aegon adopts the faith editionASOIAF wiki: https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Main_PageBlog: https://georgerrmartin.com/notablog/Old blog: https://grrm.livejournal.com/So Spake Martin (interviews): https://westeros.org/citadel/ssm/Book search: https://asearchoficeandfire.com/SSM search: https://cse.google.com/cse?cx=006888510641072775866:vm4n1jrzsdyGeneral search: http://searcherr.work/TWOW samples: https://archive.org/details/411440566-the-winds-of-winter-released-chaptersold: >>25334690
>>25362935Are there any good fanfics about the Blackfyre Rebellions?
>>25362961Agreed. Given what faggots the people became about their religion, burning down the Starry Sept and replacing the religion would have done quite well.
>>25362985Targaryens are extinct and the faith ain’t going nowhere. Cope and seethe tranny
>faction stanning Take it to /tv/ goys, were lorechads here
>>25363013Stannis hates blacks by the way.
His best work, bar none.
How will Bran and the power of the faith coexist?
Aegon the Conqueror died from a stroke huh? According to whom? A MAESTER?! Wake up...
>>25363318What the fuck took them so long
>>25362974>Are there any good fanficsno
Guys, the lack of blog posts from George is driving me insane. I know all he would post about is wildcards anyway, but his posts kept me going somehow. As it is, things just seem incredibly boring.
I hope George writes about the War on the Ninepenny Kings more. It being the last Blackfyre rebellion Until FAegon which is also just one part of the goals band of nine who wanted to overthrow nine different cities and kingoms and install their mates is such a cool idea. Would allow to cut to different kingdoms and how different people are responding to this sudden crisis, as well as Band of Nine of having troops from every part of the world so you see more rare cultures
>>25364031>I hope George writesMe too, kid.
I mean if she was YOUR mother…?
>>25362935My poor /grrm/ peeps,how have you grown so old and yet have faith in an old fatty cunt to write another book?
>>25364134If you can fuck your sister you can fuck your mother, it's all degeneracy. Not to mention Alicent leans in real close to Aemond and strokes his cheek, what sort of signals does that send? And it's not like he got super physical, it was just a kiss and she looks genuinely more disturbed than when Aegon raped a girl in S1. It's all so fucking stupid.
But what would Maelys the Monstrous' tax policy have been?
Bloodraven bros...
>>25360513It's mentioned somewhere that there are lordlings who try to sail to the Isle of Faces, but enchanted winds blow them back. Presumably it's a holdout of the CotF/singers.>>25360692this. fused black stone is dragon/fire magic related, while the greasy black stone is relics of the Deep Ones.>>25360777I was thinking that they bred firewyrms and wyverns, but this is equally plausible.for some retarded reason I'm hitting the spam filter, thus I'm splitting up my post
>>25359339Fairly accurate, although Valyria is Rome, and the Summer Islanders are Caribbean-influenced.>>25357735Yes, book 7 of HP is comparable. If Winds ever does drop, I expect spoilers to light up the internet like back in 07.>>25364031Not to be a wet blanket, but realistically, it'll take other authors building on the lore, like SW Expanded Universe, to get stories about the Ninepenny Kings, Valyria, and all the rest of it.
>>25364199A head tax
>>25364134If she was smart she have wed Aemond and Helena, Aemonds had a thing for her all his life after all.
>>25362935I know this isn't /tv/, but has anyone watched the HOTD episode? How bad was it?(I don't plan on watching it, but want to laugh)
>>25364497>How bad was it?It took me two days to get thru the first episode and that included FF thru the boring parts (i.e. most of it).Absolutely retarded show, honestly it's not even worth shitposting about.
>>25364497Cute twink got taken out RIP
>>25364288>this. fused black stone is dragon/fire magic related, while the greasy black stone is relics of the Deep Ones.Nope. More than one maester notes the similarities between the two. It’s to the point where they assume whoever built the greasy seastone chair were the same people who constructed the similarly maze like foundations of the Hightower. Said similarities are also seen at Lorath, which was said to have even taken out by denizens of the sea.Where are dragons said to come from? Asshai. What is Asshai made of? Greasy black stone. It is likely there’s fused stone out there as well. Greasy stone might even be fused stone. It’s likely the sea stone chair wasn’t carved more than twisted or molded into shape, the way the Valyrians did. I don’t know why you guys try so hard to hairsplit. It’s clear there is a connection between the two.
>>25364533NTAGreasy/oily stone is some weird black magic/ magical blowback that warped all this one special magic stone into what is it now. >Yeen>Toad statue on Isle of toads>All of Asshai (Big enough to house the all of the biggest Westerosi cities within it to spare)>Moat CailinAll deep one shit>Base of the Hightower>Old Valyria>Dragonstone>Five FortsFused stone, ancient dragon lords using dragonfire with their stone work.Different stones VERY different cultures, but im sure they were once one in the same. Great Empire of the Dawn were mayve fish people who then went into the sea and continued their human slavery on nearby populations.
>>25364598Moat Cailin too? I don't remember any special stone there
>people freak out over the royal children's parentage even though they do resemble one of their parents>nobody cares that robert arryn doesn't look like either parentI mean seriously, a blond dude and a redheaded woman produced a brown-haired kid and nobody questioned anything?
>>25365165Most cailin is just basalt, or so they say
>>25365371Basalt is made out of cooling lava. What if fused black stone is just home brewed basalt sculpted from lava with magic. Also why is there volcanic rock in a swamp. Sometimes I wonder if the neck was once a series of volcanic islands in the strait that separates northern and southern Westeros, the new land of the neck formed from cooling lava from sea volcanoes stacking on the bedrock of the sea. That’s how the sea people that destroyed lorath got to the western side of Westeros before the arm of dorne was broken
>>25364598People always forget the black stone ruins of ax isle as well.
>>25364598It’s the same magic stone technology the Valyrians used, only much older. It’s oily and greasy because the precursors to the Valyrians were seemingly from the sea, or of a fishy background, not dry land. The Valyrians bred their dragons for the sky, the land, not the oceans as far as we know (maybe there were dragon lords of the sea?). I don’t know why this is so complicated for some people here. That’s all this is. It’s not important to George, either. He just decided to make the origins of Valyria point to something fishy from the sea. It’s just a nod to Lovecraft. Yeen and the Five Forts are also formerly coastal. Every single instance of black stone, fused or oily, that isn’t Valyrian, is near the sea. Asshai and Yeen both share qualities. >Different stones VERY different culturesThe cultures they raped, maybe. The material they use is clearly similar, or linked, in some way. Again, more than one maester assumes whoever left the Seastone Chair is the same culture that made the foundations of the Hightower, which looks like the labyrinths of Lorath. The labyrinths of Lorath aren’t mentioned to be made with black stone, and yet still they note how similar they are. It’s possible this fishy culture assimilated other cultures in the process. Perhaps they went to Lorath first, were inspired by the labyrinthian architectures there, and brought it with them. Similar to how they likely took humans to Westeros before the First Men got there (the ancestors of Ironborn and the ancestors of the Hightowers and the Daynes likely predate the First Men). The ancestors of the Hightowers (just like the legendary Grey King of the Ironborn) are said to have fought off dragons for their freedom. This is odd, since you’d think they would be the ones to be controlling the dragons. Why did they not like dragons? Possibly because the original breeders of dragons weren’t nice to humans. Maybe they liked the look of Valyrian shepherds. To mate with? Eat?Yeen (which has the same qualities as Asshai—the place said to be the origin of dragons, and presumably fused stone magics) was also built with big blocky stones, so it’s likely this culture used big creatures to move them, or they were big creatures to begin with. Maybe they didn’t have fusing magics at this time. It could have been a progression. Wyverns can’t breathe fire, so perhaps they didn’t have access to fire magics in that region, until they discovered wyrms in the fourteen flames, or in underwater volcanic vents, maybe. Nagga was said to have a living fire and could sink islands. I think something went to Valyria, and like the Grey King slew Nagga and took its living flame, or magic, for himself, the Valyrians did so on a much larger scale. Or they simply took advantage of what they left behind. It would be ironic if the rapists became the raped.
What George doesn’t want you to know is that Wyrms are a sapient, intelligent race, and that humans were to them as dragons are to humans.
Brandon Snow was cooking. Weirwood arrows are kryptonite to overgrown lizards.
>>25365629dragons and white walkers are opposites and thus their weaknesses, obsidian and weirwood are opposites. Frozen fire and burning ice
>>25365314Sweetrobin Arryn is Littlefinger's son.
>>25366007Do you need to reread my post, brainlet?
>>25365586>No new postswhy would asshai, a city of oily black stone on the land, be a city of fish people? wouldn't it make more sense for it to be in the sea?
sea king of the iron islands as per house greyiron sigil: white skin green hair black iron crown House manderly sigil: white merman with dark green hair and black iron trident Mermen were a race of white skinned green haired sea people who used iron and made pacts with humans binding them with driftwood (drifwood crown and driftwood throne) These are separate from squishers/deep ones who have fishy hairless heads and rape and enslave humans The green hair makes me think they could be connected to cotf or whatever race Garth greenhair was. Rape babies of the deep ones perhaps?
>>25366010Only the Targaryens and Baratheons had magical DNA, zoomette.
>>25362935Where would you like to travel to if you had to, you will have a full year supply of food, medicine, and around 100 people on your ship. Your role is just to observe and write about everything?
>>25366711What does magical DNA have to do with what I just said? If you don't resemble either parent then your parentage would naturally be questioned especially in such a cuckoldry obsessed culture as Westeros.
the ancient Velaryons made a pact with the sea king and Addam velaryon visited the green men on the isle of faces. This is a hint that Ancient Valyrians made a pact with the sea cotf who bred sea dragons
>>25360683>if Bran is a part of it. He will be the recorder. Probably.>>25359551>This is likely alluding to the ending having Bran sitting on the throne as a sort of storytelling recorder-king, or seer-king, likely into old age.>Bran lives so long people start calling him Old Bran>he teaches generations of children the history of Westeros through his stories>but his favorite were always the scary ones
>>25366866I guess the ruined city on ulos, we know exactly nothing about that civilization other than the name
>>25365314>>25367160Hoster Tully who is his grandsire had brown hair so it's not that weird.
>>25367521And for non-magical DNA, you are most likely to inherit your grandparents hair, not your parents.
How do you cope with the fact that the only new content we are ever going to get will be fanfiction?
>>25366530There’s a theory that Asshai was formerly underwater, or that sea levels were a lot higher once. Would explain why the thousand islanders fear the sea so strongly. Asshai is a reverse Atlantis.
>>25367231That would be wholesome.
>>25366530Asshai is a port city and thus a city for fishmen AND their human slaves/ half human hybrids. Their capital we see on land was for their air breating breeding cattle hence why its on land. >>25368286That is a very interesting idea. I never considered that, a reverse Atlantis. I did always think Asshai starting with A and being this mythical city of magic was some sort of Atlantis analog. So the whole city is like what happended in Dagon. Instead of a single eldtrich monolith and a single god-like being (or just a worshipper coming to worship its god at the monolith) its a whole city. That's a very neat idea, I'm convinced
Daario is Euron's sonArya is the ValonqarJon Snow is the Night's KingVarys sent the CatspawWyman wrote the Pink LetterQuaithe is Bloodraven's daughter
>>25363187I really like Tuf Voyaging too but yeah this is probably my favorite of his.
>>25368705I hate that I liked Tuf Voyaging as much as I did.
>Maester and greenseer will work together What would this look like in practice
I prefer to skip every female pov during my asoiaf rereads.
Ohhhh Achilles mother was a sea nymph that’s why azor ahais mom was a fisher queen, nice one George
The pov per chapter is such a gimmick. Does anyone actually like how it’s written literally for TV?
>>25370263Yes I like it, it’s immersive and gives you alot of perspectives that make the world feel more real
>>25369667An original outline for the maesters was that each archmaester had their own glass candle... ...really makes you think, huh?
>>25366617They might all be local names and interpretations for the same thing. What if mermaids actually looked hideous or carnivorous?
>After the Battle of Ice, Stannis will attempt to burn Theon in front of the heart tree at Winterfell but Bran will shout through the tree to spare his life. The Northerners will take this as a sign from the Old Gods and will demand Stannis spare his life, who will renounce his "faith" in the Lord of Light which only ever existed because of Melisandre's magic anyway.You cannot convince me anything else will happen.
How hairy do you think Jon Snow is down there
Speaking of Bran, I figured out that his first vision, the one before the dream, dates to the beginning of the series, specifically Catelyn I / chapter 2 of GoT.>>25365586Good points overall. I also think it's very probable that the Deep Ones used sea dragons; I recall a line from Patchface that under the sea, the flames burn green & black & blue, which is an important hint.>>25370263what >>25370548 saidMy only complaint, to echo another anon, is that GRRM has to commit to each PoV and make it a plot thread, which I think played a large role in the story becoming bloated and unwieldy. Like the anon, some of my favorite chapters were the one-off prologues & epilogues. I think if you had brief PoVs, especially in Feast & Dance, it would've worked well and prevented structural issues.>>25371386faggot
>>25371386I hope very. It got so hard seeing Kit's ass in season 7
So let's say Theon deposes Balon instead of betraying Winterfell how differently do you think his role in the story would've played out? Euron is the interesting difference here because I feel like Theon would become his flesh puppet rather than Ramsey's Reek
is the crackling ice language of the Others a dialect of the true tongue or something separate?
>>25372058The same I think, there was mention of the children speaking in the language of the bubbling brooks and wind in the leaves and such
>>25372096I think what George is implying in this passage is that Ghost can understand the true tongue and the sounds of nature are what is directing him to the buried cache of dragonglass. So if Jon merges with him in death and picks up the same ability then communication with the Others is possible. That is if their language really is the same as the children's.
Magic does strange things to sound in-general. —Melisandre touched the ruby at her neck and spoke a word.—The sound echoed queerly from the corners of the room and twisted like a worm inside their ears. The wildling heard one word, the crow another. Neither was the word that left her lips. The ruby on the wildling's wrist darkened, and the wisps of light and shadow around him writhed and faded.Also color.—The candle was unpleasantly bright. There was something queer about it. The flame did not flicker, even when Archmaester Marwyn closed the door so hard that papers blew off a nearby table. —The light did something strange to colors too. Whites were bright as fresh-fallen snow, yellow shone like gold, reds turned to flame, but the shadows were so black they looked like holes in the world. Sam found himself staring. The candle itself was three feet tall and slender as a sword, ridged and twisted, glittering black.
>>25372190Oh shit. I think you may be right. Night king had to communicate with his wife somehow
Glass candles are everything
What did GRRM mean by this?
>>25370075Valid for Arya and Dany.What the fuck for Catelyn and Asha.
>>25372617Night's Queen who breed Others with an Other/ Azor Ahai wight was a magical women like mel, possibly fire magic or shadow binder like her
>>25372715>We are fighting shrubbery, Asha thought as she slew a man who had more leaves on him than most of the surrounding trees. That made her laugh. Her laughter drew more wolves to her, and she killed them too, wondering if she should start a count of her own. I am a woman wed, and here's my suckling babe.
>>25370849yes, literally every character wants/expects theon to die (including himself) meaning he actually has valyrian steel plot armor and cannot die for at least the first half of winds. he also has way too many semi-chekhovs: latecomer, glover hostage exchange, euron interaction, revealing whether he actually is a eunuch or not, revealing if he actually is a kinslayer, stark kids interaction, meeting mother for first time since childhood, rising up harder and stronger etc.
>>25372617Probably just thought it looked cool
Nights queen is Adara from the ice dragon
What are some of your favorite outlandishly batshit theories? I'm reading the series to my mom (we're currently 100~ pages into ASOS) and think it would be fun to share some with her. Have a few in mind, but could use more>Varys is a mermaid>Tyrion is Dany's unborn baby that time traveled into Joanna Lannister>Ned warged into Ilyn Payne upon his death
I bet you could garrison Harrenhal with Arianne's body count.
"Daemon Blackfyre, the brothers Toyne, the Vulture King, Grand Maester Hareth... traitors have always paid with their lives... even Rhaenyra Targaryen. She was daughter to one king and mother to two more, yet she died a traitor's death for trying to usurp her brother's crown."-- Stannis Baratheon --This seems like an odd thing for Stannis to say, as his house usurped the Targaryens and his daughter is his heir, just as Viserys I made his daughter Rhaenyra his heir and never swayed from that position, with the Greens clearly usurping the throne (a "death bed confession"? Please).
>>25374321>grand maester hareth Huh, I thought I knew every glup shitto. Wonder what his story was
>>25374096Are you seriously planning to read the myrish swamps passage to your frail, old mother?
>>253743211. House Targaryen broke the feudal contract first by stealing a Lord Paramount's daughter who also happened to be betrothed to another Lord Paramount, killing the aforementioned Lord Paramount and his heir and then demanding the heads of the son next in line and his Lord Paramount friend who also happened to be fostered by yet another Lord Paramount. By the laws of all gods and men, all reason to stay loyal had evaporated after such disrespect and humiliation. 2. Unlike Viserys 1, Stannis would discard Shireen as his heir the minute a son was born to him.
>>25372617She will die and be resurrected as an Other priestess
>>25374719She’s already a fire wight
>>25374767Wights can die more than once. Beric was brought back several times.
What do we think of the theory that Illyrio lied about his wife succumbing to the Grey Plague and she is actually Lemore?
>>25372438I got the feeling that some magic is an overlay. You're drawing down something else from a higher plane ala thelema to overlay it on reality, or creating your own temporary reality. Then there's stuff already bedded into reality that you can use.
>>25362935Holy hell reading that chapter of theon trying to convince his dad to help him take Casterly Rock is so cringe. He is dreaming about becoming the lord of west
>>25375618>He is dreaming about becoming the lord of westSo?
>>25364506It’s kinda impressive how badly they fucked up what should have been one of the biggest set pieces of the entire series
>>25364497Jace died because Rhaena bonded with Sheepstealer and then went straight into the battle within hours of taming him. She lost control of him and forced Jace to fly low and get taken out by the Triarchy. No Viserys rescue, because Condal can't be fucked to deal with child actors anymore and the ages of a lot of the characters are fucked.
>>25365314George dropped the plot thread of sweetrobin being Littlefinger's son.
D&D > Condal
>>25375709to be fair George has dropped every plot thread given that Winds will never come out
>>25375713>vomit > shit
A bear there was, a bear, a bear!
>>25363864I'm just surprised he didn't make a post after AKOTSK aired. During production he was raving about it, but then it came out, had great reception, and he was radio silent. I'm starting to wonder if he's dealing with health issues. He's lost a ton of weight recently according to photos and while a lot of people theorize he's just on Ozempic, weight loss in old people isn't usually a good sign.
>>25375618Attacking the absurdly rich westerlands was a smarter gamble than attacking the barren north. Also the ironmen would have had allies in the form of the north and riverlands, instead of having... none... zero... just like in their last failed rebellion. Balon was a fucking retard.
>>25374616>1. House Targaryen broke the feudal contractUsurpers always have an excuse as to why _their_ usurpation is somehow justified, the Greens did it, Robert Baratheon did it and Stannis did it.>2. Unlike Viserys 1, Stannis would discard Shireen as his heir the minute a son was born to him.Stannis hasn't fucked Selyse in years (can you blame him?) and that's not going to change any time soon, which makes Shireen his heir.But then Stannis was always a hypocrite.
>>25374329>>grand maester hareth>Huh, I thought I knew every glup shitto. Wonder what his story wasThat's the only reference for the guy.
>>25375690>It’s kinda impressive how badly they fucked upPar for the course, considering how shitty GoT was. It's actually surprising that Dunk & Egg turned out to be quite good, other than the shitty new content HBO needlessly shoe horned in.
>>25376053>Usurpers always have an excuse as to why _their_ usurpation is somehow justifiedIndeed.
>>25374321Because Stannis is basically a lawyer with a fetish for the Westerosi equivalent of stare decisis. Robert was justified because Robert won; had he failed he'd have been a traitor like Rhaenyra. Stannis certainly isn't in the business of relitigating past debates over right or wrong, as those were already decided (i.e. on the battlefield)
Holy shit this series falls off hard after storm of swordsI was a TV only and of the opinion that the show isn't worth watching after tywin dies......and it's the same for the books. WTF is AFFC? Holy shit what a slog, and then ADWD is a fucking LETS see the other half that we didn't show you! uhh noo....how about let's get on with the plot...This is what you guys have been left off with? Holy shit, I'd want tihs fat fucker's head rotting on a spike.
https://georgerrmartin.com/notablog/2026/07/01/song-of-ice-and-fire-2027-calendar/new blog post, once again by his minionsThe last real George blog was 4 months ago
>>25377270Did fatman ever adress the AI art used in AFFC? Says a lot about the "community" that it just blew over after some really mild damage control.
>>25375897Balon mentions in that very chapter that they would not be able to hold Lannisport. He was wise to be wary of Tywin's cunning.
>>25376646>was a TV only and of the opinion that the show isn't worth watching after tywin dies...I very recently realised why this was the case. Basically all the good plotlines die a at once. King's Landing plot was by far the best one, but by this point everyone was either dead or gone. The Cersie/Margery/High sparrow plot was nowhere near as compelling. Also Arya broke off with the hound and her arc suffered for it. The Danaerys plot had lost all steam the moment she sat on the Mereneese throne.
I sometimes wonder what'd happen if there was a Valyrian branch sorcerer in Westeros. Sitting somewhere quietly in the vale, 400 years old, everyone had forgotten Incestuon Badguyrhanium the Lord who followed the Targaryen's out of Valyria. Maybe even has a wyvern or some hideous mutant dragon (FOUR legs? I say.) and rides out halfway through the war of five kings and starts letting the dragon mutant burn or the wyvern eat people. Good times.
>>25377599Balon only went against the north because he hated the starks and thought they humiliated him in his rebellion. That's it. It was pure pride and seethe towards them. Allying with them against the southrons would've been way better tactically for the ironborn but Balon was fueled solely by butthurt.
>>25377270>that 3rd picI always had a feeling Cersei had the best ass of all the asoiaf women. What a semen demon.
>>25377270>https://georgerrmartin.com/notablog/2026/07/01/song-of-ice-and-fire-2027-calendar/When was the last proof of life for george?
>>25377643That would have been a cooler backstory for the three eyed raven than bloodraven
>>25378002>ravenYou mean crow
>>25377599>Balon mentions in that very chapter that they would not be able to hold Lannisport.The Ironborn would not be able to hold the North either, which has a FAR larger population so the only point of going to war was raiding for loot, which made Lannisport a much better target.As others have said, Balon was a retard.
>>25378081>FAR larger populationit does? I assumed most of the north was empty like canada while the rest of the kingdoms had denser and higher pop sizes
>>25378631Da norf and Dorne are 'thinly peopled, compared to the lands betwixt' according to the world book.
>>25378631The rpg isn't a great source but the editor of TWOIAF agrees: the Reach is far and away the most populated, followed by the riverlands and then the westerlands. Then a big dip to the North, then the Vale, then the stormlands, with Dorne and the Crownlands roughly the same, then the Iron Islands. The North is desolate but huge. Their population is probably pretty variable in winter too . I'd expect the Norths population is almost entirely southerly and coastal, the Westerlands would be like the Vale with it in valleys.
10 days until ADWD turns 15 years old.
It’s been so long that someone somewhere has predicted every twist and reveal and secret of the past. Even if George thought up something new he didn’t consider before, someone online beat him to it with a theory years ago
>>25377599>He was wise to be wary of Tywin's cunning.What the fuck is Tywin gonna do about it when his armies are engaged elsewhere? Cunning alone doesn't win wars. Armies win wars. Worst case scenario for the ironborn, they storm Lannisport and get obscenely rich, then fuck off to the Isles when the heat comes down on them. You think the Lannisters are going to be able to come after them? Balon was a fucking retard.
30 days until George personally announces the release of Winds on his blog
>>25379141I predicted that Stannis would burn Shireen twenty years ago on the Westeros forums. I don't think I was the first but it was definitely a bold opinion at the time.
>>25362935>A Song for Lya; Lyanna took his hand lightly in hers, and gave him her vampire look: big, dark eyes opened wide and staring, thin mouth lifted in a tiny faint smile. She's a small girl, almost waiflike, with short brown hair and a child's figure. >“We're Talented,” I said, smiling. With the capital, yes. Lyanna and I have been tested and registered as psi Talents, and we have the licenses to prove it.“Uh-huh,” she said, turning on her side and smiling back at me. Not her vampire half-smile this time. Her sexy little girl smile.“Valcarenghi wants us to get some rest,” I said. “It's probably not a bad idea."Lya bounced out of bed. “OK,” she said, “but these twins have got to go."“We could push them together."She smiled again. We pushed them together.And we did get some sleep. Eventually.Jon X Arya really almost made it in. I thought it was a lie, but this confirms that George had it in him to do it.
Surely it's not the same woman.
>>25379657I think it's a coincidence. The woman in Aeron's vision (if it's anyone we know at all) has to be Cersei. Melisandre would never make common cause with Euron.
>>25379657Obsidian candles are said to burn with a pale flame, so Malora Hightower or some other sorceress with access to candles like quaithe could also be a candidate >sorcery is a sword without a hilt There’s also that passage in house of the undying where dany sees>white, silver and gold haired kings wielding sword of pale flame Sorcery IS the sword of pale flame without a hilt that the old pale kings wielded
Something tells me rhaenys (wife of the conqueror) suffered the worst fate in the series. She was shot down at the HELLholt, was rumored to be tortured and whatever happened to her made Aegon so afraid he stayed out of dorne for the rest of his life
>>25380117Aegon went to dragonstone to use some magic to confirm that rhaenys soul was being tortured for some anti dragon ritual
>>25380117Are you illiterate? Rhaenys died on impact from the fall.
>>25380137>The dragon fell from the sky with Rhaenys on its back, destroying half the castle. It is not certain whether Rhaenys outlived Meraxes. There are those who say that Rhaenys lost her seat and fell to her death, while others claim that Rhaenys was crushed to death beneath Meraxes in the castle yard. A few accounts claim that Rhaenys survived the fall and died a slow death, being tortured by the Ullers, or that she was kept alive in extreme torment. Due to the uncertainty about Rhaenys's exact death, history records that she died in 10 AC at Hellholt in Dorne. Her body was never returned to King's Landing.[3][13]
>>25380125>>25380117Maybe they learned some of those “new forms of torture” the blood mages of Valyria used on slaves in goggossos, and she’s in some hellish torment from blood magic, and they told Aegon they could make it even worse if they keep trying to conquer dorne. Aegon would know of the blood magic torture from his Valyrian heritage
>>25380242I imagine something like the Ayleids from elder scrolls and their flesh gardens
>>25380242>they told Aegon they could make it even worseI think this is the most plausible scenario
Every Rhaenys has met with a bad end. Cursed name.
Gonna listen to the Mystery Knight on audiobook. I was saving it because this is likely the last D+E I will ever get to experience for the first time (no more will be written), but now seems like the right time. (Listened to the first two stories years ago and loved them)
>>25380498Enjoy
>>25380324What's the luckiest name in Asoiaf?
>>25380811Hot Pie
>>25380811Walder
>>25376053>Usurpers always have an excuse as to why _their_ usurpation is somehow justified, the Greens did it, Robert Baratheon did it and Stannis did it.Jon Arryn (who actually called the banners) was 100% justified and no Targshit can deny this. Even assuming things could have been ironed out by killing Aerys and having Rhaegar take the throne, he done got himself killed by fighting at the Trident. Then Tywin killed Aegon. At that point no one, and I mean NO ONE, wanted Viserys on the throne.
>>25381267Maybe so, but the last few decades of the story have proven that westerosi fags cannot rule themselves and need valyrians to do it for them
>>25381282Valyrians ruled Westeros for less than even the fucking Rhoynish before imploding, much less the long-runner First Men houses. Meanwhile Robert and his brothers also had the most Valyrian blood on the fucking continent besides Dany, Viserys and the very much unknown Jon so if anything that means that Valyrians indeed cannot rule.
>>25381292Ruling petty kingdoms perpetually at war with one another is not the same as a unified continent.
>>25381296Yeah the latter is somehow less impressive, because the Starks somehow maintained their hold for thousands of years while constantly at war while Valyrians can't even maintain hold of a united continent during peacetime.
>>25381300That's just GRRM's bad worldbuilding. If you want to get into that then we'll also have to talk about how unrealistic most of these noble families are by being so tiny in number.
>>25381305If GRRM's worldbuilding is bad by what measure exactly are you calling the Targ's rule a success then?
>>25381310By the fact that it was preceded by perpetually warring tards and was succeeded by the same tards perpetually warring. It's the historical notes about muh 9000 year dynasties I have a problem with when it comes to worldbuilding and I choose to ignore them.
>>25381282>move over Westerosi savages, you need a real UBERMENSCH leader to guide you into the future, time to show you how it’s done VALYRIAN STYLE>dragons all die, you’re bloodline ends and Westeros looks the same as when you conquered it The aura loss, the cringe, the secondhand embarrassment
>>25381338Except targs are still around, dragons are still around and all westerosi tards are vying for the iron throne, which was created by the targs
>>25381318>Westerosi are inferior because they keep warring with each other, I shall conquer them to prove my superiority >targs war with each other every single generation, gradually weakening their power until theyre able to be overthrown Nice job!
>>25381346the targ civil wars pale in comparison to the prior military conflicts
>>25381349>a couple skirmishes between two backwater fiefdoms every blue moon is comparable to a world war 2 every 50 years It’s not though
>>25381352what the hoares did in the riverlands alone is worse than even the worst targaryen ruler ever did Not to mention starks enslaving everyone and demanding sex slaves, boltons skinning everyone, perpetual raids from ironborn, marcher lords and dornish tards fighting 24/7 etc.
>>25381363>what the hoares did in the riverlands alone is worse than even the worst targaryen ruler ever did And it’s just Maegor with a sea viking skin
>>25381381maegor was one guy, the hoares enslaved, raped and killed thousands of innocents for generations also fuck the faith militant
>>25381363Sure, the problem is despite thousands of years of warfare (both pre and post-Targ) nothing ever changes.Culture, technology, politics, economy, religion, etc. have remained static since recorded history began, once the Andals arrived, everything on Westeros pretty much froze in place.
>>25381397again, we're going back to bad worldbuilding although the targs did create king's landing and the kingsroad so it's not like they left nothing behind
>>25381339>Except targs are still aroundA barren womb and an undead who can’t breed. The satanic bloodline of dragons is extinguished thanks to saint mirri, rest her soul >>25381391>innocents Fuck r*verlander scum
>>25381318>By the fact that it was preceded by perpetually warring tards and was succeeded by the same tards perpetually warring.Targs presided over not one, not two, but three continent wide wars caused by their own dynastic dipshittery.
>>25381405which overall had fewer casualties than prior perpetual warsisn't one of the big reasons for the wall being undermanned that fighting did in fact go down? so what I'm saying is pretty much canon
>>25381403>although the targs did create king's landingThe geological and cultural reality is that the mouth of the Blackwater would have been a major settlement since the days of the First Men, most likely House Durrandon's capital.>and the kingsroadThe route would have been there since the days of the Children of the Forest and the Targaryens never did shit to improve it, thousands of years later the Kingsroad is still a muddy track thru the woods.
>>25381411>which overall had fewer casualties than prior perpetual warsAccording to? Do you have numbers for Dance, Blackfyre, and Robert's Rebellion casualty numbers? >isn't one of the big reasons for the wall being undermanned that fighting did in fact go down? so what I'm saying is pretty much canonNot as far as I'm aware, it's more a general growing disillusionment with the Wall having any purpose. Otherwise the Wall should be packed due to the WOT5K. Even assuming you're correct, that means Targ rule led humanity to be less prepared for the Others despite muh Aegon's dream.
>>25381404>and an undead who can’t breedMartin has not yet commented on this, Jon may in fact be able to get his dick up through fire magic. We have no evidence one way or another on the Beric front.
>>25381427>>which overall had fewer casualties than prior perpetual wars>According to?Stands to reason that a few large wars mostly between armies in the field will have fewer deaths among the peasantry, then perpetual cross border raids and attacks specifically designed to kill peasants and loot their stuff.Aegon and his sisters killed a ton of dudes at the Field of Fire but most of Westeros was unaffected.
>>25381404Did you ever think a witch that hated Dany might not be the most reliable source for whether Dany can breed?Aegon is the real Aegon in any case.
>>25382553And Jon probably isnt dead for that matter.
>>25382483>Stands to reason that a few large wars mostly between armies in the field will have fewer deaths among the peasantry, then perpetual cross border raids and attacks specifically designed to kill peasants and loot their stuff.Ok you’re just a silly guy this debate is over >large wars between armies in the field don’t effect the peasantry Bro…
>>25382553>Aegon is the real Aegon in any case.That's a major kek.
The crack of dawn….the CRACK of DAWN…eggs crack…battle for the dawn…moon cracked at the crack of dawn hmmm…
I always thought George could be forgiven for not finishing the series, if he just got Winds out and it was legitimately good. At least in that sense, there would be some level of sincere forward motion, and enough development to give readers an idea of an ending for the series.As it is, I am confident he will never release Winds, and I just cannot see people ever forgiving George for that. 15+ years, no release, and then dying, will be too much beyond the pale. He will always be the joke of the fantasy community.Robert Jordan gets shit on for a situation I think was a lot more forgivable than the one George is in.
>>25382555NTA. You're either retarded or a troll. The kingdoms of Westeros whether during the Age of Heroes or the 7 kingdoms period where in a state of constant war and border raids. Compared to the sparse amount of wars that have taken place after Aegon's Conquest your argument fall apart quite easily.
>>25382936>sparse amount of warsHa, Targs caused a large amount of wars due to their incompetence, infighting and general unworthiness, a black Harren dynasty would have unironically been better for Westeros
>>25381397Which means that the Weirnet (both Singer/Other forks) are keeping the world in stasis, perhaps with the assistance of other magical powers.>>25381419Are you sure? I get the impression that they at least expanded/improved upon the Kingsroad. Also, the Targs standardized the currency, replacing the myriad of coins used before the conquest, so that's something.>>25382556The backstory of the Pisswater Prince is plausible, although a Blackfyre is equally so. who knows>>25381318>It's the historical notes about muh 9000 year dynasties I have a problem with when it comes to worldbuilding and I choose to ignore them.irl historical sources tend to blend real history with mythology. Likewise, I think GRRM isn't being literal with those dynastic histories; he's intentionally exaggerating, because their history is supposed to get murky as you go further back. Or maybe I'm giving the fat man too much credit?>>25380150Maybe she died when the dragon crashed, but then her soul was captured for Valyrian steel or some other blood & fire ritual. This would explain the conflicting accounts.
>>25383013Unlike some people, I think the backstory for Aegon as presented is perfectly plausible (we've seen stranger things in real life and Jon's existence would be equally implausible to a rational observer) and I do believe the Golden Company could be persuaded to perhaps back a Targ to get home. However Illyrio's extreme support of a random ass boy for king, up to and including getting emotional about attending his wedding and knowing his favorite treats, cannot be explained as Young Griff being anything other than Illyrio's son to me, and I've never seen any rational explanation by the real Aegon camp for why Illyrio is so caught up on and attached to this supposed lost prince hanging out on a pole boat for 18 years.
The Others will get an Ice DragonEuron will get a sea dragonWho gets the earth one >>25368549Don't forget that Mel is Bloodraven's daughter too.
Melony piper is for sure a hint about Melisandre but I don’t know how they connect. There’s no way George saying she had a “fiery personality” is a coincidence, she’s the only other character named melony
>>25383220And is a red head
>>25383220>Melony piper is for sure a hint about Melisandre but I don’t know how they connect.It's not very likely that a noble girl from Westeros would end up a slave in Asshai so I do[ubt there's an connection to House Piper but I'll agree that Melisandre is Westerosi, with the name "Melony" and the red hair clueing readers in on this.
I just got to the 2nd Jon chapter in ADWD and it repeats entire paragraphs from Sam's chapter in AFFC.What the fuck....
>>25383877Well, yeah, the entire point of that chapter is seeing Jon's thoughts after a chapter where Sam feels he no longer recognizes his friend and seeing how they bith interpreted the same words. When Dany and Jon meet I hope there are also a couple overlap chapters at first where we see how they interpret each other's words to give insight on how they think as people.
>>25383876So she’s most likely a Freefolk, a backwoods Northman or an iron islander given the track record of modern westerosi slavery
>>25383876What if women from Asshai are just pale tall hot redheads
>>25383981It would be best thematically I think if she’s a freefolk. She was taken as a child and sold to the red temple and forgot her origins, she’s more powerful at the wall because that’s where she’s from, thats where her heart truly is. The great other she’s demonized is just the old gods she originally worshipped
>>25383981We have westerlander smallfolk being sold off too.>"I've also heard whispers that Robert got a pair of twins on a serving wench at Casterly Rock, three years ago when he went west for Lord Tywin's tourney. Cersei had the babes killed, and sold the mother to a passing slaver. Too much an affront to Lannister pride, that close to home.">>25384000There is some delicious irony here if what you posit is true.>Melisandre nodded solemnly, as if she had taken his words to heart, but this Weeper did not matter. None of his free folk mattered. They were a lost people, a doomed people, destined to vanish from the earth, as the children of the forest had vanished.
ValBrienneMya StoneMalora HightowerThe Female Other who corrupted the 13th Lord CommanderAsha GreyjoySepta LemoreVisenya Targaryen MelissandreAshara DaynePsychoanalyse me based on who the top ten Ice and Fire women are that I would like to bang
>>25384312You are a submissive bottom who wants to be dominated because of porn
>>25384312>BrienneThe fuck?
Varys was dumb to back a Targ restoration and should have supported the Baratheons instead>Ned lives maybe sent to the wall where he reveals Jon's parentage >Edric is his champion instead of Aegon with Jon Arryn acting as his Joncon >Theon gets a much happier ending since the Boltons don't have much of a presence in this timeliness. Maybe actually works towards building a better relationship between Pyke and the North >Lannister influence taking out much faster than expected with Varys exposing Cersei's incest much sooner with Ned and Jon Arryn backing up his claims Daenerys and her dragons are still a threat along with The Others >>25384482I'm willing to give Brienne a chance. I find it admirable how she's one of the few knights in Westeros who acts like an actual knight.
>>25384520Varys was stupid for imploding the country in the first place by ruining Rhaegar's Harrenhal plot. Varys wants his pet project on the throne and will burn the country down to get it, he has always been no better than Littlefinger.
>>25383887But there's literally over an entire page that is copy pasted.
>>25384312Bottom bitch. In the world of ASOIAF you'd get raped by some random Ironborn dude.
Why does George call the lizard men of the grey waste “shrykes”? Shrikes are birds, not lizards. Birds that impale their prey on TREES. This is a massive hint everyone is missing. Impalement on trees? Weirwood fucking sacrifice
>>25384942It’s also a Hyperion reference to the “shrike”, an entity who tortures people on a massive tree of spikes to draw the attention of the empathy god. Yet more evidence The unspeakable rites performed at kadath to slake the hungry gods are some kind of Weirwood tree sacrifice ritual
>>25384955>>25384942Hmm interesting. The grey waste/kdath and the shrikes being connected to weirwoods opens up a lot of theorizing. I like the idea of a more dark version of old gold worship, inhuman raiders coming out of the desert to sacrifice you to their evil godtree where your soul will be trapped forever, that’s terrifying
>>25384991It also gives more reason for early humans to be so anti Weirwood, the migrants from Essos carry the cultural memory of the evil eastern variant of the demon trees, and are immediately hostile when they see them in Westeros
>>25384942>>25384955I think grey waste was once underwater, the lizard skinned men are just humans wearing the scaly skins of the green deep ones who raped the thousand islanders into existence. The tree they sacrificed their captives to grew out of the water and had a sea dragon greenseer like nagga and ygg. I just connected all this once I remembered the legendary prophet of the ironborn “the shrike”. Why the fuck would a sea worshipper take the name of a bird who impales on trees, it makes no sense other than to validate this convoluted schizophrenic theory
>>25385009The dry deep was a trench in the ocean floor where megafauna leviathans and sea dragons lived and bred, that’s what those bones are
>>25384520I also just realized in this scenario if Ned actually lives and makes it to the wall and reveals Jon's link to the throne with the arrival of Daenerys coming it could essentially undo Vary's plan to restore the Baratheon dynasty which would be incredibly ironic ending with another rebellion just with the roles reversed. But who'd be the POv characters in this timeline? Jon stays. Davos stays. Tyrion stays. Robb wouldn't be King in the North and Winterfell wouldn't get sacked so we'd have a much more stable north. Jaime potentially stays but Cersei would be dealt with much quicker, so I wouldn't make her a POV. There'd probably be no Dorne plotline too. A lot of the Dornish motivations come from their hatred of the Lannisters so they'd probably be doing their own things and not get invovled with stuff going on in King's Landing
Bittersteel is great because he makes defeat look cool. The gilded skull, the icon of the vanquished enemy used as a drinking cup to show your victory over him, but in this case used as a symbol of his ceaseless endurance and determination, his warriors spirit, raised high in honor as a banner for all those who were inspired by your burning passion
So why did Daenerys fall so badly for Daario exactly? One chapter she recalls that he brings her flowers and the next time he's mentioned she's thinking about fucking him all the time and being jealous of his swords cause he touches them?Where did all of that come from?
>>25385244He dyed his pubes blue
>>25385244She's a teenager who was raped at a young age and has extremely fucked up romantic standards as a result.
>>25385031I don't think that the War of Five Kinga happens in this timeline instead Robert's bastards would become super important maybe they get legitimised by either Renly or Stannis once they are found and it becomes another Aegon 4th scenario with them trying to make a claim to the throne
Do you think the city of the winged men is legit?
>>25385508Probably a mountain culture that wargs giant eagles similar to early vale culture and their winged knight giant eagle stuff
>>25385539I don’t think it’s eagles because they are described as men with Leather wings. I think they are an actual race of winged humanoids related to the “Winged demons” in the mountains of Asshai, possibly draconian
>>25383093good point; it's all very ambiguous.>>25383197It seems to me that earth & ice are closely related, since the CotF/Singers and the Others are forks on the Weirnet. This is analogous to the close relation between blood & fire magic.>>25384697The point is to see the same scene from different perspectives. It felt kinda cool to recognize it from one chapter to the next.>>25384998very good insights desu>>25385314This, also he's a swagfag bad boy, and that's what teenaged girls like, in this world and that of ASoIaF.>>25385508Yes, it's a real place, maybe with winged statues, or winged hussars, lol. It could also be a reference to some ancient race that once lived there, kinda like the harpies of Ghis.
Winged men mention in the house of dragon lol
>>25386161Some insider said that this episode will mention an obscure book only thing that will be more important in future spinoffs. So someone in the know confirmed that we will see the winged men probably in the corlys show, also winged men are real confirmed
>>25386173lol they were talking about yiti dude, were never seeing the winged men and they aren’t going to be important
Targsisters.....our response?
>>25385508Paragliders
Was Ormund Hightower this important in the books? They are setting him up in the show like some sort of final boss.https://youtu.be/yvHIhb5sLCQ
>>25386554why dont you read it chuddie
>>25386554>Was Ormund Hightower this important in the booksBook, not even book, a couple chapters at most. Just read it.
>>25386405>Targsisters.....our response?Just kill him.This is such a retarded tv series.
What would TWOW be like if it was written by Sara Hess?
>>25386943Stone heart bends the knee to Cersei and offers her Arya
>>253870286/10The idea is fine, but it's not Westerosi enough
>>25387094It’s just a shitpost and at least it’s not ai Get out of here with your rating shit
New Moon Man video. This one's centered around Petyr Baelish. I disagree with Moon Man's overarching theory that Stannis plots to bend the knee to Aegon, but I like most of the rest of the theory. It's also chock full of typos.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPuAOcviU-MHis video is about how Littlefinger is using his relations with Lysa to win Harrenhal while convincing everyone that he needs Harrenhal to win Lysa. He wants Harrenhal to be able to host the Great Council when Aegon arrives and everyone sues for peace, and he can play kingmaker as the host and be in a good position to survive the transition from Baratheon-Lannister rule to Targaryen Restoration. He makes a point that the titular "game of thrones" is a game played with thrones for control, and not simply a game played with human lives for the Iron Throne, and I thought that was a brilliant point.It almost sounds like his theory has a plan where he never reveals Alayne as Sansa though, which seems weird but maybe he'll get into that in the next video in 6-8 months from now.
Are the maesters hypocrites when it comes to magic? They have a link for it, and crap like alchemy and astronomy is riddled with esoteric woo woo assumptions in this day and age. Even learned people like Galileo or Isaac Newton believed in hocus pocus, although they’d phrase it differently.
>>25387627reek reek it rhymes with weak
Did George just not know how Tourneys worked? He had the internet when he wrote Game of thrones, he could have looked it up.
I guarantee you there’s at least a dozen unofficial circles or factions among the maesters. They are probably always bickering.
>>25387627The early ones probably wanted it gone but knew and believed. The modern ones just seek to stomp it out of habit and the traditions of the order. If anyone actually lit the candle they'd die. And a valyrian steel link is more a warning bell - watch this person, they're having wrongthinkbadthought, see what they really want or believe before giving them power.
i just watched the got tv series, do you guys actually enjoy this redditor's writing? excessive amount of just shit shit whores brothels rape cock balls shit murder rape shit whores rape shit
>>25388457You watched 8 seasons of a television show, hours and hours of your time, and your first thought was to come to an obscure thread for the books and say you wasted your time?
>>25385546Nibbas never read Rocannon's World and forgot that GRRM sipmped LeGuin.
>>25387627>Are the maesters hypocrites when it comes to magic?No
>>25387627>Are the maesters hypocrites when it comes to magic?Yes
>>25388379The maesters were probably more accepting of magic when it was more “naturally” available. They probably did things they didn’t even realize were magic. Ravenry is partially magic.
>>25388682>Ravenry is partially magic.No it's not, it's just their version of our messenger pigeons.
>>25388686You didn’t read the books. 1. Corvids in Westeros are seemingly sharper than the ones irl.2. Ravenry was taught to men by the children of the forest; a leftover vestige of a time when one could speak to birds. 3. Leaf tells Bran that the dead children of the forest went into the crows and ravens and probably other things.
Ravens can speak the True Speech
>>25388711None of this is implication of there being magic involved in the process of sending messages with ravens, which is something we selectively bred into birds in real life. Ravens in ASOIAF vary in how many castles they can remember to send messages to, that sounds far more like a skill based on the intelligence of the animal in the same way working dogs function than any actual magic. That selective breeding is a function in how ravens work in ASOIAF is further confirmed by Cressen specifically mention white ravens being selectively bred for important messages in ACOK.
>>25388727Lol, what the fuck is magic to you? Just mimicking the sounds of nature is apparently True Speech (ravens being able to speak it points to this) and that’s considered a form of magic. Mundane skills like making potions and poisons is seen as a form of sorcery if it’s wicked in intent, or hedge magic if it’s done with beneficial intent, like in real life history. Metallurgy and alchemy are seen as forms of wizardry to peasants, or anyone really if it’s sufficiently esoteric or cutting edge. What humans consider magic might not even be seen as magic by the children of the forest, similar to how Tolkien’s elves don’t see themselves as magical.
>>25388732>Lol, what the fuck is magic to you?Shit that we couldn't do in real life, that sets ASOIAF apart as a fantasy world? It seems like that should be obvious. In real life we can and have trained birds to remember a certain place to send messages to. Meanwhile we haven't figured out yet how to transport our minds into animals and see what they're thinking, so that seems like surefire magic to me. There's also the difference between outright magic in ASOIAF and things that certainly seem magical but seem more like Martin exaggerating real life for his setting: the prime example being Harrenhal, which should be impossible by medieval building standards but as far as I'm aware has had no mention of magic being responsible for its construction.
>>25388737Magic is a relative mental construct. It is what you make of it. It exists and is possible in the world of asoiaf, and as such there’s going to be an objective background to it, allowing for the foreground, where some hypothetical higher dimensional alien (R’hllor?) should be able to assess it and not see it as magic. Often the capital-w wizard won’t see themselves as such, as they understand things too much. Their bar for magic is higher, or just different, from your own. R’hllor likely doesn’t see itself as what its followers see it as. Are God’s miracles miraculous to Himself? Probably not. What makes magic isn’t substantial outside of the subjective perception of the mind’s eye (what is magic to one isn’t going to be magic to another), and is primarily related to exposure logic; those essential essences of wonder and mystery. Enchantment as Tolkien calls it. If everyone had the ability to control the elements, then it’s no longer magical or mysterious to them, not unless they continue to see the wonder and enchantment in it. Tolkien’s elves look to the wizards (who aren’t wizards back in Valinor) the same way men and hobbits look to the elves. The fairy like elves don’t see their arts and crafts and abilities as magical. They’re too used to what they do. Meanwhile the black machines of Mordor are likened to sorcery and black magic, as the natives of middle earth just aren’t used to that level of infrastructural horror. Gandalf uses blackpowder in the creation of fireworks for wonder and joy, while Saruman uses it in the creation of bombs for war and horror. The wizards are simply the equivalent of sagely stage magicians, or alien emissaries disguised as old men, and don’t go out out of their way to weaponize fear and ignorance to start cults and religion like Sauron does. They simply know things you don’t, and can do things you can’t. It’s as simple as that. Magic is psychological, not literal. It can’t even exist in fiction from the absolute logician’s angle. It will always be deconstructable into its basest parts or essences, like all fiction.
The alchemical tricks(*) of Melisandre and the other red priests are seen as magic by her onlookers, not herself/themselves. The visions of the red priests are seen as visions from the gods, but not the bastard wizard sending them using his little glass candle. The powers of the glass candle are seen as magic by the wizard, but not the alien powers that injected magic into the world eons ago in the primeval past.(*although some of the alchemical stuff she has certainly sounds unnatural, like the ‘black smoke that can kill a man outright’)
>>25388737Harrenhal was built using blood. The place you should really question is Casterly Rock.
>>25362935I understand why he can't bother with the mess that is Winds of Winter.But can't he at least do Fire and Blood part 2?
>>25388819never mind, apparently he said he will do only after Winds, which means never
>>25383877same kekAFFC and ADWD are so SHIT
>>25388794>Casterly RockVery reminiscent of ancient arab architecture (thamudic, nabataeans).
Does anyone else like the theory that the only reason the Lannisters got Brightroar was so the Asshai'i could afford to pay the faceless men to kill a bunch of mages and start the Doom?
>>25388898No.
>>25388898That’s retarded. Why would they need to sell just ONE of their many fucking magic swords for that? The “faceless did the doom” theory is all sorts of retarded. Not to mention that fire magic is a hard counter to assassination. A faceless man would struggle against a sorcerer like Melisandre who can see her threats in advance—and can summon a shadow that puts their assassination skill to absolute shame.
Isn't the Doom more poignant if all these theories about it being intentional or the result of blood magic are wrong and it was just freak happenstance? Sometimes the earth has the bigger dick even if you are the big bad Valyrians with your dragons.
>>25389022How good are the Faceless at fighting in open combat, if their cover is suddenly blown? Maybe they actually fought the wizards tending to the fourteen flames, if they couldn’t sneak up on them properly.
>>25389028It was likely always a natural collapse that was waiting to happen, that the Valyrians merely pushed back and kept at bay. For all we know the firewyrms rebelled against the Valyrians by boring under the fourteen flames until they collapsed in on themselves. Perhaps this is what the Valyrians were doing; keeping the horrors of the underground at bay.
>>25389029Magic is brutal. We’ve seen that sorcery can one shot a man dead immediately. Be it spontaneous dead explosions or spontaneous combustions or spontaneous shadow assassins.
Fire and blood mentions that the Valyrians delved into the earth for things no man should ever look for. Khazad-Dum moment.
>>25389034That's an in-universe book. That's what I was saying about it being more poignant for the in-universe theories to be wrong. Good and bad fortune and how people adapt are such integral themes of the series that I almost prefer that the Doom was in fact just bad fortune.
>>25389036The doom was bad fortune, but it was also clearly not natural.
Firewyrms are sapient creatures who the Valyrians brutally enslaved. Used to mine deep tunnels. FREE THEWYRMS
>>25388822he can't do part 2 because Summerhall allegedly has spoilers for the main series
>>25382654George will not be forgiven
>>25389869For the main series? If Egg tried to sacrifice Rhaegar I could see how the turn to villainy might spoil Dunk and Egg but I don't see how it would have any spoiler for the main series unless Rhaegar left a dragon egg there or something.
>>25389031>>25389034Pretty much, they overextended their fire/blood magic and brought destruction onto themselves.>>25382654I think Winds will come out, but GRRM still procrastinates harder than I did in high school. Also, the author getting killed off would be the ultimate irony, you have to admit.>>25387627I theorize that the Hightowers are heavily involved in magic, and restrict its study at the citadel so they can maintain their monopoly on it.There's also this larger theme of magic slowly fading from the world, until Dany's dragons cause a resurgence.>>25388711>3. Leaf tells Bran that the dead children of the forest went into the crows and ravens and probably other things.Correction, children/singers go into the Weirnet when they die. It's just that wargs leave an "impression" on the animals they possess, which is true of both children/singers and humans.As for ravencraft, it started out magical, then became mundane, as fitting with the theme mentioned above.
I don't like how Ice and Fiire went completely mainstream and a whole bunch of normals invaded the fanbase after GOT aired. I miss the early 00s days when it wasn't a household namen
>>25390745GOT's ending was so bad that a good chunk of fans pivoted at least partially to the books and especially book aesthetics so I'm fine. No one takes HBO's blue eyed Valyrians seriously, for instance.
>>25390750What you mean is that people have pivoted to watching Alt Shift X or some alternative ASOIAF youtuber to get their book takes, book theories, etc.Most people talking about the books haven't read them, but pretend they have through osmosis browsing online content.
>>25390771That's most people in any online discussion about a piece of media, talking about ASOIAF through osmosis about the books is better than talking about ASOIAF through osmosis about the shitty shows. The only thing that bothers me is that the shitty show STILL permeates into people thinking Jon has black curly hair and a beard rather than straight dark brown hair and no beard.
>>25390771Did you know that dragons are nukes?
Does George have a massive boner for the Faceless?> What the letter contained, none know to this day, though many have speculated. Some claim that it was a simple plea from one father to another, heartfelt words that touched Aegon’s heart. Others insist that it was a list of all those lords and noble knights who lost their lives in war. Certain septons even went so far that they suggested that missive was ensorcelled, that it had been written by Princess Meria before her death, using a vile of Queen Rhaenys’s own blood so that the King would be helpless to resist its malign magic. Grand maester Clegg, who came to Kingslanding many years later concluded that Dorne no longer had strength to fight. Driven by desperation, Clegg suggested, Prince Nymor might have threatened that, should his peace be refused, he would engage the Faceless Men of Braavos to kill Aegon’s son and heir, Rhaenys’s boy, Aenys, who was then but six years old. It may be so… but no man will ever truly know. Thus ended the First Dornish war.
>>25390165Skinchangers can escape death by going into their animals, and staying there, while their body dies. The children of the forest did this with the ravens. — He chose one bird, and then another, without success, but the third raven looked at him with shrewd black eyes, tilted its head, and gave a quork, and quick as that he was not a boy looking at a raven but a raven looking at a boy. The song of the river suddenly grew louder, the torches burned a little brighter than before, and the air was full of strange smells. When he tried to speak it came out in a scream, and his first flight ended when he crashed into a wall and ended back inside his own broken body. The raven was unhurt. It flew to him and landed on his arm, and Bran stroked its feathers and slipped inside of it again. Before long he was flying around the cavern, weaving through the long stone teeth that hung down from the ceiling, even flapping out over the abyss and swooping down into its cold black depths.— Then he realized he was not alone.— "Someone else was in the raven," he told Lord Brynden, once he had returned to his own skin. "Some girl. I felt her."— "A woman, of those who sing the song of earth," his teacher said. "Long dead, yet a part of her remains, just as a part of you would remain in Summer if your boy's flesh were to die upon the morrow. A shadow on the soul. She will not harm you."— "Do all the birds have singers in them?"— "All," Lord Brynden said. "It was the singers who taught the First Men to send messages by raven … but in those days, the birds would speak the words. The trees remember, but men forget, and so now they write the messages on parchment and tie them round the feet of birds who have never shared their skin."Over successive generations of ravens, perhaps their characteristics got passed on.
>>25391504Oh right, the second life, how'd I forget. From that portion you quoted, I assumed that it was just a lasting influence from warging, but it could indeed be the children/singers sheltering from death, living on in the ravens, with their consciousness slowly fading out over generations.Also, it's certain that all the birds in that cavern have children/singers in them, but I wonder if they meant all ravens in general? That'd really be something, and would explain their uncanny qualities, and why they seem more intelligent than birds in our world.Also, that Bran chapter is one of my favorites, I've been re-reading it.
>>25390898People who insist dragons are "just fantasy creatures" are missing the political metaphor entirely. Dragons are protected nuclear capabilities with scales. The entire feudal order bends around the fact that one dynasty possesses a monopoly on civilization-ending force, and everyone else's armies become ceremonial by comparison. The Targaryens don't rule because they're wiser, holier, or even more competent—they rule because they alone control flying strategic deterrents that can erase castles, cities, and bloodlines in an afternoon. Strip away the fire and the medieval aesthetics, and the logic is unmistakable: a ruling elite whose legitimacy rests on exclusive access to overwhelming destructive power, whose diplomacy is backed by the implicit threat of annihilation, and whose empire begins to unravel the moment that monopoly disappears. "Dragon" is simply the fantasy genre's more romantic word for an arsenal that no one else is allowed to have.
>>25391621When I was young, I used to joke that HBO had solved television mathematically. Every seven or eight minutes they'd flash a pair of breasts, a bare backside, or a penis across the screen—not because the story demanded it, but because someone in a boardroom had figured out the precise interval needed to keep an audience neurologically hooked. At the time, it was just an observation that made me laugh.Years later, the joke seems surprisingly perceptive. Modern entertainment is built on attention engineering. Writers, editors, and producers understand that the human mind is drawn toward novelty, surprise, violence, sex, mystery, and emotional escalation. They don't need a stopwatch that says "insert nudity here"; they have decades of audience research showing which moments are most effective at renewing attention. HBO became known not simply for explicit content, but for weaving moments of titillation into a broader rhythm of fascination—a cadence that kept viewers anticipating the next surprise, revelation, or intimate scene. What once sounded like an offhand joke turns out to point toward a real principle of media design: attention is cultivated, fascination is engineered, and what feels spontaneous on screen is often the product of careful creative and commercial decisions.
>>25390898Weird how on 4chan people will ignore any post with no pics
>>25391621>>25391646>>25391665Is this shitty AI sloppa or a reference to something?
>>25391668The middle one is an old copypasta from when Game of Thrones started getting popular
>>25391665>Weird how on 4chan people will ignore any post with no picsit is an image board and it's not hard to include an image.
How stinky do you think Jon is at the Wall? I doubt he feels the need to bathe much. Especially beyond the Wall.
>>25391706So the Targarians are actually David Icke's reptilians?This recontextualizes the symbol of the Turtle GRRM wears and the Fabien Societies strategy to use narratives to get people to put the wolves and reptilians in control.
>>25391708I bet he has a floral scent. Ygritte says men shouldn't smell sweet like flowers and he gets oddly defensive.
>>25391879You're on to something, there's Dany's blue flower filling the air with sweetness vision as well.
>>25382654He probably realised he can't finish the series in two books and came to the conclusion that it's too late for him to wrap it up now.
i guess he's still alive
>>25384955>>25384991>>25384998>>25385009Wow I really need to re-read the Worldbook >sea dragon greenseerCan you elaborate on what you mean by this? Like a literal sea dragon/ sea beat thats a greenseer?>humans wearing the scaly skins of the green deep onesDesert people wearing the skins of humanoid reptiles like a hood is a really cool idea. Like cloaks made from crocodile skins, but why would the people from the land of shrykes be human, and were would they get new deep one skins? Because they'd have to skins that are thousands and thousands of years old right? >Travelers claim the cities are inhabited by people as pale as the dead. Others claim the inhabitants are corpses who have been drained of blood and returned to life through dark rites.So is there like a mega huge weirwood somewhere in the desert, maybe at the heart of K'dath, the first city. But the shrikes fear the city so they can't be the inhumane raiders taking people back to the mega ancient desert tree. >>25385025So this landmass was once underneath the waves were fish people and monsters worshipped strange gods, before rising to the surface. So its the main plot of Dagon.What are the bloodless men? There are several cities worth of them so there's a lot of whatever kinds of people these are that are cabable of reproduction>Travelers claim the cities are inhabited by people as pale as the dead. Others claim the inhabitants are corpses who have been drained of blood and returned to life through dark rites.Some sort of desert version of getting patchfaced/ made a servent of the deep ones. Or like another kind of wight and another kind of dead unqiue to the desert people.
>>25392060Thought it said foid for a second
>>25392060>giving him or his publicists money
>>25388500>rocannons world>leguin Also could be a windhaven reference, where they zoom around on gliders and whatnot
>>25392061>Can you elaborate on what you mean by this? Like a literal sea dragon/ sea beat thats a greenseer?A personal theory I think is cool but I admit the evidence for it might not even be evidence. I like to combine the grey king myths so that him killing nagga and him felling ygg the demon tree are the same event, ygg being a weirwood with a sea dragon greenseer absorbed in its roots, like how its namesake yggdrasil has the dragon nidhogg at its roots. I think this peice of lore https://gameofthrones.fandom.com/wiki/White_Tree_of_Flames written for the show by George’s long time assistant Ty Mikkel might contain a hint directly from George (but totally could also just be fanfic). There’s a “pale tree of flame” in the greenhouses of Valyria, it’s essentially a weirwood except its roots grow out of the ground to coil around the trunk of the tree like a serpent. So if this is not fanfic, there are serpent Weirwood variants. And this would fit with my nagga theory
>>25392042Feature creep.
>>25392042He can always retcon and rewrite a book to fix things. Anything would be fine as long as he finished the series.
Wyrms + Wyverns = Dragons Wyrms + Whales = Naggas
>>25392746Oo I like that a lot
>>25392042He needs to drop extraneous POVs and plotlines. I know the last two seasons of GOT get shit for basically convalescing into two plotlines but that's absolutely the right way to go to finish the story in a timely manner. And desu fAegon needs to be killed ASAP, there's not time for a fAegon/Dany plotline AND wrapping up the Others.
>>25392836I agree with this completely.
>>25392061>why would the people from the land of shrykes be human, and were would they get new deep one skins? Because they'd have to skins that are thousands and thousands of years old right?>But the shrikes fear the city so they can't be the inhumane raiders taking people back to the mega ancient desert tree.Hell, maybe they are half breeds like the thousand islanders, they’re green skinned and don’t speak English, could be similar to the shrieking shrikes and their green scaly “skin”. The islanders fear the sea like the shrikes fear kdaath, probably for the same reason, Memory of the deep ones who rape, enslave and, if my theory is correct, sacrifice you to a wierwood of some sort
>>25392967Don’t speak any tongue*, rather
GRRM make autocrat porn for the profane people to submit to and learn narratives that reptilians like Donald should be in power.
>>25393345I dont see any reason to trust someone who wears fat skin to look weak and friendly while making up fake stories about why he wears the turtle symbol
The more you learn about GRRM and dissect his work and the effect his fruits had on society,I think GRRM might be a bad seed.
Is schizophrenic AI slop the usual for this general?
>>25392620I was with LML theory that the Grey King was a Valyrian dragon lorf that travelled east and his ship was made from a weirwood which petrify to a white stone line substance, hence the idea of Naggas Bones. But thats an interesting idea>>25392967That makes more sense to me. Here's how I see it.K'dath's inhuman inhabitants werw deep ones who were forced to live in the desert when that part of the world rose from the sea bed (ala the plot of Dagon), but never returned beneath the waves. We have lizards and frogs in Australia’s desert so desert reptiles/amphibians do exist so people-like reptiles and amphibians (like the people of IB from lovecraft) can exist.These non-humans would venture from the desert as the raiders from the Grey Waste. They would prey upon shrykes, kill and/or eat the men and boys and rape and breed and women and girls. Just like what the deep ones did to the people of the Thousand Isles, (sidenote, the mention of the Thousand Isles is literally on the page before the talk of K’dath, cannibal sands, city of winged men and the raiders of the grey waste). The Shrykes are now part reptile/deep one hence their venomous bite and devolved into almost animals from the generations of raiding and rape. I think they are literal reptile men as the world book says>Or are they no more than fables, the grumkins and snarks of the eastern deserts?And in the main series the mention of grumkins and snarks are used to dismiss the white walkers which we know are real, so I think the shyrkes are also real. Now K’dath is said in the book to be older than time. Thus to me reads as predating the empire of the Dawn, perhaps the long lost and forgotten enemy of the Great Empire of the Dawn. Anyway my headcanon aside. Why are the grey wastes called the grey wastes?I think the grey wastes are called that because that part of the world is covered in Ash. In Elden Ring when you burn the Erd Tree the capital city, Leyndell gets smoothed in ash once you burn the Erd Tree. I think K’dath had a giant demon tree, they sacrificed people to perhaps even impaling them upon it. And this tree was burnt creating the grey waste from its ash. I dunno if something could be the size of the Erd Tree in Elden Ring but it would need to be massive.I have no idea what ‘cannibal sands’ could mean or how it relates to anything, sounds cool might be fantasy quick sand but I dunno.Also the bones mountains being so tall are meant to be Kadath from Dream Quest of Unknown Kadath, with the city where the gods live but its empty and there's only the evil and malelvolent Nyarlathotep. K'dath being the evil city with a giant GIANT demonic tree past the worlds largest mountain being the enemy of GRRM first great civilisation makes sense to me.
>>25393578first day here huh kid heh
>>25393345>GRRM makeHe'll never do that
>>25393649>>25392620I should have mentioned the original demon tree of K'dath may have been Ygg itself. I'm not sure if that fits the timeline. But a great giant tree that has a nagga at its roots, which is a wyrm crossbreed with a whale could work.>>25392746 Ancient aquatic tree with a great whale creature at its root, reaching from the deep to the top of the sea. Bottom of the ocean is lifted to the surface. Lizard men carry one sacrificing people to their tree, proto-valyrians that become ironborn come and destroy the tree and migrate east across the seas
Winter....isn't coming?
>house dayne words are spoiler>a song of ice and fire>AZORng AfHAIce and fire>head of house dayne is Edric Dayne>EdD>Eddardoh my grrm...
>>25393649>the Grey King was a Valyrian dragon lorf that travelled east and his ship was made from a weirwood which petrify to a white stone I’ve seen some different theories on nagga and grey king and I like them all desu, they all somehow fit and are cool, that’s why ironborn myth is the best lore>>25393649This is sick as hell, great world building and I’m going to add it to my headcannon as well. The cannibal sands give a little flavor, they evoke a blasted biome of a dried up seabed, dunes of sand and sediment where aquatic life once teemed, now an apocalyptic desert where roaming scavenger tribes eat human meat to survive in the scant wasteland where no seed takes root
new>>25394349>>25394349>>25394349>>25394349>>25394349
