Is China Mieville too high IQ for this board? Because his books don’t have epic anime battles, waifus and dragons?

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One of the last remaining things Ill say about this book before I'm done with the series:

Its difficult to have an depth contained within a special "race" or simply different group or culture of human beings, when the historical origins of that group or culture are not explored. Its hard to contend that any of their behaviours, attitudes and actions are "real" in any sense, rather than a simple manifestations of the authors simplistic perception of an ideal, concept, or characteristic. Whether positive or negative.

And even besides all that I just said: Without an origin, a history, there is no basis, and without a basis. Sure there can be meat, information, lots of menial information, but without bone, which the meat exists to form around, there is no structure, nothing to hold it together, under the weight of scrutiny and no reason for it to exist.

I've been trying to think of a way to interpret the Utopians as interesting: They represent a group of the good people, who are ostracized and considered weird and freaks because they fight passionately for ideals the rest of the world isnt ready to face
They represent change, in a world scared of change, because theyre assured that the current state of things, is the ultimate ideal, the perfect utopia.

So in that sense, my prediction from before I read this book likely holds true. The Utopians are an attempt to explore "Utopia" but from the "good side" the truly hopeful, idealistic side, always striving for better, for more, for greater. And the "perfect" system that needs to be propped up on a 200 year system that rationalizes perpetual and effectively infinite assasination to maintain itself, is supposed to make you uncomfortable.

My only problem is that (so far) none of this is actually meaningful, none of it deep. I made an early argument at the end of Too Like Lightning about the problem with the assassination system morally, not from any perspective of my own, but from the very perspective the system rests on.

Sniper makes a poor argument to defend it. It essentially boils down to: The values we protect are good. And there are people who would threaten those values by offering something different. Therefore to protect our values, we must eradicate anything that seeks to change them.

But this empty and arbitrary. The Confederates of the Civil War could just as easily justified a system of slavery on that basis. The values themselves have to be justified, not appealed to on the basis of them being "normal". Because then, the only thing that would make the Confederates wrong, isnt that slavery is wrong. Its that they lost.

The reasons why the Utopians are weak to me is for similar reasons. None of the ideals in this book justify themselves, they just posit themselves. The Utopians are good and their values good, simply because they sound good and are clearly not as corrupt and conniving as everyone else.

This leaves one last thread to be sorted out for this story to be whole:

Jehovah Epicurus Donatien D'Arouet Mason.

He's the last chance this book has to die together all these disparate idyllic "philosophies" by bringing the depth out of them, through challenging them and offering a perspective so "right" that it renders others invalid and exposed, or so "right" that it adds to their possible legitimacy.

The book better do something interesting with him soon. Now that Ive written all this out, and gotten these thoughts out of my head, I have a more clear view of what rhe Book is trying to do and say, even though the way it goes about it, is...frustrating. And the characters are almost all shallow reflections of already shallow ideals. But Madame, almost to the degree Kraye is, is becoming to seem more like a Cartoon villain and obviously, uninterestingly wrong and shallow.

>>25173698
I fucking despise you and wish excruciatingly slow, painful death upon you.

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Again. One single guy. One single supervillain caused the downfall of a 10 billion people society, because he beat the woman who pretended to be impregnated by another man and got kicked out of the secret clubhouse because nobody thought that was cool...does it sound more, or less ridiculous when put like this?

>>25173713
Fucking cocksucker bot.

>>25173711
What's up with this guy? Seriously? I don't even come here all that often to do this? I gave you guys the thread for like an entire day to talk about whatever hollow shit you wanted to, and none of you could get a discussion beyond 5 post replies.
The fuck is wrong with you?

>>25173680
One man's high IQ is another's navel gazing pretentious asshole.

>>25173698
>>25173713
No one here but you thinks what you're doing is particularly unique or interesting.

>>25173698
Jesus Christ you sure do love to yap on and on and on and on about shit absolutely no one cares about, huh?

Nuke these fucking generals man. Just stop making them.

does the number of Achamian cuckoldry sections lessen past the warrior prophet? The nigga needs to move on

Why can't you read a book by yourself without having to tell internet strangers how you personally feel about every single fucking paragraph?

Are you fucking mentally ill?

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Bridger dies doesn't he?

>>25173746
Kill yourself

>>25173740
>does the number of Achamian cuckoldry sections lessen past the warrior prophet? The nigga needs to move on
What? The first half of the 3rd book is almost strictly Achamian being reminded that he's a cuck. The cucking doesn't even really start till the Thousandfold Thought. Achamian is only aware of the cucking by the end of Warrior Prophet.

>>25173743
Didn't expect the dogpile. If its that bad that losers like this>>25173739
are crying so badly that there general which had no meaningful discussion, and barely any evidence of anybody actually reading and instead complaining about how much indie or modern fiction they hate, or how much of sanderson or bakker they've read. Then fine. I'll stop. I thought I could share the fact that I'm reading, with a general that seemingly does not read, even when they do, will find any and every way to not talk deeply about the book. I hoped my endeavour may encourage people to talk more deeply about the books they read, so that I may find some interesting reason to read a new book somebody else is reading.

Clearly this general serves a different purpose. Not to discuss books and pick them apart, and analyze and try to appreciate and understand them. But as something to be waived around, as a flag of allegiance, or opposition to a certain type of "fantasy". I'll stop then.

>>25173750
>loser
You're the only loser here, wacko. Go read the book first THEN come back here and talk about it. This wall of text beside a sepia colored wall of text that you're currently doing is fucking strange.

>>25173750
You're the only motherfucker here who isn't reading. Nobody reads like this. No one. You're fucking autistic or something. I'm tired of seeing all these random sepia ebook pages everywhere.

Just STOP fucking taking pictures of each fucking page.

What the fuck happened to /sffg/?

>>25173750
>>>Clearly this general serves a different purpose. Not to discuss books and pick them apart, and analyze and try to appreciate and understand them.
You can attempt this without taking a screenshot of each and every individual paragraph on every single individual page anon.

>Okay, I'll stop.
Sure you will, see you tomorrow, nutjob.

>>25173750
You are one pretentious motherfucker, lmao.

>>25173765
newfag goodreads fags who flooded in and forgot to ignore bakkerfag

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I couldn't do it. I couldnt stave off. Maybe after im done with the book. This entire sequence is just too ridiculous. Its just too much. Shes a comicbook villain, a legit hollow comicbook villain, representative of ideals, not to express them unconventially so as to explore and test a deeper understanding, but instead, to be propped up and defeated or invoke despairing feelings of being unbeatable.

You're a fucking twat

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I could dive into how incoherent and retarded this appeal to and use of "Enlightenment" is, but is there really any point? The character would be ridiculous no matter what arbitrary basis they chose to rationalize their cartoon villain disposition, The Enlightenment appeal is a facade. It is hollow, not meant to be engaged with any deeply. Not dissected or even really improved, its an aesthetic for "wrongness" Is there really any point in trying to understand why the Joker did it? Only midwits attempt that, to pretend to imbue some semblance of depth into such a deliberately and obviously senseless representation of crime. The reality is that it means nothing other than to make Batman have to fight crime, reduced to one entity. Simplified so that we can understand nothing of what it means other than something to be defeated or prevail.

This brain damaged moron is so beyond help he can't even stop shit posting for 10 minutes. Stop with the screencaps you cunt, absolutely no one cares but you. kys.

Just imagine. This guy thinks doing this is HILARIOUS. He thinks this is the FUNNIEST shit in the WORLD and he devotes day after day after day, countless untold hours doing it. From sun up to sun down. He's done this shit for YEARS nonstop, unpreturbed. This guy has literally NO life and he will go to his GRAVE doing this shit.

Just imagine..

>>25173796
I'll stop for good once I'm done the book. I likely don't have much left to post, I've already not screenshotted many pages

>>25173808
>t.liar

>>25173812
I might not even tell you guys what Book I'm going to read instead next

>>25173680
The City and the City was incredibly pretentious and made a hash of its own premise all to culminate in a point about a third mythical city that doesn’t even exist and land on the note that everything they’re doing to uphold the illusion is bs. Except that’s already made clear. Even the protag says it’s fake and gay and can’t maintain it.
You tell me what was good about that drivel

>>25173846
sounds poetic tbqh. but poetry is always pretentiuos, innit.

Test

>>25173861
Ready to get banned again, boy?

>>25173881
Shut up, spammertranny.

I'm re-reading Titus Groan and I think I'm falling for Fuchsia

>>25173881
Might as well be announcing reports at this point, bakkertranny.

so why is every woman in bakkers book a whore, again? realism?

https://strawpoll.com/XOgOVq3Dan3

Wolfe seems to be catching up with Bakker.

>>25173979
The poll has officially ended already.

Bakker was declared the winner.

>>25173983
no, the ride never ends.

>>25174008
I wasn’t asking.

>>25174014
neither was i

>>25173750
Thank god, its about fucking time you learned to read the room and noticed how hated you are.

>400 pages into the Prince of Nothing book
>Serwe suggests sharing Kellhus to Esmenet

Oh my Bakker, this is literally like my harem anime

>>25173750
Keep posting your screenshots buddy. Every reply you got is the same 1 or 2 people who have nothing going on in their lives. I actually read your posts so feel free to continue.

>>25174087
*second prince of nothng

>>25174091
Kill yourself.

>>25174087
She is mentally ill / has a room temp IQ.

>>25174091
>Keep posting your screenshots buddy
no please not. it renders the threads utterly unreadable after bakkerfag + bakkerfag haters render it half unreadable. we have enough useless posts as it is.

Why is there no Bible in the vote for the best fantasy book?

*tips*

>>25173680
>Qussim Dhatt

>>25173846
Sounds like "muh boarders aren't even real" lib slop.

>“Yes,” Esmenet replied, her eyes forced to the ground by a strange defensiveness. “Like her … Most women are simple.”
>“And most men?”
>“Well, certainly more men than women are learned … Wise.”
>“And is this because men are more than women?”
>Esmenet stared at him, dumbfounded.
>“Or is it,” he continued, “because men are granted more than women in this world?”
>She stared, her thoughts spinning. She breathed deeply, set her palms carefully upon her knees. >“You’re saying women are … are actually equal?”

Woah ...

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Reddit is making fun of us, again!

>>25174190
Just wait until you learn about the Whale Mothers.

>>25174190
>>25174198
Nobody tell him.

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King of /sffg/.

Simple as.

We need userIDs in this board.

>>25173751
>sepia colored wall of text
>>25173756
>these random sepia ebook pages
Looks like the ReadEra app which is the low effort option on Google Play

>>25174225
so you can differentiate between the 20+ VPNs of bakkerfag? smart

>>25173765
As far as I can tell, this anon annoyed everyone by posting really low iq commentary on every individual page of Second Apocalypse until someone split the thread to exclude Bakker discussion. But it's not about Bakker, it's this guy, he just started a random other novel and kept posting in both threads. Which is funny, I'll give it up, but I still don't need to see it lol.

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>We need userIDs in this board.

>>25174233
4chan doesn't allow posting using VPNs.

>>25173765
Apparently there's a 45 year old Californian bald nurse raiding other generals daily trying to dox the bakkerfag. See >>25174194 I didn't believe this at first, but as soon as he wakes up at around 8:30 am Californian time, the thread gets derailed.

>>25174243
CERTAIN types of VPNs (of which, i won't mention here cause i think i might risk getting banned, go find it yourself.) are allowed here though

>>25174250
This is no longer the case. Virtually every commercially available VPN IP is blacklisted here. Only by having a static IP can you circumvent that, which realistically no one here would use.

>>25174279
Yet here we are. Thoughts?

>>25174287
There is no moderation in this website. That is all. And the post that do occasionally get deleted have nothing to do with quality or spamming.

>>25174288
Nah, i think this site is just both moderated and unmoderated at certain times in the worst way possible

>>25174279
People just use the furry proxy site

>>25174279
They still can't stop you rebooting your router and getting a new IP.

every healthy 4chan general needs 2-3 effort posters for every 1 schizo. too many schizos and it becomes unreadable, too many effort posters and it becomes arrogant and inward-looking.

/sffg/ is doing just fine

>>25173765
Bakkerfag, our resident obligatory threadshitter, is in his 10th year and has been undergoing an extreme case of histrionics over the past ~10 threads.
>>25174225
You can tell which posts are his through the images he uses, and his typing style vernacular.

>>25174248
>"but as soon as he wakes up at around 8:30 am Californian time, the thread gets derailed."
>08:30:36
>Schizoid's first post in the general
You literally cannot make this shit up.

>>25174338
anon, that was 7:30 in california
probably still him though

>>25174341
You're not very smart, are you?

>>25174349
I thought you meant the post you linked, nvm

>>25174341
retard

>>25173680
do you think there's a chinese guy named britain

>>25174242
We all became 100% sure this site was dead the moment they removed the user counter.

>>25173668
>doesn't even linke to the previous thread
anon was right when he said this place is dead and even reddit would be better at this point

>>25174369
>we all

>>25174334
This you (>>25174194)?

>>25174372
Everyone on this general has a reddit account

>>25174338
He already got banned fucking LMAO. Check the previous thread.

>>25174372
bakkerspammer didn't link because he wanted the thread to remain in poor quality/

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this general really is one of the worst mental asylums i've encountered.

people say there are worse generals, but where?

>>25174406
on /mu/

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I'm having a tour over classic dark fantasy, after finishing reading Clark Ashton Smith, do you recommend me to follow with Michael Moorcock, Jack vance or something else? I'm also considering reading Robert E. Howard stories because they are sword and sorcery classics, and that is attractive to me.
Also, are moorcock's only worth books the Elric of melnibone saga? What's your opinion on that in general?

>>25174406
Literally everywhere else.

I am looking for a dark fantasy series with intense battles, pitch black lore, highly intellectual themes that dovetail into real world philosophy, poignant character psychology, and just a hint of Lovecraftian horror. Is there anything out there like this?

>>25173680
if he's so high IQ then why is he a communist?

>>25174406
Check out /vg/.

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>>25174425

>>25174431
Thank you, Wilhelm!

>>25174406
It hasn't always been this bad but the last month or so the inmates have been running the asylum here.

>>25174406
It's just a certain schizoid who goes berserk at the slightest mention of a certain author.

>>25174418
Nobody will answer this because nobody in this thread reads for shit, this general is pure shitposting.
Half the faggots here haven't read The lord of the rings, let alone Moorcock's.

>>25174472
What do you mean? I have read the Lord of the Rings and it wasn't that good, let me tell you that.

>>25174472
Moorcock was one of Tolkien's greatest critics, did you know that?

>>25174279
There are services where they've used malware to infect peoples routers. So you tunnel into some random persons router and get to use a residential ip.

>>25174475
>someone says "half the thread hasn't done X thing
>someone replies "impossible, I have done X thing"
Hoky fuck, the intellectual level of this place is abysmal. Do people here know what "half" means?

>>25174485
Anon, there's 3 people in this thread.

>>25174479
Ok and?
How does that:
1) invalidate my point about half the postere here haven't read tolkien
2) how does that even remotely answers >>25174418 question?

>>25174472
LotR gets brought up by normalfags in every thread and Moorcock gets a lot of recognition too. Lurk moar.

>>25174496
Yet you can't answer a simple fucking question about fantasy literature and prefer to shitpost and fight instead of being helpful.

I really hate how Esmenet became a slut not just for every man, but for Kellhus too, wasnt achamian cucked enough? I dont even get the point of the relationship.

>>25174518
thinly veiled author's fetish

>>25174518
I don't know what the fuck you are talking about. Specify which book, if any, you are talking about.

>>25174524
the warrior prophet obviously

>>25174528
Why do you assume people have read that? If you want a general where it is implied everyone knows you are talking about that, why don't you make a general about that?
It's as if I started talking about a random fantasy book and I expecred everyone to understand what i'm talking about. Fuck off.

>>25174534
autism

>>25174418
Hey. My question remains unanswered.

>>25174418
>>25174537
You asked at one of the worst times unfortunately, this general is going through a particularly low point in mental stability with multiple long time schizoposters shitting up the thread day in and day out.

I've not read any Moorcock (yet) but he wrote the introduction to the illustrated edition of the Gormenghast series which I love. Why was he the one do that? Is there a link between him and Peake more than is detailed in the introduction?

>>25174518
Achamian will win in the end. Just keep reading after the 3rd book.

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found bakkerfag IRL

>>25174534
>Gets filtered by Bakker.
Many such cases.

if bakkers books taught me anything, its that christianity, the crusades and patriarchy are all very bad things

>>25174585
i thought they are all common sense...

>>25173706
>cartoon villain
The author got a philosophical doctorate in anime studies, and is on record saying that is very much intentional

>The Christians cast the bodies from the rooftops. They rifled the pockets of the dead, tugging rings from grey fingers, or just sawing at the knuckles to save time. Shrieking children were torn from their mothers, tossed across rooms and caught on sword point. The mothers were beaten
and raped while their gutted husbands wailed about their entrails. The Christians were like wild-eyed beasts, drunk with howling murder. Moved by the God’s own fury, they utterly destroyed all in the city, both men and women, young and old, oxen, sheep, and asses, with the edge of the sharp sword.

So how can anyone say the Crusades were a good thing after this

>common sense
The argument of a mid-wit.

>>25174585
Bringing back crusades would be the very thing to save this world.

>>25174591
i would rather being a midwit than being a christcuck

>>25174575
I think there's quite a differenxe between objecting to this general being bakker-gen and being filtered by him, but it may be just me, idk.

>>25174604
I am neither of those, but thank you for conceding that you're a retard.

>>25174609
If you post here regularly, it is expected that you have at least read the top 10 most discussed authors, no?

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>>25174585
Crazy how lefties read Bakker and figure out he is somehow their enemy

>>25174613
Why should i read something just because it's read here?
This is cult mentality. I come here to discuss fantasy fiction, not to enter your cult/hivemind.

>>25174609
bakkerspammer's world understand is black and white with no middle ground.

>>25174618
>Likes niche music genre
>Never listened to the most popular albums
Ok, retard.

>>25174621
Holy ESL.

>>25174618
>cult mentality
You clearly do not know what this means.

>>25174617
Assuming that an author is promoting something simply because they write about it is often a sign of retardation.

>>25174618
Then why are you posting here? Do you expect that others have read whatever you are posting about here? Clearly that's the case, because you are yourself admitting to not read what others read, no?

>>25174638
It's the screenshot guy, probably.

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>>25174617

Tolkien was never very good.

>>25174647
overrated - yes, but he fathered the whole genre

i know there was fantasy before him, but it was never the same after him

He shook his head. “Fie on the desert,” he murmured, then looked up in
sudden fury. “Fie on the desert! She’s … She’s … Akka loved her! Akka!
Don’t you recall? Your friend …”
Kellhus lowered his eyes in penitent sadness. “We thought he would want
this.”
“Want? Want his best friend fucking the wo—”

my boy proyas is the only one with common sense in this shitshow

>>25174643
>>25174617
I'd get it if they were a MAGA Trump-enjoyer and read Bakker's blog, then they'd be right to point out they have a political disagreement with Bakker
But this is so fucking retarded

Look, I’ll give Bakker one thing: the setting is impressive terms of scale. But honestly? The Second Apocalypse is the ultimate "I’m 14 and this is deep" filtered through a philosophy textbook and a gallon of grease.

Here’s why the Prince of Nothing is actually mid-tier garbage and bad taste:

1. The "Grimdark" Edgelord Trap
Bakker isn’t just writing dark fantasy; he’s writing a 2,000-page manifesto on why everything is miserable. We get it, R. Scott. The world is a "granary" and everyone is a "swine." After the tenth chapter of someone getting their soul flayed while a Sranc does something unspeakable in the background, it stops being shocking and just becomes a chore. It’s misery porn for people who think having a nihilistic worldview makes them an intellectual.

2. The "Realism" Excuse for the Female Characters
Every time someone points out that the female characters are essentially just non-entities or trauma-vessels (Esmenet, Serwë, etc.), the fanboys scream "MEDIEVAL REALISM!"

Give me a break. You’ve got giant logic-warping aliens and skin-spies, but a woman with an actual personality or an agency that isn't tied to a man's bed is "unrealistic"? The "whore/madonna" complex in these books is off the charts. It’s not "challenging"; it’s just a weirdly specific fetish the author keeps forcing on the reader.

3. Kellhus is a Literal Gary Stu
Kellhus is the ultimate "power fantasy" for guys who spend too much time reading body language wikis. He’s "autistic-perfect." He walks into a room, reads a facial twitch, and suddenly he’s the king of the world. It’s boring. There’s no tension because Kellhus is playing a video game with a strategy guide while everyone else is playing Iron Man mode. The "Shortest Path" is just a plot device to handwave away actual character development.

4. Purple Prose and "Deep" Philosophy
The prose is trying way too hard. It’s not "superb"; it’s bloated. He uses ten words when one would do, usually something archaic or pseudo-biblical to hide the fact that the actual philosophical point is "Life is pain and then you go to a hell that actually exists." It’s "Philosophy 101" wrapped in a Thesaurus.

5. The Fanbase (The Real Horror)
The worst part of Bakker is the "Unfall" fans who act like you’re too "low-IQ" to understand the The Thousandfold Thought. No, I get it. I just think it’s a slog written by a guy who thinks being "transgressive" is a substitute for being a good storyteller.

>>25174685
its really not bad if its AI, gotta give it that.

>>25174694
Already a better fantasy world than Sandersons.

>>25174694
Ah, Frunkia.
Home.

>>25174694
You can just not have the sandniggers. Every world doesn't need to be tainted by them.

>>25174694
Missing the mystical Orienta of the Far East (the book only mentions it about 3-4 times total).

>>25174694
Missing Bakkerland.

>Schizo eats an IP ban
>Thread becomes bearable again
Feels good, ngl.

>>25174638
>Then why are you posting here?
To discuss fantasy literature in general.
>Do you expect that others have read whatever you are posting about here?
Never said or implied that, schizo.
>Clearly that's the case, because you are yourself admitting to not read what others read, no?
Nice non sequitur.
No,just because I won't read your annoying ass bullshit does not imply i'm forcing you to read my gibberish, in fact, I haven'teven mentioned any book. I was talking about only (you) and your autistic obsession.

Yep, he mad.

>>25174680
>the female characters are essentially just non-entities or trauma-vessels
Why is this bad?

troll ^

I found Warrior Prophet actually worse than the first book and very long winded in parts … until I got to the last 100 pages, which are amazing and reveal everything built up so far.

>>25174774
Achamian's scenes during while he's a prisoner and subsequent release are absolute kino.

>>25174764
Another case of BDS.

/sffg/ - bakker general

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J U S T
U
S
T

>>25174795
Who cares about tolkien slop?
I know a better writer that is not woke

>>25174815
Sysadmin gotta be the least exciting profession on human history

I think I will start the Vorkosigan Saga when I'm done reading BOTNS

I support yellow screenshot anon's cause. I just wish he would choose better series to post every single page of.

Red God?

>>25174885
Most likely not this year

Dungeon Crawler Carl, while not exactly profound literature, is surprisingly dense. Sometimes to the point that it's a detriment. Almost every single sentence and every offhanded name/worldbuilding/joke is either setting up, hinting at, or resolving some mystery/plot thread/character arc. It becomes a bit exhausting. But it's mostly fun enough to make up for that. All that to say, if you're going to dissect every page of a series, believe it or not, it wouldn't be a bad choice.

>Achamian being mad that Esmenet fucked 10001 other men instead of 10000, as he thought of her

Idk whether I should laugh or cry at this cuck

>>25174080
Nevermind, I wont stop then.

>>25173668
What is the exact midpoint between Sanderson and Bakker? High fantasy but still grotesque and nasty?

>>25174588
>doctorate in anime studies
....
>and is on record saying that is very much intentional
why? to what point?

I found attempting to read Sanderson (I made it through half of The Way of Kings) to be a shockingly joyless experience. I thought the whole appeal of slop was the mindless entertainment. What are his fans getting out of reading this stuff?

>>25174956
So stunning and brave

>>25174974
The books are stuffed with nods and references, but not just classical/renaissance/enlighten (it shows that the author's day-job is as a history teacher)
also to Neon Genesis Evangelion

>>25174832
>I just wish he would choose better series to post every single page of.
I don't discriminate. Part of the reason I posted my analysis was incase anybody found the book interesting via them. Unfortunately I had much more to be critical of than not. But If anybody wants to know whether to read the book or not then >>25173698 this is a broad summary of what (I think) the series is trying to do, and my fundamental problems with how it tries to do it, minus my criticisms of the general character writing.

If somebody finds what the series is trying to do to be interesting, then by all means, read, I guarantee you've tolerated and read far more garbage than my framing of Terra Ignota. I'm just extra critical because I try to read philosophy and the way people talk about and represent philosophy commonly is almost toxic to me. And this series represents it poorly. So I take that very seriously.

I'll be moving on to another book now. I won't be giving up anymore, not because of any of the people who actually are fine with what I do, but out of spite to the garbage that act like the general is better when they post good reads reviews to circlejerk about, and cryjerk when somebody hasnt read moorcock.

I'll do whatever I want.

>>25175030
>but not just classical/renaissance/enlighten (it shows that the author's day-job is as a history teacher)
yeah, i figured that, youtube recommended me a video of her talking about history, despite me never searching up about the series out of icognito.

>also to Neon Genesis Evangelion
Evangelion is another overrated midwit series thats not even remotely as deep as people make it out to be, the Creator literally admits to most of the shit being included because he thought it was cool, like the christian imagery.

I guess people liked it anyway in the 90s, because the 90s breeded loser kids who were obsessed with the illusion of "relatability" and Shinji was like the first mecha protag who was a scared outcast loser who didnt want to do something dangerous like get in a big robot and fight monster angels.

But still. I don't get the nods to anime characterization. So youre telling me they characterized Perry and Madame as some of the most ridiculous anime/cartoon/comicbook esque villains with absurd motivations that make them seem less like people, and more like mere representations of shallow one dimensional ideals because...she likes that characterization and is just referencing it because its fun? Like the novel equivalent of "Oh my LISAN AL GIB!" that you see in normie twitter replies and youtube comment sections under anything dune (movie) related? (I havent read the books or watched the movie so if I mispelled it thats that)

Not even a deconstruction of the anime villain, just mere reference? Because if thats the case, I've taken this series far more seriously than it deserved to be, when its just a quirky wacky sci fi story inspired by anime and 18 century history.

>>25174816
It's comfy to larp as one.

>>25175054
>shit being included because he thought it was cool
I'm pretty sure Ada Palmer is also working by that principle

>>25175054
>Perry and Madame
There's some more stuff going on with them in the later books that makes the way they ACT make some sense, but they surely come off as acting like stock theatrical characters, I 100% agree
they are more like plot devices the book don't dwell on them, but that's like everyone in books

>>25175054
adding to this, it's one of my favorite series written in this century
the books are just so interesting and weird, and they go in very different directions than you'd expect
so I would encourage you to keep at it

but I would also be the first to acknowledge it got a lot of flaws
it's a very ambitious book and it fails at some of the things it tries to do, or doesn't do it very well
but there are also a lot of things that does work out out, and is very cool

also came off as very novel to someone that has read thousands of books, there's some new in it, some fresh

>>25175098
>the books are just so interesting and weird, and they go in very different directions than you'd expect
>also came off as very novel to someone that has read thousands of books, there's some new in it, some fresh
I dont disagree at all, its very weird and novel, similarly to the way some anime can be. I'm a bit stricter on the series because its use of Philosophy genuinely pisses me off. But once I sort of peaced together (atleast I think) what its trying to do, I sort of appreciated that its trying to approach the idea of a Utopian society in a semi interesting way.

Whether I continue or not really depends on how this book ends and what Jedd Mason does. Because hes the last piece of the puzzle whos purpose I dont quite understand. But the 2nd book was really silly at times particularly because of what this anon here
>>25175086
>but they surely come off as acting like stock theatrical characters, I 100% agree
>they are more like plot devices the book don't dwell on them, but that's like everyone in books
says.

I finished reading Warrior Prophet.

Well, that was … something. I gotta collect my thoughts for a bit.

>>25175141
That ending was dark as fuck.

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What did Sando mean by this

>>25175277
Have you considered that they are not breaking the rules and instead you are breaking the rules by deliberately encouraging and showboating a report?

>>25175277
Pagespammer has been here off and on for 17 years. He ain't going anywhere.

>>25175277
Despite the company-mandated samefaggotry you always receive from pagespammer and Bakkerspammer, know that at least one other person is also tired of this shit.

>>25175277
The schizos ARE the mods.

>>25175277
You sound resentful.

>>25175277
Dumb frog poster.

>>25175318
Stupid reddit expat faggot

I finished reading Magic the Gathering: Guildpact.

Well, that was... something. I gotta collect my thoughts for a bit.

>>25173783
based king, if people don't appreciate your posts they can just not read them

>>25175277
This is off topic.
Already did my part.

>>25175277
>>25175297

Page spammer does more for this general than you.

I'm tempted to start pagespamming a book of my own. Any recommendations?

>>25175349
Suck my cock, faggot. Talk about science fiction.

>>25175354
We are doing a Bakker re-read on our discord. Might start posting that myself.

>>25175360
How has that worked so far, sweetie?

Based mods.

Test

>>25175365
Not well, apparently,

Kek

>white guy
>christ cuck
>nigger
>fat white guy
>a literal jew
>greek muscle woman
>multiple mentions of real classical music
What year is this supposed to be set in again?

I almost want to give red rising a chance, but I genuinely havent heard anything of merit to convince me to read it, but some people say it completely changes from sounding like the most generic modern YA slop with Roman Greek Culture larp after the 1st book but...nobody actually says what makes that change significant, and what makes it good after the first book

>>25175435
Is this just going to be some commentary on religion? I was looking forward to some whimsical science fantasy adventure about the mystery of a spikey dude.

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>The Burning, by Evan Winter
A so-far 2 book series following a young man named Tau. Tau is born into the low caste in a very hierarchical society that calls themselves The Chosen, in a hellish world where thinking the wrong thoughts sends you to the underworld to get torn apart by demons. Upper castes are physically bigger, faster, and stronger than lower castes, and as a result get privileged positions in the military and form the nobility in civil society.

Tau is arrogant and acts before he thinks, and provokes a greater noble into killing his father due to Tau embarrassing a petty noble. He swears vengeance after this, and joins an elite (for the low caste) training school for the military, where he tries harder than everyone else, and becomes better than them. He goes to the underworld and fights demons until they kill him repeatedly, eventually becoming the greatest swordsman of all time. He also becomes the very young queen's champion.

The world is more interesting than the people. It's the only African-based fantasy I've ever read, with all the characters having dark skin and names of people and places resembling those from African languages, and the structure of their society provokes interesting questions.

Of the Chosen, 1/2000 women are Gifted with the ability to do magic regardless of caste, including "enraging" male greater nobles (highest caste), "enervating" enemies aka temporarily sending them to the underworld, sending messages long distances, and controlling dragons. Dragons only obey them because the Chosen has held a baby dragon captive for 200 years, which the Gifted can use to trick other dragons into doing what they want, though a Gifted dies every time they do. They only really use the dragons to kill natives trying to take their land back, and for internal wars. The proximity of the dragons also destroys the land and sea outside Chosen territory.

Because of the abuse of lower castes and dragons, the wastefulness of upper castes, and the repeated massacres of natives, I'd say the Chosen are the real villains of the story despite the protagonist Tau being one. I've never read another book like this, so this part was intriguing.

Overall, it was mediocre, 3/5.

>>25175537
>African fantasy
>No father
At least the dad didn't mean to abandon his child. I guess that's the fantasy part.

>>25175449
It's entertaining and fun to read. The "good guys" overcome a lot of overwhelming odds and some of the main characters are a lot of fun to root for. It's not some philosophically significant body of work or a pioneer of some new field. It probably won't make you a smarter person, but it might entertain you for a few months while you work through the books. That's the best I can offer.

>It probably won't make you a smarter person
>Science fiction/fantasy
>Make you smarter
Name ONE.

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>>25175564
Senpai...

>>25175564
I say this because the books that might actually do this in this general are few and far between, and retards here think that reading those books will make them better people and will refuse to read any books that they don't think can do that. Red Rising is just a fun series and it doesn't have to be anything else, and some people just aren't ready to accept that it's ok to only read for fun.

>>25175581
Books are simple the best medium for telling stories.

>>25175564
https://www.gregegan.net/ORTHOGONAL/ORTHOGONAL.html

reading sun eater and its so shit i hope it gets better later on

>>25175449
If you go into it with that mentality you probably won't ever end up liking it. I'd say what makes the books after 1 better is how its not forced to play along to what was popular at the time the first was written so its able expand into a more interesting space opera setting. Its definitely a popcorn kind of read but its very good at what it does imo great pacing and Pierce genuinely gets better as an author the further you go on. I will say that the first trilogy is mostly YA throughout but in the sequel novels that fades as the characters are older now.

>>25175258
Elves are obviously a metaphor for whites

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If anyone is interested, I just wrote a short little nine page story about death and rebirth
https://pastebin.com/VE37qB0d

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>>25174694
terrible slop

but with a few adjustments........

>>25175564
The Broken God

>>25175592
It does anon. Unfortunately it doesn't quite find its stride until the last arc of book 1

If I finish Bakkers books, will I be unable to enjoy other series because they’re all somehow worse, or is that a mere meme?

It’s my first non-normie fantasy series

>>25175625
by who?

>>25175560
>>25175598
Interesting...thanks for the honest replies

>>25175632
It does sort of kill grimdark for you because nothing else does it quite so well.

>>25174418
Moorcock is always readable. Especially Gloriana.

>>25174558
They probably were friends. Peake wrote "Boy in Darkness" at Moorcock's request.

>>25175044
I might forgive you if you do Stephen R. Donaldson's Gap Cycle series next, I want more anons to read it, but you have to read all five of them.

>>25175802
Edgy slop

>>25175808
Edgy? Yes. Slop? Absolutely not.

moorpussy has literally 0 literally merit, he would be nothing if not for his critique of tolkien

https://meereeneseblot.wordpress.com/2013/10/06/untangling-the-meereenese-knot-part-v-hizdahr-and-peace-or-daario-and-war/
Just read like all 4 of these essays, the last one I read was 4000 words, I asked an AI bot. So im assuming I just read 4000 x 4 words about A Song of Fire and Ice's "complexity".
I did this because I hear about the series so much, and how complex it is and how well written character development is. For the most part I actually found these essays to be very very well written, good quote references to substantiate their point, good basic logical deduction of the actual meaning of the text to substantiate their point, and finally, there conclusion gives little reason to think otherwise, the quotes, aka the premises, aka the evidence perfectly aligns with the conclusion.

BUT. This essay also convinced me the series is not worth reading, at the very least for character and themes. I don't know how many of you actually pay attention to the spiels I sometimes dump here. But I talked in a past thread about the concept of Morally Grey and Black and White, and the problems with both of those framings.

Based on this series of essays (which are by far the deepest and most thorough analysis of the actual depth of the story I've read, which isnt wannabe Sherlock Holmes theory crafting (which ill comment on)) The way GRRM writes is an exact appeal to the idea of gray morality and my problems with it.

So I wont waste my time deconstructing the problems here.

All I get from this, is that Daenerys has the moral depth of a child, who Martin thoroughly needed to go through establishing the flaws of her thinking...for reasons I can only assume are because he also believes that his readers largely possess the moral depth of a child, and have barely pondered the intricacies of actually implementing ones values. Both sides' responses to her Arc in this book I've seen, just seem childish. "She shoulda killed everything" and "She she was naive" GRRM actually seems to choose a more nuanced conclusion. Ill give him credit, based on these essays, hes very thorough about exploring the implications of certain behaviours to a point that things make very clear sense.

Daenerys simply isn't that principled or moral. Shes fickle, and her judgements are based on her feelings, which are predicated ultimately on preconceptions of what is normal to her. That is why she cant compromise, because she doesnt really have real values to hold onto that arent anymore fickle than her whims.

She is not naive, she is not stupid. Shes just shallow like the average person.

So if people like GRRM because he writes in such a way that reveals very clearly the "essence" of a character. Then thats fine.

My problem is that Daenerys based on this isnt an interesting character, the conclusion of her arc is essentially just accepting being the power tripping person that she is, but focusing that on something she has ties to and doesnt need to compromise to have: The Slaveless Westeros.
But this isnt anymore interesting than somebody who makes moral judgements based on the norms of their origin which are the foundation for their feelings.

Her character development didnt deepen her, didnt add anything to her, it just cast an untenable side of her, to focus on a different side of her. I've already outlined prior about how every morally grey story, ultimately devolves into either a subverted comfortable black and white, or into nothingness. This gives impressions of that.

Which evokes another different problem I have with writing: The appeal to the "realistic character". I actually dont disagree with this idea in principle, I just think people's idea of "real" is often empty, because its just affirmations of intuitive understandings of human behaviour. And I have another principle that explains why thats bad writing. But I think Ill just leave it at that.
My impression based on seeing how people talk about ASOFAI is that the more interesting part, seems to be peacing together all the plot threads and formulating theories on that. The people that love the idea of "morally grey" will then treat the characters somewhat like reality television characters where they want to see "real" seeming or "real" imitating people live out their dramatic lives, and because its doused in the shade of morally grey, they can appeal more easily to a broad normalized sense of "complexity". I dont doubt for a second that people genuinely find these characters interesting and engaging, just as I dont doubt people genuinely find real houswives of whateverz to be interesting characters.

I'm just trying to explain why people would call something not complex; complex.
I respect those who like the series, I would just like them to be honest with me. I respect the essay even if I ultimately disagree with its idea of complexity, just as I now respect GRRM and his ability to so thoroughly explore a characters simplicities and the problems and implications of that.

I would appreciate it if anybody point out where I am wrong or misunderstood. I know people who will get mad that Im saying all this based on a book I haven't read. I did watch the show, but I never continued past season 4. So I don't know how relevant that fact is. I wouldn't mind being wrong, the more good fantasy to read the better. But also the less I waste my time reading thousand paged books, the less burnt out on fantasy I'll get.

>>25176043
>>25176045
AI slop.

Did not read.

>We are not so different, Daario and I. We are both monsters. (DANY IV)
A bit funny and cheeky just for the meme, I imagine back in 2011 it wasnt yet so tainted a phrase. I don't even have anything against it, infact I like this trope. Its the argument that matters. Not the idea.

Achamian is obviously a cuck, but isnt Kellhus a cuck too since Serwes kid isnt his

>>25176057
You think that this is of any consequence to Kellhus? That he cares?

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>>25176058
at times it seems like would

>>25175537
your """reviews""" are SHIT
FUCK OFF

dont listen to him
>>25176086

>>25176086
No one likes you here.

the thousandfold thought starts out really really slow. hopefully it'll get better

>>25176109
How can I unsubscribe from your blog-post?

>>25176114
https://www.reddit.com/r/books/

>>25173680
He does a lot of good world building in which he sets terrible cliché stories nobody cares about

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Why does /sffg/ never talk about Chtorr? It has these cute little critters.

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When does it get good?

Anybody here ever read The Vorrh Trilogy books? They any good?

>>25176183
Never, unfortunately.

>>25174418
Can't go wrong with Robert E. Howard, the worst stories from him are still decent.
I love Jack Vance but his ideas are sometimes ridicilous or need a lot of time to gain track. But still great i've you want a longer comfortable read.

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Another book set on the Ringworld never never ever.

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I've finally finished the first of trilogy of the first law books. I was a bit bored for a chunk of the final book because it was a lot of battle action scenes which I didn't enjoy. However, once it was over and the character work came back I remembered how great some of the character writing for this can be.

Bayaz as the villain, the inverse of Gandal and a colossal cunt was enjoyable. His nasty words and attitude towards everyone at the end where he showed his true colours was great. I had a feeling something was up with him but I enjoyed his turn

Glotka remains the most interesting character and him rising to the top to still be an underling was still enjoyable. I'm curious how he will continue in future books.[/spoiler

F to West and F to best boy Jezal for being shat on and humilated constantly. I didn't care for Logen that much this book. His schizo between Logen and the bloody nine was a bit too repetitive for me.

Anyway, I'm taking a first law break and will continue the later books in the future. Are they recommended as well?

>>25175620
I'll write a story in setting.

But really, why does kellhus need Esmenet as his whorefu, if he could have any other woman. there seems to be zero reason other than to humiliate achamian

>>25176337
It is extremely hard for Dunyain to procreated with world borne women. You will understand the reasons for this further in the series. Esmenet for some reason does not have this problem

I really cannot fathom how I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream became so lauded and revered. It's just shitty little short story.

>>25176432
Imagine the Harlan Ellison freakout if he read your post.

>>25176432
He had a lot of sway within the industry.

>>25176337
It's:
First to cuck Achamien so that he will yield the gnosis and also because he realizes she's very intelligent and will produce good seed. But he also predicts that she will be able to bear his seed (unlikely) and turns out to be right because he correctly predicts things constantly which is one of the things he cannot fathom.

>>25176490
This has nothing to do with the gnosis at the point of Achamian's return. Otherwise he would surrender her. When Kellhus starts going after Esmenet, Achamian is already dead in their minds. When he returns she's already pregnant. There is nothing else to be done then.

>>25175633
Sorry, David Zindell.

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i now own three star wars novels
rogue one, death star and revenge of the sith
any other titles i should consider?

>>25176661
Sure, if you like shit.

>>25176292
The original First Law trilogy was a pleasure to read precisely for what you said, the character work. I've heard Heroes and Best Served Cold were alright, but I'm not rushing to read them ahead of anything else.

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>>25176661
I'd recommend these personally (old pic i took a last year so Revenge of the Sith is in there even though you already read it). The old Thrawn Trilogy novels by Timothy Zahn are excellent as well and are the real sequel trilogy we never got.

>>25176661
Darth Plageuis, Darth Bane trilogy and Thrawn are alway the recommended ones

>>25176504
Nah,Achamien has this whole thing about his own damnation he holds on to where he is justified because he gives up everything for the sake of the apocalypse. Giving up Esme is just the fulfillment of this.

Kill Star Goys trannies.

I just finished The Way of Kings.

What did I think of it?

i get it. prince of nothing is really just dune, but with the crusades instead of sandworm thingies as backdrop.

>>25176882
you enjoyed the kaladin bridge sections but thought the end was too anime
you'll attempt the next book and want to kill yourself when it's all about shalan while kaladin spends the entire time crying about being alive or whatever and then you'll drop the series

>>25174190
Is this really Bakker? The prose is really bad.

>>25176897
Anon did not read WoR.

Bakker is KING

>Then the madness fell away. Once again it was the pure thunder of the charge. The strange camaraderie of men bent to a single, fatal purpose. Hummocks, scrub, and the bones of the Vulgar Holy War’s dead rushed beneath. The wind bled through chain links, tousled Thunyeri braids and Tydonni crests. Bright banners slapped against the sky. The heathen, wicked and foul, drew closer, ever closer. One last storm of arrows, these ones almost horizontal to the ground, punching against shield and armour. Some were struck from their saddles. Tongue tips were bitten off in the concussion of the fall. The unhorsed arched across the turf, screamed and swatted at the sky. Wounded mounts danced in frothing circles nearby. The rest thundered on, over grasses, through patches of blooming milkwort waving in the wind. They couched their lances, twenty thousand men draped in great mail hauberks over thick felt, with coifs across their faces and helms that swept down to their cheeks, riding chargers caparisoned in mail or iron plates. The fear dissolved into drunken speed, into the momentum, became so mingled with exhilaration as to be indistinguishable from it. They were addicted to the charge, the Men of the Tusk. Everything focused into the glittering tip of a lance. The target nearer, nearer … The rumble of hooves and drums drowned their kinsmen’s song. They crashed through a thin screen of sumac … Saw eyes whiten in sudden terror. Then impact. The jarring splinter of wood as lances speared through shield, through armour. Suddenly the ground became still and solid beneath them, and the air rang with wails and shouts. Hands drew sword and axe. Everywhere figures grappled and hacked. Horses reared. Blades pitched blood into the sky. And the Kianene fell, undone by their ferocity, crumpling beneath northern hands, dying beneath pale faces and merciless blue eyes. The heathen recoiled from the slaughter—and fled.

KINO

>>25176899
i feel like it really dropped in quality after the first book

>>25176897
I think I'm gonna read some non-Sanderson books before I start Words of Radiance.

I think my general thoughts are
>Kaladin chapters were great
>Dalinar chapters were good, Adolin sections are ok
>Dalinar and Navani is the first decent relationship I've ever seen Brandon write (I read Mistborn first and the romance was terrible)
>Shallan chapters are ok and not as bad as people say (except for Errorgance, that is the worst chapter in the entire book)
>Bridge run chapters were the best, but I don't really like Brandon's actual fight scenes, but I think 90% of authors cannot write good fight scenes that look good/make sense in my head.

As for the Sanderlanche plot twists
>I didn't see Taravangian being secretly a competent villain coming. Not sure how I feel about it.
>Not sure if being aware of Hoid and the Cosmere as a whole (I also read Secret History) diminished some of the reveals.
>Voidbringers = Parshmen/Parshendi didn't surprise me at all. The "lost/true history of Roshar" is probably the most interesting part of the setting.
>Unlike mistborn book 1, this story ends by setting up so many new conflicts/cliffhangers that it made me partly feel like this book with three prologues tricked me into reading a 1200-page prologue the whole time.

>>25176899
I'm enjoying it.

>>25176909
The dialogue is bad. It's something Le Guin brings up in her essay on Poughkeepsie and Elfland. Elfland dialogue should never sound like Poughkeepsie dialogue. 3 masters of prose she beings up are ER Eddison, Kenneth Morris, and Tolkien. If you read their dialogue, not one could be spoken by someone today.

>>25176928
Sorry, meant to reply to >>25176923

>>25176935
The dialogue does sound like Sanderson wrote it.

I'm starting to notice a pattern here. Sanderson is synonymous with bad and Bakker is synonymous with good.

>>25176897
>while kaladin spends the entire time crying about being alive or whatever
I hear about this, and watching characters retread their development in Mistborn I worry that's just something Sanderson doesn't know how to deal with in sequels without character regression.

>>25176923
I gotta continue because I have a few other things to say.
Also I think the book could've been perfect if it were like 200 or 300 pages shorter. There's a lot of Sanderson just restating things he already told us in case we forgot.

The "only women can read/write" culture is really retarded and I think should fall apart with any level of scrutiny, especially if the whole world is aware that The Way of Kings (in-universe) was written by a man. And if women really were in control of all knowledge on Earth, they would've found a way to get out of this bullshit with their "safehands" being needed to be covered.

>>25176818
I wasn't asking.

And it's Achamian, by the way.

GRRM and Bakker are essentially two sides of the same "deconstruction" coin—it’s just that one is for boomers who like the History Channel, and the other is for pseuds who read one Heidegger summary on Wikipedia. While GRRM deconstructs medieval fantasy, Bakker deconstructs the Messiah narrative.

>>25176964
I haven't read Bakker. What has he done that Frank Herbert didn't already do for Messiah characters in Dune?

>>25176966
It's hard to say, the universes and stories are completely different. But you can see Dune and the Lord of the Rings (to a lesser extent) all over his works.

I have too noticed a pattern.

Tell me.

Wolfe is REALLY catching up, impressive

https://strawpoll.com/XOgOVq3Dan3/

How come literary fiction writers say that fiction is dead (meaning literary fiction) because it's not focused on meaningful subjects (see Cormac McCarthy) or that it needs to stop being self-indulgent, but they don't seem to even consider genre fiction when that's what's obviously the solution?

>>25176988
idk nigga it doesnt seem to me like post 2000 genre fiction is focussed on "meaningful subjects"

Favorite Conan/Solomon Kane stories? For Conan it's definitely tower of the Elephant. I just started Solomon Kane but I liked Red Shadows a lot

>>25176988
Both genre and non-genre are dead because both are telling the same old story again and again.

>>25177014
"The Queen of the Black Coast" and "The Tower of the Elephant".

>>25176988
>>25176991
What do you want, The Brothers Karamazov but set in the backdrop of a space opera?

>>25174406
>>25174406
/sffg/ is actually pretty tame. The only reason it looks so bad lately is because of bakkerfag, the dude sperging out 24/7 about said bakkerfag and the other autist who spends all day sharing screencaps about his shit books no one cares about. Like another user said, go visit /vg/

>1 filtered IP
I was wondering if my filtered wasn't working.

>>25174680
>the female characters are essentially just non-entities or trauma-vessels
this is based and probably the only reason I've considered reading he who shall not be named.

>>25177031
Holy ESL.

>>25174406
>people say there are worse generals, but where?
wow classic general and pretty much any general on /vg/ for a single player game that is more than 10 years old. Starcraft 2 General got so bad it was permabanned from /vg/.
/atoga/ on /adv/ (the /soc/ threads were better but got banned) but occasionally gets good.

>>25177044
Sorry, meant to reply to >>25177025

>>25177050
Guild Wars 2 one was purged because of some furry freak who made the general unreadable at one point. I never visited, but the story is almost legendary at this point.

>>25176292
Huh. I found Glokta to become predictable at one point in his unending snark and "wit". He's still a good character but by the third book it just read to me as "the redditor commentating on the book and expecting le subversions". I actually found Logen to be much more compelling.

>>25174406
Danganronpa and League of Legends were partial culprits for the creation of /vg/.

>>25177031
One of the Bakker posts was a copypasta i found in an old thread and i couldn't resist posting it

>>25177054
Your post reminds me that League of Legends general had (maybe still does?) an AI/Machine Learning bot BBC/blacked porn spammer

>>25174406
visual novel general once had the word "fate" spammed 15k times in one thread. i do not know if that was a peak or an average.

>>25176991
They said this in the 20th century.

>>25177051
??

>>25173668
>
is there even any hope for somebody that writes stuff in the vein of King of Elfland's Daughter? Standalone novels written to be dreamy and beautiful without any autistic attention to le magic systems?

>>25173979
I would have voted for Wolfe if it was listed as Solar Cycle and not Book of the New Sun.

>>25177079
No. You have to be an aristocrat who grew up on KJV English otherwise you're a poser.

>>25177083
I’ll vote for Rupi Kaur if I must, if that’s the price for beating the resident schizo and his VPN army

>>25177083
Same. Had to vote for Bakker instead.

I actually like the Bakkerfag.

>>25177126
Narcissist.

>>25177128
You just have bakker derangement syndrome.

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Its not as if I like you or anything... Bakker!

Sanderson jokes about how he cheats by writing 3 prologues for Way of Kings, but no one talks about how he also cheats at the end and gave the book 5 epilogues.

>>25176899
Since when is dialogue prose? The faux social commentary/philosophy parts of the book are some of the weakest written, midwit appealing

Ross Scott Bakker

>>25177148
>Since when is dialogue prose?
?

>>25173979
>series
>Blade Runner
>calling a book the name of its movie adaptation
Good authors are kryptonite to bakkerfag.

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>>25177155
Ever since the movie came out, the book is also sold under the title Blade Runner, for brand recognition

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>>25176964
Eh. I disagree. Kellhus and Prince of Nothing says nothing actually about religion or messiahs. Unless youre a midwit that sees what you want to see, and take those final "philosophical" conversations with Moenghus seriously where he basically just says Religion is a tool.

Wow...social norm and social rules and social rituals are a tool for getting people to do stuff? Wow how intelligent. Besides, the books fundamentally show that with Kellhus' mind reading powers you can appeal to a retard like Esmenet whos only "smart" because the writing says so, without even appealing to religion, instead appealing to her insecurity about a society that makes her feel inferior to men when she doesnt respect or like most men as persons.

>>25177162
>Blade Runner
So he illegally trades in swords and other pointy objects?

>>25176043
>>25176045
Deepest analysis in the entire thread and he didn't even read the book. Surprising.

>>25176964
>GRRM and Bakker are essentially two sides of the same "deconstruction" coin
George was clearly working towards a reconstruction in Feast and Dance. The tv show abandoned that and now everyone thinks he's just a cynical nihilist when he's anything but that.

But is your point that neither of them will finish their stories and dictate the point they set out to make?

Bakker does

Then where is the No-Book- I mean the No-God?

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>>25177192
>everyone thinks he's just a cynical nihilist
Naw he's definitely a nihilistic boomer faggot

https://youtu.be/rUrcThckf1I?t=610&si=yd6MFvrgoioeXjxg

>>25177211
Pretty sure the guy who made that video is a cuckold.

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>Ctrl+F
>Bakker
>50 hits
*SIGH*

>>25176043
Your mistake comes from you having not read the books, which leads you to thinking that the true depth of the story is in Daenerys' plotline and not the King's Landing plotline. The KL plot is the main thing that 90% of fans care about and are invested in. Dany is so separated from the rest of the story that she is frequently considered the worst PoV character. The whole reason she exists is because one day George asked, "What if Sauron was a PoV character and was also an attractive 14-year-old girl?" Because without her PoV in the story, all we know is there's a probably-insane young princess on the other side of the world who's hatched dragons, is raising a slave army mutts, and is crucifying people and bringing ruin to everywhere she goes. She IS the final antagonist of the story, and her PoV is us watching her gradual descent into good-intentioned evil. And Ned bent over backwards and got himself killed to save her life over prioritizing his own survival in the first book.

>>25177219
It has been a slow-day. I just woke up.

>>25176292
My recommendation would be to read the stand-alone books; The Heroes, Best Served Cold, Red Country, and maybe there's another one I'm forgetting. And then only read the Age of Madness trilogy if you are really fiending for more Abercrombie and more of this setting. The drop-off in quality in that trilogy is fairly bad but there are some good characters and great moments there and the storylines that Abercrombie builds up both in the original trilogy and the stand alone books get a decent amount of development in them (expect the Gurkish because brown southern people being evil religious fundamentalists is wrongthink kek)

>>25177219
Yeah sorry it’s so little today

>>25177221
"What if Sauron was a PoV character and was also an attractive 14-year-old girl?"
Out of ten!

>>25177211
I bet this video is utter fucking garbage. I'll probably watch it just to confirm my bias that most people are subhuman retards with zero critical thinking skills.

>>25177225
>expect
Except*

Anybody ever discover which Discord server the Bakkertrannies spam from yet?

>>25177221
>>25177233
She's fucking 14? Kek bruh

why isn't there sexo in El senor de los Rings?

>>25177238
Yup.

>>25177246
Okay. Where?

>>25177250
Your mums rectum

>>25177253
>:^(

>>25177253
Kek