Has it finally been deboonked?
Early life status?
These threads are always made in bad faith
>>25288612It was prebunked by Arry millennia ago:>Some things there are, again, a deficiency in which mars blessedness; good birth, for instance, or fine offspring, or even personal beauty: for he is not at all capable of happiness who is very ugly, or is ill-born, or solitary and childless.
>NOOO, you can't say capitalism is making life shit, you have to have to say life itself is to blame and so you should must blame your parents>life is innately sorrow, grief is the default. That makes total sense, right? Obviously we evolved to hate lifeIf you don't want to reproduce, no problem, but it is clearly horseshit that you can end humanity by doing it or that it is the problem itself. Refusing to reproduce will not end capitalism or what is making life so awful to begin, and because capitalism needs people for the reserve army of labor, if you don't reproduce they will easily find people who willLife can be fixed but only by ending labor alienation
Reminder that anti-natalists are likely to be mentally ill and have a personality disorder
>>25288992This doesn't mean that anti-natalist arguments can be dismissed solely due to this fact (inb4 crying about ad hom); it does however add context to why autists make these threads and are completely unable to understand why they are wrong. It also has direct implications regarding Benatar's quality of life argument (i.e. anti-natalists are stuck in a rigid ideological system as a cope for to sustain their defective worldview).Say you're designing a logo and you want to market test for the most appealing shade of red. Would you want most of those in your sample population to suffer from protanopia?
>>25288992Anti-natalists are at a complete poverty when it comes to weighing quality of life. Their defective nature simply precludes them from accepting any rationalization outside of their own self-indoctrination. They don't necessarily mean to be disingenuous because such is simply written into their nature.Also note that the more you talk to them the more you'll realize a sick fascination with harm, violence, and death. These people don't want to reduce harm, they want to justify their resentment and spread their misery.
>Benatar/interviewer go for a walk in the park>surrounded by lovers and families enjoying a nice sunny day>interviewer forwards the idea that life can be improved>Benatar raises his voice and starts sperging that life never improves (objectively false by the way)>Benatar literally starts crying: "life is unacceptable">interviewer is taken aback by his outburst and at a loss for words (Benatar is inconsolable)Benatar is a mentally unstable weasel so it's no wonder he mostly avoids interviews. On top of that he admits that his ideas are damaging while using the excuse that his work is academic and only meant for those that seek it out (note that these people are likely to have personality disorders and mental illness). Benatar objectively creates suffering and given that he's under the delusion that his work is toward the opposite: he's delusional and irrational.This is the figurehead of anti-natalism. A sniffling sad sack who can't even hold it together in a park on a sunny summer afternoon and finish an interview without having a nervous breakdown. Remember this the next time this loser makes another one of his "I CAN'T BREED" threads as if it's anyone else's problem but his own. Remember this the next time one of these losers starts sperging delusions about how he really cares about suffering when the reality is anti-natalists are just depressive headcases attempting to intellectualize their pathetic nature while mentally masturbating about their delusions all because absolutely no one wants to fuck them.
>>25289016>a sniffling sad sack who can't even hold it together in a park on a sunny summer afternoon and finish an interview without having a nervous breakdownHe's just like me frI agree with the three posts above as well. As one of the "depressive headcases" of the world, it seems to me that others experience a very different reality than I do. I have to imagine that my experience is heavily colored by my various neurological abnormalities. I'm also a eugenicist because I can't really see any upside to living like this
>>25288992I don't think many of them are genuine in their beliefs and just parrot things they see elsewhere uncritically. I don't agree with, for example, Zapfe, but his essay was well written and laid out his points clearly and concisely. Yet you never see it mentioned because it's a 10 page bit of norwegian writing on why human consciousness constantly self-mutilates to be able to exist in the universe rather than some le epic chud takedown or whatever. It's just some guy putting what he believes and why to sit there. It's always the 'sexy' antinatalists.
>>25288992You're in every one of these threads and you can still only manage ad hominems?
>>25288612It was debunked before it was even written
the author unironically believes Israel should exist. Hilariously ethnocentric Jew psychopath of him https://archive.is/0A53y
>>25289794>Antinatalism is invalid because I HATE JEWS
>>25289794>preaches goyim don't have a right to reproduce>but Jews do have a right to steal Palestinian land and continue the existence of a Jew supremacist state, which implies a right to continue reproducing JewsBONUS>Goyim have no right to resist
>>25289801I never said that
as a philosophical project its futile, but its a fine personal choice
>>25288612>Has it finally been deboonked?Yes (the asymmetry argument), by Julio Cabrera (also antinatalist)https://repositorio.unb.br/bitstream/10482/15458/3/ARTIGO_QualityHumanLife.pdf
>>25288639exchanging one delusion for another
>>25288612Retroactively refuted by PlatoBuried by Aristotle
>>25288612It was never bunked to begin with. How do so many normcattle read books like this -or singer's Famine, Affluence, and Morality- without critically evaluating the premises?
>>25289801You are a master debater. Give me twenty one reasons why that is not a valid argument. Cite your sources and show your work
>>25288612Anyone who wants out of life has a myriad of ways to shut it off.That they whine about it instead is very telling and invalidates their thesis.>But muh biological will to livePlenty of non chicken shits who are committed to the bit manage to kts.
bought and paid for
>>25288612I wonder what are author's views on abortion and mass migration
>>25290474Depends - is it migration to the state of Israel?
>>25288639I swear, it's always this retard shitting himself about capitalism in every thread
It's weird how I've filtered this image every time I've seen it and yet I'm still constantly seeing it. It's pathetic to make the same thread again and again so you can samefag and argue against it again and again but to tweak the md5 too so it can't be filtered is a new low.
>>25289676Their argument:>antinatalists central claim is that life is harm>they argue that you have to be alive to feel pleasure and stress this isn't guaranteed>they argue that if you're not alive you are guaranteed not to suffer/harm>[no guarentee of pleasure, risk of suffering/harm, therefore nonexistence is best = basic thread of argument]>note: they also like to being up that the fact you don't have a choice in coming into existence>they conclude that not reproducing and ending life is the optimal outcome to reduce harmWhy they're refuted:>antinatalists can't validate their central claim as they cannot weigh the total value of life in aggregate (the best they can do is assert individual bad things happen)>[this is all the refutation that is needed: they cannot draw logic, let alone an extreme conclusion, from a central claim they are unable to prove; simple as--but lets go on to point out their bad logic]>they place the weight of guaranteed outcomes on detractors but they don't have prescience to forsee the outcome/value of individual lives (let alone the aggregate of all life which they are assuming) but...>antinatalists are attempting to prove their conclusion and thereby the onus is on them produce a stable logic based on a proven premise>however, any single example of value in life automatically contravienes their premise and contradicts the logic they attempt to assert>[antinatalists are generally filtered by this because they still affirm their premise even though reason has been given to reject it]>we may come to the idea of suicide and ending life (which is logically coherent with their outlook while showing their values are actually incosistent)>suicide automatically means an end to suffering, any harm caused doesn't exist for the victim (aside, the absence of existence means you can't even weigh such anyway)>denial of suicide is an affirmation that value exists in life (or else why not? note that they won't even admit that suffering is short relative to continued existence, they really want to avoid clearly weighing anything)>if the antinatalist says it affects others a consistent logic follows that they kill them as well (the sooner the better in fact--stop them from reproducing which puts an end to countless future lives)>alas, the anti-natalist will assert their original logic no longer applies once they are alive (again, affirming the value of existing and demonstrating their logic can actually be harmful)>the last bastion is they HAD no choice to exist (conveniently it doesn't matter that they have one now) but again there are plenty of examples of lives worth living
Open question: Is there any other cult of ideology as pathetic and lame as antinatalism? With something like Marxism you at least have a chance at picking up some decent cultural critiques but with antinatalists it's literally just "WAAAAAAAA, I WISH I WASN'T BORN! WAAAAA" pity parties and masturbatory pseudo-debates they always end up losing. Sure, with Marxists you'll have a bunch of resentful poorfags and pseuds but with antinatalists it's overwhelming clinically depressed rejects and incels using Benatard as a cope for their shortcomings. That's not to even mention all the weird terrorist shit some of them get into like shooting up schools and blowing up clinics.Seriously, what a bunch of creepy fags.
>>25288639It's less that our world is "capitalistic" and more that it is artificial, governed by Jews and whatever else.
>>25288612I'll start taking antinatalist arguments seriously when the writers kill themselves or go on shooting sprees. Until then, there's no proof they seriously believe what they say.
>>25291453This post was AI generated
>>25291470You're beliefs are AI generated.
>>25288639Could you define capitalism, and explain why it makes life shit?
>>25291460
>>25291490Capitalism can be identified by a set of mutually dependent phenomena. 1. Wage labour- achievement of production activity via engaging labour in exchange for wages2. Private ownernership of means of production - The instruments and resources required for production activity are owned privately. Usually by a minority of individuals. 3. Markets- Material life is achieved through purchase of commodities in the market using money. Here's how it makes life shit. 1. Downward pressure on wages. To maximise profits and cheapen products, the Capitalist system requires wages to be as low as possible. Which means that every worker is paid the bare minimum possible, everything else being equal. This is the primary cause of material poverty. 2. Workplace misery - To maximise production and dominate the markets, the Capitalist system demands as much time and effort from the worker as possible. This leaves the worker with less time for his own life and leaves him miserable. 3. Alienation - Capitalism's ontology ia fundamentally individualistic and alienating. Which means that the expansion of Capital in all aspects of human life leads to breakdown of communities and becomes a cause of psychological and spiritual isolation. This may cause misery to the human whose inherent nature is social.
>>25291802>basic bitch understanding of capitalism >parroted grievances Yawn.
>>25291808>too stupid to recognize AI
>>25291808Well I answered your question with the objectively correct response. I don't care if you it bored you as long as I am right. >>25291814What part of my response makes you think it's AI?
>>25291817Ennumeration
>>25291820I just like lists
>>25291817>Well I answered your questionI'm not the one who asked, pseud. >>25291814It has a typo so I'm giving it the benefit of doubt. Stop being so paranoid about AI, fag.
>>25291823Your bullies were right but they failed to beat you hard enough.
>>25288612>life is... le painfulholy fr*ck.......... what a profound thinker... he's changed my life with this hecking insight!!!
>>25291839>be a typical normgroid>Pick up every incorrect and reprehensible position out of peer pressure.I'm glad I'm not like you.
>>25291878>defines himself by not being a "normgroid"Absolutely mid.>peer pressure would have made me a bad boySounds like cope about not having friends.
>>25288992>NOOOOO, the world isn't shit, you just need to take your happy pills and everything will be ok This isn't some chicken or the egg thought experiment, it's the fact that anti-natalists get their ideas after considering the state od the world and making the conclusion that the world is bad.
>>25292377>doesn't know how to read EnglishTypical
>>25289016If life can be improved then naturally it can also be degraded. If I slip one day break my neck and become a quadriplegic, the quality of my life would drastically be reduced. Anti-natalism essentially tells you that life is a huge gamble and as such your happiness is temporary, as long as you win.
>>25288639the anti natalists I've seen are all marxist environmentalists
>>25291460>why don't they try to end suffering by causing suffering
>>25291865This comment was painful to read. I physically cringed.
