>read some marx>i like his approach, his interpretation of history and social formation through a hegelian lens>look up different socialist orgs>it's all trannies, furries, retards, lepers, faggots, jews>none of them seem to grasp what marx was saying much less the broader sweep of german idealism, hegel, their influence on postmodern pragmatism etc>totally kills the hope of any vigorous political movement or awareness related to or founded on marxist critiquewew that ruined it for me. never again. guess the unwashed masses need another few hundred years to catch up still? i get that marx explicitly said a revolutionary theory wasn't strictly necessary but maybe this socialism stuff is just too complicated for your average retard. maybe that's why it never worked out. people are just too fucking stupid.
It's called "bioleninism" and it's been a complete disaster for the Left.
>>25149767bio-anything sounds like the political economy equivalent of whataboutism it's just too benignly focused on some specific thing which is incidentally only known or extrapolated with a kind of scientific realist pretense anyway which is unmistakably bourgeois although i'm not necessarily arguing against 'science' when i say this just the form of it that even makes such retarded observations about human nature as the result and not the cause of biological reality of which only the latter is really true
>>25149757People nowadays are too comfortable. The fact of the matter is that westerners, yes even poor ones, have it better than most everyone in the world. No sane person is interested in revolutionary ideology and even those who espouse interest in Marxism/socialism/communism are wannabes who glom onto those ideals because they're ~progressive~ or cause they think communism would enable them to make a living on drawing diaper furry porn (or not working at all). It's hard to uphold or care about common class interests when even the lower classes have more creature comforts at their disposal than a Medieval king.
>>25149757contemporary "lefist" politicians got money from george soros and his "open society foundations" to spread liberal crap and associate it to socialist and general leftist movements.
The working class are too well off and have too many opportunities for advancement to want to overturn our capitalistic system. In Marx’s day 30-40% of workers made a bare subsistence wage, per his own statistics. Our poverty rate now is more like 10% and even in the States we have better social welfare. We are still getting completely screwed, destroying our planet and culture, but the ol’ surplus value line won’t get you far with the modern ‘proletariat’.
>>25149815Take away A.C. and refrigerators then you might see some interest in revolution
>>25149845Even back in the day the working-class were never the ones really interested in Marxism. Have you noticed that almost all the communist revolutionaries tended to come from the bouregoisie? They were lawyers, teachers, academics. Actual working-class people never seem to be particularly interested in what Marx has to say.
>>25149757The contemporary inheritors of 'Marxism' are upper middle class 'champagne socialists' that advocate for the lumpenproletariat in opposition to the actual proletariat.
>>25149856I had to come to terms with the truth that an intellectual vanguard will always be required for revolution because the proles are sadly just too proudly and willfully ignorant to know what's best for them.
>>25149863>y-you idiots just DON'T UNDERSTAND!Yeah, how can the proles be so proudly and wilfully ignorant of the glorious history of communism?
>>25149887ironic that you use that pic. pol pot was "supported" and china was "encouraged to support" the khmer rouge by american politicians. just like with many other genocidal regimes.
>>25149856In russia, the intellectuals certainly had a major role in where communism would go, but they were not the first nor the only group to aspire for it. Before them you had the norodniks which was an assortments of groups from different social strata. We should also remember that the first sparks of the revolution began with the enlisted members of the russian navy, not exactly a bourgeois stronghold. More generally, the base of support came from the Russian workers in urbanized society but there was a great deal of skepticism from the peasants in the countryside.
>>25149930>but there was a great deal of skepticism from the peasants in the countryside.And the Bolsheviks carried out violent purges of them so their skepticism was justified.Even today I see commies and leftists talking about dealing with "the Kulaks" and it freaks me out. I know what that means, and the fact that they're still saying shit like that with a straight face is why I simply feel like I can't trust any communists.
>>25149757I assumed he just wrote about how important racial minorities and gay butt sex are.
>>25150109It's going to be bloody. And yes, a lot of well meaning people will have to die because they can't or won't shake off their chains and will fight to the death for their master. Yes, we will have to eliminate whole bloodlines down to the last root and stem because of who they are and what they represent. It's unfortunate but necessary.
>>25149859The 21st century proletariat will increasingly resemble hybrid anime-goth Discord avatars becoming the Walmart / downwardly mobile mass aesthetic default as regional accents and identities and culture vanish. All that is solid melts into air.
>>25150213glad people are finally realising this hideous aesthetic is almost exclusive to poors
>>25149757>furrieshey, hey, hey buddylets all calm downi aint with the rest of em
>>25150213fuck, i wish
>>25150217>I'm not like the other bitches
>>25150221that's right. we are race-realist ultraliberal neo-calvinists.
>>25150131
>>25149757Your fault, you should have looked for communist societies. My country's communist party is very orthodox and conservative
>>25149927He had the right idea about urbanites, academics and adulterers.
>>25149927>"encouraged to support" the khmer rouge by american politiciansAfter the Viets invaded Cambodia. Why not enable commies to kill other commies? It's a win-win for humanity.
>>25150213How do we fix this? My starting idea is that we just destroy the entertainment industry. You could probably wipe Hollywood out if Los Angeles caught on fire.
>>25151307you'd have New York to deal with then
>>25151284>we helped and might have even financed a genocidal regime after the american military lost the war and had to run away from vietnam, so the genocide is totally justified!!1I thought the commies were the bad ones? lmao.
>>25151497>"Americans forced us to commit genocide!"
>>25151307Wipe out Hollywood, and you destroy the most potent ally of communism.
>>25150109I don't necessarily think the skepticism was rooted in the new system but rather any move towards reform.The peasants were not even accommodating to previous reforms from liberals following 1905 or even before then. They largely only held a few things sacred, one of them being their religion and the subsequent view of the tsar as a holy man with a charter from god. Because of this, a lot of socialist revolutionaries (not bolsheviks) had to do a lot of groundwork to convince them otherwise. Although they had some successes, ultimately it didn't amount to much as the socialist revolutionary factions that were strongholds of the white army ultimately collapsed once the civil war was in full effect. More generally, I don't think small communities and especially rural communities lend themselves to be good models for contemporary politics. The communism vs capitalism discussion might as well be a discussion about mars or the moon are a more suitable colonial project. The peasants had a system that they were already attached to and only really wanted to free themselves of the communal debts to gentry/aristocrats that they had accumulated after they had been freed in the emancipation
>>25149810You just described historical materialism.
>>25149815>The fact of the matter is that westerners, yes even poor ones, have it better than most everyone in the worldNo. If they did, they would be stoic/buddhist fascists
>>25149815It's also just a fact that marxian analysis is completely worthless since workers are now the primary consumers and their interests are tightly wedded to capital. The only reason to be a non-tranny communist today is because you are a mindless chauvinist who think the word "burgeois" sounds somewhat feminine and you get a hard on for muscular men engaged in sweaty labor and, like a housewife, you want to pamper them whilst retaining their virility for the bedroom.
>>25151497It's just dialectics, don't worry about it.
>>25149863What's best for them is clearly being the fuckdolls of some nomenklatura elites who all look like old grannies that kiss each other on the lips.
>>25151533>americans never organized or financed any genocidal regime>we are innocent and have always been the victims, brosays the defenders of child bombers kek
>>25150223Holy based
>>25149757identity politics is legit a CIA op to kill socialist thought in the west, probably the most successful and crucial one in their history
>>25151629I never knew the non-sequitur could be an actual superpower. You should make a costume.
>read Marx superficially>have pre-existing cultural resentments reinforced instead of learning anything usefulMany many such cases. Mussolini, J Sakai, Lyndon Larouche. All have gone down this path, all neurotic liberals.>>25150213I read that article, vomit-inducing chud catamite buckleyite social climbing (and being broken up with) poisons what could be an interesting analysis. The name is also beyond retarded. I am of the opinion that the author should be killed by whatever Amerifat Peronist regime replaces the current one, not for the article but for running an "AI" startup.
>>25152750>only I understand Marx, the rest of you are kuffars
>>25149757We're very much in a revolutionary low tide. Most Marxist institutions and organizations in the west have eroded during the neoliberal era after the fall of the USSR. What was left retreated into a well meaning but mostly impotent academic scene. Even there it had to deal with increasingly liberal interpretations and theoretical frameworks. 'progress' or the prospects of a classless society were grand narratives that should be rejected. Class analysis was replaced with intersectionality theory. Franz Fanon was read as someone who analyzed the vibes of being black in a white society rather than a Marxist revolutionary. Mark Fisher is both the perfect embodiment and the perfect critique of that moment.Obviously any new revolutionary movement can and should not be repressive towards minorities, but the theoretical framing currently tends to be somewhat impractical and narcissistically concerned for those specific identities. I do think we are slowly moving out of that low tide now but its going to be annoying for a long minute more. Have patience and empathy i suppose.
How long will it take marxists to realize that their ideology is functionally dead and the elites have the social engineering and tech to ensure it will NEVER breathe again?
>>25149757>i like his approach, his interpretation of history and social formation through a hegelian lensYou really have to appreciate how ambitious Marx's undertaking was. I'm personally not that interested in modern Western "Marxist" movements, mostly due to the reasons you stated.
>>25152919>Most Marxist institutions and organizations in the west have eroded during the neoliberal era after the fall of the USSR... because Soviet funding was the only thing that kept them going.
>>25152974Yea, part of it was the falling away of the east bloc and the institutional backing it came with, part of it was the subsequent disillusionment among the Marxist institutions themselves, and a very large part were the very aggressively anti-Marxist and anti-labor policies of the now dominant western bloc: coups, assassinations, propaganda, well funded political lobbies, and so on.
>>25149927>BUT WHATABOUT ...And in a flash, the commie debate-switching tactic is deployed.
>>25153027>Perestroika was totally a CIA plot, man
>>25151925>identity politics is legit a CIA opPeople have been practicing identity politics since time immemorial, not everything you don't like is a CIA psyop designed to quash any "revolution of the proletariat," especially when you look at countries like South Africa and Zimbabwe, formerly Rhodesia if it can be called an offshoot of it. And most importantly, all politics is identity politics
>>25149757cringe communist faggot larper pseud.read real history by real modern historians looking at actual historical events in detail, rather then stupid obsolete 19th century german "grand laws of human events" theorycrafting.trans-marxism is real marxism.
>>25149930these people had nothing in common with faggot pseud larper OP and did not "like marx approach, his interpretation of history and social formation through a hegelian lens"they are completely irrelevant to the thread or to the topic of OP being a faggot subhuman as well as every other internet leftist subhuman going around larping with 19th/20th century obsolete stupid slop/cringe larp.
>>25151925just know that you are NOT cringe for posting this because the cool people on leftypol also post this.you REALLY ARE that cool che guevara mid 20th century third world socialist armed revolutionary badass and NOT just a stupid cringe internet larper faggot in 2026.
>>25149927pol pot was just taking many of the ideas that were current to the third world marxist tradition at the time and since and following them to a logical conclusion.>muh cia!kill yourself stupid worthless subhuman.
>>25150323how's your armed world revolution going stupid subhuman?
>>25152919bro it will be like the period 1880ish-20XX never happened bro. just marx theories will plug perfectly into the future and we can forget all about the total failures of all of marxist predictions and all of marxist political systems and states through all of the late 19th and entire 20th centuries.just fricking keep going around the internet posting "read kapital" no matter fricking what.
>>25153027if only it weren't for meanie cia we would be living in utopia now :(
>>25149757You will know them by their fruits...
>american high schools are dismissed for the weekend>thread turns into a 7-post chud textwall meltdownyou just cant make this shit up
>>25153297No the Perestroika was not a CIA plot, and not all anti-Marxist and anti-labor actions necessarily have to be organized by the CIA (although they certainly did a lot of the dirtier work).For example, the Mont Pelerin Society actively organized economists (Hayek, Friedman), philosophers (Popper) and various editors/journalists of main-stream media outlets (NYT, WaPo, Life) to collectively push a neoliberal line, bankrolled various big money institutions like i.e the bank of england and credit suisse. The point is that marxist institutions did not organically 'lose steam' in a vacuum. They were in a constant tug of war with very rich and powerful institutions for most of the cold war, and once they were on their own, they often had a hard time surviving.
>>25153361Every political system ever tried has failed miserably, but Marxism has not yet exhausted its vision for the future like the rest have.
>>25153400same as how every government research institution including every kind of company involved in satellites, geology, shipping etc support round earth theory. moneyed interests aren't the ONLY reason why flat earth theory has been marginalized in earth sciences academia and the wider culture but they certainly did a lot of the dirty work.
>>25153281>>BUT WHATABOUT ...are you retarded? there is a direct implication there, you brainlet.>>25153346>noo not the CIAread a book you illiterate retard
>>25153422battleship potemkin? chairman maos cultural revolution? fucking fresh as hell. that's the future right there.workers of the world rise up! so epic!
>>25153427There is no divide between the conspiratorial sounding 'moneyed interests' and an effective pragmatic theory for running world banks. The world banks are the moneyed interests. neoliberalism is effective *for them*, obviously not for normal people. ask any of the rust belt workers in rural america, or the various british post-industrial towns.
>>25153454those dumb fat losers have a quality of life and opportunities beyond the wildest dreams of anyone who ever lived in a communist society, except the party bosses. you know this.how are you fucking trannies not tired of larping as if 2026 is actually 1885 (1965 if you're more into BIPOC and do not care about the actual theories of marx)? how are you not tired of constantly regurgitating this fucking garbage, which has been destroyed so many times in so many ways that anyone knows it's bullshit, everyone knows the counterarguments and that they're valid.I genuinely do not understand the level of subhuman someone has to be to be like this.why don't you fucking stupid subhumans at least not try to find something else to larp & circlejerk with that isn't the reheated youth rebellion of baby boomers
>>25153432>cultural revolutionAs a classical liberal purging rent-seekers was arguably necessary to build a functioning state-capitalist society.
>>25153431>there is a direct implication thereYou mean about the innately repressive nature of communism, and the massacres that are its inevitable legacy?
>>25153400>The point is that marxist institutions did not organically 'lose steam' in a vacuumThe Soviet economy collapsed of its own accord, because its citizens didn't think the state was worth working for.
>>25153481Command economies don’t work, fat troonie commies are annoying, and yet Marx did explode capitalism.
>>25153509>Command economies don’t workthe amerifucks are switching over to a command economy right now. for example in housing, there are more sellers than buyers, but prices do not fall
>>25153509>Command economies don’t workcentral banks want a word with you lmao
>>25149927The only thing that can even indirectly be pointed to as America "supporting" the Khmer Rouge regime is its bombing of rural Cambodia during the Vietnam War, which converted some civilians into radicals and forced the rest into the cities, thereby allowing the Khmer Rouge to easily conquer the territories surrounding Phnom Penh. You do know that right after the Khmer Rouge took power they captured the SS Mayaguez off of Tang Island and killed dozens of Americans during the ensuing conflict, right? You do know that for the rest of Pol Pot's reign there was virtually no contact between Cambodia and the rest of the world (even other communist states had no idea what the fuck was going on), and that the very first statement President Carter made on the Khmer Rouge was a condemnation, right? For the love of God, we were backing the very government that Pol Pot overthrew, please tell me you at least know that.And this isn't even getting into the fact that Western Commies were actively denying or downplaying reports of genocide coming out of "Democratic" Kampuchea up to and even after the regime fell. Look up what Noam Chomsky had to say about it at the time.>>25150131And of course, the Khmer Rouge is an example of what happens when a communist state adopts this mindset. The "counterrevolutionary" pool gets bigger and bigger, going from soldiers of the previous regime to intellectuals to anyone wearing glasses, until the tide turns and the leadership starts eating itself, convinced that the reason their country is failing is because of traitors in the ranks.
>>25153706>You do know that right after the Khmer Rouge took power they captured the SS Mayaguez off of Tang Island and killed dozens of Americans during the ensuing conflictI'm sure the US would never sacrifice its own men to give a "enemy" force (like, say, ISIS) the opportunity to destroy its enemies.no, the US has always been honest and open about its intentions, and has never done dirty underground shit that they wouldn't admit even to this day. poor US, they are always the fucking victim.
>>25149757>vigorous political movement or awareness related to or founded on marxist critiqueYou are at least a hundred years too late for thatOrthodox Marxism was effectively killed by the '68 movements.
>>25153481>DA TROOONS out of nowhere/pol/tards are mentally ill
>>25149757That's what CIA did
>>25151925this
>>25151925nah marxists just tend to be fags
>>25149757Socialists and communists generally believe to have long since built over Marx's foundations and corrected his mistakes. It's silly to expect marxism to just be preserve din formaldehyde for two hundred years awaiting you specifically.>>25149810WHy do you believe that Human Nature causes biological reality and not the other way around? Also, what do you mean by Human Nature?
>>25150131trannies are attracted to larping as mid 20th century communists online because posting violence fantasies like this makes them feel a sense of power if only for a brief moment.
>>25153361>>25153363>>25153432>>25153481fascinating aspect of talking to chudlings ive noticed is that theyre exclusively talking to a quaint caricatures theyve constructed in their mind, and not to anything actually said. Like finding out you've been discussing a painting with a blind man.
>>25149757>it's all trannies, furries, retards, lepers, faggots, jews
>>25153728>schizophrenic posturing instead of an argumentI accept your concession.
>>25154241Is there an article or a book about that? I noticed all trannies have murderous wet dreams and want to eradicate their enemies, it's really odd.
>>25149757It's pretty easy to understand why communism, in our era, is indeed Capitalism vanguard. Since Capitalism is the world upside down, it's perfectly understandable that todays "communists", are in reality Capitalists agents. Here's a quote from Marx to clarify: "Money… thus also appears as a force of perversion against the individual and against social bonds, etc., which claim to be essences in and of themselves. It transforms fidelity into infidelity, love into hate, hate into love, virtue into vice, vice into virtue, the servant into the master, the master into the servant, stupidity into intelligence, and intelligence into stupidity.Since money, which is the existing and manifest concept of value, confuses and exchanges all things, it is the universal confusion and inversion of all things, and thus the world turned upside down, the confusion and permutation of all natural and human qualities."
>>25149845Yet the zoomer generation know that they won't have access to property, to savings.What are they gonna do, just accept? We will see.
>>25149863the vanguard always betray the proletariat. I mean we are at a turning point. Capitalism is collapsing under it's internal contradictions (valorization/devalorization). Yet there is no substitute mode of production available. Either the proles wake up, and Capitalism will collapse, and a new mode of production will be born, again based on exploitation and social class. Maybe the proles will chose to once again be a subservient class. In this case, they had an opportunity, and missed it. Maybe the future is not written, and it's the time, the next decades, for the proles to choose.
>>25150109Boslheviks are the worst ennemies of communism. Before fascism. History proved it, with the Kronstadt commune, where Lenin purged the workers wanted to self manage themselves. In Barcelona, the stalinists purged the POUM!And in the Budapest commune, it was again the bolsheviks, killing the proles, with the west validating.
>>25150115If you are not trolling, know that he said (Marx), the exact opposite.
>>25150131Well i'm not sure. These natural slave are followers. When they see that Capital cannot reproduce itself, due to the terminal crisis, and that their lifestyle suffers from it, they might turn the tide.They are only following as long as bread and circus is available.
>>25151573Well a slave is a slave, whether it be a manly factory worker, or a globohomo cashier. At one point, he starts to realize, especially if is hopes of a comfortable life are crushed.
>>25152935Social engineering cannot counter the falling rate of profit. It can only delay the waking up of the masses.
>>25153481Maybe because we marxologues have actually understood that Capitalism is doomed since 2008? I mean maybe if it was currently working, in 2026, we would promote something else than capital abolition? >>25153907>WHy do you believe that Human Nature causes biological reality and not the other way around?Human nature as something intangible is a fraud. Everything is evolutive, especially for human society. Indeed, a middle age knight, do not have the same social practice as a wall street trader. A knight was a manly man infused in bravery and honnor, when a wall street trader is basically a hedonistic merchant. Things change, when the mode of production change. >>25154259Leftoids are obsessed with minorities, rightoids are obsessed with hating minorities. Yet marxologues do not give a shit about minorities, and advise for Capital abolition
>>25149767you can call yourself a leftist support anti-labor open borders and be entirely pro-free international trade without a single iota of contradicting self awareness or peer rebuttal over the fact you are a useful idiot for global capitalism
>>25155660Except who were the first people to criticize the new left as Capitalism vanguard? The marxologues. See Jacques Elul, Guy Debord. Leftoids were always denounced for their contradictions by marxologues, since their very beginning.
>>25155678Criticizing is about all you lads do. You look down your nose at everyone, drone on in the most condescending way you possibly, and publicly devour your own over trivialities then wonder why no one wants to even listen to you much less follow you. Capital ain't your worst enemy. You are.
>>25155689>publicly devour your ownLeftists aren't our "own". I, personally, was never leftist. Not a single second.
>>25155689sir i am a post-hitler nazi
>>25155689marxists really are unlikeable. I dont think they realize how offputting and grating they come off as to the average normalfag. it seems to be a universal blindspot for them.
>>25155712Shalom
>>25155577>What are they gonna do, just accept? We will see.They already have accepted it. Maybe an extra 0.01% will turn to crime but this is already counted by police powers
>>25149757People can cope that it was different at one time but it never was.19th century marxism:>Resentful poors vs rich (despite the memes Marxism is not actually as simple as le poor vs le rich, but I’ll admit this is probably the closest it ever was to a true Marxist movement.)Early 20th century Marxism:>Resentful Jews and Slavs vs GermansMid 20th century and 21st century Marxism:>Resentful fags and non white third worlders vs straight white peopleThere has never been a Marxist movement that wasn’t primarily motivated by non-Marxist related resentment of some kind.
>>25150109The biggest meme is that Kulaks were the victims. Their entire class was inflated by the revolution and they fucking loved benefiting from redistributed land until the commie death machine finally came for them, as it always eventually does when it runs out of other people’s shit.
>>25151925Identity politics was always a huge part of Marxist movements despite the cope that there was once a purer time where people were more rational class-based actors or some retarded shit.Whether you were commie or anti commie in 20th century Eastern Europe was almost entirely determined by your ethnicity for example.
commies are totally the only ones that want to genocide people
>The two psychological tendencies that underlie modern leftism we call feelings of inferiority and oversocialization. Feelings of inferiority are characteristic of modern leftism as a whole, while oversocialization is characteristic only of a certain segment of modern leftism; but this segment is highly influential
>"Leftists may claim that their activism is motivated by compassion or by moral principle, and moral principle does play a role for the leftist of the oversocialized type. But compassion and moral principle cannot be the main motives for leftist activism. Hostility is too prominent a component of leftist behavior; so is the drive for power. Moreover, much leftist behavior is not rationally calculated to be of benefit to the people whom the leftists claim to be trying to help. For example, if one believes that affirmative action is good for black people, does it make sense to demand affirmative action in hostile or dogmatic terms? Obviously it would be more productive to take a diplomatic and conciliatory approach that would make at least verbal and symbolic concessions to white people who think that affirmative action discriminates against them. But leftist activists do not take such an approach because it would not satisfy their emotional needs. Helping black people is not their real goal. Instead, race problems serve as an excuse for them to express their own hostility and frustrated need for power. In doing so they actually harm black people, because the activists' hostile attitude toward the white majority tends to intensify race hatred.
>>25153706well the thing with Pol Pot is exactly where dialectics lead to but try convincing academics of that. that's not to say that Pol Pot had good reasons to do what he did, but the execution of it was beyond reproach.>>25156192thanks for that unrelated pic, found a new band.
>>25155655>this time it's really doomed broNo wonder you're all out of touch.
>>25151629>americans never organized or financed any genocidal regimeI mean they did finance the USSR and still fiance China
>>none of them seem to grasp what marx was saying much less the broader sweep of german idealism, hegel, their influence on postmodern pragmatism etcMarx didn’t predicate his theories on people believing or understanding them. He was a materialist and saw the organic movement of the working class as communism. Workers’ struggles are happening all the time across the globe, at every a second of your life, but social media has really distorted your understanding of the world around you. Actually talk to people with jobs instead of talking without them
>>25156523>People with jobsWorking at McDonald's or in an office isn't a real job
>>25156190No wonder why rightoids are NEETs. They are the opposite of oversocialization. On the other hand, who want to socialize with leftists, advocates of mass immigration and transgenderism.
>>25156523This. Marx actually was not an ideologues. I mean perhaps young Marx was. But old Marx, who wrote Das Kapital, described reality.>>25156621>Working at McDonald's or in an office isn't a real jobIf it wasn't a real job, the company wouldn't hire you.
>>25156488>muh generic statement from internet wanna-be nazis
>>25156887If your job doesn't produce material goods for your country, then it's a lumpenproletariat hobbysimple as
>>25157013You seem to not have understand what the lumpenproletariat is. Lumpenproletariat is different from service industry workers. Marx viewed the lumpenproletariat as fundamentally different from the proletariat, whom he saw as the revolutionary class capable of overthrowing capitalism. In contrast, the lumpenproletariat—comprising vagabonds, criminals, prostitutes, beggars, discharged soldiers, and other outcasts—lived on the fringes of society, surviving through illegal or semi-legal means. Their instability, dependency on the bourgeoisie, and lack of connection to industrial production made them more susceptible to reactionary manipulation than to revolutionary mobilization. In short, todays lumpenproletariat is comprised of drug dealers, delinquants, scammers, long term unemploayed people, travelling people, gangs...
Its too late for revolution, the nuke has already been invented, the status quo can never be altered.The most we can ever hope is it gets worse slower rather than faster.
>>25157127once the personal nuke is invented people will have true freedom be being their own sovereign states
>>25157116I repeat, jobs like fast food and office jobs contribute nothing to society
>>25155655The job of a Marxist is always to analyze the material contradictions. However, in practice they're not just working class vs ruling class, and often involve all kinds of class obfuscations you need to analyse. Marx's 18th Brumaire is a great example of him analyzing the messy mix of class relations and material interests that led to the proto-fascist takeover of Napoleon III. This means if you do do a materialist analysis, you cannot ignore oppression of minorities either. For example, American style racism developed as a way to separate Irish indentured servants from African slaves. Similarly, the current anti-immigrant sentiment is a way to enforce the separation of workers into a first world complicit 'labor aristocracy' and 'third world' of comparatively more exploited workers, and pit them against each other. Trans people are similarly a good boogeyman to help enforce the unequal relations between men and women. They are class obfuscations, but obviously ones with very real tangible effects, so they cannot be hand waved away as unimportant compared to your class analysis. The problem is finding a balance between taking it seriously and getting completely absorbed in liberal identity politics and culture wars.
>>25149767>It's called "bioleninism" and it's been a complete success for the Left.because the "people" on the left are just dysgenic biomass that society keeps insisting are equal to Men because they have a central nervous system, and the reason they have gained tremendous power is that they are worse off than everyone else; and what is "equality" but merely leveling the playing field with a renovation crew a la House Crashers? A hundred rats are capable of overpowering one man, and society is full of these rats who comprised the totality of the left.
>>25157170>generic group of people is completely useless!take your meds and get the fuck out of here
>>25157215>defective group of peopleftfy, you degenerate, take your meds (PrEP)
>>25157170>>25157227>Trolling outside of /b/
>>25157354This isn't trolling, leftists have succeeded when they are championing and defending utter scum like George Floyd, Trayvon Martin, Jordan Neely, and Renee Good, or giving a pass to people who killed Brian Thompson and Charlie Kirk by saying that they were right-wing on the basis of their conjectures, or promoting absolute lies such as "hands up, don't shoot," "mass graves at the Kamloops," You are either an extraterrestrial or a liar.
>>25149757marx was an ideas guy
>>25149757of course I hate communism, because they only believe in carnal, material desires. When I believe humanities apex is going beyond pure physical want in pursuit of ideals, that is, Idealism. The more carnal the less worthy, the more principled the more worthy, with that alone the inequality of humanity is determined. Someone's need alone does not determine their allotment, but their sheer respectability too also determines their noteworthiness.
>>25153337>71 minute readholy wordslop.
>>25153626>>25153637Not command economy. influencing economics doesn't mean you are commanding it. The acknowledgement that economy functions outside of state hands and accounting for this makes it not command.
>>25157916>George Floyd, Trayvon Martin, Jordan Neely, and Renee Good, or giving a pass to people who killed Brian Thompson and Charlie KirkThose are all psy-ops. Congrat for believing in them.
>>25158233Okay, sure, then why are you even having a discussion about politics on this board, aren't you supposed to pray instead? Why are you preaching that material conditions are not the most important thing, yet you give your opinion, and pass judgement, on how society has to be organized,, which is something temporal?
>>25157170>ay mane muhfuggin *lifted truck idling loudly* bio leninists be tryina make muh white genes disappear mane *jelly roll blaring on speaker* dey went to college bruh *packs dip* thats the muhfuggin JOOZE indoctrination bruh *spits* YA HURD ME
>>25158452i say and look like this
>>25158337Everything's a psyop when you believe that all people are equal and nothing should make them different and yet nothing is working to make that so. You're a degenerate, so of course you'd deny bioleninism. Tell me, are people like Malala Yousafzai, Rosa Parks and Greta Thunberg "organic?"
>ctrl + f "spook">0 resultsjust wanted to let you know, you are all spooked
>>25158636>"Egalitarianism is failing?">"No, it's the spooks' fault."
>>25157139>I repeat, jobs like fast food and office jobs contribute nothing to societyThat's moralistic, un-based and un-Marxist analysis. Labor is productive if it produces surplus value for capital (via turning cheap inputs into commodities that are sold for a profit). That's also why fast food is actually one of the most automable sectors because of how standardized it is, and corporations always want to lower labor costs, a lot of fast food places in the future will have robot workers. Actually already do in many places with self-order kiosks so the future is starting to look like the Fifth Element or Blade Runner:https://youtu.be/sFAPW3W2yMkhttps://youtu.be/sFAPW3W2yMk
Kiosks of the future:https://youtu.be/qhayj3-sGccAlso the contradiction in capitalism is that it is constantly trying to eliminate workers via automation, but at least per Marx's theory the workers produce value while rising unemployment also means less purchasing power so people can't buy the surplus of goods that build up (crisis of overproduction).
>>25149757I had the same experience reading Marx and Hegel over the past couple of months, that coupled with the lectures on both I attended at my local uni where the students seem to either not grasp or horribly misinterpret the texts and the poor guy leading the seminars and lectures was desperately trying to correct them. What's worse is that the same thing is happening to post-structuralists. When you actually read Adorno or Horkheimer or Deleuze you get something vastly different from what is being peddled as "post-modernism" now. It's like someone figured out a way to subvert the way people view actually good and useful ideas as retarded absolute relativism and the likes.
>>25159078And who feed the robots with food? Who repair them, do maintenance? Wagies. In any case, for those who haven't noticed, there is no future. Capital cannot reproduce itself anymore, except with fictitious credit, which will result in the collapse of the main universal mean of exchange: the dollar.
>>25159230>It's like someone figured out a way to subvert the way people view actually good and useful ideas as retarded absolute relativism and the likes.Maybe if people, or even more people, actually read the source material, this wouldn't happen.
>>25160224Midwit take. Capitalism is feeding itself with technological progress and consumerism. Even in the 1860s Marx wrote about this - a cheaper standard of living + tech = profit.
>>25159230This is universally true of all philosophers. It’s part of the fun because you have no idea what is there before you find out for yourself.
>>25149767>I know just the four-year-old anime-avatar xeet to add to this discussion!
>>25151573Yeah? &?
>>25160351>Capitalism is feeding itself with technological progress and consumerism. And that is the internal contradiction for you. Contradiction between valirization and devalorization. As the organic composition of Capital, C/V, in crease, the rate of profit decrease.
>>25158366Because I was drunk and looking for a fight when I posted that.Material conditions are not the most important thing. they are a thing to be recognized, but not the fundamental point of egress. You start with conscious willingness before any abstractions about systemics. Personal responsibility must be taken in tandem with practical ramification. Because we exist as first person isolates first, not third person systems. I will pass my judgement and my judgement is that society should balance competition with cooperation. The fundamental individual with the pragmatic group. That you don't deserve something for simply existing, but you should be passed a bone for the potential you might have. Stop seeing yourself as just a meat stick of pure causation that has no fundamental value more than the physics of a rolling stone. You are the thing that all value pours out from. I hate communism because its pure strain sees humans as just another mechanical spiritless math problem rather than the one conducting math.>pray im not particularly religious, just hegelian.
