St. Augustine believed that the multiplicity of identity, a fragmented life of sin, can find unity in a singularity—when one unifies their self with God.“What then am I, O my God? What is my nature?”“I have become a problem to myself.”“You were more inward to me than my most inward part…”“Late have I loved you… You were within me, but I was outside myself.”“My weight is my love; by it I am carried wherever I am carried.”“The mind commands the body and is obeyed… the mind commands itself and is resisted.”“Grant me chastity and continence, but not yet.”“Great is the power of memory… a vast court or palace.”“I became to myself a vast problem.”“Our heart is restless until it rests in you.”
>>25224287Ok, and where are you going with this thread?
>>25224356Here comes the aeroplane!
If life in sin be multiplicity, life in God unity, whence ariseth the desire of a unified being to multiplicity? What divine original nurtured rebellion?
>>25224437God loves you and you know that, so you work towards finding his love more clearly.
>>25224287Makes sense to me. In my journey towards (I hope) becoming a better Christian I've become a lot more aware of myself and my constituent parts, often in service of turning those parts and their faculties towards the work of God.
>>25224441My question is why were we disunified from God's love in the first place? or rather, what was the genesis of the snake's sollicitation? What command of God ordered deception into creation?
>>25224287How did this concept track over time? I'm an intellectual historian. Don't mind me.
>>25224454>My question is why were we disunified from God's love in the first place?Because we’re given free will and chose wisdom. The serpent is merely the absence of god, and in that absence, god gave us a choice between him and Satan (absence, lack of essence, freedom).
>>25224455I’m sure Augustine borrows from Plato and the Neoplatonic tradition.
>>25224373Ok, but where are you going with your thread? You just made a statement.
>>25224492That’s how discussions start, if you hadn’t noticed.
>>25224460What in God's nature prompted Him to absent Himself from His creation if he saw that it was good?
>>25224287>St. Augustine believed that the multiplicity of identity, a fragmented life of sin, can find unity in a singularity—when one unifies their self with GodlolThat sentence uses a lot of flowery, overly intellectual talk to mask a very basic truth. Augustine's real point was that a life of sin is a life of being pulled in a dozen different directions, leaving you broken and exhausted. You will never have a clear head or a quiet heart until you stop your restless wandering and find your footing in the glory of God. It's really not that complicated. You have a clearer view of "who yoi are" when all your efforts are focused on conforming yourself to the Word and glorifying God.
>>25224667Which is a wretched, sinful creature from dirt, totally reliant on Christ and his redemptive work on the cross, btw.
>>25224654Forcing your creation to love you isn't real love
>>25224654For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, declares the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts.
>>25224699Yes. Amen. >>25224686The holiness of God is traumatic to unholy people. We reject Him because we want a god we can judge, rather than a God who has the right to judge us. We have the audacity to put the Creator on trial using the very mind he gave us, proving that our sense of justice is as broken as our hearts.
Christians are mentally children
>>25224705It's s mistake to confuse our calling to humility and submission for naivete.
>>25224715>>25224707Replied to the wrong post
>>25224460>Because we’re given free will and chose wisdom. The serpent is merely the absence of god, and in that absence, god gave us a choice between him and SatanBut Satan was a fallen angel, so do angels have free will as well? Or was he purposely made to rebel and then to test humanity's free will?
>>25224686The wording here implies God needs to feel/be loved. That doesn't seem correct. Why did God *want* to create a being with free will in the first place?
>>25224724Sounds like you’ve already answered your question. Refer to the bible for the answers. I’m not even Christian, just don’t know why people struggle to understand Christianity when it’s lined out for anyone to read
Scripture doesn't say that God is holy, but HOLY, HOLY, HOLY. One should at least attempt to understand the holiness and righteousness of God, and what what means, before attempting to criticize God's actions from a moral or ethical position. If for nothing more than to understand what Christians actually believe and avoid the typical "oh wow you actually worship a being that condemns men to hell and has flooded the earth " befuddlement.
>>25224744>when it’s lined out for anyone to readIt's actually not 'lined out' whether angels have free will and what their exact powers are. Eg it's an open debate if they can know our minds similar to the Godhead, or if Satan's ability to manipulate just comes from observing humanity for so long. Or the question of if Satan was the only angel to ever rebel, why he rebelled, and so on.
>>25224750If the other angels didn’t turn into demons, then they obviously either chose to follow god or never had free will. It’s a logically deductive conclusion.
>>25224748God is defined in many church confessionals as wholly good, and that all good things spring from him. But what's the Chrisitian answer to the Euthyphroean question? Is there some pre-God-ordained Goodness that he perfectly aligns with? Or is what is Good, good because he aligns with it?
>>25224753>then they obviously either chose to follow god or never had free will. It’s a logically deductive conclusion.Senseless in the Wittgensteinean sense because you simply said "it's either A or not A." That doesn't answer which one it actually is, which was my question
>>25224759Then read the bible and don’t ask me.
>>25224750nta anon, but it's actually irrelevant to your point because the actions of angels and Satan were ordained by God, as He is an absolute sovereign, and all things work towards His purposes.>Remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me, declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, ‘My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose
>>25224764I didn't ask (((you)))
>>25224767That is the biblical answer but it's also unsatisfying because it's entirely tautological.
>>25224287good thing my stonecold chud philosopher freed western consciousness from all this guiltfagging,
>>25224756The dilemma is a misunderstanding because goodness is not a rule above God or a random choice He makes, but is simply who He is by nature. Since He is the very definition of what is right, we cannot use our own limited sense of fairness to judge Him without proving how little we actually understand about holiness. Which is why an understanding of what His holiness actually means snd entails is so vitally important.
>>25224767>>25224774Everything is ordained by God including whether or not you accept that everything is ordained by God, if you do, that's God's plan, if you don't that's God's plan, and they both work towards His ultimate purpose.
>>25224782But just as we cannot judge God we also cannot fully understand what his holiness actually means and entails, nor his ultimate purpose in creating the heavens, angels, us, etc, as entailed by >>25224699
>>25224774The logic only appears circular because there is nothing outside of God for the argument to lean on.>>25224785Exactly. Yes.>>25224789One doesn't require a perfect understanding to mitigate the issues thst arise when contending with Christian belief from a place of near total ignorance of the concept.
>>25224494No a discussion starts with a hypothesis, the following anon poses a statement to that hypothesis, a statement which is either positive or negative.
Pseuds: The Thread
itt
>>25224906>>25225299I'm trans btw in case anyone cares.
>>25225299Most retarded thing I've seen on /lit. Why would Jews try to make people Christian? This is what happens when you browse /pol too much anon.
>>25224686I guess every child that dies of cancer should have been more focused on loving God
>God's love is inevitable and ubiquitous and inherent to all things which is why I need to dress it up in prose nobody will actually understand
>>25227685>Why would Jews try to make people Christian?Hmmm today I will learn who the first people to try and make others christian were
>>25224707I'm gonna beat you like a child
>>25227702>
>>25227693you should have done that too, since you contracted AIDS
>>25224287In Latin he sounds even better.
>>25224287St. Augustine was gay for god, and I for one think that's pretty neat.
>>25227805Hahahahahahahah fuckin nailed xer ass
>>25224437men get dual natures when forced, in addition to getting sullen and impulsive. but, since no one cares about men, lets talk about how women when they get graped end up with a dual nature
>>25224667right, and socrates would say that the unexamined life isnt worth living. but it doesnt matter how philosophical you are about it, the question is whether to extrajudicially execute the divorce judge and spend the rest of your life in jail, or to tell your child that you have to drop them off and you cant come to their birthday but mommy loves you. realistically, the massive wanton slaughter of the divorce industrial complex and burning of all churches is an absolute moral imperative for every man, however, recognizing the military incapacity to perform his military duty makes a man unattractive towards women, so again, he either displays a bizzare ayn rand dual nature of i am not a member of this basedciety, or he just doesnt even try to reproduce
>>25224667>uses more words and a more flowery language
