>Funnily enough, in Chapterhouse Dune, we see the single exception to this is a small, secret community of Jewish people that have somehow retained their cultural and religious traditions almost entirely intact from how they were in the 20th century.>The Bene Gesserit adepts they encounter are absolutely gobsmacked at how they could have survived so long unchanged, unnoticed and untouched by the exodus from Earth, FTL travel, Butlerian Jihad, the Orange Catholic Bible’s influence, the Bene Gesserit’s Missionaria Protectiva, Paul’s Jihad, Leto II’s four millennia of tyranny, and the Honored Matre conquests>And they know that they’re the real deal because Reverend Mothers could draw on the Other Memory to confirm that yeah, this bunch still have pretty much the same practices from eons ago>I would argue that this is one of the most conceptually weak parts about Chapterhouse. It's too damn close to conspiracy theories about Jews, even though Herbert doesn't paint them in any bad light.>I viewed it as a "never again" kind of thing mixed with gnosticismlmao space jews. wtf do you have to say for yourself?
>>25172363This sounds like a funny bit. No evidence it's actually pro-Jewish (Herbert has some pro-Hitler stuff early on). I might read Chapterhouse.
Childhood's End by Arthur C Clarke has smth similar. After the Overlords arrive, subsequently reveal themselves and humanity has abandoned religion, it's only the Jews who retain their faith.
>>25172363>conspiracy theoriesDoes the author imply that jews in fact do not form extremely insular communities where they larp practices from eons ago?
>>25172363It was just a bit of fun mate
>>25172363If you've read anything about the history of Judaism, it would come as no surprise. Jews have always been characterised by their fanaticism.
>>25172375>Herbert has some pro-Hitler stuff early onWhat? Citation needed
>>25173130A MAGAchud misread Herbert in the most hilarious way imaginable.
>>25172363Jews have changed many times over the last 2000 years. Why would they not change in space. I dont get it.
>>25172363>It's too damn close to conspiracy theories about Jews, even though Herbert doesn't paint them in any bad light.Recall that the Bene Gesserits are antagonists in Dune who go around manipulating religions by constructing and seeding them on different planets as part of their pursuit of large-scale ideological control. That's what people think Jews do, but the Jews in Chapterhouse are resistant to this so the Bene Gesserit can't observe what they're up to. The Golden Path is about forcing humanity to scatter to make them harder to see presciently because otherwise they'll be destroyed.>>25172375>Jews have always been characterised by their fanaticism.Yeah. Well I think part of what's going on is that Jews resist assimilation but that also includes resisting assimilation into the dominant morality of gentile societies. Israel is very nationalistic and militaristic for example and that's very much at odds with a lot of liberal culture and opinion. It was the Israelis who assassinated the Ayatollah. The U.S. is focused on different targets. The dominant Israeli ethic to me seems to be Nietzschean master morality and that absolutely can be in defiance of a dominant morality, or morality of the majority, or herd:https://youtu.be/BtBmDnk4CeIhttps://youtu.be/ha-8LO0seaM>>25173417>Jews have changed many times over the last 2000 years. Why would they not change in space. I dont get it.Eh yeah it's a sci-fi novel.
>No-ships came into heavy use during and after the time of The Scattering. They were used by people fleeing the Old Imperium into the vast unknown of uncharted space. Since no-ships possessed advanced calculation systems, they did not require a Guild Navigator's prescient abilities to avoid collision with interstellar bodies. Because of this, they could escape charted territories without difficulty. However, this also meant that they came dangerously close to defying the prohibitions of the Butlerian Jihad.>During the time of the Honored Matres, when the Lost Ones were returning to the Old Imperium, no-ships had become commonplace. Not only were they used to hide individuals and their movements, but they were also employed as planetary defenses by being placed in orbit. In this way, although prescience was normally an almost faultless method for detecting planetary defenses, those who used prescience in an attempt to search for no-ships would find it difficult, if not impossible, to detect them.>At times, no-ships were often armed and took part in space battles.
>>25172375name your source, fucker, or Fannie Mae will drop a jump door over your head and then close it
the "cortical labs 1' is my new headcanon for what the guild navigators look like. a big bank of these onboad and mainlining spice through their proprietary guild lifesupport systems until they can't fire anymore and need to be recycled into their raw materials, which happens once every few months. the base cells were drawn from an ornithopter pilot who was especially dear to some powerfull buisinessman. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KeC8gxopio
>>25172363Frank Herbert was not an intellectual heavy weight ok. He thought 'Harkonnen' sounded Russian.
>>25173825keeek im starting to realize more and more that he may have been a retard
>>25173839He's just weird. Read the bio by his son. Only someone deeply weird writes a book as unpublishable in the 60s as Dune.
>>25173825>>25173839the spice is oil, the americans are the atreidies are america, the british are the empire, the guild is israel, and the sardaukar are the australians.
>>25172363>>25172375He started out by saying Islamic faith is the most powerful sleeping blunt force in the universe, so despite all stupidity it does make sense when he eventually gets to saying 'Judiasm is an immortal and unalienable magic tradition throughout all time and space'. The guy clearly found magic in all sorts of religion. I do agree Dune is some really rancid pulp at the end of the day though.
