How does the average gamer and he average reader compare in terms if intelligence and knowledge? Do the "great works" of gaming compare to those in literature or even its mediocre ones?
>>25013947>1.About the same.>2.Better in some aspects, worse in others. The strong point of games is interactivity, not storytelling.
Gamers generally have higher IQ than readers as even the most popular games such as Fortnite or LoL require you to be thinking about a lot of different factors, whereas with books, at the end of the day you're just looking at words. Everyone can read Ulysses but not everyone can beat The Witness, for example
>>25013947Depends on what we mean by average reader and average gamer. I would say that between the people I know who read much and the people I know who play many video games it is obvious who I'd call more "intelligent".
>>25013947Obviously reader. It's made even more obvious by the number of threads lately where some anon says how shit some classic is before soon revealing that 1. they simply didn't understand what they were reading, and 2. are a gamer who for some reason can't help but reference some shit game they like to play
>>25013956Gaming is a very different medium from literature. While certain games can include the contents of other mediums to different extents, like Disco Elysium in OOOP, which is text-heavy and thus in some way literary, cutscenes in games technically being film, and soundtracks being music just like any film score is, what defines the medium of "game" is its interactivity, and the "great works" of gameplay-heavy or gameplay-only games are entirely incomparable to other kinds of artwork.Minecraft is a Great Work of multiplayer gaming, but how do you compare it against Paradise Lost? Gaming is a medium that creates spontaneous pseudofictive experiences in the first person. Multiplayer games generate actually living experiences more similar to theatre improv or sports than anything else,
>>25013947Judging by the game in the picture, I bet the thing the redditor started reading after Disco Elysium is Estonian 19th century tranny erotica about actors from Vanamuna theather meeting in sheds to core each other anuses to invite the Estonian spirit - merely a scatonecrophilic Jeet demon - in.>>25013980>Kiddie games are better than books that require abstract thinking and holding patterns in your headYour brain after the Estonian meme game. Everyone can get Elysium because le based superficial teenage level Internet memes. Everyone with patience can beat the Witness since it requires trial and effort and patience - it's a kid game, after all. All games are.Not everyone, almost no one in contemporary times, and especially the gaming dalit caste, can get, without Grok, why Ulysses is called that way. And no kid can actually get Ulysses because it's a book that requires life experience and intellect enough to ponder about life and a dopamine system sturdy enough for reading and thinking, something the Bing Bing Wahoo and le wacky "literary" pol meme game destroy. Gaming is detrimental to attention spans and deep thinking. In its essence, it's the perfect Pavlovian trap: hit buttons; get result. As far away from any form of serious thinking - mathematical, logical, literary, symbolic. I won't be surprised if there's a connection between downward IQ trends, low literacy, shallow and emotional thinking and gaming.
>>25014030>how do you compare Minecraft to Paradise Lost?I hope this is a bot
reading is a very low IQ activity.the majority of readers being women is proof of this.
>>25013947gamers are smarter because women read
>>25013980The fact that /lit/fags don't immediately see this is proof that it is true.Reading does not require understanding, as evidenced by all the posts on this board.
>>25014094I mean even if you wanted to say Milton utterly triumphs over Notch, as I'm sure you'd be inclined to do, how would you construct that argument? What criteria for 'quality' do multiplayer sandbox games and literature share? It's like asking if A Hundred Years of Solitude is better than Basketball. This isn't necessarily a rhetorical question. Are games art and do games even have common ground with literature?
>>25014090>it's a kid game, after all. All games areEven Rapelay?
>>25014090Interpreting "classics" is a waste of time for neets and/or kikes.
I made 2 games and I would say that the "average gamer" is a barely sapient subhuman, seeing how they often fail to understand even some very basic systems in videogames. As to how literature's greatest works compare to gaming's greatest works? I don't know, I'm not even sure if it's fair or logical to compare them that way.
>>25013980pretty good bait I guess
Should have put this here.>>25014229
>>25013947I am a reader and I am a gamer; I am intelligent and I am virile.
>>25014516who have you been reading lately? so that I know who I share the board with.
>>25013947Gamers can fuck you up unlike /lit/ virgins. Don't mess with them.
>>25013947Others have answered your question, so tangentially related, I hate how Disco Elysium has become this unquestionable, infallible standard for a segment of gamers. The game’s quality is not in question. I genuinely loved the story’s humanism and it’s mechanic of filtering and contextualizing information and choices based on a psychological profile, but the community is filled with people who genuinely believe the only thing holding back video games is that they are video games and not something else. It’s a me of the most condescending and sneering attitudes you can have, and I believe that there are times where this spills into the game (perhaps vice versa). An example is when you examine the King’s statue and claim the vandals were cool in a nihilistic way, and then you psyche responds with some pretentious quip about how artists are immature and implying critics are more that standard. Which all comes across as too cerebral.
>>2501394799% of games have writing and storytelling comparable to books written for middle school children, even the "story-driven" ones are only praised for their writing because gamers never open a single book aside from like, Mistborn or some other redditoddler shit. DE just so happens to be barely above average in terms of storytelling, so it looks super high brow and intellectual to all of the illiterates
Silent Hill 1, Silent Hill 2, Silent Hill 4 and Signalis are better horror works than any horror book. I mean, I love Ligotti, Lovecraft and Poe but there is only so much you can go from "imagine the existential dread of the unimaginable!" and creating depressing atmospheres.
>>25015759A lot of it is also the pseudo-french and overt marxist theorizing, even if it is the bare minimum, carrying the whole thing.
>>25014163I was about 14 when I played it tbf. I would expect better from an adult (male).
>>25013947>Do the "great works" of gaming compare to those in literatureDepends on the examples, but in general: no>or even its mediocre ones?Oh hell yes. Even a fucking fighting game story has better story and characters than your average YA/Romantasy/Sanderson slop.
>>25013947The average gamer and the average reader are comparable in intelligence. The average gamer probably has an edge in knowledge because the average reader has been exposed to esoteric nonsense they consider deep, and is too submerged in Plato's cave to see how brainwashed they are.The above-average average reader has the above-average gamer beat on both accounts (intelligence and knowledge), because at that point, there is a clear difference in interplay between creator and audience. The reader will seek to discern the author's world view and reflect, whereas the gamer is only looking for a greater high from his immersion, and is at the mercy of the game developer as his sensual enjoyment is prioritized over his intellectual stimulation. And so, the above-average gamer is more of a monkey compared to the actualized humanity of the above-average reader.Most people on this board are average readers (they will attack my blog post). I am far above average (and will not respond to plebs).
>>25015818Games being an interactive medium means horror games work especially well.
>>25015818Silent Hill 3 mogs Silent Hill 1 thobeit, casual.
>>25015818>Signalisoverrated troon slop but yes games are by far the vest medium for horror
I can't wait until VR movies become a thing.
>>25017329Visually and technically, yes; everything else SH3 is just a boring epilogue to SH1 with no new ideas, interesting themes or even horror on par with the rest of the original games. Its story and characters are too straightforward, there's no mistery, but it's the most fun game to play and the one that makes people less anxious.
>>25013947Games stopped being about storytelling a long time ago. They're more about mechanics. Apples and Oranges. Doesn't mean MGS as a whole isn't kino as fuck.
>>25013947Each medium has its advantages. IMO, for movies it's dynamic images, for literature it's abstract concepts, and for games it's agency.
>>25014030Storytelling in games should be compared to dance, not literature
one has a better vocabulary than the other.
>>25013947Art is about reducing “the world” into a simpler abstraction without data loss in compression. That is what art is. That is what the first cave scratching of deer were.There’s a balance struck between depth. and economy of content/abstraction. Games do not, in general, try to do this. In fact they are almost always seeking to do the opposite for its own sake, to simply recreate reality and reduce nothing unless it’s forced by technical constraints. Le simulacra&simulation. Even in other cases, movement in the screen and by the player have this effect. But, building a scale model is not art. It’s craft.
>>25013980This, it's that age old question again.Who has the Higher IQ, a Math Major, or an English Major.
>>25017726Both are low IQ today.
>>25017727The penchant physichuds have for rattling off their resumes like private equity fags at every conceivable opportunity really makes me think it’s probably not them.Anyway, thanks for the long boomer post circuitously complaining about black people. I’ll put that 45 seconds on your tab.
>>25013980What about people that do both? I have a Steam account and a kindle account. I don't think they're mutually exclusive. And yeah I've played The Witness.
>>25015853Yet its at the core psychology of all reproduction, imagine that.
>>25014090You're giving him too much credit. The redditor in question enumerates modern science-fiction writers, Vonnegut, House of Leaves and a couple of NYT Bestsellers as his favorites. Arguably the only half decent positions on his list are Frankenstein and Brautigan's Trout Fishing in America. 19th-century Estonian erotica sounds fascinating in comparison to what he's actually reading.What's even funnier, he used to be null at his previous primary hobby as well:>And truth be told, in most cases, my own lack of skill often locks me out of progressing through games, even in story mode difficulty.What compels a person like that to write a long-winded post to humblebrag in front of internet strangers is beyond me.
Portal, The Return of Obra Dinn, some Brendon Chung games, Outer Wilds, Edith Finch etc all utilize the medium for narrative as ingeniously as the best of literature.
