Animal New Year Edition>Old:>>24990171>Recommended reading charts (Look here before asking for vague recs):https://mega.nz/folder/kj5hWI6J#0cyw0-ZdvZKOJW3fPI6RfQ/folder/4rAmSZxb>Archive:https://warosu.org/lit/?task=search2&search_subject=sffg>Goodreads:https://www.goodreads.com/group/show/1029811-sffg
I BELIEVE I JUST HAD ANOTHER NEAR RINCEWIND EXPERIENCE
How do we make fantasy good again?The bar feels like it’s only going to keep dropping over time as fewer young readers go back to older fantasy titles. With Sanderson being the most popular modern author right now his style is inevitably going to shape the next generation’s influences.
>>25000196>How do we make fantasy good again?first we have to identify the problems
>>25000196Grow up and move on or write with younger people in mind. You have seen the mountain top and it was a short mountain, but you keep wandering it anyways, chasing the dragon. People are supposed to enjoy fiction and then move on, letting it consume our lives turns it into a terrible thing when it should just be happy memories from a better time, youth.
>>25000196Stop making it "epic" in length and number of PoVs. Bring back sword and sorcery style action.Bring back good prose.Burn GRRM and Brando Sando from your mind.
>>25000231The fantasy market now is written more with young people in mind than ever before, hence 'YA'.
>>25000247Yeah, for good reason.Older people get more satisfaction out of ideas books like conceptual science and philosophy. Because eventually most of us realize these things are actually the most interesting about fiction. The morals, desires, failings, things about the human conditions. Possibilities, warnings, metaphysical traps, and so on. Fiction is great for introducing these trains of thought but seem a little condescending to us as we become more knowledgable and wise ourselves. Isn't it so? That is at least what I observe in myself and think I observe in many others.Write for young people and direct them to larger ideas which you think are important to the future. Or write more intellectual pieces for them to monkey branch to. Maybe then future generations won't get so damn stuck in the same mire we found ourselves.
the damage has been doneit cannot be reverted
>>25000242I think the problem is the leaner and more focused your work the obvious your shortcomings as author are. People don't take pulps seriously, but there was some REALLY good writing in those.
>>25000277Recommendations, Anon?
>>25000224Fantasy especially has become ridiculously incestuous. It's time to look beyond other fantasy works for your inspiration.
>>25000281I think that is a very reasonable first step.
>>25000281This is absolutely true, people have become unable to think outside of other works. This also applies to sci-fi sadly. It's hard to find works that don't heavily borrow from older, better titles. All the larger modern works like empire of silence or even red rising borrow so heavily they are only original at all very far into their stories. It's a symptom I think, movies suffered from elevator pitch syndrome, where you have to explain a whole movie in 15 seconds, so people defaulted to "x movie meets y" or "x movie with a twist" or "it's like x, but [insert some style]". Now it applies to books. "It's dune, but with a splash of GoT" or "hunger games into wh40k lite, with ancient greek salad dressing". It's an economics issue. Authors have to either bend their stories and ideas to get mainstream published (like red rising) or just be utterly creatively defunct and hope people will still care when it "gets good" 5 books in (like empire of silence). Hopefully people start self publishing or royal road publishing shit they like to write and it catches on. It's why I have some respect for web novel general. Despite the material being utter crap, you at least see people writing what they want.
>>25000159I want to memorywipe my total Discworld experience just so I can experience the awe and wonder again. Fuck this non-flat earth and it's pratchett-less surface.
>>25000224Identified (it's chuds)
>>25000305I actually don't think it's an established publishing problem. New authors simply want to mix and match all the elements they like from their favorite works.
Can someone help me find a book? I remember reading it some time in the mid 2000s.Pretty sure it was book three in a trilogy, young adult fantasy? Was pretty thick. I remember the opening scene being maybe about a shapeshifter in a crowd? And the main plot was a quest to kill an evil wizard king, maybe? I think one of the main characters was a dwarf.Pic related is my recreation of what the book cover maybe looked like. Thank you in advance.
>>25000370Sadly the description doesn't fit at all but the cover instantly made me think of Dragons of Summer Flame, good luck on your quest
>>25000363It’s not just a book problem. These days a lot of movies, anime, and manga just recycle the same old popular tropes with probably one or two new gimmicks slapped on. Older works did this too sure but they usually had enough originality to really hook the audience
>>25000380>These daysEh. Back in the old days, European theatre consisted of improvised plays with stock archetypes in stock scenarios that everyone recognized. There wasn't much pursuit of novelty in the days of antiquity either, their plays and poems dealt with familiar figures and events, competing only in the skill with which the familiar stories were told. This was a time when literacy was lower and memorization was key, so of course there'd be less interest in novelty.With literacy rates falling, we're just reverting back to that.
>>25000402with the rise of audiobooks oral narration is making a comeback as well
>>25000380lol no they didn't, you are simply ignorant of the sources they stole from. Your complaint is literally just that you are old enough that now you recognize the majority of where authors took their ideas, whereas stuff from before you were born utilizes sources too old and obscure for you to recognize for the most part. Authors have ALWAYS synthesized from various influences going back thousands of years. You think Homer was "original"? HAH
>>25000349This but replace the guy on the right's head with a gigachad
So at the outset of his journey here Frodo is kind of a little chud
>>25000440read the daily gondor
>>25000447
>>25000449
>>25000452
>>25000152Speaking of which, are Assassin's Creed novels any good? I see they're a mix of prequels and novelizations.
>>25000447Frodo's main takeaway from Gandalf's ring narrative is that Gollum should be tried and executed, he also remarks upon his frequent fantasies of dragon attacks on the Shire, as that would to the stupid and dull inhabitants "some good"
>>25000485
Can any present LotRheads inform me what of the middle earth stuff post Silmarillion is worth reading?Unfinished Tales/ History of ME/ the Christopher novels? Bit confused by it all
>>25000514Children of Hurin
>>25000514They're basically collected fragments of Tolkien's own writing.
>>25000478>shadows is the only one to not get a novel
>>25000454>>25000452>>25000449kek
>>25000000
wew, what a stinker. Is Starfishers any better or should I just accept that he peaked with Black Company and Garrett and move on?
Finished Black Company (aside from newly released books).The way they killed Kina was really anticlimactic. Dunno if I wanna push for new books, especially Port of Shadows.
Friends. I recently discovered that my Words of Radiance is a 1st edition 1st printing!YES!
>>25000196My Pillars of the genre were influenced by their experiences, mostly religion and war, Tolkein, Wolfe, Herbert, hell even Edgar Rice Burroughs fought in the civil war. Sanderson Mormon isn't pulling from any of this, Martin is a draft dodger, modern authors have nothing organic to pull from, so they just subvert Tolkein. It's tiresome, boring, and won't be remembered. That Gillian Anderson looking youtube lady was absolutely right about depictions of evil in modern literature.
>>25000739Steven Erikson went on archaeology adventures in Mongolia, is it a coincidence that he's the best modern fantasy writer when he's the only with experience of anything exotic?
>>25000750It's not coincidence anon. Honestly, I haven't read Erikson, do you think Malazan will have the staying power as some of the previous authors mentioned?I think the central more ubiquitous moral themes are what separates the genre classics from the modern writers that just push for subversion or verbose world building.
>>25000790>do you think Malazan will have the staying power as some of the previous authors mentioned?I don't know. Malazan has limited appeal due to the length and complexity of the books, and the sheer impossibility of proper adaptation since the budgets such adaptations would recquire would be on par with an Avatar movie, Malazan will never be mainstream. Of course, Wolfe is hardly mainstream either, has no adaptations, and large parts of his ouvre are completely forgotten (show me someone who has read Castleview or The Land Across lol) and his enduring legacy is mostly built on a small fraction of his works. Malazan can't be broken apart that way, so it will only stand if people are willing to read all of it.When it comes to moral themes though, there Malazan has most of its contemporaries beat. Erikson (and Esslemont) interrogate these things pretty thoroughly, with compassion winning out at the end of the day. I feel Malazan has seen its heyday already unless something changes drastically.
My fucking queen
>>25000790>do you think Malazan will have the staying powerNot him but I think Malazan is going to be looked at like LOTR a hundred years from now. Not like mainstream IP (a possibility maybe) but people discussing it and dissecting it for decades.
What is it with Lit RPGs using "The System"? I'm pretty sure I've come across five that use the term just recently. Surely you can come up with a better name for the thing your setting's magic revolves around?
>enjoy sword & sorcery>only ever allowed to discuss Conan and Malazansadfrog.exe
>>25000822Because that's the genre and the term has been in use since its inception.
>>25000830that is not true
>>25000822It's like using "credits" for your futuristic currency.>>25000825You're allowed to talk about whatever you want! Do so!
>>25000790Malazan is a very theme focused series especially in the last few books. A large chunk of the fanbase just wants sappers going kaboom (which is honestly cool as fuck) so those later entries filtered a lot of those readers outHell he even sacrifices some character works and plot momentum just to prove a pointI think the series has real staying power
>>25000822This made me remember when that chigger Tao Wong tried to copyright the "System", even going so far as to have some other author's works removed off Amazon completely at the time.
>>25000839Lol one of the few scenes I remember from the last few books is when the sappers made that dragon go kaboom from eating explosives
>>25000839I have to say, the few scenes of sappers going kaboom in No Life Forsaken felt like going home after a long time
>>25000840I remember that and that it backfired, his 'success' tanked afterwards. It all turned out similar to what happened to Aleron Kong when he tried tried to copyright 'litrpg'.>>25000834What part? 'System' is now a trope has been around for at least a decade as a word, maybe even much longer. Hell, I think even SOA used it.
What books feel the most like a 90s point and click adventure game? Besides oficial adaptations like I Have No Mouth and The Discworld ones I mean.Bonus points if It came out during the 90s aswell.
>>25000478They're all poorly written, but the Unity novelization complements the game nicely since it's from the perspective of Elise and fleshes out her character. However, the US version of the book randomly included references to Arno and Elise cheating on each other, which I assume was a result of the editor's barely disguised fetish.
>>25000852You know, a part of me suspects they did this because they had a feeling they would tank soon.It kinda reminds me of something I heard about power fantasy isekai novels, manga, and anime. Apparently, most of them start with a decent-to-good-sized audience, but their reader/viewer numbers fall off a cliff much more suddenly than in other genres. Apprently this is due to how interchangeable they are.
speaking of video game adaptations i'm reading the Silent Hill novelizations, the first one is okay so far. you get a couple of brief POV switches to other characters, like Cybil running around the town trying to find a way back to Brahams. and Dahlia gets her own brief intro, foreshadowing how she's chasing "Cheryl" around town. there's a couple of little changes here and there, like a lot of the video-gamey stuff is removed, Midiwch Elementary has all its puzzles removed in favor of Harry just kind of breezing through the high points (boiler, clock tower, the call from Cheryl, lizard boss fight). Dahlia also tries to pass herself off as a Christian by claiming she knew Harry would arrive "from our Lord" rather than it being "foretold by gyromancy". it's interesting how it goes a bit more into Harry's psychology, it really goes out of its way to explain how he's just this kind of dad-bod work at home author and not some kind of commando. his first encounter where he has to kill a Mumbler is traumatizing to him as a father. and it goes a lot into his worry over Cheryl, constantly afraid that she's been taken by a monster or kidnapped by some weird sex pervert, i guess this was the height of 'stranger danger'? i will say though it feels like it's only written for people who played the games because the author puts no effort into describing the Otherworld at all. his description of the Otherworld Midwich is weak, you'd think it was just a little messy compared to the other one and not a rusted over hellscape suspended over an infinite black pit. which i guess is understandable writing for that audience, but usually adaptations at least make an effort to extend some information about the setting for readers who randomly pick up the book not knowing/caring it's an adpatation.i started Silent Hill 2 but i wanted to go back and finish SH1 first, i didn't realize that SH1 and SH3's novelizations were translated when i stated SH2.
>>25000816The fantasy book industry and animation industry should work together like in Japan. Adapt the first book in animation and see how well that goes. Anime and manga are mainstream in the US.
>>25001000shiny objectism
>>25000836I feel it's more like using mana for the energy your magic runs on. But even that feels a bit better than "The System," though it doesn't help that most of these stories use both.
>>25001010As it turns out, instant gratification isn't very good for building long-term interest.
>>25001009TV Execs will never go for it. In their minds, animation is either for kids or Family Guy/South Park clones, and they heavily prefer completely episodic shows. The best bet would be Netflix and other streaming services, but they've cut back on their shotgun approach.
>>25000933I just watched a video yesterday that said Richard Sala's comics are like Grim Fandango and Monkey Island. He's got, 2 books, Night Drive and The Chuckling Whatsit in print right now republished by Fantagraphics, and they're originally from the 90s.
>>25001019if Netflix gets their hands on WB i wonder if they'd be smart enough to lean into that given the DCAU stuff used to be so good.
>>25000242>>25000196this. Bring back the standalone novel.
>>25000739>That Gillian Anderson looking youtube lady was absolutely right about depictions of evil in modern literatureDo you have the link?
>>25000817sniffs with zara...
is this good?
>>25001469ouroboros is not a worm but a wyrm which is a form of dragon
>>25001491oroboros is a snake
>>25001495wyrm
>>25001469Yes
>>25001495Translate draco please
>>25001006I played only the fourth game, I like SH atmosphere, but never liked its plot, although the plotline with the cult (SH1 and SH3) seems interesting, but I really never liked the plotline with the guilt (SH2).
>>25000370The Dragon King, part 3 of the Crimson Shadow trilogy by R. A. Salvatore?
>>25000370>>25000377DnD novels have many such covers:Dark Knight of KarameikosDragonking of MystaraArtefact of EvilSaga of Old CityPool of radiance The year of rogue dragons seriesetc
>>25001507draco=snake
>>25001565And what else?
>>25000152The Sword Saint - Empire of Salt #3, C.F. Iggulden (2019)The Sword Saint is another fast paced and tightly plotted entry in the Empire of Salt series. Much of what I wrote about the second book applies here as well and I don't want to excessively repeat myself. Suffice to say, the good times roll on. Read on if you want to know more, but it's not really needed. If you've read the first two, you already know what you're in for and this won't change anything.The book, and the series as a whole, is somewhat like a speedrun, though more as a display of the skill required to get through everything so quickly and yet still be enjoyable. The major downside to this is that there's simply less to read. I've been left wanting more and for now and maybe forever, there simply isn't any. There's also the issue in that there's simply not enough time for sufficient build-up for me. I'm overlooking that because of how great the action is, but it does feel a bit anticlimactic. Introducing a new country, warlord, diplomacy with multiple countries, war, and a siege while developing several characters separately and trying to provide some backstory is lot to get through in a relatively limited number of pages.I'm glad that the characters from the first and second books were brought back even though I felt it was more to create awesome set pieces than for organic story reasons, especially the choices a few of the characters make. It leans very hard into Rule of Cool and indeed I found it very cool. I'd probably have a lot of criticism if I didn't think it was so much fun from start to end. I did though, so I don't feel the need to criticize all that otherwise would.This time the viewpoint characters are more like a special forces squad than anything else. The action has them be more like an overpowering force of destruction than combatants of similar power for the most part. In that, it leans more into the power fantasy aspect again. I was almost expecting it to go along the style of Dynasty Warriors or Ninety-Nine Nights. It doesn't go quite that far, but it's definitely a story of the few against the many. The antagonists aren't able to put up nearly as much of a fight this time. I found it to be a bit funny really how they even came to power.My one minor disappointment in terms of content is that there was one character who I expected to do more, but maybe he's only what he appears to be and there's no deeper secret. Maybe it'd be in a future book if there ever was one. I hope there is one day. Each book has created several more threads that could each be their own book. As for the series overall, I had a wonderful time, but it's far too soon a parting. There's too much left unsaid. After having read all that's been been published of the Penric and Desdemona and Murderbot novella series, it's made me want to have more like that and I think it could be applicable to Empire of Salt.Rating: 4.5/5
>>25001605My plans for the rest of this month and maybe longer are undetermined at this time. I'm probably going to be mostly playing some games instead of reading, but I may surprise myself as usual and ending up reading a lot. There may be some trad pubbed western stuff now and again depending on how I'm feeling, but as previously stated I'll be focusing on other stuff for a while and I may even post it in /wng/ rather than here. That's to be decided.
this nobody without a channel on allen's stream said he was gonna try to get an ARC for daniel abraham's next book in the Kithamar series. is it easy getting ARCs? you just gotta email asking for it and they'll send you?
>>25001592?
>>25000790>Honestly, I haven't read Erikson, do you think Malazan will have the staying power as some of the previous authors mentioned?Malazan's problem is it's actually divisive. People love it or hate it, usually basing their feelings on the very first book.
>>25001654I've gotten DRCs from that series and read them and then wrote about them. I've also posted about my experiences with Netgalley more generally.ARC = physical DRC = digital
>>25001009>The fantasy book industry and animation industry should work together like in Japan.Funnily enough a Japanese animation approached RJ to adapt A Wheel of Time into animated movies but it fell through. Wonder how the current landscape of adaptations would look like if it actaully happened and it was successful
>>25001605>>25001612your """reviews""" are SHITFUCK OFF
>>25001831Probably not any better than other similar that have been made.
>>25001840Be sure to follow me wherever I go.
>>25000196https://fantasyhandbook.wordpress.com/2024/05/14/romantasy-science-fiction-and-the-publishing-gender-gap/Fantasy sucks now because the target audience of young autistic males is now subliterate. I used to be able to go to a Barnes and Noble and find cool-looking fantasy novels, now the entire section is covered with romantasy trash because there's no longer an audience for good fantasy. My generation and the generation beneath it have fried their brains with vidya, and even vidya are getting dumbed down.>My son, age twenty-three, lives in a house filled—over-filled, one might even say—with books of all genres and categories, and he reads none of them.>None of them.>He plays video games. Exclusively.Grim.
>>25001333I think it was this one https://youtu.be/4cv659HLRUg?si=JE3E4GAyoGu9rV23
The reading chart is useful, but is there a reading chart in there (I didn't see one) that I could use to fill out my book shelves to impress nerdy women. I have been working my way through the alt scene chick pipeline lately, and I feel embarrassed by my empty shelves (I usually just pirate) but I also know that a lot of stuff will just give them the ick. I am looking for stuff that'll make them make pic related. I assume that terrible Gideon series is up there.
>>25002003It doesn't matter if you're being sincere or trolling. That won't help.
>>25002006I am being 100% sincere. I've been able to get laid, but I know that my empty shelves are pure "Male Living Space" and filling them with the stuff I actually read would truly scare the hoes.
>>25002008I pity your performativity.
>>25002011I'm sorry, man. Actual nerd culture makes me grimace, but I also only can get aroused for those types of autistic women.
>>25002018Because due to the lack of social skills and awareness they're easy to manipulate? Well, ok, have fun preying on vulnerable autistic women.
>>25002024It's actually because they have hobbies. Do you know how fucking hard it is to find a woman who has an actual hobby? Their hobbies might be cringe and shallow, but at least they have them. I got burned out so badly on TLC women in my early 20's, and I know for a fact it's only gotten worse since now they just watch schizo TikToks. I'll take the nerdy women any day of the week.
>>25001942Oh sweet thanks
>>25002003>>25002008>>25002018Listen and understand: women do not give a fuck about what a guy reads, they're attracted to their face, height and frame. And this still applies for autistic/nerdy women too who have the same base attractions that other women have.Chad can have a bookshelf of nothing but "red flag" books like Infinite Jest, Pynchon, Mishima, Fight Club, American Psycho or whatever, and girls will think its quirky and interesting. But an ugly manlet can have her perfect library and she still wouldn't want him. Attraction is not based on what's in their bookshelf ffs.If a woman is remarking about, she already wasn't attracted to you, and is just using that as an excuse.
>>25002036>Listen and understand: women do not give a fuck about what a guy readsLast year I slept with three women from the same book club. So, this just isn't true.
>>25002043this doesn't contradict with what I said at all; they were already attracted to you before they found out what you read, not because of what you read; that was just a conversation piece
>>25001942Liking the video so far, but metaethics is one of my hobbiestrying not to get too triggered by the privation theory stuff, it's like she's speed running all my common gripes, lmao I don't actually think most writers have a concrete theory of morality, so it's not they write stories like that *because* they are moral anti-realists that just seems false, right? Most people have not spent time thinking about this, learnt the specific langue, etc It's going to be a lot simpler, that people copy what's in vogue, and currently the things she critiques are in vouges. So her points stand.
Guys, please recommend me a good middle-grade fantasy series to give to my nephew. He liked Harry Potter but didn't like Percy Jackson.
>>25002049>that was just a conversation pieceWhich is what the books are for.
>>25002067ok, and chad doesn't really need to read those books or have them in his library, he can nod along and still hit at the end of the night
>>25002062The Cradle series.
book that has this kind of dynamic?
>>25002159The one I'm writing
>>25002159Chronicles of the Black Company. Just ignore that she wants to fuck her father figure and everyone else in the company is holding back from wanting to do the same to her.
>>25002162i am going to read it........
>>25002159Didn't love the book, but I immediately thought of Between Two Fires
>>25001526SH2 only sounds hacky today because it's the favorite of hacks to try and imitate. the game itself is very well done, very beautiful story. lots to dissect and analyze. SH1 and SH3 are a little more clear cut but the occult stuff is cool.>>25002062Eragon comes to mind, maybe the Darren Shan series though it's more urban fantasy with vampires and stuff.
>>25001526How do you know if you liked them if you didn't play SH1-3?
>>25002056>I don't actually think most writers have a concrete theory of morality, so it's not they write stories like that *because* they are moral anti-realists >that just seems false, right? Most people have not spent time thinking about this, learnt the specific langue, etcI think you answered yourself, but these writers are the product of influx of moral relativism, they don't think about it because they're the boiled frog.I mostly just agree with her in regards to the dilution of what evil is. When we muddy what evil means, we also lose what it means to be good, then what's the fucking point of anything. The moral grey characters are just too forgettable, uncompelling and far too common now. I haven't really studied this, even as a hobby, just dwelling on religion and literature and my frustations. If you have a recommendations I would be interested.
>>25002195and yeah i know you said "good fantasy" but he also liked Harry Potter
>>25001312This is paramount. One of the first things I look at when checking out a sci-fi or fantasy book is if it is part of the series. Bring back 60's, 70's, and 80's stylized art, 180-300ish page bangers. Tight prose and descriptions, escape from modern vernacular, sword and sorcery approach towards combat, ethics, women.I have exhausted roughly 10 different new age sword and sorcery publications and almost all of them are pozzed out the ass. It's so fucking unfortunate. At one point I found some website that supposedly only published e-books of non-woke scifi and fantasy but the entire concept, while probably necessary, just seemed cringe but in the opposite direction. I wonder if any of it's good...I tried googling to find it again and failed..there were at least 50 titles up though.I did see that there is a Paladins of Vance series of books by Spatterlight Press that includes book 2.5 of the dying earth (written in 2024) and 4 other novels that are under this publications 'series'. Anyways I bought all 4 of them to see if they are any good. They're supposed to be written in the Vancian style so it's worth a fucking shot.
>>25002159This kinda has that dynamic, though it seems most of the time this happens in the book, the girl is some kind of hoyden rather than a cinnamon roll.
>>25000825that book cover lowkey looks like one of those DAZ3D porn comics
>>25001312Broke and starving authors can't write standalone books anymore. They all need the multi-book series so they can stretch their book advances over years.
>>25000650we could have told you not to read this. oh, well. live and learn.
>>25000650That title reads like a joke
Reminder to report and ignore newfags like >>25001840 who actively contribute to off-topic discussion and have been spamming off-topic for literal years.>https://warosu.org/lit/thread/21311319#p21323327>>25002062The Pendragon Adventures. Everworld.
>>25002360Passing WindA fart empire chronicle
>>25002423 Please, every toot and turd must be chronicled for the good of the empire
>>25002003Sadly Rothfuss is the one girls like.
>>25001881Got this book from a local author, I think its available on Amazon but idrk. Its def not romantasy tho, so maybe he might like that.
sort by pagecount on your to-read list and start your year off by reading the longest books
>>25000196Start making anime and video game adaptations of older titles to draw in men. All would-be fantasy authors should have a big interest in world history, language, fairy tales, religion, and mythology, and read non-Tolkien fantasy BEFORE they start typing shit up.
>>25002515Japonese people don’t give a shit about western media. They would rather adapt the 23210th isekai tittle or another battle shounen garbage than engage with westernslop
>>25002539Because they have the same problems we westerners do when translating THEIR works. It's no wonder they retreat to their native literature bubble. .
Thoughts?>Sadly, science fiction has become dominated by slop. The very idea that science fiction is "genre fiction" is a permit for the slopification of SF.>Here are some suggestions to escape the SLOP MINDSET and help scifi join the New Renaissance.>1. Don't talk about science fiction as "genre". Talk about science fiction as a tradition or movement.>2. Replace the term "franchise" with "mythos". Lord of the Rings is a mythos, not a franchise.>3. Ignore metrics like "box-office" and "downloads". Look at what new scifi actually means to people.>4. Never be content with content. If you can't swap the word "content" for "culture" without laughing that's a lesson in itself.>5. Stop consuming. Start critiquing. The whole point of this community is to make that shift possible by creating the space to critique.>6. It's not Entertainment. It's Art. There is no entertainment industry. There is just a really shitty art industry that is failing at making art
>>25000478>Assassin's CreedThat really reminds me I could go for some more of that Ancient Greece historical fiction. >mfw choosing the "good guys" the the Peloponnesian War
>>25002629you a faggot or homo? that's the choice.
>>25002622Kinda true, but I think it'll take more than just changes in diction to reverse the direction of sci-fi. I recommended a book a few messages up from yours, Reprimand. It kinda tickled my brain for the philosophical concepts it drew from its premise of a war with mars. Its KDP published, unfortunately, but it feels like indie. So I wonder your take on differentiating indie sci fi from the AI sci fi spam that's drowning out most KDP book sales.
>>25002622Pseud nonsense
>>25000816>large parts of his ouvre are completely forgotten (show me someone who has read Castleview or The Land Across lol) and his enduring legacy is mostly built on a small fraction of his worksI think that is more damning of the readership than anything.
>>25002622Is this ai slop, critiquing ai slop?
Human civilization peaked in 2022.
>>25002159I’ve found, I’ve found that I actually hate this dynamic, that I’ve found I hate this dynamic, and the new anime, the one that came out, the one that everyone loves, the one that came out that everyone loves, that had this, that had this, it didn’t appeal, did not appeal, to me, to me, I just, I just found the little girl annoying, the little girl always trying, always trying to be cutesy, to be cutesy in a way that is cloying, cloying, that makes me realize I hate this dynamic, that I’ve found, that I’ve found I hate, this dynamic.
James 'Sexual Assault' Corey
>>25002691why do you type like this
Can I get a qrd on the meme about Cook and Erickson somehow being extremely popular GOATs? Is it like the new Bakker thing but more subtle?
>>25002806>extremely popular GOATsnot really. like one anon said their thing is they're very divisive and people will give up quickly on both of them.>eriksongardens of the moon is a massive filter most simply cannot get through>cooksome inherently cannot stand his writing style because it's very to-the-point
>>25002806It's no meme, they are simply highly rated by a lot of people.
>>25002806no one cares about either of them in any fantasy circlemost readers are into sanderson or rf kuang or pierce brown or similar authors/sffg/ and r/fantasy barely represent the mainstream audience
>>25002811Wish Cook wrote more about first taken. Kinda sad that half of them gets like one or two sentences and then its just mention of them dying.
>>25002824we might actually find out more about them in the tabletop rpg game that's coming out soon. not written by cook, but I suppose they at least checked shit with him before going full fan fiction mode. three pieces of fiction they've released so far specifically feature those taken who didn't get any attention in the novels.https://theblackcompanyrpg.com/the-faceless-man/https://theblackcompanyrpg.com/nightcrawler/https://theblackcompanyrpg.com/moonbiter/
>>25002844I read it, it just doesnt feel the same.
Does anyone else get the feeling they've read all the good fantasy stories and now they're just picking at the leftovers?
>>25002888No, I keep disocvering new things seemingly endlessly. This applies to most of my hobbies.
>>25002891Just new things, or new good things?
>>25002896New good things, duh. Wouldn't bother otherwise. Though when I say "new" I don't necessarily mean "recent", just things new to me.
>>25002811What confuses me is that they both are, for good or bad, quite niche, and only well-known among some circles of fantasy enthusiasts. Average reader is very unlikely to ever hear of either - no accolades, no adaptations, minimal media presence, few editions of their work none of which ever made bestsellers, and hardly any other author ever mentions them. But the last dozen or so threads gets into this larp that they are somehow critically acclaimed mainstream pillars of fantasy with massive recognition and influence. Like, what? >>25002813>by a lot of peopleThis lot of people, is it in the thread with us right now?
i am glad to be a newfagI’ve still got a library full of hundreds of older books to dig into for the next one or two decades
>>25002912Are you saying they're NOT critically acclaimed?
>>250028881. You haven't even read George McDonald2. Maybe it's time to graduate to real literature for grownups (science fiction)
>>25002917I am, what about it?
>>25002925
>>25002888No. You should read more than two books a year, and consider extending your range of selection from what appears on some normalfag-approved bestseller list.
>>25002928
>>25002888I guarantee you you haven't. It's just likely you've only heard about works that have some sort of reputation.
>>25002928Are yo asking me for proof of absence?
>>25002978The AI has spoken, checkmate meatbag!
>>25002912The question is do the kind of works they are appeal to your average reader.
>>25003001Obviously the answer is yes, especially for Erikson if you go by number of books sold.
>>25003007What number?
>>25003015Damn, I don't have to think for myself at all with these AI results3 million is around the same that Pynchon's books sold back in the 70s
What are some fantasy premises/ideas that you'd like to see realized that you think haven't been executed properly yet?
>>25003047I'd really like some fantasy focusing on Oyakodon.
>>25003051What? Some chinese cicken and eggs dish? I don't get it
>>25003055It's a euphemism for a threesome with a mother and daughter.
>>250030263 million is not ever reaching up to the ankles of Riftwar, His Dark Materials, Pern or the Inheritance Cycle, and those have independently reported US sales, not self-reported worldwides. Still, nobody in this thread would ever tongue Feist's, McCaffrey or Pullman's asshole this way. And I'm not even the one to bring up sales numbers, you just slided towards those after failing to name any influences, awards or recognition.
>>25003064Ah... hot.
>>25002423>>25002441kek
>>25003069Well maybe that's just because Feist, McCaffrey or Pullman don't have enough relevance to have dedicated shills and dedicated haters interacting in every single thread lol
>>25003105That's the whole thing - neither did Erickson. Until very recently all of the sudden.
>>25003116>EricksonSteve Erickson is a very different writer from Steven Erikson...
>Argue about relevance while fully aware that none of these authors will be comparable to sanderson ten years from nowmany such case
>>25003136But with how bad Wind and Truth was, the Sandersonian conversation has turned more critical.
sanderwhosanderwhat
This thread is now under a blockade by the Trade Federation until such a time as dues are paid to writers less known! Each of you must have something to contribute that is rarely talked about in these threads. You cannot simply read what everyone else in the thread reads, right?For example, as a kid I read this thing called Over Sea, Under Stone. It was like a kids' version of a Da Vinci Code style conspiracy treasure hunt, that then evolved into actual magic and supernatural stuff in the sequels.
