For me it requires demolishing my (unintentional) idolatry towards reason. Once you understand how little we can ever know the autistic screeching about the Bible being unevidenced stops mattering. It is a spiritual thing and no amount of explanation can make it sound convincing until you've experienced it imo. For me it came from studying higher mathematic and learning a bit about how the brain works.

It helps if you have a crisis where something you thought was unassailably true shatters.

Islam, Christianity, Hinduism or Paganism, all of these are equally inconceivable and ludicrous at its surface but they all point towards a God. How do I reconcile this in my mind?

>>25211924
This is all ludicrous. You expect sane myths and religions to express your experience?

>>25211910
there's not a single religion out there that was handcrafted for our time and for our people - its all self interpretation. All of them are being made, preached, and teached for desert people thousand something years ago, not for you or for me, or for other anon in this board, or anyone, nothing. Anyone who claim otherwise are hypocrites and lying to themselves

>>25211910
Even religion can't disprove the existence of a supreme being.
Faith doesn't need a creed. In fact you're better off without one.

>>25211935
>>25211935
That entire framing is fucking retarded. Everything is self created and reinterpreted from moment to moment. Whatever 20th/19th century philosophy you read to reach this conclusion was written for men who lead lives more like those the apostles did than like yours.

Technological disruption proceeds exponentially: The only beliefs worth having are universal.

>>25211935
>there's not a single religion out there that was handcrafted for our time and for our people
Expect for the fact that even the one handcrafted for "our people" (if you mean europeans) pointed towards a Sky father, no different from what Christianity or Islam teaches.

>>25211947
Do you mean Germanic paganism?

We really have almost no idea what they believed compared to Mediterraneans. 95% of the shit you read about it on the Internet is straight up fabricated and most of the stuff in print is severely distorted. I don't think you can draw many conclusions from it one way or the other.

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>>25211950
>Do you mean Germanic paganism?
I mean OG paganism, Yamnaya PIE religion.

>>25211947
>>25211950
For example "allfather" isn't even accurate, snorri mistranslated it. Odins title was more like "lord of the universe", there was no connotation of fatherhood.

>>25211952
Much as I love PIE stuff we know next to nothing about that. I try not to draw many conclusions from it, we could discover something in ten years that might upend all of it.

I do agree the "there's a lord sitting on the top of the hierarchy of reality" is a pretty common motif though, maybe universal for Europeans.

Willing yourself to believe in something you don’t think is true is nihilism

>>25211953
>lord of the universe
Oh, so even more like Christianity/Islam? Point being: all of these people believed in a supreme being. How is esoteric Islam (belief in supremacy of God/Allah) different from Germanic belief in Odin as Lord of the Universe?

My point is that the myths or stories of these religious are just pretext for the masses, 99% of people need a story to believe in. At their core, all of these religions teach the same thing.

>>25211957
Easy solution: Will yourself to also not believe in nihilism.

It's Faith, not nihilism.

>>25211956
>I do agree the "there's a lord sitting on the top of the hierarchy of reality" is a pretty common motif though, maybe universal for Europeans.
My point is that it seems to be universal humanity not just Europeans. Do you agree?

>>25211910
be like jesus. stand up and say the truth to powerful people. perform whatever miracles you can along the way. you'll never have another nihilistic day in your life.

>>25211960
Yeah look at my last post. I sort of agree with you. I'm making an orthogonal point about how we take reconstructed and poorly recorded shit at face values far more than we should.

>>25211910
For me, it was first recognizing and accepting the ubiquitous inclination to sin which exists in all of mankind (concupiscence). Faith helped me work in two directions from there in order to complete the picture. On one hand, there must have been a fall from grace (eating the forbidden fruit) which brought sin into the world. Secondly, man is in need of a savior to redeem him from sin. God gives us a Savior in Jesus Christ. The wages of sin are death, and all men are sinners, but Jesus offers us eternal life if we love Him and turn away from sin (keep the commandments). To keep the commandments and love God means we must die to ourselves (accept the Cross). Either you live only to serve your own sinful desires and die the second death (hell), or you live to serve God and join with Christ in the Resurrection and eternal life. That is the meaning and drama of life.

>>25211910
>the stories in religious texts are all fiction?
Lol, should I tell you?

>>25211965
you cant say thr truth without being a pessimistic or nihilistic.
The people who are constantly happy, the goycattle, who consoomed whatever marvel slop on theater, they lived with their own lies that the life they are living day by day are meaningful and happy. Their happiness however is a jewish fabrication of manipulating their dopamine instead of an an actual, honest, self pleasure

>>25211910
choose to be ethical without religion

>>25211962
I don't know enough about non European traditions to agree or not agree.

can we get some replies by people who have actually had their faith tested

>>25211968
you must be 18 or older to post

>>25211973
Oxymoronic, look up the etymology of religion.

>>25211968
none of this matter when you realize that the reason why you was born in here in this world is because your parents fucked each other, rolling on top of each other on top of that bed matress like a pair of sweaty pigs

>>25211977
I was agnostic-atheist for a while and my faith was used as an excuse to abuse me when I was a kid (not priest rape lol). I still feel distaste towards the rosary because of it. Not sure if you mean that or what.

t. >>25211919

>>25211981
>the reason why you was born in here in this world is because your parents fucked each other, rolling on top of each other on top of that bed matress like a pair of sweaty pigs
Does the fact that you have poop and cum inside you at all times give you an existential crisis too?

>>25211991
Stop trying to make a substance out of it. Life is all about ejaculation and shitting, nothing else, there's no hero journey or heroic death, at the end of the day you will shit in order to stay alive and ejaculate, thats all

>>25211972
You're a boring cunt, and that's the truth. Christ is King.

>>25212002
And? You have a very strong negative attachment to animal existence which I don't think is universal.

>>25211910
history is fiction

>>25211910
History is fiction

>>25211910
God is logically obvious. Does existence exit? Does the potential of existence exist? If potential exists or existence exist, HOW? You need something that exists that never did not exist to prove this. If your question is how do you pick what brand of skydaddy to follow then the answer is just Catholicism and everything else is pure and utter cope. Religions exist and sustain themselves in so far as they acknowledge Jesus Christ. Catholicism absolutely exists because She is fed by the very body of Jesus.
>>25212002
>Life is all about ejaculation and shitting, nothing else,
What then is life?

>>25211979
irrelevant to its meaning

>>25211961
No, it’s nihilism. You’re denying reality and retreating into a fantasy

>>25212027
>God is logically obvious.
Then you should be able to explain why, very succinctly.

>>25212027
>God is logically obvious
Then you should be able to explain why, very succinctly.

>>25212034
There's no reality but what we can perceive, and I perceive God and Christ. They are quite literally more real than you are by all objective metrics.

Also, your autism isn't an argument.

>>25212031
Not at all, all ethical systems are isomorphic to religions in practice.

>>25212051
i willed myself to believe in ethics without religion

>>25211919
Absolute fpbp. This is it.

>>25211919
Also doesn't Polanyi's Logic Of Liberty address this?

>>25212047
See the next sentences

>>25211910
To be a mere Mortal Human, living on a floating circle called Earth, in the middle of an endless space, with other stars, planets so far out that we can only imagine travelling to in a far distant future, for us to proclaim God, a Creator of the planet we live on, and the vastness of the unexplored galaxy, space, planets, stars, universe and beyond, to proclaim we know nothing created it, is to simply put our heads in the ground saying "sunlight doesnt exist".

Clearly God existents, and we attempt to pay respect to God, many proclaim God to be represented through religions, animism or self spiritualism. Regardless it's all humans attempting to worship God, an entity we cannot grasp, and the closer an indviduals worship to god relates to universality, the more closer it is to God.

If not, then we'd not be a species, we'd evolve as one organism over thousands of thousands of years, but instead we don't, we evolve to live, create live and die together as different individuals from this species. Many simply refuse to look at reality through the lens of existential acceptance.

>>25211924
What is ridiculous, is being a mortal arguing over whether God exists or not. Clearly we live in this universe, evolution exists, technology exists, science exists, laws of reality exist, and the universe is so vastly unexplored. These are signs that this system of existence is created by an Entity. To pretend nothing created a system is to pretend nothing exists, while existing. Many Athiests will say "life is what you make of it" which isnt true, we didn't make Earth, we didnt make Stars, we didnt make this Universe, we are existing in anothers creation, and we have explored 0.0000000000000000001% of it? Clearly it is instinctive to believe in God, and majority of humanity in all of history believed in God, it's only until academia said "God doesnt exist, because of human hypocrisy! and we cant find God, and life is what we make of it" <----- thats not logically coherent lol. It's simply Cope Pill. Humanity in the year 3000 if there is no major war or natural disaster, is predicted to be so technologically and cognitively advanced, that we would look like literal monkies playing with electricity, and from their perspective to look at us saying "ah we know god doesnt exist" would be seen as foolishness.

We are primitive A F, how about learn to colonize the galaxy first, see whats out there before pretending God doesnt exist. Regardless of different religions or ways to worship god, as long as it's univerally ethincal, positive for the species then it's closer to god. as he is universal, and simply unknowable from our primitive monkey perspective, ooo ooo aaa aaa sex. Ooo ooo aa aaa money, ooo ooo aaa aaa praise. etc.

test

>>25212027
>What then is life?
something that exist because of ejaculation

>>25212047
My post does so.

>>25211919

Had the opposite experience from this. My belief in God is gone for good.

>there is more to existence than mankind knows and might ever know
>materialism is too reductive logically to be correct
Yes
>but these ancient jews in the desert figured it out
>obey them for eternity
No

>believe in math a human projection to be eternal objective truth
>can't believe in God a human projection to be eternal objective truth.

I've never been particularly bothered by nihilism.
>Reality is fundamentally meaningless.
Yeah, so what?
If life has intrinsic purpose, I would see that as awfully restrictive, but since it doesn't, I'm free to do whatever I want relatively free of consequence.
I can eat a delicious burger, have sex with a beautiful woman, develop an elaborate philosophical system that ultimately leads nowhere, many "pointless" things.
You feel as if things make be eternal or etched in the sky by God in order to be significant, which is a masochistic grandiosity that only serves to cripple your own potential.
It's ultimately your choice, though, which can either be paralyzing or empowering.

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>>25212219
“It would be better if there were nothing. Since there is more pain than pleasure on earth, every satisfaction is only transitory, creating new desires and new distresses, and the agony of the devoured animal is always far greater than the pleasure of the devourer.”

People who say what you're saying are just asking to get Job'd. All your examples are aesthetic, how do they possibly balance out against the horrors that can afflict a human being? Having sex with a beautiful woman is only so much of a consolation when your daughter is raped, or your tribe is enslaved. There has to be something more than aesthetic enjoyment, or else the line between staying alive and slitting one's wrists is remarkably thin.

>>25212230
I've experienced certain degrees of "horrors" in my life, such as homelessness, incarceration, insanity, various things that should've broken me into terminal cynicism, which admittedly does emerge from time to time.
Regardless, I would experience all that agony again, hunger, pain, a complete loss of all rational faculties, because they've reinforced and refined my character into something I'm becoming increasingly satisfied with. The relief I feel is enormous, as I'm grateful to be alive from even having attempted suicide before, and I can look back on all these negative experiences as personally enriching. They've given me enhanced abilities to relate to people, to form meaningful, rewarding bonds that adds to the pleasantness in the world, and a part or me decided to destroy myself with addiction for precisely this reason, so I could more intimately understand the nature of suffering so I could help pull people out.
It takes rigor, strength, virtue rights overcome the the evils of the world, which is more than immersing oneself in aesthetic pleasures. It's the logical impossibility endpoint of the fundamental drive to improve one's conditions so that life becomes ultimately worth living.

>Raised Catholic, run of the mill Catholic school upbringing
>Never got too deep into it growing up but pray, go to mass when I can/holidays, live like Jesus says as best I can
>See online LARP about young men joining the Church in droves all over the internet like it’s some kind of movement
>Decide to rigorously study Catholic philosophy, Church teachings and the Bible and take it fully seriously
>Completely lose faith from this and realize it’s just a bunch of stories and made up history to get you to act a certain way and Jesus probably was just some apocalyptic preacher that got mythologized
>Feel like shit

Well now what? This is 100% a serious post. I feel people are willfully ignorant to be faithful and not look further into the origins and teachings of what they put faith in. Apolegetics is ridiculous too. It’s a horrible feeling.

>>25211968
>Evolution clearly true, we are basically big apes
>Apes like to fuck and eat and kill eachother
>Consciousness arises
>Big apes now feel bad doing some of those things to people because it harms the community
If anything it wasn’t a fall, we got BETTER than our ancestors. We rose up from pure animal instict. Unless you think two hominids actually ate a fruit in a magical garden somewhere.

>>25211910
Things can be True while being fiction.

>>25212190
>jews received Logos via revelation
>greeks pondered Logos via reason
>union manifests truth on earth
Doesnt bother me

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>>25211910

>>25212129
What a horribly reductionist viewpoint

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>>25211910
On the contrary, historical evidence (such as there is) corroborates quite well with the events of the Bible. However, no amount of evidence or argument will convince you that God does or doesn't exist; they can lead you to it, or away from it, but to believe is an act of the will. Think upon the prayer: "Lord I believe; help my unbelief." Also if you want to believe I suggest you surround yourself with religious imagery and information, read the Scriptures, read the Church Fathers, read the religious poets; try and understand why people believe that what you call "fiction" is more true than "facts and logic."
>>25211919
A little off-topic from the thread, but I can relate. It's very easy, especially if you can read and write or do mathematics well, to let your own intellect and understanding rule your life. It's especially easy to feel that way with the internet.
Funny enough, Infinite Jest of all things was the book that really helped me recognize it and start to work on it.

What are the differences between what you call fiction and not fiction?
Where does it come from? Why is it so? What's the basis for their differing worth?
Why? And why do you need a why? Why are we asking why? What is 'it'? And if you don't care why don't you care?
You'll find the answer at the heart of all doubt.

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>>25211910
>i can't find any evidence for this thing is want to believe in
>can anyone help me believe in it anyways???

This is a really dumb way to reason. Anyways, read these.

>>25212301
>to get you to act a certain way
So, to be clear, you think a bunch of Galileean modwit heavily accented fishermen, some Jewish tax collector, and an anal retentive rabbi conspired to get people to take care of the poor and all of them died for it so that they could, what? Pull a prank? Get a lambo? What is the benefit of doing that to anyone? St. Paul in Colossians says EXPLICITLY to watch out for anyone wants to control your diet or what you touch or taste or hold (this is a heavily Jewish and pagan context with taboos but still). Does the Church somehow profit every time you don't wack off? Only spiritually of course.
>go to mass when I can/holidays, live like Jesus says as best I can
It's possible you were not in a state of grace, albeit also possible you were. You need to go to Mass every Sunday and holy days of obligation unless you have legitimate exceptions. I hate to say but run of the mill Catholics are nearly all accidental heretics or heterodox.
>>25212129
Is food that what is chewed? Are the words you're reading a mere motion of fingers and a vibration of air?

>>25212301
You either never get it back again or go down the insufferable "it's bs but I'm going to pretend that doesn't matter and just go along with the feel-good social vibes" route. ie total fucking cowardice - unless it's for the sake of your kids, which makes it a bit better.

>t.never had any faith

>>25212870
There's an ancient Mesopotamian account of a man eating a lamb alive in front of guards to prove that the monarchy was in crisis. He ate a lamb alive to produce a sign.

People do dumb shit to prove points.

>>25212875
This is insane level of cope. Pray to the Blessed ever-Virgin Mary for like two minutes, "Help my Faith."

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>>25211910
Rid?

>>25212877
Fwiw, I'll just tell you: Whatever you think about the Catholic Church reveals who you are (Her wounds are yours, Her "errors" are yours). She will accept your faults as Her own in appearance out of Her perfect himility. You believe it was lies to control you? It's not. Lying is a sin.

>>25212878
>>25212882
It's genuinely ridiculous that in the modern world, on modern fucking 4chan, there are unironic christcucks. fuck me.

>>25212891
It's literally the best place to evangelize. Do you think people on facebook care about the Truth? You people only care about the Truth or you wouldn't be here

>>25211910
If you don't want to dread nihilism just learn to look at 0 as +0 instead of -0.

>>25211910
Because in the end, belief in a theistic thought, is not about abolishing reason but a rejection of those who reject God. It's a manichean, cruel thought. You are with us or against us. Those who sin are forever banished and those who love God are forever saved. A life is just 75 years. The actions of man do not deserve so much. Study Buddhism. Read the Pali canon. Read the Diamond and Heart Sutras. Read about the infinite Buddhas. Your salvation will not be found in the hands of the other and salvation, in the first place, should not be discriminatory.

>>25211910
>believe in God when the stories in religious texts are all fiction?

"According to the tenets of Hyperstition, there is no difference in principle between a universe, a religion, and a hoax. All involve an engineering of manifestation, or practical fiction, that is ultimately unworthy of belief. Nothing is true, because everything is under production. Because the future is a fiction it has a more intense reality than either the present or the past. Ccru uses and is used by hyperstition to colonize the future, traffic with the virtual, and continually re-invent itself."

"Deprogramming simultaneously retro-produced the program, just as witch-trials preceded devil-worship and regressive hypnotherapy preceded false memory syndrome. Yet, once these ‘fictions’ are produced, they function in and as reality."

"In the hyperstitional model Kaye outlined, fiction is not opposed to the real. Rather, reality is understood to be composed of fictions – consistent semiotic terrains that condition perceptual, affective and behaviorial responses."
"Kaye maintained that it was ‘far from accidental’ that Burroughs’s equation of reality and fiction had been most widely embraced only in its negative aspect – as a variety of ‘postmodern’ ontological skepticism – rather than in its positive sense, as an investigation into the magical powers of incantation and manifestation: the efficacy of the virtual."

"Whereas hyperstitional agitation produces a ‘positive unbelief’ – a provisionalizing of any reality frame in the name of pragmatic engagement rather than epistemological hesitation – OGU [One God Universe] feeds on belief. In order to work, the story that runs reality has to be believed, which is also to say that the existence of a control program determining reality must not be suspected or believed. Credulity in the face of the OGU meta-narrative is inevitably coupled with a refusal to accept that entities like Control have any substantive existence. That’s why, to get out of OGU, a systematic shedding of all beliefs is a prerequisite. “Only those who can leave behind everything they have ever believed in can hope to escape” (WL116). Techniques of escape depend on attaining the unbelief of assassin-magician Hassan i Sabbah: nothing is true, everything is permitted. Once again, Kaye cautioned that this must be carefully distinguished from ‘postmodern relativism’. Burroughs-Sabbah’s ‘nothing is true’ cannot be equated with postmodernism’s ‘nothing is real’. On the contrary: nothing is true because there is no single, authorized version of reality – instead, there is a superfluity, an excess, of realities. “The Adversary’s game plan is to persuade you that he does not exist” (WL12)."

>>25212179
What happened, anon?

>>25211910
>>25213038
" In Burroughs’ mythology, OGU emerges once MU (the Magical Universe) is violently overthrown by the forces of monopoly (WL113). The Magical Universe is populated by many gods, eternally in conflict: there is no possibility of unitary Truth, since the nature of reality is constantly contested by heterogeneous entities whose interests are radically incommensurable. Where monotheistic fiction tells of a rebellious secession from the primordial One, Burroughs describes the One initiating a war against the Many: “These were troubled times. There was war in the heavens as the One God attempted to exterminate or neutralize the Many Gods and establish an absolute seat of power. The priests were aligning themselves on one side or the other. Revolution was spreading up from the South, moving from the East and from the Western deserts” (WL101).

OGU is “antimagical, authoritarian, dogmatic, the deadly enemy of those who are committed to the magical universe, spontaneous, unpredictable, alive. The universe they are imposing is controlled, predictable, dead” (WL59). Such a universe gives rise to the dreary paradoxes – so familiar to monotheistic theology – that necessarily attend omnipotence and omniscience.

“Consider the One God Universe: OGU. The spirit recoils in horror from such a deadly impasse. He is all-powerful and all-knowing. Because He can do everything, He can do nothing, since the act of doing demands opposition. He knows everything, so there is nothing for him to learn. He can’t go anywhere, since He is already fucking everywhere, like cowshit in Calcutta. … The OGU is a prerecorded universe in which He is the recorder” (WL113).

For Kaye, the superiority of Burroughs’s analysis of power – over ‘trivial’ ideology critique – consists in its repeated emphasis on the relationship between control systems and temporality. Burroughs is emphatic, obsessive: “[I]n Time any being that is spontaneous and alive will wither and die like an old joke” (WL111). “A basic impasse of all control machines is this: Control needs time in which to exercise control” (WV 339). OGU control codings far exceed ideological manipulation, amounting to cosmic reality programming, because – at the limit – “the One God is Time” (WL111). The presumption of chronological time is written into the organism at the most basic level, scripted into its unconsciously performed habituated behaviors: “Time is that which ends. Time is limited time experienced by a sentient creature. Sentient of time, that is – making adjustments to time in terms of what Korzybski calls neuro-muscular intention behaviour with respect to the environment as a whole ... A plant turns towards the sun, nocturnal animal stirs at sun set ... shit, piss, move, eat, fuck, die. Why does Control need humans? Control needs time. Control needs human time. Control needs your shit piss pain orgasm death” (AP 17). "

>>25212870
> It's possible you were not in a state of grace, albeit also possible you were. You need to go to Mass every Sunday and holy days of obligation unless you have legitimate exceptions.
This is the pill that is hardest for me to swallow. I am Christian. I do believe in Christ. But I think faith in the process is the part that’s most difficult to me despite having faith in Jesus, if that makes sense.

One of the most peaceful time in my life was in December last year, where I confessed and spent a month fully following the commandments as best I could and praying. I won’t lie and say it did not feel like a big weight had left me. As time went on, I’m much better but still sometimes very anxious about the future and my well being. My attendance to church has become not so disciplined, though I still try.

It just sometimes feels so hard to grasp. Some times I feel that utter peace, others it feels out of reach. I don’t wanna make it sound like my life is a complete hell. All is good in general. But mentally I can sometimes torture myself.

>>25212891
I've been here (well, mostly altchans) since 2011 buddy. Pray to Niel DeGrasse Tyson about it.

>>25213038
I can't help but feel that all this CCRU adjacent shit is 99% style 1% substance. Also no, witch trials did not precede devil worship. A later larp mythology did form but there really were medieval people who practiced weird explicitly-evil folk magic occasionally. Germanic pre Christian ritual was no stranger to human sacrifice.

>>25213062
>But I think faith in the process is the part that’s most difficult to me despite having faith in Jesus, if that makes sense.
There is a legitimate quasi-post-modern strain in mysticism that should not be ignored nor denied. What I think God likes is really what I imagine God likes based on what others have said and what feels true; I understand God in a very, very limited way and I probably wouldn't be right about what He loves. When someone says, albeit however well-intentioned, something like, "God loves x," with a one-dimensional simplicity, there is a sense in which we are supposed to believe that this apparent, simple "peasant piety' is somehow more "childlike" than someone who really wrestles with the Faith. This is untrue. "Being converted as little children" here means one who trusts the Faith absolutely but is honest about one's feeling of inadequacy and limitations therein that do give rise to visible contradictions. This Douay-Rheims translation of Psalm 80 always strikes me:
>Thou calledst upon me in affliction, and I delivered thee: I heard thee in the secret place of tempest: I proved thee at the waters of contradiction.
True piety, in the Catholic sense, looks far closer to blasphemy than to piety. After all, what was Our Master condemned for? What is more blasphemous than eating a resurrected Person's heart Who is God?

>>25212356
Even this is odd. Socrates said he had a voice in his head command him to investigate things and question things that weren't true. This is summarily ignored by moderns for some reason.

>>25212190
>hasn't eternally vowed himself as an eternal slave of Jesus Christ
ngmi

>>25213241
>t. slave of the devil
Gotta serve somebody.

>>25213294
My post wasn't sarcastic.

>>25213236
isnt this just OCD/intuition

>>25213398
Does this sound like it?
>Some one may wonder why I go about in private giving advice and busying myself with the concerns of others, but do not venture to come forward in public and advise the state. I will tell you why. You have heard me speak at sundry times and in divers places of an oracle or sign which comes to me, and is the divinity which Meletus ridicules in the indictment. dThis sign, which is a kind of voice, first began to come to me when I was a child; it always forbids but never commands me to do anything which I am going to do. This is what deters me from being a politician.
Correction: it never positively commanded him.

>>25211910
>>25212025
>>25212015
Reality is fiction.

>>25213459
>Reality is fiction.
>>25213038
>>25213056
"Power operates most effectively not by persuading the conscious mind, but by delimiting in advance what it is possible to experience. By formatting the most basic biological processes of the organism in terms of temporality, Control ensures that all human experience is of – and in – time. That is why time is a ‘prison’ for humans. “Man was born in time. He lives and dies in time. Wherever he goes he takes time with him and imposes time” (GC 17).

Korzybski’s definition of man as the ‘time-binding animal’ has a double sense for Burroughs. On the one hand, human beings are binding time for themselves: they “can make information available over any length of time to other men through writing” (GC 66). On the other hand, humans are binding themselves into time, building more of the prison which constrains their affects and perceptions. “Korzybski’s words took on a horrible new meaning for Burroughs in the library,” Kaye said, “he saw what time-binding really was, all the books, already written, time bound forever”.

Since writing customarily operates as the principal means of ‘time-binding’, Burroughs reasoned that innovating new writing techniques would unbind time, blowing a hole in the OGU ‘pre-sent’, and opening up Space. “Cut the Word Lines with scissors or switchblades as preferred … The Word Lines keep you in time … Cut the in lines … Make out lines to Space” (WV 270). Space has to be understood not as empirical extension, still less as a transcendental given, but in the most abstract sense, as the zone of unbound potentialities lying beyond the purview of the OGU’s already-written.

“You can see that Burroughs’s writing involves the highest possible stakes,” Kaye wrote. “It does not represent cosmic war: it is already a weapon in that war. It is not surprising that the forces ranged against him – the many forces ranged against him, you can’t overestimate their influence on this planet – sought to neutralize that weapon. It was a matter of the gravest urgency that his works be classified as fantasies, experimental dada, anything but that they should be recognized as what they are: technologies for altering reality.” "

>>25212034
Is reality even real though?

>>25212301
Same exact thing but I got really, really, really into Catholicism. It hurt to leave. If the love of God is infinite losing my family in a housefire would've been less of a loss. Still trying to reconcile things. Hope it gets better for you anon

>>25212878
>This is insane level of cope. Pray to the Blessed ever-Virgin Mary for like two minutes, "Help my Faith."
Nta but the year before I left the Church i prayed the Memorare every morning and night with the intention of strengthen my faith. It only declined further. Unless I end up converting on my deathbed, this type of thing does nothing

>>25212301
in the same boat but protestant

>>25212301
>what now?
What's your ethnic background? Where do you live (country/state)?

>>25211910
If you assume an omnipotent God who works in mysterious ways, you can excuse away all of the issues you have with the bible.

>>25213316
My bad, anon, please forgive me.

>>25211910
All you need to do is talk to God. You can do it quietly in your mind. You don’t have to kneel or close your eyes every time. Just look at a tree and think of him. He speaks through all things.
Though it may take time. It happened so gradually to me. For many months I felt nearly how you described. Often his voice can feel very quiet, but it is constant like a gentle whistle of wind. I am starting to feel that this voice is not quiet at all but our world drowns it out or we learn to ignore it. But I see now that wherever I look it is there.

>>25212870
>So, to be clear, you think a bunch of Galileean modwit heavily accented fishermen, some Jewish tax collector, and an anal retentive rabbi conspired to get people to take care of the poor and all of them died for it so that they could, what? Pull a prank? Get a lambo? What is the benefit of doing that to anyone?
Jesus thought the world was ending imminently and was rebelling against the old covenant for the people of Israel. He openly ignored gentiles. I doubt he thought his teachings would spread worldwide or would be misrepresented by Paul so badly. Paul was a pharisee supposedly also rebelling thinking the world was ending imminiently too and loved rules.

We don’t even really know what the actual people in the gospels said or did, they werent written by eyewitnesses and were AFTER Pauls letters. We don’t even know who was martyrd or when or if at all

>>25211910
Nietzsche

No gods are necessary to kick the dippiness of nihilism.

>>25214307
Anecdotally, I have never met someone who claimed that they "did the Catholic thing" and did not have a serious misunderstanding of the Church. Can She command you to believe something? If you refuse to believe it, and it is clearly and authoritatively taught, is that definitionally heresy?

>>25214442
Absolutely nothing you said is correct or has any substance other than Paul being potentially open to a more immanent eschaton.

>>25214339
You're not contrite and you're a baiter. I forgive you for that.

>>25212891
only catholics and muslims are this cringe

>>25214527
What does a sinner sound like to a saint?

>>25214522
What about what I said wasn’t correct? Let’s hear it. Please don’t tell me you think the gospels literally happened as written?

>>25214566
Everything but what I said was partly correct was totally correct.
>Please don’t tell me you think the gospels literally happened as written?
There are likely small variants in exact wordings and some orders of things happening but overall they are literally the truest historical document we have from that period.

>>25211910
You're mixing the meta with the normative. I see this confusion a lot. People just can't seem to help but make these category errors in philosophical discussions. Nothing matters, so what? A movie is also meaningless in the grand schema of all things considered yet I can allow myself to like or dislike it. You can set up your life around normative values that you find positive without it being grounded in any higher purpose or divinity. Your life being meaningless (not in your control) has got nothing to do with you doing the right thing (in your control), these are two different categories all together.

>>25214602
>You’re incorrect but also correct
Schizo?
>The truest historical document from that era
That doesn’t make them true or historical though

>>25214602
and if we are to trust those documents it was pretty clear Jesus though the end times were less than a generation away.

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>>25212230
>There has to be something more than aesthetic enjoyment, or else the line between staying alive and slitting one's wrists is remarkably thin.
Well the line between you staying alive and everything you've decided is immaculate and sacred and valuable being snuffed out is also very thin. This whole "being a living human" business is a very romantic thing, we're just so often ground into a jaded and dull state by the things we do to ourselves (and other people do to us) that we often forget how much of this extravagant tragedy or euphoria can strike us in an instant. But it's a swift and unpredictable thing. It's only fitting that what we live for is just as much of a fickle, pernicious thing.