre. Blending noir with "x" is one of the better kept open secrets.

don't reply to me, Tina

>>24992554
...

>>24992506
Write the contrast between idealism and pragmatic reality. Give arguments for and against both. Have some villains that get redeemed and some who don't. Allow the character to taste both and come to a middle ground in their beliefs and the nuances that come from it.

>>24992532
It wasn't underboob. No I will not elaborate.

>>24992552
>I just mean to ask what people find interesting about characters that reaffirm commonly held moral standards.
It's less that they're interesting, and more that they're refreshing since everyone wants to be avant-garde and right amoral psychos or anti-hero MCs instead.
Like, sometimes it's just nice to have a knight go slay a dragon, rescue a princess, and marry her. Or terrorists take over the school, and a student stands against them and rescues the busty student council president and then they start dating. Just basic fantasy.

>>24992560
your loss

Becuse I'm so easy going and easy to get along with, and also not responding to *anyone*... here.
https://kcsivils.com/blog/what-makes-a-noir-protagonist-the-anatomy-of-a-flawed-hero-in-a-broken
>
this is a decent medium depth overlook, of the several things that make a true noir character. it can't hurt to read it, it takes like two minutes.
Seriously, the "sigma male" merely is a modern classification for what authors knew existed all along. Its gret itroduction, too many snippets just label noir MC as "antiheroes" and that's woefully incomplete.
also at the end? There's at leasttwo lins, toartiles showing noir *bended* with other genres. It literally fits into any genre. It brings complexity to the MC. It raises the bar up from comic book hero MCs and juvenile aura farming.
Not replying to *anyone*, just there's several anons dicussing this topic, and you're all looking for... noir.
Maube if someone else says it, someone might believe me. Who knows. My own moral compass, won;t let me not try to help and give back. Especially with all the good will and help I get here, I feel its the least I can do for my "fans".
you're welcome.
you guys skirt around this issue many times in the past. the pulp series PARKER is a great example.

it's already been *thirty minutes* and none of you have responded you've reead it. i don't mean *anyone*, it's just that you *were* discussing so don't pretend you don't want to read it.
>
I know my "fans" are lurking in the thread.
again, you're welcome.
you guys knows that I do it all for you

>>24992501
how often do you check all the stories to see if the status changes?

>>24992712
The only time I'm doing literally anything is when I make these posts. I'm probably going to do once every 2 weeks at most for the ongoing. Maybe once a month for the hiatus. This time it was less time between because it's a new year. The inactive will be checked far less. I don't know how often. Probably a few times a year at most. Updating the stats will only be for the ongoing and not that often since they don't change much less it's a brand new story that's doing really well.

I'm in /wng/ more or less daily though.

>tinatroon spamming again
What a nice start to this dogshit thread

>>24992743
tina is like a 70 year old socially starved ojii-san, give him some slack

>>24992744
I refuse to believe that's anywhere close to their true age.

If all goes well, my plan for later this month is to start reading then writing about /wng/ stuff in earnest until I become too jaded to continue on.

I can't wait for next week when half the fictions I follow start posting regularly again. This Christmas/New Years break has been really rough.

>>24992743
Trolling is against the rules on /lit/. Just report and hide the posts. No need to distract the thread by talking about it.

>>24992567
good bit of the definition of noir.

>>24992757
he's said he's an old fucker, icr how old though.
very minimum 40, but i think he said 60

which kinda makes sense, for some reason old posters are reallyyyy weird, it's a trend I've noticed for a while

>>24992757
I'm not 70, not even close.

>>24992782
>While I am pushing 60, my *values* are those of a person 20 years older than me.
I also refuse to believe that.

>>24992671
that you, kinoman?

I'm off work tomorrow. Imma gonna stay up a couple hours and finish the chapter I'm on and I like where its going. If anyone wants a sample read, just post a response to this post and I'll peek at it when I take a break. I know sometimes Its hard to get a read. Peace out.

based if true

>>24992806
Sure why not
Im not gonna make an account though

why are so many of the big name english original web novels written by ESLs?
do EFLs just not know how to make kino slop?

>>24992856
EFL education system makes them obsessed with prose and (the post-modernist idea of) meaning.
They are the frog in the well and can't comprehend Mount Kino

>>24992865
I wish english speakers cared about prose

>>24992856
it helps that they can live off like $300/mo

>>24992872
Prose is just the vehicle that delivers the story. People don't care about it unless it's so bad they can't help but notice it.

>>24992872
Me too kid. I feel my prose somehow got actually worse as I read through The Iliad, Odyssey, and Stranger in a Strange Land this past year. Before that it was Frank's Dune saga and Tanya LNs and it only got progressively worse after I finished Dune. The knowledge poisoned me too greatly. Actually kind of concerned what War and Peace, Rama, and some others in Heinlein's catalog will do to me presently. I peaked with Tanya, somehow, and I couldn't even finish the story I was writing as I read through that series.

>>24992882
Why would this affect anything? I said the big name stories
Genuinely more of the most popular english web novels are by ESLs compared to EFLs. Yes, including the #1 making millions and millions a year, Primal Hunter

>>24992891
>why does less overhead (especially relative to the global economy) promote creative careers?
i don't know, retard. unless you're suggesting the people living in favelas are secretly genius relative to english speakers

what ACTUAL point are you trying to make?

>>24992891
but if you're actually curious; it's cultural, etc.
there are probably x20 the webnovel writers in SEA

>>24992909
>what ACTUAL point are you trying to make?
it was a question or at most a discussion topic, not a point I'm trying to make
and your suggestion that poor third worlders are better at writing web novels because... they're under less financial strain?... is genuinely baffling

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>>24992909
This is massive cope.
U.S. was leading the world in both productivity and creativity for a century.
Nobody is suggesting anything, it's blatantly obvious to everyone that angloids shat their own bed

>>24992924
the us is the only EFL country? cot dam

>>24992923
incredibly low iq if oyu cant work it out

>>24992506
Righteousness and ideals aren't static. Characters can grow and change what they consider to be a right or just course of action. If you think a "morally good" character is boring then you aren't putting them in situations where they have interesting things to do or struggle against.

>>24992935
cope

>>24992927
Good point, the Bongs were dominating before that, so that makes the overall fall from grace even worse.

>>24992941
cope is pretending you people can write

>>24992945
cope AND seethe

>>24992950
>millions poors writing in english for our sweet sweet dollar
yes, secret geniuses

Which LitRPGs might be considered Literature?

>Finally stopped pussyfooting around and wrote the first chapter of my dossier
>500 words
That's good for an introduction chapter, right?

>>24992951
emphasis on seethe

the white mans burden is now explaining per capita to browns

>>24992958
A fifth of the way there, anon! Keep going!

>>24992956
Azarinth Healer (the original WN).

>>24992971
so easily mindbroken

>>24992976
My only issue is how long should I write these dossiers chapters. I’m guessing some where between 1.5 k to 3k should suffice right? The introduction chapter being the exception.

>>24992958
it's fine for a prologue
make it part of ch1 proper
the practical minimal chapter length is 1500
some do as little as 1k-ish tho

>>24993009
Outside of the personal dossiers of characters. Which will be around 2-3k, the other chapters will at best be around 1k to 1.5k. I just don’t see myself writing anything higher than that for dossiers.

>>24992988
Actually because of how you're doing it, I think you can break a few more of RR's "meta" rules. For instance, you could do 500 word daily posts, or even more than once daily. Just whatever the article or dossier entry of the day is, post it and refuse to elaborate. Because you're just dropping sprinkles and breadcrumbs, and you're not doing a normal narrative, it SHOULD encourage people to go back and put the pieces together.
I would still do a first post of several different things together, maybe like they were all paperclipped together and someone chanced upon them, and then after that it's all individual.

Now because you're not following the meta, it's going to hurt your readership at least at first. Discoverability is going to be shit, probably. I would STRONGLY recommend going hard on shoutout networking or ads. It's a neat little literary project but unless these are articles about the Hero's Journey to Defeat the Demon Lord with his Dragon Maid Wife, and they include his scouted powerlevel and such, it's not what the typical RR reader is looking for.

Pictures might also be a good idea.

Anyway good luck, I think you'll need it. And have fun.

>>24992831
>Sure why not
>Im not gonna make an account though
go to catbox (i think its catbox.moe, dont quote me), just click and select your text file you wrote. a chapter or excerpt. filename must end with "filename.TXT" that you selected. in seconds, just click on the hash link which automatically copies it to the clipboard. just paste that link in your post. Easy.

>>24992976
Why the original azarinth healer specifically? Is the new version worse in any way?

>>24992939
Got any examples?

>>24993012
yeah that's fine

Dragons in Space. 8k words minimum.
Fuck I'm already so slammed right now writing up a new fiction for a launch in a few weeks. Dare I try to write a short story and fuck myself with a full novel again?

What're you all thinking for the community contest that just got announced?

>>24993023
I haven't actually read the edited novel version yet but something about the original Azarinth Healer is peak battle maniac libro for me. I also have fond memories of reading it every spare moment when I was living in and traveling around Italy so remembering it brings back memories on the trains, in Venice, Firenze, etc.

>>24993082
Realistically you won't have a chance to win the contest if you don't hit that 40k mark. You can always set your pre-launch novel aside and see if the contest works out. Act accordingly.

>>24993082
What if my mechas are just named "dragoons"

that's close enough... right?

>>24993103
just make them fight space dragons 5head

>>24993089
Nah given how overwhelmed the judges are going to be I think short stories have a real shot. I could shit out 8k words in two days, but I don't really have two days to spare at this point unless I want to give up on trying to keep my current patreons subbed after my current fiction ends...

I also have no fucking idea what I would do with dragons in space. The rules say it has to be independent of current works so I couldn't just make a fanfic of my current work.

>>24993103
Nah man I feel like that would be over the line. At least make the mechs dragon shaped (wings as heat dispersion sails, for example).

>>24993027
the classic example. STealing is wrong. Yo have rigid sense of right and wrong, you will never steal. Really, though? Its the depression. Your kid is starving. Will you steal a loaf of bread? I bet you would. All of a sudden, stealig is the *right* course of action. And not stealing, makes you a coward and an asshole. See the black and white rules twisting under the strain the environment places on you. Added to it, is the other people all around you, telling you things like that. Ordinary upstanding citizens, cheered on bank robbers and did major crimes themselves. Now these are just basic classic textbook introductions to how to twist values, an still be "correct". A bright and creative person could come up with many more.

>>24993027
I'm the anon that did the loaf of bread example. What if you stole bread, but got caught. The cop, beat you up with a billy club, to you know. Teach these worthless bums a thing or two and keep that muh law and order. Your kid starves to death while youre in jail. Gonna stalk and assault that cop when you get out?he *knows* he was on a power trip, just enjoying having power over you. Why not show him what that's like. V-e-r-y seductive thought. And so what if the cop dies for the head injuries. Big whoop, he all but killed your child. Now. what will your inclinations be, when you know about a situation where some dirty cop, is beating up the hookers and stealing their money. Oh, yeahhhhhh. Cold blooded and premeditated murder? Is now not looking like the bad thing, why its practically the right thing to do. Then? you'll never hurt an honest citizen. But people like criminals dirty cops... if they fuck you over, you're experienced at violence now. You'll stalk and kill them with now no hesitation. A brutal killer... but one with a high moral code. No women, no kids. No honest joe six packs. But violent criminals, dirty cops... they cross you or your code? they'll never see you coming. Your values? Twist, twist, twist.

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>>24993163
It’s not as if their morals have somehow changed in that example. It’s just that certain things are more important than others, as is the case in any moral framework. It is commonly accepted that human life/wellbeing is more important than holding up principles like “don’t steal”. Hence why people are ok with stealing bread, but not ok with stealing ps5s and flatscreen tvs. Even in the case of widespread popular crime, it is only after a society has failed its moral obligation towards the wellbeing of its members that dismantling of the system is considered “correct”.
Perhaps this facet of morality is revealed, but I would not call it growth.

A morally subversive character would refuse to condone stealing even if it meant that a starving child would die.

>>24993027
I'm steal bred anon, ast example. See the progression? The moral values, of the once *rigid* good person have twisted under all the progressive strains. Because their values are so rigid, they now have their own (twisted) code. Stealing? From banks or other big business, is fine. Old blooded murder from criminals that are double crossing fucks, is another free pass. All it takes, is practice and experience. BANG! that formerly perfectly moral person, is now a very nice person, but don;t cross them in certain ways. WHat if that same person, was also not lazy. Believed i the work ethic. hat wtatever you do, you must dedicate yourself to perfecting your work. Hey. You;d be perfecting stealg big scores, and murder and hand to hand violence. Toss in a decent IQ, and you have a *very* formidable person running around 10 years later. and THERE, is your noir anti-hero. He's kind of lovable, and in some weird way, the sort of good guy, in the crime novel. As long as he's dealing with horrible criminals, he's the good guy. Kind of. He's complex, dangerous, dedicated to craft. devious and cunning. al while being polite and upstanding. He would hand your wallet back to you if it fell out of your pocket. YOU don;t deserve to be stolen from. He'd GIVE you a hundred dollar bill, to feed your kids not even knowing you. Heart of gold, but a ruthless thief and killer. He feels no remorse for his crimes, after all he only targets bad people that deserve it. he sleeps perfect at night, he has a clear conscience.

holy fuck just start a blog

tina. meds.

the proposed discussion, was about how a morally rigid person could get twisted into right and wrong move around. I provided a case for it, how it could go. The anon? *asked* for *examples* and I, after a long time and he got no replies, decided to provide an in depth example. he now has a framework, to outline if he wants to. Sorry, but the question wasn't what is 2 plus 2, it required more. If you don't like the post its too long, ignore it. and that is case for meds? for what. giving someone what they asked for, and more. do have a pleasant evening, sir. I really Iike that character I just created.I think that might be the foundation for my next book when I'm done screwing the present one up. By 1950? That depression guy is going to be a bad ass to write. Basically... PARKER in 1950's big city. Might be... kino.

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>novel get reviewbombed by three kingdom autist
Chinese webnovel scene is wild

>>24993203
This is why my cultivation sory has nothing to do with China

>>24993203
the three kingdoms fandom has had at least 400 years from the novel’s inception to autistically debate each other. this results in fans pulling up citations other fans wrote during the Ming-Qing transition.

as an side, the autists of the Three Kingdoms are unhinged. you have “Cao Cao Was Right to Massacre Xu Province” apologists to marxist Liu Bei fans trying to retroactively apply class struggle theories to the figures of the Three Kingdoms and unironically believe that history moves exactly as Marx said it does.

>>24993203
three kingdoms is the powerscaler son to the illiad's fujoshi daughter

God do I hate furries and scalies.

i'm writing a small amount daily

>>24993374
what are we calling a "small amount"

I am of the opinion that litrpg is inherently bad and only makes anything that includes it's elements strictly worse. The reasoning is that by ripping off video game and ttrpg mechanics, which themselves were simplified abstractions to real world complexity due to their formats, all for the benefit of people on the spectrum and/or imbeciles who can't deal with anything complex and must have everything spelled out in clear numbers and stats that they grew up on glued to a screen, otherwise their brains short circuit.

>>24993392
I can understand the appeal. It gives easily understood guarantee of progress. It makes even trivial things that might not seem so important on their own seem rewarding and worth your attention if only the numbers go up. Expressing character growth without a system is much harder and easy for the audience to miss.

That said, the majority of litrpg authors fail to take advantage of this and just spam numbers and notifications for the sheer hell of it.

>>24993392
writing is inherently bad, it is an abstraction for speech which can be song and sagas
only children and the simple minded would take in information by written symbol rather than oratory tone

I fucking did it. After hours languishing, I posted my work on Archive of our own. Just tell me if I should regret it or not.
https://archiveofourown.org/works/77072556/chapters/201736796

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>>24993392
LitRPG mechanics are the only way to make magic interesting .
State the rules from the start, and the reader will be free from the author pulling out some sort of absurd asspull to save his self-insert MC.

>>24992976
azarinth cheater is not really literature anon
you are just another drake

>>24993435
>Two interconnect incidents shake the very foundation of the Mutant Liberation Front, in retreat and quickly losing popular support in Prospect City, they regroup to gather information on what happened on those incidents, the events leading up to those incidents shocks them.
Well, see it as an opportunity to improve, I guess.

>>24993383
500 words

>>24993459
I’m dogshit at summaries.

>>24993464
the shouts in the street rose as one "GENETIC FILTH OUT OF PROSPECT CITY!"

mutants is marvel protected copyright too

>>24993428
>easily understood guarantee of progress
Litrpg elements should not be required for someone to easily understand progress if they're past elementary school, and even then the smarter ones wouldn't need it. For anyone in their 20s+ it should be beyond embarrassing unless mentally challenged.

>>24993431
That's cool, except speech can't be absorbed at the speed most people can read, and audiobooks are already a thing for those that prefer that medium. It is also highly limited by budget constraints where it's very rare to have every character individually voice acted along with background effects, while a lot of people with active imaginations prefer this to monotone oral narration. It's just a preference of medium not an inherently superior/inferior quality.

Meanwhile litrpg is a degeneration and simplification of literature, prose or poetry or whatever you want to try and apply it to.

>>24993436
>LitRPG mechanics are the only way to make magic interesting

I'm not saying Sanderson is good but he's best known for his structured magic systems, saying litrpg mechanics are the only way to make magic interesting is beyond absurd and narrow-minded.

>>24993464
I mean, sure, it's a bad summary, that's true enough. There's a lot more issues beyond just that, though.

>>24993471
Critique away.

>>24993470
A degenerate who prefers his stories like McDonalds. Making excuses.

>>24993470
Sanderson is a fair knight, and all his magic system is based on the fact that he, as an author, won't purposefully break it.

A LitRPG put it into law.

I hate google, search for "Leather Harnesses" all products for humans. This is retarded.

>>24993475
>Two interconnect incidents shake the very foundation of the Mutant Liberation Front, in retreat and quickly losing popular support in Prospect City, they regroup to gather information on what happened on those incidents, the events leading up to those incidents shocks them.
So, first of all, this needs to be split up. Your usage of commas is inappropriate because it's actually three sentences you've conjoined together into one abomination.
>Two interconnect incidents shake the very foundation of the Mutant Liberation Front.
>In retreat and quickly losing popular support in Prospect City, they regroup to gather information on what happened on those incidents.
>The events leading up to those incidents shocks them.
That's at least a little more readable. Is it a better summary? No, not really. Let's go through the rest quickly.

Second problem: "incidents". Meaningless term that it is, you reuse it once per sentence.
Third problem: "The events leading up to those incidents shocks them" is worthless and grammatically incorrect. How exactly is left as an exercise for the reader.
Fourth problem: is the focus the Mutant Liberation Front or what lies at the bottom of these "incidents"? Pick one and emphasize that.
Fifth problem: Hooks, motherfucker. What's the hook meant to be here, "the events leading up to those incidents"? That tells me nothing about what the story will actually be like. Is this a story about an investigation into what happened, a story about what happened leading up to those incidents, or is this a story about something else entirely?
Sixth problem: Prospect City just isn't a good name. No particular suggestions here, but c'mon.

If I were to rewrite this, then maybe it'd be something like this.
>The first Prospect City Incident forces the Mutant Liberation Front into retreat, but the second leaves them barely holding on to the little popular support they have left. Desperate, they regroup to gather information, only to find [something].
Fill in that [something] with something like "the deep-nested roots of a conspiracy against them" or "betrayal from within" or "a truth that someone desperately wants to keep hidden" or "far more than they were hoping for". Those are all options but I don't know what your actual plot is like, just do something with it to make the reader actually want to read your work.

>>24993431
Thank you Mr Tate, very cool

>>24993497
Where is your bugatti readlet?

>>24993488
Litrpg magic systems are as much made up on the fly bullshit in 99% of cases, unless you have the full rulebook and know how everything interacts and have literally everything statted out it gives nothing but an illusion of being any less of a plot device than completely unstructured mystical portrayals of magic.

And in the extremely rare theoretical cases where the autism would be high enough to have a fully fleshed out system it would still be a niche oversimplification for the benefit of those on the spectrum who can't deal with the real world not having bullet damage and HP bars, not something strictly magic related. So to say litrpg is the only way to make magic interesting is to say litrpg is the only way to make any story interesting.

>>24993506
harry potter magic is better than sanderson. You cast the spell correct and got a wand = it fires.

>>24993514
It's literally all the exact same aside for flavor. Unless you end up blatantly contradicting yourself or pulling out something previously not established it doesn't matter if it's king Arthur magic or the most autistic litrpg story ever made. It's just a narative tool and something to evoke cool imagery, the number crunching doesn't make things any more "realistic" in-universe, it's just video game/ttrpg autist bait.

>>24993506
In my book, I use Windows to state rules for the Skills, which are purposefully crafted to be exploited in the right environment and enemy.
That's the best part of a LitRPG, like a mystery, the reader might be able to anticipate how the fight goes.

Working on some sloppa that’s supposed to be street levels superheroes with some king-fu flavoring, like Iron Fist or Daredevil.

Would it be better to just lean one way or the other though? Just go full Spider-Man or Invincible instead?

>>24993514
And the cast uses the same 5 spells at 11 and 18 because the author has the imagination of a squirrel

>>24993622
that is not true, the final spell list is something like 10-12

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240 FOLLOWERS!!! 5 new in less than a day.
Was the last chapter that good? I wrote it on my smartphone.

>>24993679
How would the most recent chapter drive new followers? They have 1000 pages to even get there

>>24993714
It happened a couples times.
Perhaps, someone here has read it, like it, and decided to read the whole thing.

>>24993197
>the proposed discussion, was about how a morally rigid person could get twisted into right and wrong move around
no it wasn't tina

>>24993670
I only remember the protagonist ever using expellianus, stupefy and "cut my classmate to pieces"

>>24993792
allohomora
accio
stupefy
expecto patronus
wingardium leviosa
sectum sempra
lumos I think
the shield one they practice
the disarm one

//three deadlies
crucio
mind control
kill spell

//teleportation

just the ones I can recall

>>24993797
Bro, I honestly don't give a crap

>>24993792
CUT MY LIFE INTO PIECES

>>24993818
THIS IS MY LAST HOGWARTS

>>24993815
Next time stop giving a crap before complaining and being proven wrong desu.

>>24993783
>>>24993197 (You)
>>the proposed discussion, was about how a morally rigid person could get twisted into right and wrong move around
>no it wasn't tina
>
Tina-anon here. Actually, it was. Here's the conversation. first is opening question, followed by all the (none me) replies. The asker, is asking for "noir" though he does not know it. All these responses? are describing "noir", though they don't CALL it that. You do realize that just because *gasp* Tina-anon said it, doesn't make it wrong or false. What if I said the sky is blue. I know I'm the weird kid in the classroom, so I provided a great link to explain noir. Which is *exactly* what all those responses, are explaining without once saying the word... noir.
>
https://kcsivils.com/blog/what-makes-a-noir-protagonist-the-anatomy-of-a-flawed-hero-in-a-broken
>
this link, explains *everything* that all those anons answered with. It might be the ONE time, Tina-anon gave something useful and correct.
>
proof:

How do I write moralfag characters when I am simply too sigma for concepts like good and evil?
I have a much harder time making "morally good" characters interesting, probably because I don't think they're all that interesting myself.
-----
just because a character is morally good doesn't mean they don't have flaws or make the right choices in every situation, not every character that wants to do the right thing needs to be the boy scout infallible Superman/Captain America
-----
Make them self righteous pricks with rigid beliefs. That's what a moralfag is, after all. Or you could make them actual good people with depth but that may take skill you don't have.
-----
To me, all the most interesting characters don't do that. Either they have no morals, or they have their own set of rules that run at least slightly counter to the society they live in. Like Batman refusing to kill, even though he knows that the villains he spares will kill more people down the road.
-----
Write the contrast between idealism and pragmatic reality. Give arguments for and against both. Have some villains that get redeemed and some who don't. Allow the character to taste both and come to a middle ground in their beliefs and the nuances that come from it.

tina....

>>24993354
I avoided beastkin in my last story but I'm putting them in this one. And talking snakes (with dommy mommy tone/vibes). Deal with it.

>>24993911
>tina....
are you asking me to answer you. I doubt it. More likely, you are just spray-painting "tina" on my post.
>
being honest, how do people read 1,000,000 word WNs, and complain about a couple extra lines of text in a post. You know, I deliberately provide the link simply because I knew that if Tina said it, it would be not only ignored it would be laughed at. Which is fine, I can't care. That's my mistake for trying to be nice and help. I'll try not to do that again, I know how horrible of a thing that is. Cheers.

>>24993450
>you are just another drake
How can you quote such a deeply meaningful line from the story and say it's not literature?
It's libro.
Just eat the sun lmao

>>24994180
I read it religiously when it was running ages ago. How could I not quote that one?

Still not literature me thinks. Good story and entertainment.
We just have to call it a new category.

>>24994180
I tried to read AH like five times when I was looking for healer stories but couldn't. It's utter dogshit

>>24994201
Have you read Lifeweaver or 1% Lifesteal yet? Do you know any other good ones? I'm an absolute sucker for healer-fighter MC stories. Might as well be crack for me.

>>24994221
I was specifically looking for healer stories, but they're all actually "immortal battle junkie" stories.

>the first chapter has more than 3 lines of dialogue
DROPPED

>>24994265
There's BTDEM but BTDEM is kinda crap.
Well if you find something good definitely post it in /wng/ I'm always on the lookout.

>>24994265
I know there's a couple of manwha / manga, including some about being a doctor in a world where everyone just uses healing magic. Doctor's Rebirth, Isekai Doctor, Life of a Quack Healer (which isn't actually about a quack). Obviously there's also the manga Jin which you should read if you haven't.

>>24994333
Oh, and Divine Surgeon, nearly forgot about that one.

>>24994333
>>24994334
Thanks for the recs!
I have a hard time getting into manga since I'm picky about how I read it. I really should just buy a dedicated tablet for it but it never seems worth it.

>>24994287
anon who says "thing X, dropped."
>drops anon

Kinoman. you still kicking around. say something interesting.

>>24994528
Worldbuilding is the fuel of your story.
It doesn't matter how good your engine, when your world is completely discovered, the whole machine will stop.

>>24994539
eugh.

>>24994539
worldbuilding is a meme and JK rowling is proof of that

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>>24994543
Worldbuilding doesn't necessarily mean depth like mine.

Harry Potter is Atmosphere Farming. You don't read it to learn about the Magic Wars of China, but to experience a Belle Époque England with all its aesthetic + magic.

Characters >= Plot >>>>> POWER GAP >>>>>> Worldbuilding

>>24994551
Characters and plot can't exist without worldbuilding.
Or better, none of their actions or events would have any meaning without it.

*story exists in the real world*

>>24994558
If your story exists in the real world, why have I never heard of any of your characters or plot events on Xitter?
In short, you, the author, have diverged the timeline to allow your babies to be born, making it no longer a reality.

>>24994539
Dumbest statement of 2026

>>24994581
I'm just ahead of my time.

>>24994539
>Worldbuilding is the fuel of your story.
if you're going for "sweeping epic", then yes. Its why I always refer to Dune when I reference your book. LOTR, another sweeping epic. But, some very successful books and genres, don't build worlds.
>It doesn't matter how good your engine, when your world is completely discovered, the whole machine will stop.
in the big trilogy sweeping epic, yes. You unfold your giant orld in pace with the story. You lernthe last thing, the twist reveal or the ending in time with it being the last thing in that world you learn.
But other genres, exist in our world. You don't have to build a world, for example a crime novel. Take Airframe (Crichton) its not world building for him to explain over the course of the novel how airplanes are built and everything around that. He's just turning a flashlight and a magnifying glass on a part of our existing world that few know about. And a small setting hardboil novel, is in a world we already know.
>
imagine this. A giant movie, all the sets, the other world, all that. orld building. Its... le epic. But, if the actors are just people off the street, its not fun to watch. There's no ignoring premise, characters, dialogue, plot, skill. LOTR would be shit without all the unique interesting characters.

>>24994528
>say something interesting.
and you didn't disappoint. good job kinoman. have a (you)

>>24994539
damn it. now you got me worrying about my present project. I didn't world build. and its set in another world, lol. As different as it is, I rely on character and plot. part of the whole thing is that I compare and contrast the MC from our world, and its clash/mesh with that word.
but if I try a big world building(never tried), you mogged the shit out of me, lol

>>24994627
>I rely on character and plot.
As you should.

>>24994592
kinoman. you did a lot of combat action in your work. any chance I can get your opinion on a short excerpt of mine. We swap. I'll read a coupe thousand words of your combat scene.

>>24994627
Worldbuilding is just autist bait. Don't sweat it. People who claim to love worldbuilding don't even study the geography of the world they live in right now. They are unserious.

>>24993494
>Second problem: "incidents". Meaningless term that it is, you reuse it once per sentence.
I will admit that writing this is my first attempt at writing a dossier. So I don't know how these things go.

>Third problem: "The events leading up to those incidents shocks them" is worthless and grammatically incorrect. How exactly is left as an exercise for the reader.
Thanks for telling me this.

>Fourth problem: is the focus the Mutant Liberation Front or what lies at the bottom of these "incidents"? Pick one and emphasize that.
I thought I made it clear that the Mutant Liberation Front is trying to get to the bottom of those incidents. The entire dossier is from their perspective.

>Fifth problem: Hooks, motherfucker. What's the hook meant to be here, "the events leading up to those incidents"? That tells me nothing about what the story will actually be like. Is this a story about an investigation into what happened, a story about what happened leading up to those incidents, or is this a story about something else entirely?
There is no hook. Even in the story proper, there is no hook. The first chapter is literally just snippets of everyday life and how XYZ characters told the POV characters about new opportunities that eventually spiral out of control.

>Sixth problem: Prospect City just isn't a good name. No particular suggestions here, but c'mon.
Prospect City is just a stand-in for Chicago. The only reason why I don't use Chicago is because I don't want to be bogged down due to its local politics and streets.

After thinking about it. I delete my work. The Dossiers should either be release in the middle or at the end, but not before the main story

>>24994549
kino

Anyone here go to kindle? Do you have to delete your entire story off RR?

>>24994678
Don’t go to kindle. I have yet to see an RR get rich from kindle. Just do a patreon or something g.

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The constant struggle of editing, the never ending lawn-mower killing not just the darlings but the entire flower bed. Fuck my shit up desu senpaitachi.

>>24994688
>Don’t go to kindle. I have yet to see an RR get rich from kindle.
How would you know how rich stubfags are?

>>24994678
You can be on amazon without leaving RR. Only Kindle Unlimited requires exclusivity, depending on the TOS which I haven't looked at in over 6 months. Lots of people make good money from it, but the numbers aren't public. Zogarth said he makes more from Amazon (presumably KU) than from Patreon, and he makes a fuckton from patreon, so you can guess it's worth a bit. The only problem is that amazon's internal discoverability is worse than RR.

Generally you can leave a "sample" of your work on RR. I've seen the first few chapters left up after stubbing. So you can keep your current following up to date with new chapters while new readers are forced into KU or buying the books or pirating to get caught up.

>>24994698
This is literally not what gaslighting means.

>>24994705
I'll gaslight you

>>24994704
>The only problem is that amazon's internal discoverability is worse than RR.
Makes perfect sense. more genres than mainly just WNs. All those people browsing, rading, buying, ubscriptions. It draws all the authors out of the woodwork. But I read that if you just dump even an epic book on KU/amazon its literally just like the tree fallig in the forest and no one hears it. WIthout being surrounded by other books ie a company with a presence there takes you there. Without web presence and buzz. Nothing will happen. That's why for a new author, it's basically WN success first or there's no next step. or getting accepted by some publisher that has a decent e-book division. Its like trad pub back i the day to me some indie author gets printed? Who knew. Now if Del-Rey SF picked you up, well that was a diff story. Your book was now next to other famous SF author's books on their section of the book store shelf.

>>24994705
>This is literally not what gaslighting means.
in a way, it is. The origin, comes from a guy convincing someone things are not as they really are. He does it to make them unsettled, and clingy, and then they turn to him. He uses it to control them. This is convincing yourself things aren't as they seem. you are attempting to exert control over yourself. Human beings have a surprising capacity to tell themselves things, and come to sort of believe it. if you tell yourself that you're worthless and weak for too long, you will be. People have turned thing around by doing the opposite. You don't realize the change because its so gradual. I'm just saying I can see what they mesn by using the term gaslighting that way. You're fooling yourself, but to a good end.

>>24994688
>yet to see an RR get rich from kindle
Almost all authors make more on kindle than they do royalroad lol

>>24994760
This post is attempting to gaslight anons

>>24994929
>This post is attempting to gaslight anons
uh, yeah. sure. Look, anon. Which makes more sense to you. to tell yourself positive things in the mirror after the shower every morning, shaving? Or, bad things. Gee, i'm really gaslighting anons. If you can't even believe in yourself that you can do things, no one else ever will. you have to believe you can do things, to have a chance of ever doing anything.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ng-G4OJDGM
I want to write a cultivation story...

>>24995064
is that a fucking AI voice over

>the 2 best rated series on RR are time-loop
>all the other time-loop series are dogshit
how does this happen?

>>24995137
sucess breeds dogshit

>>24995064
then do it

>>24995137
One of them was planned out from the beginning to the end. Also, it has character development instead of reaffirming his anti-social belief.

>>24995171
>One of them was planned out from the beginning to the end
surely that is standard fare? how on earth are you supposed to write anything competent without planning the whole thing out first

How much stronger are cultivators compared to regular people?

How many mortals does it take to defeat a Qi Gathering pupil? How many Qi Gatherers does it take to beat a Foundation Establishment expert? How many mortals does it take to beat a Golden Core cultivator? Can 1000 foundation establishment experts really defeat a Nascent Soul master?

>>24993535
This is what clueless people actually believe. The magic in Harry Potter leaves a hundred plotholes and takes people out of the story.

>>24995182
quantity cannot overcome quality
it's impossible

>>24994653
>worldbuilding is geography.
And writing is all about putting words together to create a sentence that makes sense.
>>24994632
Sure, but for me, battles are my weakest point since I force myself to make them as short as possible.

Here's my magic system:
>if you have glitter you can cast a spell by throwing it
>certain characters carry glitter in their pockets, even when they're wearing a skimpy dress with no pockets.
>they cast spells whenever the author wants them to
I am laughing at all these complicated rules and systems everyone comes up with for magic. Just tell a good story.

>>24995182
It varies greatly setting and setting. Commonly, martial artists can somewhat contend with qi gatherers in the later stages. Chinks tend to make it so there's a huge gap between major stages because it lets them be lazy about worldbuilding and power scales.

>>24994617
There is always something to uncover in any plot.
Once it is discovered, your story ought to end.

>>24995194
systems are fun to invent. Devising a set of rules and then creating exploits is fun. A big reveal of the exploits in the system or the parts that the characters didn't know is fun. It adds another layer. Is it needed? No, you can simply tell a good story, but if people want to go further I see no issue with it.

>>24995178
>surely that is standard fare?
Nope. If anything, planning things out is incredibly rare.

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Man, trying to figure out how to rewrite the first chapter is so soul-crushing

>>24995201
...why?

>>24995216
Lots of writers do best finding the story as they write it

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>first beta reader got back to me with feedback on a new chapter 1 draft
>I hit most of the notes I wanted
>just need to write the next ten chapters now
Ugh I don't remember outlining being this hard to get started on last year.

>>24995217
that sounds like prototyping, as long as it's not released in any capacity aside from short stories then it seems reasonable, but you still need to plan once you're done all that

>>24995229
this sounds nice to say but the reality of things, especially when it comes to serial fiction, is that most people write via the discovery method, at most setting down guideposts ahead of time (e.g. a battle that must take place or so on)

>>24995206
>Man, trying to figure out how to rewrite the first chapter is so soul-crushing
same here. the good news or me is that once several chapters in, I'm in a groove and on a roll. Not having what plagued the complaints on my first couple chapters. Maybe when I'm done, I can keep that running and rewrite the first couple chapters.

>>24995137
are you calling my timeloop story dogshit bruv

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>>24995193
okay, here. going to bed soon, you kinoman (and anyone else) feel free to read and leave posted comments. its the isekai-transmigration MC's first encounter with any enemy. the enemy looks like pic related

>>24995254
shit. forgot link! (tired, lol)
https://files.catbox.moe/0xp4a7.txt

>>24995216
he's wrong and just saying things

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>>24995206
I wound up writing my first chapter three times. The first time I got too in my head trying to write it "good," so I stopped early. The next day I decided to write from what I myself thought was a good starting point, with the main characters childhood, and then I wrote like three chapters worth of stuff that is objectively bad first chapter material. But by that point I was more comfortable with the character and his backstory, so the day after that, I came in and wrote the "good" first chapter and it came out nice.

I also consciously gave myself permission on day two to write a bad first chapter, and told myself that whatever happens, if I write the first chapter 3+ times, that I could just pick the best of the three and go from there.

You could also skip the first chapter, write the next few chapters, and then go back and build the first chapter based on what comes after.

Don't give up!

>>24995252
if you're years of the apocalypse then you're okay (minus the identity shit), otherwise yes

>>24994333
>>24994311
I didn't exactly mean the MC being a doctor/pharmacist, but having the healer role in a dungeon/adventurer/army team and not becoming a 1-man army himself. That shit is rare.

Of JP web novels, I kinda enjoyed The Wrong Way to Use Healing Magic. It still kinda strays into the solo leveling territory, but also involves actually being supportive in combat.

>>24995146
I can't figure out how to start it. Although sentenced to be a hero gave me some ideas.

>>24995279
Yeah... There's a few, I think, but actual parties in stories, and with the healer as the MC, that's pretty rare. 1 man army immortal healer battle maniac is just too fun.
But it's a market gap you could fill. Make it something like Log Horizon, even.

>>24995262
hi, smug sippy. You were here last night, I remember the pic. She cute, I downloaded her into my anime folder last nite. your first chapter story, parts sound familiar. I knew the MC backstory on mine, and I tried to thoroughly let the reader be introduced to him reminiscing, childhood and wartime experiences and all. It lets you know what makes him "tick" while he's looking out the window. He's getting ready to go out and take care of something dangerous. 5k words, and the last k or so, was he got triple crossed and murdered by those he trusted and were closest. Anon read it, and pointed out that all the internal monologue was just too much. I guess I'm info dumping his backstory all at once. I need to rewrite the first couple chapters, to watch that. Once I'm a couple chapters in, its plot starting and characters and dialogue, so its not got that problem. I guess I finish out like that, then I'll have to rewrite the first 1 to 3 chapters using the style I picked up thats better. Sucks though, I like reading that stuff. Like putting my dog down, lol. Oh well. I guess i can always save those chapters as "bonus" for readers? patreon bonus, whatever if I ever get to that point. never did patreon before. have a good night, smug-sippy-anon.

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>>24995290
what if I told you there are multiple smug sippies...

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https://rentry.co/msn6zoeq

1st chapter redo. boy this is tough

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Should I read Solo Leveling? I liked the anime.

I stopped reading reverend insanity on like chapter 1700 and im not sure if i should start from the start again or just rawdog it and pick it up where i left it off and it was like 6months ago btw.

>>24995297
The artwork alone makes it worth it. The artist made crazy improvement over the course of the webtoon.

>>24995254
Okay, Kino-man here, I read it all.

It starts, at least for me, feeling a bit like Lord of the Flies with girls, and the monster’s description is also good. That being said, adding some flavor about your worldbuilding might help remove doubts from the readers.
It’s fine for the first chapter to be mysterious, but your goal is also to bait people.

The fight is confusing.
It’s not bad, but at times I can’t tell whether the MC is thinking or acting. For me, the solution would be to alternate the paragraphs: one where the MC analyzes the situation, and another where he actually acts.

I hope my opinion helps you.

>>24995297
Read Omniscent reader viewpoint or The Novel's Extra.

Same concept, but better executed.

>>24995305
The novel's extra is terrible garbage

>>24995307
First half is peak Rom-Com.

I always worry that I have too many chapters without action. I had a lot of fight scenes early on and I don't know if readers are looking forward to more of that or the character growth. going 3 chapters without someone bashing someone's head with a stick feels like I'm letting people down.

>>24995311
>bland, autistic, all-knowing gary stu gets every chick lusting after him by just walking by
yawn

>I Became The Academy's Defensive Swordsman
>learns skill copy five chapters in to let him do offensive swordsmanship also
goddamnit

>>24995304
thanks. all opinions taken.
PS its not chapter one. this is after he's been there, this is the first actual combat. just a couple little dramas with the locals he's getting used to before this.
PS - he spent 12 years in the 197th infantry in the sandbox wars. He was a tough guy after he got out and got betrayed and murdered. he woke up in the transmigrated world. He's him. he thinks like himself, all his experiences, everything. But, he isekai'd into one of the girls that wasn't really there in the head, all the girls know is that she just "woke up" and started talking one day. "she" does everything like a guy, and I get humor out of it. "she" just works out like a boxer, lol. The girls think shes "dancing" when she's shadowboxing,lol. To him, he feels like he's in a little "flyweight" boxer's body, instead of a light heavyweight. No trooning, no contact, nothing like that. I totally play it straight. he's about to find out there's lots *more* just like him there, and they're all getting grouped up and will discover each other. as you read, it reads like a guy warrior,lol. She has his 1000 yard stare from the war, and his serious blank face that's scary. In a recent chapter, I got humor out of her getting drunk with the vilage elder. he knows what she is and he thinks he knows why he's there.

>>24995324
lot of words to say "I'm trans btw"

>>24995319
these titles are always a fucking lie
>HOW I CONQUERED THE WORLD FORM THE COMFORT OF MY HOME DOING NOTHING AT ALL SLOW LIFE EASY PEASY
>it is in fact not a slow life and he leaves home

>>24995314
This horrid mindset of dividing your writing into stiff blocks of "action" and "character development" and treating them like sugar and salt will only result in terrible things.

>>24995314
Fight scenes are boring and I usually skim them or outright skip them.

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>>24995297
Nyo

>>24995324
as you read, its all fun and games until someone tires you out and buries an ax in your skull. the character, spent 12 years boxing, growing up. Then went off to the sandbox ward, another 12 years. then some years in the bad part of the city, with a dangerous job. He's actually *sick* of fighting his whole life.

>>24995327
not, but project all you want. like when you're dead you get control over where you get isekai'd into which body. I get humor out of it, and during action, even I forget its not a guy hen i read for editing. I don't know, I just see all these female warriors in all these games, and thought it would be a kick. Now that said, I dont care who reads it or why as long as they click on it. if you read it? that link. You wouldn't even know its not a guy.

>>24995337
If you're dreaming about being shoved into a woman's body and think that's not trans, you should probably go on a journey of self-discovery, chief.

>>24995194
>even when they're wearing a skimpy dress with no pockets.
Where do they hide the glitter!?

>>24995439
it is their sweat

>>24995337
>You wouldn't even know its not a guy.
So it has a few jokes in the first chapter then nothing? No worries about periods or guys wanting to fuck him?

>>24995439
victoria's secret compartment duh

>>24995448
jokes, not at first. it starts out dark and heavy. his death as a hard-boiled private eye comes at the hands of two female unlicensed detectives he uses to work on cases. the one accepts a "hit" out on him for cash. She recruits the other one, who comes and tells him. take the cash and play along he tells her. At the meet, the loyal one? Pops him in the back of the head, then on the ground. Isekai. When girl are chasing him in the new world he comes to in, he's in *no* mood for girls chasing and cornering him. He take a rock to the head of the leader girl and is about to kill her. When he figures out he's in a girl, seeing himself in the water at the fountain he freaks. He took over the body of a girl that's basically I imagined a pretty young teenage girl, but she's profoundly autistic. flaps her arms and hums. When she "wakes up" (him) you get some "girl drama", but... he was a boxer, so he don't pull hair. I guess the only "joke", is he has to remember to squat to piss lol. Thanks for he idea, forgot menstruation. I can work that in. First person, so I avoid the whole "he-she" thing. His body gives him no feelings for girls, go figure. The mentor and the one girl know. There's no other guys around, but when it happens and one tries something, that guy's going to be in for the shock of his life. I plan on some humor when the others "waking up" like him are brought together. Like I said, I wrote it and when reading it, I forget its a girl sometimes. I know I see all these anime images and girls in games warriors, and wondered how "hard" I could write one. Here's a paragraph or two, next post. I write it as serious as any epic fantasy hero.

>>24995330
I don't think my writing is blocky, I write what comes naturally but I look back and think there's been a lot of talking and walking in the last 10k words and I wonder if that's ok or not.

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>>24995448
"See with your own eyes. The Chikara. Do not touch."

They looked like young girls. But their faces, didn't. The eyes were drawn scary. Their faces, looked like angry men. They looked intimidating. They were in what appeared to be armor. They had weapons. One held a severed Akuma head up for the people to see. Her weapon in her other hand. There were circles drawn around parts of them. Some, had these halos around their hands. Others, all around their bodies. There were body parts of what I took to be chopped up Akuma, strewn everywhere. There was nothing left standing, the entire place looked like a wasteland.

I stared for a while at it. Put men's faces on them, different armor and uniforms, rifles in their hands. The utter destruction around them, bodies all over. And those faces and eyes.

It wouldn't look unlike the 197th, after a battle was over.

"What does this say, Suki."

In an after battle trophy snapshot, it would later get a title. Mine all had 197th Infantry labeling it. I wanted to know what they called themselves.

"The people, called them the Chikara. But this, is what they named themselves. Though the people, did not use their own name. And, I do not know what it means."

"Can I just hear it, then."

"the... Sah, Moo, Ree. That, would be close."

I feel a little sick. Is it because I'm not well yet, just up and moving around. I'm sure that's a part of it. Perhaps the wine. I'm much smaller now, and I've never drank at all. And I all but chugged two large cups of strong wine, I'm feeling it. And again, I'm sure that plays into the feeling as well.

But I know there's more to it.

This idyllic, peaceful place. I'm finally back home, in some way. I know love and acceptance, and tranquility once more. But some monster came, and I killed it. I can't get away from what I am. I can't even die to escape from it all. There's no heaven for me. No hell, either. Not even a great nothing, I could just be gone. I'm going to have to go through this all over again, I can sense that.

God, the great Chikara, and whatever the hell the next place calls it. I'll never know peace. This, will never end. I'm in some other time and place, and they have it all as well. They had their great world war, it seems. I can't even kill myself to get away from it all. I'd just wake up into the next war. Some other time, some other place. Some other body but it will never change.

It must be like this everywhere. You read the bible? Heaven itself. There was a great war there, too.

Earth. This place. Even Heaven.

Is hell the only quiet neighborhood, where a guy can relax and enjoy the afterlife.

>>24995572
Yes, this is the kind of writing that comes naturally to ADD-riddled zoomers who can't find meaning in living and fall asleep if someone isn't beaten to death every 5 minutes.

>>24995575
almost refreshing to see this kind of basic weebery really, a genetic throwback to a simpler time

>>24995650
I'm saying my writing does not have that.

>>24995332
no seoul station necromancer, no reincarnator

do you think the next great web novel will come from /wng/?

>>24995873
Yes. It's called Gu Zhen Ren.

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>>24995873
no

>>24995873
>next great webnovel
Speaking of, what is the webnovel canon? Who are the greats in our field? Should we be telling the newcomers to start with the chinks?

>>24995901
Most will get filtered by poor translations, even though the best Chinese works are head and shoulders above everything else.

>>24995873
I think it will come from AI

>>24995901
Mother of Learning
Reverend Insanity
Invisible Dragon
Sword Art Online (SAO)

>>24995901
>Who are the greats in our field?
This question is controversial anywhere but especially on 4chan since the site is even more contrarian than regular people are (who are by nature themselves obnoxiously contrarian on average)

Personally I would just make a list of what I see others talk about most & what sells best and has the most readers. My personal favorites don't tend to line up with public opinion though (as no one's here would)

>Should we be telling the newcomers to start with the chinks?
Why would we? MTL prose is repulsive to most readers. Globally speaking stuff like LOTM has the most readers of any web novel, but if you're talking about the English-reading sphere, I guarantee more people have read and talk about stuff like DCC, PH, MOL, so on

>>24995901
>Who are the greats in our field?
Find authors who found a gimmick and then inspired many people to copy them.
if you cannot trace the origin, pick the most famous version of the copy.
Every time I see portals and a guy who specially uses a dagger, I think of solo leveling.

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>>24995928
>invisible dragon

>>24995940
>invisible dragon
You're right that poison is probably too strong for a newcomer. Pick a Korean novel and then we'll have equilibrium.

>>24995928
>>24995930
>Not putting Worm in recommended
ngmi

MLA was posted 6 months ago and has the 6th most followers on the entire site
Why can't a /wg/er do that?

>>24995945
Worm is a gateway web novel for trad fantasy readers, but in the actual sphere of web fiction it's probably not even in the top 10 of popularity

>>24995946
I will

>>24995950
Yeah? How many fanfics did people write for <your favorite wn>?

>>24995957
You would be floored by how many wormfic authors either have not read worm or read a bit of it and dropped it
The fanfic scene for that story is honestly fascinating, and you're right, it probably deserves a mention on any 'greats' list for that alone... but everything I said still stands. The story itself is not that popular (when speaking about all-timers).

>>24995964
You know I think I'm wrong. I went and checked out Worm's comment sections to try to get an idea of its popularity and the epilogue chapter has more than 1,000 comments

People don't talk about it much anymore, but I guess that's because it ended a while ago, and that always drops discourse off a cliff

If a story ends, can it even really be called a web novel?

>>24995964
it is just a superhero comic (a bad one) in writing

>>24996031
All writing is just a better medium being done worse in prose

>>24995964
I know, and it's a bit of a meme,.but the quality fanfics you'd actually want to spend your time on are usually written by actual Worm enjoyers

>>24996042
Fair enough, that is why the most important english literature is a stage play.

>>24995986
yes...?

>>24995964
I generally assume that half of all fanfic is written by people with little familiarity to the original work.

>>24996462
>I generally assume that half of all fanfic is written by people with little familiarity to the original work.
You can't do this with worm fanfic.

should i read worm? i only read cultivation web novels.

>>24996529
it's not a cultivation story

>>24996529
No.

>>24996529
>>24996533
fortunately there's at least one fanfic by famed fanfictioneer ryuugi which crosses over worm and xianxia:
https://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/worm-xianxia-sect.989803/

>>24995986
If a story doesnt end, can it be called a story? The most basic elements of a story are the beginning, middle, and end.

>>24996529
> i only read cultivation web novels.
Ask yourself why. Is it the setting or the constantly escalating power leveling? If it's the latter then Worm is most definitely for you.

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There are a million subversions of the 'hero/demon king' setting but are there any orthodox writings of this setup? I never see any where the protagonist is just a hero that goes on an adventure, it's always some lame harem leveling cheat subversion' these days.
Do any good traditional yuusha novels exist? Ashen Mage is the closest to what I'm looking for in terms of adventure and writing quality but even then it has the two subversions of TS+the MC being the mage party member, not the yuusha. Highserk is also good but it's still a subversion.

>>24995666
This might well be my first straight out compliment on my writing. I'm touched. Thank you, anon. One more rung up the ladder for me.

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>>24992485
Who will write the next Brothers Karamazov as a webnovel?

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>>24996724
ahem...

>>24996683
Just play Dragon Quest or any Final Fantasy game.

>>24996683
usually they end with the tragic death of the hero, they were never meant to be disneyfied self inserts

arthus, siegfried, achilles all die

berserk is pretty close to a real hero story even if it is technically anti hero

>>24996683
>TS+the MC being the mage party member, not the yuusha
Mages can't be heroes?

>>24996886
no, they can be shoehorned in but really double know
doesn't fit the archetype

you can have a mage protagonist but not a hero

>>24992552
>Examples being...?
Someone who has morals because being bad is bad?? Those fucking 4channel edgelords I swear to god.

>>24995575
The prose is not bad at all, and plain good for self published standards. I'd put an interrogation mark on questions, but it's more of a nitpick.

>>24996683
>Ashen Mage
what's with Koreans and genderbend anyway

>>24995901
Nowhere Stars but newfags are not acquainted with mahou shoujo. It's much better than mediocrity like MoL or generic cultivation trash spammed for 6+ years like RI.

>>24996895
>what is a good person?
>uh… THEY’RE JUST GOOD!!!!!
Objective morality has been dead for hundreds of years nigga. You’re going to have to try harder than that.

>>24996939
i can feel the pedophilic aura radiating from this post

>>24996683
>never see any where the protagonist is just a hero that goes on an adventure
Yeah it's unfortunately rare, when I first got into chinese webnovels this was what they provided, though they had their own tropes and downfalls. Now 99% of them are lame harem leveling cheat subversion garbage too

>>24995901
Lord of Mysteries
Got Dropped into a Ghost Story, Still Gotta Work
(slight quality gap)
Mystical Beast City
I’m an Infinite Regressor, But I’ve Got Stories to Tell
Became a Failed Experimental Subject
(larger quality gap)
Surviving Among the Entities
Beginning After the End

I can't think of anything else that I'd call objectively good other than these unless the umbrella expands to cover fanfiction. 3p omniscient vp was good until it got bad at like the halfway point. Kidnapped dragons was also good until it wasn't.
There was one elf story but it's only in chinese and the ending was mediocre compared to the brilliance of what came before
'No To Being the Suffering Heroine' has some kino moments that you can't read anywhere else
Maybe 'I Come From the Abyss to Save Humanity Today' if we're being a bit generous
There was one gumiho webnovel that was alright if you exclude fanservice but I forgot the name

>>24996976
>random newfag offtopic commentary
I hope you get those urges fixed before they intrude upon your real world.

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>finally get human feedback I always yearned for
>completely get fucking demolished
>rot in bed and no longer feel like editing or feel anything in general

>>24996939
Mahou shoujo just rarely gets written these days outside of subversionGARBAGE like mahoako in general
In the west, at least - the koreans are still strangely fixated on it, but their stories all suck or are smut.
Actually, there was 1 (one) korean mahou shojou that was really really good at showing a SoL aspect, but I lost the name when the site I read it from DMCA'd, sob

>>24997010
Honestly, I feel you gotta be a real otaku to 'get' mahou shoujo because it hasn't really been relevant in quite some time lol outside of like Madoka which is still 15 years old.

>>24997034
Actually, I take that back. I never got into it but I think PreCure is still ongoing and huge?

>>24997041
Yes, PreCure still lives

>>24997045
PreCure has a more lighthearted and happy tone versus sad and depressed, right?

>>24997048
I think so, yes. Somewhat like pokemon is my impression of it, though I've never watched an episode.

>>24997052
Gotcha. The essence of mahou shoujo atmosphere and what it stands for is its own discussion but I admit that if normals had any introduction or knowledge of magical girl then it would (big guess here) be PreCure since it's the biggest <current thing>. Or maybe some Sailor Moon they watched as a kid.

>>24997010
Nowhere Stars and the like are inspired by the subversion stuff.
I don't see the point in playing Mahou Shoujo strait when it was literally made for little girls.

>>24997052
It's shonen for girls
Power of friendship and love and just be yourself and bla bla

>>24996971
who's a good edgy boy? You, you're a good edgy boy!
*pets you*

>>24997079
NS gets heavy at times and could be its own thing outside of mahou shoujo. Same with Carl's books with similar themes.

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>>24997059
>The essence of mahou shoujo atmosphere and what it stands for is its own discussion
Yeah, like any piece of writing or genre there's so many components that goes into it that you can't really differentiate them adequately unless going by hard distinctions such as tone, era or basic premise.
Stuff like madoka and sailor moon were the first popular subversions iirc (drastic tone shift) and most other contemporary/subsequent works these days are influenced by self-reference or subversion to some degree, else they risk being bland and one dimensional from treading the same steps as their predecessors due to being made for little girls as >>24997079 mentions.
In the west at least, I think that Sailor Moon is still the most popular mahou shoujo. I don't hear precure referenced at all.

>>24997096
I would like to add that I enjoyed the bit of Nanoha that I have watched, and I really need to get around to reading Cardcaptor Sakura, as far as other popular magical girls go.

We /mahou shoujo general/ now.

>>24996911
>The prose is not bad at all, and plain good for self published standards.
rough draft, not edited yet. thanks.
I'd put an interrogation mark on questions, but it's more of a nitpick.
no, nitpicks are fine.

>>24996729
>>>24995575 (You)
>The prose is not bad at all, and plain good for self published standards. I'd put an interrogation mark on questions, but it's more of a nitpick.
kinoman. look, at, this.
>>24995575 (You)
The prose is not bad at all, and plain good for self published standards. I'd put an interrogation mark on questions, but it's more of a nitpick.
(don't blow my cover, kinoman)

>>24996999
pretty much every writer has been rightfully shit on while learning
be strong

>legally download "Of Dog, Volpir and Man: An Out Of Cruel Space Story"
>harem is meh but at least it's sci fi sorta
>MC is a 55 years old man
seriously? And of course a special force badass relic because why not

>>24997096
Yeah Sailor Moon is already a departure from what a traditional MS is and it's the only one normies know, and often they only know about it second hand because of something like the Star Guardian League of Legends skin line

>>24997137
writing music, writing books, artists.
you learn to take it on the chin and keep chugging along, or you can't do it. Nobody was good at their chosen art, the first time they tried it. Every new artist is dreadful. Its part of the curve. Ever see a famous a-list actor, and during a roast they show their early or worst work? They laugh at themselves and join in making jokes. Its part of the whole deal.

>>24997086
it's for pedogooners

>>24997170
Maybe it is now but not originally
>>24997148
This sounds like something a German or Czech would write

>>24997183
From his Amazon bio, dude is reddit and an obnoxious boomer at the same time:

Eric Wesson is a lifelong science fiction enthusiast and former US Marine who escaped active duty only to find himself working for the Air Force as a civilian.

His unending mission is to deliver to you, the people, upbeat, energetic, pulse-pounding and grounded military sci-fi action with strong romantic themes. Brave new worlds where men are men, women are women, little green fuzzy creatures from Tau Ceti VII are little green fuzzy creatures from Tau Ceti VII and everyone can be a hero if they work for it.

Despite persistent rumors, Eric is definitely not a sentient house cat operating a human-shaped mech suit. Any evidence to the contrary is purely circumstantial.

When he's not writing science fiction, Eric can be found... writing science fiction. And when he needs a break? He writes something completely different. He resides in the Great State of Texas with his wife, two dogs, and an ever-growing collection of unfinished manuscripts.

You can find more of Eric’s worlds on Patreon, where he shares free lore articles, background stories, and setting details for readers who want to dive deeper.

criticism has literally never helped anyone

it's just bullying under a fancy name

>>24997227
Hard disagree. Unless you have an inferiority complex, or too much pride, well intentioned criticism can only help you improve, even if you disagree with it. If criticism feels like bullying, your sense of self may be tied too closely to whatever is being criticized, and you should take some distance.

>>24997304
nope, it doesn't work and is just an excuse for people to shit on somebody

>>24997227
trvth nvke!

>>24996724
I dont know, but I'm writing the Don Quixote webnovel.

>>24997308
I've gotten a lot of constructive criticism in my job and I genuinely enjoyed it because I could improve. But then again 4chan is not the most positive place so if you're experience with criticism is on here I get where you're coming from.

>>24997227
helped me

>>24997227
some segment of the public comprising your demographic you're writing towards, is going to give you brutal take-downs. Its inevitable. Its going to happen more if your work carries any controversial aspect. Learning up front about this fact of the writing world, and getting over it, is essential. You learn to take a net negative and fashion it into a net positive. More broadly speaking, bullying serves a sociological function. Peole that are teased and freak out, wil get bullied for that. Its the group testing the members, seeing which are tough and can stand up under pressure, they can be relied on. Most social mammals do this. Its colloquially called by humans a shit-test, and if its test-passed you move up in the hierarchy. Its instinct. You can think of it, writing or IRL bullying, as a boxer showing he's not a pussy.

>>24997322
>>24997320
nope, you're just justifying your own abuse like a battered housewife

>>24997324
>actually, lying down and taking the abuse is good! You should be a cuck that says thank you when someone shits on you.
Slave morality runs deep.

>>24997326
I can give you a pre-criticism piece and a post-criticism piece if you like
I improved alot as a writer due to criticism, some even owed to /wg/

>>24997326
hope for your sake you're baiting desu

>>24997227
It's like scoring in games. It lets you get a feel how you performed and adjust accordingly. Having others be the measure is a bit more unreliable than that, but it's better than nothing.

>>24997336
>some even owed to /wg/
(pulp fiction voice)
"that's a bold statement, anon."

>>24997331
>>actually, lying down and taking the abuse is good! You should be a cuck that says thank you when someone shits on you
half decent bait. yet it could stand improvement. but seriously, anon. we're not talking about physical abuse. We're talking about *words*. That's what criticism, both constructive as well as abusive really is. w-o-r-d-s. When you sperg and flip, you look either just as bad as the crab, or worse, you look even worse. A tle of two writers, and which one looks superior to theother when both get bullying over-critical nonsense. The one who laughs it off and ignores it or says something witty and moves on? Or the one that flips out like a little bitch. So this is either substandard bait, or you're one of those people that are so inadequate they buy into this whole "dude, I gotta be alpha" bullshit. Nothing to be gained and everything to lose by whining. Now get some better bait. Or grow up and quit thinking like a ten year old. FFS, you got to be over 18 to post here, kid. act like it. *adults* who freak at teasing from little kids? Look like retards. Adults ho laugh it off and make a joke and ignore the kid, win. I won;t even send you a bill for this useful advice, like Tate would. Which is the tier that this shit comes from.

>>24997227
It's helped me when it's come from intelligent people. One time I wrote a kid's horrible singing was like a strangled cat, and a guy said "it's cliche and not funny." And I thought about it and realized yeah, I wasnt trying to be funny anyway, I was just being lazy and wrote the first thing thay came to mind, and it was cliche. And since then I've been avoiding cliches like that, turning them over and turning them into something new.

Another useful writing bit was when someone pointed out a short story had no conflict. I knew it wasnt working, but it wasnt until I heard that critique that I understood what was wrong.

But when I get critique like "your story should have lesbian representation," or "I found these misogynistic jokes that were very clearly jokes to be horribly offensive," or when you get some faggot who's just hate critiquing little quips like "do better" and "come on," then yes, it is just bullying.

>>24997403
spare your sadomasochistic bullshit, faggot

>>24997413
Please don't reply to him. Just wait for him to break a rule and report him.

>>24997409
By definition the things you listed aren't critique or even proper criticism, they are just whining or bullying. Critique is pointing out bad AND GOOD things with the intent of helping others produce good things in the future. Unmitigated shitting on something isn't critique at all.

in most things getting schooled by people better than you is a great way to improve. why is writing somehow different.

>>24997454
It's not, but people get really attached to their first creative works and think criticism of the work is criticism of them, partly because they made the rookie mistake of "expressing themselves" in the work rather than just trying to be entertaining. 50% autism/aspergers, 50% problem caused by modern art academies (since roughly the impressionist movement).

crybullies always shit their pants when called out lol

>>24997442
critique is just critical observation
nice or cruel doesn't come into it

>>24997413
I'm sorry. I'm an anon. I get my opinion. that's simply that. not lowering myself to debate that.

>>24997413
really intelligent comeback. you must resemble my remarks. how is it that you get some pronouncement from authority. because you dont.

You retards are getting trolled

>>24997471
What I'm saying is that
>this sucks and you should kill yourself
Is not critique at all.
>this sucks >this is great
Is critique to the most minimal extent
>this sucks because you fucked up x y and z and you did a b and c alright but instead of doing x y and z like you did, do it more like authors g h and k
Is good (valuable) critique.

>>24997699
vapid comments are never critique, regardless the tone
if you've ever been to a workshop then you'd know to resent both
>this sucks
>this is great
equally
critique is critical observation. judgements on the quality of the work aren't in themselves critical. there has be an attempt to communicate the reasoning behind that judgement
>this sucks/is great because [reasoning]
is critique
since personal experience is subjective and a lot of how readers feel about writing is how they experience it, it's good to include your personal feelings. this also should be explained
>your writing made me feel bad/good
not critique
>your writing made me feel bad/good because [reasoning]
is critique
what differentiate good critique from bad is the precision of the observations and how well they're reasoned. not all reasoning is equal. saying a piece is bad because it's not diverse enough is garbage critique

>>24997758
Even most properly argued critique is useless because people are stupid, inattentive and barely literate.
>this sucks because the text says they went out, but how could they get out when nobody opened the door, did they teleport or what?? I'm very intelligent
>dear reader, the underlying assumption is that they got out normally by using the door since none of them was injured in the process
>the author can't take criticism! looks like I hit a sore spot when you got so desperately defensive lololol

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Making a cover for my next series

>>24997909
people who think and talk about plot holes are some of the dumbest mouth breathers on the planet
never listen to cinemasins posters

>>24998109
Arcane Ggar

>>24998209
I’m doing a fancy logo design

Why do koreans all write their female leads so shit? All entitled and self-absorbed, it's exhausting to read. Are the writers masochists? Awful.